What makes Volkswagen rank so low and why don’t more people buy them?
Posted by phtphongg@reddit | askcarguys | View on Reddit | 451 comments
I’ve been looking into different compact sedans, and one thing I keep noticing is that Volkswagen usually ranks pretty low on a lot of reliability sites.
What I don’t fully understand is… why?
From what I’ve seen and heard:
- Their engines seem pretty solid overall
- A lot of complaints are more about electrical issues and smaller stuff rather than major engine failure
- People always say you need to be strict with maintenance for a VW to last long
But here’s where I’m confused, shouldn’t that apply to all cars? I feel like any car will last long if you maintain it properly, not just VW.
I also hear people say that Americans don’t stay on top of maintenance as much, which hurts VW reliability ratings. But again, that doesn’t feel like a great reason to rank a brand low if the car itself is fine when taken care of.
So what’s actually causing Volkswagen to rank so low?
- Is it really just electrical issues?
- Is it maintenance sensitivity?
- Or is there something bigger I’m missing?
Also, if they’re not that bad, why don’t more people buy them compared to other brands?
Curious to hear from owners or mechanics, especially people who’ve owned VWs long-term.
HB97082@reddit
Your entire premise is wrong. VW is best selling brand in Europe.
Electrical_Side_3023@reddit
People in Europe generally don't keep their cars as long as those in America, so I imagine Europeans experience less worsening maintenance issues on their VWs.
UnluckyGamer505@reddit
That is not true. Both USA and Europe have an average car age of about 12-13 years. The difference is negligable.
A fuck ton of 20+ year old cars with 300k km (180k miles) are driving around here, even in Germany. When cars get too old or have driven too much for the average german, they get sold to eastern europe and the balkans where they are driven to the ground.
stonkstogo@reddit
I think the difference is that in the US, a 20 year old car could easily have 300k miles. So although you’re likely correct, Europeans keep cars longer, I would be willing to bet that it’s because we wear out our cars more.
True_Goat_7810@reddit
And those are german by a large amount.
KookySurprise8094@reddit
Not in Finland. Year 2025, 4 most selling car models was Toyota cars and VW:s best car was in place 8th.
sponge_bobba@reddit
My brand new Tiguan burned oil about every 3000 miles had to put oil in. Volkswagen claims that is just normal maintenance.
autofan06@reddit
German car problems with none of the benefits. Basic maintenance costs are the same as Mercedes or bmw but you don’t get the luxury or performance that you would from them.
Careful-Sell-9877@reddit
No they arent.
Common misconception. Everyone thinks they are built like audis, but they arent. Ive never had issues getting it serviced anywhere, even in rural areas.
stonkstogo@reddit
If you go get to the local lube shop, they’ll put whatever synthetic fluid in the same weight. If you look at the manual, it’ll require specific (and more expensive) 508 oil. Just because you can take it anywhere, doesn’t mean you should. My Tiguan for example… AGM battery $250+, and a reprogrammed computer +$100. Any other non luxury brand $100 battery, simple swap. Tack on vehicle specific haldex fluid, transmission fluid, even fucking coolant. All at a premium compared to a Honda, Toyota, or Nissan. It’s premium prices for a non-premium car.
Hungry-Job-3198@reddit
They are nowhere near the same costs unless you’re only talking about entry level Mercedes or bmw. I’m not a vw fan, but come on.
warpigz@reddit
Mercedes and BMW are rear or all wheel drive and sell cars based on that, somewhat justifying their higher costs. A GTI is directly competing against a Civic SI and is way costlier to maintain.
BryanDaBlaznAzn@reddit
For the trade off of extra maintenance cost you get more power, more refined driving experience, an arguably nicer interior and tuneability. It’s not everyone’s cup of tea though
autofan06@reddit
You wana argue that a gti is more tunable than civics? Ok bud.
BryanDaBlaznAzn@reddit
if we’re strictly talking ECU tunes, than yes a GTI would make more hp
bequietanddrive000@reddit
The interiors in vw are dogshit. You can tell how broke the group are just by sticking your head in the window. Its also not a more refined driving experience comparing apples to apples. Its pretty much the same as every other car in each price bracket.
4q20@reddit
Definitely nicer interior and a much more solid feel overall compared to my old Hondas and Toyotas. I love to drive and all my previous cars were FWD but my Tiguan right now is AWD. Best car I ever had so far.
perfect__situation@reddit
Yeah it's closer to Mini prices.
crookedledder@reddit
But unnecessarily costly in similar ways that are kinda unique to those goofy Germans.
Comparable Japanese and American designs are far more practical.
Hungry-Job-3198@reddit
Agreed on that part for sure
EverLovinHand@reddit
The basic maintenance costs are no where near the same. I have an Audi. And VW’s definitely offer more luxury than other brands in the higher trims. You’re off base in multiple ways
4q20@reddit
Off base and Out of my element. Two of my favorite phrases
howrunowgoodnyou@reddit
No they aren’t. I’m approaching 180k on my 04 and it’s chipped af. Been a great car.
Ogzhotcuz@reddit
This completely untrue. I've owned a VW GTI for 7+ years now. My buddy owns a BMW and weve compared notes. His maintenance is always at least about 50% more.
BMW and Mercedes maintenance is a whole other level of overpriced.
EricRP@reddit
And saying golf R doesn't have the performance of a BMW or Merc.. pfft!
crookedledder@reddit
They're German.
Among mechanics, nothing more needs to be said.
bigred83@reddit
German cars aren’t hard. Just different
ExternalTree1949@reddit
Why are they different? Very common cars.
bigred83@reddit
Different compared to working on American, Japanese or Korean cars. They’re usually more particular, more control units, more programming. German cars have a different feel when driving. I worked on Japanese cars for most of my career and switched to bmw and it’s easy to switch between the Japanese brands, or even gmc in comparison to switching to BMW. For me at least.
crookedledder@reddit
I'm glad there are folks like yourself around. Otherwise German equipment would very quickly become worthless.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
I get the joke 😅 but I think that’s a bit of an oversimplification. “German” usually just means more complex engineering and tighter tolerances, which also means they’re less forgiving if you skip maintenance. That’s different from being outright unreliable. So yeah, I get why mechanics say that, but it’s probably more about cost and maintenance sensitivity than just “German = bad.”
crookedledder@reddit
No, it exactly means unreliable and difficult to repair.
But if you bring it into the shop every few weeks, sure you can keep it running.
UnluckyGamer505@reddit
Part of the issue is probably that america gets high trim models with new tech and big engines. What you guys consider "base spec" is usually in the middle or the top segment in Europe/Germany.
It doesnt make sense to export cheap commuter cars to the US. So, since you have the pricier cars with more power, you have to go to the shop more often to get basic service done.
If you keep servicing the car at the intervals which get recommended, you should be fine. The problems start when you dont change your oil, filters, belts etc. Japanese cars tend to take that negligence way more into account, while Germans just tend to trust the costumer to do basic maintinance every now and then.
crookedledder@reddit
The problem is that you have to take apart the entire front end if the car to replace the thermostat.
That's two bolts on my car.
Slowvia@reddit
Maintenance has nothing to do with it. German cars break more often than comparable Japanese cars. I’ve been turning wrenches professionally for over a decade, and the German cars have considerably more issues. They also cost more to fix/maintain because they’re more complex and packaged tighter than other makes.
I’ve seen Mercedes cars cost over a grand just to replace the thermostat. I’ve seen VW water pumps fail before 30,000 miles. I’ve seen VW brakes needing replacement at 20,000 miles, and they take more time because we have to hook up a scan tool to do a simple brake job. I’ve seen BMWs puking oil after 20,000 miles. There are so many fasteners (nuts and bolts) that are one time use, and have to replaced every time you remove them, and that cost adds up fast.
The simple fact is that they cost more to own than a Japanese car, and are significantly less reliable. The quality of parts on German cars are atrocious, and VW is the worst offender.
I think that nothing else drives like a BMW, and I think they’re a blast. But I’ll never own another German car again. Once was enough for me to get a bad taste in my mouth.
Oh, and the shop that I work at refuses to touch any German vehicles, for any reason, period. Won’t even change the oil, or replace tires on them. And a lot of shops around me are moving that way. We send them all to a local German specialist shop.
So go ahead and buy one, it seems like you’re ignoring all of the advice in this thread anyway. Just remember that it isn’t normal to have monthly visits to the local auto shop.
perfect__situation@reddit
More like German = fun
Pineapple_Towel@reddit
Repairs are stooooopid expensive and frequent.
OddPick84@reddit
My buddy had a Passat for just few years then his engine went psst and died
Aggressive_Ask89144@reddit
The entire car is plastic
Handy_Man_67@reddit
Here’s my vehicle purchase history. Guess which one turned out to be a total disaster:
1982 Toyota Celica GT-S 5 speed, 189,000 miles
1992 Honda Accord EX 6 speed, 225,000 miles
2002 Volvo V70 T5 6 speed wagon, 265,000 miles
2010 Volkswagen Jetta Sportwagen TDI 6 speed, 52,000 miles
2017 Toyota Tacoma automatic, traded for flat-towable vehicle in 2022.
2022 Ford Ranger Lariat automatic, set up for flat towing behind motorhome. Sold MH, then truck at 35,000 miles
2024 Toyota Tundra 1794 hybrid, my current vehicle
You got it! The VW was the biggest piece of $hite that I ever had the misfortune to buy. Turbo failure at 52,000 miles (after 48,000 mile warranty expired) shoved lubricating oil down into the intake manifold. Dealer said that they couldn’t guarantee the $4,000 repair. Then Dieselgate came to light whereby VW had falsified emissions data by illegally creating software to mask high emissions during testing.
I would buy literally anything other than a VW. Anything.
Good luck!
