Reporting a potential violation
Posted by Bitter_Reality7510@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 86 comments
Throw away account.
I’m trying to figure out the best course of action here. I’ve found a few pictures of a pilot I know, taken by passengers, showing the pilot operating a CJ1 without a qualified SIC. I looked the pilot up on the airman registry and saw that they are typed in the airplane but there is an “SIC required“ limitation. On 2 occasions so far, I have seen photos posted by his passengers on social media with them occupying the right seat of the airplane. I know both people and looked them up as well and saw that one was a pilot but held no SIC privileges and the other holds no FAA issued certs at all.
Additionally, I suspect the pilot to be operating illegal charter flights (134.5). I used to work with them and during conversations, they mentioned conducting such activities.
What is the best way to report this and remain anonymous? The pilot is the type to retaliate by making false claims to the FAA in order to endanger my certificates.
Or should I hold off on reporting and directly speak to the pilot and the passenger? (for context, I used to fly an airplane owned by the primary pax but moved on).
HuntSpecific7670@reddit
I’m pretty sure you can report and remain anonymous. He’s playing with people’s lives and shouldn’t be allowed to fly. A lot of people die around the world all because someone is breaking rules. What he’s doing is extremely unsafe. On the off chance he throws false accusations, sue his ass
Murky-Resident-3082@reddit
You can write the fsdo a letter and they have to investigate, however this won’t be anonymous, after 30 days whoever you reported can FOI request the documents that led up to this and they will redact nothing so you will be known
TuckNT340@reddit
134.5 is referring to a single company owning and operating an airplane for the “owners”. When purchased this way to separate liability generally. When said company only exists to operate the airplane, and does not have a legitimate business use for the aircraft - the FAA considers them to be an operator. Often this comes down to the differences in how the IRS and FAA see business structures. While technically illegal- unless they are actively booking flights and taking payment from non company people- the FAA really tends to not bother with these cases honestly. It’s only when there are additional issues which are already being investigated do they seem to take action.
The online pilot database is notoriously unreliable, and can take a long time to update.
I’d make sure that what was happening was legit before reporting. If you report anonymously- and the only evidence resides in a place that the FAA cannot access (ie a private FB) nothing will come of it beyond a phone call. If they require evidence- you may not be able to stay anonymous. If the pilot had action against them and challenged it, they would generally be given the opportunity to impeach the source of said evidence.
It’s early, apologies for
Typos. Hopefully it’s clear enough.
Op- report it if you’re relatively certain that it’s a problem, but, if you’ve gone digging looking for a problem as retaliation - there’s still a pretty solid chance this ends up involving you as a named party if there’s any legal action, or not going anywhere. If you’re digging because there’s “beef” said pilot will know it was you regardless.
k12pcb@reddit
This is how Greg Biffle died
Bitter_Reality7510@reddit (OP)
That's exactly what I thought. The parallels are uncanny.
Flaky-Associate-6273@reddit
Side note, not to say this shouldn't be reported, but airmen records is generally some period of time behind in processing certificate info. https://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification
GliderWizard@reddit
The FSDO would have access to more up to date information.
Rainebowraine123@reddit
Sounds like this has been over long enough of a period that it should have updated by now.
The_5star_Golden_God@reddit
Yep, this is definitely a situation that could lead to more people getting killed for something so preventable.
RaiseTheDed@reddit
FAA Hotline. You can stay anonymous. It's an online form as well
Top-Intern4073@reddit
Years ago, I used the Hotline. The FAA took action but allowed the violators to hear the recording. Fortunately, they didn’t recognize my voice. 🙄
TobyADev@reddit
They probably should allow that tbh… hearing all evidence and all that…
Use an online form next time to stay anonymous surely
42ElectricSundaes@reddit
Use funny voice. Check
EagleCatchingFish@reddit
" 'Ello Govnah I've a bi' of an infraction to report, I 'ave."
Recent-Day3062@reddit
Mary Poppins!
davenuk@reddit
I'm available for voice work.
Me ol' China
Ok-Distance-426@reddit
Me specialty's an Englishman.
KarmaTheBrit@reddit
Please don’t, they’ll end up thinking it’s me lmao 🤣
cfijay@reddit
I say son they up to no good so ima call in the Dag burn law out here an let them handle it
Murphysburger@reddit
I guess you could use an A l voice.
Ok-Tale-5112@reddit
Use AI to create a voice
davisre114@reddit
The faa hotline can be done online now, anonymously if you so choose
b_vitamin@reddit
Send in a spectrogram. They’ll never be able to decode it.
