"God of the" thinking needs to die. School failed miserably to teach how polytheism actually worked. The next time I see "God of thunder" I'll need to bite my knuckles
it's a simplification because it's a lot easier to say "selene was the god of the moon" than it is to say "selene was the personification of the moon, silver and magic, and had ties to the Underworld, the Hunt and alchemy"
I think they鈥檙e referring to the fact that previous polytheistic religions used Gods as placeholders for forces of nature and didn鈥檛 see them as just floating people in the sky that ruled things. The God themselves WERE each of the elements of existence manifested.
They stepped into a more human form mostly when lessons in morality were taught. They need to become relatable if the goal with the stories is to shape the morality of your population.
But yeah. Poseidon IS the Ocean, Hades IS the underworld, etc. They have the thing they are themselves, and then a vessel body of sorts for the sake of moral lessons.
It's more varied than this. Not everyone who was part of a society with a dominant polytheistic pov thought the same things, at any point in history.
I.e. The idea of "odin" at all, is completely modern; even amongst Norse and Germanic societies there were probably 100s of variations of him, with some being more human and some being more vague.
Norse specifically tended towards the relatability of more personified "human" gods who were associated with other aspects. Semi related but it's also it's not confirmed in what way Thor was ever associated with lightning.
Iirc the idea comes from literally one sentence; a description of him opening a door and getting ready to fuck someone up, and there's thunder and lightning in the background. There's no other mention of his role as a "thunder god" anywhere else, overtime or not.
If anything, Odin was commonly a patron of sailors, and he was sometimes thought to be able to calm storms at sea, which is more of a direct association than Thor has.
They believed the gods were said forces personified. In this sense they were neither good nor evil but just were. Poseidon is the sea and at times the sea can be both beneficial and destructive to us, but none of this good or evil it just is.
So yeah in Greek mythology there are gods and goddesses that represent phenomenons and concepts, like sleep/Hypnos, death/Thanatos, and the west wind/Zephyros. The main Olympian gods, on the other hand, like Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades were given their divine authority by their father, Kronos. They weren't born ruling any particular part of nature.
In polytheistic religions the gods usually have a whole spectrum of things attached to them, they are literally aspects of humanity itself. Look at Thor, whole would basically be the god of all the chaotic aspects of masculinity. A mirror through which we can examine ourselves and understand ourselves, all of us have Thor living inside us and by understanding what went good/bad for him when he basically just follows instinct and goes hard on everything, we can learn about ourselves and life. Bro also produces lightning as a side effect when he smacks shit and is suddenly reduced from major reflection of our deepest male instincts to "HURR DURR GOD OF THUNDER".
It's like this with "all" (I am no deep expert so take ALL with a grain of salt) polytheism. The gods are aspects of ourselves. Dionysos is not to be literally taken as a lazy drunk asshole, you can view your own hedonistic sides through him. Through Freya you can explore unfettered vanity, etc etc etc.
脼贸rr is not the "chaotic aspects of masculinity". I think he's moreso supposed to be understood as representing all the ideal characteristics a Norse man should posess according to the norms of that time. He's a protector, he's goes out and righteously destroys evil, bad creatures. He's a force for good in Norse cosmology, holding evil J谦tnar at bay and devoting himelf to protecting humanity and their world. 脼贸rr is not some force living inside us. In my view, the sources point to 脼贸rr being a literal, godly person Norsemen truly believed rode the skies on his chariot, and an example to strive for as a man back then.
I am most well read in Norse myth, so I can't speak for the others, but in Norse myth, I really don't think the gods are aspects of ourselves. They are living, breathing, very human-like personalities who affect the world in complex ways, while they mirror humans at the same time. And while they are flawed and full of very human feelings and emotions, they often stand as examples to follow, a prime example being the Ragna R酶k myth, where, in spite of knowing that they will die and nothing can be done about it because such is their fate, they still want to go down swinging, thereby representing very important ideals for the norms and culture at that time.
