Ferrari Is Playing Chess With The Luce | Autostrada Magazine
Posted by nukleabomb@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 107 comments
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Posted by nukleabomb@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 107 comments
[removed]
gimmiedacash@reddit
I may be in a minority but I could give a fuck less about Ferrari and their buy x meh cars to get a shot at good, model of sales.
No_Speed9064@reddit
No
LheelaSP@reddit
I can also play chess.
But I suck at it so I always lose. Make of that what you will.
AndreLeGeant88@reddit
This isn't serious you know? He actually says people are just reacting based on their own biases and these cars are appealing to a new generation. The end part:
"Or maybe I, and other car enthusiasts, are just out of touch dinosaurs unable to see that the next generation loves these futuristic tech focused electric performance cars. Maybe the automotive climate is shifting towards a new generation and we’re being left behind?
Na that’s not possible, it’s definitely a massive conspiracy.
Also, aliens built the pyramids."
tofubeanz420@reddit
https://www.reddit.com/r/TheSimpsons/comments/22fern/am_i_so_out_of_touch/
birdseye-maple@reddit
Ya definitely buried the lead, I doubt many people make it to the end of the article.
I just think companies don't know what to do with performance EVs yet, so we see some oddities. It's a simplistic view, but I think it's correct.
ggtsu_00@reddit
Is it really that hard to make and bring to market a performance EV that isn't a horrendous uglified abomination? Where's the Polestar 6? Where's the Tesla Roadster?
lee1026@reddit
If you want performance, you want low weight. If you want low weight, you need less batteries. If you need less batteries, you need aero. You want aero, well, there are very well established rules on what your car need to look like.
kraken_enrager@reddit
Tbh the inoniq 5 n was absolutely goated.
ggtsu_00@reddit
Cool, but could we do the same thing but at a form factor comparable to the Veloster N instead of instead of a crossover/SUV?
cabs84@reddit
this is what i truly want
jse000@reddit
Same. An electric GTI with maybe slightly too much power and a modest curb weight would be in my driveway immediately.
kraken_enrager@reddit
Tbh isn’t it like 170mm GC. Tall but really not that tall. Also ioniq 6 n exists I think.
strongmanass@reddit
Dead due to nobody wanting a $200K Polestar (at least right now).
FormalOperational@reddit
They should have never spun Polestar off from Volvo tbh. Nobody wants to buy a (luxury) car from a brand that lacks an established dealer network.
strongmanass@reddit
I think the decision was fine, but the strategy didn't make sense.
"Let's make the Porsche of EVs (ignore that Porsche is making the Porsche of EVs). The first car is a $150K twin-charged 4 cylinder PHEV GT because that was the CEO's pet project when he was at Volvo. The second model is a $45K EV. The very middle of mass market is how we'll convince people that we're a 6 figure brand. We don't have colors to offer them, we don't have an interior customization program, we don't have anything except CUVs and one sedan. And (like you said) we also don't have a dealer network. Please form an orderly line at the door."
To be fair to them, they did sell out the P6 pre-orders at $25K apiece. But part of that pre-order was that only those cars would get the blue color as an option; everything else would be greyscale. And then they couldn't even deliver.
birdseye-maple@reddit
I don't know why they can't be prettier, but I think companies have noted the struggle in selling performance EVs to traditional enthusiasts so they make attempts at attracting a different audience.
Pixelplanet5@reddit
yea its this but also people have gotten used to a specific look which included a very large cooler and a matching grill in the front.
Thats why so many brands have their specific shape of grill as their signature look.
now with EVs we are not wasting 70 - 80% of the energy as heat anymore so we dont need these grill anymore.
at the same time we do need a thicker floor in the car to have room for the batteries so the engineering requirements for the cars are changing a lot.
Sandy_Koufax@reddit
And fitting the batteries somewhere.
Blanchimont@reddit
Porsche Taycan, Mercedes AMG GT 4-Door Coupe, something like the Xiaomi SU7. They're all cars with a low, sleek body style despite being fully electric cars. I'd even go as far as saying batteries have never been an issue, because the first popular mass market EV was the Tesla Model S and that is also a fairly low car compare to the Ferrari Luce.