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Electrical problems are no small thing.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
That’s true, electrical problems aren’t minor. I just feel like most of the issues people bring up are more annoying/intermittent problems rather than catastrophic failures like engines or transmissions blowing up. Still matters for ownership though, especially since electrical issues can be hard to diagnose and expensive to fix, so I get why it hurts their reputation.
ebranscom243@reddit
As far as maintenance goes Germans expect you to be very punctual with your maintenance and the cars are designed with that in mind. If you do the maintenance on time vw can be reliable. Japanese cars are designed knowing that people are going to abuse them and skip on maintenance and they are designed accordingly. So while both cars can be reliable the maintenance levels will be different for the same amount of reliability. Japanese cars seem to handle abuse much better than VWs.
tinpants44@reddit
Seems shortsighted to design a car with low margin of error. Just setting yourself up for poor experiences.
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Electrical systems do not normally require maintenance
Due-Pear-8687@reddit
Exactly…….. but that’s VW and their fans. Parts breaking is dubbed maintenance. Tween my wife and I we have had 4. Gawd help Me if I bring one home. Note: recently I have considered a 2022 VW GTI…… Gotta Be Manual. KnownI can afford the maintenance- cheaper Than a Porsche. Eh Just Get A new Civic Si. A lot Of Fun and they don’t break
stillpiercer_@reddit
The Civic SI is just as expensive as a GTI, much slower, and is significantly poorer in equipment. Honda reliability also isn’t what it used to be. Kinda a poor comparison.
Due-Pear-8687@reddit
Good Points:‘I didn’t buy a civic because of that 1.5 turbo made me nervous. Point is that sooner than later my wife will take my RAV4 that I bought for her…….. and my Old Z3 will die
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Don’t hold your breath on that Z3. Those things are tough as hell
ebranscom243@reddit
I never said they did. OP asked about the maintenance schedules and reliability for Japanese cars versus VWs. I answered one of his questions.
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Kind of. The point is that there is no amount of maintenance that will achieve the same reliability as a Japanese car. Because the failures will be largely on things that never needed maintenance to begin with.
jnyc777@reddit
But they can take hours of tracing to find the electrical problem sometimes costing plenty of dollars just to source the problem, then you gotta fix the problem
Future-Bit2788@reddit
Zero amount of maintenance will fix a flawed design of certain parts…
When the DSG‘s first came out, they were lifetime fills.
High-pressure pump failure?
Decarbs?
I like both brands, but let’s not act like Vw could have made some of their flaws a little bit more tolerable.
cakebythejake@reddit
I couldnt roll my eyes further back with your nazi comment.
Nearly EVERY auto manufacturer has a dark and storied past.
Henry Ford - Profoundly antisemetic and spread conspiracies accordingly
Hitler even admired henry ford.
BMW & Mercedes-Benz - Same ties to support for Nazi’s as VW just not founded by them.
GM - Owned Opel during WWII and indirectly supported production
Toyota - produced military equipment and vehicles for imperial japan.
Mitsubishi - used forced POW labor during WWII
Fiat - Mussolini / Italy
Renault - also WWII collaboration with the nazis
Annnnd if an automaker doesnt have ties to the nazis they most likely are associated with child labor, anti-union practices, lobbying, manipulating fuel economy (or emissions data)
So… thats a pretty shallow argument.
Future-Bit2788@reddit
Which other manufacturer was founded directly by hitler?
I don’t disagree with your points (I worked for Vw for 6 years and have owned a few dozen…) but between the treehuggers who screeched when diesel gate happened and their founder, I’m quite amazed they never rebranded.
Successful_Cress6639@reddit
Apple?
FitFormal7363@reddit
Glad Porsche didn't make the list! 🤣
Ok_Two_2604@reddit
Yeah, it would tank his popularity.
ASlipperyRichard@reddit
Porsche made vehicles for the Germans during WWII, such as the Elefant tank destroyer
Successful_Cress6639@reddit
Rolling around in their VWs drinking fanta.
th3l33tbmc@reddit
There’s a dumb fuckin take, right there.
ProfessionalBread176@reddit
Exactly, because what good is a powertrain if the electricals are causing it not to start, stall, or run?
Or if you simply can't use the power windows because...
Who wants to deal with crap like that if they don't have to?
Even at a lower price, with VW, you end up paying more overall
supercargo@reddit
Here’s the thing about those electrical problems: they are expensive to fix. You’ll have some fault code on a module buried deep under trim panels. Who knows why it failed, maybe due to a capacitor on a circuit board that should have cost $0.20 but they went with the cheap $0.05 part. It doesn’t matter, no one is taking the time to figure that out, gotta replace the module, which is a $350 part.
And then it takes over an hour of “mechanic” time to replace because they need to drop the dash to get to the screw holding another thing to even access where the module lives. And once they replace it, they need to program it. And after all that, the problem isn’t resolved. So the process is repeated, replacing additional components, until hopefully they stumble upon the root cause.
So that small problem becomes a big problem due to how these cars are designed and constructed. And, like, sure…the car is drivable, but the electronics are so ingrained in the function of the basic things (door locks, power seats, rear hatch motors, and so on) which become completely unusable when those electrical problems happen that you aren’t going to want to ignore them. It’s the opposite of Mitch Headburg’s escalator, there is no graceful degradation. Your power window doesn’t turn into a manual crank window when the control module craps out.
Successful_Cress6639@reddit
The annoying leg is being sent to a "German car specialist" to fix the electrical problem, and having to mortgage your house.
I had an audi years ago and every "minor problem" cost the earth to fix.
canofelephants@reddit
Mortgage your home?
I had to sell a kidney to keep my Mini running (they're owned by BMW, so Germanish?)
TriumphSprint@reddit
I had the same Audi.
dark-green@reddit
Rented a VW for a few weeks over the winter and the screens would stop working when it was too cold
tigress666@reddit
I replied to you about a bmw I had. One of its electrical issues was small. It was just an electrical contact that needed cleaning. It also caused the car to randomly start running bad or even stalling while I was driving it. It took a frikkin year to figure out what was causing it cause it was random (as in would only do it sometimes) and there were many problems that could have caused the behaviors. Small electronic problems can cause big issues. And are a bitch to figure out if you were do.
KeeganY_SR-UVB76@reddit
An electrical problem can very quickly turn into a catastrophic failure, especially with EFI.
GingerMan027@reddit
You would think after all these years, they'd have fixed them. I mean, it's not news.
oIVLIANo@reddit
You'd also think that after all this time, Subaru would have fixed their head gaskets, but here we are.
sewiv@reddit
Subaru head gaskets haven't been an issue for over a decade. Not a comparison.
1cyChains@reddit
But they have……? Let the class know when Subaru moved on from EJ’s smh.
Boopped_Snoot@reddit
Even the EJs didn't actually have any major problems outside of a couple of years and certain versions of the engine at that. My 06 WRX has an entirely original engine and 5 speed closing in on 400K miles. It's been running 21 lb of boost since I got it at 30K miles. I abuse the absolute crap out of it but I also do maintenance and I'm not dumb enough to drop the clutch from a standstill.
It's the same kind of nonsense Hyundai/Kia/Genesis is going through right now. It's going to "blow up HuRdAdADuR" yeah Hyundai brought that on themselves by recommending 20K mile oil changes and expecting the owners to actually check their oil when they got gas Just like Mazda I did with the RX-8 but instead of sweeping it under the rug like Mazda Hyundai double down on their warranty and fixed the issue to boot.
You can buy a used Hyundai or Kia and be guaranteed more trouble-free miles or you don't pay a dime to fix it then you can get out of an American or German before it's scrap yard bound. I just got a letter in the mail for My used Kia letting me know they're extending the warranty to 180,000 mi. The last one I had had some serious issues about 10K after the warranty went out and Kia USA stepped in and paid for everything without me even asking or anything.
The people that were around back then Don't say to remember but in the '90s and '80s Japanese cars were cheap throwaway things but you only bought if you couldn't afford anything "better" now a lot of those same cars are renown for being the most reliable cars ever made and the Japanese are struggling to hit the quality level they had back then. I feel like the Korean cars are in that phase right now. They're still cheaper than most of their cars and honestly they look better and have nicer interiors and better tech than a lot of German cars and really make Japanese an American cars look like a U-Haul rental but they are also standing behind their quality with crazy warranties which Is something they wouldn't be able to afford to do if they really had tons of quality issues.
friendIdiglove@reddit
Yeah. They moved on to broken ringlands and threw in CVTs for good measure.
osmiumblue66@reddit
Every one of these I see on the road has some kind of screwed up exterior light. Taillight, DRL, headlamp, something. Those may be somewhat minor, but those same gremlins can and will visit other electrical components in the car.
argyle9000@reddit
That’s true!
willjacks9@reddit
I m here to say this only.
DoubleNaught_Spy@reddit
Anything that requires repeated trips to the shop, no matter how minor, is a deal breaker for me.
Comfortable-Figure17@reddit
This is it. My daughter loved driving her VWs and had a great mechanic but trips to shop for minor repairs got to be too much.
Johnlc29@reddit
Exactly I have a mechanic who i go to and he will not touch anything made by the VW group if its anything elctrical. He doesnt have a problem with the mechanical but he's done chasing the electrical gremlins.
Slowvia@reddit
My shop won’t work on any VW products at all. Won’t even do oil changes on them anymore.
ThePoltageist@reddit
Breh I have had an ongoing gremlin for over a year with my Tiguan but I’ve finally got it I think, wish me luck, and if they aren’t a euro/german specific mechanic, I would not under any circumstances take it to the for anything that I wouldn’t feel confident doing myself, waste of time and money on attempted diagnostics.
andruszko@reddit
That's true. However, Volkswagens are actually pretty easy to work on if you're remotely skilled. Most mechanics simply aren't.
JaniceRossi_in_2R@reddit
Decades of terrible wiring. I’ve owned several lol
ElectricSnowBunny@reddit
I've given up on German cars, the electrical gremlins are such a massive hassle and eventually ruin everything great about them.
Eventually every German car just decides hey fuck you this window is tired of you telling it what to do.
joemc225@reddit
An electrical problem in today's cars can be way more than an inconvenience. It can affect how the engine runs (or doesn't), and can make your car seem like it's possessed by demons, by randomly disrupting multiple systems and functions.
Today, an electrical problem can mean several trips to the repair shop, where they run diagnostics, replace something, only to have you return again, up until they replace the car's computer module, at a cost of at least $1500 and probably more. Even then, you can only hope that resolved the problem, until a reasonable timespan tells you it has.
