Just got fired from a Legacy. What now?

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Schwalbe262Guy@reddit

I’m not in the airlines yet, but from what I understand it’s difficult to get fired from a legacy no?

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Neither-Way-4889@reddit

Why do you have the FAA commercial pilot written test in your flair? CAX is the written exam, the license is CPL-Airplane.

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KCPilot17@reddit

You don't get fired at a legacy for failing one line check for "a mistake at the end". Getting fired would come from multiple additional trainings, attitude problems, etc.

More details are required here.

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Baystate411@reddit

unless it was a big ass mistake and a disregard for safety. something an FSAP wouldnt even cover...

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Baystate411@reddit

showing up drunk, texting and flying, sexual harrassment.

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Baystate411@reddit

well, if you do all 3 you actually get promoted to chief pilot

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Neither-Way-4889@reddit

Throw in sleeping in the cockpit and you've got yourself an FAA inspector!

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andrewrbat@reddit

Any voluntary noncompliance with rules,sop or regs. The only way to get fired for performance in the way he specified.

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Twarrior913@reddit

Seriously. Legacies will drag your fighting corpse over the finish line it seems if you have the right attitude.

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0621Hertz@reddit

As much as I chuckle and agree with that when I read that here, I wonder if remarks such as these will be brought up to congress once the next “big accident” occurs and pilot negligence is to blame.

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ThatRunwayBehindUs@reddit

Theres a lot missing here... Broadly speaking- I've heard and seen that its pretty hard to get fired from a legacy job, even with the training difficulties.

I guess my question primarily stems from... was it an attitude issue? Because the hours and capability seem like they would be there to me. And then having some issues on a check isn't necessarily an issue either - but its how you deal with and respond to that which can cause more problems.

Thats kinda what I see the issue being here, but... who knows maybe im way off base.

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bourbon_lemonade@reddit (OP)

I’m a little shocked by it. Seems like several people are. I took longer to get to the line check than normal (50+ hours), but my training was showing progression. There were comments talking about positive attitude and pleasure to fly with. My mentor, rep, and even the check pilot who failed me all said not to worry about it. Line training manager called right after the fail and said the LCA had only positive things to say and they appreciated me having a great attitude about it. Everything on the check was graded well until the end. I did make the mistake and fail the check, but nobody I talked to expected them to fire me.

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Spock_Nipples@reddit

This doesn't sound like legacy training at all. Are you sure you aren't bullshiting us, here? 50+ hours would be a huge red flag at the legacy level; I can see a regional maybe going through/putting up with that, but if you're struggling that much at the legacy level, then that's going to stem from either lying about your experience, or having a lot of training/ability issues in the past (which would show up on your records). Are you sure this was an actual legacy airline?

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Pubics_Cube@reddit

50+ hours to get to the line check?!?

My brother in Yeager, that's not "a bit longer"

Most legacy training departments are very "wham Bam thank you ma'am" and have you out the door with like 7-10 sims & OE

You would've had to repeatedly forgotten basic shit like triggers and flows or putting the gear down. What aren't you telling us?

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ChiefDaddyJ@reddit

What mistake did you make? Did you have any failures or training difficulties prior?

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rayman3325@reddit

OP is lying, trolling, making up a story and is probably in high school

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UnfortunateSnort12@reddit

Right? We need to know “the mistake”! Did they bend the spar? Did they struggle with taxi instructions? Like what is the mistake?

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Rhinoj97@reddit

What was your mistake at the end that failed you? That’s the missing link here for all of us to understand this.

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aw_shux@reddit

You refer to “the mistake,” but refuse to say what it is. Given the context you’ve already shared, it would be helpful for others to know the mistake to provide more helpful advice to you.

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AutomagicJackelope@reddit

You need to provide us more information. What was the mistake?

I'm finding it hard to believe that a single mistake led to a line check failure which led to termination. There's more to this than that.

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changgerz@reddit

“the transition was extremely difficult” but “everything was going well”

not sure it was going as well as OP thought, unfortunately? not sure what else to assume

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andrewrbat@reddit

We all know that 121s usually have a spelled out training and failure plan in the fom or pwa, maybe both.

My airline specifies exactly how many extra sims, failures of validations, and check rides can happen before you go before a review board, and/or are subject to firing or disciplinary action.

Simply underperforming on an aspect of the line check is not going to get you fired if thats your only failure. I know plenty of people who did this, and worse, got more oe, or training, special tracking, and are now flying the line just fine.