Blanchimont@reddit
That's the issue I have with the Luce. I don't mind Ferrari making an electric car. I definitely prefer a combustion engine for a Ferrari, especially a V8 or V12, but I also understand and accept that times are changing and Ferrari cannot go without an EV with all these emission regulations all over the globe becoming stricter.
But what I cannot and wil not understand, is why they had to make it look like this. Ferrari has always been about emotion, and desire. Motorsport heritage, soul and often beautiful design. With an EV those aspects are more important than ever, because spec-wise all these performance EVs are incredibly similar. So why on earth did they drop the ball so hard and made their EV so ugly? It can't be the battery forcing them to make a crossover, nor can the EV powertrain be the reason for this design. Aerodynamics also isn't the answer. Porsche's Taycan Turbo GT notes similar performance and range figures in a car that does look like a proper Porsche. And though they dropped the ball with the front and rear, the new AMG GT 4-door Coupe is exactly what is says on the tin. Unmistakably Mercedes, packaged in a 4 door coupe body style that looks great from the side.
Long story short: Luce ugly, gimme an electric modern reinterpretation of the 456GT Venice sedan instead.
jeebidy@reddit
I really don't think the Ferrari is ugly, I just don't know who Ferrari thinks is in the market for a $600k Nissan Leaf.
strongmanass@reddit
Spot on. I haven't found anything compelling since the original Tesla Roadster. Porsche got close with the Taycan, but I really dislike the interior and two-speed gearbox.
Bonerchill@reddit
Just an FYI and not to correct you: the phrase is “burying the lede,” in which case the lede is the introductory sentence or paragraph summarizing a story and interesting the reader.
Tangled2@reddit
I feel like the old motor companies are afraid to release performance electrics that might compete with their heritage brands on both looks and performance. A proper quad motor 911 could kick the living shit out 911 Turbo S everywhere except weight and sound. Feels like that might piss people off. So they make weird looking or intentionally under-motor them.
Trevski@reddit
^(lede, buried the lede)
threeinacorner@reddit
The truth is, true performance EVs aren't really viable yet. At least not until SSBs mature.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
On the street? Id argue they are definitely there. Theres not a lot of cars that will out-handle and out accelerate an M3P for the money. \~1:33 at Laguna Seca on street legal tires is very fast.
Track days are still too logistically challenging outside of the few tracks across the US that have the charging infrastructure to support them.
cookingboy@reddit
Yeah, those Gen Z and Gen Alpha kids will surely be buying this $650k Ioniq 5 ripoff lmao
wrsndede@reddit
Even if it were meant to be serious it doesn't make sense considering Chinese EVs are sold in Europe. People will just gravitate towards them if they don't like the fugly cars from traditional automakers.
Threedawg@reddit
It took one comment for the OP and the journalists message to fly over this subreddits head.
Principalskinnermeme.jpg
throttlehouseTH@reddit
Nice catch. It’s meant to be slightly tongue-in-cheek. However something does seem a bit off doesn’t it? This is only one particularly wild possibility. But I am genuinely curious to see where this all goes.
leedle1234@reddit
The futuristic tech focus EV part of the Luce is the least controversial part. This feels like the media gaslighting. It's getting hate for being ugly on the outside.
Recoil42@reddit
But they fucked that up too. If you want to go see a futuristic tech-focused electric performance car, the Tesla Model S, Nio ET9, and Xiaomi YU7 GT are all great expressions of what that looks like. See also the incoming Lexus LFA.
Ferrari's done something else entirely, which is a simulacrum of what a tech-focused electric performance car would be from someone hearing about the desired attributes over a game of broken telephone. That's why it's so uniquely awful.
Sandy_Koufax@reddit
Model S is dead.
Recoil42@reddit
And nonetheless is still a better example of a futuristic tech-focused electric performance car than the Ferrari Luce.
pvdp90@reddit
Rare Tesla W nowadays
maxipanda8321@reddit
Isn t that what a luxury boutique should do? Something else entirely? Is it what we wanted? Probably not for most of us, but it s something different, and a lot of functionality decisions are good. As bad as it looks, the interior is more functional that a Golf, and that s strange.
