1,000 horse power electric BMW M3 to be priced 'in same ballpark' as gasoline twin
Posted by kstetter@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 198 comments
Posted by kstetter@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 198 comments
theColeHardTruth@reddit
Translated from PR speak:
"We're going to jack up the gas M3's price to match the EV, since we know you fools will pay that much"
kon---@reddit
EVs are the cars with the jacked up price.
There's a reason they're typically aligned with their ICE counterparts. Manufacturers justify the EV performance as reason to price it alongside their ICE vehicles.
A base M3 Comp with an engine under the hood is $83,500.
$83.5k for a compact EV is a wild ask.
cookingboy@reddit
> $83.5k for a compact EV is a wild task.
If it’s not a wild ask for a compact ICE, why is it a wild ask for an EV?
trickn0l0gy@reddit
Because EVs are wildly more simple to build and maintain. Much less complexity, fewer parts.
cookingboy@reddit
Simpler doesn’t mean it’s cheaper to build. Batteries cost a ton.
And things like no need for maintenance is a reason why consumers are willing to pay more for it
adrr@reddit
Not as much as an engine, transmission, exhaust etc. Why Chinese EVs are so cheap. Battery + motors for EV is gonna be under $8k.
deja-roo@reddit
Chinese EVs are cheap because they are massively subsidized by the Chinese government. They also have cheaper workers.
cookingboy@reddit
The are not subsidized by the government at all. There has never been any direct subsidies. That is literally propaganda.
The only subsidies that were there were industrial subsidies, and the company that benefited the most was Tesla, an American company.
The Chinese EVs are cheap because their entire supply chain that is far more powerful.
As far as labor goes Chinese EV companies pay engineers almost as much as German companies (and for some roles more than German companies) do and factory workers make 2x as much as Mexican auto workers, and American companies build millions of cars in Mexico.
deja-roo@reddit
This article claims that's not true:
https://www.csis.org/blogs/trustee-china-hand/chinese-ev-dilemma-subsidized-yet-striking
What are you basing the claim on that the government doesn't directly subsidize EV production?
HeyyyyListennnnnn@reddit
It does help that the entire supply chain has been subsidized/incentivized for the last 30-40 years. Cheap loans and R&D grants for all kinds of manufacturing have been the norm in China and the reason why competition is so fierce at every level of the supply chain.
cookingboy@reddit
Yes, that's what I meant by industrial policy. What they did was incredible considering it was a very long term play.
HeyyyyListennnnnn@reddit
There were plenty of direct subsidies along the way, just not so much in the "here's some cash to make BEV's" form but in the "Oh, you want to build a factory and train up subsistence farmers? Here's a cheap loan for your contribution to national economic power" form.
adrr@reddit
US and EU have shelled out tens of billions in the same type of incentives. That’s not the reason EU and American EVs will lose. Most important part of the Ev is the battery just like the most important part of the gas car is the engine. It’s the most expensive part of the car but none of EU and US manufacturers own this part of the car. They either use Chinese or Japanese batteries. Why byd dominates and also CATL’s skateboard chassis. BMW uses CATL batteries, they are literally funding their own competition.Tesla is switching to CATL batteries. It’s like if all the gas cars engines came from two Chinese manufacturers who also produced gas cars.
HeyyyyListennnnnn@reddit
They haven't. US and EU might have offered incentives for battery manufacturing, but they didn't offer the same incentives to Aluminium, Nickel, and graphite mills. They didn't offer cheap loans to companies that wanted to set up a factory stamping out control arms, or offer tax incentives to companies extruding copper wire or fabricating transistors.
Comparison of subsidies at the battery manufacturing or vehicle OEM level are superficial and miss the real story behind China's rise. The Chinese government has spent 40 years piling policy upon policy to become the leading manufacturer of everything.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
I really wonder they would keep price advantage after Chinese govt don't support their automakers anymore.
HeyyyyListennnnnn@reddit
They will, simply because the supply chain is incredibly competitive. OEM's have incredible pricing power over their suppliers because there are a seemingly infinite number of lower tier manufacturers willing to make components for whatever price you desire.
cookingboy@reddit
What do you mean anymore? All subsidies have stopped more than a year ago.
adrr@reddit
Byd has plant in Hungary to get around EU tariffs. Still significantly cheaper than EU cars.
stevowns@reddit
Simpler because it ends up with possibly less moving parts yes ONCE everything is in production. You're grossly underestimating how much it costs to develop an ev platform and the cost of batteries in today's market.. not to mention the tooling to mass produce it.
