Just Wow: We Drove the Xiaomi SU7 Ultra on the Track | MotorTrend
Posted by pursuer_of_simurg@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 147 comments
Posted by pursuer_of_simurg@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 147 comments
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
The car is still only sold in China, it doesn't come most world.
JellyOkarin@reddit
The fact that CT5V Blackwing is virtually only available in NA doesn't stop people from recommending it
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Nobody's recommending it in Europe.
Slideways@reddit
Really?
Because it didn’t stop Evo and CAR from singing its praises.
https://www.evo.co.uk/cadillac/204653/cadillac-ct5-v-blackwing-2022-review-detroit-takes-on-the-bmw-m5-competition
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/cadillac/ct5-v-blackwing/
GrynaiTaip@reddit
You seriously don't understand the meaning of "Not available in Europe"?
How do you recommend something that cannot be purchased? Is this American education in full display?
RichardNixon345@reddit
We get it, you don’t do that in Germany.
Slideways@reddit
You don’t see the parallel of European car mags driving and praising the CTS-V and an American car mag driving and praising the SU7?
Murciless@reddit
That’s bonkers if true. CT5-V Blackwing is the ultimate supersedan. With a wicked 6spd manual as the cherry on top of a phenomenal chassis.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
It's bonkers that some cars aren't available in some regions?
Europe has plenty of fast luxury sedans, this one wouldn't stand out.
Murciless@reddit
It’s bonkers if no one is recommending it. And the only way someone wouldn’t recommend it over any other sedan, even an M5, is if they haven’t driven the Blackwing.
exolomus@reddit
No one in Europe will recommend the CT5-V, or any GM car or even most american cars.
All imported cars are subject to tariffs and tax, no dealership network and with warranty being void or heavily restricted, every spare part need to be ordered from the states (don't forget about shipping, tariffs and taxes).
In the case of the blackwing, the cheapest new car from one of Germany's biggest us car importer costs around 200k USD
Is the blackwing a car you would recommend for that price with all the hassle involved?
JK_Chan@reddit
There's no use recommending it because no one can get it there. I can recommend the nissan presage as an absolute bargain of a family MPV but by the time you pay all the import fees and all that it's not gonna be a bargain of a car, it's gonna be an expensive shitbox. If anyone in europe manages to pay all the fees and do all the paperwork to get one imported, they might as well have got a giulia gtam instead.
HandOfGood@reddit
Are you illiterate
GrynaiTaip@reddit
You really don't understand it, do you?
jimflaigle@reddit
And never forget the Dacia Sandro.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Most world have had strict emission rule, so that’s one of most reasons why CT5-V BlackWing been American exclusive model.
For EV, you don’t have that problem because they’ve no reason to ban.
durrtyurr@reddit
Countries and regions around the world have used "having different emissions regulations" as a way to protect local car makers for basically the entire time that emission regulations have existed.
Blyatskinator@reddit
… Maybe because this is a sub/website where the majority are Americans?? Lol
JellyOkarin@reddit
Dunno about the sub (doesn't say r/carsinusa tho), but pretty sure the yanks make up less than 50% of all redditors
oneonus@reddit
Exactly, it's a phenomenal car and unless this sub is renamed to be US specific, people need to think before the made poor comments. This car could be sold in North America, but we all know why it's not.
Thee_Sinner@reddit
To be clear, tho, more than 50% is not required to be the majority.
-Tilde@reddit
You’re thinking of a plurality. Majority means more than half of a total
samcuu@reddit
That might be true 10-15 years ago. You'll be surprised how much of reddit/the internet are Indian nowadays.
Working_Elephant5344@reddit
I’m very skeptical about the price of the entire SU7 lineup. On paper, it looks like they’re offering Model S quality for the price of a Model 3. What’s the catch?
SomeRandomGamer3@reddit
Subsidised by their government, sold at a loss or break even. Same thing they did with their phones, their top model used to be half the price of the newest Samsung with similar specs now that they have established the brand they up the price closer to competitiors.
A-Stranger-1@reddit
No catch. You're just used overpriced worse cars in the West.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Their government is subsidizing the production, end goal is to push other manufacturers to bankruptcy and then raise prices.
