Why are some trucking companies using 10-panel tests instead of 5-panel?
Posted by Forward-Concern403@reddit | Truckers | View on Reddit | 80 comments
I applied for a driving job this week, and during onboarding, they mentioned their pre-employment screening uses a 10-panel instead of the standard 5-panel. I always hear people talk about.
I never paid much attention to the difference before because every company seems to handle testing differently. It got me wondering how common the larger panels actually are in trucking nowadays.
Is the difference just “testing for more substances,” or are companies moving toward 10-panel setups because of insurance, safety departments, DOT requirements, and post accident policies? thanks
deezkeys098@reddit
The same old excuses “insurance”
DaSaw@reddit
Which just pushes out the real answer. Why does insurance want this? Presumably because it saves them money on claims, but then you have to ask: what claims are the ten panel tests preventing that five panel tests won't, and how?
DumatRising@reddit
Covers more drugs so there's less chance of someone addicted to those slipping in and getting high while driving. So it avoids DUI related claims which are always big hits.
Neither one covers everything but the first five are the most common and the extra 5 are getting more common.
Naborsx21@reddit
Ehhhhh insurance doesn't care. Most of the time when people say "insurance" they just don't want to hire you.
Source: I failed a drug test once, bought my own truck and went owner op. Insurance didn't give a flying fuck about my failed pre employment drug test for THC. I'd been told no 50000 times and worked for the Russians, Igor was my.beat friend and employer for a year or two. When I found out if I bought a truck and I surance would be no more expensive than another 27 year old dude with x years driving exp, I was shocked.
Maybe if you crash into a house and tested positive for meth I'm sure it's different. But idk, shrug I've been driving and working since the failed drug test and after getting my own insurance and seeing how it didn't affect things, a lot of people are just stuck in thinking in old ways.
DaSaw@reddit
Remember that most megas are handling their insurance in-house. They have damage, they don't face increased premiums. They eat the entire cost. So they can make whatever rules they want.
Naborsx21@reddit
Yeah that's fine. I mean the megas are fine, they are the hardest ones to work for. It really pisses me off when you get a small carrier. I'm an oo now because of well this shit, but I've had a small husband wife team that hauled frac sand in Texas tell me they would hire me if I gave them $5000 cash to hold onto just in case bc I surance was gunna rake them over the coals for a failed drug test. Lol.
I have my own insurance, they probably have similar coverage they're bullshit and lying.
I also want to add I don't really care if you say no or we just don't want to hire you I've been told no a thousand times. When people lie to you or try to make you feel bad about it or try to get.money out of you.its.a special kind of pain you feel.
DumatRising@reddit
To be fair THC doesn't increase your risk of a DUI claim since studies have/are showing it doesn't impair your driving after you use it enough. So from an insurance perspective there's no additional risk to factor into premiums.
Insurance is really a fancy algorithm that attempts to calculate what the average claim payout will be per insurance period will be and then charges the insured that amount plus a little extra for profit. With one THC test fail your risk change is non-existent, it's as risky for the insurance company to insure you as it is a completely clean driver since you're both as equally likely to get a DUI claim. But as you bring up slam into a building on something harder? Or fail a test with something that severely impacts driving/is more addictive? That's a huge change in risk assessment.
Naborsx21@reddit
Yeah I get that. I've just been told no and given nasty remarks for even applying to places because I've been told their insurance won't even touch me. If you ask who their insurance is and get a quote from them it's laughable.
I've had places tell me to give them $5000 cash to hold onto because they need it for the increased insurance prices. Lol
Bunch of liars.
PraiseTalos66012@reddit
5 panel test covers: THC, Amphetamines including methamphetamine and MDA/MDMA, cocaine, Opioids, and PCP
So it's actually a lot more than 5 drugs that get detected it's 5 categories of drugs.
The 10 panel does add some very important drugs such as: Benzodiazepines, Methadone, Methaqualone, Propoxyphene.
All of those drugs in the 10 panel are addictive and are commonly abused substances(to include methadone).
The Benzodiazepines are really the biggest spot that the 5 panel misses, that's an entire category of highly addicted and extremely commonly abused drugs.
scottiethegoonie@reddit
Always thought it was kind of wild that the 5 panel includes PCP but not benzos, or that alcohol is tested by breath but none of these other GABA drugs.
