Slopocalypse is what we should be really worried about.
Posted by Sad_Bandicoot_6925@reddit | LocalLLaMA | View on Reddit | 30 comments
SaaSocalypse refers to the market correction of SaaS stocks - driven by the fear that AI would deprecate the need for SaaS. I think it is mostly unfounded - SaaS is not going anywhere - it is just getting a new class of customers - Agents. Agents will both consume and create more SaaS - so we should expect an explosion of SaaS rather than an implosion.
But what I think is real, and immediate, is Slopocalpyse. And I think we are only seeing the tip of it.
Entire socials are drowning out in AI slop. This is creating a very 'jarring' experience to consumers who are subject to the AI driven regurgitation of content. But I suspect there is something more sinister going on underneath.
Over the last two years - I have started using AI more and more driven by a belief that rapidly accelerated use of AI will result in efficiency and performative gains over all domains. One of the important subjects has been business strategy. I have been running long discussions - specifically with Claude Opus, around business strategy for NonBioS.
This is something which started naturally as I upped my use of AI for everything. However, I am now coming around to the conclusion that this could be drastically counter productive. And the danger is not just that it is robbing you of critical thinking skills, or drowning your thoughts in sycophantic AI prose, it is that in my experience it could be disastrously, concretely wrong.
Two instances which closed this gap for me - I ran two specific discussions with Opus on specific business outcomes. One was around marketing tactics for NonBioS, and the other was improving conversions. These were not just single chats - but multiple of them looking at the topics with different lenses. Over the next few months I largely executed the advice that Opus gave me. The outcomes from those two actions which happened over the last quarter are just becoming visible - and it is becoming clear that both the tactics were disastrously wrong. Not only did they not result in the desired outcomes - but they diverted efforts from strategies that would have worked better. The culprit was Opus - and the blame was on me who chose to believe in it.
For the strategy around marketing tactics - Opus advised me that email marketing to our already existing userbase, which runs into thousands, would be the most productive marketing tactic. This worked out wrong - largely because most of our early users came from my network - (ex)engineers, IIT, (ex)FAANG professionals. But our most valuable builders turned out to be solo/independent business founders based in developed markets. For the second discussion around improving conversions - Opus advised me to reduce our entitlements on the free plan - this tanked our conversion instead. After we realized it, we overcompensated - and dramatically increased the free plan entitlements. This got conversion back on track, and then some.
In both cases, the answers that Opus gave were wrong. But the answers being wrong is not the main problem - the problem is that confident, well-reasoned wrongness is more dangerous than obvious wrongness, because you act on it.
But this wasn't the first time, I noticed similar behavior from Gemini in March of 2025. In our internal testing at NonBioS the Gemini March 2025 checkpoint - was one of the best coding models ever. Matching the current SOTA frontier models - this is something which has been reported around the internet. The key behaviour that I recall with Gemini was - that what made it best for coding - seemed like it made it disastrous for non coding fields. Specifically medicine - of which I ran multiple tests - multiple chats revealed that Gemini will double down on a wrong diagnosis once it made that call and will not retrace or revisit the diagnosis even when provided with compelling counter evidence.
This is very similar to what I suspect is going on with Opus. My thesis is that models which are great at coding are horrible in domains where the solution space is unbounded - like medicine or business strategy. And I suspect it is for the exact same reasons that make them great at coding. When given a problem space, they will choose a solution early on and double down on it. In coding, this behaviour is rewarding - because if the solution doesn't work - it can be verified quickly - you can backtrack - and try something else. And the strong belief that the solution is correct helps you converge to the point of verification rapidly.
But in subjects where the outcomes are open-ended, require substantial resources to implement, and results are visible only over a longer time period, the optimal strategy requires deeper holistic evaluations of early solutions to create a more grounded perspective.
The disaster specifically is to use frontier coding models for domains where the solution space is open-ended, and it happens not just because of the specific thought process that coding models are excellent with, but also because of the unique intersection of reinforcement learning driven sycophancy combined with their ability to convince you of their thought process due to the scaling law enablements.