Chockfullofnutmeg@reddit
In North America vw wanted the division to be separate from European operations and a lot of components to were sourced from b grade suppliers. To add on to this because vw was only selling 60-100k cars in the us, most auto parts stores didn’t stock parts so any problem, (pre mainstream internet shopping) meant going to the dealer and paying an armload. My sibling had a hand me down vw and recall the MAF had to be changed 3 times over the course of a couple years.
DANPARTSMAN44@reddit
Guess I'm an exception
2013 VW Passat 2.5 L 225,000. No major problems Other than heater mode blend door failure
1984 VW rabbit diesel 300,000 miles no problems ever Still has original clutch
I feel lucky
cmcms@reddit
And not to mention they cheated on emissions tests several years ago….
Ok-Highlight-3402@reddit
I love mine. But it has its problems,
Can't lock my driver's door at all. Trunk popper doesn't work.
I have the parts, just been too lazy.
Mechanically it's been okay.
But the PCV and coolant system have their design problems and I played wack-a-mole/you are the weakest link with the coolant system for a good year and a half.
Mind you it is an 2004 with 199,000mi on it. But it is impressively rust-less for a 22 year old car.
The 2008 Toyota it replaced was rusty when I bought it and totally rotten 2.5 years later.
JustaYnLivin@reddit
When i was in used car sales every VW had electrical problems mainly doors not locking, windows stuck open/closed, radio display shitting out, gauges not working, and every dashboard flaking from heat and wear, basically anything with with common accessories and comfort. But yeah drivetrain ok if manual, suspension always good though.
NoobensMcarthur@reddit
I’ve had my VW for over 15 years and the only major problem in that time has been the fucking door locks. They’ve never really worked right, and last year the auto locks just don’t work at all anymore. It’s probably the lock controller, but I’m not going to spend $250 on a part and rip my dash apart for some door locks.
Probably time to send it on to a parking lot upstate.
SamPackElliott@reddit
The doors not locking and window problems are because people slam the doors. The parts are made of plastic like most modern cars. The only difference is with vw products you only need to tap the door with a finger tip and it'll close and latch. Yet people still slam the shit out of them.
yogaballcactus@reddit
What kind of copium is this? People aren’t out there selectively slamming only VW doors. Ford and Toyota and Hyundai can all make doors that survive being closed by the same people in the same way. If VW can’t then that’s a VW problem, not a “people slam doors” problem.
SamPackElliott@reddit
It's not copium. It's the reason it happens. You don't HAVE to slam doors. By your tone it sounds like you're prone to throwing tantrums though. Who knows, maybe one day you'll own a car where the doors don't need to be slammed.
yogaballcactus@reddit
I suspect the VW door lock and window problems have nothing to do with how people close the doors. They are probably just designed cheaply. But it is hilarious that “people slam VW doors extra hard” is what you’ve latched onto to defend them.
I actually do own a German car. It’s not made by Volkswagen, though, so it has normal doors that can survive being both opened and closed hahaha
SamPackElliott@reddit
Buddy... Do you have reading comprehension problems? I said it's because they're slammed and they don't need to be. I had a passenger door latch break twice because my ex slammed the door. My sister had her latch break because her husband slams the door. Why would you slam a door when it doesn't need to be slammed? I didn't say anything about slamming extra hard or anything. I just said continual abuse causes them to break. They may be cheaply made. Again, you don't NEED to slam the door. I don't slam my doors and I've never had a problem. People who do slam the doors have problems. That's on them for slamming a door that doesn't NEED to be slammed.
yogaballcactus@reddit
My girlfriend also has no awareness of the physical world and sometimes slams doors accidentally. Thankfully, BMW designed their doors to survive this behavior, so I didn’t have to leave her.
Full disclosure: I’ve never owned a VW product and I’ve got no idea if they are cheaply made or not. But talking to you is convincing me that they are definitely cheaply made hahaha. Why would you keep on buying the same cars where you’ve had the door latch break twice and your family has had the same problem? I’ve genuinely never heard of a door latch breaking before today. It’s wild to me that that can even happen.
SamPackElliott@reddit
Dude... You need reading lessons. I don't have that problem because like I said, you can close them with one finger, all you need to do is get the closing motion started and it closes itself and latches. I buy them because they have, or at least had, very good build quality at an affordable price. The ea888 engine also handles upgrades extremely well and is super easy to work on. You just seem obsessed with abusing the shit out of your car. I personally like to take care of my stuff though. I found the cause to the problem and tell people not to slam the doors. It's as easy as that.
yogaballcactus@reddit
I think you owe it to yourself to own a car with functional doors at some point in your life. You don’t need more than a finger to close my doors either. But they can also be closed with some authority without damage.
Some of us, while we know not to slam the door ourselves, have kids or significant others or friends who aren’t always so gentle, so we require a car that will survive normal use in the normal world.
SamPackElliott@reddit
Again with the reading comprehension. I own a car with functional doors. I remind people not slam them. They can be slammed but continually slamming them breaks the solder in the latch. I don't get what's so hard to understand. If you want to abuse you car you shouldn't buy a Volkswagen product.
yogaballcactus@reddit
Okay bud. I hope those VW doors are nice enough to be worth having to give everyone who rides with you a little pep talk about your twice-broken door latches before they exit the vehicle.
SamPackElliott@reddit
Man. You need Hooked On Phonics or something. I didn't say anything about a pep talk. I simply say, "Please don't slam the door." That's it. It works too. I've had 4 more VWs since the one with broken latch and it hasn't happened since. Crazy how not abusing car stops things from breaking.
yogaballcactus@reddit
I have literally never had to tell someone not to slam a door and I have had precisely zero broken door latches. I’ve also never owned a VW. I think there might be a correlation there.
What’s really funny to me about this is that you seem to agree that the VW doors are really fragile. Fragile enough that you have to warn people about it when they ride with you. But you’re still defending them for some reason. Like VW sold you a product that breaks under normal use and instead of being like “yeah the doors are fragile and that’s annoying” you’re trying to tell me that it’s people’s behavior that’s to blame. It’s absurd and hilarious.
SamPackElliott@reddit
Again with the reading comprehension dude. Normal operation is lightly touching the door and letting it close. Normal operation is not slamming the piss out of it everytime you close it. I don't get what is so hard to understand. Did you fail high school?
yogaballcactus@reddit
Normal operation is whatever the average person does. If you have to teach everyone who gets into the car how to close the door then it’s not normal.
SamPackElliott@reddit
An average high school graduate would notice that it takes nearly zero effort to close the door so there is no need to slam it.
yogaballcactus@reddit
By that definition, I guess your ex didn’t graduate high school, as evidenced by the two broken door latches.
SamPackElliott@reddit
I never said she was smart. Dude come on. Do you slam every door in your house? Why would you slam a car door when it closes so easily?
yogaballcactus@reddit
Idk why people slam car doors. I just know mine don’t break when they do.
SamPackElliott@reddit
This is getting old with the reading comprehension thing. Repeated slamming breaks the solder. They don't break if slammed once. If they are slammed over and over again they do because they are designed to close so easily. They don't have the resistance built into the hinges and/or door stays that other manufacturers have that make the doors hard to close because they are designed to close easily and smoothly. Surely English isn't your first language because I've never seen someone struggle so hard with understanding such a simple concept.
yogaballcactus@reddit
Bro do you work for VW’s marketing department? Like we get it, the fragile doors that break are a feature, not a bug.
Feel free to spend your money on whatever dumb shit you want. Just don’t expect the rest of us not to laugh at you for it.
SamPackElliott@reddit
I hope you don't have a wife/girlfriend for their sake. With your penchant for abusing things, there is no way she can have a good life. If you understood English you'd have read multiple times that the doors are designed to close easily. There is literally no need to slam them. Repeated slamming breaks the solder. If you use the doors as they are designed(designed to close easily and smoothly in case you forgot already) they have absolutely no problems. If you're a troglodyte who just can't survive without slamming everything in sight, you shouldn't buy a car that has doors that has doors that are designed to close easily. It's a simple concept.
yogaballcactus@reddit
Yeeeah that’s what I thought. The VW seems good until someone offers to show you that another car has doors as easy to close that don’t break under normal use.
Or maybe there’s nothing wrong with VW doors and your ex and your brother in law are both troglodytes (your words, not mine!)
yogaballcactus@reddit
Bro if I send you a video of me closing the door on something other than a VW with one finger will you admit you are wrong and shut up about it?
Slowvia@reddit
Lol, wut.
Dude I have an old pile of shit Ford truck that I have to slam the door on because…. well it’s an old piece of shit Ford truck. Guess what? Power locks and windows work just fine on it.
technobobble@reddit
I love when users are blamed for problems
diavel65@reddit
Quality,overpriced labor,expensive parts,poor customer service from VW dealers.
SenorCardgay@reddit
German cars are why I'm racist against Germans. Just the most convoluted engineering designs that are a pain in the ass to fix, and still less reliable than any other brand.
skylabbananaguitar@reddit
A lot of people are not buying them because they are supporting the Israeli genocide.
Cultural-Lab-4948@reddit
I had four VWs. Bought new and kept them each for 3-4 years. Only issue I experienced was an intermittent advanced cruise control sensor issue on a Touareg that the dealer could not replicate/fix so I learned to live with it. I did most routine maintenance myself including oil changes, diesel fuel filters and DSG fluid/filter.
VW often requires specific spec/formulation fluids that can be hard to find outside of the dealer or online so I can imagine that lot of people get the wrong spec/formulation engine oil a lot if they use a quick lube place and I’m sure that could cause issues longer term. Also the DSG service every 40k miles cost $400-600 at the dealer so I’m sure that tended to get skipped/ignored.
2010 Jetta Sportwagen TDI, 2013 Tiguan, 2013 GTI w/DSG and 2017 Touareg. Traded the Tiguan for a 2019 Honda Civic and the Touareg for a 2021 Ram 1500.
ProfessionalBread176@reddit
Long term, VW is a bad bet. Great for short term leases, before the electrical issues make you lose your mind.
Sadly, even after all those years, they refuse to address these things, and then scratch their heads why more customers won't buy them.
