Linux only usable thanks to LLM's
Posted by Ok-Arm-8412@reddit | linux | View on Reddit | 172 comments
I'm currently using Ubuntu on my x1 carbon gen 7. It's great, feels so much snappy, touch pads more responsive, battery lasts longer and the fans hardly spool up.
BUT this is all only possible because of LLM's, I ask the LLM to help me install the thing i'm trying to achieve and it also problem solves when I run into issues. There's no way i'd of figured out how to complete most installs let alone the following just to run android.
- Add a custom repository
- Initialise a containerised Android system
- Install GApps via a community Python script
- Drop into an Android shell
- Query an SQLite database
- Convert hex to decimal to satisfy Google's registration form
But when you do get it all up and running it's a pretty powerful tool. I'm just not sure Linux has a chance to ever become a serious operating system for consumers because it's so much work. Makes me appreciate what Microsoft and apple have to do in order for normal people to be able to do things.
But i applaud how good LLM's are, in my case Claude. Makes things so easy.
For the experts here, how do you figure this stuff out, how good is your memory to remember all the different things you have to do, how do you figure it out when you don't know? Look forward to the comments.
ricjuh-NL@reddit
RTFM
tuxooo@reddit
you asked an LLM how to install Ubuntu ?! Really ? The Linux Distribution that is about 100x easier to install than windows ?! Seriously ? are you not exaggerating slightly or like a lot ? Literally pressing next next next next and done, then you have a installation with office, browser, and other generic stuff installed out of the box ON your toolbar without anything to do?!
dude ... people are really going backwards.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
This is objectively false. Neither of us are exaggerating at all. Windows is genuinely clicking "okay" a handful of times and being done. That's the START of a Linux install.
If you want to replace an LLM and be on our beck and call personally, great. If not, you do not have the right to tell us how to research.
tuxooo@reddit
one more fun fact:
Time Comparison: USB Boot to Desktop
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
Active interaction doesn't mean matching abilities, getting Linux to okay nice takes longer than 11 minutes. Background processing had nothing to do with how straightforward installation is. I don't know where you get your 8 vs 25 numbers from but factor in getting as much to work as Windows does out of the box AND the time required to fuck with the live usb install to ensure compatibility BEFORE even starting the OS install And things get even enough that doesn't matter. And we're taking about ease of install not time to install And in my experience the install options were more opaque on linux Linux is superior, that's WHY it takes more effort and knowledge. That's going to be true without claiming it doesn't require more effort.
tuxooo@reddit
windows does it out of the box ? What the 5 pages of toggles for collecting information, the set up for accounts, the impossibility of offline installation, the must set up of Microsoft account for cloud etc ? out of the box ? dude stop shilling. Just say you prefer microsoft, dont go out of your way to twist facts.
Install windows 11 today, and Ubuntu on a fresh installation on a fresh drive. I dare you. Put a timer and a video. Post it. Il bet money it. In fact stream it. I will give you money to cover your time IF Ubuntu takes as much or more than windows to install on a fresh partition. I bet it will be close to the statistics i posted.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
It's not about time, it's about complexity. I don't remember doing much to set up my account. Online or not is irrelevant as I'm always online. Other issues with being online are irrelevant to installation. I don't remember having to install Microsoft cloud. Even if i did, disabling it is STILL easier than installing and configuring Linux. I'm not shilling but i appreciate the ad hominem. If you had a valid argument you wouldn't need to reduce yourself to accusations. I'm not "shilling" for Microsoft. To me, comparing Linux to Windows is like comparing Macintosh to Windows. One's a tricycle, the other's a crotch rocket. More dangerous, harder to drive, but still the better option.
tuxooo@reddit
As i said another person here (and this is coming from a person who used windows more than you did PROBABLY, by a long mile and was in the insider program for many years), a bee cant convince a fly that honey is better than shit. I dont know what else to tell you. Enjoy windows though, to each his own.
SunlightScribe@reddit
I don't want to entirely dispute this, but Secure Boot tends to throw a wrench into things. I've recently installed CachyOS alongside Windows and it took me hours to figure out how to get it to boot because my BIOS refused to recognize the bootloader I had chosen. Not to mention I had to sign keys.
Maybe I'm cursed, but I seem to always run into various hardware quirks that turn a 10 minute job into a day long affair. The world seems to bend over backwards for Windows while Linux users have to fight just to get to the login screen.
tuxooo@reddit
That is a separate topic. I am comparing clean installs on a clean system, separately. You are putting an abstraction on top of things.
