How do they not get it?
Posted by podgerama@reddit | talesfromtechsupport | View on Reddit | 77 comments
The people i work with are driving me slowly insane.
I had to have a very long in depth discussion with several of my colleagues over some remote engineering.
All I was doing was requesting a new SSL certificate from sectigo and using openSSL to manipulate it from being a pfx file, into a cer and key file so it can be uploaded into an azure hosted debian linux machine which runs the client's phone system.
"you need to be on site to do this!" was the start of it.
"Pardon?"
"you need to go to site to do the SSL work, as it's for their phone system"
"What?"
"as you are installing this, you need access to their phone system!"
"you do realise this is a hosted phone system?"
"O.K. so do you need to be scheduled in to go to the branch office nearest you, or the head office in the city?"
"it's hosted in a microsoft azure data center"
"well, give us the address for the DC then!"
my head hit my hands so hard i think it broke my desk
"o.k. i'm not sure i have the time or the crayons necessary to explain this. I do the SSL creation on my own laptop and using a web portal for Sectigo, this can be done from anywhere in the world, no need to be anywhere specific. Installing a certificate is NOT a physical action, there is no device that needs to be connected for this to happen, it's a transfer of data and a reconfiguration. Nothing hosted in azure can be physically accessed by the clients. I have full remote access to their azure infrastructure from my laptop, which i again, can do from anywhere in the world. There is zero requirement for me to go to the client's office to update a backend system which is not even in their offices. It's called remote engineering for a reason, so i do not need to waste 3 hours of my day travelling unnecessarily to do a job i can do from my desk at home"
wielandmc@reddit
Simple answer - it's in Bora Bora. Send me there + it will take a week to complete.
syntaxerror53@reddit
On the ISS in space.
Can't just call an Uber.
pacmanic@reddit
It also requires extra budget for “cables” but I can save time and get them at any hotel bar when there.
wrincewind@reddit
you'd be surprised how many screwdrivers you need to buy for a job like this...
Hebrewhammer8d8@reddit
Top shelf only?
MikeSchwab63@reddit
Pitcairn Island.
Ha-Funny-Boy@reddit
I knew a guy that lived on Pitcairn Island, Tom Christian. It is not what most people think.
https://www.immigration.pn/life-on-pitcairn-island
SuDragon2k3@reddit
You really really really don't want to go to Pitcairn Island.
SeanBZA@reddit
Unless you actually like going to a place that makes Bleak house look like a tropical paradise.
Jwatts1113@reddit
2 weeks. And it requires my "assistant" to travel with me.
wielandmc@reddit
Is that your young beautiful female assistant?
This_guy_works@reddit
A Coldplay concert you say?
CircularRobert@reddit
To shreds, you say?
Simlish@reddit
And what about her sister?
Illustrious-Sea5894@reddit
To shreds, you say?
bugzor@reddit
Haha as someone not in tech support, I didn’t understand any of this
This_guy_works@reddit
He's updating a file on a virtual server hosted in Azure (Microsoft) datacenters. There is no physical location to travel to. It's like telling someone to update their Gmail account by going to on site to Google to apply the change.
Geminii27@reddit
Or updating something in a corporate Gmail account by physically traveling to one of the corporate offices. With... idk, a wrench or something.
This_guy_works@reddit
Maybe just need to tighten the network valve. Did you even try it before saying it couldn't be done?
syntaxerror53@reddit
Or Google was too slow.
So needed a Torque wrench to give it more power to work more faster.
nerdguy1138@reddit
Id love to see any self-important random CFO go to a Google data center, (if you can even find them) and demand to be let in "so my employee can update a certificate!"
That camera footage better have audio.
Alutus@reddit
He's doing something with a super long stick. They insist he drops the stick and walks over there instead to poke it directly.
BrainWaveCC@reddit
No, he'll still have to use the stick whenever he gets to whichever destination they want him to get to, because you still have to use the stick. No customer has access to touch the stuff without the stick.
himitsumono@reddit
And customers WITH a stick aren't allowed in to touch anything.
Because data center.
HINDBRAIN@reddit
No, they want him to walk over there with the stick and poke something far away. But he can already do it from where he's standing so the walking is completely pointless.