Milk_MAN1963@reddit
It's a excuse. I do the minimum and my insurance company has never asked me to to do anything more
DumatRising@reddit
It depends on your company, and what rates they give you. Also if your self insured or not. Self insured carriers have more ability to negotiate with themselves for better rates in return for lowering risk.
Vast_Ad9788@reddit
The 5-panel tests for the standard DOT required substances, but companies are switching to 10-panel because it catches more stuff their insurance companies care about.
Most of the bigger fleets are going this route now since it covers them better for liability purposes and helps weed out drivers who might be using things that aren't DOT tested but could still impair driving. The extra substances usually include things like benzos and barbiturates that the regular DOT panel misses.
bigmac22077@reddit
Fuck it psilocybin it is then.
Intelligent-Site7686@reddit
Most psychedelics don't show up on drug tests, same with kratom and the semi-synthetic derivatives. MDA/MDMA/5-mapb can show up as amphetamines, I think same goes for m-cathinone and all the newer ones in that family. Ketamine and dxm can show up as PCP.
You can be a truck driver nodding out on 7-OH and hitting the DMT vape and never have to worry about failing a drug test, but the fat dude who smoked weed three months ago can easily get blacklisted from trucking
bigmac22077@reddit
I really hope thc rules officially change by July with that new hearing. I’ll go get my medicinal card again and be worry free.
Upbeat-Interview8554@reddit
Extremely doubt it will affect trucking. Ever since the Biden admin talked about rescheduling the large trucking companies already made their stance clear. It might be a couple years until either weed is tested on and proven safe to drive with or there’s a rapid test that detects inebriation like alcohol
bigmac22077@reddit
Bro you can take opioids with a prescription when you’re not driving. Thc is no different. HHS has zero authority to test for schedule 3 drugs. Stop acting like weed is some tabu substance that’s worse than anything else we’re allowed to take.
Upbeat-Interview8554@reddit
Bro I’m with you 100% I love weed and hate that I had to quit for this job. But the system is rigged by our own body. Weed is fat soluble so it stays in your system way longer than any other drug. Opioids are out and undetectable in a day or two. I wish they would switch over to saliva testing since it’s a great equalizer. But until then weed users are pissing hot for weeks or months
Come to think of it saliva would be better since you can’t just substitute fake piss. They just have it out for us
bigmac22077@reddit
And once again. If you pissed hot for opioids and had a prescription, at least at my state employed job I would not get in trouble.
This is the way it’s going to move for marijuana
Naborsx21@reddit
I hope so. I broke my sternum and several vertebrae in my back in a car accident. Everything around my heart kinda was shattered and reconstructed. I liked weed as a teenager and lived in Colorado at the time so I was like fuck it I'll just try all sorts of CBD THC anything. I didn't like opiates , didn't like the way they made me feel, knew too many people that overdosed or got addicted I just didn't want to take them and saw / see weed as pretty harmless.
I waited a long time after taking it but not long enough and pissed hot on a pre employment drug test and went through SAP and everything.
Kinda nuts I could've taken tons of opiates and with a Drs note it's be okay, but if you explain that to some people they just view you as a druggie that should never be allowed near a semi truck again lol. But the opiates and taking 18 pills a day? That's fine a Dr signed off on it! Lol... No regrets though. I think opioids / opiates are really destructive.
slyguy929229@reddit
The popularity boost kratom got really pisses me off. After my injury I was given opioids I did not like them. Too low of a dose and I hurt constantly like a bad tooth ache. Too high and I felt inebriated. Kratom was like the sweet spot. No pain no intoxication. Now we got crackheads out here turning it into legal heroine or stuffing it into pills and taking 100 at a time.
Use it right make it into the nastiest most disgusting water and lead powder smoothie you’ve ever had. Drink it down gagging and retching the entire time. Struggling to keep it down so hard you start sweating. Won’t want to abuse it then even if you have an addictive personality lmfao. (Maybe they will tho pot heads don’t seem to mind coughing themselves half to death)
Intelligent-Site7686@reddit
I think kratom is kind of a miracle drug... an opiate that won't kill you. If I were counseling junkies I'd try to get them on to it instead of methadone, suboxone, etc and taper down on dosage. It's crazy that nowadays they're having kratom addicts in rehab go on suboxone
AgreeAndSubmit@reddit
They're currently legal in Detroit and Ann Arber Michigan. Everyone knows Colorado is. The Michigan places you can find on Google maps. And yes, mushrooms it is. I'll take 2 chocolate bars please.