Try installing Windows after Linux, you will have the same issue, then windows becomes the problem.
tuxooo@reddit
Click Comparison: USB Boot to Browser
Assumes a standard installation on a single-drive system without custom partitioning.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
I didn't think clicking a mouse was a relevant metric for installing an entire operating system 🤷
tuxooo@reddit
No ? What do you call clicking next few times and finish ? With the installation process being literally it. No partitioning for fresh ubuntu installation (as you can use automatic), no nothing else?
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
I had to partition. And i would have some the same with Windows otherwise, your comment made no sense 🤷
tuxooo@reddit
Of course it did not. How could it.
tuxooo@reddit
Bonus fact:
Comparison Summary
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
Subjective and irrelevant.. Those are features. Testing it in live mode is now difficult and involved for someone new. I've never needed to download/update a Windows drive in Windows 10/11. The online requirement isn't about ease of install, everyone's already online anyway
Overall feel: Windows: just works Ubuntu: hope you're a jacket who knows command line. OR, and this is particularly relevant: you ask an LLM
tuxooo@reddit
I used windows since 95 up to 11 including, i was in the early access program, i had every single windows including server windows. I had vista, 8, all the bad ones as well and i was fine with them.
Windows does NOT simply just work.
I am using linux for 2 years now exclusively, I had 1 issue. Microsoft office works, in cloud and with work around or free office suites that does EXACTLY the same thing. Adobe products work in a web environment 1:1 as the web based (I use lighroom for RAW editing).
The ONLY! problematic thing is kernel level anti cheat games.
STOP inventing with your old ass information.
I have full AMD setup for my CPU and GPU, on my laptop and my desktop, i dont even have to install drivers for anything. IT JUST WORKS, plug and play after installation. Fuck out of here with your windows needs 3 hours of installing updates and drivers AFTER i made a fresh installation. And you have pre installed candy crush, recall, copilot (everywhere for that matter even in notepad), xbox live, and microsoft teams + 100 other bullcrap. Enjoy.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Not to install ubuntu, but arguably that's another thing consumers would have to get their head around. Partitioning correctly etc etc. It's installing the apps you want within it.
You may be a programming expert. I am not. 95% of the windows/mac user base will be not.
DonaldMerwinElbert@reddit
This has absolutely nothing to do with programming.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Fair enough. But you do need to know a shit load of commands that you don't coming from windows or mac os.
tuxooo@reddit
using ubuntu you literally have to know ... nothing. After clicking next and finish 5 times, you open your browser and open youtube and start to brain rot.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
you've literally given up even trying
tuxooo@reddit
Looking at YOUR deleted post by yourself, and the massive downvotes you got for the bullshit you said... yeah, sure buddy, whatever you say.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I didn’t delete it. The auto mods have temporarily removed it due to people flagging it.
I’m not worried about down votes. It’s amazing how many people have become triggered.
You may be pleased to know you’re winning that game lol
tuxooo@reddit
I am sure you are not worried about votes mate. As I have already told you, a bee cant convince a fly that honey is better than shit. Thus our conversation concludes on this note.
tuxooo@reddit
so you mean to tell me these are not your words ? where you clearly and specifically say that you used LLMS to install ubuntu and ONLY thanks to them you managed to do it ?
Again ... are you not exaggerating, like a LOT ?
consumers will have to wrap around clicking next ? You serious dude ? Windows has over 10x time more complicated installation process for years. Hands down, no arguing at all.
literally an automated process for ubuntu, you have to do absolutely jack shit if you want to.
yeah ... every time i hit next next next i am hacking the world trade center, the KGB and the NSA at the same time on every click next. When i click install or finish the world is in the palm of my hands with my superb hacking skills.
you are right homie ... i got you messed up with someone else who did still have some cognitive abilities ... I was wrong, I am sorry.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
i'm not sure we're reading the same thing.
But more importantly, ignoring this post. Everything ok? you've come in pretty hefty.
tuxooo@reddit
I'm allergic to bullshit, sorry. I got a instant rash, when exposed to idiocracy.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Makes no sense. You've got overly protective.
tuxooo@reddit
Sure buddy. A bee cant convince a fly that honey is better than shit, what can I tell you.
tooclosetocall82@reddit
Just be careful about what you are running in a shell. LLMs have been known to suggest unsafe things, and without much experience you may not catch it.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Noted. And the most likely thing to catch me out.
