I'm considering bailing from my company because of a single piece of software

[-]

Sleepytitan@reddit

The worst thing about MSP life is software for lawyers and doctors.

It’s all dogshit and the support is nearly nonexistent.

Add to that the personality types you deal with supporting lawyers and doctors and it’s a recipe for a bad time.

The good news is you can always try corporate life. We have SAP and Salesforce and teams of consultants and meetings after meetings and circling back offline to ping you later…

[-]

SandyTech@reddit

And the software vendor’s first response is that it’s somehow your fault.

[-]

ReputationNo8889@reddit

And even if you prove to them it has nothing to do with you, they still say "works on our end with custom patches and fixes applied that you dont have access to"

[-]

This is 10+ years ago but I had to manage a bus/trucking route planning software that was built using FoxPro in the 90’s and used multiple Access databases on the backend. If you even looked at the software wrong it would corrupt the database. Support wouldn’t even attempt to fix the database, they would just say “restore it from backup”. Problem was if you tried to back it up with something like Backup Exec while someone was using the software, the backup would fail most of the time. So there was only few hour window when you could get a good backup because this piece of shit was so slow that it could take hours to a actually finish processing the next days routes that ran over night. Had to be a 100+ hours of work would be lost every year because of the database corruption.

[-]

dontera@reddit

This post is relevant to me. During COVID I was employed by the nations largest Bankruptcy, Foreclosure, and Evictions lawfirm as their development department director. I had to swallow a lot of moral guilt to get through the day to day, but the real monster of that place was their software - specifically the 5 case management software stacks we ran, three of which were custom, in-house solutions, the oldest of which was going on 15 years.

It was chaos and I still don't know how the company continued forward every day. Some of the highlights: Most of the servers were Windows Server 2008 (in 2020) for which we had to get extended MS support. The Foreclosure software (FMS) was an offshore-written abomination that could only run in IE 11 and had memory leaks too numerous to fix. Our Evictions office down in Florida used an out of support 3rd party case management system (cant recall name) that they'd had custom work done for but then lost the code and hasn't been updated in years.

My only solace is that i was pretty bad at that particular role for various reasons and in my few years there hardly moved the needle for them.

[-]

gamersonlinux@reddit

I don't know how companies work in such legacy systems today? I know it's expensive to update and migrate data to new systems... not to mention expensive, but in the long run it's better for everyone!

I have worked in the newspaper industry and insurance industry. It's crazy how they still used Solaris on Supermicro servers and A/S 400 for their CRM. Supporting these ancient systems has so many hoops to jump through it's amazing anybody can get anything done.

[-]

dontera@reddit

Momentum and lost knowledge. Those are the core factors that keep a replacement system project from getting started.

My current company is running a 15-year old custom SaaS for which we've lost core knowledge of how the system is used by our customers. We know we need to replace it, but recreating the decades of custom changes would be nearly impossible on the first try. So we basically need to reinvent the service and train users on the new way, which with have many downstream impacts on the way people have been doing they job for years.

[-]

gamersonlinux@reddit

Very good point! Techs leave company and never really documented their processes or even cross trained anyone to assist. I've seen it a few times and it really sucks.

I was at a company who still used AS/400 for their CRM. It was emulated cause it's no longer supported but it still works. Every year they talked about upgrading to modern systems and then ended up renewing the hardware budget for the AS/400 to run another 10 years.

[-]

dontera@reddit

The only time I've seen a company break that cycle is when I was hired by a small company who had a very rudimentary custom business app, but wanted to trash it. They asked me to create a new app from scratch. I did and it was a great success. I built a 15-person dev department around me and was laid off 5 years later. That was in 2015 - I hear they will release their replacement for my app any quarter now...

[-]

frankentriple@reddit

I’m going to give you the piece of advice I wish I’d gotten years earlier.

Embrace the corpo attitude. Live it. Love it.

The minute I did, my salary doubled and workload halved. Went from 20 years of msp hell to now I run my own team of devs in less than 5 years.

Be the change you want to see. From the inside.

[-]

StoneCypher@reddit

i don’t understand what this means

[-]

minoltabro@reddit

Wish it. Want it. Do it.

[-]

StoneCypher@reddit

see it. believe it. experience it.

[-]

Flamenverfer@reddit

I can synthesize this for you and break it down into actionable chunks, synergy

[-]

frankentriple@reddit

You get it.

[-]

DirtyPiss@reddit

Buy in to Leap. Stop being a naysayer and figure out ways to make it work. Your objections have been noted, staying as the stick in the mud does makes work more unpleasant. If they’re changing from the software it will be because of user’s feedback, not system admin’s

[-]

StoneCypher@reddit

did you reply to the wrong comment?

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

Well when you put it like that I'm tempted haha, teach me your ways

[-]

Snowmobile2004@reddit

If the issue is on the LEAP side, file a support ticket with them, and do other stuff while you wait. Of management asks for an update, it’s out of your hands. Big corpos move slowly, just relax and don’t try to rush anything, makes everything way less stressful

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

I know what you're saying, but LEAP support are so bad they have actually broken machines and then said they can't help.

I do need to work on my stress management because it's not there but I struggle with depression and that does not make things easy

[-]

psiphre@reddit

they have actually broken machines and then said they can't help.

if it takes more than a couple hours, just reimage the pc and move on

[-]

frankentriple@reddit

You have to embrace the rediculous. You have to swim in it. Bathe in it. And then ask for more. There's a reason its there even if you don't see it right away. Shed your defensiveness and learn "corporate honesty". Its more about attitude than aptitude and they can smell it a mile away.

You gotta drink the cool aid. That simple. once you do, things unlock. And you begin to see WHY its that way.

[-]

psiphre@reddit

cool aid.

[-]

mudo2000@reddit

the rediculous

Ah yes, the art of diculing something all over again later...

[-]

frankentriple@reddit

I saw the red squiggle but it looked right, dammit! But now I see the error, thanks for pointing it out.

[-]

MurkyInvestigator810@reddit

Your other option is working in the public sector, which has benefits and drawbacks. You won't have that "look how profitable we are while you barely got raise this year" attitude because you just won't get raises at all. We only get raises if it's a strong enough political bargaining chip that year. We're paid about 80-90% the current market rate and get benefits that are no longer better than working for a soulless corporation. Time was, you would accept the lower pay rate for a much more secure retirement and better health insurance. Those days are over.

[-]

NibblyPig@reddit

My advice is embrace it and simply let it crash and burn. People have to experience the full brunt of problems.

Stop fixing it, stop working so hard to make shit things less shit. Go full CYA, schedule meetings, remediations, detail everything in full about how you've tried to fix things but cannot.

NOTHING gets people to change their mind faster than you estimating it will take 2 weeks to fix an issue, CLEARLY in meetings declaring this, explaining why in detail, then every single day calmly working on it with full transparent progress reports about how you're not getting any closer to it.