Gotta admit I loved that Diesel thing they did, hacking the onboard computers to report good data instead of actual...
Interesting-Bed-8890@reddit
I had 2018 GLI Jetta, it had lower than 25k miles, and the year before we sold it it started to have a piston misfire, cause it's idle to bounce between 2-3 and then the engine would die, I took it to the mechanic and they fixed the misfiring, then within 6 months the problem returned, so I just gave up and sold it. I wasn't going invest time and money trying to find a gremlin.
sinph1@reddit
I’ve owned 3 VWs and it’s true that maintenance costs are more frequent and higher than other brands, I’ve never experienced any serious issues like everyone else. Granted I’ve only bought VWs that were strictly built in Germany.
They are far more fun to drive than Toyota or any other econobox equivalent and can get great gas mileage if you know how to drive a car.
From what I’ve heard VWs built in NA have QA issues.
Preshe8jaz@reddit
I never trusted that company after the emission scandal. They put out commercials for years pretending to be green and more efficient than a Prius, but it tuned out to be fraud from the top down.
ClaspedDread@reddit
I currently own a 2018 Volkswagen GTI with a 6 speed manual transmission. I bought it with 22k miles 4 years ago, and it's currently at 73k miles. This is my first VW and I have no brand loyalty. Let me give you some insight.
TLDR the car is great but the problems are numerous and annoying. VW is pathetic.
I absolutely love the car.... sometimes. It looks great, it's very comfortable, it's practical, it's very fun to drive, and it has all of the features I could want.
But, holy shit, this car has been painful. Let me give you a list of issues I had with this car.
One of the belts quietly squeaks sometimes when I turn the wheel to the left. The belt has been replaced but the problem persisted. I couldn't figure it out, and neither could a VW dealer or 2 different independent VW specialty shops figure it out either. I just live with it now.
The water pump had to be replaced three times because it would warp (it's plastic) and leak coolant everywhere. Yes, three different times. It's a very common issue on these cars. The first two water pumps were covered under warranty, the third one was not.
The oil pan (also plastic) warped and refused to seal properly, so it would spray oil everywhere from the seams. A new gasket didn't fix it, so I had to replace the whole oil pan. I decided to buy a metal one. No leaks now, but the car did run low on oil because of the issue.
The left rear brake caliper cracked and leaked brake fluid everywhere. It wasn't the brake line, the actual caliper developed a very small crack. Another person I know owns a 2017 Jetta and he had the same thing happen. I replaced the caliper and the brake lines just to be safe.
The turbocharger waste gate (electic motor that controls boost pressure) sometimes gets stuck closed, which puts the car into a limp mode. The fix is easy but it keeps happening, and I can't imagine this continuous issue is good for the turbo.
Water leaks in the interior. I don't know how this is even an issue anymore. The area where the spare tire goes was flooded with water. The passenger floor was soaked with water.
The trunk issue was caused by three, THREE, different issues. The drain hose behind the VW badge snapped (common issue, of course it is), so water would just drain into the trunk area. The tail light seals failed, so water would seep past them and drip down behind the plastic panels. Finally, there are air pressure vents in the trunk area located behind the rear bumper. Those seals failed too and water would pool up.
The passenger issue was caused by the A/C drain hose seal failing.
I'm just dumbfounded by how many dumb issues this car has had. I don't race the car or drive it super crazy. This was my first VW, but it may be my last.
Malakai0013@reddit
Sometime around the 2000s or 2010s they started to extremely overengineer and overdesign their cars. They stopped making simple cars that were easy to keep running. They stopped being "the affordable German brand" and became the little brother to Audi, which are made for people who can afford those repair quotes of just buy a new Audi every four years.
MrBiggleswerth2@reddit
I’m a mechanic. I see a lot of cooling system, evap, and electrical issues with Volkswagens at low mileage. They can be a bear to work on and parts are expensive. I would never own one. There are plenty of better engineered and more reliable vehicles.
Cinderpath@reddit
It’s peculiar, on Germany, Europe, obviously they are great cars, easy to work on, and every mechanic knows them, spare parts are cheap. So like anything it’s familiarity, and availability locally. The TDI 2.0 Turbodiesel is amazing. I get 58 mpg in my wagon.
LiesInRuins@reddit
Electrical problems are a major turn-off (no pun intended). They are often tough to troubleshoot, companies pretend there is no issue and won’t repair it. Older VWs didn’t have these problems, it’s more of a modern VW thing. Regular maintenance doesn’t fix electrical issues.
superanth@reddit
For me it’s Dieselgate. They put so much effort into lying to their customers that there’s no way I trust them not to make their cars unsafe to the driver in some way.
croppedcross3@reddit
My buddy had a Passat that had a electrical problem. The car randomly wouldn't start, and when it didn't, it had to be towed. He had it towed to the dealership five times and "fixed" before he said fuck it and sold the car.
xampl9@reddit
I had a 1995 Jetta GLX and something expensive broke yearly. Plus small things went wrong routinely, like the door trim falling off. The dealer was also sub-par in every respect (sales, service, and parts departments were all incompetent)
Ok sure that was 30 years ago and that was a Mexican built car. What about now? I test-drove a US made Passat and found three defects without even trying hard. And the dealer insisted that all cars depreciate at the same rate when it came to trade in value. So little had changed.
OkCoast5312@reddit
The reputation is well-deserved and long standing. Do not buy an old VW. You’d have better living with an old Plymouth.
I haven’t looked into this in a while, but your “why” question has several answers.
They used to make systems dependent upon each other. IDK if this still works the same but when one electrical component failed, a series of issues would pop up, not just one.
Hard to find parts and hard to find mechanics. This has been the story for decades. How could this still be a problem? I think it still is.
So, you have the combination of design failures that cause frequent breakdowns and then the inability to get it repaired easily and cheaply.
When you hear people brag about German engineering, ask them who built the A-bomb, landed a man on the moon, and developed the Internet. 👌🏻
67442@reddit
I was at a VW Dealership just this today. Picked up a Jetta that was in for recall work,Rental Company. The Big one. Place was like a morgue. One guy in service, one salesman on his phone. Very quiet.
ms_merry@reddit
Lonely as the Maytag repairman?
67442@reddit
He looked really bored. He must have sold his 1-2 for the month. This was in Grand Blanc Michigan,GM territory.
LITTELHAWK@reddit
They often require specialty tools to work on. Nothing they currently make really stands out, besides the microbus. Pricing is equal with competitors. They don't have a pickup in America. They don't have the reliability of a Toyota or Honda. They don't have the safety rating of a Volvo or Subaru. Need more?
lunchbox651@reddit
Genuinely curious what specialty tools are needed, I never needed anything VW specific when working on my own. The only odd thing, compared to local cars, was torx wrenches.
yeawrongperson@reddit
I was in your shoes before, you must not own a newer Audi that’s why I say it. My 2021 A4 will requires VCDS, a $200 cable and software to unlock ebrake retraction for rear pads and rotors when I wanna replace them, you need it for coding a new battery if you wanna replace it, you need it for transmission adaptations if you change your fluids out, and some other dumb stuff.
lunchbox651@reddit
Yeah nuh, newest I've worked on is a MK5 GTI. I typically don't like working on cars even that new.
lunchbox651@reddit
Yeah nuh, newest I've worked on is a MK5 GTI. I typically don't like working on cars even that new.
Weary-Astronaut1335@reddit
Timing tools?
DilapidatedPlum@reddit
Some require triple square sockets/wrenches for the axles. But I'd rather have that than the setup that some Camry's have.
howrunowgoodnyou@reddit
Those cost $12. For a set. I don’t really see how that’s a big deal. Triple square is a great fastener type that doesn’t strip.
mmmmmyee@reddit
When your local mompop mechanic see the same tool for 100+ at the snapon truck (because of course they’ll only shop at snapon, and that’s if they stock it), yeah they’ll pass and send you to the local euro shop that charges $200 an hr lol.
DilapidatedPlum@reddit
Oh Ik I have a bunch of sets since I've lost them only to find them again after I've bought some.
ShittyPhoneSupport@reddit
Right? Like, i have computers and electronics with torx. And the "special" socket for the "triple square" cost me a whopping 5 bucks.
20 bucks on amazon gets you a set of sockets and bits that have every kind you would need for vw. Is it different? Sure. Is it drastically expensive? Not in my experience, as someone who has owned 2 vws from the last 10 years
KillerKittenwMittens@reddit
I wish more manufacturers would use etorx, specifically. What an amazing socket those are. They seat right every time.
MeIsMyName@reddit
They're great until you find out the last guy just stuck his hex socket on there and fucked up the splines. :(
lunchbox651@reddit
Yeah maybe it's the IT worker in me that doesn't see torx and things like that as a big deal.
LITTELHAWK@reddit
I remember the Torx, a special wrench for something, and a special socket for something else. I didn't think it was all that bad, but my brother-in-law sure made a big deal about it every time we did something with his car. Maybe he was just buying metric stuff one at a time.
vilius_m_lt@reddit
Everything in passanger vehicles is metric nowdays. It’s been like that for a while
New_Courage1259@reddit
Yeah but the amount of triple square bit fasteners on a VW is ridiculous when pretty much every other brand uses regular metric hex head fasteners.
LITTELHAWK@reddit
I am aware.
No-Candidate-2380@reddit
Since when Torx is a special tool?
lunchbox651@reddit
I get that, I'm Australian so whenever I had to get imperial stuff I'd bitch about it too.
SevroAuShitTalker@reddit
Iirc its more than just metric (most people have a dual set here too), they have some proprietary type tools
vilius_m_lt@reddit
All manufacturers have proprietary tools.. you really can’t set the timing on 3.0 Duramax without $1000+ special tool set..
friendIdiglove@reddit
Yeah, because they didn’t key any of the sprockets.
Robins-dad@reddit
A torx fastener is super common these days in every brand. It requires a socket or bit, not a wrench.
Piney_Dude@reddit
The reverse torx are awesome (
KillerKittenwMittens@reddit
My favorite socket, I honestly wish they were used more
Sad_Construction_668@reddit
Triple Square Bits
lunchbox651@reddit
Interesting, not something I've needed but thank you for the link!