DecadentEx@reddit
That doesn't matter; cannabis is completelylegal in half the U.S. If it isn't legal Federally they can fire you over it. So if a larger panel drug screen covers psilocybin (which some can) you'll be canned - though I think you won't get put in the Clearing House, as it wouldn't fall under DOT regulations.
Nervous_Nectarine683@reddit
To each their own,I don't want anyone driving one of our trucks that addicted to anything..Water, coffee, orange juice and similar non alcoholic beverages are fine..too much risk from nuclear verdicts in a lawsuit..
duckbobtarry@reddit
Just how it is though. Until its federally legal and regulated, drug tests popping positive for even medical Marijuana in a legal state and you're kicked off the road. Bullshit honestly.
scottiethegoonie@reddit
It's not addictive, nor is it recreational in the traditional sense. No reason for it to be tested for. Getting it's schedule dropped down on the Fed level. One of the few things Mango man is getting right.
luis474703@reddit
And even if they did text for psychedelics they are out your system in 1 day too 😂😂 so trip all you want 🤷♂️🍄🍄🍄👀
AgreeAndSubmit@reddit
The dot 5 panel tests for: THC cocaine Benzos Amphet and Pcp. I keep my drug copy as should any of you. False positives are real, and there is no rebuttal to your job loss.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/epic-drug-lab-scandal-results-more-20-000-convictions-dropped-n747891
https://www.bbc.com/bbcthree/article/bf2caf17-55e1-4708-87b6-e9cd3bf4321d
SadnessOutOfContext@reddit
Thought it was opiates, not benzos, but haven’t looked at it the list in awhile.
jaykfar84@reddit
You're right, it's opiates not benzos on the DOT 5-panel.
WHODUNNITT303@reddit
I had my case dropped off my record years later because of this dumb broad in Maas
AgreeAndSubmit@reddit
I wondered if I'd ever talk to someone affected by this story. I would love to hear your tale, every verb, adjective and iota.
lonistershunnel@reddit
Are companies upfront about using 10-panel during the application process, or do most drivers only find out when they show up for the test?
Nervous_Nectarine683@reddit
As an employer who pays commensurate for experience along with a healthcare package at no cost to you with additional family insurance charged separately it matters to have someone on board who does what they say and has integrity.. the 10 panel test is just one line item..I also hold myself to a high standard..
genocyde26008219@reddit
Just do what I do and make sure you piss EVRYWHERE when they call you in and blame your “nervous bladder” 😂
jaykfar84@reddit
The insurance thing is real, but people miss the bigger picture. Fleets started pushing beyond the 5-panel when fentanyl contamination became impossible to ignore.
Guys were testing clean on DOT panels but still showing impairment. A 10 or 12-panel catches benzos, barbiturates, and fentanyl that the standard panel completely misses. Been in logistics compliance for 11 years. The companies serious about safety aren't stopping at 10-panel either.
Some are running 12 and 13-panel cups now. Places like 12PanelNow supply these to fleets wholesale because demand from carriers has exploded post-pandemic
smacketkusltard5@reddit
My last carrier switched mid-contract and said straight up it was after a post-accident claim where the driver tested clean on the DOT panel but the toxicology report told a completely different story. Nobody talks about how big that gap actually is between what DOT requires and what's actually in someone's system.
polarjunkie@reddit
Because someone that would ask such a question shouldn't be on the road behind my wife and kids in a semi.
xdjfrick@reddit
Yes let's place some people who borrow a back pain pill to treat emergency gout on their day off , or hits a joint with their buddy on vacation in the same catagory as drivers who shoot meth every day. Standard drug testing has major flaws.
polarjunkie@reddit
Yes, let's. You know you are subject to random drug tests dictated by the federal government who also tracks the results and gives them to every potential employer Plus will make you go to rehab before you can drive again but you chose to borrow a pain pill or smoke a joint. That makes you a moron or demonstrates that you simply don't care.