Ok-Winner-6589@reddit
Windows also ask for partition. If you want to dualboot you have to create partitions whatever you use Windows or Linux
And Ubuntu has default partitions, even Arch has them
NursingHome773@reddit
Uhmm what. People without any Linux skills have done what you have done with LLM's for decades.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Not disputing this. But that user base was tiny and reserved for the true experts. With the advent of claude code no doubt it's helping with the progression, but also giving access to normies like myself.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
"I'm not helping you, use Google" *Uses Google "No not that way! And no, I'm still not gonna help you!"
Linuxologue@reddit
You are disputing it in your very title
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
From a general consumer's experience ... maybe i need to be more specific?
Linuxologue@reddit
My mom is on Linux. She knows nothing about computers. Or LLMs.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
But her son or daughter appear to be an expert?
Linuxologue@reddit
Fair enough I see how that could be interpreted like that. it was not installed by me and I live about 1500km away from my mom, so I don't actually provide support.
She would not have been able to install it alone, but she would not have been able to install Windows either.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
I also never could have done it without an LLM but with the LLM it was very much worth the trouble. I have 3 computers, all on linux. 2 on kde plasma, 1 on mint xcfe(10 year old i3, plenty for Google drive) I switched from Windows when i stopped playing video games. I'll never look back.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I'm really enjoying the experience but I do put this down to the help from LLM's.
Appreciate your comment.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
I literally would not bother with Linux without the LLM. I'm not spending 10 times longer to research basics just to run an OS.
Journeyj012@reddit
could you have googled "how to add custom repository ubuntu" and done it that way?
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Just tried it. Ignoring Gemini, you have to trawl through pages of forums. Top 2 searches are from 2022 and 2015.
DiScOrDaNtChAoS@reddit
top search was literally the answer, are you stupid?
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
Simple rule: If you do the "let me Google that for you" you're saying "ask someone else, I'm not helping."
So that is exactly what I'm going to do. I've heard that shit for decades. You wanted me to look it up, I'm looking it up MY way, the way that involves asking ONE quickly answered question, not digging. This is what people wanted when they told me to Google. So it's what I'm doing. Help me or don't, but if you don't help, you don't get to tell me where i can get help from. And i guarantee you there are still assholes who say "Google it" and you go to an llm and they say "noooo not that way".
DiScOrDaNtChAoS@reddit
One thing that separates intelligent people from the rest is the learned helplessness that comes from refusal to do your due dilligence first.
r_daniel_oliver@reddit
LLLM is my due diligence. He'll one of the LLMs IS Google. So u find it especially hilarious when the same person says "google it" but then are like "not that way only my way" 🤣🤣🤣 Not enough to tell you they won't help, they also tell you who you can't ask for help? Nope.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Agree
iamakorndawg@reddit
To be fair, when I just googled that exact phrase the top result is a Stack Exchange post titled "How to create a local APT repository?" which is.... not the same thing.
OP, please take the time to understand everything the LLM tells you. That is the only way to get to a point where you no longer need the AI for basic tasks.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
This is exactly how I use and LLM. I don't use it to just answer questions, it's like have a teacher on hand 24/7 answering anything you want.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
lols
Journeyj012@reddit
the reason the top 2 searches are that new is because it hasn't really changed in a long time.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Fair enough
smashing_michael@reddit
It's great that an LLM has made Linux more accessible to you.
It's a shame that you made the decision that Linux has no chance, or whatever, before actually learning anything for yourself, but hey, we needed more opinions from people who can't Google or read docs anyway.
But who reads directions anyway when you can just ask an LLM, then conclude that Linux is unusable without them?
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Can you honestly say that linux will get serious traction with consumers if they have to manage via a terminal?
I can foresee LLM's assiting you clever lot to develop the distro's to windows/mac os levels of simplicity but without the bullshit. THEN i could imagine a world where linux is viable for the normal population. I hope it happens.
FeelThePoveR@reddit
The thing is they don't have to do that. On Fedora the only things that I had to do from the terminal are - installing the media codecs and installing the Nvidia drivers, the rest I could manage from the KDE Discover store app.
BUT if for example I chose the number 1 recommended distribution for newbies (Mint) then I wouldn't have to interact with the terminal at all as they have a GUI installer for everything (including Nvidia drivers and media codecs management).