BelongingsintheYard@reddit
I needed triple square on my 1990 Audi.
vilius_m_lt@reddit
Volvos use those too
mHo2@reddit
This should be enough to convince you. Yes I have one.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/audi-vw-long-hex-bit-socket-cta-tools-8541
ThePoltageist@reddit
Who makes sway bar end links out of fucking plastic as well? I had one snap and it will definitely be replaced with the metal aftermarket one, one of the few times I would say going aftermarket helps your vehicles value is a major improvement of a known failure point.
lunchbox651@reddit
Is that really that specific? it's just a hex bit and extension. Socket extensions and hex bits aren't uncommon.
Materials and design choices - definitely hit and miss with VW (see: plastic oil pans) but that happens with every manufacturer. I don't think I've ever worked on a car (I'm no mechanic obvs) and not seen at least something that felt silly for the sake of cost efficiency or space savings.
mHo2@reddit
You need it to be very skinny or it won’t fit in the manifold. Extensions will get stuck. Trust me, you need that.
lunchbox651@reddit
Makes sense. Cheers for clarifying.
KillerKittenwMittens@reddit
It's just people complaining about torz and triple square which will cost all of like $20 for a set on Amazon.
Hersbird@reddit
They don't use torx, they use triple square. They also use different diagnostic tools that need to communicate with the car for simple things like a brake job.
DoctorDblYou@reddit
Audi shares the same diagnostic tool. It was $400 to get the caliper pins to retract.
KillerKittenwMittens@reddit
It's $200 to buy vcds and you now own the tool and can do all of it whenever you want. It's really not that big of a deal when you consider a half decent obd scan tool is almost half that anyway.
If you're really cheap or need real dealer level software you can just sail the seas for odis
SpreadStrict1867@reddit
They use both. You have no clue what you're talking about
clintj1975@reddit
They've used all of them over the years - regular hex, 12 point, triple square, and Torx. My Mk4 had mostly hex and Torx, and the front axle nuts needed a 12 point socket if you needed to swap wheel bearings out. Lots of non-reusable TTY bolts, too.
b8nmsguy@reddit
Every single bolt I’ve encountered on my VW is either a Torx or a 10mm XZN bolt which is a very special tool. VW also has a special tool to remove their oil drain plugs and sometimes their computers are incompatible or not helpful when you use a regular OBDII so you need a $200-$1,200 scanner like VAG-COM or ODIS.
lunchbox651@reddit
I don't remember ever needing XZN, what did you need them for?
Is the sump plug tool for newer VW? I'm pretty sure my MKV and MKIV were just 10/12mm sockets.
Yeah OBD thing is fair - I did get a Foxwell unit specifically because it was really good for my gen golfs.
b8nmsguy@reddit
EA888 satan bolt! Took me a good 35 minutes to take off lol
beer_curmudgeon@reddit
My wife had a newish Tiguan for a bit, and apparently they needed a special connector in order to remove the oil cap.
She would only then go to that specific shop, since t She couldn't be sure a random oil change place also had this special bit.
vilius_m_lt@reddit
You don’t
lunchbox651@reddit
To remove the oil cap? Not the filter? I haven't owned a Tiguan so I can't be sure but I can't find anything unique about their oil change process. Would be happy to be corrected.
beer_curmudgeon@reddit
My intel is like... 3rd hand? Plus several years, plus i didnt fully invest in the story. So. Some details could be wrong.
'Anything is possible' - Barbie
lunchbox651@reddit
All good, thanks all the same
ms_merry@reddit
If you don’t know why are you sharing
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
Those are fair points, but I don’t think it’s that one-sided. Yeah, they don’t dominate in one category like Toyota with reliability or Volvo/Subaru with safety, but they still offer a good balance of driving feel, interior quality, and refinement compared to a lot of competitors. And while they may need more careful maintenance, it doesn’t mean they’re bad cars, just less forgiving if you don’t stay on top of things.
I think the bigger issue is they don’t really stand out strongly in one area, so people just default to brands that clearly win in something.
just_a_random_guy733@reddit
I definitely think that driving feel is underrated. A 2012 Golf handles nicer than a 2025 Corolla.
Brownfletching@reddit
I think the maintenance/repair aspect is a bigger deal than you think. My parents had an 03 v6 Passat when I was just learning how to drive (pretty awesome car tbh). It sprung a pretty substantial power steering leak at one point. I remember it took nearly a week before we could find a mechanic that was willing to work on the thing. We finally found a speciality euro mechanic who was over an hour away who fixed it. The parts alone were over $1000, in 2008 money. VW had, for reasons known only to them, moulded like 4 different, otherwise unrelated parts all together out of the same piece of plastic, in some unholy amalgamation of random tubes and wires. So, you had to replace about half the car for that one small leak. It wasn't much longer after that we traded it in for a new Hyundai instead.
Asian companies and most American companies don't do stuff like that with their engineering. Anyone who consults a non-euro mechanic before buying a car will probably get warned away from VW. Hence, part of why they never "caught on."
I do think competition is also a big part of it though. Nearly every quality they have is done as well or better by another company. Couple that with a reputation for below average reliability, and any company would struggle.
kod@reddit
The GTI is basically alone in its segment, seems like it stands out
Ozuar@reddit
And the Golf R is excellent
flaiks@reddit
Maybe in NA but in Europe we have shitloads of hot hatches, or at least did before they all started getting replaced with EV versions.
LITTELHAWK@reddit
Compact hatch? Crosstrek, Impreza, Bolt, Trax, RAV4, Corolla, Prius...
ChingyBingyBongyBong@reddit
Uhh a GTI is a trackable hot hatch…
Fun-Grab-9337@reddit
What the fuck even is this list lol
Rox217@reddit
Comparing a RAV4 to a GTI is absolutely hilarious.
kod@reddit
None of those are even remotely hot hatches
SpecificBookkeeper43@reddit
Except the gr Corolla, which I’m sure OP didn’t consider because he’s just throwing out cars that are egg shaped
-jakeh-@reddit
They need a special tool to depress the caliper piston on the brakes but they lend them to you at autozone. That took me an hour of frustration to figure out, I’d done so many brakes and my car wife finally made me watch a video on how to depress the caliper, damn it’s got me watching videos before I do anything even if I’ve done it before.
Robins-dad@reddit
Who said that? I sell tools to mechanics and the only tools VW (and Audi and a few other German brands) need that are uncommon are triple square sockets.
I think the reputation is based on older models where QC was lacking. I had a 2017 GTI that I drove for 140,000+ miles. It did have the common water pump/thermostat housing leak but it was covered under the 60,000 mile powertrain warranty. Every brand has their quirks. I did regular maintenance and paid attention.
Traditional_Can_3983@reddit
I bet VW Currywurst needs a special one off too to eat.
bigred83@reddit
They do have the reliability of Honda and Toyota. Honda and Toyota are both in the shitter right now
CW_Forums@reddit
Toyota and Honda both at the top of Consumer Reports reliability:
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/car-reliability-owner-satisfaction/who-makes-the-most-reliable-cars-a7824554938/?ez_cid=CLIENT_ID(AMP_ECID_EZOIC)
TheActualPhock@reddit
VW now makes 1-1.5 liter cars with 3 cylinders. Such engine resource is expected to be very low, as it revs in high rpm range to produce enough power to get the shitbox moving. Any higher capacity NA engine will outlast these engines at least 3x of mileage, because they don’t need to rev in highs to output same amount of power (to get you going basically), so less rpms, less heat, less wear. Not to mention vw now has a lineup similar to homeless dog breed counts.
Spudtater@reddit
Had a Passat Diesel. SOB’s lied to me and everyone else about the emissions. They lost all credibility during Dieselgate. I would never give them another dime. There are better and more dependable vehicles out there.
stupidfock@reddit
Misconceptions, past business moves that sucked and getting lumped in with their luxury counter parts.
VW is plenty reliable and fine. Actually easy to work on tbh.
VW tanked a lot of their rep for in the US when they tried to make VW brand luxury too not just Audi and above. Made them too expensive, zero market fit, and made people align them more with higher end German cars which usually have the issues not the low end ones. That wasn’t even that long ago, like two decades back. So they are still recovering from that reputation. Not to mention they even put a v12 in one back then which is obviously not aligning ur brand with reliability or reasonableness lol. Was the Phaeton in the 2000s, built on a Bentley platform
Tome_Bombadil@reddit
Wife had an Atlas.
Brakes wore out very quickly, lot of chattering/squealing, progressed to thrumming from the rear. Whatever. I buy new pads and rotors, I'll change them.
I try using my OBD2 dongle to release the electronic parking brake, no luck.
I assume it wants a real scanner, I buy a highly reviewed proper scanner specifically good with German makes.
No luck.
Ask my neighbor who manages an Oil Change place if I was missing something, he tries it. No luck, he drives back to his shop, gets the $5,000+ Autel and brings it back.
No luck.
Finally i just take it to a brake place. They get it done, i ask them how they released the electronic parking brake. He says they had to apply a 5v power to it locally. He jumped it with bare wires.
The brakes start chattering and thrusting less than 10k miles later.
There was no way in the car or its software that worked to release the electronic parking brake. It just applied it, and disregarded anything to release it.
Tomthumb1990@reddit
They’re complex, pricey and not for stupid people that skip maintenance. Best cars I’ve ever owned hands down.
yureku_the_potato@reddit
Just get a Saab
Acceptable_Golf_8623@reddit
Electrical issues are a massive headache. You cant skimp on maintenance.
Those 2 things alone are enough to put anybody off owning one
Radiant-Video7257@reddit
Repairs are expensive and not always easy enough to do oneself. Not the most reliable car you can get in the price bracket.
rzugorzyt@reddit
> - Their engines seem pretty solid overall
No, because you never know which one is fucked up or not. VW has long records of producing shitty engines mixed with average ones. They had absolute disasters in their range like 1.8 TFSI or 1.4 TSI twincharged or family of engines, where some were ok, but some were junk. You have to master engine codes before finding a car to buy. Great examples are 2.0 TDI and 1.9 TDI.