A-Stranger-1@reddit
Western OEMs are subsidized as well.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Only a little bit, nowhere near as much as the ones in China.
420bIaze@reddit
"The Chinese government is paying thousands of dollars so foreigners can have a cheaper car" is not a compelling argument not to buy one.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
Outsourcing all labour to China is generally not a great idea.
420bIaze@reddit
Chinese car companies are increasingly manufacturing their cars overseas.
GrynaiTaip@reddit
How many such factories are overseas? Also do they hire locals, or bring their own workers from China?
For infrastructure projects (bridges, ports, highways) they bring their own workers.
420bIaze@reddit
Chinese car companies currently have dozens of active manufacturing sites in at least 16 countries globally. They employ a mix of local and international staff, in accordance with local labour laws.
I don't have any clear reason to inherently prefer manufacturing from any alternative country to China. There are no saints in auto manufacturing.
Like if you buy a Volkswagen over a BYD for alleged German ethical superiority, you'd have to ignore VWs history of unethical and illegal conduct. And ignore that VW manufactures cars in China, India, Brazil, Russia, South Africa, etc. And even if you specifically buy a German manufactured one, many components are going to be sourced from countries with lower labour and environmental standards.
Logitech4873@reddit
Cheaper labour I think.
TangerineBroad4604@reddit
More so highly automated manufacturing these days
Ajeje_brazorf9@reddit
Not really, more about economies of scale
KingMario05@reddit
Your data, I imagine.
opeth10657@reddit
Yeah, here in the US we just give all our information directly to Elon through the government
Much more efficient
the_lamou@reddit
The catch is that an autoworker in China earns about 10-25% of what an autoworker in the West earns. Plus fewer environmental regulations, plus state support that doesn't get counted in subsidy totals but that would be unthinkable in the West (like maximum prices on materials for key industries). Plus zero enforcement of international copyrights/trademarks/patents.
deleted_by_reddit@reddit
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austic@reddit
I wonder if Canada might get it in the Chinese EV deal
MartiniPolice21@reddit
I mean, half of this sub seems to be people talking about cars only sold in the US
kaelis7@reddit
I’m jealous every time someone mentions the C8 on this sub.
I’m like yeah yeah sure let’s buy the 60k€ V8 super car hm so easy to do that in France I don’t know why I’m looking at 100k€ 4-cylinders cars instead.
WarDEagle@reddit
We feel similarly jealous about your Alpine!
anynamesleft@reddit
OMG I saw a classic Alpine when I was stationed in Germany. I walked around that thing for a good hour in a state of lust. One of the best looking cars ever. Then to learn the history was enthralling.
bluecheetos@reddit
80% of Redditors are from the US so ...
the_lamou@reddit
Well, half of Reddit is Americans, so that makes sense.
tightcall@reddit
Coming to Europe next year, gonna sell like hotcakes.
Evening_Effective_55@reddit
Its going to be a lot more expensive in Europe than in China. A Denza Z9 GT is around 43k€ in China while in Europe it’s a 115k€ car , at that price is a much harder sale because the badge matters a lot more to buyers.
the_lamou@reddit
Not just due to VAT and tariffs but also due to global pricing strategy. The price in any given market is always going to be as high as the company thinks they can sell the car for, not just the home market price in local currency.
mazi710@reddit
They're expanding to Europe next year. But general rule of thumb, Chinese cars cost double or more outside of China, compared to in China. The base Xiaomi cars are probably gonna sell very good, but they're gonna be priced similarly to all other cars we already have.
i_marketing@reddit
It depends where. The Zeekr 7x sells for about 15% more in Australia than it costs in China. In general, a lot of Chinese EVs in Australia cost about 15% to 20% more in Australia than China. You can also get Chinese EVs for a good price in many Asian countries, with respect to the price in China.
cookingboy@reddit
Even then it would still be a bargain, considering that's the price of a slightly optioned Taycan 4S, meanwhile beating the Taycan Turbo GT in every way possible.
mazi710@reddit
Oh for sure, it's just people like me reading "$75k, I might be able to afford that!" are gonna be in for a rude awakening.
cookingboy@reddit
To be fair not even in China do many people get the Ultra. The lesser trims are still crazy good and are 40% cheaper, so that's the sweet spot.