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
No sane person considers the 3 series 'compact' lmao. It's a mid-large sedan.
cookingboy@reddit
Here in America it's absolutely a compact car.
It's slightly bigger than a Honda Civic and smaller than a Honda Accord, the poster child of a mid-sized sedan.
It's not even close to a large sedan, only the 7 series is considered a large sedan here in the U.S. A 5-series is a mid-sized sedan.
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
So you straight up call it a mid size sedan, then call it a compact. How does your brain reconcile that?
cookingboy@reddit
Where did I call it a mid sized sedan?
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
You say it's bigger than a small sedan, then call it a compact, which is smaller than a small sedan. And it's the same class of car as an Accord.
cookingboy@reddit
Where did I say it's the same class of car as an Accord? I said it's slightly bigger than a Civic.
Size wise, it's in the same class of car as the Civic.
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
Bro, BMW makes this really easy, because they use numbered models. The 1 series is their compact. 2 is the small sedan. 3/4 is mid-size. 5/6 is large. 7 is high end luxury. 8 is high end performance. It's really simple.
cookingboy@reddit
1 series does not exist in the U.S.
2 series is what we call sub-compact here.
Just stop arguing. If you don’t live in the U.S, you have no idea what you are talking about.
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
As far as RWD cars go, it absolutely is a compact car. FWD cars are a different story. The 3-series is the same size as my IS on the outside, which is also a compact. If the 3-series is a mid-large, what do you call the 5-series and 7-series? Also, the EPA considers the 3-series (and my car) a compact as well.
kstetter@reddit (OP)
The 3 series is considered a mid-size car in my country
DodgerBlueRobert1@reddit
I understand that. But here in the USA, the 3-series has always been considered "compact" (although the E36 and older were subcompact), while the 5-series is midsize, and 7-series is fullsize.
Temporary_Shirt_6236@reddit
Because EVs are kinda soulless? And the M3 is supposed to be the opposite of that?
BMWbill@reddit
Not sure why you are downvoted. There is no doubt that EV cars are more soulless. They have far less character in the driveline, with linear torque that is at full straight from 0 RPM to like, 20,000 RPM, all the while being nearly silent. I currently drive a Tesla and I will be getting an M-sport i3, but I fully understand why EV supercars and EV motorcycles don't sell well- unlike daily drivers, machines of passion require quirky sounds and start-up procedures and clanking gears.
Temporary_Shirt_6236@reddit
I am getting downvoted because despite its name, this sub is crawling with people who don't see cars as anything more than conveyance from point A to point B. Any opinion other than that is unacceptable. Soulless EVs for soulless people.
BMWbill@reddit
Ah. Well, maybe they all have a point then…. I support your right to have your own opinion of course, but, on the other hand you also seem narrow minded and close minded by that statement. I support the idea that DV cars are certainly more soulless, but are they die people who have no soul? Every EV owner I know personally is a car fanatic. They bought their EV because it’s the best tool for their need. Just as most smart people buy an electric razor. Are they soulless people? Or just smarter people? The EV is the better car for commuting. Most people with a 911 or a Ferrari will have an electric car too. Does that really make them soulless?
disciple31@reddit
The tesla fanboys are so nonsensical its insane. There is no serious comparison between a model 3 performance and an m3 except for some spots on the stat sheet. Theyre different brackets of car
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
They genuinely do not understand that there are aspects of a car that people care about other than power and price.
Kryptus@reddit
Ya this thing better significantly outperform a model 3 performance in every metric.
HighHokie@reddit
It certainly will, but it’s going to be significantly more expensive unfortunately.
banned_from_r_cars@reddit
Issue is that even if it does in performance can the software even be 50% as good?
danemepoznaqt@reddit
Are you actually saying the car that doesn't have carplay/AA has good software? And you are comparing that to the arguably, consistently best infotainment system?
disciple31@reddit
50%? yes it absolutely can lol
Super901@reddit
everything except curb weight
PurpleSausage77@reddit
Yeah…BMW is going to be hefty. Tesla all have aluminum bodies and lots of light weight parts aside from the DC motor and HV battery pack. All built ground up as EV first & only.
Model 3 4000lbs. The gas engine M3 already weighs that much.
Mother____Clucker@reddit
To be fair, it probably will. That said, if they want a 10% premium over the ICE M3, demand probably won't follow.
kstetter@reddit (OP)
3 series are full-size cars
kon---@reddit
They're compact.