Basically, do what chatgpt would do. You ask chatgpt how many sandwiches are required to feed enough staff to mine enough resources to manufacture enough golf balls fit in a hot air balloon in 1 month and it will damn well answer you. It will take freaking ages, be absolutely useless due to assumptions and such, but it WILL answer you. You simply methodically do the same thing.

Software is broken, I have no idea how it works so I need 14 days to decompile the source code and analyse it, along with $5000 of software to deconstruct it, then I need 3 people working 8 hour shifts to comb through and find the bug. After that we need to build a fix and deploy it. If there are any software updates during that time it may break things and we'll have to start again. Estimated time, 3 months, estimated cost, $250,000. I've reduced it as much as I can. Shall I proceed? If yes (and it's often yes hoping magically it won't happen with you being scapegoated) then you thoroughly document what you're doing, progress report to everyone every 4 hours, and after a few days people will start feeling uneasy ("Is it done yet?", "As per my report we're 3% completed and have 2 months left") and then more and more panic will set in, then they have a meeting where they ask you to speed things up, clutch at straws etc, you continue throughout all of this to be cool as a cucumber but very busy. The entire time you suggest your alternative (ditch the garbage, go with better solution). Eventually they start asking how long to implement the new solution and the cost, then a bit more panic, then eventually they convince themselves that with this trainwreck at full steam that it would be wise to migrate. You start migrating and you get what you want. No stress, no panic, no pulling crazy shifts, and ultimately no crap software that doesn't work.

[-]

Soylent_gray@reddit

Remind me of eDocs DM

[-]

biztactix@reddit

Dont worry, there are far worse software out there... it can always be worse.

gif

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

I mean...it COULD have been SAP

./shudder

[-]

Evil-Bosse@reddit

SAP is great, if you own a company that sells SAP consultancy hours. If not, yeah I'd avoid any sort of responsibility or hints that I can solve stuff in it. I'd rather manage an 20 year old Citrix environment with undocumented registry hacks completely on obsolete hardware

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joshbudde@reddit

Its Citrix. Undocumented registry hacks are a given.

[-]

redmage07734@reddit

Citrix is fine as long as you're not pushing unsupported software onto the platform or dealing with remote workers using fucking cellular internet

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DevDude2025@reddit

Just deploy LEAP on Citrix. 😂

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cosmin_c@reddit

if you own a company that sells SAP consultancy hours

Companies being able to sell consultancy means that specific piece of software is an absolute fucking mess in the first place and nobody should touch it. Alas...

I always wondered what made SAP so indispensable and at the same time so complex and prone to breaking that the companies using it haven't been able to replace it and all I can think is the developers just built on top of stuff on top of stuff ad nauseam until nobody knew exactly how to explain it without a few weeks training just to get your head around one module.

[-]

TheDevauto@reddit

Not really. SAP is like mainframes in that it becomes tied in so heavily to business processes, data and reporting that the company could not function without it.

That said, I think a lot of these monolithic software vendors could see problems in the future. Not as much with the install base as net new clients. Its too easy now to build what you need and that will keep getting better. As silly as the "vibe code" movement is, tjis stuff is changing very fast and what isnt possible today may be reality next week.

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cosmin_c@reddit

SAP is like mainframes in that it becomes tied in so heavily to business processes, data and reporting that the company could not function without it.

Thank you for this. Apparently nobody who I ever asked knew how to explain this (all of them were users though rather than admins). It finally clicked.

I don't think vibe coding an alternative for SAP is an option to be honest. I've coded as a hobby and coding with LLMs adds in a lot of slop in that the code is not optimised, it breaks easily, it can introduce awkward bugs (funnily enough it sometimes can debug the code it wrote), overall I can't see this deployed at scale without banjaxing the soap production for the next 10-15 years if the victim is a soap factory for example.

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TheDevauto@reddit

Dont think of it as either vibe coding or the entire sap stack. Rather look at how rapidly the coding tools are improving and consider the fact that monolithic software is a generic solution for many which means a lot of features go unused.

I think in the future companies with build whay they need exactly without the whole stack. The difference might be manufacturing companies.

[-]

TotallyInOverMyHead@reddit

I'd rather run everything Mail on a SB2011.

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USarpe@reddit

SBS 2003 with ISA Proxy all in one machine! To be honest, I loved the ISA Proxy, but the XP SP2 security policy first brought a lot of trouble, although it was the right decision.

[-]

Savings_Art5944@reddit

ISA was good.

[-]

USarpe@reddit

Never saw a better user interface for a firewall

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RikiWardOG@reddit

I'd rather manage an 20 year old Citrix environment with undocumented registry hacks completely on obsolete hardware

I felt this one haha

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alpha417@reddit

The documentation is the registry hacks.

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Bagelson@reddit

20 year old Citrix environment with undocumented registry hacks completely on obsolete hardware

Hey, I got one of those. Migration to a 10 year old RDS environment with undocumented hacks completely on obsolete hardware is almost complete.

[-]

Cheech47@reddit

SAP is like Oracle. It's sold directly to the c-suite, and the implementation comes with at least 2 people that make at minimum 200K/year, you don't know what they do and if you fire them, the application breaks in a week.

[-]

FraShe27@reddit

Hey, that’s exactly what I do! LMAO

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Sleepytitan@reddit

In my experience no one actually supports those Citrix environments. They exist solely as vendor portals that my users need to do their job and I have to figure out how to access them completely blind.

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TodaysSJW@reddit

You animal

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FeetalsGizz@reddit

I've seen comments like this about SAP for years (and not just on this sub) and I could never relate...until the past couple years.

I work at a fairly big org (\~5500 people) and we used to have a team of 50 IT folks dedicated to supporting SAP full time. Everything worked as smooth as silk. A couple years back IT got downsized/outsourced and there's now 10 people who can support SAP, but only part time because they have other systems to manage too.

I understand the anti-SAP comments now.

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

When we were in the pipeline to swap out our ERP-solution where I work, I basically stated VERY firmly to my boss two things:
1: If the solution was IFS, I'm quitting this position and will start as a helper down in the wash-hall dealing with cleaning and detailing heavy construction machinery.
2: If SAP was chose, I'd flat out quit.

I still stand by those two. I've worked with SAP as a user more than I care to in the years I've been in the biz, and I CANNOT for the life of me think of much worse fates than having to support it as an admin 😛

[-]

Raknaren@reddit

have you tried Dynamics365 ?

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

Yep, we run it. And compared to SAP, it’s fast. Even with the utterly idiotically made ISV we use.

[-]

Raknaren@reddit

ours is heavily modified, that's more likely the problem.

we were on Navision2013R2 but a least it was on-prem, so snappy until it crashed

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

We were on AX2012R12, which was end of life something fierce. And also pissingly slow, for some absolutely weird reason.