It's also a common misconception that 脼贸rr produces lightning in that way. There exists literally one attestation where 脼贸rr directly is associated with lightning, that being when he arrives to duel Hrungnir. Other than that, he just hits things real hard with his hammer. Yes, he likely was associated with thunder and lightning, his name suggests as much. But in what ways that would come to light and how Norsemen imagined it, that is impossible to really firmly say. Personally, I've always been fond of the thought that it's his chariot that produces thunder and lightning when it rolls across the skies. The Celts had a corresponding god that created thunder and lightning in such a way, to my understanding, and the Celts and Germanics were neighbouring cultures and closely related in certain aspects. But again, no one really knows.
There's also nothing to suggest that Freyja has anything to do with vanity. She has different 'sins', if you want to call them that.
Btw, I hope I don't come across as condescending, that is not my intention. I just feel that your statements here contradict what I know and have been taught from my studies at my university. Interpretations of course differ.
I know Anon is trying to make le funny greentext joke, but the Egyptians didn't believe Ra was the god of the sun, they believed Ra literally was the sun聽
I think this is the case for most religions and mythologies. A lot of solar deities' names are also the literal word for "sun" in their respective language and some examples include the Greek god Helios, the Roman god Sol, the Norse goddess Sunna, the Babylonian god Shamash, the Hindu god Surya, etc.
when helium was discovered by analyzing the spectral data from the sun it was named after Helios, both the ancient Greek name for sun and the respective titan god.
That's how it worked in ancient times in ancient near East and some mediterranean cultures, For eg Yahweh to the canaanites literally meant "he who he is".
And also other deities mentioned in biblical and extrabiblical texts like Shamash/Shams meaning Sun for the mesopotamians and Dagan(dagon) meaning grain or fertility, but Israelites understood it to mean dag the hebrew word for fish hence the merman thing.
I forget if it was Loose Change or one of the following documentaries, but I was watching when it came out and was getting sucked in by it till it got the point of Ra = Sun of God part and realized it was drivel made by an edgelord. Dodged a bullet on that one
thegoodcrumpets@reddit
"God of the" thinking needs to die. School failed miserably to teach how polytheism actually worked. The next time I see "God of thunder" I'll need to bite my knuckles
Manuel-Breathing@reddit
it's a simplification because it's a lot easier to say "selene was the god of the moon" than it is to say "selene was the personification of the moon, silver and magic, and had ties to the Underworld, the Hunt and alchemy"
Gonedric@reddit
So Thunder God, Sun God, etc. is more in line with the correct way of thinking at the time or what are you referring to, genuine question?
The_Big_Crouton@reddit
I think they鈥檙e referring to the fact that previous polytheistic religions used Gods as placeholders for forces of nature and didn鈥檛 see them as just floating people in the sky that ruled things. The God themselves WERE each of the elements of existence manifested.
Gonedric@reddit
Did they? Then what about Thunder God Zeus fucking everything and getting everything and everyone pregnant? 馃槀
The_Big_Crouton@reddit
They stepped into a more human form mostly when lessons in morality were taught. They need to become relatable if the goal with the stories is to shape the morality of your population.
But yeah. Poseidon IS the Ocean, Hades IS the underworld, etc. They have the thing they are themselves, and then a vessel body of sorts for the sake of moral lessons.
Ok_Being4209@reddit
It's more varied than this. Not everyone who was part of a society with a dominant polytheistic pov thought the same things, at any point in history.
I.e. The idea of "odin" at all, is completely modern; even amongst Norse and Germanic societies there were probably 100s of variations of him, with some being more human and some being more vague.
Norse specifically tended towards the relatability of more personified "human" gods who were associated with other aspects. Semi related but it's also it's not confirmed in what way Thor was ever associated with lightning. Iirc the idea comes from literally one sentence; a description of him opening a door and getting ready to fuck someone up, and there's thunder and lightning in the background. There's no other mention of his role as a "thunder god" anywhere else, overtime or not.