If they can get the lesser trim for sale for around $60-70k ($30-40k in China), it would seriously dent the sale of the like of the new BMW i3.
mazi710@reddit
In Europe we already have high end Chinese brands like Xpeng and Zeekr, I assume Xiaomi will be priced similar to that.
The base Zeekr 7GT is a luxury wagon with 421hp, 75kwh battery, 480kw max charging speed, for €35.000.
They're pretty wild value for money, but still suffer in sales compared to the big 3 because "it's Chinese" even though they win in reviews and direct comparisons to BMW, Audi, Mercedes etc.
Logitech4873@reddit
China is a HUGE market.
Szymon_Sz@reddit
Private import is a thing. I have just seen SU7 in Poland.
umm_like_totes@reddit
They could import it to the US, pay the 100% or whatever tariff and it would probably still cost less than a 911 though.
zdy132@reddit
It's being tested in Germany since 2025, with rumors around launching in 2027. Now is a good time to take a look at it.
BrunoEye@reddit
It'll be interesting to see the prices when it comes to the west.
cookingboy@reddit
I think people here don't realize how Xiaomi made their first car about 2 years ago.
The SU7 was announced in December, 2023. So many people thought it was a concept car made by a cellphone maker for PR only.
Then they put it into mass production in 4 months, and shipped 200k units 8 months later. And then here we are today.
I still remember when people first started talking about Chinese EVs a few years ago most people here didn't believe the acclaim they are getting, and at one point this sub went into full witch hunt mode calling people bots, shills, or spreading Chinese propaganda. Just look at the comments on this thread a year ago.
Well /u/AmericanExcellence, /u/Rabo_McDongleberry, do you think Motor Trend has now also joined the likes of Edmunds review, Ford CEO Jim Farley, and reporters from the BBC in shilling for the Chinese government?
I actually want the American car industry to succeed. There is so much great history and genuinely world class products as well. Hell even the Chinese give full credits to Tesla for kickstart this whole EV thing.
But unfortunately it seems like our reaction to being surpassed is to double down on burying our head in the sand and close off the country. This is what the Chinese did at the end of the Qing Dynasty, and what followed was 100 years of humiliation.
Ecsta@reddit
The engine/powertrain setup is just so ridiculously complicated that it was a huge barrier to entry. Whereas battery + electric motors are simplistic, especially for a tech company located in China where they have easy access to basically everything.
I'm excited we're going to get them in Canada.
acog@reddit
It’s going to be interesting, and probably sad, to see what happens to enthusiast cars over time.
Like, forget about the Luce for a second, how will a company like Ferrari survive? Yes, historically their cars were beautiful but it was their engines that made the legend.
There’s no such thing as a characterful EV motor. All EVs give the same acceleration experience, instant full torque and nearly silent operation.
The cost of batteries is steadily falling and their capabilities are steadily rising. Manufacturing and maintenance costs are lower for EVs. Combine that with renewable power’s cost also rapidly falling and the future for gas engines is bleak, regardless of government mandates.
Sports cars are already a shrinking niche, and it’s only going to get harder to make a profit. Toyota didn’t partner with Subaru and BMW for sports cars because it was easier—it’s way harder to develop a product in conjunction with another company. They did it because it wasn’t financially viable to do it themselves.
All that is to say I have very mixed feelings about EVs, lol.
zdy132@reddit
Race horses are still around, and loved by many. There will always be a place for ICE, just maybe not as prominent as today.
Sandy_Koufax@reddit
I’m not so sure it’s the same. This feels more like the shift from carbureted to fuel injected.
zdy132@reddit
Yeah it's a very rough analogy. Perhaps steam engine to ICE would be a better one?
420bIaze@reddit
You can give an EV motor any torque curve and sound you want with software.
If just depends whether we can mature to a point of accepting that flaws and imperfections are what make cars fun.
ardric@reddit
You can give it a real 6MT transmission, real clutch pedal, RWD with mechanical LSD and balanced handling.
