BALKANERS ONLY: Do you think ILGA’s LGBT maps are misleading when it comes to the average experience of LGBT people in each European country? Or do you find them accurate?
Posted by Substratas@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 35 comments
ZinbaluPrime@reddit
I don't even understand what this map shows... Legal rights? Is there even any laws in the Balkans that restrict you in some way for being gay?
titaincognita@reddit
You're not wrong. This map is a horrible visual made off of broad metrics that aren't well defined. The thread op got this from mentions the same. There are definitely better choices out there than this one.
Self-Bitter@reddit
No law restricts women from being women also but somehow there has been an endless evolution towards equality through legislation..
chillbill1@reddit
Lol
Lorumba@reddit
Thanks to Ataturk I can be alive in turkey but yeah generally not a good experience.
77 percent of the pop thinks we shouldnt have equal rights but the people that say "everyone should have equal rights" are growing.
There are safe heavens for lgbt people in turkey but whole east side of the country from ankara is pretty hostile towards it. You cant go out dressing the way you want if you are not in these safe heavens. The goverment is pushing for laws against lgbtq+ people the most recent one being if you grow your hair and dont act like a man you will get punished or smthn but they cant act on it.
Western side of the county is better for the lgbtq+ folks.
Its shitty as hell here but I will not leave these lands to live comfortably in german or wherever the fuck. We will slowly make this country what it was supposed to be. Even if I d¡e I will not d¡e in foreign land.
https://i.redd.it/jms546dgm11h1.gif
koltuklanmis_kargi@reddit
Homosexuality was decriminalized 30 years before Ataturk was born.
serbixwe@reddit
I'm a gay guy who lives in Istanbul. I shortly lived in Belgrade too. I was verbally attacked twice while holding hands with my bf in Belgrade downtown in the short time I was there. While in Istanbul we'd hug, hold hands and kiss in many parts of the city and nothing ever happened. But according to this map I'm living in hell but Serbia is a much better place.🤷♂️
Born-Ad8034@reddit
It because you Turkish not gay
Markomannia@reddit
Society in Serbia is homophobic beyond reasonable comprehension; even the rigid Serbian state has menaged to be a bit less homophobic then the society.
Adorable-Ad-1180@reddit
I can't imagine its pleasant to be gay in Serbia whatsover. It makes so much more sense to move to NY or something.
ExplanationFew7003@reddit
joke’s on you then! I know a gay couple who lives together and they even adopted a dog from a lady who knew about them. I also happened to be at the wedding where kuma was a lesbian and came with her gf. Everyone knew and novody cared. Also, none of that happened in Belgrade and nobody involved’s from Belgrade. But keep being a whiny lil “serbiazz homophobic” bitch
Substratas@reddit (OP)
Out-of-closet LGBT people who have experienced living in both Western Europe & Balkans are also welcome to give their opinions.
Weirdo9495@reddit
I gave some of my relevant opinions here and here in the thread you linked.
chillbill1@reddit
AfD wants all of that, while their chief is a woman married to another woman (migrant!) who live in Switzerland! The hypocrisy cannot be bigger
Weirdo9495@reddit
Exactly. Why would she care, her wealth and residency alone puts her far above us common plebs. Her actual ideology is just extreme neoliberalism and AfD is a perfect vehicle for it. She's also an useful figleaf for the party.
Ace-inThe-Hole@reddit
In Greece we now can get married and adopt, so it does get better for us.
BWC_Python@reddit
Adopt real living children? Jesus Christ all mighty....
Ace-inThe-Hole@reddit
I know right? They could turn queer like me, the horror!
BWC_Python@reddit
Yes! exactly
Ace-inThe-Hole@reddit
I am already a mother and in a straight marriage. Hope you sleep easier at night.
BWC_Python@reddit
women are nice, no matter the choice. Most beautiful living being on earth.
BWC_Python@reddit
yes, accurate and I hope it stays this way. I cannot undrstand when there are so much beautiful women around, why would someone choose the opposite
DefinitelyNotEgg@reddit
True, that's why every woman should be a lesbian!
Ace-inThe-Hole@reddit
Amen to that!
Successful-Biggy@reddit
I believe, Turkiye should have been a lil bit higher on the map but still at the downside.
Inevitable_Motor_685@reddit
UK being at 44% doesn't make sense even with the more recent anti trans climate
Also Italy? Like c'mon lol how come Italy is even lower than places like Bosnia, Serbia or Albania
Substratas@reddit (OP)
Exactly! Also, Greece & Sweden are worlds apart.
Even Spain & Malta are nowhere near Sweden. Idk what ILGA is smoking.
Self-Bitter@reddit
You should better read the context of the maps you post before asking or commenting. In this case for example the map is about legislation not social acceptance.
And your remark for Spain shows you don't know what you are talking about. Spain is just like Nordics but with the addition of a much friendlier human approach.
And finally Greece is not backwards as many here love to believe. Definitely not in par with Sweden but worlds apart is too much (ok it might be in rural Crete or Northern Greece) especially if you have to compare with other European countries (ahem ahem OP)...
BWC_Python@reddit
greeks invented manlove
West_Possible_7969@reddit
This is about legal frameworks & policies, as it says right there in the picture. Greece upped the ante considerably with almost full marriage equality and anti discrimination laws, Spain’s framework is also one of the best. Sweden regressed regarding trans rights where Spain has accelerated rapidly all related reforms and is leading.
tipoftheiceberg1234@reddit
No wayyy Montenegro is that liberal. Maybe, by the grace of god, they’ve passed some progressive laws concerning gays.
My mom has a friend from Montenegro (let’s call her Svetlana). This is what her grandma said to her and her brother (let’s call him Igor) when they were growing up.
“Svetlana, you will always have your brother to look up to and rely on in your life” (she turns to Igor) “Igor my son, unfortunately you don’t have anyone”.
As much as we all love Montenegro we still think they have a very ancient mentality. Like ancient. While some of the is obviously propaganda, to think that Montenegro is just 11% behind the Netherlands in terms of gay acceptance and laws?
Something is fishy here 🐟
redonredgrave@reddit
Assuming it's solely looking at laws it's likely cause same sex unions started being recognized in ~2020, still don't think it should be in the green though
Adorable-Ad-1180@reddit
Montenegro is very much western liberal and lame now, they've decided to go full that direction to seperate themselves from us and suck up to EU to get membership. The people themselves though are another story.
albo_kapedani@reddit
Albania and the UK at the same levels for LGBTQ experience and rights?! Bullcrap.
Apatride@reddit
It literally says it is about laws, which should be the same for everyone and every couple (so LGBT should have the same health coverage and benefits as straight couple). From what I can see, socially, the issue is more complicated. Public displays of affection are rather uncommon so, if someone abides to that, there is no issue since there is no clear evidence of sexual/romantic preferences. Otherwise, outside of a few idiots (I saw one dude with a tshirt wishing very bad things to LGBT people), most people are fine with it. I did notice, though, that the Balkan LGBT community appears to be more edgy, more underground, which makes sense.