Recoil42@reddit
A thing isn't desirable just because it ignores established wisdom.
ZetaM3@reddit
Except those young people ARE not the buying demographic.
strongmanass@reddit
Think of "new generation" more broadly. It's not a new generation in terms of age, but rather a new kind of enthusiast, one interested in the next generation of cars. A new [generation of enthusiast].
aka_mank@reddit
You can make a statement like that, which has some truth, then you can apply it to a $600k electric Prius with a legendary prancing horse on it.
Both things can be true.
Enthusiasts are out of touch & this is a car aimed almost exclusively at a few Chinese buyers.
ggtsu_00@reddit
Need to respect Poe's Law here.
ggouge@reddit
Ya even my 9 year old who thinks the cyber truck is peak car design thinks the Luce looks stupid
Tutorbin76@reddit
Unpopular and probably stupid opinion, but all they had to do was keep that awful cyan colour option out of the line until after launch. There's a reason "Ferrari red" is a thing, even if it's actually Rossa Corsa.
Huge_World4801@reddit
This thing is an insult to even exist
ASZD_@reddit
Here comes the swath of contrarians, just for the sake of it
SopranoCrew@reddit
more like playing with themselves lol
Snazzy21@reddit
I’m not convinced because Ferrari put too much effort into getting a famous designer and developed their own electric motor.
I suspect Toyota did the same thing with the bZ4X, but they minimized the cost of failure wherever possible.
I strongly oppose the idea of supercars getting a carve out to use ICE because it is functionally an exception for wealthy to needlessly pollute more while everyone else faces the consequences. I love engines, but I don’t want another thing like private jets where the beneficiaries are the people least impacted too
PossibleHero@reddit
Agreed, can also please stop thinking these companies are actually THAT smart and take out tin foil hats off? Sometimes products (actually all the time) suck or miss the mark entirely. Ferrari made a bet 3-5yrs ago likely assuming the world would have pivoted even harder towards full EV adoption.
Just like tons of other write downs happening in the industry (Ford, GM, Volvo, Honda…ect) it hasn’t happened yet. Meanwhile others like Toyota who we thought looked kinda silly during COVID betting on Hybrid instead are winning.
dontreadragebait@reddit
Ferrari will sell every single one though.
PossibleHero@reddit
Oh I agree! Whether it’s a forced purchase as an entry to buy another one of their exclusive cars or someone who actually likes it. It’s the weirdest thing.
turb0_encapsulator@reddit
If they are really playing this game, they are just going to lose to companies like BMW and Porsche that make great EVs.
dontreadragebait@reddit
It’s just become fun to hate on this, so it’s gone viral. The hate isn’t proportional. Sure, this is ugly, but so is the purosangue. The purosangue actually looks worse imo. And it’s their best selling car, and they’ll sell every single one of these too. This is the “removal of the headphone jack” of cars. Lots of extremely loud raging across the whole internet, but most people moved on and people buy smartphones without them in droves and it’s largely fine.
drfsrich@reddit
It's none of the things people love about the Ferrari, and absolutely in line in terms of styling and performance with cars costing 1/6 of the price. Chess?
dalittle@reddit
Anyone is calling Ferrari destroying their brand chess is hilarious.
Left-Hand_Free@reddit
The author of the article is 100% correct. They’re making them ugly on purpose. No one with a brain wants an EV anyway. Certainly no true car enthusiast wants one. Anyone willing to pay $700,000 for a car that’s little more than a polished Tesla Model 3 is a moron.
QuinTheReal@reddit
Actually the only reasonable thought I‘ve read explaining the Luce. A chess move to make people hate EV‘s to vote against EU ICE ban. If that turns out to be true at some point, praise them.
Shalashaska19@reddit
That’s a very expensive gamble on top of the bad optics against a company that is very brand sensitive.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
I think more realistically, if it is a conspiracy - its more geared towards quieting shareholders and a subset of board members about a bigger pivot to electrification.
