Why do sailors get so much hate from power boaters?
Posted by Brandgeek@reddit | sailing | View on Reddit | 364 comments
I see it way more online than irl but they are so passionate in their hate I just don’t get it. My favorite is when they call us “blow boaters”! I’ve got no problems with powerboats, in fact, I really enjoy when I get to go out on one. So why do they hate us so much?
desertrat75@reddit
I don’t see a lot of Trump flags on sailboats. Just sayin.
reggae_muffin@reddit
You’re not in the right area. Sailboats are popular amongst that conservative, old money, snobby population. The people you see flying Trump flags off their powerboats are just trashy, low class people. That old money group are Trump supporters too, they just don’t advertise as readily.
BuildingSerious9369@reddit
America doesn't have old money though
reggae_muffin@reddit
What a terminally dumb statement to make. You ever been to the US NE?
BuildingSerious9369@reddit
Yeah it's all new money you idiot. Old money is from 1000 years ago not inheriting it from your grandad. Moron
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
That sounds like east coast sailing culture. I haven’t felt this on the west coast, there are some snobs of course but everyone else is chill.
reggae_muffin@reddit
Maybe it is, I’m not from the US so I’m not an expert on coastal stereotypes but I can tell you I see a lot of conservative, WASPy, old money types who are extremely Republican/pro-Trump even where I’m at in the Caribbean. Sailing is an old money sport/hobby after all.
It’s the difference between the newer, younger, liberal, ‘grotty yachty’ type and the older, preppy, conservative, wealthy, ‘snotty yachty’ type.
chicoooooooo@reddit
Because they are dumping $100s into their tanks and we aren't, in addition to what everyone else has said
Photodan24@reddit
Until you have to replace a $7,000 racing sail...
MapleDesperado@reddit
After all, sails are another form of oil - and we have to pay for it up front.
arbitrageME@reddit
we all pay $1000s to the marina, brother. The tank is just the tip
Dry_Customer967@reddit
Speak for yourself, I pay $200 a year in mooring fees. Not that I wouldn't pay for a marina berth if I could though, the price definitely reflects the convenience.
arbitrageME@reddit
how do you get to the boat? Tender vessel?
Dry_Customer967@reddit
Yeah, got that for 50 from a guy in my club
jay-ehh-ess-ohh-enn@reddit
A lot more than 100s.
ArugulaEnthusiast@reddit
The truth is, we are the cyclist of the sea
Ever-Wandering@reddit
Exactly this. We have names for all boaters out there.
The large commercial ships we call stink pots
Sailboats are the bicycles of the sea
And powerboats are called credit card captains.
_gooder@reddit
Lol! My dad, a very salty salt, always called motorboats stinkpots. I haven't heard the others. He called jetskis mosquitoes.
dmills_00@reddit
Then there is the wooden sailboat Vs the 'Tupperware' (Fibreglass boats).
IceTech59@reddit
Leaky teaky vs plastic fantastic?
hellcat_uk@reddit
Jetski/jetbike are seachavs. On land they would be riding around your streets on a quad bike at 2am.
Wtfdidistumbleinon@reddit
We call them homochariots here.
CodeMUDkey@reddit
Seachavs 😂
Lakeview_Mama@reddit
That's great! My son, now 20, used to call jetskis "boatercycles" when he was little.
TechnicianFar9804@reddit
Jetskis are sea lice
aluditte@reddit
I always preferred “Garbage Scowls” for large commercial vessels and nasty large motorboats with attitude.
3-2-1_liftoff@reddit
‘The cyclists of the sea’ is Perfect! We have our own language, our own gear, we’re obsessive about weight aloft, and a lot of us won’t shut up about it.
Thankfully, we don’t have to wear spandex
foilrider@reddit
neoprene instead.
Blexcr0id@reddit
MAMIN. middle-aged man in neoprene?
Mycomako@reddit
Well found!
TheUsualCrinimal@reddit
I love sailing naked, TBH
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
This is true, I never shut up about obscure sailing things lmao I do warn people when conversations stray to sailing that I can talk about this for hours.
MarvellaNasty@reddit
I am endlessly annoying as I correct the names of everything it’s not the floor it’s sole, it’s not the kitchen is the galley it’s not the bed it’s the birth there are no ropes on a sailboat
geoffpz1@reddit
My wife is to the point where she just rolls her eyes and and mouths "Again" and simply walks away... LOL
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
She’s a keeper
Holden_Coalfield@reddit
You see, the word "obscure" has an arcane history in sailing lore and jargon as do many words in French and English and. . . .
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
Isn’t it wonderful!
LameBMX@reddit
wait until you learn about rotating mass....
TXfire4305@reddit
Wait what? I need a new rabbit hole for trivia night.
LameBMX@reddit
yea, have fun with that. when it comes to riding a tiny weight off the wheels is like a huge weight off the frame. even more so when making movements that go against gyrscopic precession.
drroop@reddit
It might not be spandex, but I wear a life jacket or foulies more often than I see power boaters wear life jackets or foulies.
On a stink pot, you can drive from inside so no need for foulies. They tend to stay in when things get nautical. Their deck is relatively level and dry, there is no reason to leave the cockpit and nothing is going to knock you unconscious and send you overboard, so no real reason for a life jacket.
GezoutenMeer@reddit
But neoprene.
doned_mest_up@reddit
We wear it because we want to, dammit!
hahaha-whatever@reddit
So many funny but wrong answers in this thread. The reason for the feud is the same as the reason for the feud between skiers and snowboarders. Google Freud's Narcissism of Small Differences. It's all right there.
LorthNeeda@reddit
It’s really not that small of a difference though. Sailing and power boating are completely different activities imo.
chillaxtion@reddit
As someone who owns no boat the difference is small.
SnooApples6110@reddit
When I was a kid , I bought a sailboat with my paper route money. $125 for a snark. I used it everyday for two years. The wind is always a bit different so not boring. Decided I wanted a power boat. My dads friend traded me a 12 ft row boat and my dad bought the motor. He went cheap- turns out it was an older Merc off a hydroplane with an open carb and the thing flew. I could get it airborne if I hit a large wake. Neighbor let me use one of their docks. After one summer I got bored with it and sold it and bought a Hobie. Recently out sailing with a friend and someone who had never sailed. We were on a 30 footer. When the motor turned off she said "Oh wow now I get it".
hobbycollector@reddit
I'm sorry, how are drinking and drinking different? Oh sorry, I thought you said drinking.
notawight@reddit
Both are water translation.
A power boat will get you to your destination faster.
When sailing, you're already there.
Rough-Jackfruit2306@reddit
Way to prove the point.
Graystone_Industries@reddit
This comment has some...ironic foundations to it.
hahaha-whatever@reddit
Do you care to explain?
Volvo_Commander@reddit
Freud was a crackhead lmao
oldskoolak98@reddit
Nice analogy. Floaty things going across water, and slippery boards going over snow.
Firmly in the sails and 1 board camp.
Just couldn't see myself in a powerboat or on skis.
Massnative@reddit
I came to find this comment! :-)
montananightz@reddit
Ah fuck. No wonder everyone hates me both on and off the water. Plus, I cycle a e-bike so even the cyclists hate me!
CaptainBFF@reddit
An e-bike. Wtf? Do you keep the engine on when the wind picks up, too??
; )
montananightz@reddit
It's the only way I can get up to hull speed on a clipper!
gravelpi@reddit
Do sailors have an analogous term to "Fred" in the cycling world? The person that shows up with the most expensive race bike and gear, talks about how fast it is, but is still slower than most of the group?
(do don't me wrong, I'm sure that guy exists; just wondering if it's widespread enough to have a name)
kektothebone@reddit
Paddleboarders are pedestrians
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
No they are unicyclists.
Auggie_Otter@reddit
Funny thing is a lot of the guys in my sailing club just absolutely hate kayakers and paddleboarders. It's like there's some kind of hierarchy where people dislike the things that are slower than they are on the water.
I just hate the mentality of disliking others for enjoying being on the water in a different way than you. As far as I'm concerned all boaters, paddlers, and even swimmers should just be respectful, follow the "rules of the road", and watch each others' backs.
