Just watched S5E1 for the first time and I have thoughts
Posted by rockandrollfun@reddit | xena | View on Reddit | 18 comments
I’m going through my first real watch through after seeing the first 2-3 seasons in the original run (blab about it here https://www.reddit.com/r/xena/s/CB3QeUC472 and I’m not progressing very quickly at all lol in spite of enjoying it vastly!)
Took a month break between seasons 4 and 5, and it’s a heck of an episode to come back to. I prefer the Greek cheese and not Christian Schmaltz but looking past that, I have a serious question: was Gabrielle really going to let them chop up demon Xena to little pieces for eternity??? She allowed the ambush to happen. I kept expecting her to step in and stop the archangels from trying to get the best of her but it didn’t happen.
Demon X was still really romantic I thought… albeit in that possessed, scary, manipulative sort of way but still kind of romantic wanting to spend eternity together!
Overall_Sandwich_671@reddit
Orpheus was dismembered by Bacchus and they managed to make him whole again, so Gabby must have assumed they'd find a way to restore Xena.
Agent8699@reddit
Worst case scenario, she could just keep Xena’s head around. They could chat, transfer water to one another, etc 😆
Pop_Stensbold@reddit
Fallen Angel is one of my absolute favourites and for me the best season opener of them all. Truly epic and emotional.
Agent8699@reddit
Unfortunately, Gabrielle gets pretty minimal screen time in this episode, especially given everything she goes through. I mean, five minutes ago she was a pacifist, then dead, then a demon and she’s happy to become an archangel! 🗡️
I guess whatever … spiritual conflict she felt about fighting is just magically resolved because Michael tells her it’s okay / offers her the option of becoming an archangel, but it’s still pretty sudden.
As for chopping Xena into little pieces. I believe that Gabrielle planned to stop demon Xena, but she’d never give up on her. So, archangel Gabrielle and demon Xena’s decapitated head would travel around the afterlife as Gabrielle sought a way to make demon Xena just regular old (evil-ish) Xena again.
They were dead, so Gabrielle literally had an eternity to figure out a way to “save” Xena. She knew Xena had managed to save Callisto, so I’m sure Gabrielle figured she could eventually find a way to save Xena too.
rockandrollfun@reddit (OP)
I can buy into her having the optimism that she’d figure it out, someway.
That’s a good point that her pacifism just melted away (being an angel of all things) but… and I get a little confused when the religions and rules about the afterlife mix up… maybe Gabrielle could still hear when the living spoke about her and she heard Eli’s proclamation that the way of peace wasn’t for her?
Agent8699@reddit
Maybe? But, that seemed to be a Tartarus / Elysian Fields rule? And Gabrielle was in … purgatory waiting to be reincarnated within the afterlife real of Eli’s so-called God of Love / Light?
Even if Gabrielle heard Eli, which I find doubtful, I don’t know whether that would be enough to sway her from her prior path of pacifism. It seems to more so boil down to bad writing / underwriting Gabrielle’s character.
As others have pointed out, the extent to which the archangel process changes the personality, thoughts, actions, etc of the individual is also unclear. Xena became extremely compassionate - sacrificing her eternity of reincarnations with Gabrielle to save Callisto for something which Xena had previously denied full responsibility (ie saying she didn’t even know how the fire broke out and blaming the fire and wind for the destruction of Cirra).
So, surely an extra compassionate Gabrielle would be even more driven to save Xena, even if she first has to stop her from conquering heaven?
SakuraTacos@reddit
“In ‘Fallen,’” I started, “the Archangel Michael says that the Demon Xena is beyond saving and must be chopped into little bits to prevent her from taking over Heaven. Gabrielle gave into his decision.”
“Well, that’s a matter of opinion, isn’t it?” she said with a hidden smile in her voice I could read across the miles. “She might have said all right, but I don’t believe Gabrielle would ever be able to chop Xena up into many pieces. I just tried to believe Gabrielle would do what was appropriate at the time. If Xena really had to be destroyed, it would probably have been up to Michael to do it.”