I know to the eye they're large enough but, put them next to mid-sized and full sized and you'd see, they're compacts.
2/3/4 series are compact
5/8 series are mid-sized
7 series are full size
cbf1232@reddit
If you look at the actual European classifications, the 1-series and 2-series are considered a "C" segment, which is a "subcompact executive" car in the UK. This is considered "compact" in the USA.
The 3-series is considered a "D" segment, which is "compact executive" in the UK or "mid-size" in the USA.
The 5-series is "E" segment, which is "Executive" in the UK or "Full-size" in the USA.
The 7-series is the "F" segment, which is "full-size luxury" in the USA.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
You can buy LWB 3 and 5 in China IIRC. A LWB 3-Series can be considered true mid-size.
kstetter@reddit (OP)
In my country it's a mid size, my mistake.
In my country it is:
1/2 series are compact
3/4 are mid-size
5/6 are full-size
plz_callme_swarley@reddit
lol what? they'd gladly lower the price of the EV cars if they could be they're just more expensive on the front end.
the reason why no one is buying them now without the check is cuz they're too expensive
strongmanass@reddit
Not my segment so it's moot in some sense, but I'd sooner pay that for the right EV than a comparable ICE car. BMW and whoever else enters the space just need to find the right buyers and adjust volume expectations.
RIP_Soulja_Slim@reddit
Tbf this is the M3 electric variant, not just an electric 3 series. I believe the intent is to have a base 3 series with power comparable to like a model 3 performance that’s priced around 50 or so.
strongmanass@reddit
The current M3 is no more expensive in real terms than any other generation and there's no reason to believe the next one will be any different.
y-u-gae@reddit
The current M3 got a segnificant price increase with the facelift and another price increase 2 years ago.
strongmanass@reddit
For inflation from one year to the next I took the previous year's inflation according to US BLS. So the right-most column tracks the YoY real-term value of the $70,895 price of the M3 in 2021. And even if you just take the inflation-adjusted value of the biggest price hike - from 2022 to 2023 - the inflation-adjusted price is $75,439. So at no point this generation has the M3 gotten more expensive from one year to the next. It's decreased every single year.
y-u-gae@reddit
Your reasoning and calcluations are very wrong. You can't just compare prices to 2026 and add a year of inflation out of thin air, you need to compare prices to the year they were raised in.
For the sake of argument:
Also are we goign to ignore that the current 3-series G20 has been on sale for ages since 2019? Production and development costs have been earned back a long time ago and the car has been getting much cheaper to produce over the past 7 years it has been in production. Are we going to talk about the many downgrades that made the 3-series cheaper to produce over time as well? Like less leather, worse materials, worse ambient light since the 2nd facelift? Are we going to talk about the climate control unit with real buttons that dissapeared into the screen touch interface with the first facelift? The cost cutting they did on the 3-series is crazy and you justify the price.
If anything the 3-series should have gotten cheaper over time not more expensive.
strongmanass@reddit
That's not what I did. I tracked the real value of $70,895 from January 2021 to January 2026, giving the value at 12 month intervals. $70,895 in January 2021 was worth $88,151 in January 2026. The price of the 2026 M3 is $80,650 which is less than the real value of its initial 2021 price. The calculations are from the Bureau of Labor Statistics.
That only compares the price increase to inflation for a given 12 month period (and in all but one case the price increase was less than inflation). But it doesn't fully track the price of the G80 M3 over time. BMW set the price of the G80 M3 in its first year on sale. That price was based on market forces, their R&D, sales projections, etc. Tracking the real value of the initial price BMW set essentially tracks how the M3's price has changed within this generation.
It's $70,895 and that was worth $88,151 in January 2026 according to the BLS. I'm not sure where you're getting $79K.
$73K from January 2021 was worth $83,489 in January 2023. I don't know where you're getting your inflation-adjusted values; they're very different from the BLS and other reputable sources.
You didn't mention the G20 anywhere in your previous comment.
It has gotten cheaper. The 2019 starting price was $41,245 which is worth $53,295 today. The 2026 starting price for the 3 series is $48,850.
y-u-gae@reddit
No thats not what you are doing. You can't take January 2021 prices, you need to take December 2022 prices since until then the M3 was $70k, you are adding a whole 2 years (January 2021-December 2022) of peak inflation out of thin air that did not have a price increase, it was 70k until December 2022, thats the base price! Then MSRP was $75k in January 2023. Again taking January 2021 as your base price is completely wrong. By your logic they predicted inflation in advance each time raising the price before inflation actually happened.