RaiseTheDed@reddit
Damn. I used to to report a flight school using an out of current FTD and charging an arm and a leg for it. Used the online form though
MehCFI@reddit
Sounds like plenty worth reporting imo, but worth saying that just cause you didn’t see SIC privileges for the right seat passenger/pilot online doesn’t mean they don’t have a 61.55 SIC that just hasn’t been added to their cert at a FSDO.
adventuresofh@reddit
FSDOs often won’t even add it anymore. Seattle outright refuses, Portland is ok about it (and are a lot easier to work with than many FSDOs)
We use a local DPE for all of our SIC sign offs now because it was getting to be too much of a hassle to deal with the FSDOs in general.
Lazypilot306@reddit
Seattle FSDO often doesn’t answer the phone or return calls.
adventuresofh@reddit
We always email - they seem slightly more responsive that way.
Equivalent-Pop-750@reddit
If you want to be anonymous file a FAA Hotline Complaint. I would encourage you to provide your name. Hotline complaints are received in Washington,DC and assigned to the appropriate FSDO. If you provide your name the assigned inspector will be able to build a solid case. Your name and contact information is forbidden to be included in any report. Please file a Hotline Complaint and DM me if you have any questions.
m4a785m@reddit
Even if you do it "anonymously" be prepared for them to know it was you that reported it
BooTsMaLoNe98@reddit
Depending on how far op wants to go, you could easily download a phone call voice modifier on your phone. Obviously nothing crazy like a SpongeBob voice, but a disguise 🤷
Guysmiley777@reddit
Time to break out my best version of Sir Bedevere from Monty Python.
goatrider@reddit
This new learning amazes me! Explain again how sheep's bladders may be employed to prevent earthquakes.
RaiseTheDed@reddit
You can submit hotline reports online. You can keep it public, anonymous, or completely redacted (I can't remember the terms but one the inspector can call you for more info, the other they can't. Or something like that)
Occams_ElectricRazor@reddit
There are plenty of ways to make it anonymous now.
Ok-Distance-426@reddit
There is a confidential/anonymous form that will accomplish this. Retaliatory claims are not followed up because that would discourage reporting. You could also contact the FSDO or use the ASRS reporting system. This pilot displays arrogance which is a safety violation. Report him immediately.
Or, you can forward the information to someone who will be unaffected if they report this pilot's dangerous actions. Another option is to take the individual aside with another trusted individual as a witness, and let him know that they have used up all of their leeway and they will be reported on their next unauthorised flight. Let the pilot know that if he tries to retaliate, an attorney is involved who will take action if he does not correct his errors or tries retaliation. Let him know there exists incontrovertable evidense of his actions.
What you describe is serious, and needs to be addressed immediately, or people will die. Anti-authority arrogance is particulalrly toxic, and perhaps he has difficulty consigning other pilots to fly with him.
adventuresofh@reddit
You can anonymously report it through the FAA hotline. If you know the one passenger who is a pilot well, you can talk to them, and there are casual ways to ask. “Hey, I saw you you’ve been flying with so and so, when did you get your SIC?” You can also talk to the pilot directly - but if they’re the type to retaliate, that may not be wise.
There’s also a couple of things to consider.
The FAA takes ages to update anything, this pilot could well have the single pilot type rating and it just hasn’t updated. I’ve been waiting for almost 6 months for the new registration for my airplane 🙄 and still don’t have it in hand or an update on the online registry.
You don’t have to have SIC listed on your certificate in the US. You can fly on a logbook endorsement under 61.55.
If the passenger has gotten an SIC endorsement under 61.55, they may be in the process of getting it added to their certificate and it just doesn’t show up yet. You used to be able to do this through an appointment at your local FSDO, but some offices (like Seattle) have said it is now policy to not take appointments for this and that you have to go through a DPE. If you can’t find a DPE willing to process it for you, then you’re out of luck until you can either get a FSDO appointment or find a DPE.
If you’re seriously worried about retaliation, your best bet is to document things as best you can and report and report anonymously.
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
Make sure you have your facts straight first. Did the SIC get out of the seat to take the photo? Are you positive the SIC isn’t qualified? If I were you, I’d speak to the pilot first. Reading the comments, it seems they’d find out it was you either way. Don’t be confrontational, don’t escalate if things get heated. You are acting out of his and everyone on that planes best interest. Hold onto that when you talk to them. Good luck.
Mobe-E-Duck@reddit
This is terrible advice. Of course get the facts as straight as possible, but talk to the pilot first? Then what when someone does report the guy? He’ll assume it was Op and Op will suffer the consequences this post is meant to avoid.
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
If this situation is truly against the regs, he can’t be retaliated against, that’s a whole other legal situation. If he’s going to report a safety issue, he should feel safe enough to stick by it with his name. He should go into this expecting his name will be found anyway and deal with whatever social consequences there might be.
Mobe-E-Duck@reddit
Irrelevant of legality the retaliation can (and according to Op would) occur and have consequences that would be difficult or impossible to mitigate.