That's the beauty of Linux, you have every flavor available for you - you can run Mint with Cinammon for a streamlined experience, you can run Arch with Hyperland if you want to tinker and screw around in the terminal or you can go with Fedora KDE or Cachy if you want something in-between for example.
I think you have a warped perspective, on one hand you say that LLMs and terminal was necessary for Linux to work for your usecase and that by extension it's not really viable for an average consumer - I strongly disagree with that.
In my opinion out of the box experience on Linux in general is excellent. You get to try out the system before installing it, the install install has less menus to go through than on Windows (and you can actually install it with a local account without terminal oobe bypasses lol).
After the install you don't "need" to do anything. You have a system with batteries included for basically every device that you can plug into it, so there's not fumbling around trying to assemble all of the drivers from the web (Nvidia drivers are the exception, Nouveau drivers are serviceable but not really optimal).
If you want to you can install apps using a central gui (like KDE Discover, Mint Software Manager, Gnome Software or Shelly for example) and don't have to look up .exe's on some random sites.
Maintaining the system is easier as well as you don't need to update every single app separately, you can update both the system and apps from a gui. On Windows you can update the system from the gui, but for the apps you either need to update them one-by-one or you need to use winget in the terminal.
Even skipping all that, the average user mostly interacts with the browser, media player and steam so your usecase is a power user one not something an average guy would do and it's not any easier to accomplish on Windows (unless you consider the Android Studio AVD manager performance acceptable)
smashing_michael@reddit
The overwhelming number of people I know who daily-drive Linux (including back in the day when we drove terminal-only Linux) are Linux sysadmins. Myself included. So learning the system inside out was already part of my life. Running a desktop on it isn't a big deal if you're already an admin.
For folks getting into Linux recently and entirely as desktop users, especially those folks coming from Windows; you've got a big jump coming for you. Not only were *nix systems originally terminal-only, they were originally multi-user, and things you need to know to install and use a Linux system right now are significantly different.
What irks me about your post (and similar posts, lots of redit posters are people complaining about how hard it is) is the conclusion that it can't be done. It can. Not only is using Linux learnable, it isn't as hard as, I think, folks who hit the initial learning curve think. Reading some documentation and figuring out the basics can get you using Linux very effectively.
On the other hand, if you're expecting the system itself to be a drop-in replacement for Windows; it's not, and it wasn't designed to be. Linux as a desktop computer is still pretty rough around the edges, but more importantly it's based on a completely different paradigm of use. That's confusing and difficult right off the bat. Especially when it comes to learning the shell, which might as well be arcane spellcasting even if you're familiar with programming.
So my point here is this; you installed Linux and expected it to be easy and it wasn't. Then you probably tried to get it to be a useful desktop for gaming and daily use, and for that it's even worse. While I appreciate that LLMs can help, I couldn't disagree more that you can't learn it without them.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
This is exactly the type of comment I was hoping for. Considered and educated.
Your first paragraph suggests your social circle shows the industry or interests your in. But as a populous, it's the smallest percent.
I agree it's a learning curve as with anything, but it's a very time consuming learning curve vs windows or mac os. Desktop users haven't got time or the patience for it. In all honesty, i'm probably more suited to mac os as a user these days, but I hate the propriety nature of it and I believe neither windows or mac os is good for society compared to linux.
Maybe i'm looking at it all wrong.
I haven't come to it for gaming. Daily use yes. Professional use, investigating. My enviroment is very corporate, i've been intrigued to see if I can manage the two.
smashing_michael@reddit
Thanks for that. I usually say this to people: if you're looking to gain control over your computer, learning Linux is a great way to do that. If you really just want to be a user of software and want the OS out of your way, skip it.
play_minecraft_wot@reddit
May I introduce you to... web searching?
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
....And then you then have to trawl through pages of forums.
martin7274@reddit
Lazy
SunlightScribe@reddit
The thing that makes LLMs better for the average person is that it attempts to apply the knowledge to your particular use case. You give it a snippet of your error logs and it can suggest a few things.
You should obviously supplement this with your own googling in order to verify what it's telling you. But it seems to be able to dig much deeper than a cursory google search ever could.
The eternal problem is that many people don't care about providing a solution once their issue is solved and people telling you to "just look it up on the wiki/google" and never providing a link to this supposed phantom information that apparently exists.