I'm also very glad that I'm not directly involved in the day-to-day ops of our D365FO. That's the other guy-stuff, I deal with the fun stuff (Entra/O365/Intune/On-prem AD etc).

[-]

LUHG_HANI@reddit

Ohh god. We are updating to SAP S4 Fiori. Even finding documentation on infastructure implementation is difficult. You need a support contract just for that.

[-]

NoodleSchmoodle@reddit

My previous employer, a fortune 50 company, is upgrading to S4/HANA. It took 2 full years just to do 3 small to medium business units in one work stream.

I retired.

[-]

Crotean@reddit

SAP is perfectly fine. But people need to actually be trained to use it and it has to be implemented properly. It's an enterprise level software that can do A LOT, but that requires investment to work properly. Like 30% of the world's GDP is processed in SAP for a reason.

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Sovos@reddit

Yep, goes for all ERP and lots of other daily-use software as well - if the people or team implementing it really know their shit, it's going to be amazing. If they don't have a full grasp of the eccentricities and inner workings of the software, it's going to be set up in a way that handicaps the business as long as they use it.

I've seen 1 place that had a clean, happy SAP system, and 5 where it was the most common hindrance to productivity.

If you know another company that praises their SAP, find out what company implemented it for them.

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bukkithedd@reddit

Have you MET an average user? 😂

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Crotean@reddit

Business which actually understand technology and train and staff for it do exist. There are just fewer of them then there should be.

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03263@reddit

I don't believe you.

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Hyperbolic_Mess@reddit

I worked at a large US manufacturer and we became the lucky recipients of the largest SAP deployment ever. It went so well our CEO was tweeted at by one of our largest buyers, it was just a picture of an empty warehouse asking where the fuck our products were...

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

That sounds about right, to be honest 😛 In the years I

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Hyperbolic_Mess@reddit

Yeah I'd just come from a much smaller UK firm that had also just rolled out SAP to replace a bespoke system built in the 80s and everyone hated it so much we all got "I survived SAP" mugs made up for the office 🤣

The US firm's rollout was piloted in Canada and we ended up being unable to ship anything within Canada so had to fullfil orders from US depots with the old system for months. They lost so much money and I think it triggered quite a few resignations. Absolutely top system

[-]

BanAssaultGeese@reddit

AS400 incoming

[-]

BBOAaaaarrrrrrggghhh@reddit

Still give me nightmare... In 2017, company I worked went bankrupt... Well we were the last client of IBM with an AS400 from 1997 using Movex ERP from early 2000's... Sight what a pain to use and to backup with QIC tape...

[-]

bukkithedd@reddit

We had one of our parts-people squish the AS/400-server with a 20-ton excavator when we phased that solution out 😃

The look of pure glee on his face was amazing.

[-]

LarsLarsPantsonFars1@reddit

We just switched to SAP. Quitting very soon.

[-]

osmedex@reddit

SAP=Shitty Accounting Program!

[-]

m3galinux@reddit

Or worse, PeopleSoft. Still runs on COBOL. Not kidding.

[-]

vonarchimboldi@reddit

dude i worked for a small company that used an old ass version of SAP for their ERP. that shit is not built for small companies it’s fucking terrible for it. they wouldn’t move off of it cause whatever flat fee they paid for a license in 2009 or whatever would be replaced with the saas billing model and they were cheap.

[-]

rescbr@reddit

There is absolutely no problem! They can buy support from consultancies specialized in supporting outdated SAP deployments like Rimini Street.

Heard about them in a previous job and I found out that this was how medium businesses handled the whole SAP thing.

[-]

DoctorSlipalot@reddit

Or Sage

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Pazuuuzu@reddit

Sap is Germany's revenge for losing WW2...

[-]

crimson_ruin_princes@reddit

I cry inside every time i get a SAP ticket in.

[-]

pdp10@reddit

./shudder
Copyright SAP AG, 1972-2006
License validation... failed.
Segmentation fault.

[-]

ITguydoingITthings@reddit

I've experienced. And the fact that such bad software exists in THAT field? Hilarious.

But there's awful software in medical. And accounting. And manufacturing.

And Sage is still out there.

[-]

Raknaren@reddit

a lot of medical software is semi-inhouse. I'd say it compares to a state owned rail service

[-]

biztactix@reddit

I've been auditing some pharmacy software recently, no names... but one of their api endpoints returns the hashes for all the pharmacists...

Mmmhmmm

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ITguydoingITthings@reddit

It's fine. The state probably says so. 🙄

[-]

TU4AR@reddit

Enter Google Workspace sync for outlook.

I will give my two weeks notice as soon as I see it. Just use a web browser. For fucks sake.

[-]

terminalzero@reddit

but I've been running my life off my outlook tasks list for 14 years and I'll be DAMNED if I have to spend 30 minutes typing reminders like 'don't shit your pants at your desk' into google tasks!

[-]

vogelke@reddit

'don't shit your pants at your desk'

Take my upvote.

[-]

Crafty_Morning_6296@reddit

/r/shittysysadmin

[-]

TU4AR@reddit

User error, closing ticket.

[-]

TheGlennDavid@reddit

I like that literally every industry has its own bespoke ERP/CRM dumpster fire.

Anyone who has only worked in one industry is certain theirs is the worst.

Anyone who has worked in multiple industries knows that a "list of the worst ones" is just a mobius strip to hell.

[-]

PlayingDoomOnAGPS@reddit

Oracle.

[-]

Robyz@reddit

Came here for this statement take my upvote!

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valar12@reddit

Mf doesn’t use the legacy version of PCLaw. There are worse case management solutions too.

[-]

mistyjeanw@reddit

Please don't say this out loud.

[-]

hak8or@reddit

Don't forget about auto star that's common in the embedded sector!

https://www.reddit.com/r/embedded/comments/smq04d/your_opinion_on_autosar/

[-]

osmiumblue66@reddit

Banking software. Fine, until you gotta update it.

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zombieroadrunner@reddit

Then you presumably need to hire a COBOL programmer?

[-]

osmiumblue66@reddit

No, this is all windows and Java based.

[-]

DeadStockWalking@reddit

What banking software is Java based? Which core?

[-]

zombieroadrunner@reddit

I'm so sorry for your loss (of sanity).

[-]

osmiumblue66@reddit

Lived to tell, and I appreciate your understanding as well.

[-]

ProperEye8285@reddit

You should've been a goat farmer.

https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/s/KwvEkfFLQS

[-]

M365Expert@reddit

This sounds like "Clearwell" back in the day, all the lawyers wanted it but it was impossible to teach them how to use it and any update broke it completly.

[-]

Beautiful_Abrocoma56@reddit

Fuck LEAP and their goofy ass support team - I feel your pain.

Although if I had a dollar for every time it’s shit the bed to the point of reinstall, I could retire.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

At one point we knew the bad ones by name.