Your advice ignores his concerns.
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
So I tell OP yeah there’s this way to report anonymously. Totally confidential. In reality, there are absolutely ways this person can and might find out. He’s already in a vulnerable position just posting this on Reddit. He goes and tells one of his buddies who he thinks he can trust. Well that guy goes and tells someone else & so on. Retaliation is on the table one way or another. Which way do you handle it? I’d go talk to the pilot. Express concern for the pilot and his pax. Get my facts straight before pursuing action.
Mobe-E-Duck@reddit
See above
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
His concerns are more abstract than what is written.
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
If you’ve read the other comments, he’s likely going to get found out anyway.
LonelyExpression4973@reddit
I guess you were the type to tell the teacher when someone did something naughty at school?
grain_farmer@reddit
Every time I see a post about safety concerns there’s always one or two people posting crap like this.
Flimsy-Ad-858@reddit
He deleted it, was it a boomer doing the "back in my day" dance or something?
grain_farmer@reddit
It was a comment to the effect of “I bet you used to snitch if the teacher forgot to assign homework”
k12pcb@reddit
I think we found a non pilot
pattern_altitude@reddit
Or someone who should be
LonelyExpression4973@reddit
Or a maybe a non American 🤪 either way a lesser being.
k12pcb@reddit
I’m not American
Mammoth_Impress_3108@reddit
If being naughty at school risked other people's lives, then I probably would tattle on them too
capt_Obvious2u@reddit
I would start with a discussion with the pilot themselves, personally.
Such conversation could start with, “Hey dude, I’m concerned about something that you might be exposing yourself (and in a very related way me) to.
Figure if something goes wrong you yourself could be getting a phone call from investigators as a prior employee. So to be sure you ABSOLUTELY have a stake in this, the typical, “Mind your own business.” Rebuttal just doesn’t hold water here. It is your business.
I would pitch it as looking out for him on a personal level though, his money, his livelihood and his pax safety.
I’m the type, that I would flat out ask. “Hey bro, are you legal and upright with this? All your paperwork is squared away?” I’m not going to assume you want to engage in such a high pressure potentially combative conversation.
Direct communication with those involved and those responsible is key to validating the situation. I would caution you against going to the pax and asking them. Go to the ringleader, go to the one that the general public is going to putting their trust in.
We as pilots ought to be perfectly fine with anyone coming to us and asking about qualifications. You better be ready to give an answer, and be okay with being put under some scrutiny.
If you’re in the wrong, stop and get in the right. It’s just not worth it.
davisre114@reddit
You can file an faa hotline report online. You can post pictures, videos, everything. No need for certified letters or a phone call. Can be completely anonymous if you choose. Just know that if you dont use the anonymous option the person can FOIA and find out who filed it. The only problem with anonymous is that that FAA cant see who filed it either.
Ban_DeezNts@reddit
Send a certified letter anonymously to the Chief of the FSDO in your area.
dodexahedron@reddit
You can send certified anonymously?
TIL.
Ban_DeezNts@reddit
In the return address space, just repeat the address you’re sending to.
RhinoGuy13@reddit
You don't even have to pay for the stamp if you do this.
dodexahedron@reddit
Huh. I didn't think they'd let you do that. 🤷♂️
Never tried, though. It's important enough to me at the moment that I'll trust you, bro.
Interesting, nonetheless.
Ban_DeezNts@reddit
I’ve done it, but I’m in Alaska. We’re 50 years behind on everything.
dodexahedron@reddit
I guess since you get a tracking number, the return address is obsolete for certified anyway, actually thinking about it.
Before that was a thing, it would have been kind of pointless without a legit return address.
acceleratedpilot@reddit
Your pictures are not evidence and could have easily been taken by the sic, who got up to oet the passenger sit for photo. People like to brag, and this person could have been doing so when you thought you overheard an infraction.
Worldly-Asparagus-20@reddit
Don’t be a snitch
minfremi@reddit
Re: the supposed SIC. There is no requirement that the SIC Type be printed on the pilot’s certificate (posted on Airmen Registry). He may have a simple endorsement that states he has been trained in the aircraft type to act as SIC, and he hasn’t gone to an evaluator yet to get it printed on the cert. If he did get it validated recently, then there is a chance the registry has not been updated (it’ll take about a month).
If you know the SIC well, ask him about the SIC type/endorsement. I’m somewhat of a rating collector, so I’d probably know what to ask without mentioning the PIC and giving suspicion. Maybe.
LymePilot@reddit
I get the CJ1 is tiny, but did the photo show cockpit to cabin? Are you 100% sure there isn’t another pilot in the back allowing the passenger to occupy seat for a photo in cruise?
