BMWs used to be amazing. I still plan on being buried in a 68' 2000. It's been a slow spiral down the shitter ever since - with some brief reprieves: The M3 of the late 80s stands out. And as ugly as it was, my brother had a 2002 BMW M Coupe - remember the one that looked like a goddamn orange shoe? But omg, we had so much fun taking that car to the Phoenix speedway. It will always be legandary to me, but I'm guessing most people think it's hideous.
The new BMW cars (hell most manufacturers) are just bloated money grabs - $90,000 for a Jeep. A jeep... Isn't this where Nero fiddled?
The BMW M used to mean something: Built for driving, dammit. Now you can get the badge without the engine for extra $.
Half the moms in my neighborhood have an M badge. Hilariously enough, it's the real M cars (I live in Franklin, TN - home to extremely rich people that float below the radar). The other half drive tanks - Navigator, Escalade, etc.
Today, BMWs are the same as Audis - cars for douchebags. Ooh, look at my horizontal blinkers!
What a bunch of twits.
Douchebag downvotes incoming from people who think a Veyron is an actual sports car, drive 6,000lb porkers around with M badges, and hate being faced with that truth. Hodor.
eh ma gerd - They are bring back the goddamn shoe! This is a BMW I might actually buy.
https://www.roadandtrack.com/news/a43960305/bmw-clownshoe-cost-build/
Yes the brand has been diluted for money. BMW slaps M on a lot of things, AMG goes all the way down to 43, and somehow every Audi is an S. However, this doesn’t discount how manufacturers still output some amazing cars.
> somehow every Audi is an S
lol\^
I agree, there are some amazing cars out there. I think I am just less impressed with the innovation these days from most car manufacturers (other than TSLA) - and no, I don't own one. But only a luddite doesn't accept their technological prowess.
10 years ago, the average price of a car was 30k. Today, the average price of a car is $47,000, and most cars now offer everything as an option. So, maybe I am not impressed that mileage has barely increased, speed is stagnant, and car weights continue to rise as fast as those of Americans'.
wow, look at all the insecure twits downvoting me. I'm sorry your cars spins it's wheels like a politician trying to answer a yes/no question. Or you spent $300,000 on a car you can only drive on special occasions.
Stop being betas
Wish they’d make a Velar SVR but at the same time I wouldn’t buy it because I’m not willing to accept the crazy depreciation on a range. It’s absurd how badly they depreciate.
A high end Velar is already as expensive as an entry RR sport so it makes no sense to buy the Velar as the sport is much more comfortable and luxurious.
Oh I agree that Velar is by far the best looking Range Rover, especially with the new Sport and RR design. I'm sad that it is also going to be the third favourite child of the family.
Can't imagine the amount of cluelesness it takes to downvote this comment lol. Range Rover is awful to drive and it feels like a hot hatchback compared to G 63. Both are awful cars for the price though.
Family member owns a 2021 model and it's super comfortable bumps wise but it handles and stops like a marshmallow also body roll is very noticable almost G wagon territory. But yeah i hate fat cars.
Mate if you's driven a RR in 2018 you know what to expect. They don't change much. Remove a corporations dick from your throat and you will see that as well.
Mate I've driven multiple L405 and L460, it's a completely new platform, I agree the body roll in the older car is bad but the new one is like chalk and cheese (new active roll bars, rear wheel steering etc), maybe back your assumptions with facts before acting like a fool on the internet.
Yes, the point is that the G Wagen is every bit as nice of a place to be (which was the other person’s point) while also being faster and better off road.
I love the G wagen, but I would rather daily drive a car that doesn’t require I slam the doors with like 100lbs of force every single time I get in or out.
Also, the G wagen doesn’t have adjustable ride height and the rear legroom is much tighter.
The Range Rover is simply a more comfortable car.
Crazy to think just a few years ago 600 horse power had everyone screaming nascar and super car levels. Now it’s just another day. 600 is what 300 used to be.