> - A lot of complaints are more about electrical issues and smaller stuff rather than major engine failure
Electrical issues nowadays are more important than engine issues.
> - People always say you need to be strict with maintenance for a VW to last long
Yes, because these cars are paper-made and can't withstand any slightest service neglect.
Chemical_Support4748@reddit
go buy one
Mattynice75@reddit
Expensive for routine services. Very expensive for when anything goes wrong.
PearlMillingCompany@reddit
I’ve heard that US Volkswagens don’t have as good build quality compared to german manufactured Volkswagens. German cars have stricter maintenance requirements and Americans don’t keep up with preventative maintenance as much as Europeans.
allisayisbeautiful@reddit
Some are made in mexico also, like fiat. Thats a big no no for me. Not sure if we actually get those though.
yogaballcactus@reddit
I suspect it is true that Americans don’t keep up with the maintenance as much. But other cars sold in America deal a lot better with neglect than German cars do. Sometimes the use case calls for something that can be beat up and put away wet without breaking or leaving you stranded.
ms_merry@reddit
So never owned one?
Eodbro12@reddit
For me personally, I bought a used Volkswagen GTI as my first grown up car with no co-signer. I loved it, one of my favorite cars of all time.
However.
The electrical gremlins were a nightmare. One time the entire left side of my car stopped working. The culprit? Bad window control module. I had an advanced obd2 reader. Went through the codes, and on my third replacement I gave up and took it to Volkswagen. Turns out they had to program it. Took 5 minutes. The cost? 300$ for the programming on top of the 250 ish I’d already spent on controllers.
That was the first car I ever had where I realized that no matter how good you are mechanically, if you can’t reprogram modules you’re useless. It honestly broke my heart. My shitty old land rover was more serviceable at that time.
Because of that I just never bought another one. I’ve had Subarus fords and Hyundais and with regular maintenance I’ve never had problems like that again. Maybe I was unlucky idk.
markmakesfun@reddit
VW=death from a thousand papercuts. Blaming it on the owner is bullshit. On my wife’s car, the trim fell off the side of it driving down the street. What deferred maintenance produced that? The gas pedal stopped working because a rubber grommet rotted away and fell off. How was that my wife’s fault? I could give a half dozen more, but it’s too depressing to remember.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
Yeah that’s fair — stuff like trim falling off or a pedal issue definitely isn’t “maintenance,” that’s just build quality / materials. I think that’s where a lot of the frustration with VW comes from, it’s not always major failures, it’s a bunch of random small issues adding up, which is honestly worse for daily ownership. So yeah, I get why people call it “death by a thousand cuts.” Even if the engine is fine, dealing with that kind of stuff would get old fast.
confuus-duin@reddit
I beg to differ, the papercuts are easily repairable yourself. Changed the window buttons last year on my 2013 Skoda Octavia with a ridiculously small 1,2L TSI Volkswagen engine. I have carried many heavy loads for days without any problems, suspension is getting worse though. It started complaining when I drove 180km/h for a little too long, but it still brought me home fine while staying in low rpm’s. Paid less than €800 for a full service, obligatory yearly inspection and the engine trouble fixed. Drives perfectly again and we’re around 270k kilometers. I’m planning on making it to 300k.
Careful-Sell-9877@reddit
Most of the issues were with older models
usernameHELP101@reddit
Our tiguan, 2012 tfsi shit itself before 12,000km . Engine Needed a rebuild. It was serviced as VW wanted, it had an Easy life
lefthook_hospital@reddit
The tale of blaming it on the owner with VWs is a straight up myth, I had a GTI for 12 years and it was insanely frustrating needing to bring it into the shop for work 1-2 times a year on top of oil changes and scheduled maintenance items. Once I was out of warranty each trip was also quite expensive and took several hours to get things fixed. It was absolutely comedic that I had water pumps fail two years in a row on the same month (March 2013 and March 2014). Sure it was covered under warranty, but waiting for hours for a tow and then spending more hours at the dealership is not a fun experience.
Successful_Cress6639@reddit
You would think the Nazi founded car model would at least have reliable controls to turn on the gas.
john_a1985@reddit
That's fucking metal.
I have never been so conflicted between upvoting and downvoting a comment.
Bravo!
Oceanbreeze871@reddit
My old Jetta the dipstick handle snapped off. It was a piece of plastic glued to a piece of metal.
My automatic windows broke and fell into the door, shattering, 4 different times because the system was designed with plastic clips instead of metal.
The glove box handle snapped off. I’m there was a little plastic hinge piece that went.
That’s all design cheapness.
Scary-Detail-3206@reddit
We had an 07 rabbit with only 160k kms in it when we traded it in. I liked the car but it had constant evap system issues that we paid tons of labour to try and resolve. Most of the front suspension failed within the first 100k kms and that all had to be replaced. There was significant body rust but there was a warranty on that at least so we had more than half the body panels replaced.
Pure-Efficiency-8432@reddit
I had an ‘09 Rabbit. Traded it in at 120k miles. Passenger seat wouldn’t move (handle broke off), windows would roll themselves down after being rolled up, roof liner fell down and had to be repaired, oil pan leaked (didn’t even hit anything), side mirror fried itself and looked like it was lit on fire, radio fried at like 80k, and it ate car batteries for breakfast.
I still loved that damn car tho
usernameHELP101@reddit
Some of the absolute crap the VW dealer tried to tell us was absurd...
ziganaut@reddit
Death from a thousand paper cuts just about sums it up. When I had my GTI, minor things broke that I never had break or heard of breaking on any car that me or my friends/family/coworkers owned. Just stupid stuff that is inconvenient and costly to fix like rear defroster fuse blowing over and over, headliner sagging horribly, power windows working when they feel like it, bad interior rattles that randomly come and go just to name a few. Oh and the damn check engine lights…
But the car drove great and never left me stranded. That’s how VW sells cars — they drive really well.
ScaryfatkidGT@reddit
My 2014 Tiguan has lasted longer than my 2002 Highlander did…
However the Haldex AWD system has given us some trouble that several places told us required a $6000 whole new rear axle… turns out you just need to clean the “non serviceable” filter.
Daseagle@reddit
Hey. The classic saying in my part of the world was, that your wife can be from the next village, but your car has to be from Germany.
Alas, we grew out of that.
Now, they're:
Simply the value proposition isn't there anymore. When you need an electronics specialist far more than a mechanic to fix a car, that should tell you that somewhere, you took several wrong turns in your design process.
CaliforniaNavyDude@reddit
Personally I don't think their bad reputation is earned. Some can be problematic, but they aren't the worst offenders. Chevrolet and its subbrands have seen the biggest fall in recent years. The lamda platform vehicles, the Cruz, modern pickups and full size SUV's, all I recommend people avoid like the plague. Stellantis is equally terrible with many of its models, but Dodge was never high up in reliability anyway. Chevrolet was once. And Tesla? Poorly built from day one. It was excusable when they were just getting started but no more.
Lykos767@reddit
I have a 2021 Jetta and it's been mostly fine but if I didn't already own a bunch of tools from working on my old ford truck and jeep cherokee I would have had it at a shop twice this year so far for loose bolts in the doors.
PackageDangerous6837@reddit
Have had two -- 2020 Jetta and 2024 Taos. Like any manufacturer you want to skip the first year or two of new generations. VWs drive nicer than any other mainstream car. They don't have that power steering overboosted to numbness that Asian manufacturers have and they don't handle like a dog like American manufacturers. Interiors, even on base models, are much, much better than everyone else. If you keep getting new ones right before the warranty runs out you never have to worry about how much repairs cost!
SlimChris94@reddit
Over engineered German bullshit. They’re 20 years ahead of their time. Slow your roll and make it more efficient / cheaper to produce. The headliners gonna fall down in 7.5 years anyways. The end.
No_Win7658@reddit
Are these reliability Numbers based on asking people for perception or are they real? Careful with things like that.
That being said, VW is far from the overengineered stuff it comes from
404notfound420@reddit
They are built to expire at 100k miles due to planned obsolescence. Sure they can run a bit longer but they all get electrical failures, rust and burn oil and become uneconomical to repair. In Europe 100k miles is decent for a car then it's basically scrap. They also lost alot of reputation with the whole diesel gate thing a few years ago.
No_Session_2659@reddit
vw electrical gremlins are real and mechanics hate chasing them down which tanks resale value and reputation way more than a blown engine would
ojiisam@reddit
My sister had a Jetta and the seats were hard
Gumb1i@reddit
When I have to pull the entire front clip to do basic maintenance and repair that is a no go for me.
6randcru@reddit
If you lease, VW are great. They handle really well. The cheap plastic everywhere that makes it not an Audi starts to break in year two. Year three it’s time to start shopping
RecommendationUsed31@reddit
Ive had my egolf for 6 years. Its been probably the nicest car ive owned. Changed the tires and thats it
BCNEP@reddit
I have owned 5 modern VAG products.
Besides the SQ5 (which did not have a single issue in 2 years of owner ship), these cars all share the 2.0 TFSI, gen 3 or later.
Earlier models of their 2.0 had oil consumption issues, as well as other gremlins, but by gen 3 those were mostly eliminated. I have had 3 gen 3s and currently have a gen 4. The only consistent problem I have found with these engines is premature water pump and thermostat failure, but this is a known issue in the community and is to be expected. Additionally it is covered under warranty if you’re still within it. I have had 2 fail, both golf Rs. One a gen 3, the other a gen 4. It sucked momentarily, but it was fixed in 2 days for free and off I went.
Otherwise I have experienced some electrical issues, mainly with my current 2024. Occasionally, less than once a month, my dome light controls don’t work so I can’t turn on the lights or adjust the sunroof. The next time I start the vehicle, the issue goes away. Haven’t even bothered mentioning it to the dealer.
Finding mechanics to work on the car is no problem. Any euro shop will do it if you must go independent, and otherwise dealership experience has been great, they even honor my Canadian imports warranty. Maintenance costs are standard, and I would bet my life you’re paying the same at the Toyota or Honda dealership. You definitely are at the GM and stellantis dealerships.
Maintenance intervals are pretty standard. I usually change my oil every 5k , but could easily go 10k. If you have AWD you need to maintain that as well, but more like 40k miles.