Red_roka@reddit
This would be best reported to the FAA hotline or directly to a FSDO. You can remain anonymous or confidential with the hotline. If you choose anonymous there is absolutely no information passed on for the investigator to reach out to you so I’d encourage you to be as detailed as possible because that’s all the investigator will be able to go off of. You can email your FSDO office email from a burner email with a fake name as well. Either way, if there are any findings they’re not going to release your info to them just as they won’t let you know what action was taken against the violator.
GayNgsFromOuterSpace@reddit
Why you sticking your nose in business that dosnt concern you? Snitches get stitches btw. I'd watch your back if you report it
Lucky_Lawfulness903@reddit
Part 91 you just need three landings and a sign off.
jaylw314@reddit
Not about how to report it, but if you know the passengers involved, you can be damned sure one of them has posted those photos on Facebook. If you report the link to those photos as evidence, that makes it less obvious once he is aware of the report as to who it may have come from
DatabaseOutrageous54@reddit
Report it using your own name since you seem so sure of your accusation, that's only fair. If you can't do that, then forget about it and drop it.
Chemical-Pressure-24@reddit
Agree with this.
Any-Worldliness-679@reddit
Utterly stupid take. OP could be 100% correct, actual lives could be saved, and the person in question could retaliate against them. Somehow, to you, retaliation would be deserved? That's the only way your argument makes sense.
I don't know how long you've been in aviation, but unlike most other areas of the world, when people fuck around, there ARE often dire consequences. I've personally known SEVERAL in my career that died and took innocent people with them.
So fuck your silly "man up" test; if they ARE (we don't know, of course, and if they aren't it's no foul) fucking around, they 1000% deserve to be shut down.
DatabaseOutrageous54@reddit
We are talking about integrity, if I know something that is important enough to report I am going to put my name on it.
If I find that it's that important to me, I will state that in an official report and not hide behind anonymity because I am afraid of possible retaliation.
Honesty is part of integrity and I have seen too many pilots get reported because someone didn't like them.
They thought that they would try and interfere with someone's flight career because of that and hide to watch the fireworks.
Mike93747743@reddit
Actually. The down voters here are full of shit. If you are a professional and suspect an issue, put your name on it.
KudzuAU@reddit
With seniority comes invincibility, no?
SavingsPirate4495@reddit
Ask this person straight up…..”Hey…how is it that you’re flying this airplane legally if it requires someone in the right seat to have SIC training and there’s not a qualified person with you? Did you get a single pilot waiver or something?”
If they are flying illegally, then you need to STRONGLY encourage them to cut that sh*t out. Yesterday!
flyingforfun3@reddit
Okay so you report and action is taken. It could save lives.
You report, and turns out that he has the single pilot type but it wasn’t updated on the airmen inquiry? Nothing happens and all good.
DCSafeCurrent@reddit
You sure it’s a 525? SIC required is extremely rare in a 525 and often seen in types that require SPE.
flyingforfun3@reddit
I have the type. If you are single pilot it’s C525S If not it’s C525 and probably an annotation about an SIC. I also have a King Air 350 single pilot type. BE300 without annotation.
rdrcrmatt@reddit
Report this. 100%.
There is a reason why we have the rigor we have. Respect the rules, and someone putting public safety in jeopardy in their shenanigans needs to be fried.
CheesecakeOver6207@reddit
Hold up. Before you go down this road. The CJ1 is a single pilot jet. You do not need a SIC on that plane. It’s perfectly legal to have a single pilot fly and have a passenger sitting right seat in a CJ1.
brantmacga@reddit
You have to be type-rated for single pilot and OP said their cert shows SIC required. So they cannot fly single pilot. Also cannot have passengers in the cockpit if chartering and op says they are conducting illegal charters.
Shit-Pilot@reddit
It’s a small world, do what you want but expect people to figure out it was you that went to the FAA.
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Throw away account.
I’m trying to figure out the best course of action here. I’ve found a few pictures of a pilot I know, taken by passengers, showing the pilot operating a CJ1 without a qualified SIC. I looked the pilot up on the airman registry and saw that they are typed in the airplane but there is an “SIC required“ limitation. On 2 occasions so far, I have seen photos posted by his passengers on social media with them occupying the right seat of the airplane. I know both people and looked them up as well and saw that one was a pilot but held no SIC privileges and the other holds no FAA issued certs at all.
Additionally, I suspect the pilot to be operating illegal charter flights (134.5). I used to work with them and during conversations, they mentioned conducting such activities.
What is the best way to report this and remain anonymous? The pilot is the type to retaliate by making false claims to the FAA in order to endanger my certificates.
Or should I hold off on reporting and directly speak to the pilot and the passenger? (for context, I used to fly an airplane owned by the primary pax but moved on).
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