Private Pilot Glider to single engine

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jayreggy@reddit

Yep, that works! It’s hard to find motor gliders to rent but if you can afford one this is a great path. Also I’m sorry you’re instructor pushed you to getting a medical, he did you a big disservice

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YKRed@reddit

How was that a disservice? Student should know if they can hold a medical before spending a ton of money training.

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Yes but you do that through research not just going in and finding out. Once you've been denied a medical sport pilot is off the table for the rest of your life (unless you get a medical approved). They wanted to be a sport pilot and their CFI burned that option.

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graphical_molerat@reddit

Speaking as someone who flew gliders for sport for 20 years and only then got his PPL, there is the additional slight complication that real gliders do handle a bit differently than powered planes. And if you train on them, getting used to PPL planes will be a bit of a learning experience you should also plan some time to account for.

For starters, you fly them with the other hand (gliders you have the stick in your right hand, PPL in your left - but this is a minor issue). But in powered planes, you hardly use the rudder (and when you do, it's to counteract propeller torque), while it's absolutely essential to fly turns in a glider properly. So once you get used to proper copious coordinated rudder input in a glider, you will then have to mostly unlearn this to fly a Cessna. Same with that slight nose down nudge to fly nice turns in a glider (you need a bit more energy for the turn, so you instinctively nose them down a tiny bit before starting the turn - keep doing that in a Cessna, and it will drive your instructor crazy. Ask me how I know...). Landing a glider is quite different than landing a Cessna: the basic principle is of course the same, but even if you are good at getting gliders back on the ground, don't expect Cessnas to be a snap. And once you get used to the sort of bank angles you fly in gliders without even thinking twice about it (45 degrees or more in a tight thermal is totally normal), it takes a while to not absent-mindedly bank a Cessna like that as well. Unless you want the instructor to get all agitated, that is.

And generally, 20 hours from zero to glider flying is wishful thinking. Unless you are extremely talented, you need 10 to 15 to solo.

I used the term "real gliders" to differentiate proper sailplanes from "certificate gliders": things like a Scheibe Falke, which is basically a normal powered plane with slightly longer wings and dodgy landing characteristics. And paperwork that says it is a glider. If you train on one of these, you of course get a lot more PPL-relevant experience. But I have no idea how common these things are stateside.

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Mad_Rooster_7164@reddit

Are you on one antidepressant or multiple?

You should research this further.

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

On 2. Heard that polypharmacy is an issue. Already talked to a HIMS AME. Waiting fir the letter of requirement

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Mad_Rooster_7164@reddit

Yes, it’s a rule out on one page and on the other it just says “not currently on multiple”. Glad you’re talking with the HIMS to come up with a plan!

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Bunslow@reddit

That CFI fucked you imo (opinions vary)

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stewi2@reddit

I would recommend getting a glider rating in either case if you can afford the time commitment - makes you a better pilot :)

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s2soviet@reddit

Depends on your goals. If your goals is to go to an airline, and you’re tight on a budget, I’d save the money to put towards your PPL.

But if you just want to have fun and/or want to gain some skills, gliding is awesome. And no, you don’t need a medical to fly gliders.

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

I just want to be able to fly, when I want

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s2soviet@reddit

Go for it then. I personally love gliding!

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MNSoaring@reddit

Motor gliders, that are reliable, and not terrible to maintain or repair, are expensive. Pipistrel Sinus, for example, is an excellent choice with a rotax engine and the company is now owned by textron. But, be prepared to pay $100k

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ltcterry@reddit

CFi insisted that I go get my Medical first of all.

It's good advice to get a medical early, but should be tempered with the rest of the story. I tell people "if you have X... then be really careful about pursuing a medical." By leaving out critical bits and "insisting" your instructor did you no favors.

obtain it by 20 hrs flying and pretty lenient rules.

Just like Private ASEL is "officially" 40 hours but 70-75 in the real world, you are unlikely to get Private done in a glider in 20 hours. Plan on double that for reality. "Lenient rules" is an unsafe training expectation and a recipe for disaster.

A motor glider is going to be hard to find. You might want to look into one of the full time glider training places and push hard there. Get started in a traditional glider. Buy and add on motor glider when ready.

There's a place in north Georgia that has a motor glider in their fleet. Likewise Inverness, FL. There are undoubtedly others, but I am not aware of them.

Sorry you got misdirected on your medical. Hope you get it all worked out.

There are, by the way, about the same number of glider-only pilots in the US as Sport-only. Private includes Sport, but that's useless at the moment w/ your medical in limbo.

Good luck and fly safely!

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__joel_t@reddit

You can get a sport pilot certificate while this is pending! The sport pilot rules allow you to use your driver's license as your medical as long as your most recent application wasn't denied. As long as it remains deferred, you can go sport.

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SSMDive@reddit

14 CFR 61.23(c)(2)(ii) ‘Have been found eligible for the issuance of at least a third-class airman medical certificate at the time of his or her most recent application’

He was not found eligible.