Im using the same calculator as you are. $71k, the MSRP of a M3 in December 2022 is actually $79k in 2026, while the current M3 is $80k.
Tf do you mean didn't mention G20? The M3 G80 is build on the 3-series G20, its the same car, i obviously mean the G80, thats a modified G20.
It has not gotten cheaper if you caluclate it coorrectly as i have demonstrated.
strongmanass@reddit
I took the first time BMW set the G80 M3 price. Them not changing it for 2022 simply means the 2022 car was vastly cheaper than in 2021. Why should I use December 2022 just because BMW didn't change the price? Inflation still happened. The fact that BMW chose not to price it into the 2022 year is their problem.
I'm tracking the value of a sum of money starting with the first time BMW set the G80 M3 price. Separately, I'm looking at the price of an M3 each year. I'm then looking at which value is greater.
Yes, that's how businesses decide pricing strategy.
The G20 is a different model code with a different price and a different release year. You mentioned only G80 initially.
What you did is ignore that inflation happened just because BMW didn't change the price of the M3.
samuraijon@reddit
I don’t understand your inflation adjusted price. Wouldn’t 2026 be equal and you want to refer everything with respect to current price and not 2021 price?
didimao0072000@reddit
You’re right. That guy is using a bizarre way to calculate “inflation” that doesn’t make sense and isn’t used by anyone. A 2021 BMW M3 priced at $70,895 would be $131,688 today when adjusted inflation.
strongmanass@reddit
The inflation-adjusted price for a given year is the previous year's inflation-adjusted price plus 12 months of inflation. So the 2022 inflation-adjusted price is the 2021 price plus inflation. 2023 applies inflation to that 2022 value, etc. It's the value of a bucket of ~$71K in cash at yearly points from 2021 to now.
The value for 2026 is the 2025 inflation-adjusted price plus inflation. It's what $70,895 from 2021 was worth in January of this year - i.e. what the M3 would cost this year if the 2021 price tracked inflation every year. Hypothetically, if you had $71K in 2021 and put it in an account that tracked inflation, and then used that money to buy a 2026 M3 in January, you'd have money left over.
GeneralMotorsV8@reddit
always that one brother pulling the inflation card
the_lamou@reddit
You mean "doing it right instead of going off of vibes"?
strongmanass@reddit
Because it's the only way to compare prices over time. Otherwise we may as well talk about the days of 10 cent gallons of milk.
geko29@reddit
The E30 was by FAR the most expensive in current dollars. G80 roughly $1500 more expensive at launch than the prior 3 generations at their respective launches in real terms.
Base MSRP at launch, with 2026 equivalent in parentheses:
The 2027 is cheaper in real dollars than any generation was at launch, including its own.
Immediate_Bee_6472@reddit
Where did u get these numbers ? Cars are absolutely more expensive today and the buying power of the same dollar is 50% of what is was in 2001
Alternative Metric: Using Personal Consumption Expenditures (PCE)—the Fed's preferred metric—$45,000 in 2001 is equivalent to roughly $77,213 in 2026.
A fact of life is once prices go up they are never coming down .. never even if they could why would they lower the price ? Pandemic opened the flood gates and it’s no going back ..shitboxes that would rot are now 3-4k
strongmanass@reddit
Yeah people who say it's gotten more expensive aren't looking at the big picture. Another nuance is that keeping the price flat makes expensive cars like this more affordable for the target buyer because someone who could afford a $100K car in 1988 has seen huge growth in income and net worth over that time.
Put another way, take the income and net worth for the e.g. 80th percentile individual/household from 1988 and compare their income and net worth against inflation. Income/net worth have way outpaced inflation, which means these people have more disposable income for an M3.
shlerm@reddit
Interestingly the M3 price stays fairly stable with inflation. Until the latest g80 model, which in 2021 is already ahead of the inflation calculator at £98k (£75k in 2021). Whilst nearly every model cost at new from 1985 come to £75k/78k in today's money.
SerialExperimentLean@reddit
We don't get the base M3 in the UK anymore though, only the 4wd competition. Unless I'm missing something it starts at £91k on the BMW website too
braytag@reddit
Let me introduce you to the id.buzz
Martbern@reddit
The Buzz is not similar at all
braytag@reddit
The EV can't be significantly more expensive because that will blunt its appeal.
an EV that would have been a smashing success if it was not overpriced.
Martbern@reddit
Depending on your market, the ID Buzz isn't necessarily badly priced at all. It's the first version of its type and will come down on price over time.