People who get fired like this usually do so by knowingly violating a rule, sop, etc, or acting in bad faith, lying, or being wildly inappropriate (harassment or something).

People who have gotten the axe in this way recently include people using their phone at a time when its not allowed, listening to music on their headset, using guard for inappropriate things, etc. even most of the incidents I’m aware of include multiple warnings and chances. No offense op but im skeptical.

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orestes114@reddit

Yep a single mistake in training is never going to end your career. Unless it was intentional disregard for the company's SOPs or something like that. Or if you show that you're not willing to learn from said mistake. In other words, if your attitude sucks.

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OzrielArelius@reddit

you can bend metal on a line check and still not get fired

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flyingforfun3@reddit

What did you fail on?

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G25777K@reddit

You won't get an answer, waste of time answering if we don't have a full picture.

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KehreAzerith@reddit

He probably fucked up big time, keeps referring it to as a little mistake, which is honestly infuriating. People want to help but it's impossible to help without context provided

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G25777K@reddit

Yes, it's a balance between privacy and getting good advice, but as you said has to be more then a little mistake.

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shortfinal@reddit

it wasn't the mistake or the failure.

it was 100% how they responded to the very first time someone else told them they needed more training.

If I could guess. unbecoming.

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Raccoon_Ratatouille@reddit

Not sure why would you delete it. Obviously context matters and you’re leaving a lot out. What was the mistake?

As far as 121 goes, yeah a legacy is going to have huge doubts that if you couldn’t pass a training program at let’s say Delta, why would you be able to pass at American? So the key to a 121 future is going to be rehabbing your resume. Apply to majors or regionals, get hired, get through training and work your way back up and pass the 121 training programs. Yeah it will be tough to say “I’m 0-1, legacy airline give me a chance!”, but it’s much easier to say “I didn’t make it through this legacy, but I went to SkyWest and did great, then I went to frontier and did great, I’ve learned from mistake and I proved it and I’m ready to come back to a legacy”

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davihar@reddit

Did it involve bourbon?

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davihar@reddit

The OP’s choice of user name might be related to the IP’s decision making, that was a factor in the firing. Just speculation without any facts though.

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imapilotaz@reddit

I thought Denzel showed being drunk and doing a bump of nose fairy dust helps to be a great pylot...

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bustervich@reddit

Are you not supposed to celebrate taxiing in on your line check with a big swig of bourbon?

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shortfinal@reddit

You won't be forthcoming about the mistake which implies you're still having trouble accepting the validity of it. sounds like, if you were to give us all the details, we'd chuck you in the bin too.

If you're even 1% as cagey about why you did a mistake to your peers/check airman, then yeah, the firing is easily justified.

Pilots excel when they're humble, honest, and forthcoming.

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Frost_907@reddit

What kind of mistake are we talking about?

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rayman3325@reddit

Absolutely didn’t happen. You gotta be trolling or 14 and making up a story. This is legitimately impossible with your described scenario. You would have had a long process of multiple failures, retraining, training review board meetings, etc. if it was seriously one failure you failed, argued, blamed the instructor/check airman said some shit. Then got fired for that. This would never ever happen as described. Impossible.

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554TangoAlpha@reddit

Beg and plead to get back to your great 91 position? What did you fail on? It’s kinda hard to get fired from a 121 legacy even on probation.

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Hobie52@reddit

We had someone leave our small 135 for a legacy then leave during training. They hired him back but made him start over on seniority. Might be an option if OP left on good terms.

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sq_lp@reddit

I’ve seen a good amount of new hires get sent back to TK after a failed line check. I don’t know the details, I just see it on their schedule. IOE, back to TK, IOE again, then reserve.

There’s more that you are not telling us.

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No-Try3904@reddit

Did you whip out your phone during taxi to the gate? When the check airman asked if you were done yet, did you reply “not yet” and finish texting?

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changgerz@reddit

he meowed on guard

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Happy-Table-9515@reddit

Wait! What?!? You can be fired for that! …..🙈🙊🙉

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Baystate411@reddit

if I was a LCA and my student meowed on guard I would def put the plan in motion to have them terminated

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OptFire@reddit

It’s happened, I know a guy. He was fired lmao.

