We have a large number of chromebooks in our business and for what we use them for their hardware is fine, but the EOL means they become redundant for us. We never expected this to happen so soon after purchase and we are disappointed from an environmental and business perspective that good kit is having to be disposed. Come on Google you can do better.
welp more disinfo/misleading titling.
No they don't have an "expiry date"; simply speaking additional, free, customised operating system updates are developped for 5-8 years for most models; after that the company stop bothering and mostly update new models instead, but the computer doesn't stop working at all (until it's physical broken or otherwise damaged by the user or something i guess).
This is also independant from typical playstore update; that aren't blocked either (if your favorite software have updates; they'll keep installing as long as it's technically possible).
This is like saying "windows 7 computers are expired ewaste". No, this is openly misleading at best.
The red states sellers do have an issue with making "fragilized versions" to sell in their states intending them to break down faster physically to sell new ones, but that's a completely different problem.
But *why* cut off updates to these devices in the first place?
ChromeOS is a much lighter OS than Windows, so surely it would run fine with the latest updates on newer devices as well if Wondows does on a 10+ year old PC, provided you upgrade RAM and SSD.
> But why cut off updates to these devices in the first place?
If you read my post they're not cutting it off and that's a lie.
Google don't write themselves new updates for it, but if your software have updates written by their developpers, they'll still install via the playstore (which is where they typically install).
> ChromeOS is a much lighter OS than Windows, so surely it would run fine with the latest updates on newer devices as well if Wondows does on a 10+ year old PC, provided you upgrade RAM and SSD.
> provided you upgrade RAM and SSD.
I suspect you mislead on purpose : as the SSD and ram are built in inside the ""CPU"" (SOC : monolythic system on a chip) in a lot of models, they cannot be replaced.
And no, it's not because of a vendor lock in which you would love ot imply i suspect, but because chromeos is a side project and consumer product built on redeveloppment of embedded and arm(riscv) hardware.
You can't put a "new" or M.2 SATA SSD into a phone. It's enlarged phone hardware with a large screen and keyboard.
Secondly, if you want to run a different OS version on the chromebook you absolutely can. If you want to make your own roms, you can. They're just not going to hold your hand on a 10+y old model for you because there's other things to do.
You litterally don't understand the older models aren't standard laptop hardware.
Chromeos is what happens when you devel linux and risc and some commercial wandering in point out this is 90% of a working computer, so they put the finishing touches on it to make it an usable laptop from it.
> Derry Lyons, director of information technology services for South Kitsap School District, near Seattle, Washington, explained in an email to The Register that Chromebook expiration doesn't entirely brick the devices but does render them unusable for a critical function: testing.
> "For South Kitsap, the constraining factor in end-of-life is that the publishers of our state testing software require specific (current) ChromeOS versions to run the clients," said Lyons. "Once a Chromebook goes end-of-life and is no longer eligible for OS updates, we have a very limited time before the device is no longer supported for state testing - a BIG need for mobile devices.
>"Technically, the Chromebook may still function for general browsing purposes, but it would be incompatible with the testing software," he said.
Context for the organization that published the initial report: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Interest_Research_Group
> expiration dates are based on the certification of a given model
Not to defend google, but this is more of an issue with the school districts handling of contracts with the private testing services they contracted.
The problem is people in general just care about the price.
Often times, when you explain that the $300 laptop is better than the $100, not just because of the support window but build quality, capabilities, etc all they take from it is that they can buy more of the $100 to cover the ones that will break or even that it will be someone else's problem two years from now but I'll look like a genius now.
This isn't just a Chromecast issue, the same talk happens with Windows systems, just more on gettng the lowest end equipment they can find to "save money" only to complain six months later that it's so slow and can't run anything.
Notwithstanding the absolutely valid [point about kids](https://old.reddit.com/r/hardware/comments/12trfmg/chromebook_expiration_date_repair_issues_bad_for/jh50bkv/) in another comment reply, it does remind me of
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boots_theory
... the "Sam Vimes Boots Theory" (also identified by others and described in different terms, multiple times over the course of at least decades, if not centuries, e.g., by James Baldwin as cited in [this piece](https://www.nytimes.com/2011/06/25/opinion/25blow.html)).
There are so many "paradoxes" in economics and human behavior. Of course, I use quotes because they aren't really outright paradoxes / contradictions. But, it's hard not to be annoyed sometimes by some of the dissonance - e.g., everyone clamoring for the cheapest possible goods while decrying the displacement of locally owned stores by Walmart (where "locally owned stores" and "Walmart" are really 'variables' / 'stand-ins' for any number of frequently heard pairings).