But muh efficiency! EV's don't need transmissions! lol. Some chinese manufacturer will introduce an actual enthusiast EV in the next year or two and the internet is going to lose it's fucking mind.
strongmanass@reddit
The acceleration in ICE cars is an act of design. Ferrari is very open about tuning the acceleration profile of the 12cilindri and Roma/Amalfi to give drivers the feeling they want them to experience. The same will be done for EVs (and is already done by a few auto makers).
Rabo_McDongleberry@reddit
I never said that Chinese cars aren't good? So idk why you lumped me in.
What I did say was that it felt like some sort of an artificial thing online. Like the tariffs were being discussed and then at the same time all the media hype around Chinese cars came at the same time. It felt inorganic and I'd you know anything about the current state of internet, you know for a damn fact nothing is truly "viral" anymore. It's all just fabricated.
So again. I have nothing negative against Chinese cars. But there is still something inorganic about how all the similar articles that pop up around the same time.
g0atm3a1@reddit
It has been incredible to observe the anti-Chinese folks coming to grips with reality on Reddit as a whole.
CaptainKoala@reddit
Even if you are fully anti-China you simply have to acknowledge that they have completely destroyed us on electric vehicle technology and production volume. Like you cannot overstate just how hard they annihilated us. Despite the US having like a 15 year head start.
i_marketing@reddit
AmericanExcellence, you noticed this person too, lol.
TangerineBroad4604@reddit
What a goofy ass username, surely an unbiased perspective re: China and surely not a shill for the US
K_R_A_K_E_N_540@reddit
Back in 2018 I went to the Frankfurt motor show and there was a small corner for Chinese brands, they felt off, cheapish. In 2024 I want to the paria motor show, more than half of the show was Chinese brands, for every 1 person looking at German cars, there were 10 crowding to look at Chinese cars. And the shocking part was that getting out of a 25k Chinese car and into a 80k German car, the Chinese car felt much better built
Several-Eggplant4460@reddit
The Germans are doing everything they can to go downmarket, by enshittifying the interiors of their non flagship cars.
Meanwhile the Chinese are doing all they can to go upmarket.
Once the Chinese figure out performance and reliability, the Germans are in trouble.
Mysterious-Lick@reddit
I bought & drove it in GT7. Underwhelming.
phenix_igloo@reddit
Ferrari luce lol
Trades46@reddit
The Xiaomi isn't even the closest competitor. Take a look at the YangWang U9, a subsidiary of BYD that actually looks like what an EV supercar should.
Sandy_Koufax@reddit
I just can’t get over these names.
strongmanass@reddit
It's a shame they can't be as distinguished as RAM or Hummer or Dodge. I do hope those Chinese auto makers are able to at least give the cars names as lofty as the venerable Scat Pack.
Trades46@reddit
仰望 roughly translates to "to admire" in Chinese. It sounds better locally than in English.
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
It’s a sad day when a Chinese EV company makes a more Ferrari car than the newest car made by Ferrari
m1a2c2kali@reddit
Honestly if this was the luce there wouldn’t have been as much of an uproar lol
cookingboy@reddit
You know what's really funny? Ferrai was literally benchmarking the Xiaomi internally: https://www.reddit.com/r/electricvehicles/comments/1md8v9l/report_ferrari_were_so_impressed_by_the_xiaomi/
Then Ferrari decision makers unironically got together, and went "yep, if we make this Xiaomi uglier, slower, and cost 4 times as much, and slap a Ferrari badge on it we'd have a amazing product!"
CortaCircuit@reddit
Ew
Der_Apfeldieb@reddit
All Tesla Model 3 sold in Europe are made in China. Xiaomi will come to Europe in 2027 and will have about the same prices als Tesla. The extreme SU7 Ultra about the same as an Model S Plaid.
But expect the new YU7 GT SUV to be very aggressive in price/performance.
Trades46@reddit
An EV having a ton of hp and big range figures isn't hard to do. What is amazing is how Xiaomi which started from nothing made a car that is good handling, brakes well and so confidence inspiring that allows a driver to push and trust it enough to tame 1500hp and make use of all that power. There are videos online (mostly in Chinese mind you) that dig though the technical aspect of the SU7 Ultra that shows the lengths and engineering Xiaomi's team to develop this thing and the fact they can sell it for ~$75k USD equivalent....wow is definitely the word MT summarized.