I'm by no means new to Linux, but I'm a debian-based guy and recently thought to try out CachyOS. The amount of search results with people just replying with "look it up on the Arch wiki" and never providing a link was obscene.
I don't blame people for using LLMs.
r0bc94@reddit
Maybe the thing about LLMs is also that they present you the thing you searched in a simple text prompt.
When searching the web, you’ll find a ton of SE optimized bullshit websites, outdated information, websites full of ads with annoying cookie banners everywhere..
Old_One_I@reddit
Hey man. Everything has learning curve, the OS , the applications. Even windows and Mac. Unless you’re just trying to jump on Reddit and scroll for hours. Ask yourself this question, maybe you’re a “power user “ or maybe you’re just a pleb like most. All your bullet points, would you have been able to do it without consulting some sort of information?
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I'm certainly a pleb like most
BUT, i imagine eventually would have been able to have figured it out, but how long.. no idea.
LLM's though allow me to get specific with the whys at any point accelerating my understanding.
Old_One_I@reddit
I understand. In my opinion I think the problem would be leaning on it all the time, but then again that’s no different than a lazy Linux user that can’t or won’t remember how to do something and keeps a guide or wiki or a cheat sheet or a web browser around etc. we are all there trust me unless it’s our job, even then I’ll bet they still do it. Something about AI ticks people off. I don’t concern myself with them. Most of them don’t even know why they are so mad other than everyone else is. Ya know. I’ve been using Linux for more than twenty years. It always sucked and was frustrating. But it was doable and had a certain satisfaction. I go on a Mac which I have and don’t know how to do a damn thing lol. The last few years I’ve been only using windows. I’m not on my computer much anymore and don’t have the time to stay updated on the latest. But I’ll tell you the itch is coming back.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
It's simply a tool to utilise.
Old_One_I@reddit
I think the old adage is , it's not what you know it's if you know how to find it.
Old_One_I@reddit
Exactly. If it works for you why not? If doesn’t that’s ok too!
Old_One_I@reddit
I’m going down memory lane now. My older brother was college to be electrical engineer and they made him learn Linux as a course. This was so long ago lol. Well…he made me learn Linux too. I didn’t get it at first. He made me a dual boot set up with the very first Ubuntu, I mean the first Ubuntu. I didn’t use it unless I was just checking it out , maybe get on the web or whatever. But it went stagnant. Then I tried again a year or so later and got into it, like really. He showed me gentoo which he was using. A ridiculously hard and complicated distro. Well that piqued my interest. So he brought me a thick ass book on Linux commands and shell programming. That piqued my interest even more, so he bought me several more books on programming and even purchased an Oreilies book club membership that we shared to check out any books we wanted. Good times
Old_One_I@reddit
People go to college and spend crazy money just to learn how to use an application like excel lol. Just an extreme example
undrwater@reddit
I usually use(d) the forums and IRC for such queries.
The more familiar you become with the system in general, the easier the concepts become.
Same as Windows. Windows is hard for me now as I have little experience with it anymore.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Interesting, I can see that happening but I'd imagine your knowledge around computers far far exceeds my own.
undrwater@reddit
It's possible. My experience began about 40 years ago with an i386 laptop, installing Windows 3.1.
While I've been fascinated with computer technology, professionally I was mostly a social worker. Semi-retired now.
digitallis@reddit
All of that stuff was available on standard stack overflow pages long before llms.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
But how long did it take to find what you needed?
digitallis@reddit
Not very? First link most times. Sometimes yes it takes a few more hits, but we call that "using search".
Trapped-In-Dreams@reddit
I assume you are talking about waydroid, there are actually some scripts that do GApps installation and attestation for you, some even with a gui. Don't listen to some comments in here btw, these days LLMs are often better for learning than googling and forums. But if you plan to use Linux long-term you better learn how use those, you will need them once in a while.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Waydroid indeed.
Appreciate the comments
Cool_Samoyed@reddit
People aren't being kind to you but I get your point. LLMs lower the entry barrier so much. Just always be mindful of what you run in the terminal, as it could mess up your system badly.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Appreciate the comment.
Cool_Samoyed@reddit
Hope you won't get discouraged if some online people are mean. It's just internet. Enjoy you new system! And use these LLMs to learn to use it thoroughly and it's going to work amazingly for you
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Appreciated.