I believe I saw a story in the mass media not too long ago highlighting the underlying 'problem'. It's an issue that crops up in (human) decision-making continuously, and it's not as though many people aren't aware of it, at least, when attention is brought to it. It's very easy to make "small(er) decisions" in individual moments that contradict each other ultimately. It's natural as perspective / focus varies from moment-to-moment.
Awareness can be helpful, but it's incredibly difficult to be extremely consistent on all scales. Trying to steer markets and people to produce better outcomes on average is also incredibly difficult, although, at least some of the regulation that now exists does help (unfortunately, some policies have also harmed in ways that tend to mirror the short-sightedness of individuals - unsurprising considering it's humans driving that policymaking).
Didn't really intend to write an essay, nor to ... leave it with a not very finished feel ... but, restroom time is up so ...
[Well... there it is ...](https://youtu.be/jmd3SejK_so?t=5s)
At least 100 vs 300€ the difference is big and you expect it. But when the difference between 400€ and 500€ is celeron/athlon -> i5/r5, 64GB EMMC -> 256GB M.2, 4GB -> 8GB of ram. It's insane how at some price point u just suddenly switch from generic unbranded product lines to branded ones and the performance doubles or triples.
A couple years ago at work we received funding to upgrade some computers and printers. In the end we had about $600 left over. My boss decided he wanted a laptop for himself, so I found a decently spec windows laptop for him under $600. Instead he decided to buy a bunch of $80 Chromebooks. They are so bad no one uses them.
>Often times, when you explain that the $300 laptop is better than the $100, not just because of the support window but build quality, capabilities, etc all they take from it is that they can buy more of the $100 to cover the ones that will break or even that it will be someone else's problem two years from now but I'll look like a genius now.
Kids break everything. It doesn't matter what it is, they'll find a way. I knew what the AUE date was a few years ago when I bought my nephew a Samsung Chromebook 3 (and one for myself) for $99. I also knew it's likelihood of surviving that long was next to zero. 2 years and 4 missing or broken power supplies later, I still don't think it was a waste. It's not useful for much of anything now aside from looking up game guides and streaming tv but at least it gave the boy a chance to prove he could handle something without it getting completely destroyed and now he has a much nicer and more powerful laptop.
Fortunately nowadays it seems like Google, manufacturers, and to a lesser extent, retailers are doing a little bit better of a job - all of the first page results for chromebooks except one used listing on Best Buy's site are all 2028+ AUE date, including multiple sub $200 options.
While they technically work for some browsing it's not just testing websites that won't allow outdated browsers.
They are running outdated un-patched versions that have known vulnerabilities. Online banking websites for example will also not allow you to login.
Are they trying to tell us that regular laptops have a life span of 10 to 16 years and only chrome books have a short lifespan of 5 to 8? I’m not buying it.
Yes, but a lot of people expect them to nowadays. When Windows 11 was announced, there were tons of posts on how Microsoft was being greedy because they were making their "perfectly fine" circa 2011 computer obsolete in 2025. Computers just aren't seen as necessary nowadays so people just find ways to justify not spending anything on them until they break.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows10/comments/ve4tm0/should\_i\_be\_worry\_if\_i\_couldnt\_upgrade\_my\_laptop/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Windows10/comments/ve4tm0/should_i_be_worry_if_i_couldnt_upgrade_my_laptop/)
Here's one from almost a year ago An i7-3520m is from 2012, so OP is fully expecting his then 13 year old laptop to be good enough to use.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/windows/comments/q7b3gq/windows\_11\_running\_on\_a\_2008\_laptop/](https://www.reddit.com/r/windows/comments/q7b3gq/windows_11_running_on_a_2008_laptop/)
Another with a 2008 laptop. and I can keep going. The last decade was a fluke where every new generation of processor was only 5-10% faster than the last one and there hasn't been any major changes to the form factor that would prompt people to upgrade. The point is, there's is a significant amount of people who for various reasons think computers, especially laptops are a "Buy it for life" product.
Sure, but you make it sound like Windows 11 obsoletes only older computers from 2011, when in fact it obsoletes as recent computers as from 2017, and there were many posts about >2011computers being obsolete so you are being very misleading by downplaying the year so much to fit your narrative and I'm calling you out on that.