Tuning and modding potential is unreal, a stage 1 tune from a legitimate tuner on a golf r can push you towards 400hp/400ft-lbs torque with just your cellphone and a cable. The only supporting mod you really need is better spark plugs which will run you about $100. All in $600 for damn near 25% power gains.
Add to that tha they look great and have high quality interiors. If you see any complaining about capacitive touch on the steering wheel ignore it, literally no fat finger issues in almost 2 years of ownership.
I could keep going but I’ll stop. I own a 2026 Lexus too btw so I do see the value in other popular brands, I just have had a special place in my heart for VW since I first started driving.
JamieAmpzilla@reddit
Dishonesty baked within the company DNA. Alltrack Sunroof example-manufacturing defect from poor design causes sunroof drains to be easily plugged and then they overflow into passenger compartment. Manual says nothing about the need to clean sunroofs, but massive complaints lead the company to recommend cleaning the sunroof drains every 3 years. Except, there are two more sunroof drains not mentioned in owner or service manuals that also need to be cleaned, but they require partial dissemble over the interior to reach. VW as a manufacturer has been deeply dishonest about this whole affair.
Changing front headlights is usually simple. Not in an Alltrack. You need to pry out the tire well liner to get to the light assembly. Not user friendly.
Many great aspects to the car, but the manufacturer has no trustworthiness. The Dieselgate lack of morality continues.
BHG_702@reddit
I’ve only owned 1 VW and it was a 2.5l Jetta. It was a solid car, I will say however, they are a royal pain in the ass to work on. I can’t imagine the more complicated engines. I’m a BMW guy tho so it could just be my bias, but working on a VW reminded me of working on a Ford. Gotta pull out the engine to change a light bulb an shit (not really) 😂
jlwolford@reddit
When I went shopping for a daily the iron block e888 engine in the GTI stood out for being a robust engine. It is capable of extreme horsepower. I know about the water pump life etc, but about like my vintage BMWs. The core is without comparison for an I4. Honda and Toyota have some serious issues. I can deal with the ancillary parts. Looking at you Honda 1.5t with blown head gasket.
Carguycr@reddit
VWs and Skodas are taxis in other countries they are pretty sturdy when well maintained with the basics. The only thing I can say bad about VW after having a couple is the electrics like accessories sometimes go haywire. Think the alarm, central lock, power windows things like that.
vahmer@reddit
Have you seen a volkswagen? They’re so dull, i’ll better buy a toyota, it will last longer at least
nilecrane@reddit
I haven’t been in a vw in a while but I remember the interiors were hard and cold to me. Those were a pasat, a Jetta, and a new bug.
Chaz_wazzers@reddit
VW has had the most yo-yo sales in North America going back as long as I can remember. Usually - nice interiors, nice stying, which brings in new buyers - then they get burned by quality issues, reliability then sales crash, then models get refreshed and cycle repeats.
PugDriver@reddit
2 of my favorite cars - '82 Scirocco and '16 GTI Autobahn
Impressionist_Canary@reddit
I’ve had 4, im doing my part
FriedChicken4Dayzz@reddit
I’m currently at 240,000km on a MK7 Golf SportWagen and have done regular maintenance as well as replaced the high pressure fuel pump, thermostat (under warranty way back) and maybe one or two other non-routine parts but great overall! Car doesn’t live a low mile life and is driven in all weather including real winter with salt. Car should be good to pass 300,000km without issue based on how many things I’ve replaced recently.
Tezzmond@reddit
Never own a European car, always lease them, and never own one about if warranty. There is a reason they have low resale values compared to Japanese etc.
FRYETIME@reddit
My grandma had a VW and that thing was the biggest piece of shit
basshed8@reddit
Germans punish vw owners for driving their car 50km past a brake service or an oil change
PoeticDeath@reddit
Everyone I have known that owns a VW, raves about them when they are new. But they always seem to hit a point where absolutely everything starts to just fall apart.
Holls867@reddit
I don’t prefer to work in them
Possible_Marketing32@reddit
German cars are reliable you just need to be on top of maintenance an Audi can't be treated like a Toyota they need to be driven hard German cars don't like slow traffic and be on time with maintenance especially oil changes I've worked on plenty high mileage VWs, Audis, Mercs and BMWs that had maintenance done when it's due and they live long happy lives
ChocolateVisual1637@reddit
Got a 2012 sportwagon with 104k. Just got a 100k check up and she's running beautifully. Had some issues with the sunroof in the beginning but I couldn't be happier.
howrunowgoodnyou@reddit
My 04 chipped 1.8T vw has been excellent.
RandomGen-Xer@reddit
European makes, in general, have been "avoid at all costs" to me for all the years I've been driving. More expensive to fix, often requiring specialty tools, and lots of them are plagued with electrical problems.
BabaThoughts@reddit
I’ve owned many. Good cars.
Gringuin007@reddit
Uhhhh f VW. And F Audi. 💩dealer. 💩service. 💩parts. No star across the board. New depreciates like mad. CPO and they don’t honor warranty. So yeah f Audi
The_ENFIDL@reddit
Electrical problems, expensive maintenance and repairs, and if you want to work on it yourself you'll need specialty tools too.
HobsHere@reddit
On top of the electrical problems, several VW models are known for needing very pricey suspension work at or before 100k miles. Japanese cars usually go longer on original suspension parts, and are much cheaper to repair if they don't.
Sea-Rip3902@reddit
Never again. Junk
Toiletpirate@reddit
I think this was maybe true a couple of decades ago but now every car costs a fortune to fix.
z0mbiemechanic@reddit
You can buy every tool you could possibly need on Amazon. If you plan on doing the work yourself.
nuttgod@reddit
For what it's worth at this point in the thread, my immediate family and myself have owned no fewer than 15 VAG cars including Volkswagen, Audi, and Porsche vehicles ranging from early 80s to 2024 model years.
We have never had a car fail on us in any catastrophic way, most of which made it to or above 200k miles before being sold in good driving condition. They do not require any crazy specialty tools. A set of torx sockets for sure, and maybe a set e-torx, and triple square sockets. Less than $100 for everything at harbor freight. There are numerous affordable options for scanners for VAG-COM diagnostics. Aftermarket support for volkswagens is excellent. Factory service manuals are literally available for download.
Resources like FCP Euro, Pelican, and ECS Tuning are huge for their lifetime part replacement policies. As in, you pay for an oil change once and dont pay for it again.
Also, with a volkswagen, the paint wont look terrible in 10 years, it'll be more comfortable, more refined, a better ride, and quieter than any competition in the segment. I will say that volkswagen has not been proactive in making a super compelling hybrid or EV.
Literally just do the service on time yourself, and/or take it to a competent Euro mechanic and these cars will treat you well. Most of the advice you see about avoiding german cars is from people who bang rocks together, or wait for dash lights to show up to make a service appointment. Its a german car with german sensibilities, don't be dumb. Use a torque wrench, use the manual, use genuine, OE, or OEM quality parts.
Altruistic_Cover_998@reddit
Vw hasn’t made a dependable car since the bug.
cisforcar@reddit
Rank so low as in reliability? Because in terms of popularity they are second only to Toyota. They are very popular in our HCOL city. Driving in the city you’re going to see a lot of golfs, tiguans, atlas.
Juliuscesear1990@reddit
Have you seen what you need to do to swap an air filter on some of them? If they over engineer something like that what else have they done? The cost to maintain/repair them is also incredibly high
engmadison@reddit
I have to unscrew like 6 bolts in my 2019 Jetta...what do other models need?
LordOnionRingle@reddit
Same with my 2019 Tiguan took me a couple minutes.
ms_merry@reddit
Which one did you drive.
Juliuscesear1990@reddit
None, I was looking at buying one but that and the plastic oil pan worried me
ms_merry@reddit
Ah okay
ubsurd_retort@reddit
I've owned multiple VW's and the dealership service is terrible and the cars develop rattles after 30k miles. Ive also had multiple electrical issues that are solved only to show up the next morning again. Really badly made cars
Why-tf-not@reddit
To change the headlight bulb on our vw Jetta, I had to jack up the front, remove the wheel, remove the fender liner, and loosen a few screws, then put everything back together. It took two hours. Would be faster the second time but this was the first time. My current truck I need to remove one plastic clip holding in an access panel, pull a rubber cover and replace the bulb. Takes about 5 min. My old Toyota, I needed to pop the hood and twist the bulb out of the back of the headlight. Takes at most two min. This goes for almost every basic maintenance task on the vehicle. The vw was a lot of fun to drive, got great fuel economy, but every maintenance task was a pain in the ass to do.
Jt8726@reddit
Maybe it's not as common anymore but VW has history of electrical issues and not reliable.
j526w@reddit
I’ve they have issues, but my mk7 gti has only one major issue and has 176k miles currently. Tuned and redline daily but i stay on point with the maintenance 🤷🏽♂️
itsjakerobb@reddit
Electrical issues are often the most difficult kind to diagnose and resolve. Not always expensive, but elusive. You can’t fix it if you can’t figure it out.
Some cars tolerate lazy maintenance better.
hind3rm3@reddit
Because they are vanilla ice cream.
Leverkaas2516@reddit
I have a Jetta. It's nice, I like it. But it's been in the shop for minor stuff at least twice as much in the first 40k miles as any of the Japanese cars I've owned (Honda, Toyota, Subaru). Parts are more expensive. And it's unbelievably complicated in every way. The owner's manual is much, much thicker. It's like they couldn't stop adding features.
I got the Jetta cheap because the dealership couldn't seem to get any customer traffic right after Dieselgate. Time will tell whether it was a wise decision or not.
ScalarBoy@reddit
I own a 2013 Jetta 2.5 SE w/ 5M. It has 140k miles on it now. I had to think hard, but I only had 3 electrical issues. Twice I had replace the throttle body because it went into perminent limp mode. Online, they were about $50, and the swap takes 30 minutes. Now, I keep a spare in the trunk with the correct torx driver. So, no big deal.
The other issue was a faulty door lick actuator. I replaced the bad one with a new one after watching a YouTube video. Maybe it was $150 and 2 hours.