FeelThePoveR@reddit
I mean he shouldn't really be that surprised that if he deals with absolute statements like "Linux is only usable thanks to LLMs" that people will also be inclined to respond accordingly (with the same absolute/rigid statements).
His post title makes it seems like you need to turn your Linux install into an agentic system to be able to get anything done which is obviously untrue.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I'll be honest. I wasn't expecting the community to take it to the literal extreme. But that's on me.
Hrafna55@reddit
I feel like this post has to be click bait.
I learnt out how host all my own services by reading documentation, blogs, forum posts etc. An LLM might be convenient but that's it. At best it saves you some time. At worst it gives you the wrong information and actually costs you time.
Plus its an environmental nightmare.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Not intended as rage bait.
It certainly saves time. Which is important to me. I am yet to receive any incorrect information via an LLM. It's done it all which also showed me how technical and layed it can get. Running android was my example. How many Linux users here could do that first time, and within 10 minutes? Maybe all of you, then I hold my hands up and am wrong.
Hrafna55@reddit
I am sure that getting your example working would have taken me more than ten minutes, yes.
However. The posts title 'Linux is only usable thanks to LLMs' is flat wrong.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I wasn't expecting the literal take but that's on me.
AestheticalGL@reddit
im sorry but I cant tell if this is satire or actually someone who uses LLMs to install an OS with a graphical installer
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Have i not written this clearly? Its about installing the software you need within ubuntu? BUT i feel this community is missing the point and elitism is seeping through, almost immediately ... unfortunately.
whosdr@reddit
I think your title and a few specific sentences might be problematic, since they could be read as you saying broadly, "Linux is not usable to anyone without the use of an LLM"
Which, you posted to a group of people who all learned to use Linux before the advent of the technology. You might see why that would cause a reaction.
This line in particular does give me a chuckle though, since I've read basically the same thing for the past 6 years—all while Linux adoption has been accelerating for private use (and that's before LLMs were public tech):
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
The title does appear to unintentionally have stirred the hornets nest.
I still stand by my comment though. The adoption has indeed accelerated but I'm under the belief that's due to gaming, of which has already been set up pre-user for the task at hand. Happy to be corrected though.
whosdr@reddit
I'm of the belief that the degradation of Windows has a lot to do with it. But also the Linux desktop has continued to improve with time.
Distros have popped up that are more consumer-focused, desktops have been gaining features wanted by the mass rather than more fringe users.
I try to help on that front in little bits too. I poke my head into the KDE visual design team every few months, point out any pain points I've had and see if any of the regulars are interested in pursuing it. (Bizarrely effective too, but you do need to approach the topics and people with a very focused and constructive mindset.)
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
That's a fair view, and I can agree with it all.
"focus and constructive mindset" good traits to have!
Icy-Astronomer-9814@reddit
I have been searching the web and solving things for many years.
The summary is often pretty good (especially if you change duckduckgo to reasoning) at filtering down and bringing solutions but I do feel that it also limits me as i don't up front know from when the information is and if a bug has been fixed that it's trying to get you to work around.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Definitely. I'd imagine you're a great problem solver, I'd also imagine you've sometimes spent hours solving something.
whosdr@reddit
Sometimes there is no solution though. And in those cases, LLMs still have a habit of hallucinating so that they can give you an answer.
Which is fine if you know and accept those kinds of risks. :p
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Agree, am i'm at risk of not realising. But enjoying the experience non the less
whosdr@reddit
I think to add, there is a big difference in how the tool's used. If you also have an open mind to learn at least the surface level of the topic at hand through using the tool, you'll be in a much better place than those who copy-paste from it.
Personally I'm oldschool and rely on first-hand sources and search engines. I rarely have had to ask people for help, as the amount of information already out there is incredible. (And it's mostly where the LLM got its information from anyway.)
There's a lot more I could say, but I think I'm going to get into the "Didn't ask" territory if I go any further. :P
CarlosEduardoAraujo@reddit
And one of the great advantages is that LLMs don't annoy you.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
By the responses i've had you'd think the forum would love that ;)
MATHIS111111@reddit
I'm sorry society failed you and that you now have to rely on AI to accomplish basic tasks.
Why do we still allow uncontrolled access to AI, when we can see how it affects people. People like OP. They deserve justice for what has been done to them and their brains. It's truly sad how we seemingly don't care, no, we even allow our kids to use AI, when there is evidently a huge risk they could end up like OP.