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latedescent@reddit

yes thankfully

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Rhinoj97@reddit

This is hard to believe without more information. Guys and gals at my Air Line falter all the time but they are there to help you. OP must’ve failed 4-5 sims and had a bad attitude

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KehreAzerith@reddit

I think the first step is coming clean and telling us how you got fired from a legacy

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Spock_Nipples@reddit

There's way more to this story. A legacy isn't going to fire you over an oppsie on a line check. Would have to be a cumulative issue and [whatever] was the last straw, unless you disk something truly and incredibly reckless and dangerous, or told check airman to honest his own ass or something.

Legacy training is about helping you to get through and become a better pilot; not setting you up to fail; so your post is either bullshit one leaving a lot of information out.

No one can tell you how hireable you're going to be unless you're honest about what's going on. And if you can't be honest about what's going on, then that's part of the issue.

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FlapsFail@reddit

Having been a CKA at a 121, I’ll echo what everyone else is saying here. If you simply bust a line check at this level, it’s not a huge deal (even if it’s your initial line check) and certainly is not a termination-worthy kind of event on its own.

OP I wish you the best of luck, but I’m guessing there’s more to the story here. We can’t give you a great answer if we only have part of the story.

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Ancient_Juice_1127@reddit

This doesn't add up. At my company you'd be sent back to Dallas for extra training not just - boom fired. You had to have completely F'd something up big time yes?

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RealP4@reddit

Hard to say without describing what happened. But only thing you do now is fire up that resume and keep on trucking 💪

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MyPilotInterview@reddit

As others have said there is a lot of missing context - you have two options. Get back into the 91 world, and say the 121 world wasn’t meant to be. Or try and build yourself from the ground up, which is typically KeyLime, Kalitta Charters, etc, then to F9 and then try again for better companies. But I’m not sure anyone would deal with reserve, those operators and the salary when you can slip back into the left seat of a 91 program.

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Diver_Driver@reddit

Depends on why you actually got fired. A simple mistake at the end of an initial line check will not get you fired from a Legacy. There is much more to this story. I doubt you could get on with another Legacy at this point though regardless of what happened.

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rvr600@reddit

The airline has already invested tens of thousands of dollars in you. They want you to pass. There has to be more to this than one screw up on your line check.

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PILOT9000@reddit

Everything wasn’t going well until the end with a little mistake on a line check. That’s just not how it works at that level.

Back to 91 or 135. If you can’t make it through training at a legacy then you’re done in the 121 world.

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ATKoast@reddit

How egregious was the error? Failing a line check isn’t a huge deal. If you have a good attitude, own the mistakes and are willing to learn from them, there should no reason why you couldn’t get some extra training and try again. Never heard of anyone getting fired for failing one line check failure.

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UNDR08@reddit

As someone who’s involved in hiring. I will say. You’re probably done when it comes to legacy’s or other major’s.

A regional “may” take a chance. But that would be the only way to get back to a legacy, is show you can get thru training and all that at a 121 carrier.

—

I’d go back to 91, and write it off as, this wasn’t for me or an environment I excelled in. The 91 and even 135 world will eat that up.

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bourbon_lemonade@reddit (OP)

I appreciate that. That was my thought. I’m in my 40s so I kind of assumed this did it for me in the 121 world. Had a great career 91, I guess I’ll try to find a place there.

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0621Hertz@reddit

I’m not sure what age you are but the consensus is you go back to Part 91/135 flying and apply until you get another shot.

It happens, but a lot is left to mystery because of lack of details pertaining to your circumstances of why you got fired from a Legacy Carrier. And big carriers have much more gentlemen’s experience than a regional.

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AntoineEx@reddit

I’m sorry that this happened to you. This is an incredibly hard transition and you’re not alone. During regional training part 135, 91 , fighter guys generally had the hardest time. I would get back to part 91 and get a clean training record while reflecting on what you could have done better or differently during training. A clean record and a solid answer about this failure will go a long way in a few years when you try 121 again.

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Head-Cricket9375@reddit

For what

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Happy-Table-9515@reddit

I’ve got nothing to add, as you’ve not (understandably) provided enough info. Regardless, good luck.

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rFlyingTower@reddit

This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:

I left a great 91 position after 15 years to pursue the airlines like I’d always dreamed of. Got lucky and got on at my legacy of choice. The transition was difficult and I failed my initial line check. Everything was going well until I made a mistake at the end. I’m obviously devastated and still in shock from blowing that opportunity.

I’ve got over 6000 hours. 3500 pic jet. Management and leadership experience. No other failures. Is it possible to continue to pursue 121 flying? Is anyone going to hire me straight off a failure? How do you get back into something? I’d appreciate any advice.

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