Can you climb up the mast of my sailboat?
Posted by hl_lost@reddit | sailing | View on Reddit | 46 comments
new to sailing and this sunday, something happened so that the halyard does not make the mainsail go all the way up. Like its almost to the top but maybe 6 inches short and no amount of winching is working which makes me think something is messed up at the top. Its a 22 foot 1987 laguna sailboat.
Is it possible for me to get the equipment and climb the mast? im 200lbs. Or is it better to go through the trouble of bringing the mast down and then fixing whatever went wrong on top? Or could it be that something else is going on? the halyard attached to the sail is clear and free all the way to the top and i can't see any issues with the return line. I best guess is the block at top is tangled or something
ideas? advice? thanks in advance
geoffpz1@reddit
Dude, take the mast down, it is a 22 ft boat. I race a 20 ft keelboat. We have taken the mast down between races, on the H20 to get stuff and have done it hundredss of times in the PL at away regattas for the last 20 years. It is way easier than trying to climb the damn thing or getting next to a large RV or something in the PL. Maybe try and get next to a crane(then use bosuns chair) or another large boat(lean mast over to get to it. Heck, that being said, We heel boats over, in the slip with the main hallyard, to clean the bottom. You can get to it like that. It really is not that hard and you can prob do it in 1/2 hr, with a buddy and a 6 pack depending on what is screwy.
Switch-in-MD@reddit
Don’t drink the six pack before hoisting someone aloft.
djfoundation@reddit
Wow, it's a rare occasion that I see another Laguna '22 posting, cheers! Even if your boom is still clipped in it should go to the top. Try hoisting without the sail as suggested, check your halyard exit. Also make sure your slugs aren't getting bound up in the track.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
why hello fellow laguna owner!!! thanks ill try hoisting without sail. i think that will answer some questions
djfoundation@reddit
Switch-in-MD@reddit
Take the reef out. 🤣
djfoundation@reddit
Wait a second. I am looking at a picture from Saturday and my halyard stops about a foot short. Once your luff is taught you are at the top.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
But there were wrinkles in the sail. I think I'll tighten everything and see next time. Sorry new sailor and got my asa 101 but still learning
OptiMom1534@reddit
Just raft up next to a substancially larger yacht and use their halyard to go up. Easy peasy.
HelicopterUpbeat5199@reddit
Is the sail slack when it gets to where it stops or it it tight? Where it's tight and where it's slack will tell you a lot about the problem. If it's slack all the way down, the problem is probably in the mast. If it's tight all the way down, you probably need to loosen something like the sheet. If it's loose up to a certain point and then tight, there's something gumming up the works at that point. If its tight up to a point and the loose above that, you are off the map and probably pulling the wrong rope.
Re going up the mast vs raising or lowering, on a 22 ft boat, raising and lowering the mast is easy and going up the mast is sketchy. It reverses on bigger boats. Bigger mast is harder to take down and put up, but going aloft is safer (or at least more predictable).
LameBMX@reddit
umm. seems lots of people forgot physics and leverage. just careen the boat across an empty dock or 3. you got the mast height of leverage to lift the keels weight. and dont worry about the crashing noises, you just forgot to secure some stuff in the cabin. if it aint comfy to climb.. its gonna be easy to tip.
DefectorChris@reddit
Lift the boom!
Dr_Ramekins_MD@reddit
On a 22-footer, you likely have a hinged mast step that makes bringing the mast down a relatively simple job. I'd rather do that than try to climb the mast on a small boat.
Bonus, you get to closely inspect your rigging.
texasrigger@reddit
Are you new to sailboats? A very common mistake for new sailors is for them to try to hoist the sail while the boom is being held down either by the mainsheet or boom vang. The boom generally has to be able to freely lift to get full hoist. Otherwise what is happening is that the leech (the trailing edge of the sail) is getting tight and stopping the luff (the forward edge of the sail) from getting full hoist. The typical symptom of that mistake is the sail stopping 6" or so from full hoist. I've seen it countless times. I'll bet that's your issue. Completely ease the mainsheet and vang prior to hoisting and see if that doesn't fix your problem.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
yes i am. awesome ill try that next. i did have to loosen the boom vang because it was causing the issue but now ill take it off and then try again. i also did not ease the mainsheet. will try that as well. thank you so muhc
texasrigger@reddit
Yep, there it is right there. Try releasing both the mainsheet and the vang and then grab the end of the boom and lift it up a couple of feet to pull plenty of slack into the system.
bagnap@reddit
Or - scandalise the main with the topping lift before lifting or dropping the main sheet. Works for me every time
ElProfeGuapo@reddit
Could be this too. I think we need photos.
NoZooplanktonblame75@reddit
Taking the mast down is the best option. If, however, you have a handy dock/pier that is maybe 20' above the water at low tide, you could also tie up below that pier, walk up to the pier deck with end of your halyard in hand (other end secured of course), and pull the mast top towards you with the halyard, allowing you to work on/inspect the affected area. This is all very situational, but on the 23' Compac I did this a few times to retrieve a lost halyard. The boat can heel over quite a bit without harm (aside from debris falling off shelves down below maybe) and your leverage advantage with the halyard allows you to tilt the boat very effectively (on a small boat). Bonus tip, this can also get you out of the mud when your keel is stuck.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
wow thats cool man. never thought of this but it makes sense. wouldnt the large keel make it much harder though? Did you have to use block and tackle for this?
justtoreadthenews@reddit
Can't you bring onshore and park it to the side of a tower? In our club, we have a tower and we use it all the time for lost or blocked halyards.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
ah ill check with my marina
underwaterCanuck@reddit
That sounds like a great idea I've never seen in the wild.
justtoreadthenews@reddit
It is really useful. I used it three times already (two halyards and fixing a wind vane) and I see someone else using it once or twice per month.