GulfofMaineLobsters@reddit
The only watercraft I will judge harshly are the PWCs jetskis and such. 9-10 times the operator has no clue and no concern for the rules or anyone else on the water. I say they can burn, may they all have itchy genitalia in publicly unacceptable places!
tcrex2525@reddit
Paddle boarders and kayaks are speed bumps… 😂
ShirleyWuzSerious@reddit
Gonna day the same reason cyclist get picked on by motorcyclists
_cramil@reddit
Was 100% going to post the exact same thing. But you beat me to it LOL. Power boaters just be “Get outta my way! You’re going too slow and holding me up.” Then they speed by and the Wake is the power boater version of rolling coal. Doubly so if it also happens to be diesel powered.
Negative_Mood@reddit
Trawler owner here. We go the same speed as sail boats. Guess we are the friendly motor boats
YellowFlare555@reddit
Aye and you're not knuckleheads that think the COLREGs apply to everybody but yourselves
WildForestFerret@reddit
Yeah y’all are chill
YellowFlare555@reddit
That and they get mad they think they can pass your bow, then see they are too slow and have to pass your stern
marshman82@reddit
That's kayaks.
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
I see us as the classy cruisers and the motor boat jackoffs as kids revving around on quad bikes and motor bikes with no muffler.
LameBMX@reddit
spit out my sandwich on this...
good one lol
KCJwnz@reddit
Omg... It's true! Are... Are we the baddies?
BoatUnderstander@reddit
No, cyclists are good
rypher@reddit
Traveling via bike instead of car is good. Biking on streets while ignoring traffic laws and clogging up two lane highways is not. Around me there are lots of highways that are frequented by mobs of road bikers every weekend and traffic grinds to a halt trying to pass. It’s incredibly stressful for some drivers and stupid dangerous for the bikers.
BoatUnderstander@reddit
Whoa, that's crazy man. Around me there are lots of highways, roads, and streets that are frequented by mobs of motorists every hour of every day, making the town dangerous, dirty, and loud. It's stressful and dangerous for everyone, but the drivers don't really notice because they're too busy texting. I'm sure you had to wait behind a cyclist for 30 seconds once though; that must have been very hard for you.
rypher@reddit
Nah, I don’t mind. I’m just not unaware of the public sentiment.
AshingiiAshuaa@reddit
No, there's a huge difference.
Roads were built for cars. They're paid for by taxes on fuel. Cyclists make them less usable so that they can enjoy some exercise. They clog the one and only method most people have of getting to work and the business of life for their own leisure. A lot of people see that as selfish, especially when they group up in the pelotons and make passing difficult.
The seas weren't built for or paid for by powerboaters. If anything the sailors were there first. Also, most power boaters are out for leisure, which is no more important than a sailor's leisure.
gniarch@reddit
That's never been completely true and as time goes by, the portion paid by gas taxes is decreasing, even before EV.
Most recent number after a quick search was that 42% of roads were paid by non-users in 2015
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2015-05-13/debunking-the-myth-that-because-of-the-gas-tax-only-drivers-pay-for-roads
I admit I didn't read the whole thing but I believe that's for highways. City roads don't see much of those taxes
clorox2@reddit
The Prius of the Pacific
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
😂😂😂
lens4hire@reddit
I'm an active participant in both communities; both groups can be pretty elitist. The powerboat set, just point it where you want it to go and floor it, seem to be the champions of "my wallet says I can do what I want." Sailors are a different kind of elitist. We know you can't just jump on a sailboat and point it where you want to go; you have to know stuff to make it work and we tend to relish that.
To be fair, unless they're racing a lot, neither group seems to have a lock on right-of-way ignorance.
Handyman858@reddit
One ia technology working with nature [sail where the wind allows] and the other is technology dominating nature [man make boat go that way, throttle full, ugh!]. It's often those outlooks that clash
Bob70533457973917@reddit
Sailing takes some knowledge and skill, which they're too impatient to acquire and develop.
here2learn914@reddit
They are jealous that sailors have skills and strength!
Anstigmat@reddit
Inferiority complex, and we have the right of way.
HampshireTurtle@reddit
We don't always have right of way.
A sailing dinghy requires less water and is much more maneuverable than a "gin palace", and in the Hamble, dinghies are specifically told to give way to bigger boats.
(makes sense as if there's any wind I can sail a laser where I like, while without bow thrusters a stopped motor cruiser or a yacht under power has no control and is at the mercy of the wind and current)
blueberrybannock@reddit
Sailboats under sail power alone always have right of way over power driven boats.
Birdchild@reddit
This is certainly not unilaterally true. My understanding is that the overtaking boat gives way (including a sailboat overtaking a power boat for whatever reason). Also, vessels restricted by draft have right of way. This list isn't comprehensive.
blueberrybannock@reddit
That is correct as well. Overtaking vessels are always “give way”.
Birdchild@reddit
If my answer is correct, your answer is necessarily not correct. It's irresponsible to post incorrect information about such an important topic, especially with such confidence.
blueberrybannock@reddit
I edited it for clarity. I typed that in response to the original comment which implied it was based on vessel size.
MSgtGunny@reddit
This is one of those, “you can be legally correct and still dead” things.
Birdchild@reddit
No it definitely isn't. Sailboats do not always have right of way over "power driven boats".
MSgtGunny@reddit
I never said they did? I just said this might be one of those situations where you can be in the right, but because you didn’t act defensively, you/your boat becomes injured.
Birdchild@reddit
The user you responded to is definitely not legally correct.
MSgtGunny@reddit
I’m not a lawyer, which is why I said “you can” not “you are”.
Birdchild@reddit
In the case of the user you responded to, you very well could be legally wrong and also dead.
HampshireTurtle@reddit
No they really don't and that attitude might be one reason for people to dislike sailing boats.
In a 16ft Wayfarer I did not have right of way over the 1000+ft Queen Mary 2 in Southampton Water due to Southampton Harbour byelaws (nor did I have any intention of trying my luck but the Harbour Master made very sure I was planning to give way).
The Col Regs state "A vessel of less than 20 metres in length or a sailing vessel shall not impede the passage of a vessel which can safely navigate only within a narrow channel or fairway..... [and] shall not impede the safe passage of a power-driven vessel following a traffic lane."
Later when specifying the "give way" and "stand on" vessels the Col Regs state sail must give way to
(i) a vessel not under command;
(ii) a vessel restricted in her ability to maneuver;
(iii) a vessel engaged in fishing.
and not impede vessels constrained by draft.
Generally I've ignored these rules and gone by:
if it's bigger than me I give way,
if it's working I give way,
if it's racing I give way,
if it's smaller than me or paddling I give way (I'm not going to wipe out a paddle board and rowing looks like hard work)
if it's another dinghy and I don't know how competent they are ... I give way.
The two things I'll play chicken with are other dinghies crewed by people I know are in control, and sandbanks.
blueberrybannock@reddit
That would classify as a “vessel restricted in its ability to manuever” not a “power driven vessel”. I was clear in what I wrote, there is a hierarchy and sailboats are near the bottom, but are above power driven vessels.
YeahwhateverDOOD@reddit
In my experience, people who own sailboats assume 100% of the time that they have the right of way just because they’re on a sailboat…. Even when they’re not actively under sail. If they’re under power then they’re considered a power driven vessel like any other power driven vessel such as a center console or cabin cruiser. Only have right of way if they’re actively under sail. This is what infuriates a lot of people, their lack of correct knowledge.
adb1228@reddit
Only when under power from a sail. Not your engines.
Most people that have sail boats don’t understand that.
FoxIslander@reddit
Add to that anyone can operate a power boat with an hour of basic training...not that way at all with sailing. It took me 10 yrs before I felt I had fully mastered sailing. That included 4 summers as racing crew.
JoeMojo@reddit
My favorite uncle had a great quote about this…
“J*, in sailing, as in life, don’t get yourself killed enforcing your right of way”
Pleased_to_meet_u@reddit
My father often said, "Graveyards are full of people who had the right of way."
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
The right of way thing was my guess too lol
CappyCapo0080@reddit
Stand in vessel would be more appropriate, but I agree, they always have to give way :(
Alecto7374@reddit
And they usually do....passing by at full throttle, 50 feet across the bow 😆
FestinaLente747@reddit
Well, if we’re going to get nit picky, wouldn’t stand ON vessel be more appropriate?
