Confused about this departure procedure
Posted by muhhifawzi@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 24 comments
For the Ventura transition, the route description says to expect vectors to the LAX VORTAC, but the description for the Ventura transition starts with “From over SLI VORTAC..”
- how did we get to SLI when we’re expecting radar vectors to LAX, and then continuing west?
- for lost comms scenario right after departure, would you fly to LAX or SLI?
Dry-Horror-4188@reddit
Before I moved to TX and when I was based at KFUL I flew this departure all the time. SoCal almost never takes you to SLI they will Radar vector you to LAX and then have you fly the departure.
On lost coms, per the procedure, you will be expected to fly the full departure.
MeatResident2697@reddit
I've never seen a chart that "continues on the following page"
coma24@reddit
it's super commons for SIDs. Look at the charts for LAX.
MeatResident2697@reddit
We use jeppesen and doesn't really happen there.
x4457@reddit
1) See how LAX is after SLI on the departure procedure? You skip that first part when you wind up over LAX.
2) You follow the same route hierarchy as any other moment on an IFR flight. Assigned, Vectored, Expected, Filed. You have been told to expect vectors to the LAX VOR (it is on the chart), so you would proceed to the LAX VOR.
coma24@reddit
You and I go way back....but I don't know about that reasoning 😄
Look at SAN and MYF, they have substantially different versions of the CWARD2 SID.
SIDs are encoded per airport...even if they share the same name. There's no reason they couldn't have different text for LGB's VTU transition to say "from over LAX," if they wanted.
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
That’s what I was thinking, but then it just doesn’t make sense why they’d even include “from the SLI VORTAC” for that transition when we’re skipping that entire portion.
x4457@reddit
Sure it does, very simply: this departure doesn't only serve LGB.
IntroiboAdAltareDei2@reddit
Then why include this portion of the DP for Long Beach? I can see where th confusion is.
x4457@reddit
Because NACO charts are good but not great.
kmac6821@reddit
NACO hasn’t been a thing for what, two decades?
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
I wonder if the Jepp charts would show the same thing
x4457@reddit
They do, but more clearly.
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
Oh god I completely forgot about that, thanks 🤦♂️
time_adc@reddit
Read the second page. It clearly says to expect vectors. Do you see it below the instructions for each runway and each transition?
Not sure if you are flying piston aircraft. If so it's easier to depart using the HAWWC3 departure from LGB.
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
Alright thats what I thought it was, just the wording at the bottom of “from SLI VORTAC” was confusing, but as others have cleared up that is because other airports use the same DP.
I’m not actually flying this DP, I’m helping a friend study for his checkride and I haven’t reviewed DPs in months so I thought no shame in asking for help.
Bwin101@reddit
Rwy 26/30 towards LAX, Rwy 08/12 right turn to SLI then transition via Wilma. That is what I would do.
MadFalcon101@reddit
From what I understand the expect vectors to lax is for departing lgb specifically and the bottom is the description of the entire transition and also can apply to kful departures
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
Thank you
x4457@reddit
And SNA.
OCFlier@reddit
Read the top of the second page. Fly runway heading to 800 then expect vectors to LAX VOR
zarmril@reddit
Not a helpful answer, assuming that OP can read English.
muhhifawzi@reddit (OP)
That’s what I thought, but it’s odd then that they’d write at the bottom “from the SLI VORTAC” when at no point along that departure you’re at the SLI VORTAC, if you are just being directed to LAX.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
For the Ventura transition, the route description says to expect vectors to the LAX VORTAC, but the description for the Ventura transition starts with “From over SLI VORTAC..”
- how did we get to SLI when we’re expecting radar vectors to LAX, and then continuing west?
- for lost comms scenario right after departure, would you fly to LAX or SLI?
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