The comment I was responding to was that laptops lasting 10 to 16 years isn't normal. What I said was there's a growing amount of people who expect them to. Your whole deal with what about 7 gen is on you.
Last laptop I bought lasted ten years.
It didn't fail either, I replaced a few parts over the years (keyboard, gave it a better wifi card, upgraded the ram) but it didn't ever fail, it's still working, that's just wear and tear.
Only reason I upgraded was because the GPU was severely aged and I wanted to do some things that taxed it too far, CPU etc were still perfectly adequate.
I've got an old Asus UL30A with the original battery from 2009. The HDD, RAM and Battery are all accessible without removing the whole back cover which is nice and it still lasts 6+ hours on battery.
I don't use it much, but it's surprising how long these things last if you're kinda nice to them and are willing to put up with slower hardware.
I don't think many original purchasers are keeping them for that long, but there seems to be a pretty thriving industry around refurbishing ThinkPads that old.
How many regular laptops do you know that simply stop working after 5-8 years without any actual hardware failure because the manufacturer decided you need to upgrade now?
All of Intel 7th gen laptop CPUs, like the popular i7-7700HQ, which were available since like 2017 (or 2016?), are not supported by Windows 11. Windows 10's EOL is October 14, 2025.
Stop working. Not necessarily. Perform poorly so employees are not productive ? Most if not all by the time they hit 8 years.
Is there life left in it ? Yes possibly, but those won’t be the low end budget machines we are discussing.
So, just to make sure I understand, you're okay with the idea of manufacturers telling you how long you're allowed to use a system for before replacing it, rather than letting you make that decision yourself?
What happens if they lower it to 3 years? How about 1? Is that still cool? If you buy a brand new notebook tomorrow and then in May 2024 it stops working because hey, you're not operating at maximum efficiency, time for a new notebook, you'd be okay with that?
I don’t think you understood me correctly. The manufacturer can do whatever they want. I can choose to spend money on it or not. I choose to NEVER buy a chrome book (never have and never will) because of the limitations in both OS , applications and lifespan. I honestly don’t understand why people buy them under the current conditions other than the ridiculously low price.
My only leverage in a free market is how I spend my money. If people continue to purchase chromebooks with the current limitations then they will continue to be manufactured and supported in the same way they are now. You are essentially telling Google that you are good with the way things are.
>I choose to NEVER buy a chrome book (never have and never will) because of the limitations in both OS , applications and lifespan. I honestly don’t understand why people buy them under the current conditions other than the ridiculously low price.
Chrome is one of the only operating systems that's designed for portability from the ground up, without a huge enterprise license cost attached. That's why it's such a great choice for schools, and why Google marketed it as such.
The simple fact is, high school students don't need the sort of power you're talking about. They don't need a 12-core CPU, they don't need 32GB of RAM, they don't need a 17" 4K display, they don't need an RTX 4090 GPU. They need something lightweight, with a long battery life that will last the school day, and that is extremely easy to use and nearly impossible to fuck up. Chromebooks offer that. If a student breaks his Chromebook, you just hand him a new one, because once he puts in his Google account information, the notebook is immediately configured the exact same as the last one was. If he forgets his at home, you hand him the janky-ass spare clunker from the back of the class that smells like the weird kid who can't stop farting, and again, once he puts in his Google account information, it's immediately configured the exact same as the one he forgot at home.
The problem is that Google decided in their infinite wisdom to give Chromebooks an artificial expiration date, typically of 5 years, after which point, it simply stops working. There's nothing *wrong* with the notebook at that point, and in fact, you could install a different operating system onto it and continue using it just fine, but you can't keep running Chrome OS on it, because Google wants you to go buy a new one.
The problem here is software, Chromebooks are more closed down, like a phone or tablet, so when they go EOL, many apps and websites stop working, while on regular laptops, 10 to 15 years of OS support is almost guaranteed and you can easily install an alternative OS, so as long as the hardware works, you can use it (of course, crappy hardware or low end components will shorten its lifespan)
Bullshit.
I bought a laptop (windows, core i7 7th gen) in 2018. It was one of the nicer ones available at the time. (i opted for a top of the line CPU from the previous generation instead of an 8th gen i5). Since it doesn't have the TPM (an anti piracy measure), I can't get windows 11, meaning only 7 years of support on a laptop bordering workstation quality. I understand that you *can* get 10-15 years out of a laptop if you're really lucky, but that doesn't mean you will. Nowadays, expect 7-8 years out of a windows workstation laptop and just be happy if you manage to get more than that.