DangerousPlane@reddit
Nope. It’s question 7 on the safe boating exam. If a power boat and sailing vessel meet, the sailing vessel has right of way until another sailing vessel comes, which can stand in for the first so sailing vessels continue having right of way over power boats.
CappyCapo0080@reddit
My point was "right of way" isn't a term recognized by the coast guard anymore, it's stand on and give way vessels. Too many people took "right of way" to mean they don't need to change course when it becomes obvious that the give way vessel will not take maneuvers to avoid a collision.
CappyCapo0080@reddit
Yes, and if it's picky enough for the USCG, it's pick enough for me
marshman82@reddit
But too many sailors think that the right of way extends to when their sails are down.
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
You mean we're the stand on vessel when under sail?
TradGear@reddit
Sailboats don’t have right of way. In most cases they are the “stand on” vessel to maintain speed and direction while under sail; it becomes the power vessels duty to maneuver to avoid a collision. The “right of way” is not in the colregs and severely misunderstood but accepted by both sailors and those under power.
texasaaron@reddit
No such thing and not always,and this is probably the root of the problem (for professional mariners such as myself). To be fair, lots of wayward power boaters out there as well.
tcrex2525@reddit
I actually came here to say the reason sailboaters get a bad rap among professional mariners is because they always think they have the right of way when very often they do not. I’ve lost count of how many times we’ve been constrained by draft, or restricted to the traffic lanes, and some blow boater almost gets crushed because they think they’re in the right.
TradGear@reddit
Just the same; many (most) power boaters think that they have to give way to EVERY sailboat that they come across, whether under power or sail. I motor a lot (sailboat) in the AICW and many times I am the give way vessel; yet the stand on power vessel does not understand that they are to maintain speed and direction. It turns into an awkward high school dance that leaves us both pissed off.
millijuna@reddit
In my part of the world, I’m happy that the professionals/deep seas will often talk/coordinate with us via VHF. This is part of the reason why I carry AIS so that if I am doing something that has the possibility of concerning them, they can easily call me.
texasaaron@reddit
Thank you for that. AIS is a life saver when it comes.to.communication!
tcrex2525@reddit
I’d agree, but it’s staggering how often we try to contact a smaller vessel lazily tacking back and fort across the traffic lanes and no one ever answers.
WiredAndTeary@reddit
Many years ago was out on the water in a 39ft sailboat, when we became aware there small 15-ish ft dinghy sailing directly toward us.
The guy in the dinghy just kept yelling at us "Steam gives way to sail! Steam gives way to sail!" over and over and over again right up until the point when he sailed straight into us and fell in the water.
We were at anchor on a mooring buoy, and had been for some hours.
The guy even put in a complaint against us at the local yacht club, who understandably laughed him out the room.
tcrex2525@reddit
That’s hilarious!
…and also very familiar
texasaaron@reddit
The downvotes are hilarious. 🤣 I have been sailing (as in wind-powered vessels) since the age of about 7 and have owned upwards of a dozen different sailboats. I am now 55 and have been a professional mariner for about half my adult life. I know lots of careful, knowledgeable, seamanlike yachtsman. On the weekly, I witness many, many folks who are a hazard to navigation and would benefit from a.) a careful reading of the rules, b.) a glance at the appropriate Coast Pilot volume, c.) a working VHF, and d.) the knowledge of what frequencies are customarily used/monitored in a given location (see b above, and no, it's not always 16 or 13.)P
Oobenny@reddit
So many power Bo waters think they’re constrained by draft on inland waters. Check that definition again.
me_too_999@reddit
Yes, and often tack in front of a passing boat when colregs dictate "maintain heading."
There is no such thing as "right of way" in colregs.
Only stand on vessel which must maintain course and speed, and give way vessel which must adjust heading.
tcrex2525@reddit
Exactly. If you’re the stand on vessel, stand on! When you’re not, stay out of the way because it takes us forever to turn or stop. I don’t even work on that big a ship, which I think makes the problem even worse.
BraskysAnSOB@reddit
As someone with an appreciation for both power and sail, it’s not the right of way that’s the problem, it’s the abuse of it. I don’t mind giving way, but when I’ve clearly turned to take the stern and the sailboat tacks back into my path and I have to go back around the other way I get frustrated. It’s a respect thing.
If you’re in a car and there’s a pedestrian in the crosswalk, you stop and let them go. No big deal. If that pedestrian stops half way to make a phone call while you’re waiting you’re going to get mad. Same idea.
WalkingCrab@reddit
Totally agree. I see other sailors sometimes lacking considerations when they manoeuvre.
I mean, as a pedestrian, it doesn’t cost me much to let a car go if he’s holding a long line of traffic. Same goes for sailing.
Boils down to some individuals, on both sides, who feels entitled to be dicks.
struggleworm@reddit
Yea except t where I’m at they dont seem to have learned about right of way rules.
Rhueh@reddit
I've never encountered that, either in person or on line. I have often found powerboaters to be needlessly apologetic about being a powerboater when they find out I'm a sailor, but I've never had one be negative about sailing in any way whatsoever.
Horror-Promotion-598@reddit
I hate power boaters because they leave huge wakes.
jahmon007@reddit
My dad calls them “rag ships.”
Ok_Obligation2559@reddit
We should band together and pool all of our hate toward jet skis
mikemarshvegas@reddit
ha ha blow boaters!! A sailor, seaman, mariner, or seafarer is a person who works aboard a watercraft as part of its crew, and may work in any one of a number of different ...
Power boaters are #@%&! that make fun of blow boaters.
we are all people enjoying life on the water.
Wild4Awhile-HD@reddit
From a landlubber’s viewpoint both power and sail boats are just holes in the water to pour your money into. Sails are fine as long as there is a breeze but when there isn’t …. Then they needs some POWER. Personally I believe power boaters are a bit jealous of the knowledge and skills needed to sail effectively as all the power folks need is a key and fuel and awareness of their draft.
Wolfwere88@reddit
They are sick of all their passengers remarking how beautiful the $7k sailboat looks while they drive their floating second mortgage.
CyberMongrel@reddit
Don’t forget the kidney they sold to fill up with fuel.
dasreboot@reddit
Asked a guy with a 90 foot cruiser how much fuel it burned. He asked what throttle setting. I said full throttle. He replied 280 gallons per hour. So like $1000 to move your boat 30 miles in an hour.
NewPurpose4139@reddit
The 80' Hatteras Sport Fisher that a guy I knew lived on cost 6500 to go from Freeport Texas to Key West and he did it two or three times a year. But he never went full throttle so he burned much less fuel.
They sure are comfortable to live on though
alarbus@reddit
Meanwhile *wind is free*
Avokado1337@reddit
The Musto gear I most definetly need even though I’m only sailing in the summer isn’t though
CatHydrofoiler@reddit
I've replaced all my foul weather gear will Musto LPX and MPX... I am scared to add it all up. MPX 2.0 jacket and bibs MPX dry suit LPX jacket and smock Tall sea boots (these things f#ck, if you know what I mean! That was a compliment) From fleece suit Misc base and mid layer stuff
However.... It's worth it. The stuff just works better than anything else out there. Granted, most my dingy gear is Zhik and it's killer too.
They just replaced my year old MPX 2.0 jacket for free because of some weird stuff going on with the cloth.
If the warranty stuff holds up, their gear will be worth it
reggae_muffin@reddit
Ah yes, but the sails I use to catch said free wind are the most expensive bits of my boat.
MaximumTurtleSpeed@reddit
Something something beans, something fart joke 💨
chugachj@reddit
It’s because you’re unbearably slow, have the right of way, and I can’t tell if you’re about to switch tack.
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
And that's just the full fuel tank
Sock_Eating_Golden@reddit
I love power boats. But, there's nothing like watching a sailboat heeled over.
dermatofibrosarcoma@reddit
Now you are exaggerating in earnest… 2k more like it
csdirty@reddit
I think the hatred - which, as with so many things seems so much worse online than it really is - comes down to a difference in how we view the shared resource of a body of water. I go out to enjoy nature, to harness the wind (I love the moment the iron genny gets switched off).