It is selling quite well in Norway, where the ICE counterpart quickly matches it in price while having less equipment and comfort.
Kia PV5 has recently appeared as an alternative.
FourEyesAndThighs@reddit
And had a decent range. 220 miles (less than 200 in the real world) is just stupid for what is supposed to be a road trip/recreational vehicle. The only camping you're gonna be doing is in your driveway while it's charging.
Aggressive_Hat_9999@reddit
the id buzz happened because auto unions absolutely forced their will
management wanted to scrap it
outlawsix@reddit
The car thats getting cancelled in the US after a year? You think BMW is following VW's lead?
Parcours97@reddit
The VW T7 is more expensive than the ID Buzz. What are you even on about dude?
willpc14@reddit
Is that really unexpected with how expensive it is to get engines through current emissions regulations?
strongmanass@reddit
1) That's been the case for several years already.
2) There's some, but not huge, elasticity at that end of the sports car market. Auto makers still need to hit a price point or sales will tank.
3) BMW said the B58 and S58 meet the latest Euro regs, so that engine R&D is essentially paid for.
Ok_Explorer604@reddit
Yeah, I can't imagine BMW would offer Model S Plaid performance for the same price, or cheaper. If they do, the dealers will mark it up to the high heavens for years.
Kryptus@reddit
The model 3 performance is gonna make this thing look like a bad value I'd imagine. For 55k you get a 2.9 0-60.
Spa_5_Fitness_Camp@reddit
If you don't care about the chassis or interior at all, sure. The Model 3 is hardly a dynamic masterpiece, even by EV standards.
xlb250@reddit
I wouldn’t say the interior is better
x3nhydr4lutr1sx@reddit
M3P will win on curb weight, price, and tech, but lose on every other metric. At track days, weight is king, so I suspect M3P will still dominate, if only to save on tire and brake costs.
I'm personally gonna be torn between the two once iM3 is released, we'll see.
element515@reddit
BMW tech is pretty good. Other than hands free self driving, idk rather the bmw UI and CarPlay than teslas
LegendaryOutlaw@reddit
When it comes to track performance, I think the difference between an EV M3 and a M3P will be in the tuning. Teslas are known to heat up quickly and then cut power to conserve the drivetrain and battery health. Even if you introduce extra cooling, the computer decides without even looking at working temps, it just assumes if you've been running full throttle for a while that the car is getting hot and limits output.
I'm betting the BMW won't do that, they'll probably have different ECU maps set up for track use, so that the car can go for longer than the Tesla without limiting power.
But the M3P is tough to beat if you're looking for a well priced and comfortable daily driver that can also deliver 90% of the performance of an M3. I've had my 2018 model for a long time, and will likely buy a new M3P when it's time to trade in.
x3nhydr4lutr1sx@reddit
BMW will definitely have faster track times, not denying that. But brakes and tires money becomes more important as track time increases.
My 2026 is also the first time I replaced an older car (2019) with the exact same model and trim, it's just that good a daily driver. In fact, wife claims it more often just because of the FSD 😭.
y-u-gae@reddit
The current BMW M3 already beats the Model 3 in every metric and is just as fast 0-60, faster 62-124mph. The M3 EV with double the power will humiliate it, lets be real here.
KSoMA@reddit
BMW makes cars to order. Allocations are a little tight for M cars but not markup tight. You will have an easier time buying an M3 EV below MSRP than you would a CTR with $1k markup.
kstetter@reddit (OP)
BMW is competing with Chinese brands in Europe, which have more power than Tesla at cheaper prices.
Kryptus@reddit
Most people with M3 money in Europe want status and wont be proud of a Chinese car regardless of specs.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Anyway, they still need to keep up because more Chinese automakers are serious to take their market share. Of corse, we highly sure most Europe car buyers would stay their domestic automakers, but it could change in their biggest car market China.
strongmanass@reddit
Dealer markup only works if there are people willing to buy the car over MSRP. I don't think that will be the case for the M3 EV and I don't think BMW dealers will try it. The only time dealer markup for EVs happened successfully was during Covid shortages.
india2wallst@reddit
Get this man to BMWs marketing division
Bigringcycling@reddit
The sticker price is the same but then you’ll need to pay a $1000/monsubscription to unlock the steering wheel.
Lower_Kick268@reddit
BMW people are wild, they could jack up the price 40k and sell just as many cars even though they're not that good
strongmanass@reddit
Its cool to hate BMW on car forums, but what are you basing that on? Pick any current BMWs and compare it to its direct predecessor post-Neue Klasse (original). I doubt you'll find any price increases.