Slopocalypse is not just the socials being overrun by AI drivel, but our minds being overrun with confident, well-articulated but ungrounded AI thoughts. And it's not just that they sometimes end up steering us towards wrong discussions in places that matter most, but they are robbing us of our ability to drive our thoughts to come up with our own convictions. Because that is what makes us humans above anything else - and we might be trading it away already.
msemyanovsky@reddit
I am sorry when your own text features "is not just that, it is that" how could you preach against slop? Start from yourself!
Sad_Bandicoot_6925@reddit (OP)
Exact zero words in this were written by AI. Can you point me to the "its not just that, it is that" phrasing ?
Even if it is there, it came from me directly - and that is actually pointing to the issue - we are becoming the slop that we read.
sn2006gy@reddit
it reads like ai slop :(
Due-Function-4877@reddit
Next time, OP should say "brah" a bunch of times to keep you happy, zoomer
sn2006gy@reddit
zoomer hahahaha
thread-e-printing@reddit
All moral persuasion is slop. Always has been
No_Afternoon_4260@reddit
sadly everything reads like slope to me these days, is it because i've read too much ai? Because my fellow human brothers started talking like ai? We are doomed x)
sn2006gy@reddit
I mean, i stated the obvious and still got downvoted. People don't want to hear this.
msemyanovsky@reddit
"And the danger is not just that it is robbing you of critical thinking skills, or drowning your thoughts in sycophantic AI prose, it is that in my experience it could be disastrously, concretely wrong"
"And it's not just that they sometimes end up steering us towards wrong discussions in places that matter most, but they are"
If you have edited this for hours, surely you can point these out better than me scanning this thing for a minute? I don't know if you wrote or read before AI era but to me these constructions feel extremely foreign and revolting.
Monkey_1505@reddit
Not just that, is perfectly normal writing brah.
Sad_Bandicoot_6925@reddit (OP)
Read it again - This is NOT the phrasing AI uses typically. The "its not just that, it is that" phrasing is typically clubbed very close together when it is AI writing.
This is absolutely written by me - and untouched by AI. But I agree that there is a loose match on that phrasing - but it was subconcious.
stoppableDissolution@reddit
To be fair, I notice myself using gptisms sometimes too. If you read a lot of ai output you almost inevitably will pick up some of it :c
Pleasant-Shallot-707@reddit
Slop code from AI tools is a skills issue of the developer
a_beautiful_rhind@reddit
Social media has been dead since forever. The LLMs might raise the collective IQ there.
Sad_Bandicoot_6925@reddit (OP)
haha - agree !
Dany0@reddit
I actually don't agree, LLM is raw intelligence. LLMs are like autistic savants with superhuman memory, but autistic savants pretty consistently score at most one std deviation above average on IQ tests
So no, 1. they don't raise average IQ here 2. even if they did, I'm not sure it would be actually beneficial 3. I'm not sure IQ is even a relevant measure here, another reason why IQ tests should be taken with a grain of salf
crantob@reddit
I think the author has identified some of the downsides to overuse of LLMs.
I disagree with the meta-outlook. It's your individual choice, when and whether to interact with a LLM. Don't overuse it, just as you don't overuse alcohol without drawbacks.
Thanks for the contribution.
socialjusticeinme@reddit
The term I like to use in my personal life is “we used to surf the internet, now we surf the sea of slop”
The sad part is it’s only going to get worse from here.
BringTea_666@reddit
Honestly that is not the issue.
The biggest issues is that with ai being main "search" tool it means sites can't make money from adds which means they can't operate adds which means it makes no sense to make sites in the first place.
Secondly those searches cost money and each "ask" form AI can lead to 100s of sites being visited and scrubbed for info instead of 1-10 usually people search for.