Power boaters love speed, some love to roar of their engines. A power boat imposes itself on nature. Noise, smell, wake, loud music.
So it's two philosophies, and I think the sailboat haters know deep down that their way of using the resource is selfish and inconsiderate, but they justify it by invoking their right to do what they want. This leads to the knowledge that the people who use the resource in the opposite way to them are better stewards of the resource, and that leads to hatred and resentment.
the_third_lebowski@reddit
Your first part is probably the best answer so far. Then you go off the rails lol. "We just view the world differently . . . and so they must be upset because they know my view is the right one."
csdirty@reddit
Ha! Yeah, I agree.
Puzzleheaded-Ad-2746@reddit
I think powerboaters hate sailboaters because you think this way and call them selfish, inconsiderate, and think of yourself as holier than thou.
csdirty@reddit
If you read what I wrote, I specifically referred to "sailboat haters". I think there are lots of power boaters who don't hate sailboats and sailors, and there are lots of competent and considerate power boaters.
But I get it, my post does nothing to make a sailboat hater into a sailboat lover.
I still think the philosophies are different, though. There is zero overlap between a sailboat owner and a cigarette boat owner who runs a 1500 hp engine wide open without mufflers on an inland body of water. There is not a very big overlap between a sailor listening to music in the cockpit at anchor and a power boat blasting music in a 10-boat raft.
Anyway, you make a fair point.
aluditte@reddit
Agreed that you succinctly draw the parallels. I worked for years as a cook and first mate long and short chartering, delivery runs, and private owners on +65’ of both ilks. Generally, sailors are more adaptive and capable to handle a variety of mechanical, electrical, navigational issues as a matter of necessity and to be self reliant 1,500 nm offshore. I admired that compared to the turn key, self importance and disregard for the environment I found on most motor yachts. On a sailboat we were a part of a team that might require all hands to be capable and knowledgeable. On a motor yacht there was more of a servant relationship to the guests and owner and a blatant and consistent disregard for the environment and courtesy towards other boaters. This is generally from my east coast, Maine to Trinidad, Races to plotzing. Motor boats were steak and potatoes, beer, hard liquor and drugs, AC, wide screen TV’s, noxious fumes and a lot of wave thumping and bilge dumping. Sailors better diet and taste in wine and weed, books and storytelling, self entertaining, choosing a more gentle course by conferring with the wind and sea rather than battling or conquering it with a straight line trajectory regardless.
lmg00d@reddit
This is BY FAR my favorite explanation because I've never seen it expressed so succinctly. I think the dichotomy of enjoying nature vs. imposing oneself on nature is a huge tension in my life generally.
LorthNeeda@reddit
I don’t think a lot of motor boaters are thinking this deeply
erosannin66@reddit
It's creeping in their subconscious minds
kenlbear@reddit
Power yachts— where horsepower is inversely proportional to IQ. Going nowhere at great expense. Bikinis on a power boat: deck fluff. Pussy palace. Floating bordello. Fuelish extravagance. Power boaters have their own sayings about us sailors. But we’re too far offshore to hear them.
marlinbohnee@reddit
The real problem is the idiots that don’t know the rules of the road regardless of the type of watercraft. Just like cars you should have to be licensed to operate any vessel sail or power. The real problem is the damn jet skiers though. Everyone hates them.
Rico1958@reddit
I think it's more the other way around. As a power boater I really don't give the sailboaters much time in my head I just go do my thing
HumberGrumb@reddit
Unless another vessel is restricted in ability to maneuver, sailboats under sail have the right of way.
Massnative@reddit
I came to find this comment! Thank You!
kbeaver83@reddit
Merchant marine here currently on the Pacific. I got no hate.
Present_Armadillo_34@reddit
We invented engines so we wouldn’t have to rely on the wind.
Ok_Shoe6806@reddit
It’s like mountain biking vs road bikes, one is lame AF and the other is sweet
EddieTreetrunk@reddit
You should try sailing some time
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
What makes you think I don’t sail?
Tal_Farlow_@reddit
I always thought sailors looked down on power boats. I’m not a fan, personally. They have no boating skills, ignore safety, and always need rescuing
aufstand@reddit
They also seem to love to generate wakes and thus destroy nature, ignoring all warning signs and prior license-proven knowledge. Also, the noise! And the smell! I very much despise the whole concept. There are exceptions, but only very few.
Tal_Farlow_@reddit
Agreed. Very little regard for nature and wildlife
AZ424242@reddit
The thing few people mentioned, but maybe the main difference is, power boat owners do not realize how sailboats can maneuver. So:
Power boat owner - this smug sailor forces me to give the right of way, why can’t he turn just 5” on the wheel and help a bit like any motorboat.
Sailor - oh my god, if I turn 5” more to the wind, the boat is going to stop and I will loose all my altitude.
CardinalPuff-Skipper@reddit
My sail loft owner friend said once that pretty much all sailors are reasonably intelligent, whereas power boaters have a lower point of entry. They just need the money to buy.
rokosbasilica@reddit
Because the threshold above which people consider something a “yacht” in the colloquial sense is like $10k for a sailboat and like $400k for a power boat.
millijuna@reddit
I’m reasonably confident that I’ve been “part of the scenery” in the wedding photos of probably half a dozen couples. When we’re out for a day sail, it’s usually off this park where I frequently see wedding parties getting their pictures taken. A sailboat, even our 50 year old Ericson 27, is always nice to see in the background, especially when we’re flying the kite.
Auggie_Otter@reddit
I love the difference between a yacht in the colloquial sense and the technical sense. The average Joe thinks a yacht is only 200 a foot or more billionaire super yacht while the Coast Guard will say a 35 foot boat with a cabin that is used for recreation is a yacht.
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
a 10k sailboat? not sure that's a "yacht" I think you need to get to the £150l level (like a 35 foot cruiser) for a SB. And like 750k+ for a power.
TheLordVader1978@reddit
Is that $400k before they strap 8 Honda civics to the back?
OptiMom1534@reddit
It’s definitely 5k before they strap 8 Honda civics to the back 😂😂
TheLordVader1978@reddit
Ya think they get a group discount when they have to take them in for service? Say like 250-300 per unit and you got 8? $2500 per 100 hrs.
Wtfdidistumbleinon@reddit
This is why I hate myself, I’ve been paying a head doctor for years and never got to the bottom of it. I have a “powerboat” 6m with a 130 outboard and a yacht 9m with a diesel sail drive. The relief is so relaxing now I know the reason lol
gibarel1@reddit
I've seen it be the opposite irl, where sailers look down on power boaters because "they don't really care, are reckless and always in a hurry"
pkrycton@reddit
Sailers are generally skilled and attentive to the rules. Power boaters have an alarming number of unskilled seamen and treat the seaways like an open parking lot. Power boats are fun. Just lay back and blast through the water. Sail requires skill and attention and a joy to travel just by the winds. What sailers hate are the unskilled power boaters that ignore rules, safety, and courtesy. I've seen much of all the different seamen.
Pattern_Is_Movement@reddit
I’ve honestly never bothered to notice, if someone is going to be childish like that why would I waste my time listening.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
The internet
Willyatthebeach@reddit
Worked at a gas dock on a bay as a kid. Some great sail boaters. No shortage of obnoxious power boaters. But overall sail boaters were a much worse crowd. Often went out of the way to show contempt for my "dock rat" self, just purposely obnoxious. Bought far less gas and almost never ever tipped even when I provided an above average service, like essentially mooring their boat for them. And compared to power boaters displayed less seamanship ability overall also. Clearly a lot of people bought their craft because they had expendable income and thought it would be a cool thing to do without prior expirience. A couple times each summer Id have someone just ram the dock straight on. Again, some super cool sailors out there. But this was a generalized question.
your_Assholiness@reddit
I'm a sailor but I also have a small fishing boat. Power Boaters want to Show (Off) and Go, Sailors just enjoy being on the water. One of my favorite stories about sailing is Being Passed by a Butterfly on the ICW.
spookyjibe@reddit
We are slow and not very agile on the water so we get in the way.
Motorboats are fast, and completely clueless about the rules of the seaway or even how to operate their boats.