MeButNotMeToo@reddit
And on top of that, what they’re poking with a stick, isn’t even “it”. OP is poking something with a stick, that will be pushed into a giant conveyer belt system that will distribute what’s been poked to the right locations, making as many copies as necessary.
The_Real_Flatmeat@reddit
I used to be "with it", then they changed what "it" was
Mickenfox@reddit
Now I want to build a tiny conveyer belt-based computer network.
anubisviech@reddit
I bet RFC 1149 would be a more interesting hobby to follow.
Diminios@reddit
Factorio beckons you. I'm not even joking.
anubisviech@reddit
And usually no one knows (or needs to know) where the belt really goes, until it finally arrives by magic called "routing".
Shazam1269@reddit
Yeah, I haven't had to get off my ass to change the channel on the TV for a long GD time. It's not exactly apples to apples, but close enough.
androshalforc1@reddit
I better example might be.
This meeting could have been an email.
BrainWaveCC@reddit
Or, we need everyone who is at home and about to do this zoom meeting together, to go into their respective offices in different cities -- to do the same zoom meeting.
the-nick-of-time@reddit
RTO 🎉
Sure, we all talk through Teams throughout the day, and all meetings are done using Teams, and some of our closest colleagues are in entitely different cities, but corporate says we have to be at our desks to do these Teams meetings where we can annoy everyone around us with our side of the conversation.
TinyNiceWolf@reddit
Exactly right. We can sit in recliners, press a button on our remotes, and HBO comes on. All thanks to remote engineers like OP.
steveparker88@reddit
Have another upvote.
5thhorseman_@reddit
Except there isn't an "over there" he can walk to, because its' a cloud service.
__wildwing__@reddit
Not a stick so much as a long pipe which he pours the data through. And it goes into a connector specifically designed for the pipe. Like a coffee shop with drive up only, they turn you away if you walk up.
----_____----@reddit
tldr: "The Cloud"
Turdulator@reddit
He’s doing something that can be done just by going to a website, so it can be done from just about anywhere in the world with internet access…. And they are trying to tell him he needs to travel to a specific building in order to do it, which makes zero sense and demonstrates they have no idea what they are talking about.
KingofGamesYami@reddit
SSL (or TLS) is a protocol for enabling trusted connections between servers. A usage you're probably familiar with is HTTP over SSL/TLS, more commonly known as HTTPS.
To accomplish this, the server has a certificate and the client has a different certificate, which it can use to verify the server's certificate.
For most clients, the client-side certificates are distributed through OS and application security updates. However, it's possible (and useful!) to use certificates that aren't part of this default trust chain. This requires some manual work to transfer the files, which OP was doing.
None of this actually requires physical presence, because it's just moving some files around (and executing a few commands on them).
Azure is Microsoft's cloud platform similar to AWS. They manage all the physical aspects of servers, i.e. power, internet, upkeep, security etc. for a fee. They do not allow third parties physical access to their data centers.
Renbarre@reddit
He has to do some programming changes on a client system that he will do from his laptop. He was told to travel to the client office to do it because his ignorant boss (?) thought it had to be done on site.
musicnerd1023@reddit
I didn't understand 60% of the words, but I understood 1000% of OP's struggles.
Turbojelly@reddit
Imagine working from home and being told you had to come into the office every time you need to create a document
Zankastia@reddit
I would say
"Yeah man, the ssl injection should be done in insert city trip you always wanted to do so how are you going to cover my expenses?
Paardenlul88@reddit
I hope you're not actually this condescending to your colleagues.
Blue_Veritas731@reddit
I hope you're not actually being serious in asking that question.
You know that Venting to others is a "thing", right? Or maybe you're that One person who has Never, in their life, sarcastically vented to another human being about how the human beings you work with/for are complete dumbasses sometimes. And Why do they vent to others in said fashion? B/c it's not polite/responsible/safe/smart to actually talk to other people that way.
Paardenlul88@reddit
I'm referring to the citation about the "time and the crayons".
johnTheEmpath@reddit
I don't know the tone of how the crayon line was said but sometimes people are hard up or on the edge of burnout (specifically burnout with colleagues) its understandable. Buuuuut you're not wrong either to think there's another direction it could go.