—
Phew, took me a while, I’ve been searching for this quote for you. I knew I’d read Renee talking about this somewhere. Here’s the full interview with a lot more great insight from Renee about the episode: https://www.whenheartscollide.net/magazines-and-newsletters/love-left-on-the-cutting-room-floor
My personal headcanon is that Xena and Gabrielle would have taken turns rescuing each other from Hell and sacrificing themselves over and over for an eternity, or until Michael got sick of it haha
7Clarinetto9@reddit
Make Michael have his own "Been There, Done That" story to tell for eternity. 🤭
SakuraTacos@reddit
“Every day, the rooster crows, Xena flies up from Hell and takes Gabrielle, Xena comes back alone, I make her an Angel, she flies back down to Hell to rescue Gabrielle, Gabrielle comes back alone, then the whole thing starts all over again!”
rockandrollfun@reddit (OP)
“We are going to run out of purifying water at this rate!” - Michael
7Clarinetto9@reddit
But if it resets everyday they shouldn't run out of water. Unless a change in the cycle could cause that to happen like needing to purify a buttload of souls. Oh no, would that mess up everything?
rockandrollfun@reddit (OP)
Let’s see, if it really was repeating then no problem with the two of them. But if they needed a lot, they’d only ever have what was available that day.
By the way this reminds me of something that always bugged me about the movie Groundhog Day. I don’t think the lead character could ever get stronger or more dexterous (like, he learns to toss cards and play concert piano) because his body, muscles and muscle memory would reset every night. Hmmm, except his brain must retain some physical changes or else he wouldn’t remember things from reset to rest.
I tend to overthink things ;)
SakuraTacos@reddit
I never thought of that before! Cuz if his body doesn’t change with aging (he was stuck in that loop for over 30 years!) then it couldn’t have gained any muscle memory or gained any physical skills. Literally unwatchable! lol
7Clarinetto9@reddit
I've never seen Groundhog Day (don't hurt me). I'm guessing the title is because the reset just so happens to be that day of the year?
rockandrollfun@reddit (OP)
Thank you!
Yes, I thought that the “If that’s what must be done” comment before Gabrielle was “purified” was said in a very placating, fingers-crossed-behind-my-back manner, but I was a little surprised she didn’t jump in and somewhat spoil the ambush.
Ha and I totally thought for a second that they would at least swap out once as demons when Gabrielle sacrificed her soul to save Xena!
SakuraTacos@reddit
Yeah, I just imagine, as an angel, Gabrielle got overwhelmed by Xena’s wickedness, while still being filled with love for her + she was purified so she didn’t want the other angels harmed… so she kinda just got caught in the middle of it all
Also, wasn’t Demon Xena’s face right before she takes Gabrielle so stinkin’ cute 🥹
RotaVitae@reddit
Fallen Angel is a weird one because Xena and Gab seem to act really out of character at times. But we're not looking at Xena and Gab as we know them on Earth, we're looking at their souls in this pseudo-Christian afterlife. And Michael says that furthermore as angels, they become extremely sensitive to emotions and risk acting on them with extreme decisions. For instance, Xena never once cried for Callisto's pain on Earth, and even admitted she liked the idea of her living forever with mental anguish as a god. In Heaven, not only is she moved to tears, but she exchanges her life for Hell to see Callisto forcibly redeemed at last.
Demon Xena is motivated by selfishness. She wants Gabrielle with her, because it means she gets her girlfriend, but it also means her Lord gets another demon added to the ranks, win/win.
Angel Gabrielle is motivated by justice, and she sees that unlike Demon Callisto, Demon Xena became the captain of Hell's armies and is leading the assaults on Heaven. With Xena's skills, Hell now has an actual chance of doing great damage to the angelic ranks. Gab's devotion to justice for the cause means Xena must be stopped, despite that she still loves her. Chopping her into pieces would be the most thorough way to stop her.
Neither of these actions are what either of them would take for each other on Earth, but their souls are acting differently in a place influencing them that way. The whole thing about violating the Greater Good for each other doesn't apply here.
OrangeClyde@reddit
They should have won soooo many awards for makeup and costuming for that episode