Ok-Combination7287@reddit
How is weed worse than alcohol? I'll deal with a stoner that smokes a joint on vacation over a guy getting drunk on Friday night any day.
tyoung89@reddit
They’re both terrible to be on when driving, which is also why my companies have random breathalyzer tests too.
Ok-Combination7287@reddit
Agreed. I'm not advocating for driving anything while intoxicated. I'm pointing out that is acceptable to go get black out drunk and drive 24 hours later. But using a legal product (in a ton of places) that is far less harmful is not acceptable for 30 days in a drug test.
Also, drunks start fights and act like complete assholes regularly. Pot heads eat candy and play video games. I vastly prefer dealing with a pot head than a drunk.
Intelligent-Site7686@reddit
The DOT rules for alcohol are you can't consume alcohol within 4 hours of going on duty, and you have to blow zeroes when going on duty... so you can be blackout drunk and drive less than 24 hours afterwards depending on how fast you metabolize
PraiseTalos66012@reddit
The limit is 0.04% for on duty. But if you blow over 0.02% but under 0.04% you still get removed from duty for 24hr. You can however blow under 0.02% but over 0% and there wouldn't be consequences.
Realistically most companies won't enforce anything under 0.01% for the same reason dot allows 0.02%, at those levels you could have never had a drink and your life and still blow over 0.01% just because you are some fruit or other food/beverage that contains a tiny amount of alcohol recently.
polarjunkie@reddit
What did you read that made you respond how is weed worse than alcohol? When did I say was worse or it was even bad? I said you have to be a moron to know the consequences and decide to do it anyway.
PraiseTalos66012@reddit
A painkiller to treat emergency gout?
Uhhh that's not gonna do anything for gout....
Also as long as you go get prescribed the medication you'll be good, even if you first borrowed a pill from someone.
CaptCooterluvr@reddit
Someone who’s stupid enough to do either knowing full well they could be tested the next day and lose their livelihood doesn’t have the judgment skills to be in this business.
bigmac22077@reddit
You’re just a junkie, get off that high horse.
AgreeAndSubmit@reddit
Or put the phone down. Or use the blinkie stick.
Cardinal_350@reddit
"Why can't I take drugs and have a CDL?" Never worried about a drug test in my 25 year career. 5 or 100 panel
anxious_polarbear@reddit
A lot of the things a 10-panel tests for are drugs that are commonly prescribed by doctors, and are perfectly safe to drive on. Hell, I was a much safer driver taking my Ativan than without it.
PraiseTalos66012@reddit
That's fine.
You can take literally any and all prescribed medications.
Contrary to popular belief there is no such thing as a DOT/FMCSA banned medication list and none of the medications tested for are banned.
"But THC" The thing there is that you don't have a legitimate federally recognized prescription because it's schedule 1 so it cannot be legally prescribed.
And no the list of schedule 1 substances isn't "the banned list". Schedule 1 substances are not regulated or controlled by the DOT/FMCSA in any way shape or form and the DOT/FMCSA never say you cannot drive if you are being prescribed those medications. And that's for a good reason, it doesn't make sense since you literally cannot get a legitimate federally recognized prescription for a schedule 1 substance.
Randomfactoid42@reddit
You might want to ask what those extra panels are testing for. Especially if you take any prescription meds or certain supplements.
PraiseTalos66012@reddit
You can take literally any and all prescribed medications.
Contrary to popular belief there is no such thing as a DOT/FMCSA banned medication list and none of the medications tested for are banned.
"But THC" The thing there is that you don't have a legitimate federally recognized prescription because it's schedule 1 so it cannot be legally prescribed.
And no the list of schedule 1 substances isn't "the banned list". Schedule 1 substances are not regulated or controlled by the DOT/FMCSA in any way shape or form and the DOT/FMCSA never say you cannot drive if you are being prescribed those medications. And that's for a good reason, it doesn't make sense since you literally cannot get a legitimate federally recognized prescription for a schedule 1 substance.
polarjunkie@reddit
A positive with a legit prescription doesn't hurt you. They can do further testing and distinguish between supplements and other things. The point is to identify possible problems.
king_rootin_tootin@reddit
The problem is they treat different drugs differently
A man can nearly OD on cocaine and pass a piss test the next week, no problem. But it can take up to three months to pee clean for weed, and that hair test is a whole different story.
devilinblue22@reddit
He says while sipping a beer after a long day.