When I'm driving my motor boat and coming in behind a sailboat in a narrow channel I curse the sailboat.
When I'm sailing my sailboat, I laugh at all the wildly ignorant and uneducated motorboats out there.
portisleft@reddit
It's like asking why hikers hate campers, or kayakers hate jetskiers... people using the same thing for completely different reasons. I'm a sailor, and I bet fishermen have wed night racing courses, when there's 25 sailboats coming barrelling down on their anchored little fishing boat.
Even-Sky-3186@reddit
When that guy uses wind to cross from Maine to NY … for free and the power boat uses litres of fuel … that’s the reason.
LiquidDreamtime@reddit
The mindset of blending and and getting in-sync with nature vs. dominating it with power.
Sailboats must respect the sea and the weather, and work with them to get where we’re going.
Power boaters don’t know or care about the sea or the weather, they’ll plow through regardless.
dawa43@reddit
There is a distinct personality difference between sailors and power boaters.
The journey is more important, more fun than the destination - sailor
Are we there yet - power boater
Not in a hurry not on a schedule - sailor
Get out of my way, I have things to do and places to be - power boater
Also sailors tend to look down on power boaters because a lot of them are "credit card captains" with very little knowledge of their boat... This is not necessarily fair, but it is what it is
mimisikuray@reddit
The credit card captain is so true. Also quite the noisy bunch.
Graystone_Industries@reddit
This. The noise, and the comfort in producing such large amounts of it. Everyone has to consume this good, regardless of consent.
I assume you mean noise in all the ways.
mimisikuray@reddit
Yes, unrestrained and vulgar display of noise in all possible ways.
zooomenhance@reddit
My favorite phrase is that motorboaters are in a rush to get somewhere, while a sailor is already there.
old_hippy@reddit
Same with pontoon boats!!
LameBMX@reddit
when people ask, I refer to it as riding your back porch to a destination, not a car.
TheFluffiestRedditor@reddit
Yes, oh so yes. Captured the essence perfectly.
Jshan91@reddit
I’m filing that one away for later thank you
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
"I have never heard of the rule of the road" - power boater
romainmqr@reddit
I come from Brittany, France where I've always seen the opposite; sailors are perceived as sportsmen with navigation and meteorology knowledge whereas motor boats are more for people with less skill or education. But then I know more sailors than not so there's a bias there! Personally i like both, they just have different use cases
pharmamess@reddit
Neutral here.
I think it's cos of Popeye.
Agrijus@reddit
stinkpots gonna stinkpot
Wonderful-Shallot451@reddit
They are scared of what they don't understand
CaptainRibeye@reddit
So many power boats seem to enjoy waking me when Sailing out in the lower Hudson River where there is very little traffic and an enormous channel. Either they enjoy it or are completely oblivious because they seem uninterested in making any slight turn to give a bit of space. To me it boils down to gas prices…… they totally resent a modest sailboats cost to refuel.
oh_andsixteen@reddit
Sailing is Woke...until you remind the Inbreds how Christopher Columbus got here.
69vuman@reddit
I was taught in a sailing instructors class that in maritime law, the a boat under sail has the ROW over a powered boat, and the powered boat actually must yield. Sailors sometimes refer to powered boats as “stink pots.”
losthaligonian@reddit
As a member of both communities, I feel that powerboaters spend way less time thinking about sailboaters than sailboaters do about powerboaters. Powerboaters tend to regard sailboats as slow moving obstacles to be avoided, and their crews as fussy neighbours that are always complaining about the wind, or wakes and noise from other boats.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
I think irl neither thinks about the other much unless they are admiring a fine vessel or if there’s an incident. It’s once we get online that the feud intensifies.
aufstand@reddit
Nah, i really avoid them everywhere, at least when they're with their boats. Just almost always annoying.
Cute-Lock-6019@reddit
Where I'm from the rules say powerboats must give sailboats way. I suppose that could be a bit annoying if a sailboat is tacking away in front of them.
aufstand@reddit
I tend to avoid tacking or generally sailing near them if i can. I really don't like their noise, smell and their often stupidly-too-big wake. Also, most of them having their fenders out is telling another story i totally want to avoid...
millijuna@reddit
Yes and no, it's not always that simple. COLREGs are quite complex.
drroop@reddit
We're in their way.
We're slow
We drive erratically
We get too close
Similar to why cars don't like bicycles.
I don't like power boats because they throw big wakes and get in the way either from fishing, or having to wait for them to pass before tacking across their path.
The latter, yeah, I have the right of way, but I'm not going to count on them paying attention. Some of them have autopilots too.
In the marina I'm a bit leery of them because I think they don't like us and they have this tendency to heel to starboard.
Seeksp@reddit
I'm not a sailor, but I really feel the opposite is true. Power boaters act like bicyclists. They feel entitled. Are commonly obnoxious. The rules of the road/water only apply to them when they feel like it. They don't realize their wakes cause problems for other.
drroop@reddit
The auto industry were the ones that made jaywalking illegal. Before cars, it made perfect sense to cross the street in the middle of the block. It was not a problem until cars came along. People owned the streets until cars came along and took them over.
It is legal in some states to roll through a stop sign on a bicycle. A couple reasons for that. One, at the lower speed, there's more time to see the cross traffic. Two, the bicycle doesn't have the power or momentum to cause serious injury like a car does.
It's the same with the power boats vs. the sailboat. A 10,000lb boat at 5kts might do some damage, but just doesn't have the power to do serious injury like a 10,000lb boat at 20kts. You can tell the sailboat doesn't have the energy to cause as much damage because its engine to get it to 5kts is only 10hp, vs 300hp for the power boat. 10hp isn't going to provide the vehicle as much energy to cause injury as 300hp is. With a bicycle, they have about 1/2hp, or maybe as much as 2hp if it is electric. It is orders of magnitude less power and less momentum to cause damage.
When the power isn't free, either by sail or by pedaling, losing that momentum for traffic controls is much more onerous than just pushing a little lever, which is why the rules favor the sailboat and the bicycle.
Bicycles have the additional advantage of being small. Being able to sneak up between the line of cars waiting at the light and the side of the road, makes it so they're not adding to the line.
Entire_Toe2640@reddit
I am both a sailor and I own a motorboat. I consider sailors to be the only real boaters. To be a good sailor you need superior knowledge of every aspect of safe boating - navigation, seamanship, use of equipment and weather. Motor boaters generally believe using a boat is the same as driving a car. They have no knowledge of the navigation rules. They're answer to every problem is to apply more power. They get annoyed with slower sailboats.
Superglue_777@reddit
where i live there is mutual respect between commercial mariners and sailors as we give way to each other but the sailors absolutely despise the few ignorant pleasure boaters who feel entitled to not follow the rules just because they have a bigger boat
SDN_stilldoesnothing@reddit
because the hate is mutual.
So many power boaters don't know the rules of the waters. With that said, many sailors don't know the rules either.
hew3@reddit
My wife says that guys who operate powerboats are the same guys who bounce their partner’s head off the headboard during sex. I can’t watch a powerboat pounding into a chop without laughing.
WadjulaBoy@reddit
A mate of mine likes to have a friendly dig at how slow our sailing vessel goes compared to his fishing boat so I challenged him to a race, from Australia to Fiji.
Willing_Hyena233@reddit
I’ll take the bet. Our 57 ft motor-cat is up for it.
WadjulaBoy@reddit
"his fishing boat"
I'm aware other power boats have that range but "his fishing boat" wouldn't get more than 200km. Really are a sensitive lot you stink potters.
Willing_Hyena233@reddit
We are a Sportfishing boat and can make that distance without taking on extra fuel.
WadjulaBoy@reddit
Fair enough, bit of a run to the start point in Australia for you though huh?
Did you not factor that part in? Ahahaaa
Paypal will do fine for my winnings ;)
millijuna@reddit
It's like the old joke about the fighter pilot who pulled up along side the airliner.
Fighter pilot radios over "Hey, watch what I can do" and proceeds to barrel roll.
Airliner pilot radios back "How cute, watch this." after about 5 minutes of steady cruising, "See, isn't that great?"
Fighter pilot replies "You didn't do anything."