If you're reading this Mo, fuck you

[-]

Helpful_Ad_9447@reddit

LEAP sounds like a nightmare. The fact that updates uninstall it is impressively bad. I'd be looking elsewhere too.

[-]

cyber_r0nin@reddit

Well, that isn't necessarily weird. What's bad is the data has to be redownloaded. The data should be separate from the actual application. That is horrible design. No db?

[-]

Helpful_Ad_9447@reddit

Exactly. Re-downloading everything after an update is insane. That is not a bug, that is someone building it wrong from the ground up. No wonder people are fed up with it.

[-]

dontbethefatguy@reddit

My firm is on Partner4Windows at the moment and I’m considering LEAP or Clio as an alternative - you may be swaying me.

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porsten@reddit

Worked IT support awhile ago for a company that supported LEAP among other case management software. Smokeball was an alternative.

We had to do work on both but LEAP was notoriously difficult to get their engineers involved (which they nearly always had to be involved for one reason or another that never made sense beyond 'their software is shit').

Smokeball I don't particularly remember many cases - it had issues but more along the lines of 'this computer is a piece of shit and shouldn't even be working' issues moreso than Smokeball.

Basically - avoid LEAP unless you like pain.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

I got into the habit of recording the desktop sessions on the occassions they did logon, they have special tools they run that aren't available to us and they won't give them to you if asked.

9/10 they don't know what the tools do, some Fiverr dev in India probably makes them

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

As someone who's been the IT Coord. For law firms using LEAP, myCase, ATO, and now Clio. I can safely say go with Clio. They have unmatched customer support and problem resolution.
I'm not affiliated with them, no commissions. They're just that good

[-]

Django_gvl@reddit

What about Neos from Assembly Software?

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

I have never used Neos. But a safe way to test any software is to ask the for a test/play environment where they can load 2 or 3 of your cases and have an attorney and 1 or 2 leads/paralegal work on it. It's not perfect but they'll tell you exactly what's missing or wrong (they always tell you whats wrong...)

[-]

Draken_S@reddit

Clio, SmartAdvocate or FileVine - do not even glance at anything else in the legal space.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

FOR GODS SAKE DO NOT GO WITH LEAP

There is no amount of hyperbole, metaphors, or pure fucking begging that I can articulate to properly inform you just how much my entire team and I despise that stupid backwards piece of shit software.

Also it's about £200-250 per user per month

[-]

Kurgan_IT@reddit

I'm a freelance sysadmin and I have found shit like this more than once. And they usually try to tell the customer that it's my fault if their software sucks.

[-]

TheGlennDavid@reddit

"Well you see your IT guy wouldn't follow our recommended practices (running the installer as a domain admin, making everyone a workstation admin, 'opening the firewall') so we can't guarantee the product will work."

[-]

Kurgan_IT@reddit

If some software vendor asks for a horribly insecure setup, I tell them "sure, sign a document that states that you want me to do this and that". They never do.

[-]

lightshowhumming@reddit

Ahh this happened more than once in the world? How about network and firewall settings being kept explicitly secret? :)

[-]

henk717@reddit

Had a fun one a few months ago. Customer (car dealership) called me up that he'd like me to uninstall the antivirus. He had already contacted the vendor and they had assured them that they were being blocked by the antivirus, that antivirus's are a scam because updating windows is enough and that if we'd delete the antivirus it would fix his issue of not being able to install the update he needed for a car he was working on.

Obviously I am not an idiot, I have access to the allow panel so if it was genuinely the antivirus i'd have made sure that it would get out of the way. I'm not going to uninstall an antivirus when all you have to do is allow the software.

So I opened the update to trigger the antivirus alert and looked in the panel. No alert. Not from my attempt, not from any other attempt. The antivirus wasn't in the way at all the next button in the wizard was just greyed out and you couldn't install it.

Most setups thankfully dump a more detailed log into temp as your installing so you can have a clue what is really going on. I looked and.... bingo! The exact log I wanted. It had a hidden "This update is not applicable for this copy of the software" hidden in there. But they didn't present this during the installation, it would just silently not let you continue.

Placed the log on the desktop and told him about the real issue, that it wasn't our antivirus at all and that the update wasn't applicable despite being automatically downloaded by their launcher. He went back to the vendor with it, i did offer that if the vendor would cause trouble that he can put me in a conference call because i'd win that argument. Never heard back so I assume the vendor went "Oooooooh" and then fixed the real issue.

[-]

SevaraB@reddit

In their defense, I’ve seen customers demand some wild off-label usage and then blame the vendor for themselves misunderstanding what the software does and effectively misusing the software. Cases like these are usually some not-quite-50/50 split combination of the vendor’s documentation/training not being up to snuff and the customer just being a stubborn snowflake that’s trying to reinvent the wheel.

[-]

Kurgan_IT@reddit

This can also happen, of course. But here I am talking about a vendor that used a "database" on a file share with Access, and tried to tell the customer that it's the network that's slow, not the fact that Access is not meant to work on a file share with 50 users on it and 500 GB of data.

[-]

PlsChgMe@reddit

What a nightmare.

[-]

Phaedrus_Schmaedrus@reddit

"off-label usage" ime often means "running a firewall"

[-]

SevaraB@reddit

When you specifically buy a cloud service and then refuse to unblock said cloud provider at your firewall, you deserve all the pain you get. Networking ain’t magic.

[-]

kingslayerer@reddit

If you do quit, make sure to mention this as reason

[-]

cyber_r0nin@reddit

Lol software 'engineered' with Fiver.

[-]

Banquet-Beer@reddit

Sounds like a good combo of AI and pajeet programming

[-]

Nova_Terra@reddit

Am also not a fan of leap personally either, love them or hate them iManage generally does what it says on the tin but netdocs seems interesting

[-]

ITcurmudgeon@reddit

The worst thing about iManage is that it uses Outlook for its front end.

We support numerous law offices, and they all use a different CMS.

iManage is rather dogshit in my experience.

Another firm uses Netdocs. All in the cloud and it generally seems to just work. It's not a big practice so not sure how it scales.

One firm uses Time Matters, also dogshit and doesn't look like the GUI has been updated since the late 90s.

The largest firm we support uses Perfect Law. It's also the law based software I am most (unfortunately) familiar with. All self hosted. The upside with PLAW is that it combines billing into the CMS, so there's only one app. Downside is, it's self hosted, it uses SQL with the database being designed by them, and their DB (as far as I can tell), really doesn't abide by too many best practices for SQL. There are a considerable amount of table locks occuring, which in turn causes the office apps to freeze up for a subset of users. Plus side is, it has forced me into learning a good amount of database stuff. It also sadly seems the better of the bunch.

Then we have a small firm where we deployed Clio in the past year. Support requests from them for the CMS dropped off to roughly zero. Again, it's a very small firm so really not sure how it scales.