I guess most clubs and marinas don't have climbing towers for safety regulations/liability.
sailingtroy@reddit
I have a Tanzer 22 and my sail does not quite go all the ways to the top, either. That's normal on small boats. It makes space for the roach of the sail to fit underneath the backstay. It used to freak me out, too, but if your mainsail luff is properly tensioned, then there is no problem.
DO NOT CLIMB THE MAST. It is too puny for any human life to be trusted to it. When I need to do work aloft, I borrow a bosun's chair and get lifted up on the mast crane.
VilleeZ@reddit
Really, do not climb the mast in caps? Do mast sizes go down a lot per ft of boat or am i missing something? Isn't the force from wind on the sail much greater on the mast than just a dude hanging on a rope?
I have a 26ft boat that weighs roughly 2200kg, i have not climbed the mast and probably would not, because I'm not a small guy. But I wouldn't have hesitated to hoist up my girlfriend for example, should I really not?
greatlakesailors@reddit
Generally on boats under about 25' to 27' the rigging is not strong enough to safely bring a person up the mast. To hoist a 200 lb person you need halyards and blocks with a breaking strength of at least 3000 lb. Also putting 200 lb at the top of the mast of a 22' would change the boat's centre of gravity by enough that you could capsize it and end up tied to a masthead that's underwater.
It's a very different story on larger boats with more stability and stronger rigging.
VilleeZ@reddit
I appreciate the explanation but it still doesn't quite sit right with me. You would not go to the tippy top of the mast but would try to reach it from below. You of course would do that while the boat is tied down safely in a marina. If I can pull my main sail up with massive winds without anything breaking, I'm sure I can pull up at least someone a bit smaller, not an overweight dude like myself, but an average woman for example. I'm not trying to argue for arguments sake, just looking for more info, if someone is willing to share their knowledge.
On the other hand I can see how there may not be enough leverage to pull a person to the top of the mast. But again I don't think we even need to talk about pulling anyone further than 80-90% of the way, just so they can barely reach.
djfoundation@reddit
I've boosted my gf up the mast of my Laguna 22', and she inchwormed a bit further to catch a snagged line before. I wouldn't rope up making tree forts or anything.
texasrigger@reddit
That's not correct at all. A mast is purely a compression member and capable of withstanding a ton of load. At 25' you are in to 3/16" cable which has a breaking strength of over 4000 lbs per cable and those are just stabilizing that mast and keeping it in compression. A 5/16" or 3/8" halyard are both up to the task. A 200lb person aloft will not capsize a 25' boat, not even close.
24' is typically the minimum I will climb but there have been exceptions that were even smaller if I knew the rig was up to it. Every boat is a case by case basis but the line I quoted above is just wrong.
Stormin_333@reddit
200 is too heavy for climbing a 22 footer. Not enough counter weight. Even if it doesn't capsize it'll be very unstable.
If these other suggestions don't work, you could climb a bigger boat tied beside it and use a halyard to tip/heel yours within reach.
Elses_pels@reddit
A 22ft boat should be a short enough mast. Low tide (if thy are in you area) and a height pier may do the trick. I did it on my boat but I have fairly good tides for it. Where are you?
No-Sail-6510@reddit
You could try something like aluminaslick or one of those aluminum lubricants on the slugs. Sometimes it just doesn’t go all the way. Could be a used sail from another boat for example
iron82@reddit
If it's really 6 inches, it's fine. Working as intended.
iron82@reddit
To troubleshoot, see if you can pull the halyard all the way without the mainsail attached. Attach a spare line to the clip so you can pull it back down.
Successful_Cod_8904@reddit
Why a spare line? end to end it. That's why we whip a loop at the end.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
Ah amazing idea! Thanks
iron82@reddit
The most likely causes are the sail isn't long enough, which is probably not a problem, or there is friction in the mast track.
slamminng@reddit
This \^. If it can actually go to the top then silicon spray your slides or bolt rope.
timeport-0@reddit
go find a bridge lower than the last and bring a small ladder
euph_22@reddit
What does the sail look like? If you're able to tension the luff properly, the sail is up. Sail should be flat along the mast without wrinkles or scallops (creases mean there is too much tension).
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
It has a few wrinkles for sure
ElProfeGuapo@reddit
You might need to take a picture, chief. “A few wrinkles” could be anything from a genuine concern, to totally reasonable, given wind direction, speed, and trimming. Plus, are you using the cunningham? If you still have wrinkles with the cunningham, that might be even more of a sign that the sail isn’t going up fully.
If all else fails though, you can always reef.
hl_lost@reddit (OP)
Ah thanks. The only reference I have is that the MST was going up further before yesterday. I don't use the cunningham.
porttackapproach2@reddit
I am not personally familiar with that model but it looks pretty similar to my swing keel Catalina 22. I wouldn’t even try to climb that mast as it would hit the water before I got to the top. Not enough counterweight.
Uncle_Bill@reddit
Climbed to the top of a J-24's mast a couple times.