Lots of "traditional" investors bought into incumbent premium brands including RACE and have been pushing them hard to pivot to chase the volcanic gains of the EV stocks.
gdnws@reddit
While I think your scenario is far more likely, if they can kill two birds with one ugly stone why not.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
I personally dont think anyone is dumb enough to believe that the Luce is proof that all EV Ferraris will have to look like the Luce, and will be priced like the Luce - and would use that belief to would oppose EU EV mandates.
Especially when Pininfarina has made better EV Ferraris than Ferrari.
gdnws@reddit
Which is why I think your view is far more likely however an extension of what you proposed can be applied towards the EU ev legislation. And I don't think it would be wrong to say that Ferrari, historically, has had quite a bit of ego and outsized influence either. Do I think this is a likely play here? No, I think it is more as you said to placate board members. But with their ego, I could see them thinking that they might nudge the scales of the EU legislation even if it isn't their primary goal.
Otherwise do I think that the Luce means anything about how EVs need to look? No since there are a number of good looking EVs in their own right. The Porsche Taycan comes to mind for me immediately. As do a number of the Cadillacs. The Luce is just Ferrarri's multipla.
skorpyn@reddit
💯 my thoughts as well upon seeing this. Actually really smart in a devious way. Refuse to believe they thought it would be a smash. All a ploy
ZetaM3@reddit
Really smart Ferrari is wasting billions of dollars to hurt themselves?
Venous@reddit
Do you know how much money big oil is worth?
Pixelplanet5@reddit
theres no true ICE ban in the EU.
theres nothing stopping manufacturers from still producing as many as they want as long as they run on efuels and stay within their emission limits.
given that so many people are still parroting that theres so much development left to do for combustion engines and that efuels are going to be the future that should be no problem right?
of course thats only the case until you take look at basic physics.
Recoil42@reddit
This is just cope. If they wanted people to hate EVs they wouldn't have hired LoveFrom to fuck it up. They'd have just done it themselves.
Street_Algae_7475@reddit
Actually consultants since time immemorial are great for throwing under the bus
Recoil42@reddit
Throwing LoveFrom "under the bus" would be getting people to hate LoveFrom, not EVs, thus making the entire argument self-defeating. I'm flabbergasted I need to explain this, frankly.
Blanchimont@reddit
Nah. If we continue the hypothesis that they want people to hate EVs hiring LoveFrom is actually a masterstroke.
If the car does what it is meant to do, they can blame LoveFrom and absolve Flavio Manzoni and the Ferrari Centro Stile team of any blame.
If the car is a massive succes, they can pat themselves on the back for making the daring decision to team up with LoveFrom for reinventing Ferrari for the modern times.
threeinacorner@reddit
Fucking bullshit. I'm sorry to be so harsh but It pisses me off to see this kind of opinion. If Ferrari wants people to hate EVs they would have gone to great lengths in designing their own packs, their own inverters, their own motors.
They wouldn't have built an entirely new facility to accomodate EVs and hybrid production FFS.
IsometricRain@reddit
Calm down lil bro. It's just an electric car, and a fun article by the Throttle house guy.
ArcticBP@reddit
Yeah this sub is really beyond repair
They’d bring back leaded gas if they could
Trevski@reddit
Bring back? Man you can buy leaded gas right now at any airport with a fuel station!
ZetaM3@reddit
This is the dumbest comment I’ve read so far today.
Beekeeper_Dan@reddit
“Never attribute to malice that which can be attributed to stupidity”
Baby-girl-54321@reddit
Sometimes a car’s purpose isn’t to sell volume it’s to buy time.
narwhal_breeder@reddit
Buy time? What time are they buying?