My Impreza has 148 horsepower, I can't even imagine driving a 300 horsepower car let alone a 600 horsepower car. I feel like the power would kill me lol.
As someone who jumped from 150-430 you get used to the power super quick.
Although it all depends on how the power is produced and how the transmission is geared as well. But after a couple of months you might start to feel the itch for more lol
In all fairness, the horsepower figures are just peak power ratings under ideal conditions at wide-open throttle. If you’re driving conservatively, the ECU will trim the fuel to its lowest consumption setting and the same 600 hp engine will only produce about 150-200 to get you going in traffic.
That’s why cars with 90 hp can still “keep up with traffic”, but would need proportionally more throttle to do so.
Eh, win some and lose some. If I’m getting downvoted by powertrain engineers, I’ll be open to an education. But seeing as I’ve built, tuned, and serviced fuel injection systems for the last eight years with professional results, I’m going to stand by what I said.
You are more correct than the goobers downvoting you know.
I’ve got a 496hp V8 that, at cruise, works on 4 cylinders. I’m assuming it takes about 75 hp or less to keep it rolling down the road.
Besides that. HP is calculated. Torque is measured.
Pretty sure the reason why you got downvotes if any is because gasoline engines maintain almost identical AFR for the most part and AFR only weakly influences power in a gasoline engine. Leaning things out just isn’t done because it causes emissions to go through the roof as the catalytic converters want to see stoichiometric AFR. At WOT things run rich but that’s because the extra fuel cools things down and actually slows down the pressure spike from combustion. That means less power, not more.
Modern DBW is what’s really making things more tractable. The throttle is barely responding to the accelerator pedal to make the resulting torque response nice and linear instead of just giving you tons of torque from small pedal inputs.
I didn’t say the ecu leans the mixture. I said fuel trimming means fuel volume is adjusted based on the throttle position and the amount of air going into the engine, measured by the MAF sensor. So a 14.7:1 AFR is achieved at any possible throttle position, but obviously at lower throttle position, there will be a lower air and fuel delivery, which will yield lower torque and therefore lower HP. Except for WOT, where it’ll probably be closer to 12.5:1.
You are right. What is the use of so many horsepower when you can't drive that fast?
Mine got 329, but only on some stretches on German Autobahns i can go full speed. Torque is more useful. Hp sells, torque wins races.
>Hp sells, torque wins races.
That's just plain wrong. Hp is a function of torque times rpm, so they're connected. Torque at low rpm shows you if the engine is usable in regular driving conditions, but hp is king for racing.
It's Carroll Shelby's quote.
I am very well aware about the relation with hp & torque: Torque × rpm / 5252 = horsepower
F1 race cars have high hp/ low torque due to the very short stroke motors and insanely high rpm.
Drag race cars (Shelby's reference) has it the other way around.
As F1 situations, hitting >140 mph/225 kmh, don't appear here much in daily life. Even if in Germany fewer and fewer stretches of Autobahns you can go flat out. I keep it with the torque. ( 0-60 mph/ 0-100 kmh < 5 seconds with 600 nm torque).
It's a completely different platform to what I'm used to. My car is AWD, a Sedan, and a CVT with 148 horsepower, going to a FWD manual hatchback with 400 horsepower and it also being my dad's car, it was so different that it was scary IMO.
I went from 170 to 295 in my Golf wagon and it definitely makes a difference at higher speeds (and when launching it, lol) but around town normal driving it may as well be the same. 300hp isn't really a whole lot in the grand scheme of things
The kind of car it’s in matters a lot. An awd sedan with all the driving assists and modern traction control is way less scary than a gen 1 viper even if it has more power and is faster.