Lower_Kick268@reddit
Compare any current BMW to cars in the same category made by other manufacturers and they're not good deals.
strongmanass@reddit
Like Mercedes and Audi, which are BMW's direct competitors? The BMW is always priced in the middle and almost always the performance winner.
Lower_Kick268@reddit
Compare to Cadillac and they're not good deal
AwesomeBantha@reddit
Disagree. The M3/M4 CSL were like $145k+ MSRP, supposed to be desirable limited editions, but they were hard to sell new and apparently even discounted at one point. If people won’t spend that on a CSL, they won’t spend it on a base M3/4.
Same could be said about the XM, BMW though they knew how to grab marketshare from the G63, whose buyers are still paying over sticker, but it turns out BMW doesn’t know how to pull that off.
Recoil42@reddit
I mean, yeah, that's literally how the EU regulations work. You have an emissions pool and gasoline cars pay if they're outside of the (very stringent) EU requirements. The gas M3 is taxed highly, the EV M3 isn't.
iching66@reddit
please stop the hp hike... make the car better instead
HoldingForGenova@reddit
By all reports, the iX3 and i3 are phenomenal EVs. So they're doing the thing you're complaining about them not doing...
Aerospaced0ut@reddit
The weight is what'll hold it back which is 90% battery weight... May as well get every KW possible out of the battery they use.
V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit
Sadly, more car buyers in these days think big hp meaning best, they don't look how these car weight and chassis setting.
strongmanass@reddit
The four motors are to make it better. With electric motors you don't gain much by selecting a weaker one over a more powerful one, so if you decide you want the dynamic advantages of powering each wheel independently, by default you'll have a wildly powerful car. But driving modes with different power output are easier than with ICE, so you can get the dynamic benefits of four motors while also having a somewhat tame driving mode.
bestmaokaina@reddit
Bmw: Best we can do is increase the screen size and keep removing buttons
Jimbenas@reddit
I feel like I can barely accelerate with the current 500hp offered. I need the 1000
stupidber@reddit
Won't be the same ballpark for the 2nd owner
Smileboy67@reddit
Influencers already have enough issues with a 500ish HP M3, what is going to happen with something double that and instant torque.
Clover-kun@reddit
The Model S Plaid has been out for half a decade
Aerospaced0ut@reddit
Isn't it like $120K with the brake package necessary to actually stop the dang thing? M3s are typically closer to $80K. Even at $90K they'll sell a lot more than Tesla sells Plaids.
LongjumpingLock5875@reddit
If you can turn off the Front motors or something and make it RWD only like the current M cars, that could be an issue.
That is a big reason so many people crash them, they turn it to RWD only, turn off traction control, and send it into the nearest barrier.
rugbyj@reddit
The trick is to send it into the furthest barrier. Can take weeks.
Clover-kun@reddit
It's laughably easy to turn off the front motor and traction control to enable full blown drift mode with S3XY buttons
mynamejeff-97@reddit
Probably not a lot because it will likely be all wheel drive. Skill issues aren’t as apparent when both axles are driven. Imagine if F1 was all wheel drive.
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
This is my most anticipated car in a while. The iX3 hits all the right points for range and charging speed to really be practical for my needs, and I’m hoping the switch to a sedan form for the M3 offsets the range hit from all the performance trimmings to make it still hit that 350-400 mile range.
WesKidFresh@reddit
Id CONSIDER trading my id4 and my f83 if it's truly fun. Not sure I can give up the stick shift + vert combo for the weekends.
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
I’ll be keeping the NSX forever no matter what for that reason.
Aerospaced0ut@reddit
Disregard my prior comment lol
strongmanass@reddit
Neue Klasse i4 convertible rumors are still going strong.
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
Aw man if that’s real then I have to wait for that.
Aerospaced0ut@reddit
Keep the NSX forever, tho
AmNoSuperSand52@reddit
Considering how new the EV6 and Charger are wouldn’t it be more economical to just get rid of one of them for now. Depreciation is going to hit like a truck
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
Charger is already on a lease with heavy discounts. I won’t be buying it out when it’s done, my TCO for the car will be $20k when it goes back to the dealer and that’s fine by me.
The EV6 is old enough that it’s already taken most of its depreciation hit and so I don’t really care about maximizing the value I get out of it. The difference between selling it now and a year or two from now is gonna be only a few thousand dollars.