Airliner pilot replies "Sure I did. I got up, stretched my legs, took a leak, got myself a coffee, and sat down again."
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
Genius 😂
Xnyx@reddit
My taken is that it's a learned hate.. Sort of.
First.. Live aboards are the scum of earth don't ya know?
There are more sailors that live aboard than there are smokers and belchers that live aboard.
Smokers and belchers are actually evil trolls that sleep in their engine rooms...if you know what I mean.
Smokers and belchers rule all... Except the high seas where they must give way to the dainty sailor under way.
Im sure the big bad wolf is annoyed that red riding hood always wins.
/satire
naked_nomad@reddit
There is nothing like turning into the wind, raising the sails, killing the iron genny, veering off the wind and feeling the boat come alive as the sails catch the wind and the boat heels over. They say the adventure begins when a power boater gets to their destination. For sailors, the adventure is getting to their destination.
Ned_herring69@reddit
The older I get the more I realize how culturally accurate Waterworld was vis a vis "smokers" vs sailors
curi0us____@reddit
Guess it depends on where you live. Here we have a lot of commercial fishermen and they hate everyone, even each other. Everyone else gets along good.
vincec9999@reddit
Been around water my whole life and in the coast guard and never really experienced anyone who passionately hates either side. Commercial vessels def get frustrated but more often than not they are helpful.
GoldenPresidio@reddit
It’s the other way around lol
JoeMojo@reddit
I used to sail with a group pretty regularly ironically before I moved away to live at the beach. We all thought that all power boaters were lazy, unskilled, drunken rednecks. So, just sayin’, to be fair, it goes both ways.
alex1033@reddit
I sail most of the time in a coastal zone with plenty of islets, fjords and narrow fairways.
AFAIK motor boats hate me for that they have to slow down in the narrows and follow my pace, for that I can work upwind in a narrow channel tacking back and forth and they can't go straight at 40 knots (well, 40 knots are usually not allowed in the narrows, but who would remember?), for those club races where a pack of sailboats is focused only in the next mark and they will stand by their course, for that I refuse to take shallow places at the dock, and so on. Someone else wrote in comments that sailboats are cyclists on a highway.
I sail in the area where sailors and motorists make a lot more sense than in other areas, so I don't have any hate for the motorboats. But what I don't like about them is that make a lot of wake when it can be disastrous, they never look back or around when going at full speed, they are often unpredictable and unclear - even if they change their course to avoid you, it's so little so you change your course too and it brings even more confusion. Nothing special, same old stuff.
Ancientways113@reddit
Motoring
toyodaforlife@reddit
Sailors are generally well informed about conditions and safety, powerboats tend to ‘point and shoot’. It’s a cultural clash that cannot be solved. Sailors are better educated, smell better, cook better, sing better, do unmentionable things better, write better and are better looking 9.9 out of 10x, it’s science.
SVAuspicious@reddit
We know different sailors.
In my experience, power boaters generally smell better. Generators, A/C, inside steering, and showers twice a day help a lot. There is a limit to what you can do with baby wipes.
As for cooking, I know a disturbing number of sailors who provision from the frozen food aisle. I watched a boat in Norfolk load over a dozen delivery pizzas before leaving for Bermuda. I swear the stock for Hormel goes up before the Caribbean 1500 every year.
That isn't to say I don't cheat. Pastry for chicken pot pie comes from a Pillsbury tube. There are limits. Never ever "oven ready" noodles for my lasagna.
sail fast and eat well, dave
CaptainBFF@reddit
Mast envy
jannw@reddit
right of way, mostly, and many don't understand the "rules of the road" as well as they should
Defiant-Giraffe@reddit
Because the sailboaters actually look like they're having fun.
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
Is that what we call it? :D
worthaa@reddit
Watching a sailboat is the closest thing to dreaming.
MadtownV@reddit
“Ships at a distance have every man's wish on board. For some they come in with the tide. For others they sail forever on the same horizon, never out of sight, never landing until the Watcher turns his eyes away in resignation, his dreams mocked to death by Time.” - ZN Hurston
e4aZ7aXT63u6PmRgiRYT@reddit
The same reason men with magnum dongs and super model girlfriends are hated by other men.
thwbunkie@reddit
Before I could sale I had a rib , I used to think sailing looked crap. Then I learnt to sale and changed my mind. But I could be noted up having a gin and tonic . And power boaters would come so close to us for no reason and gasses would end up smashed. Due to ill health I’ve had to give up sailing and go back to the dark side . Bought a motor cruiser but I still hate poweboaters. ( I’ve not bought a dry robe yet)
Intelligent_Art_6004@reddit
Wut?
thwbunkie@reddit
Sorry I don’t know what WUT stands for. Sorry. Newish here
DaXBones@reddit
Jealousy.
1) At the end of a day on the water, sailors' kidneys are intact and not pissing blood.
2) My good friend has a 31' Sea Ray, and he's also a private pilot. Per hour, running his boat costs more than renting a Cessna. Me? my 30' sloop costs $0.53 a day in diesel fuel.
Dendroapsis@reddit
Do we? I thought it was the other way around. Power boaters have a reputation for being reckless and irresponsible among sailors. I’ve not really heard much hate coming the other way
Chris_Christ@reddit
Would sail boats get mad if canoes kept getting in their way?
emerging-tub@reddit
Well given that sail power has right of way in your example, yeah they probably would get mad, and rightly so.
Chris_Christ@reddit
You seem to misunderstand my example
emerging-tub@reddit
It only seems that way though.
_gooder@reddit
Those interloping stinkpots can get bent! Sailing came first! 😂
Current-Brain-1983@reddit
Because the sail has the right of way over power. Same mentality as someone who won't let you merge onto the freeway
l008com@reddit
Powerboater here. You guys drive me crazy because where I boat in and around Boston harbor, the little sailboat rental shops release like 30 sailboats into the main navigation channel without any clue what they're doing. So all the powered boats are trying to watch out for ships and other small boats and just get to where they're going, meanwhile a swarm of sailboats are just randomly darting all over the place.
Then over on the Charles river, it's the same thing. Except for some reason, the boats on the charles river always seem to stay out WAY past sunset with ZERO lights on the boats. Just in case it's not hard enough avoiding hitting these things, now you also can't see them coming half the time.
MargaretBrownsGhost@reddit
Because they didn't factor in the fact that they have to stay in range of land because of fuel supplies, while SV owners can actually wait a short while in the highs before sailing on to whichever destination they decide on. Being tethered makes for a less satisfying experience.
Willing_Hyena233@reddit
With 5,000 liters, our motor power cat has a range of 2,400 NM,so we can go pretty much wherever we want without having to do it leaning to one side. We don’t have to stick to established sailing routes in season to find the wind and we can go in a straight line. We can outrun storms if we need to with speed up to 18 knots.
dontdoxmebru@reddit
My dad would yell at the “god damn rag baggers” for operating under sail in harbors with no regard for the right of way.
smedlap@reddit
I see it as the other way around.
Big-Face5874@reddit
No hate from this power boater. But most boaters are complete idiots with no real knowledge of boating rules, so it’s not a surprise that these clowns would “hate” sailors.
I was a professional mariner that has more hours going in reverse than the average boater had in forward gear.
Sail boats have the right of way under sail. Give them the right of way.
drphillovestoparty@reddit
They are insecure about their ugly tupperware boats with high gas bills that lack any skill to operate, compared to our pretty sailboats that always catch glances from the ladies dreaming of adventure....
Brokenbowman@reddit
It’s two different mindsets, from my observation power boats are very destination focused - lets go to the wter
millijuna@reddit
I dunno, for my E27, a new mainsail is about 1/8 the cost of a new engine. We’ve been in the early stages of figuring out a repower, and a Beta 16 is about $16k when all is said and done. A new main is $2k.
Spiggots@reddit
We picked up a new mainsail and foresail (110) from North for about 3k, total. Worth looking into, new sails make for a totally different boat.
millijuna@reddit
We sewed our own 120 jib using a sailrite kit, and it’s worked fabulously. A kit for the main is about $900, but the value proposition is lower. At the boat show, we got a ROM quote for about $2100 Canadian for a new main, vs the $900 USD kit.