If anything, Odin was commonly a patron of sailors, and he was sometimes thought to be able to calm storms at sea, which is more of a direct association than Thor has.
SeamanTheSailor@reddit
What about Aphrodite coming out the clam? Was it just a really beautiful clam? Were they steamed? Steamed clams
The_Big_Crouton@reddit
What about aurora borealis?
Plental-Dan@reddit
Aurora? The Greeks called her Eos
TheIronzombie39@reddit (OP)
They believed the gods were said forces personified. In this sense they were neither good nor evil but just were. Poseidon is the sea and at times the sea can be both beneficial and destructive to us, but none of this good or evil it just is.
abelian424@reddit
What about genius loci then? You're saying it's basically just the 'vibes' of the place?
FrozenAquarius@reddit
So yeah in Greek mythology there are gods and goddesses that represent phenomenons and concepts, like sleep/Hypnos, death/Thanatos, and the west wind/Zephyros. The main Olympian gods, on the other hand, like Zeus, Poseidon, and Hades were given their divine authority by their father, Kronos. They weren't born ruling any particular part of nature.
thegoodcrumpets@reddit
In polytheistic religions the gods usually have a whole spectrum of things attached to them, they are literally aspects of humanity itself. Look at Thor, whole would basically be the god of all the chaotic aspects of masculinity. A mirror through which we can examine ourselves and understand ourselves, all of us have Thor living inside us and by understanding what went good/bad for him when he basically just follows instinct and goes hard on everything, we can learn about ourselves and life. Bro also produces lightning as a side effect when he smacks shit and is suddenly reduced from major reflection of our deepest male instincts to "HURR DURR GOD OF THUNDER".
It's like this with "all" (I am no deep expert so take ALL with a grain of salt) polytheism. The gods are aspects of ourselves. Dionysos is not to be literally taken as a lazy drunk asshole, you can view your own hedonistic sides through him. Through Freya you can explore unfettered vanity, etc etc etc.
Gullfaxi09@reddit
脼贸rr is not the "chaotic aspects of masculinity". I think he's moreso supposed to be understood as representing all the ideal characteristics a Norse man should posess according to the norms of that time. He's a protector, he's goes out and righteously destroys evil, bad creatures. He's a force for good in Norse cosmology, holding evil J谦tnar at bay and devoting himelf to protecting humanity and their world. 脼贸rr is not some force living inside us. In my view, the sources point to 脼贸rr being a literal, godly person Norsemen truly believed rode the skies on his chariot, and an example to strive for as a man back then.
I am most well read in Norse myth, so I can't speak for the others, but in Norse myth, I really don't think the gods are aspects of ourselves. They are living, breathing, very human-like personalities who affect the world in complex ways, while they mirror humans at the same time. And while they are flawed and full of very human feelings and emotions, they often stand as examples to follow, a prime example being the Ragna R酶k myth, where, in spite of knowing that they will die and nothing can be done about it because such is their fate, they still want to go down swinging, thereby representing very important ideals for the norms and culture at that time.
It's also a common misconception that 脼贸rr produces lightning in that way. There exists literally one attestation where 脼贸rr directly is associated with lightning, that being when he arrives to duel Hrungnir. Other than that, he just hits things real hard with his hammer. Yes, he likely was associated with thunder and lightning, his name suggests as much. But in what ways that would come to light and how Norsemen imagined it, that is impossible to really firmly say. Personally, I've always been fond of the thought that it's his chariot that produces thunder and lightning when it rolls across the skies. The Celts had a corresponding god that created thunder and lightning in such a way, to my understanding, and the Celts and Germanics were neighbouring cultures and closely related in certain aspects. But again, no one really knows.
There's also nothing to suggest that Freyja has anything to do with vanity. She has different 'sins', if you want to call them that.
Btw, I hope I don't come across as condescending, that is not my intention. I just feel that your statements here contradict what I know and have been taught from my studies at my university. Interpretations of course differ.