SilviOnPC@reddit
Really really hoping it will be absolutely tremendous in every way so I can snag a G80 M3 comp for 50k.
stulogic@reddit
I could be quite tempted for daily fun. If they do a touring eventually I'll be doing everything I can to get one.
xlb250@reddit
Modern BMW is awesome for daily fun. The steering/chassis connects you to the driving experience.
rugbyj@reddit
They will be.
^(Location dependent.)
Baby-girl-54321@reddit
Sounds great on paper, but if it’s heavy and numb, it won’t replace the gas M3 experience.
SarcasticOptimist@reddit
Fwiw the i4 feels better to drive than the plug in 3 series. I trust BMW to at least make it better than the awful x1.
PurpleSausage77@reddit
Love how 700-1000hp is just a casual HP range for EV daily drivers now. Just efficient af beasts.
SarcasticOptimist@reddit
It feels weird having 825hp. Granted I'm basically always in comfort mode. Even launching the 600hp Touring spec feels absurd.
cookingboy@reddit
Awesome. This will be my next daily driver
SarcasticOptimist@reddit
The i4 is the right size but the range and packaging were deal breakers. The i3 looks like they learned the right lessons from it. I'm surprised how well BMW adjusted to EVs compared to Porsche or Honda.
A_Pointy_Rock@reddit
That is so vague.
A top trim, fully outlined ICE M3 costing around the same as a base model EV M3 could be labelled as "in the same ballpark".
phxees@reddit
Here’s how it works:
Journalists: How much will this car cost?
BMW: We aren’t ready to announce pricing yet.
Journalists: Will the ICE and EV versions have the same pricing?
BMW: Uhhh They will be in the same ballpark.
Most Journalists: Oh so they are the same price, that’s news.
A few Journalists: Wow everyone’s writing they are the same price, hmmm I heard they’ll be in the same ballpark, so I’ll write about that.
Car Enthusiasts: Screw BMW for trying to manipulate us.
LongjumpingLock5875@reddit
Yea, the price delta between the base, and top trim fully loaded M3 is pretty crazy.
I see people constantly figuring out how to spend more and more on the same car lol.
Starts at $80k for the manual M3, but you can get a fully loaded version into the upper $120k range with Individual interior and exterior colors.
Ok-Improvement-3670@reddit
Especially considering that they will be making 3-4 different M3s
costafilh0@reddit
I'll wait for the 3000 HP version.
rugbyj@reddit
M3000.
Odd-Staff6245@reddit
My microwave and Weber Kettlen a are around the same price, but I rather have a hamburger made in a microwave said no one ever
Trollygag@reddit
In that color, yes please
ConfusedTapeworm@reddit
It's not an M3 unless it's in oxford green, it's just sparkling 330Ci.
Trollygag@reddit
German car in Bri'ish racing color
SnooTigers6088@reddit
And with that grill thanks
KSoMA@reddit
This wouldn't be too shocking. Similarly equipped, you can get a i4 xDrive 40i for a similar price to a M440iX. Same with the iX3 xDrive 50 vs the X3 M50.
WIP1992@reddit
Don’t care if it’s 2000hp I’ll take an M3 Comp over an M3 Duracell Edition any day
pleasedonotredeem@reddit
HELLYA BORTHER EVS ARE 4 SOFTHAND LIBRULS
Activehannes@reddit
Can confirm. Am librul, lick duracells every day
CallLivesMatter@reddit
It hasn’t been about this for 20 years, why start now?
M3Core@reddit
Yawn.
cabs84@reddit
in before soulless microwave
YellowFogLights@reddit
Ballparks are massive
rugbyj@reddit
Enough room to swing a bat.
nathanforyouseason5@reddit
But not enough room to contain the ball within foul range
nolongerbanned99@reddit
Funny writing. This says there are 16 motors the way they wrote it. ‘Set to feature four electric motors driving each wheel’
kstetter@reddit (OP)
BMW is transitioning from having I6 engines to 16 motors.
nolongerbanned99@reddit
Makes good sense.
CorporalClegg@reddit
But are all 4 motors for each wheel inline? I don't want any v4 motor crap
ExtruDR@reddit
This will be great. I fully anticipate that the ICE M3 will get all the love, especially among reviewers, and sales will also track this if the costs come in roughly the same. I can also see the ICE M3 also depreciating less... which is where it gets more exciting for me.
A four-year-old EV M3 for the same money as a new 4-cylinder 3-series? Yes please! I am that guy that the used EV would appeal to when it hits the under $50k price point.
Mysterious-Lick@reddit
And it’ll depreciate way faster.