Brokenbowman@reddit
2k for an Ericsson 27 sounds about right for a basic Rolly Tasker cruising main. Check out some prices on high performance sails from North or Ullman. A dyneema laminate set of ..main, Genoa & blade jib will push close to what you’re paying for that Beta. Also why 16 hp? That’s a lot for a 27 ft boat. I have an 8hp Yanmar 1gm10 which pushes me along at hull speed.
millijuna@reddit
Oh, I’m well aware of what higher end/larger sails cost.
As for the engine, our current engine is a 40 year old 1GM10 with a lot of hours on it. It’s losing compression, and getting increasingly hard to start in the winter. The two cylinder engines are easier to start (yay glowplugs), are fresh water cooled (lets us plumb the coolant loop into our hot water heater), can take a bigger alternator with a poly-vee belt, and especially when winter sailing, we’ve found ourselves going into wind/chop that drops us to 3 or 4 knots, so a bit more power would be nice.
Spiggots@reddit
You have a C&C27? I've got a 26. They rock!
Brokenbowman@reddit
Cool, what year? Is it the 26 Wave?
Spiggots@reddit
Nope the 1st version, 1977. I believe the Waves got a little more ballast and maybe a shorter rig, right?
Whats funny is that all I could find online about the 26's was that they were super tender, and ultimately a failure beside the success of the 27.
Thing is, though, we have found the opposite - she is actually a fairly tough little pocket cruiser, perfectly comfortable w/no need for a reef until 20+ knots, and with the reefs in she'll hang in there till 30. Past that we respect her limits. New sails probably contribute to this impression tremendously.
Anyway, perfect boat for a couple, and a first boat. It's really warmed me to C&Cs, apparently the 27s - basically perfect mini cruisers.
All that said, I do have a bit of a smile to deal with, but I'm learning not to think about it.
Brokenbowman@reddit
That’s a great version of the 26, classic C&C design. the Wave is a similar hull to my boat but as you said, shorter rig & shoal draft. The 25, 27 & 30 were all introduced first and then C&C introduced the 24, 26 & 29 which cannibalized the former models. Still a great boat with a”cheater “ PHRF rating!
Spiggots@reddit
Yeah seems like they had a hard time recapturing the magic of the 27 and 30, especially.
crosaby77@reddit
First season out sailing last year. I just was shocked at how motor boaters in our experience can’t wait a single second or ever let us just try to dock in peace. Always cutting in front but that cyclist of the sea is so fitting ahah. I guess that makes me understand a bit better. If you’re in a hotrod it’s probably a little tough to sit the extra minute and watch some sloth approach the pier.
Ohbertpogi@reddit
Powerboaters hate their own kind, or anything that floats and produces wake for that matter.
mimisikuray@reddit
You’re right, they do hate each other as well.
Lady_JadeCD@reddit
Want to shut up a power boater. Ask them for a race. To Bermuda.
TBarretH@reddit
As the saying goes, "They hate us cuz they aint us"
OptiMom1534@reddit
Nailed it.
Suitable-Ad6145@reddit
They hate us because ah they ain't us
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
I believe it goes “they hate us cuz they anus”
OptiMom1534@reddit
Pretty sure it’s the other way around. There are more of us than there are of them. They can only go as far as their fuel tanks will take them but we can cross oceans….
djjolicoeur@reddit
I have a power boat and a sailboat so I see both sides. A lot of boaters on both sides don’t even know the basic rules of the road and a lot of sailors wind up getting in the way unnecessarily. a lot of power boaters don’t even know they’re supposed to give way to sailboats in my experience.
Vaguito52@reddit
Because we get right of way
FrogFlavor@reddit
Hikers hate mountain bikers so maybe it all averages out
Mackey_Corp@reddit
They’re just jealous they have to spend all that money on fuel and we’re making a whole tank last all summer.
butnotfuunny@reddit
When I was learning to sail in Florida in the 80s power boats were always referred to as ‘stink pots’. So there’s that.
XS4Me@reddit
Good times
standardtissue@reddit
"Waves" yeah no, that's wake. Like I never thought morays would eat my face until a moray ate my face.
REDDITSHITLORD@reddit
Ahh, the Battle of Lake Travis...
MargaretBrownsGhost@reddit
Wake upon wake upon wake crossed by more wakes and amplified by even more wakes......
Compounded by half the boats bearing banners almost as big as the boats themselves...
Must have been fun... Not!
MargaretBrownsGhost@reddit
That isn't to say that one scene in Caddyshack wasn't enjoyable...
SmokeyMacPott@reddit
Never forget, never forgive
losthaligonian@reddit
The easiest way to piss off a powerboater is to leave your halyards unsecured overnight. Nothing raises the hairs on a non-sailor's neck like the slap of a steel cable against an aluminum mast.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
To be fair that sound is annoying when ur trying to sleep. I’ve secured neighbors’ halyards more than once.
dravideditor@reddit
Sailboats are in their way. They want to zoom around FAST, we want to putt putt or sail 5mph.
usual_suspect_redux@reddit
Pee pee size.
Psilologist@reddit
They're jealous. I can go around the world non stop. They can make it a few miles and sink with a small wave.
DanielvMcNutt@reddit
Rag haulers..., thinking they have the right of way without their laundry on fishing poles
LibrarianSocrates@reddit
we call them "stink boats"
SailingSpark@reddit
I also Kayak, you would be surprised how many powerboats love to wake Kayaks.
JackasaurusChance@reddit
Because we are better at everything!
Atomic-pangolin@reddit
A number of things- power and sail think they’re better than the other, in a sense we kinda are the cyclists of the sea as someone else pointed out and we have right of way. And sail doesn’t like motor because they’re douchebags, yet we forget our true enemy are the a***ole jet skis/waverunners/ whatever they are
DahDitDit-DitDah@reddit
No one likes speed bumps
sailorsail@reddit
I’ve only gotten respect from power boaters. Sailing is a lot harder than power boating and they know it
kdjfsk@reddit
probably the crippling financial realities of the cost of gasoline, making them want to go in a straight line to save gas, meanwhile they have to give right if way to sailboats who can zig zag all day for free.
Starboardsheet@reddit
It might have something to do with speed. I’ve seen a lot of good seamanship and mutual respect between trawler/ displacement power boaters and sailors. Both have the slow boat attitude and an awareness of currents and therefor more planning.
redwoodtree@reddit
Stink potters be stink potting.
Roadscrape@reddit
Oh, great line! I'm a sailor and roadie!
jefurii@reddit
Maybe sailing is an implicit criticism of power boating?
haikusbot@reddit
Maybe sailing is
An implicit criticism
Of power boating?
- jefurii
^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^Learn more about me.
^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Roadscrape@reddit
For me it was the inconsiderate stupidity of most power boaters. "No Wake" means "can't read". Getting rolled out of the ICW into mud flats by Bertram's driven by the blind. Yes there are good power boaters. My uncle was commodore of the TN Coast Guard Aux. Even he admits that with no IQ test for power boats even the village idiot can drive one. BTW, I grew up sailing and power boating/ skiing.
capitali@reddit
Destination vs Journey - I see that mentioned a lot in the comments and I think this is a big part of it. I am a live-aboard traveling on a small sailing catamaran. It’s all journey with the closest thing to a destination being a general direction.
I am around many live-aboard traveling powerboats (trawlers) and they are as polite and concerned about wakes and safety and communications as I any group could be. They are power boaters doing a journey though, not a destination.
I really do think this is probably the biggest point of conflict between the different groups. We have different needs, wants, and goals. That’s how you define different.
AeroRep@reddit
I think the hate is because powerboaters hate that we have right of way, and don’t have a clue why. And they have no idea how to operate a sailboat, so inferiority complex. Probably think all the lines are just to “look cool”.
Salt-y@reddit
It's all about the right of way.
capitali@reddit
I think power boaters dislike sailors because sailors often point these things out to power boaters who’s big complaint is “sailboats are two slow”
Khakikadet@reddit
While most recreational boaters have little understanding of COLREGs, WAFIs know just enough to get themselves in trouble, i.e. "I only need to know Rule 18, I have right of way"
Also yall look like you're having so much fun in miserable conditions. But it's most when you're in the way, not showing up on radar. One red light I'm supposed to see. Not a fan.