[-]

Nova_Terra@reddit

I'd be curious to see how iManage decides to pivot in light of Outlook (new) and whether or not that pivot is even possible at least in the current way we interact with iManage in Outlook Classic.

[-]

fatwhippetz@reddit

Every time I get a call about Leap I wince, I feel your pain.

[-]

x-TheMysticGoose-x@reddit

Smokeball is good but might be AU only. It's the gold standard here.

[-]

stoo182@reddit

Yep, manage a company who use LEAP. Spend most of the time uninstalling and reinstalling as it’s the only way to resolve issues! Also, the inbuilt repair tool does nothing!

[-]

Ozwulf67@reddit

My wife's firm looked at it...choose FileVine instead. They are happy. ( https://www.filevine.com/ )

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

Oof fucking Leap...

No chance in convincing them to migrate to Clio?

[-]

HolidayWallaby@reddit

Clio the AI company?

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

Well, it's complicated (but not really).

The have different products within Clio.

Manage, Grow, Works, etc...

Last year the acquired vLex for $1B. Vlex was an AI company. Now Clio implemented their AI into their CMS. And its comparable (if not better) than WestLaw's. The AI product is called C"lio Works" and it doesn't come standard with their base product.

[-]

HolidayWallaby@reddit

Ah I'm thinking of a different Clio, there's a new AI startup with the same name

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

Every chance I get to mention it I do lol, main caveat is that LEAP charges you to leave, and then when you do they just dump all your files on the client and expect them to sort it out

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

Clio's team does the migration and from what I understand it's included.

From your comment I'm assuming your files are in the cloud on their servers. What's the total size?

[-]

AntagonizedDane@reddit

Imagine having such bad customer service that fixing it becomes a main selling point for other providers lol

[-]

fcisler@reddit

I won’t name any software and it was 10+ years ago….but….
A certain software got bought out and just absolutely tanked. There was the competing solution, X, but to migrate data it was a 6 month+ wait. They also were unable to import most files related to the clients - a big dealbreaker for some.
They had been promising it was in the works but couldn’t commit to a timeline.
In comes a msp friend of mine and sells them on I’ll convert and import. Ummm ok.
Took around a month but i had it done. The big “blocker” was that (IIRC) the original product files were in $this format and new product wanted $that….something really rather trivial.
After using it for a bit the customer went back to company X and told them it was done. They couldn’t believe it! Word spread around and soon I had tons of clients to convert. This went well for a bit. As far as I know they might have never even migrated a customer before I snatched them all up. At some point I started asking how people found me and company X started saying I was “their” data conversion guy.

[-]

pdp10@reddit

Word spread around and soon I had tons of clients to convert.

Good for your client. A lot of the time, the client will keep quiet, sometimes for fear of helping its competitors.

At some point I started asking how people found me and company X started saying I was “their” data conversion guy.

Funny, but not too surprising from small business.

I'm envisioning 40 lines of awk in a loop, plus some integrity validation routines.

[-]

fcisler@reddit

I wish I could include more context. The TL;DR is that the company I helped had #1 guy on the topic. As in quite literally wrote the book on it. It got involved but they threatened a breach and his reply was something to the effect of a flyer for him being the keynote speaker for an event they were sponsoring…. They FAFO

[-]

nhaines@reddit

Once had a problem with Windows 2000 and KVM. The only solution I was able to find was literally in a German book written 7 years earlier. The client bought the book for me, and I sat down and translated it and published the translation. (Something to do with multi-processor support in Win2K needing a driver or else the OS would randomly lock up entirely.)

[-]

ricdanger@reddit

Can confirm, in late ‘80s we were the only people capable of data conversion for this old product. The trick? They “printed” their reports into a parallel-to-serial converter and we sucked it into our SCO box and ran it through a truly massive awk script to create our flat files. Captured nearly the whole market!

[-]

pdp10@reddit

I never sold this, but thirty years ago I had a conversion in C on Unix that could take any size file, whereas the PC-based solutions read everything into RAM first. What OS/2 could eventually manage to batch convert in 45 minutes, Windows 95 would fail to do, and Unix ran at line speed of the I/O.

[-]

Cheech47@reddit

You just described basically all modern Cloud services. Startup costs are simple, but if you want to pull data and move to someplace else? Oh, that's going to cost you.

[-]

redmage753@reddit

It made me chuckle to see ai SaaS enthusiasts suddenly championing standardized data formats and whinging about why nobody had thought to do it years before.

So yep. Here we are. Lol. For the same reason they want to be profitable, grifitng folk for no reason other than to pretend they did something useful by riding someone else's hard work.

[-]

Mindestiny@reddit

It's frustratingly common in the SaaS world. It's explicitly a sales tactic for a lot of companies to keep you "locked in" by making it as incredibly difficult as possible to migrate away.

So other companies make it a selling point to navigate the bullshit for you and charge you for "migration services" as part of their onboarding. We just blew like $15k on this to go from one platform to another, the alternative was essentially to build our own migration app which would've taken months that we didn't have and a lot more than $15k in labor.

All part of the SaaS game unfortunately.

[-]

TodaysSJW@reddit

Wait… you’re getting customer service?

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

I've never waited more than a minute to reach someone, even if it was low level support.

For more complicated solution they had me communicate directly to a specialist and walk them through what was going. They were very transparent with what could and couldn't be done.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

It's tough to say how much as we don't manage that aspect. But that knowledge is an absolute weapon in my arsenal

[-]

Defiant-Chip6513@reddit

On avg it's about $25 for every 100GB. If you figure out how much they're charging you for storage you can math it out.

We migrated 15TB in total ($3.75k/month). From start to finish (initial sit down to launch day) it took about 6 months. I would've been more comfortable having a year to get everyone 100% but we were in a time crunch due to contracts.

And the best part? Clio does not charge for storage. Unlimited storage space baby!

[-]

maethlin@reddit

If misery loves company, maybe have a read through this thread to make you feel better lol

https://www.reddit.com/r/LawFirm/comments/10gnlo6/looking_for_personal_review_on_leap_practice/

[-]

Xelopheris@reddit

As with anything else, gotta create a business case. Cost of staying versus estimated cost of switching.

[-]

GenerateUsefulName@reddit

If this is in the EU, there is the EU Data Act I recently learned about. Basically software vendors can not just deliver the data to you in a way that you can not import it easily to another tool. They need to provide API connections and smooth ways to transfer data, including metadata. They can also not charge for this extra. Unfortunately for existing contracts it only comes into effect in September.

[-]

JKL213@reddit

If any German sysadmins in law firms are listening - it could have been the beA Desktop Client.

[-]

nyckidryan@reddit

Reminds me of Dentrix bakc when I did freelance work in the 90s. 😵

My last nightmare - Prophet... radio studio automation software. Download their remote support software and THEY install it for you.

I do NOT miss radio IT.

[-]

ubermonkey@reddit

Years ago I worked for a consulting company that was trying to use a shared contacts system called Goldmine.