OP, if you need help with anything, please reach out. We are here for you.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Lol - strong assumptions here ;)
fellipec@reddit
When you read the comments you understand why OP prefers to ask an AI and not ask another person.
I think is better that OP could learn how to use Linux with an AI than not use it at all and I'll not gatekeep anything because that.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
There's a real tribalism going on.
It's certainly lowered the barrier to entry, and i'm enjoying the experience. I just don't have time to spend hours trying to figure something out, I've got stuff to do!
fellipec@reddit
Some things never change.
If you permit me one advice, OP, try to learn from the AI instead of just doing blindly what it says.
And yes, that would be the same advice for people that go googling around. Don't copy/paste scripts strangers post, but learn from them.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Appreciated. it's exactly how i use an LLM
WhitePeace36@reddit
the thing is, for most things there is already a solution somewhere on the internet. The only thing which might not be yet is for extreme new stuff, but an AI will also not know it .
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
There will be but you have to find it, in multiple places when you could just go to one.
For the extremely new stuff, agreed.
fellipec@reddit
Sure, and there are still books around. Want to learn something from them, googling around, asking on forums, asking an AI, I don't care. I'm just happy that people are trying to use Linux.
FeelThePoveR@reddit
I switched 2 months ago from Windows to Fedora.
I didn't use LLMs, I still don't like using them generally. Searching around manually at least lets me learn something about the system.
Setup in my case was extremely simple (quicker and somewhat easier then on Windows even excluding secure boot shim setup) - looking up how to install Nvidia drivers (which led me to RPMFusion wiki that I followed), searching how to install codecs (doing the swap and group install commands), install steam and that was pretty much it for the base setup. The rest I just installed as I needed something new.
But looking at your usecase this should also be extremely easy - for example following only the top search results and ignoring the LLMs output the containerized android setup is basically just
So I wouldn't really expect to have any issues with that as well if I needed something like this.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
This is fair enough. Everyone has their preferred methods. I just like being able to treat an LLM like a teacher that you can ask multiple times about anything specifically.
MatchingTurret@reddit
That's just basic computer literacy.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Disagree
Discipline_Cautious1@reddit
Does the CNN know this? Please report this to the news.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Nope. I have no idea what your point is?
RudePragmatist@reddit
I read books, blogs and learnt how to search correctly by understanding terminology. That is something the current generation struggles with.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Disagree.
avisadius@reddit
OP forgot what kind of server LLM's used
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
not relevant
FeistyCandy1516@reddit
Bait used to be believable.
And if not, really a shame the current generation is already so depended on AI that they don't know that before that self search via google existed.
Or back in my days, via books and magazines.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I'm not the current generation.
Because I'm utilising a tool doesn't mean i'm dependant. My angle is, i would not have bothered to move to linux as it would have been too time consuming and hassly.
Old_One_I@reddit
This is crazyness. I’m not dogging on for asking AI how to do something it damn!
Old_One_I@reddit
For specific information like distro installation and what not, always had the install guide or wiki on hand. Other more Linuxy stuff, I just learned through reading a book or any of the available info options.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
But if you really want to drill down on specifics you can ask an LLM if what you're reading doesn't quite make sense to you.
Old_One_I@reddit
Like I said . I’m not dogging on you. I have never used AI yet except for asking Gemini to translate French for me because I talk to a lady in France on here ❤️ and I also asked it to make me some pictures for celebration posts when I was a mod.
Old_One_I@reddit
For specific information like distro installation and what not, always had the install guide or wiki on hand. Other more Linuxy stuff, I just learned through reading a book or any of the available info options.
No-Camera-720@reddit
Wow, the Mistake Generator doesn't work. Go figure. Learn stuff. It is tedious and takes a lot of back and forth, but it's better to use your own brain.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Don't dispute this at all.
kido5217@reddit
Keyboard-monitor interface is defective.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
no idea what this means. Nerd joke?
FeelThePoveR@reddit
Kind of - it's another take on PEBCAK (Problem Exists Between Chair And Keyboard)
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Or a loose 'nut' - between the seat and the steering wheel.
overclockedmangle@reddit
I guarantee you if you rely on LLM’s it won’t be long before you end up back on Windows. You either engage your brain and commit to learn or one day whilst you’re copy and pasting commands spat out by the glorified autocorrect it’ll break sudo and you’ll find yourself in the shit.