There's the whole linux debate, but I don't want to learn an entirely new OS. I've tried to use it before and it constantly leaves me frustrated.
I've brought this up in some other threads, and people were quite agressive saying "it's a laptop bro, you're lucky you got more than 5 years out of it". I'm of the mindset that you *should* get 10 years out of a laptop if it's a nice one. When did this change happen??
2018-2025 is still 7 years, and it's not like w10 will stop working after that. If you're concerned about security updates there are plenty of third party tools to extends your products life. The office i work in had computers running XP until last year.
> There's the whole linux debate, but I don't want to learn an entirely new OS.
that's a you problem. you *have that option*. 99.99% of windows laptops sold are technically just platform agnostic machines. they aren't inherently windows devices, and as such, *you have options*. once a Chromebook reaches EOL, you're fucked and that's it.
My device is still perfectly capable of running windows 11. It's frustrating that it isn't supported. The software I use is not easy to get working on linux (fusion 360). Plus, there's value to sticking to what you know. I've tried to switch 3 or 4 times now and I always come back frustrated. When I'm working on something I don't want to wait half a day for myself to troubleshoot, browse forums, etc... If someone is paying me to design something and I have to troubleshoot, I usually end up eating that expense. I *could* use a half-ass janky solution with lots of bugs (wine), or I *could* completely uproot my workflow in favour of linux friendly software but that's a lot. As I said, there's value to sticking with what you know.
>once a Chromebook reaches EOL, you're fucked and that's it.
[That's just blatantly false.](https://www.makeuseof.com/best-linux-distros-for-chromebooks/)
That's why I said "almost guaranteed" to have 10y support, the problem is Windows 11 messed up everything and Microsoft almost certainly did it from peer pressure from manufacturers. They know most people don't really need the latest HW, so they wanna force to upgrade (even though any 10yoPC with an i3 can run Chrome and Office)
But from Microsoft's POV, it means less people will upgrade to the latest Windows version, so I bet they won't do that again for some time
MS didn't mess up. Read up on the Trusted Computing Initiative. MS was one of the Proponents of TPM and such before Y2K and Win11 and later is just the final implementation of that thinking. Simply put, MS wants to own the hardware and if that's the case, then they can sure as hell provide it because if I bought it, it'll run what ever I want, which is why I'm planning on dropping Windows by mid year and either FreeBSD or back to Gentoo Linux.
Yes Steam Deck has pushed things far enough tha my gaming needs are mostly met by Proton on Either BSD or Linux
So I can use a third party workaround that isn't supported by microsoft?
I wouldn't care, but I have to contact support every month or two. I had a system running a similar TPM bypass last year and they refused to touch the thing as soon as they realized. I use windows because when something goes wrong, I can call some guy on the other side of the planet to fix it right away.
> while on regular laptops, 10 to 15 years of OS support is almost guaranteed
my dude both the life span of windows 7-10 and the past several mac oses prove that is a lie.
What. You can upgrade from 7 to 11 FOR FREE. If your hardware supports 11, then only to 10. You gen install and run 10 on literally 16 year old computers, what are you even talking about.
>You gen install and run 10 on literally 16 year old computers, what are you even talking about.
That's absolutely fantastic!!
Unfortunately I can't download windows 11 on my workstation laptop from 5 years ago. They went from being really good about supporting older hardware to abysmal. All because of the TPM2.0, which is meant to deter software piracy.
In theory, you can go from 7 to 11 for free. In practice, lots of people can't even go from 10 to 11 on perfectly usable hardware.
you can install w11 on your older machines, you can disable all the hardware checks https://www.tomshardware.com/how-to/bypass-windows-11-tpm-requirement
Windows 10 is supported until 2025. Realistically that will probably be extended by a year or two.
I'm not a fan of TPM either but I work in IT and regularly run into computers built 13-15 years ago that people are still actively using.
you can buy a tpm module for a couple of dollars, and other hardware manufacturers even had the foresight to include virtual TPM. i’m sorry you bought a poorly designed laptop, but yikes.
the issue is most windows machines still provide security updates even past Microsoft guarantees them. Individual pieces of software also can be updated by you. Or even windows machines are pretty generic so you could just install Linux on them while especially older chrome books that's not always possible
Exactly. When updates stop, the web browser doesn't even get any security updates and after that it's so locked down you can't use most of them for anything else. You can't even use a chrome os device as a basic file server because the OS hides the network from Android or Linux apps
Even then, 5-8 years for a mobile device (phone/laptop) is pretty good.