NoCard1571@reddit
I know Anon is trying to make le funny greentext joke, but the Egyptians didn't believe Ra was the god of the sun, they believed Ra literally was the sun聽
TheIronzombie39@reddit (OP)
I think this is the case for most religions and mythologies. A lot of solar deities' names are also the literal word for "sun" in their respective language and some examples include the Greek god Helios, the Roman god Sol, the Norse goddess Sunna, the Babylonian god Shamash, the Hindu god Surya, etc.
HubrisOfApollo@reddit
when helium was discovered by analyzing the spectral data from the sun it was named after Helios, both the ancient Greek name for sun and the respective titan god.
KrustyDaBeastTv@reddit
If im not wrong Sol is norse
TheIronzombie39@reddit (OP)
I鈥檓 referring to this Sol.
6crem@reddit
We have been doing the same personifying an unanimated object since ancient times and writing our own earth-chan sun-daddy fan-fics.
haywire@reddit
They believed the sun was the sun? Genius.
WoolooOfWallStreet@reddit
Basically like Helios or Sol
DarkScorpion48@reddit
No way bro, we all know only anime does anthropomorphism. Are you telling me the ancient Egyptians were weebs?
baz4k6z@reddit
Bro there have been weebs all across history. For sure ancient Egyptians made gooning materials in their papyrus stuff.
An_Draoidh_Uaine@reddit
Mean_Marketing9458@reddit
That's how it worked in ancient times in ancient near East and some mediterranean cultures, For eg Yahweh to the canaanites literally meant "he who he is".
And also other deities mentioned in biblical and extrabiblical texts like Shamash/Shams meaning Sun for the mesopotamians and Dagan(dagon) meaning grain or fertility, but Israelites understood it to mean dag the hebrew word for fish hence the merman thing.
FloZone@reddit
Thor means thunder, Zeus is just god, Jupiter is god-father. Most is shallow naming and sometimes there is confusion like Cronos/Chronos.聽
AestheticMirror@reddit
They thought he was the sun
The_Shittiest_Meme@reddit
this was very common
Current_Database_728@reddit
Less god of the sun and more personification of the sun聽
Thomas_TheDank@reddit
https://i.redd.it/tgotiu2wra3h1.gif
internetlad@reddit
. . . What
b400k513@reddit
The solar flares will persist until morale improves.
lewd-boy-o@reddit
"Ancient Egyptians"
Name literally means ancient egyptians
Who writes this shit?
thr33beggars@reddit
Well they did name Egypt after the Egyptians.
P_mp_n@reddit
Ancient Egyptians called their land Khemet
thr33beggars@reddit
Not according to the ancient Egyptians I鈥檝e talked to
P_mp_n@reddit
Damn dook, u beggars is old
Out you travel with Mr. Peabody
my-27th-account@reddit
Blud said the joke again 馃拃
Sad-Guarantee-4678@reddit
Op is the god of the idiot
Pintsocream@reddit
Most gods are derived from the sun
Elddif_Dog@reddit
Is God, name literally means God in English. Who writes this shit.
Wankainu@reddit
Pagans
XxCotHGxX@reddit
They thought the sun WAS the god. They didn't name their god after the sun.
Significant_Lab4263@reddit
Low quality Hideo Kojima is thinking
mcwopper@reddit
I forget if it was Loose Change or one of the following documentaries, but I was watching when it came out and was getting sucked in by it till it got the point of Ra = Sun of God part and realized it was drivel made by an edgelord. Dodged a bullet on that one
scoutpred@reddit
writes?
OP IS A TROGLODYTE, ANCIENT EGYPTIANS DRAW.
mrhaluko23@reddit
It's almost as if they're personified forces of nature and not literally meant to be people smh.
MathematicianNew2770@reddit
OP, Sun named the Sun after himself because he is the god of the Sun.
It's like you making your dog after yourself and your neighbour complaining about it.