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__joel_t@reddit

Yep, you're right, I was wrong.

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AviatorCrafty@reddit

I can’t remember if it was in a legal interpretation or F&Q, but deferral counts as denial for sport pilot purposes so he’s sadly locked out of it even now

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

Checked that, can't solo or check ride until it is cleared.

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SSMDive@reddit

1- Your CFI screwed you. I mentor a lot of people getting out of the military and that want to become pilots. One of the first things I do is send them the FAA medical application and have them read it. I don’t ask for them to answer to me, but I tell them if there is anything they are going to mark other than perfect history, then need to slow down and not apply for a medical yet. Many of them have been shot down by their military medical records for which they were getting disability pay.

2- Yes, you can fly gliders even with a deferred medical. Some in the field want to debate that, but the law as written allow you to self certify.

3- Yes you can get a self launch glider and actually have MORE permissions than a light sport pilot. Night flying for example. I knew a retired airline guy that lost his medical, he flew all over the US in a self launch glider. I’m trying to recall, I knew he flew at night and over 10k, but I think he flew IFR as well.

4- With no experience, it is highly unlikely you will get a Glider PPL in 20 hours.

5 Log all the hours. This I don’t think so. You will have a GLIDER with self launch endorsement. Not AIRPLANE SEL. The certification of the aircraft matters. I don’t believe someone with a PPL SEL can just hop into a motor glider that is certified as a glider without the needed certification.

But going from motor glider to SEL will be easy.

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AviatorCrafty@reddit

Strictly from the FAA perspective, yes you technically could fly gliders on a deferred medical since no medical is required for gliders and only self certification is needed. Then begins the whole debate held among glider pilots where if you even can self certify with a denied or deferred medical, my personal take on it is whatever you decide, be ok with the liability and risk involved.

Now for the training part. You mentioned you were in VA and I myself am also a CFI-G in VA, I’d check out to see if one of the four SSA clubs are nearest you and go visit during operations and perhaps a club member or instructor could take you up for a demo flight. SVS is the only glider club in Virginia that seems to have motorgliders available for members. The 20 hours you see for the Private Pilot - Glider rating are the absolute minimum and as an instructor I can tell you very few people get it in the at minimum, either from weather forcing training breaks or something happening outside of your control like instructor availability (most if not all CFI-Gs are volunteer unless you’re at a commercial operation). That’s all assuming that you join a club and learn in a “pure” glider launched via aerotow. I’m not sure what a “cheap” motorglider would be as most I see are $55K-$500K, unless you find an old Faulke in good condition. You’d have to find a CFI-G who is self launch endorsed to train you, but your best bet to find a CFI-G are at any SSA glider club. I’d ultimately recommend you try a few flights in a pure glider before trying to buy a motor one.

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

If I can find one, will you be willing to train?

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AviatorCrafty@reddit

Unfortunately I am not self launch endorsed yet, but it’s on my list of things to accomplish in the future!

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Glider__Guider@reddit

Do it! (Not a lawyer) Did something similar myself

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

Thanks for the info, Can you guide more? a.dramit78@gmail.com 540 553 2945 please

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Glider__Guider@reddit

I’d remove your contact info quickly.

It’s like you say, gliders don’t require a medical. They require you to be fit to fly. FAA may argue that if you were denied a medical then you aren’t fit to fly, but then the regs could/should say that like they do for sport pilot.

So get your glider license and fly, then do power add-on

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

Technically not denied, might clear it as well but the length of delay and procedures is killing

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Glider__Guider@reddit

Yes. My point is there is an argument to be made that you can’t. I’m not a lawyer. I decided that between my judgement and my doc’s, I was safe to fly gliders. Then dealt with FAA medical team…

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DriveMost1182@reddit (OP)

Did you end up getting your medical too, how long did it take?

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Glider__Guider@reddit

Yes, then went to basicmed as it kept getting screwed up for renewal. A year or two.

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rFlyingTower@reddit

This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:

I just started working to get a PPL, my plan was to get a sports pilot certificate first andwork towards the pilot after that. But my CFi insisted that I go get my Medical first of all. I got deferred because I am on anti depressants. Waiting on the FAA letter for additional info. I know I have to go through a HIMS AME and can take upto 18 months or more and a few extra grands. Now I can't even get a sports pilot license till this is resolved. Today I saw a motorized glider just exactly like a Cessna, similar engine and controls. I tried to search and found that I can work towards being a private glider pilot without a medical even if I am deferred and obtain it by 20 hrs flying and pretty lenient rules. And then when my Medical is resolved I can get the private plane single engine rating also log in all the hours in glider towards that. Is it right? or is there a catch? If someone can guide. I shall be buying some cheap motor glider to start if this is doable. I am in Virginia, any guidance welcome!!

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AutoModerator@reddit

Hi, I'm a bot and it looks like you're asking a question about medical issues: depressant.

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