It shat the bed ALL THE FUCKING TIME. Finally, we got a service bulletin from them that included a list of risk factors that could cause their product to corrupt its own database. Hidden in the bullet list was one fairly simple factor:

Heavy use

I shit you not.

[-]

BWMerlin@reddit

How odd, I was talking to someone very recently and they said that the best CRM that they had ever used was Goldmine.

Personally I have never used it and when I jumped onto their website to check it out I thought they must have closed up shop and just left their site running as looking at it the software looks striat out of the 90's early 00's.

[-]

nyckidryan@reddit

If they say it's the best then they're not actually using it.

(Was that person's initials DPA by chance? 😁)

[-]

ubermonkey@reddit

Anyone who describes that abomination as the best of ANYTHING should have their head examined and their point of view permanently discarded. LOL.

[-]

Coarch@reddit

I remember re indexing the database all the time.

[-]

Opteron170@reddit

lol I know people that work for this company.

[-]

nyckidryan@reddit

Send them a link to this... maybe it will get somewhere. 😁

[-]

Huge-Two-3358@reddit

Law vs dental developers going head to head on who can make the shittiest software

[-]

nyckidryan@reddit

I'm pretty sure Dentrix wasn't this bad... though I quit doing that support around Y2K. 😛

[-]

GhostlyCrowd@reddit

Monkey Fight!

[-]

nyckidryan@reddit

Reminds me of Dentrix bakc when I did freelance work in the 90s. 😵

[-]

Leonakerz@reddit

I am working in the legal sector too, we currently use 3 (yes you read that right, THREE) applications for case management and they all FUCKING SUCK.

[-]

ycwpilot@reddit

is iManage one of them?

[-]

Leonakerz@reddit

We use iManage, but its more of a document mannager than a case management system if were honest.

[-]

omegafivethreefive@reddit

Hey man I'm in software development.

I'm the guy who gets called to fix the pile of crap.

[-]

Phalebus@reddit

I worked with LEAP years ago and whilst I agree it’s awful, there is definitely worse software out there to support.

Look into Airlock Digital or Carelink Plus if you really feel like punishing yourself… I even worked directly with the Carelink team 12 years ago, base coding is still the same with no modifications able to be done on base platform as the OG coder left with his millions once it was sold and no one knows how to make it work better. 12 years later and this is still the case…

[-]

mercurygreen@reddit

I refer to that just as "nicheware"

Literally over a BILLION people use Word, so there is a lot of work done on fixing and improving it, with Microsoft constantly getting bug reports so they know what to fix.

Looking up LEAP, that number is less than 70K. Very specialized, very targeted... and if you do the math, you can realize how LITTLE they're probably spending on tech support for it.

And... It's not one of the top ten things used by lawyers. So there is that...

[-]

mayesa@reddit

I work in court reporting and everything is bad even the “new” stuff.

[-]

Savings_Art5944@reddit

At least it is not the PROMIS software.

[-]

machacker89@reddit

I had one similar called ELN. Used in the Biopharmaceuticals. Boy this this was nightmare. If you don't get set-up sequence correctly. You had to start all over (reimage).

[-]

LightBeerIsAwful@reddit

I’m not sure is good legal software out there.

Starting to think the same about financial.

[-]

ycwpilot@reddit

There isn't. I've looked for so long and have found nothing.

[-]

paleologus@reddit

Even coders hate lawyers.

[-]

er1cAtWork2@reddit

I’ll take law firms over medical any day!

[-]

ycwpilot@reddit

ah the medical field, keeping faxing alive. Drives me absolutely insane.

[-]

UpsetMarsupial@reddit

And I'll take seppuku over medical lawyers.

[-]

Dustonred@reddit

The bar is law for hating lawyers.

[-]

Mad_Physicist@reddit

Excellent pun? Maybe...

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Stylux@reddit

Self-hating one here, I agree.

[-]

ycwpilot@reddit

LEAP is starting to move everything to the web ala Clio. Your nightmare might be over soon. We ran into the same issue with their desktop application it was absolutely awful. Unbelievably resource intensive, anyone using it we basically had to bump them to 32GB Ram, doesnt play nice with terminal servers either.

That being said, their sales department sold the person previous to me on this software and did an amazing job. They left me to pick up the pieces.

Could be worse, they could be using Amicus.

[-]

TheRealLambardi@reddit

umm...every...I mean every industry has their crappy software we are all stuck with...Have not found a single one.

Mine right now....how how how how how horrid is the ATS system for hiring. I thought it was bad on the candidate side in searching for a job.

Turns out it can be far far worse for the employer.

[-]

WavePsychological505@reddit

I used to work at an MSP years ago, just aboute every industry we supported had some Frankenstein software that sounds this , doctors offices, realestate, accountants, did my head in.

We had to build and maintain our own extensive SOP’s to do basic tasks like software upgrades, new computer setups etc.

Guess allot of these systems are moving or have moved to browser based SaaS now at least.

[-]

omasque@reddit

Startup idea masquerading as a problem.

[-]

HomesickDegen@reddit

My company uses ThreatLocker, Xcitium and SentilOne. I’ve seen spills of molasses move faster than our $10,000 CAD workstations. It’s honestly baffling as to why our upper management puts up with it. Lost productivity for our designers and developers is in the hundreds of hours per week.

[-]

baron_vlad@reddit

Well, having done Legal IT for 30 years now, and supporting Leap sites since it first hit the market, I can tell you the current 'Cloud' based Leap is orders of magnitude better than the old self hosted version. Which gives you some idea just how bad it used to be.

[-]

Original-Design1257@reddit

If you bail for someplace else, the next job will have a similar piece of software. I’ve been doing this 25 years. Every job has a LEAP.

[-]

MrJacks0n@reddit

Only one?

[-]

MrJacks0n@reddit

The more you spend on software, the worse it is. Make it a backend system and it's 2x worse. Just deal with it the best you can and improve everything else.

[-]

julzavk@reddit

I have to sympathize with the OP about LEAP, used to support a law firm that did lots of immigration work that used it but we hosted their desktops as Citrix single session non persistent VDI so it added another layer of fuckery to the mix. IIRC this it a run once installer and it builds a database every time, so we had to deal with Citrix profiles blowing out. Also PVS, so it caused the write cache to blow out and crash vdi's frequently, took heaps off tuning to get it to work

[-]

StreetLeader5036@reddit

Can confirm, LEAP is garbage.

I pushed it back hard on LEAP support to sort out and make sure the client knows they are constantly waiting on LEAP support.

[-]

Drakoolya@reddit

Of course it is some lawfirm software.

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Afraid_Baseball_3962@reddit

Seems like someone snuck in and topped off your tank of Giveashit. Crack open the release valve and drain it back down to a sustainable level. You can't completely empty the tank or you'll stop showing up for work, but if drop it down to the MIN line, you should be okay in a day or two.

