Most modern military aircraft that can be maintained in a private collection?
Posted by Blue_Etalon@reddit | aviation | View on Reddit | 20 comments
Hope this fits the sub. There are lot's of old warbirds out there flying. P-51s, B-29's, F-86s, F-104s etc. At what point do you think it becomes impossible for private individuals, or even large warbird associations to restore and maintain more modern aircraft?
F-4s were built in the thousands and there's a world wide supply system most likely still in place for them. The A-10 is a maybe, because it's such a dead simple aircraft at its heart. Maybe even F-16s, if only because so many of them are out there and there are lot's of parts available.
Note: I realize that some aircraft like the A-10, F-4, and F-16 may be in the too hard pile for private ownership because even though they are old, they are still of high military value for many nations.
discreetjoe2@reddit
If you have enough money there’s no limit. Draken International has over 150 former military aircraft. They were in the process of buying a couple dozen F-16s from Europe but they all got sent to Ukraine.
Kardinal@reddit
There are still limits, even with enough money. The companies that ownband operate fourth gen fighters right now do so by virtue of being government contractors, they could not do so without that connection.
discreetjoe2@reddit
Yeah, and how do they get those connections… With money.
Kardinal@reddit
If you have no experience or knowledge of the matter it is okay to not say anything.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
Phantoms are out there. The starfighters are supposedly buying a dozen from Korea. Collins has one.
Look at isaacmans collection for what is possible. Multiple mig29s and a tornado. F16s and f18s are possible as well.
CrapMaster32@reddit
There’s a private F-15 out there too iirc
Kardinal@reddit
Only as a static display. Not a flying unit.
dscottj@reddit
Also important to keep in mind that the only ones you'll see flying are ones we sold to other countries. Due to various laws and regulations, it's effectively impossible to acquire a flight-worthy aircraft from the USN or USAF. So flyable F-16s, or F-18s? No problem! Flyable A-10s, or (it boggles the mind) B-52s? It will never happen.
Well, it'll never happen without an act of Congress. C.f. The Maverick Act.
ChevTecGroup@reddit
The phantom was sold directly from the US to Collings foundation through an act of congress
Kardinal@reddit
Many of the "private" Vipers and Hornets are actually only owned by and through military contracts, not as private "I can just fly it when I feel like it because it's my property" situations.
Top Aces owns some F-16s but is the only one. Draken tried to get some from the Dutch in 2023 but it fell through. No other private Vipers are known.
Air USA owns some F-18s but it is the only one.
Both companies are basically only able to own them because they are government contractors. An individual who wanted to buy them would be unable to do so.
Hamsternoir@reddit
First generation Harriers have been in private collections for a while, Art Nalls flew a FA.2 and there's a few groups looking at getting more airworthy, either another SHar or a T.4/T.4N depending on who you talk to.
Blue_Etalon@reddit (OP)
Oh boy, I’d rather learn to fly in a wing suit
thecanadiandriver101@reddit
A10 is far far far from dead simple. All the modules will be a nightmare to service without USAF support.
DevelopmentFar9463@reddit
Private flying b29 are not that numerous afaik. Even advanced ww2 planes are hard to maintain with reasonable costs.
TaskForceCausality@reddit
The polished F-100F Super Sabre formerly located in Texas is a good case study. As I understand it, the owner and his posse of maintainers simply got too old to safely work on it. That matters when most service actions start with “remove the back half of the airplane”.
Unlike WWII stuff that was produced by the thousands, most Cold War aircraft require specific and precise maintenance protocols to operate. Even if an individual could afford an F-4, F-100,F-104 or similar keeping these birds safely airworthy is an ongoing and expensive process. Even relatively simple warbirds like a MiG-17 need a literal crew of people.
Newer stuff is going to be even worse in this area, because higher tech also requires higher maintenance support. The F-16 uses a hydrazine activated APU which, to put it mildly, shouldn’t be messed with by amateurs.
An A-10 wouldn’t be inherently tough to maintain, but you’d need a lot of ballast to replace the 30mm gun- a heavy and integral part of the aircraft which will not be included on delivery to a civilian user. Further, Big Air Force has not treated their A-10s with the best care - a political topic for a different day- so I doubt many of them will even be structurally fit enough for civil use, assuming they’d be inclined to transfer one or two for airworthy museum use.
Finally, the cash and spare parts situation with these jets mean their airborne days tend to be limited. Few people and foundations can regularly afford $20k fuel bills , and (A-10 excluded) good luck getting an engine refurbished or a hard to find part replaced. There’s a reason why most privately owned jet fighters are part of aggressor and military charter fleets.
ScholarErrant@reddit
One thought I keep coming back to is as spotter planes. CalFire, for instance, might be able to retire its existing Broncos. Replace the cannon with thermal imaging equipment and other cameras plus ballast.
WTXRedRaider@reddit
My neighbor has 2 Hueys and a Cobra
bnzgfx@reddit
Be nice to your neighbor.
RCFLYER86@reddit
A lot of it does come down to government restrictions as well, the Collings Foundation F-4 had to go through a ton of hoops to get flying again back in the early 2000s. The airframes of these jets also have life limits for fatigue which may prevent something like an A-10 from being privately used in the future if the government doesn’t already cause problems with that.
WesternBlueRanger@reddit
Well, there are a number of F-16's that are privately owned; Top Aces, a Canadian outfit providing aggressor training to many Western air forces operates a fleet of used F-16's that they purchased from Israel.
https://topaces.com/our-fleet/lockheed-martin-f-16a