Resculptured_art@reddit
Finally, someone used the WAFI acronym! Its the funniest term I've heard yet. And I'm a sail guy lol
krysjez@reddit
What does it stand for?
Resculptured_art@reddit
Wind Assisted F-ing Idiot
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
What do you mean when we are in the way?
Khakikadet@reddit
A lot of sailors tend to focus on the part of Rule 18 that says power driven vessels should keep out of the way of sailing vessel, but neglect rule 9 that says don't impeded vessels in narrow channels or fairways. It happens more often than it should, but just a little while ago we were outbound down the Delaware River and a catamaran pulls out in front of us and turns to raise his sail in the middle of the channel. Happens all time in SF Bay as well, sail boats trying their luck against unlimited tonnage vessels. I don't want to kill anyone but it seems like some sailors have a death wish.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/CuNvcbirBU7/?igsh=MXM0Nzdna2IxczFyNg==
Comfortable-Heat8233@reddit
I love to sail but I like to fish more so I have a power boat. I’ve had friends make comments about snooty sailboat owners and the right of way thing is mentioned often. I always counter with “have you ever sailed?” “No?” “It’s pretty cool man, very peaceful”.
Photodan24@reddit
I don't think too much about hate coming from people who willingly ride on vessels that are more stable when capsized.
StatisticianNormal15@reddit
I think it’s because it actually takes skill to captain a sailboat and we have the right of way.
Weak-Carpet3339@reddit
Because we can enjoy boating doing something they can't. Easy to turn a key and the boat moves. Power boaters see us as showoffs. How often do you see a commercial of a boat other than a sailboat.....Never.
TemperatePirate@reddit
I'm convinced you made up the term "blow boaters" just for this post.
I think most power boaters don't think about us at all.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
The earliest use of blow boater I could find on Reddit was 14 years ago
This post however was inspired by comment sections on Instagram. Check out Qualified Captain if you want to see this term used in the wild
Defiant-Giraffe@reddit
No, I've heard that for decades.
Not to say I agree entirely with OP; they're being a bit melodramatic.
But stink pots and blowboats, that's been a thing for a long time.
1959Mason@reddit
Sailboaters need to tack back and forth to get upwind. Powerboaters go in a straight line. They don’t understand why the sailboats keep changing direction. It confuses them and makes them angry. In their self absorbed minds they think the sailboat is somehow out to get them. Hilarity ensues.
HalfMoonHudson@reddit
I do both. I hate everyone on the water. Actually I see where everybody is coming from(also kayak but haven’t given SUP a try yet ). Also everyone look out for everyone please.
WhatIGot21@reddit
When I was having my boat surveyed during the sea trial we saw a sailboat and I said that is beautiful and that I couldn’t wait to move on to sailing, the surveyor said don’t be a blow boater, they think everything is free because the wind is. I’m still planning on getting a sailboat eventually.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
Lol where did he get that idea?? Any sailor worth their salt knows how expensive this hobby is. But I guess that makes sense since he isn’t a sailor.
millijuna@reddit
It’s either expensive in money, or expensive in time. We’ve just spent the last week sewing a new set of upholstery for our sailboat. Next up is sewing a new mainsail.
WhatIGot21@reddit
Yeah, I know how expensive anything on the water is, currently in a floating camper.
Jealous-Key-7465@reddit
Just like the motorists harass and roll coal on cyclists.
I’ve been out training and the same POS captain on a 65’ charter in the middle of nowhere comes and wakes our bow full speed then S turns and wakes another sailboat on their bow.
I made it public on local social media and should also drop a google review. Total micro penis move
andyhenault@reddit
It’s like the relationship between cyclists and pickup truck drivers.
Overall-Tailor8949@reddit
I'd blame it on that relative to "p_n_s envy" called "Fuel dock envy". Especially with the high cost of go-go juice.
PHPaul@reddit
Not sure I’ve experienced this. From a UK perspective there’s probably a general sense that people who use engines are a bit vulgar and probably went to a comprehensive, but none of it is serious.
Aargau@reddit
They don't. This is a manufactured outrage position.
By and large everyone gets along, only if you use the corner cases do you find something worth posting on reddit.
Random-Mutant@reddit
As a sailor (owned a 30’ race keelboat and both harbour and passage racing and cruising) and now a power boat owner (21’, 200 on the back, I’m older, have kids), plus having insight from my days flying gliders (power pilots have the same attitude to glider pilots)…
I think power boaters see sailboats as “unpredictable”. They seem to turn 90° at random intervals not related to navigation or destination. The can’t read the signs of a vessel ready about, or remember that the draft is ten times deeper. What’s all that heeling about too? Dipping your lee rail just looks unsafe.
Sailing is definitely about the journey; power about the destination. There is a very different mindset. And this dichotomy causes lack of understanding of the other’s reasons for being on the water. Wind and water is either a force to be worked with or overcome respectively.
So it’s somewhat like arguing whether the image is a vase or two heads in profile. As sailors are more forgiving (it’s the nature of the challenge- work with what you have) we* don’t have a problem with power (much- keep your wake down please) and power boaters are more obstinate (get out of my way! The sea is my birthright!) then there will always be this difference.
MyCrackpotTheories@reddit
It's like a high school dropout resenting college graduates. They think that sailboaters think they are better than motorboaters, so they send the perceived hate back.
The thing is, sailors ARE better, so it all works out.
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
Mirroring perceived hate… I like that one.
JonnyRocks@reddit
i was really into sailing abput 25 years ago and the community was very anti power boater. we didnt have much in tbe way of online communities to find complainers so i never saw the otger side
REDDITSHITLORD@reddit
You ever get mocked by fat people while you workout? It's the same mentality.
MasterShoNuffTLD@reddit
Because they’re wrong
Brandgeek@reddit (OP)
The only right answer
nylondragon64@reddit
I like and sail on the great south bay long island N.Y. most power boaters have no clue as to the rules of navigation. They pass to close and the wrong side. Their wake just slow us down. Plus the speed limit is 40mph. Than you get speedboats going like 80mph. Oh theirs another $100 of fuel. Take that out of the bay and on the ocean where it belongs. So here is the opposite of your post in my eyes.
saltwaterflyguy@reddit
The number of people that cannot dock their boat is truly astonishing. I have owned both and I could back both into a slip, a double screw power boat which is about the easiest thing on the planet to back down and a single screw nearly full keel sailboat which is the second most difficult thing to back down with the single screw lobster boat being the most difficult, those guys are amazing in how they can handle a boat.
nylondragon64@reddit
Yeah its the guys with fishing boats at are real good at it. The weekend warriors with pleasure boats and think they are driving a car, they are the comedy act. For me predominant sw wind. My slip is east west. Not need to back in. Pier along side. I sometimes do in like wind.
mcm87@reddit
In addition to the things everyone else has said, a lot of powerboat guys hate sailboats because they hate cruisers/liveaboards for being what they perceive to be bums/boat trash/vagrants.
MikeMelga@reddit
In my European country, sailboat owners have huge respect from power boaters.
Sailboat owners are a bit neutral on power boaters. On one side, they enjoy the ocean like us. On the other side, it's simply a different crowd, we don't relate.
LateralThinkerer@reddit
Sailboats are seen as obstructions with rights of way.
Kryptosis@reddit
Definitely the right of way point.
jh937hfiu3hrhv9@reddit
Self absorbed egomaniacs who view anything slower as an obstacle. You are not a person, you are flotsam. Same relationship between motorcyclists and cagers.
gedmathteacher@reddit
Who’s who in the motorcycle/car example?
jh937hfiu3hrhv9@reddit
Motorcyclists are the sailors. Cagers try to run them off the road or pretend they are not there.
gedmathteacher@reddit
Gotcha. I ride and sail but I’ve never compared the vehicles!
bga93@reddit
Cuz I get like 1 mpg. We can all hate cabin cruisers plowing through the no wake zones together though
n3w1ight@reddit
I am a sailor and I hope power boats disappear for good as they just destroy the environment and are super inefficient. Only sailing should be allowed :)
Ok-Jury8596@reddit
Damn, I was gonna say all that!