In other news- doesn't it seem like this is a common thing in support roles(I'm a db analyst who does a lot of support tasks) it always occurs to me the fact that people space out and forget literal terms. I side with both theories of that 'crayons are needed' and 'i need to help them jog their memory what remote means'
fpsfreak@reddit
lol...I'm gonna use it next time
zelda_888@reddit
I wish I could remember who in this sub to credit for the expression, preparing a report for upper manglement "in formal crayon."
Z4-Driver@reddit
Wait, they don't send it by snailmail on a 3.5" floppy disk? Which you need to put in the floppy drive of the server on site?
AlexisFR@reddit
I mean, that's absurd in itself
paulcaar@reddit
What makes it absurd? Genuinely asking
AlexisFR@reddit
Why would you put your phone system in the cloud?
Gigawhut@reddit
To make it fully geo redundant? To avoid supporting on prem infrastructure and the additional headaches involved? To make it scalable? It may fit your DR plans better than on prem hardware?
Lots of reasons
AngryCod@reddit
"No travel required. I can do the work remotely." Seems like it would have prevented a lot of annoying conversation.
ivain@reddit
Yeah, but do you have to disclaim every obvious detail of your work every time you have to work ?
AngryCod@reddit
When you stop being a door mat, people stop looking over your shoulder. Why was the other person in OP's conversation even involved?
meitemark@reddit
The other person was maybe manglement. A mangler that maybe started and stopped with learning prior to the invention of internet.
ivain@reddit
Maybe you should stop thinking than op is stupid, that i'm a doormat, and that you know better, while you are ignorant of the situation. Maybe you should start with thje question, and not the judgment
BrainWaveCC@reddit
I'm not 100% sure, but one reason that OP is flabbergasted is that this seems to have been a conversation with technical people.
Special-Original-215@reddit
It's tech speak for:
how to install a yearly update
Though why does Sectigo not download a cert directly? All my SSL vendors offer both formats
Mr_ToDo@reddit
I don't know, it could be fun to figure that out, at least for a device you have physical access too
Cert printed on paper, scanner hooked up to the/a server, and some back end logic to take any scan, OCR it, verify what it is, and shove it in place
It's a super pointless device but it actually kind of sounds like it'd be pretty cool feeling to actually use with the right scanner. Maybe add a shredder in line to up the risk/"security"
Or a fax line into a scanner into the server
Or, well, just do it remotely. Kind of boring though.
fragerrard@reddit
Well, you could print a cert on a punch card or a set of them. That would look cool.
Imagine having a deck of cards that are one cert and a key.
Then you just need a punch card reader.
Naf623@reddit
Punch card reader would be a fairly simple mobile app to make using the camera...
I know you mean a physical one, which woukd also be cool. And plugging such an old concept into a USB would be kinda hilarious.
fragerrard@reddit
Exactly!
Some steampunk tech. IT needs some magic and mystery again..
ThunderDwn@reddit
I'm stealing this for future use. I know just the CEO I can use it on.
OffSeer@reddit
A very serious mistake on your part. We all know that any hosted updates to phone systems must take place at the center in Honolulu, HI.
Equivalent-Salary357@reddit
It sounds like it might have been quicker to just go to the site than to change their mind.
duke78@reddit
Now you ruined it for everybody. The next time someone wants to take a half day off to "fix a certificate" (and get some air, and buy an ice cream), they will be told to do it from their desk.
palinola@reddit
So... you're frustrated that someone else wasn't familiar with the requirements of the task you were doing? The thing you're the expert in and they're not? And instead of explaining the situation to them you chose to be salty about it and get frustrated?
podgerama@reddit (OP)
The other person being someone who has worked in the industry of I.T. Service provisioning for 20 years and has failed to grasp the concept of remote work, despite the fact that the main crux of what I do is enable companies to be able to work remotely.
androshalforc1@reddit
I wouldn’t be surprised if this is the other person.
Look man Im just the phone jockey, the system requires that i put in an address for a service call it doesn’t have an option for remote. and it’s a pain in the ass, like 5 minutes work to add an address that’s not one of the service centres or the customers address, and if i don’t get you off the phone in 30 seconds my KPIs are going down the drain.
Sofa_King_We_Todd@reddit
See this is 6 hours you could've billed to the company for the round trip, practically a free day off considering how they probably don't respect your off hours. Sure I'll go to a branch office over here, oh I had to put gas in the car, here is the expense report.
No_Wear295@reddit
Do it "on-site" over the VPN from the nearest pub / beach / chill location of choice?