Wait for a used one.
K_R_A_K_E_N_540@reddit
I love how before Tesla came along the German car brands would do 10-20hp incremental HP bumps with each new model or facelift. All of a sudden we can have near 300hp Priuses and 1000hp M cars
Trollygag@reddit
2010 M3 was 410 hp
2015 M3, Tesla had long been out, 425 hp
2020 M3, Tesla had been making cars for almost 10 years, 480 hp
2025 M3, Tesla out for almost 15 years, 473-525hp
2027 M3, 525hp, or 900 from EV
Nero_Wolff@reddit
Honestly 400-500hp is enough for a mid sized daily driver sedan
mastawyrm@reddit
Yep that's about the point where even tires too performance oriented to daily will need traction control at speeds below the speed limit. Going much higher requires awd or is only useful on track. Give me 300-400hp and work on lower weight all day.
Nero_Wolff@reddit
Requires AWD and/or very stick and/or very wide tires which then increases road noise
I’m loving the 415hp + RWD of the E90 M3 and really wish modern equivalents existed with an NA V8 of around this power
A Coyote or GM NA pushrod V8 in a midsize RWD sedan with a manual would be awesome. CT5 Blackwing exists but its overkill
kstetter@reddit (OP)
A cheap full-size daily driver sedan used to make 250hp for a base model in the 2000s, back when they were still popular.
Nero_Wolff@reddit
I was talking in the context of M3s and their direct competitors
Of course for a normal car like a Camry, 400+ hp is way overkill
ryencool@reddit
Hell the 272 in my 2023 RWD model 3 feels like a ton in 95% of situations.
Nero_Wolff@reddit
280-300 is good too depending on weight, I was moreso talking in the context of M3s and their direct competitors
I’d hav no interest in a 1000hp M3
kstetter@reddit (OP)
That little? a base model Holden Commodore was making 230 horsepower in 2004. No hate to the Model 3, it's a nice car.
I thought it would make more since Tesla is a luxury brand and everyone talks about how powerful they are.
bigloser42@reddit
WTF are you talking about?
E30 M3 - 192hp
E36 M3 - 240hp(+48hp)
E46 M3 - 333hp(+93hp)
E90 M3 - 420hp(+87hp)
F80 M3 - 425hp(+5hp but gained 111lbs-ft)
G80 M3 - 473hp(+48hp)
The M3’s smallest hp gains happened in the Tesla era.
MamaSendHelpPls@reddit
The prius seems good for 196 HP, IDK how that's near 300.
OwnPermission95@reddit
Has more to do with WV powertrains. The amount of engineering required to make a 1k hp ev is nothing compared to some kind of twin turbocharged v8-10 making the same.
ilovechoralmusic@reddit
Hp does not matter on the European market. The average European drives a car with 120 HP.
Clover-kun@reddit
Not really news, BMW's current EVs are already very similar in pricing to their gas cars
daredaki-sama@reddit
lol EV version cost more?
noSSD4me@reddit
RIP the legends of I6 and V8 M3's, you'll be missed...
GasManMatt123@reddit
Not a big reader huh?
noSSD4me@reddit
Not really, no
bestmaokaina@reddit
Incoming 99K base M3
Least_Confidence_225@reddit
1000hp electric M3 priced like a gas M3? That's either a miracle or marketing speak
Maximilianne@reddit
RIP cars and coffee visitors
Lower_Kick268@reddit
That's a BMW? It looks like a Pontiac
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
It’s a hypothetical render from the magazine.
Lower_Kick268@reddit
I hope they end up changing the design
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
The iX3 looks great I’m sure they’ll have a good design for it.
Lower_Kick268@reddit
No it doesn't lol, it looks like a shittier Alfa Romeo, BMW's design language is absolutely terrible rn on their electric cars.
SharkBaitDLS@reddit
The iX3 has proper kidney grilles again finally. I get that some people liked the era of giant grills from BMW but I’m happy to see them return to original form.
kstetter@reddit (OP)
Pontiac's grilles look amazing
Lower_Kick268@reddit
This car is so ugly tho, look at the article and a photo of a late Pontiac Sunfire
isysopi201@reddit
Can I just get 333whp at each axle?
sleepyguy007@reddit
lets call it now... the 3 year depreciation will not be in the same ballpark.
SchnitzelTruck@reddit
We've gotten to the point where power is just an irrelevant number with no functional difference.
TheAntiAirGuy@reddit
Same price like a Xiaomi Su7 Ultra ... BMW, maybe?