Cardinal_350@reddit
What part of this post involved alcohol haha? The difference between them is drugs are illegal and booze isn't
king_rootin_tootin@reddit
The part where he brought up drugs.
anxious_polarbear@reddit
You missed the point entirely.
Cardinal_350@reddit
No I didn't. I find it hilarious when you tell someone they can't smoke pot and the first thing they scream is "BUT BUT BUT BOOZE!!". 2 different things completely legally
devilinblue22@reddit
You are literally screaming the point, while not understanding at all, this is fascinating.
anxious_polarbear@reddit
Yes they are two different things legally (that is, if you completely ignore why weed was outlawed in the first place - note, it wasn't because it was deemed harmful, intoxicating, or addictive).
The point you missed is that they're not that different as far as effects. Having a joint after work and sleeping it off is really no different that having a few beers after work and sleeping it off. It's absolutely ridiculous that weed is illegal and booze isn't - again, especially if you know why weed was originally outlawed.
devilinblue22@reddit
I love the confidence man.
obsolete_broccoli@reddit
But you can! Psychedelics are usually metabolized too fast to be tested for, and/or prohibitively expensive (in the case for LSD)… and then you have DMT, which cannot even be tested for since your body makes it naturally anyways
:)
lol
DaSaw@reddit
Pretty sure they're more worried about (opiate) pills and meth and shit. And cannabis, given it's still federally illegal but people have gotten used to thinking of it as legal in a lot of places.
Unable_Strength_2712@reddit
My company has a sign that lets drivers know that its still illegal under federal law and since were federally regulated you actually can lose your job over it, they mention the thc-a delta 8 shit you can by at any convenience store here in texas too... crazy that people have to be reminded of it.
25_Unknown_Devices@reddit
Wooohoo!! I passed my 100 panel text!! Got 98/100!! Pro results right there baby. Full send
Forward-Concern403@reddit (OP)
Big up! That's encouraging ,,
curlyfat@reddit
Good job, buddy!
nicerakk@reddit
Per Google
No, companies cannot use a 10-panel drug test to satisfy the FMCSA pre-employment requirements. FMCSA regulations mandatorily require a specific 5-panel urine test covering marijuana, cocaine, amphetamines, opiates, and PCP. A 10-panel test includes extra substances and does not comply with federal regulations.
Key Points on FMCSA Drug Testing:Mandatory Panel: DOT/FMCSA tests are 5-panel, defined by 49 CFR Part 40, and cannot be modified or substituted.
10-Panel Usage: Employers may use 10-panel tests for company-authority (non-DOT) testing, but it cannot replace the required DOT pre-employment test.
Alternative Testing: Starting 2023, oral fluid (saliva) collection is permitted as a 5-panel alternative to urine, but it must still be the 5-panel, not a 10-panel.
Consequences: Using a 10-panel test in place of the required 5-panel can result in FMCSA audit citations.For a compliant, valid pre-employment screening, the test must follow the 5-panel DOT compliant drug and alcohol testing procedures.
nicerakk@reddit
https://www.foleyservices.com/articles/dot-drug-testing-program-requirements/
nicerakk@reddit
If the 10 panel is the only drug test you do for pre employment, report them to FMCSA. They will audit then fine them
Little_NaCl-y@reddit
They will give you a standard 5 panel as well because that's the only form currently accepted by DOT. The 10 panel is for internal use only.
Virtchoo@reddit
Same reason they do hair tests. Because they can require anything they want for employment. 10 panel and hair tests are not DOT reportable though, just for internal purposes
Brooklynj-718@reddit
An official DOT/FMCSA drug test is not a 10-panel. The DOT test is the federally regulated DOT panel under 49 CFR Part 40.
A company can require a 10-panel, but that would be a separate non-DOT/company test. They can do both during onboarding, but they’re supposed to keep them separate. DOT tests and non-DOT tests cannot be mixed together or treated as one test....just sayin.
possibly_lost45@reddit
Probably because they can.