100% soon google search will be broken as sites will start to limit views or simply remove google web services to be indexed by google. So the only way to get to site would be to know it from someone else and there will be modifications to name so that some people will have www. anaconda300python. com while others www. anaconda1444422python. com and other tricks to make automated search impossible.
socialjusticeinme@reddit
It’s already hosting ads. Ever ask it for product recommendations? Instead of big flashing banner ads, it will definitively steer you towards whoever is paying the most for the LLM to rank their product higher.
It’s a lot more insidious than traditional advertising since everyone just assumes the AI has all the data and would present it without bias.
Monkey_1505@reddit
The coincidence of a rise in AI hate because of slop, and of stuff breaking because of CEOs with AI psychosis, could lead to some interesting years.
thread-e-printing@reddit
It's just the US AI majors trying to get regulated so that they can capture it in the next season. Plot development jerking motion
DynamoDynamite@reddit
The confident wrongness problem is exactly what a colleague of mine has been building around, because confident-sounding outputs that fall apart under scrutiny are worse than obviously wrong ones as you act on them and the failure mode you're describing has a name in their validation runtime called retroactive narrative collapse where the model rewrites what it claimed to have seen rather than updating. The coding-model-in-open-domains thesis tracks too because the same convergence behavior that makes them good at code is catastrophic when verification takes a quarter and costs real resources. They shared something relevant here if you want to dig into the validation layers https://gist.github.com/intheheartofit/e22a4c95700d4526b9926dc0cf3a1bd8
DynamoDynamite@reddit
The confident wrongness problem is exactly what I've been building around, because confident-sounding outputs that fall apart under scrutiny are worse than obviously wrong ones as you act on them and the failure mode you're describing has a name in my validation runtime called retroactive narrative collapse where the model rewrites what it claimed to have seen rather than updating. The coding-model-in-open-domains thesis tracks too because the same convergence behavior that makes them good at code is catastrophic when verification takes a quarter and costs real resources. I shared something relevant here if you want to dig into the validation layers https://gist.github.com/intheheartofit/e22a4c95700d4526b9926dc0cf3a1bd8
catplusplusok@reddit
Are you saying that you were guaranteed to make better decisions yourself or hired an infallible human consultant to make them for you? In business, it's also all about failing fast, trying things on small scale and pivoting if they do not work. Opus gave you clear, verifiable things to try and you tried them and discovered the actual better solutions. How was AI supposed to know that your future users would turn out to be different from your current users and respond to different incentives?
I have been using Grok and Google antigravity for all kind of personal tasks - booking vacations, planning events, doing taxes. Yes, it's not perfect and, as you mentioned, it's on me to verify particulars. But it's way better than what I consistently do on my own. I don't have time to read hundreds of X posts reviewing a particular hotel. Maybe the lesson is to spend more personal time researching the highest profile decisions and delegate smaller tasks like oredering office supplies to agents?
Sad_Bandicoot_6925@reddit (OP)
You are right - my post is mostly a different perspective. Truth is most likely in the middle.
Then-Topic8766@reddit
Sturgeon's law says "Ninety percent of everything is crap". Edward M. Lerner joked in 2006, "Sturgeon's law posits that ninety percent of everything is crap. Either Sturgeon was a cockeyed optimist, or he knew nothing about software." AI slop rises it on another level.
No_Afternoon_4260@reddit
lol you made my day
jcdoe@reddit
You asked a bullshit machine how to run your business?
Maybe the issue isn’t AI, but use case. Google would have been a better use of your time, you could have copied someone else’s business model.
mrgalacticpresident@reddit
One big unspoken danger is not the slop in itself but the effects of slop everywhere on future AI training.
80% of everything is crude was true before AI and will probably be approximately true after AI. Don't even think about the web as some sort of holy human made grail of content. The core issue is though that AI will self-replicate crude and might succumb to the accumulation of slop before it breaks into a healthy baseline of "80% is crude" again.
We might see modern AI trained on Internet pre-LLM slop + selective inclusion of high quality sources. Regardless of whether AI or man was the content provider.