Ferrari is extremely profitable without it - the market segment of the Luce ($650,000 premium EVs) is microscopic.
strongmanass@reddit
Not just that. A $650K electric crossover. It's more than a Purosangue, more than a RR Phantom. It's one of the most expensivr family cars ever. The only four door cars I can recall costing more are the Aston Martin Lagonda and Hongqi Guoli, and I wouldn't exactly call those "family cars."
joshb625@reddit
Honestly can’t stand the looks but I think the price is the bigger issue with this car. What is it competing against? Because there really aren’t any competitors priced at this price point. They will sell because it’s a Ferrari, but the design and price have me confused.
bhop_monsterjam@reddit
i think they'll still sell them all
Ok_Two_2604@reddit
They will require people to buy one to get on the list for other cars, to meet electrification requirements. Like how they do with the wagon ones.
Wompie@reddit
I personally believe that you are going to see these lining the streets in Monaco next year, like you see with all the other small electric zippy cars that are used to get around out there. But this time it’s also a status symbol, which they love.
Is it good looking? Well that is in the eye of the beholder. Do you remember what people said about the purosangue? Comparing it to a Mazda 3 and such.
kid50cal@reddit
I wrote a piece on my substack about a completely different theory. Won’t post here as to not self promote. But here’s the gist.
I think it’s more of a change management failure. The new teams that are responsible for the launch of their EVs aren’t experts in their brands they’re working for. There’s so much internal miscommunication that makes it way into the press release that you can sniff something is wrong.
They tried using their legacy teams and that failed (ID.4, Bz4x, etc.). Now there going with ground up teams, and these teams don’t understand what defines the brand identity.
They’re also selling to a completely different audience. Tech bros, Silicon Valley, essentially people of the next generation. I don’t know how there gonna maintain their legacy without alienating us petrol heads.
hiro111@reddit
I feel like there's a small, dedicated band of internal combustion enthusiasts who don't like EVs as a matter of principle. They like vroom vroom, they see themselves as "canyon carvers" and they refer to car models by their internal designation. Still, I think the vast (VAST) majority of people couldn't care less about these things. Most people are far more focused on reliability, resale value, ease of living with the vehicle and cost. For a lot of people EVs fail for those reasons, not because of what's under the hood. I think EVs can and will solve all of these problems.
sioux612@reddit
There is a chess m9ve called thr Bongcloud
So yes, Ferrari might be playing chess. Just not well
PRSArchon@reddit
I think the reality isnt far off from this theory. BMW did something similar with the i3. Starting with a controversial car makes everything that comes after it look much better than it actually is.
wimpires@reddit
The reason isn't that complicated.
For whatever reason z Ferrari gave lovefrom carte blanche authority to do whatever they wanted.
And they decided to pretty much just reuse whatever was in mind for the Apple Car. And adapted some of it for Ferrari.
To be fair I think they nailed it with the interior. The concept is brilliant z not perfectly executed but still damn good.
I am not going to comment on the exterior...
And the price well they probably just worked backwards from "it cost us €1bn to develop and we think we can sell maybe 1,500-2,000 of these so it has to be priced around €600k to break even" and that's that
ZetaM3@reddit
The same Gen Z that is obviously buying Ferraris right?
strongmanass@reddit
He didn't say anything about Gen Z. I think those two orphaned z are meant to be commas.
dattroll123@reddit
More like playing connect 4
r23dom@reddit
Ferrari is plays chess..... on the race track
kon---@reddit
No. They're playing checkers.
BMW...is the brand playing EV chess.
NoctD@reddit
Chess implies they actually thought this over, appears not looking at the Luce they built.
bbatu@reddit
300 elo chess though
SEND_ME_FAKE_NEWS@reddit
They're playing chess, but have only played checkers before
Lower_Kick268@reddit
"playing chess" is shareholder speak for, "we fucked up"
ikilledtupac@reddit
That car is checkers
narwhal_breeder@reddit
checkers requires some executive function - I think they are playing go-fish or Sorry.
MGPS@reddit
I for one welcome our new electric Ferrari minivan overlords.
flatpetey@reddit
They let Ive go loose and he showed that, in the end, he is a one-trick pony of Dieter Rams style design.
tararira1@reddit
I like the Luce
narwhal_breeder@reddit
nice try Benedetto
bzb321@reddit
They’re playing chess like me. Botez gambit a queen
hi_im_bored13@reddit
People here clearly aren't reading through the whole article lol
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