[-]

Grrl_geek@reddit

Will be stealing this in the future: "someone snuck in and topped off your tank of Giveashit..."

[-]

MortadellaKing@reddit

Move to manufacturing and managing rockwell.

[-]

jimicus@reddit

Welcome to the wonderful world of line of business software.

I think the most annoying one I had was a terminal emulator - a terminal emulator, FFS! - that had a list of annoyances too long to list here.

It's enough to say that automated installation was off the cards completely until a forced update came along (please don't ask for details; we'll be here all day!), and I pointed out that manually updating every PC in the building would take about three weeks. Three weeks in which nobody would be working, because the old version wasn't compatible with the necessary change.

Miraculously, the project manager - who for years had point blank refused to ask the vendor to provide a means to automate the installation - suddenly found he could ask them.

[-]

Inevitable_Ratio_851@reddit

Leave. If they won't spend a few hundred bucks to fix your daily workflow, they definitely won't pay for proper servers or raises. Bad hardware is just the tip of the iceberg in places like that

[-]

AnomalyNexus@reddit

That's the problem with specialized software. Either they know how to program or they know how to do the specialized thing. Rarely both.

[-]

gnordli@reddit

Leap is absolute garbage. The weird part was how they managed support. You never talked to L3 support. L3 would mysteriously logon to the computer in the middle of the night, because they are based in a different timezone.

They continually tried to put the blame on me for misconfiguration. But all computers were configured the same via GPO. They couldn't tell me what settings needed to get deployed to fix the issues. It was a continual, round and round, wipe the computer, new profile, BS that never fixed anything.

[-]

AmusingVegetable@reddit

My plan B is piano player for a bordello.

[-]

grishnackh@reddit

Hahaha fuck LEAP - this post makes me SO glad I recently left the MSP space for an internal role.

[-]

naive_pasta@reddit

I was talking to them last week, lucky escape I suppose, but I'm still stuck with Proclaim :/

[-]

awesomegamer919@reddit

Going to be brutally honest, Leap really isn’t that bad, you mention the recent Adobe issue (they had a workaround within like 30 minutes for us), but plenty of other software has similar issues - Genie Medical software completely broke on any system that had Edge installed, it took a day for a workaround to come out (rolling back edge updates and blocking new versions) but even that would break the moment someone ran something that needed a newer version of Edge and their solution required installing Chrome on every client device, including app servers.

[-]

alrightknight@reddit

I deal heavily with both Leap and Genie it does make me want to take up the goat farming profession.

[-]

marklein@reddit

I had a client with LEAP. The broken Adobe plugin was the only IT related problem we had to solve. Lawyers didn't like it and switched away, but IT problems weren't an issue.

[-]

SecludedExtrovert@reddit

I support a system like that. It’s terrible. Made me consider looking around, too.

[-]

Apprehensive_Bat_980@reddit

That’s single piece of software for me is Dynamics CRM. Hate CRM, I should’ve refused any ownership of this.

[-]

robbdire@reddit

As someone who works in an MSP, and has many clients with LEAP....yeah.....that and Sage...just.....how do they keep in business?

[-]

abz_eng@reddit

Because there isn't much competition, inertia plus fear of the unknown/consequences of it going wrong

Nobody got fire for buying IBM

If it ain't Boeing, I ain't going

Though with the McDonell take over and the engineers being relegated/not replace and quality being replaced by profit it's becoming

If it is Boeing, I ain't going

[-]

cyberman0@reddit

I had one of those, "Amazing Charts" for medical.. Tip, Not so Amazing. Specially when the clies has a custom app that they use that splices into the same database to custom make billing. Whenever you update the software the Billing thing they made falls apart if the SQL database gets a new field added and then can't find anything. Cause you never have to keep Hipaa software current right?

[-]

Chrismscotland@reddit

Funny, we use a system called InTapp which integrates into SharePoint and is meant to be case management for lawyers ( we aren't lawyers so I've no idea who selected it) - its a total nightmare at times as well!

[-]

christurnbull@reddit

worldox stood still on flat files for so long, the world revolved around relational databases and back to flat file. Now they sell a "cloud" service which is uses a super-beefy cpu to index the document database

ours was accessed via citrix which made everything worse.

Did i mention the lawyers wanted to print, a lot?

[-]

BrilliantJob2759@reddit

Printing was also life at one of my past jobs at an accounting firm. One of the owners believed in paper backups and was also a hoarder. When moving locations, we quietly junked 50 banker boxes of old accounting magazines alone.

[-]

z092p@reddit

previous client was using an old old intapp sharepoint DMS version, as soon as i joined a law firm and saw intapp i shuddered

luckily we just use them for time recording 🤣

[-]

reol7x@reddit

I did not need to red this today.

I'm not in charge of it but I will definitely be supporting it...my org is looking at intapp right now.

[-]

Chrismscotland@reddit

I think our main problem with it is that its not built to meet our needs and we were using a very old version - its been alright since I managed to get it brought back up to date. To be fair to them I can't praise their support enough!

[-]

jackievfx@reddit

LEAP was so annoying. It literally pushed me to find a new employer.

[-]

Jaki_Shell@reddit

There is worse.. It could be AASHTOWare Bridge Rating (BrR)

Been in IT almost 2 decades and this thing is so horribly designed, its sad.

Every PC that we have it running on, is also running as a SQL server itsself.....

Then upgrading to the next version up? Good luck, something always breaks and its never the same thing,

[-]

davy_crockett_slayer@reddit

Look into Advanced Packager or Master Packager and re-package the software. It will allow you to remove auto updates, customize the install, and verify the application is stable before a company wide update.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

Ah interesting shout, thank you!

[-]

davy_crockett_slayer@reddit

No problem! Start here. The course material is quite good, and there's a community of people to help you out if you're stuck. https://www.advancedinstaller.com/application-packaging-training/msi-advanced/overview.html

[-]

linknt01@reddit

I used to burn a ton of time managing shit applications like this. In fact I turned it into a whole business. These days, AI is so good I can just point it at my box and find out EXACTLY what settings or log files I need to change.

[-]

ThePodd222@reddit

You have my sympathy. We merged with a small firm who used LEAP and it was pretty bad from what I saw, made worse by their users not keeping very complete or accurate records. We merged their data into our existing practice management system and dumped the licences pretty quickly.

[-]

23-centimetre-nails@reddit

yeah same here, I work at a fleet management company and there's two pieces of software we offer that are probably gonna make me quit in a few months; this awful third party compliance software that we lease to our customers, and the fucking unusable control dashboard for some of our dashcams.

[-]

jayhawk88@reddit

Damn, I had "Trellix" at 3-1 odds...

[-]

sdrawkcabineter@reddit

Where to begin.

So, you can't disable automatic updates, and you have no solution for caching/replication or a versioned updates repository.