I know what you mean! When I was younger I went from a base 350z to a 6.4 Hemi. It felt insane and I was even scared to drive it for a while. Now the speeds don’t bother me but EV’s do, that instant torque is scary sometimes
i’ve owned 10+ cars, and never had a one with over 220hp. i think my 3500lb, 17’ sedan would feel awesome with 300-400hp, but more than that seems like it would just cost in fuel, brakes and tires while providing minimally more thrill. at that point, it only matters if you’re drag racing, drifting or roll racing.
Yeah, I mean my current car is pretty quick at 250hp. I think the about the S4 however, and desire it for the hp bump. But then whenever I head out to my local twisty turns, and on ramps, and I break the law almost immediately, I think "maybe 250 is enough"
Then when I get out of the car, it's back to wanting more :(
It always surprises me by how many Range Rovers I see. Deffinitely the most >$100k vehicle I see on the road. They start at like $107k now, and I see them everywhere, even in super rural areas.
It's because they always are most handsome, distinctive looking SUV's out there.
Look at BMW's. They the XM looked like a lego model.
Look at Merc's. The Maybach looks so ordinary. You have keep convincing yourself it was worth all the money.
Look at Bentley. The Bentagya....or whatever its called has a face only a mother can love. That too from a manufacturer who's sedan is one of the most beautiful in the world.
Look at Audi. They looked great about 15 years ago. Then they kept the same design and now its aged.
So it's not surprising that people buy Range Rover's. Plus a typical owner has multiple cars. So they do not need Corolla reliability.
It’s because of the IRS light truck rule. It meets the high price requirement to write it off entirely to reduce your tax exposure. You’ll see a lot of small business owners with it or other high priced SUV’s.
I think because they really are fantastic cars, and at 100k they truly feel uber premium before you end up getting into Bentley territory. Yes there are reliability concerns etc, but just for interior quality and luxury they are hard to beat
Because if you're buying them new, they're really really nice cars. Reliability can be very hit or miss, but if its new, you just have a loaner. The people who buy them don't seem to mind
Sorry guys this must vary by country, im UK born and bred and Land Rover is sort of unique in that the models stand apart in name, with the Range Rover simply being called Range Rover (while still being built by a company called Jaguar-Land Rover). Semantics I guess.
Most people (here in Canada) only ever call or a Range Rover but it’s formal name is longer.
And when I google “Range rover uk”, the first result takes me to autotrader UK which has the full name: https://www.autotrader.co.uk/car-search?advertising-location=at_cars&aggregatedTrim=&body-type=&colour=&fuel-type=&lat-long=43.653768989782584%2C%20-79.41871918973378&make=Land%20Rover&model=Range%20Rover&sort=relevance&transmission=&year-to=2020
Yeah they started getting delivered mid 2022 while the partnership with BMW was announced 2019. The S68 only premiered with the facelift x7 m60i which was delivered late 22 I think. They should have just modernized their 5.0 supercharged and called it a day IMO, unfortunately Thierry Bollore shut down all ICE investment.
The 2024 Land Rover Range Rover SV will come with a 606-HP hybrid V8 engine, while the PHEV 550e version will have 542 HP. This is part of Land Rover's commitment to electrify its entire lineup by 2026.
The 606-HP hybrid V8 engine in the Range Rover SV is a combination of a 4.4-liter V8 engine and an electric motor. It has a maximum torque of 553 lb-ft and can reach a top speed of 155 mph. The hybrid engine can deliver up to 31 miles of electric-only range.
The PHEV 550e version of the Range Rover SV has a 2.0-liter four-cylinder engine coupled with an electric motor. It can deliver up to 42 miles of electric-only range and has a maximum torque of 398 lb-ft. It can reach a top speed of 137 mph.
Both versions of the 2024 Land Rover Range Rover SV come with advanced features such as a 12.3-inch digital driver display, a 10-inch touchscreen infotainment system, and a premium audio system. The vehicle also has adaptive cruise control, lane departure warning, and a 360-degree camera system.
The 2024 Land Rover Range Rover SV is expected to be available in the US in early 2024. Pricing for the hybrid V8 and PHEV 550e has not been announced yet.
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