By all means, use LLM’s to learn, but don’t rely on them or you’ll regret it.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Exactly how I use them. It's sped up my knowledge far faster than it would have elsewhere.
stein89jp@reddit
Feel kind of bad for this generation...
Ok-Winner-6589@reddit
He is not joung tho... At least he has a comment on other subreddit saying that he has been 25 years into something
(I checked the profile because I though It was ragebait or an AI Bro)
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
42 to be exact.
Ok-Winner-6589@reddit
Remember guys, never show new technology to old people, they don't understand It and then complain newer generations rely on It too much
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Lol
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
There's more out there than knowing how to whack in a load of commands within the terminal. Try not to be to elitism.
stein89jp@reddit
Never said you have to memorize everything. Not trying to be ass it's just a basic problem solving problem. Have a problem, look it up and learn from it instead.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
I agree. But having access to a single point of resource and right first time drop the barrier to entry
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Pilubolaer@reddit
this has to be ragebait
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Not intended. Trying to give a perspective from a non expert programmer user who genuinely enjoys the experience.
Pilubolaer@reddit
Saying its only possible because of LLMs is crazy
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Ok, So it may have been a slight exaggeration.
PocketStationMonk@reddit
If you are dependant on LLMs, that’s on you.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Absolutely. But this isn't my skillset and nor do I particularly want it to be beyond a certain level.
martin7274@reddit
go do a sanity check on yourself
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
lols
xoteonlinux@reddit
If LLMs are good enough, why are you still using your computer manually? Wouldn't it be better to allow the LLM to handle your computer with your data completely autonomous and just ask if you need something specific?
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
feels like you're being Facetious?
rw-rw-r--@reddit
I'm wondering how I've managed to use it as my primary desktop for over 25 years... (Hint: reading, googling, learning).
What Microsoft created is a totally opaque and user-unfixable OS. At the first major issue you're stuck and online advice is always the same magic incantations of a few "random" commands and the suggestion to reinstall.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
No no i agree. I have my own reasons for not liking windows anymore, and i've used it since windows 3.0. Ubuntu has been great, but i also put this down to the LLM Help.
But i don't have the time unfortunately to spend hours problem solving and wading through forums trying to piece together from far cleverer people than I to achieve what I wanted.
ingmar_@reddit
I may sound like an old fart, but the documentation has always been there. RTFM is nothing new.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Agree, and the old farts usually are the better problem solvers, especially when something fails and you have to go old school. But i also bet you've spent hours figuring something out!
Appreciate the comment.
Ok-Winner-6589@reddit
The Ubuntu installing process is more simple than the Windows one, if you aren't able to install Ubuntu you are capable of installing amy OS at all. No, LLMs are not needed for that.
Not just that, but running Android containers is not even possible on Windows or any other non-Linux OS
Nothing you mention is supposed to be used daily and It works the same on every fucking OS. Why the fuck do you expect to use a database without querys? Or how do you expect It to work on Windows?
Ubuntu has Snaps and you can install flatpak, there is a fucking store that allows you to install software, you don't have to even open a browser, is literally what everyone does on their phones. It's the same Mac users do and Windows users call them "retards". But now you need an AI and enabling repos to do so...
"You have to search throw websites" oh, no fucking way, whats Next? "I need an AI to speak, do you expect me to read the result of my prompt?" Obviously. Peak stupidity
Canchito@reddit
The amount of cope and elitism in this thread is beyond belief. It should be a reason to rejoice that LLMs make everything more accessible to the masses, including Linux... and your reaction is to bemoan the days when knowledge was for the privileged few. Pathetic.
peace991@reddit
Years of use, experience and repetition. Started with RedHat books that are the size of encyclopedias. Then came Google and now LLM’s. There’s almost zero reason now to post questions.
Ok-Arm-8412@reddit (OP)
Absolutely. I agree, Surely it's a good thing and giving more access to a bigger user base.
tooclosetocall82@reddit
Good luck future people when there’s future questions and answers on the web for LLMs to source from.
0x645@reddit
read forums. ask on stackoverflow. ask more experienced friend. there was saying 'the best distro for you is the ditro your neighbor use'
Grumpy_Ontarian_III@reddit
Stop using AI/LLMs. Seriously, they are really, really bad for your brain.
thefeedling@reddit
People have been using LFS much before LLM's dreamed to exist.