You don't utilize VMs or snapshots, and probably don't read the application integration logs.

Yeah, I remember those times.

[-]

DaemosDaen@reddit

I've never dealt with the software, but I just want to point out that your wanting to JUMP SHIP because of a software call LEAP....

🤣

Anyway... Yea we've all dealt with crappy software. Hell I deal with at least two pieces of crappy software that's industry standard. (Tenmast and Adobe CC) I feel the pain man.

[-]

TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

Believe me we've worn out the jokes to the point we even got to Monty Python sketches

https://www.youtube.com/clip/Ugkx-mxXKy1gdf5DDw9ntZn9xz4LVRVy6d6_

[-]

MeccIt@reddit

Oh it's fucking LEAP!

These fuckers' sales people lie through their teeth to get a sale, and then IT people are left trying to support one of the trickiest customers, lawyers who don't know squat.

LEAP was M$ Windows only and I once had an installation running on a Window's VM on a Mac which was hairy enough. Then they upgraded the Mac to Silicon and we drew the line at maintaining an ARM Windows VM just to balance LEAP on. Don't get me started on their Office 365 tenant incompatibilities.

[-]

_c0mical@reddit

I saw the title and thought it was going to be Chrone

[-]

DarraignTheSane@reddit

We've all been there man:

https://www.reddit.com/r/sysadmin/comments/1sokt0t/what_is_a_piece_of_software_or_hardware_that/ogu8n13/

Use this time to learn how things should not be done. Work on getting your resume out there. Don't bail until you've landed something that you feel will be absolutely better, because chances are there will still be some legacy technical debt there too.

[-]

JuanTheMower@reddit

This thread reminds me how much happier I am after leaving an MSP that was in the legal vertical. Fuck lawyers and fuck all these stupid DMS apps that barely work the way they’re “supposed to” (except netdocs, netdocs was surprisingly solid)

[-]

No_Organization_3311@reddit

LEAP is satan. There aren’t many CMS/PMS platforms I didn’t think were godawful - the only one I actually liked was Peppermint, but that was just dynamics with a lawyery reskin. Dynamics is beautiful.

[-]

ExceptionEX@reddit

Yeah man, I would say if this isn't something you can deal with Daily I'm not sure that looking at a different field isn't something you might want to look into. Over decades, nearly every job, has one piece of shit mission critical software that makes you want to claw your eyes out regularly

[-]

Remnence@reddit

Find out the hourly rate of the affected lawyers. Make a little spreadsheet of the lost hours. Show the partners. Enjoy your new software migration.

[-]

KateAnn00@reddit

I think the unpredictability is what really kills morale with software like this.

If something is consistently bad you can at least work around it. But when updates randomly uninstall things, integrations silently break, and support makes it worse, people start dreading opening tickets at all.

Also sounds like classic MSP pain where you become the punching bag for vendor issues you can’t actually control.

[-]

1z1z2x2x3c3c4v4v@reddit

You need to learn not to get so stressed. It is what it is, shitty SW. Nothing you can do about it, except to fix what you can and make your suggestions.

Then you go home and spend the money you made, doing the things you love to do, with the people you love the most.

So, yes, you need to learn not to stress out over it. If you can't on your own, get therapy.

Changing careers won't change the fact that you get too stressed over things you can't control.

[-]

ObjectiveApartment84@reddit

Sounds like Trimble vista

[-]

achelon5@reddit

Lotus Notes used to give me that feeling as a user

[-]

christurnbull@reddit

I'll give notes one thing: it was modular. Know enough javascript and you can customise it to how you need.

[-]

achelon5@reddit

The UI was stuck in a timewarp. Everyone hated it. It is incredible that the product still survives as "HCL Notes"

[-]

christurnbull@reddit

I need my archived emails from 17 years ago!

[-]

dreniarb@reddit

Corp isn't too bad especially if it's small. And especially if the IT team is small. Solo even has it's upsides - there's no one to get permission from for most things, you do it all. And solo has downsides - you do it all so there's no one check you and most importantly no one else to blame.

[-]

pdp10@reddit

While you're still there, you should track down some other end-users of this software and see if your site is an outlier, and what everyone else is doing to mitigate.

[-]

christurnbull@reddit

I have a small number of users with LEAP and i'm glad i'm not responsible for it.

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dopey_giraffe@reddit

I worked for MSPs for eight years and got my first internal role a year and a half ago. I will neverrrrrrrr go back to an MSP as long as I can help it.

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TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

The longer I stay the more with-you I am

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CeC-P@reddit

What does it do that's so special beyond having a folder in Windows on a share for each case and putting all relevant documents inside it then indexing the location in Windows?

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Kraziel2530@reddit

It dumps the files nonchalantly in a prog files folder for user access.

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RikiWardOG@reddit

It is what it is, once you accept that and communicate with them that you're doing what you can then that's all there is to it. I get it's frustrating but it's out of your control, don't dwell on it. You work for lawyers and an MSP that's the real problem lol. Lawyers suck to work for and then getting hit from both sides being an msp... yikes no thanks.

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CatDredger@reddit

Case management software universally sucks.

As someone who has been doing legal it for nearly 2 decades. Non of these all-in-one products are actually one-size-fit-all. In fact, I can confidently say, one-size-fits-no-one.

If you ever get to the point where you get to have some say in these matters, lean towards one-off, specific solutions to attorney problems/workflow.

And for the love of god, do no use their integrated DMS. Get yourself a real DMS and make it mandatory, regardless of where else it is "more convenient"

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Adorable_Knee5569@reddit

Ahh LEAP, the bain of my life for the last two years. The MD decided to sign a 3 year contract with them without our knowledge so we had no choice but to implement it. It is honestly the worst software and customer service I have experienced in my 20 year career. Just kicked off a project to move over to an alternative (any alternative) before the contract expires next year.

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TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

If you've not seen the othe comments Clio is shaping up to be the best alternative

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Adorable_Knee5569@reddit

I have seen them, I believe that is on our list.

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Django_gvl@reddit

Neos by Assembly Software is another choice

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Crenorz@reddit

yea, grow a pair. Unless your the creator or the one programming, your just the implementer and making sure the lights are on guy. Very common to have shit software, or even a great one goes to shit with a single update. Happens all the time. I just did that - told my boss, after this change, these are your options. He was all like - but I want it the way it was. I was SUPPORTIVE, agreeing we "should" be able to go back. But I bet not, BUT I will check. I called support, he called our rep - all to confirm I was right. But he needed to hear it from them. In the end, I looked great and the software company looked bad. That is the best you can hope for. Just make them know - you agree, but you have NO control over what another company does with THEIR stuff.

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moldyjellybean@reddit

Canvas if pretty awful too

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peoplepersonmanguy@reddit

Just keep telling everyone the answer is to reinstall and delete local cache files.

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TheKingOfSpite@reddit (OP)

Been here before have you hahaha

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