I've worked in IT for various orgs and the average lifespan of a laptop is probably 3-4 years with some models being exceptionally durable and some being garbage.
I think this school district's problem is they're buying "disposable" laptops and expecting them to last just as long as normal laptops.
This is a textbook case of you get what you pay for.
Most districts I've heard of that have Chromebooks buy them for each individual student and the device is basically theirs, making the effective lifespan ~4 years as they progress through elementary/middle/high school.
> This is a textbook case of you get what you pay for.
but the schools refuse to admit that. otherwise they'd have to spend more money on the school and less on admin pet projects
Do they? I feel like it’s just people on this thread projecting for them. I think school IT would be shocked if anything that touches a child’s hand survives more than a few years no matter the price, and are fine with cycling through cheap hardware.
The issue with garbage is more one of negative externalities than poor economic choices from schools.
If you consider the usual hardware failures such as the hinges breaking down, hinges messing up the display cable, broken screens, battery failing, etc. , then yeah, it's pretty safe to assume that must laptops are "dead" by the time they reach 8 years old.
But those injuries are not necessarily fatal, they just cripple the portability.
If you take a laptop from 12 years ago (Sandy Bridge era) and use it as a desktop (battery is dead, screen/display cable are likely to be out of service, etc.), it can still run the latest version of Windows 10 or the Linux distro of your choice and get the latest versions of web browsers. It won't be powerful gaming machine/workstation, but it's still good enough for office apps and web browsing.
I have an old laptop with a [Celeron B810](https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/55657/intel-celeron-processor-b810-2m-cache-1-60-ghz.html) from 2011, it's show, but it still runs.
With ChromeOS, you get an outdated web browser instead, and no way of updating it. And if you don't pay attention to the precise specs of the Chromebook, you might pick an older model and get only 2-3 years of updates before it stops.
I kind of understand why Google might want to stop updating the OS, but Chrome should be able to be updated separately from the OS to limit the risks of using an outdated browser on the web.
Personally I think a Black Friday laptop deal is a much better buy then any Chromebook. Sure it’s a budget laptop but it’s running a mainstream OS that can be updated or changed. With a Chromebook or tablet it’s a lower price , limited feature set, limited update options, pretty much zero upgrade options.
My desktop pc is 12 years old (first gen i7) it works fine but it’s specs are far beyond what any Chromebook would ever be. It’s not an apples to apples comparison. I have newer computers but that old one is still my primary daily driver. Cost far more to build than a chrome book, and it’s been upgraded (HD/ RAM / video card) multiple times.
Do I think it’s shitty that chromebooks stop being updated at a certain point? Absolutely which is why I would never buy one knowing what they are and what role they serve. But that price sure is attractive isn’t it ?
It’s a trade off. Price vs. longevity and performance. Also with it being google you’re probably giving up a certain level of privacy as well or at least agreeing to them collecting data about you.
https://www.hotspotshield.com/blog/chromebook-google-spyware-machine/
I find it interesting that people think they will buy a Chromebook for $200.00 and get 10-15 years of good use out of it.
My desktop from ~09 still works just fine and I only recently handed down a business class laptop from the core 2 era that's a solid school machine for my buddy's kid's classwork.
Call me a Luddite, but having schoolchildren use laptops in the classroom doesn't sound like a good idea at all, especially if their lifespan is also quite limited.
you’re an out of touch luddite. this is a hardware sub, can you take the pearl clutching back to facebook. like it or not computers are an integral part of society and kids need to learn how to use them, or else they would be even more of tiktok drones than they are now
source : i taught multiple coding classes and physics classes for kids as well as did tutoring.
I'm 20 and computers have been in the classroom since kindergarten. They were bulky CRT desktops. I think we got laptops in the early 2000s, but they were shared across the whole school. Your class would book the laptop cart for a period and everyone would get to use a computer. You'd have to sign it out and whatnot. Now, students are issued their own laptops. I liked the carts better, made using the computer feel like a special occasion. Like rolling in the big TV on the cart, but cybertechnical™ 👉😎👉
i do agree, but when the schools go out of their way to get the worst things possible or people buy only the lowest priced thing and refuse to learn how shit actually works i cant blame JUST google.
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