For comparison, it took years for the Model S Plaid to hit the ring and it was always a dodgy time with no posted full lap video, and the fact it came from Elon Musk whom is arguably one of the least trustworthy person alive these days. It wasn't until later that they released a "track pack" that added nearly a grand to the Plaid sticker price to even get to its official time.
uber_neutrino@reddit
They didn't have to start from nothing any more than chevy did with the C8 motor. Plenty of examples they could be "inspired" by.
Brothernod@reddit
Yeah, but does it have CarPlay?
Sgtfullmetal@reddit
It does.
Brothernod@reddit
Well shit, I’ll take 2.
horribleone@reddit
An ultra heavy car is fast around a track? Cool, now do more than 3 laps
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
How many cars do you know that are running 4 laps in a row of the Nordschleife?
That’s 60 miles of track driving
horribleone@reddit
Why do you guys keep mentioning the ring? The track in the article is in Tianjin
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
Because this car famously set an EV lap record there. And it’s much longer than your typical circuit
RevvCats@reddit
Most HPDE sessions last 20-30 mins, and most people who are paying for a track day want to be out there for the full session.
Yes the ring is long, so for a 7 min pace to be what I’d consider track ready it would need to be capable of doing 3-4 laps without stopping or going into limp mode. If it needs to go into a lower power endurance mode to last that long then that’s the track time that matters.
Then there’s the issue of the car being able to charge up and cool down enough to do another session after a 40-60 min rest.
avoidhugeships@reddit
I don't know why you are being down voted. Most EVs cannot sustain the performance for track days.
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
He’s being downvoted because this car is able to do an entire lap of the Nurburgring without an issue. That’s a 13 mile circuit
avoidhugeships@reddit
That is not as long as a typical track session.
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
You think they just showed up to drive one lap?
horribleone@reddit
There's no nice way to say that most people on this subreddit aren't interested when it comes to the details of automotive engineering or just physics in general
cookingboy@reddit
When was the last time you took your car around the Nurburgring for 4 laps?
It's been a dream of mine, so I'm jealous.
horribleone@reddit
What a bizarre non sequitur. I said what I said because all of these journalists continuously heap praise on EVs for "hiding their weight", which is a telltale sign that they don't hotlap for more than a couple of laps; a disappointment considering that performance repeatability is one of the true quality tests for any car and yet nobody bothers to benchmark that because they would rather repeat some insignificant numbers like the 0-60 time instead of something actually meaningful
wrsndede@reddit
Damn, it looks good. They should just make Chinese EV manufactures to form a joint venture with American auto makers and let them sell these EVs here.
ALOIsFasterThanYou@reddit
That’d be a sensible response, but sense is in short supply these days, as evidenced by the response to attempts to set up CATL/Ford and Gotion battery plants in the US.
wrsndede@reddit
It's a no-brainer. The only one who loses in the short term would be Tesla, but doubt it matters to them long term since they seem to be losing interest in being an automaker anyway.
tnolan182@reddit
Doubt we will ever see them here in the US, seems as if banning Chinese autos has bipartisan support in congress oddly enough
durrtyurr@reddit
Yeah, the article a few days ago on this sub talking about how the proposed legislation against Chinese cars could inadvertently ban Mercedes mentioned that the legislation has bipartisan support. America's automotive manufacturing industry is split relatively evenly between red and blue districts, I know for a fact that's true in KY (literally a 50/50 split. Two ford plants in a blue district, a GM plant and a Toyota plant in red districts).
cookingboy@reddit
That's when you know this country cannot deal with being behind, because even our own politicans drank too much of the American Exceptionalism koolaid.
When the Chinese auto industry was far behind, they used the JVs to absord and western IPs and know-hows to catch up in an incredibly short amount of time.
Now the American auto industry is far behind, we just ban competition and pat ourselves on the shoulder to feel better.
As a Chinese American, this almost hilarious fits the Asian parents vs. white parents stereotypes:
Asian parents: Why you only got A-? Look at Brian and John, they got A in everything, become friends with them and learn!
White parents: Well you tried your best so feel proud of your accomplishment! Don't compare against others, compare against yourself!
sicklyslick@reddit
The US can't improve if it can't admit it's behind.
China has always chased after the US, looking up to it, try to be it.
Yankee831@reddit
I mean if the US did the same to China as was done. They would have to enter into minority partnerships which they’re still able to do and they could absolutely import or build compliant vehicles but that would undermine the whole endeavor.
ALOIsFasterThanYou@reddit
If I'm understanding you correctly, I think that's my point (as well as that of the OP) - I'd be in favor of Chinese-style JVs, but with the roles reversed; 51% for the US automaker, 49% for the Chinese counterpart. There are already similar JVs in other Chinese export markets where they hold minority ownership, such as SAIC in India and Leapmotor in Europe. Ford-Geely seems quite plausible, given the rumors.
But that's dependent on whether or not these bills become law. There's the aforementioned ban on even partial Chinese ownership, there's another one that places a blanket ban on Chinese cars entering the US (even if driven overland by Canadian or Mexican visitors with no intent to sell here), and who knows what they'll come up with tomorrow.
Bderken@reddit
Not a fact but I look at Polestar (Volvo EV) as just Chinese tech now
007meow@reddit
Any venture with American companies would find prices jacked up to absurd levels
superchibisan2@reddit
How about let's not
ProfessorCaptain@reddit
No car play so we hate it right guys?!
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xlb250@reddit
I would be terrified driving such a fast car on the track. If anything related to braking fails, I’m getting pancaked.
Ok-Heron-128@reddit
Lighter than an M5
Kaylee-X@reddit
There are actual motorhomes lighter than the M5. Not a high bar to clear, but it's still funny that a 1500hp ev is lighter than an M5.
_galaga_@reddit
When the 5 series came out so porky I liked to point out it was heavier than my Cayenne by a few hundred pounds. Look like the M5 is almost 400 lbs heavier.
Th1rt13n@reddit
Except M5 can be trusted the breaks will actually work
Logitech4873@reddit
Brakes*
Th1rt13n@reddit
Oh we’ve got a grammar natsi in here, nice!
Maybe cause they already failed on a few journos and xiaomi went above and beyond to punish said journalists for speaking out?
Logitech4873@reddit
That's not a grammar thing. You used the wrong word.
Th1rt13n@reddit
Are you a teacher or something?
Srtviper@reddit
Well you being a moron does make me question you engineering credentials when it comes to the subject at hand.
captainpistoff@reddit
Both definitely work better than your grammar.
Th1rt13n@reddit
Mah man, if that’s all you’re capable of, I’ve got some bad news for you
kinda_guilty@reddit
Periods at the end of sentences, bruv.
Th1rt13n@reddit
Getting downvoted in the cars sub for saying a Chinese car is shit is a badge of honour lmao
HuntKey2603@reddit
fear! uncertainty! doubt!
MojaMonkey@reddit
How many 300kmh to 50kmh brake pulls would you trust the M5 for? 3? Maybe 5?
BrunoEye@reddit
I would much prefer it if there weren't any breaks.
Andreaspetersen12@reddit
Why?
Pixelplanet5@reddit
its not heavier then other cars in its class and because its an EV it could still come to a full stop if all break discs fail at the same time.
exquisitopendejo@reddit
I drive a much lighter and slower car than this. I’d still be pretty worried if my brakes failed.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Some people still said that it was still better than Model S Plaid although Tesla offered it with upgrade brake package...
kron98_@reddit
Saw one on German plates yesterday in Madrid. I think it was the base trim, but it was all kitted out with sensors (LIDAR, I suppose). Excited to see the final spec sheet on this one.
Vhozite@reddit
Speaking purely on looks this is how more EVs (or even better a coupe version of this) should look. Not a minimalist blob (Model 3), not an SUV (Ioniq 5), and certainly not whatever the fuck BMW and Ferrari are releasing. More Evija, SU7, and Taycan, and less of everything else please.
I think 1500 HP is way overkill but impressive nonetheless
zvekl@reddit
I like the specs but looks wise mehhhh
Go Xiaomi though, I love their products
Original_Bat509@reddit
The Xiaomi SU7 Ultra impressed on track with extreme acceleration, strong grip, and surprisingly mature handling for a first-gen performance EV.