Other than that, just regular maintenance that I do every 5k miles.
TieStreet4235@reddit
Will always be some warning light on that dashboard, air bag sensors engine faults or whatever, windows not working, trim breaking. Long wait till the part comes from Germany
Mykonethreetripleone@reddit
Parts expensive. Hard to work on.
GoldBlueberryy@reddit
German manufacturer problems/cost without the German luxury.
Turbulent-Today830@reddit
They undercarriage and engine is mostly made of hard plastic; they’re complete 🐕 💩
jbochsler@reddit
Because I bought one once. Never fucking again.
If you gave me one it would be up for sale in minutes.
WatchStoredInAss@reddit
Perhaps because they are unreliable pieces of shit?
AgonizingGasPains@reddit
Because "reliability ratings" have nothing to do with how long a car will last. It is a marketing ploy, nothing more.
JD Powers, CR and other ranking organizations use the manufacturers data which only counts the number of warranty claims during the "initial warranty period" (which means different things to different manufacturers). Under this system, a blown transmission on a Honda ranks as "more reliable" than two smaller issues, like a cracked mirror and a loose visor, on a VW. Therefore, the VW (that will still get you to work) "sucks" compared to a Honda (stuck at the dealership waiting for a new transmission).
I only bought used cars old enough to have a large following, at which point the community around that car pretty much knows all the issues, how to correct it permanently, and how to save money doing it.
phtphongg@reddit (OP)
I get what you’re saying, and I agree that reliability ratings don’t always equal long-term durability.
But I wouldn’t say they’re completely meaningless either they still reflect how often things go wrong early on, even if they don’t weight major vs minor issues the way people expect.
I do like your point about buying used with a strong community though. At that stage, you get a much clearer picture of:
That probably gives a more real-world view of ownership than just looking at rankings alone.
AgonizingGasPains@reddit
Just remember the old adage that "correlation is not causation." Auto manufacturers, JD Power and CR would love you to continue to think that a car with an 83-reliability rating is "longer lasting" than one with a 79-reliability rating, when as you stated, it is only an indicator of the number of things that were asked to be corrected under warranty, not a metric like "how many of this year, make and model are still on the road 20 years later?"
BarnBuiltBeaters@reddit
I had an 2014 Audi A4 and loved that car. Everyone says its hard to work on but honestly it isnt besides the couple of extra tools you need. It was stupid reliable too....until it started consuming a quarter of oil every 400 miles. I supposedly bought the model that didnt have that issue, just at the time no one had enough miles on them yet. VAG lost my trust after that. Still miss the car though!
lunchbox651@reddit
I've owned 2 VWs and currently have a Skoda (VW with a hat, basically).
They are no less reliable than most other cars, a lot of the complaints either come from cars with known issues (the dry clutch DSG in the mid-2000s model VWs failing) or people fear the "euro tax".
There's a really prevalent idea that euros are so expensive to maintain, they are temperamental etc etc. It's not true (as a generalisation). Maintaining a VW is like any other car, service it properly and you'll be fine.
tbright1965@reddit
Owning a VW in a region where you can get a Skoda is different from owning a VW where 100 years is a long time.
(The joke is in Europe, 100 miles is a long distance and in America, 100 years is a long time.)
Different perspectives and realities in both places.
If I lived in Europe again, I'd probably own a VW or even a Skoda. (Really wanted to try one out as my rental car last year when I spent two weeks in Germany.)
Minimum_Persimmon281@reddit
I mean people in Europe drive less than Americans, but the differences aren’t that crazy. People only draw that conclusion when they compare statistics that aren’t comparable from Europe vs the US (mileage per car vs mileage per driver). Also, how the car is driven matters alot too.
The biggest difference between brand reputations is different models, engines, transmissions wtc i would say.
Also, If i had to guess, the guy above is from New Zealand or Australia, etc, not Europe.
lunchbox651@reddit
I don't live in Europe or the United States and I live in a very remote area (142 miles each way to get to a mechanic). It's still a non-issue.
tbright1965@reddit
Got it. I was careful to not say you lived in Europe. My experience is with the US and Europe as I've lived in both regions.
But, I can see where you may have thought I said you live in Europe.
I bet it's beautiful where you live.
lunchbox651@reddit
It's all good, I just wanted to be clear that I'm not in an area most would think owning a Skoda would be wise, yet I've had no issues at all because it's serviced on time by a reputable mechanic.
Thanks, it is pretty gorgeous down here.
lookingatmycouch@reddit
When I had my Saab, it was before I got into car repair other than oil changes. My first brake job cost like $1200 front brakes only, and that was back in the mid-'90s. Dealer sold me all kinds of nonsense like it needs special tools, special parts, thiings can brake if you DIY it, the electronics. I knew it was nonsense but paid the fee bc I needed to be able to drive.
Second time for brakes, the Internet was just getting good. I internetted doing a brake job on a Saab, found a great DIY forum. Verified that no, a brake job should not cost $1200. I think back then it was like $60 for pads and rotors. Got myself a good set of tools that I still have, and rarely have to take a car I own to the shop.
TLDR: If you can turn a doorknob and follow instructions, you can fix most things on a car, no matter where it's from.
lunchbox651@reddit
This is my mentality too.
gustyaeroplane81@reddit
Seeing the air filter box held by 14 bolts while the oil pan is glued on….
Majsharan@reddit
The Jetta/golf and atlas are the only cars they make that are good.
Get0utCl0wn@reddit
Bad electrical and no diesels
Opening-Cut-5684@reddit
Former vw sedan owner here I got it cheap and low miles and it was great for a long commute I had to make it had good gas mileage. The pros good gas mileage. The cons everything else. It was not a fun car to drive it wasn’t comfortable or had any cool tech features it sat low compared to any other sedan I’ve driven. The repair cost were stupid expensive and there was always something that needed to be done and it always required a special part, special tool, special price for everything and there was always an issue. When a light comes on it lights up your whole dash like a Christmas tree you don’t know if the tire pressure is low or the car is about to explode. I’ll never buy one again so so many better options.
olllooolollloool@reddit
They used to have soul, so I was willing to put up with the expensive parts/repairs, crayon smell, and rickety plastic interiors (I've have a Mk2, Mk3, and Mk4 Jetta). New VW's are either ruined by dieselgate emissions restrictions, made as cheaply as possible, or bland normieboxes. I bought a new Honda CR-V and hardly miss my VWs.
hawken54321@reddit
Corporate policy to cheat on diesel emissions several years ago. Engineers were ordered to pass emissions programming only during testing. Driving tests had more power and emissions which shocked other diesel manufacturers in Europe.
Just_blorpo@reddit
This may be fading now, but back in 2015 VW had a big scandal because they cheated on emissions tests using a software trick. It eroded trust. They paid huge fines. It may still be on some peoples minds.
homeslce@reddit
I had a VW Golf once. Worst car I ever owned. Windows would fall into the doors, power steering line leaked, Bosch this, Bosch that, all expense, all went bad. Bosch spark plug wires would go bad, sunroof leaked and car smelled like mold, burned oil and yes I changed the oil on time every time, airbag light came on the went away and then came on again, electrical issues are expensive , oh, the oxygen sensor went bad again, great, manual transmission stopped going into reverse because a plastic part broke, but hey, the engine was fine. Go ahead, buy one.
demdareting@reddit
Electrical issues. The were so great back on the day with the Rabbit, Scirocco and Jetta. Then they got into over engineering in the 2000s and they have never really recovered. Diesel Gate was a huge blow to them and they are still trying to find their way.
buttsnuggles@reddit
My VW is really nice to drive. It makes up for being slightly less reliable than other cars I’ve had.
It’s not sporty but it’s very composed and confident. It’ll also do long fast runs on the highway with no sweat.
Familymanjoe@reddit
I bought one. Probably doesn't count because I buy used and avoid a lot of depreciation. VW's management has lost its way. They need to get back to offering the vehicles we want with the engines we want.
Dieselgate only seemed to hit them even though other brands have gotten caught doing the same thing (and those vehicles were great and remain highly desirable).
Putting climate controls exclusively on the touch screen didn't help either but we're assured that's been corrected.
TheIronMonkey53@reddit
Never had an issue with my VWs. Had to golfs that each lasted 15 years and my wife had an Atlas now with no issues
Wild-Highway-8739@reddit
For starters there is VW's history and a very distant second is german cars are a pain in the ass to work on.
Timely_Chicken_8789@reddit
Quality is shit. Even the Wolfsburg models. A friend’s daughter used to work at a VW dealership and says they’ve been in the shitter for years.
OldDude1960@reddit
Back in my youth, well before anything electronic in them, VWs were good, mostly reliable cars. As were most other cars. Cars today are a nightmare of over engineering and electronic complexity.
I just traded in a 2014 Jetta base, with the 2 liter, soc and the 5 speed manual. It was a basic vehicle, 40 mpg, not much power - I had the car for 12 years and had no electronic or engine/transmission issues. The only real issue was oem coil spring breakage - something I'd never had an issue with before on any vehicle. I replaced them with aftermarket parts - no issues.
Over the years I did hear from friends and coworkers the had more high end versions of VW models, and that they were prone to electronic issues, and a couple that had turbo issues with the 1.8 liter engine.
xxxxCHExxxx@reddit
I’ve had 2 GTIs in my day and LOVED them both but what really turned me off about VW was the TDI scandal a few years back. There was a documentary that went over the scandal and left a bad taste in my mouth. nowadays I see the cars and see boring takes on sedans and SUVs. They also have a high cost to maintain which I’m glad to have in my rear view mirror.
duhjankywanky@reddit
I wonder how many of these comments are from 1st person encounters of these VW problems…
Beardedwrench115@reddit
Cost of maintaining is pretty high for a "normal" car plus they're designs are dated and bland. The current Jetta is 8 years old and not really all that different looking from the previous model that started in 2010. Meanwhile in the last 8 years, the Hyundai Elantra has had 2 facelifts and a whole new generation with much bolder styling.
ZimaGotchi@reddit
I had a Passat and ended up getting rid of it it due to the maintenance requirements of the double wishbone front suspension - but I would not necessarily shy away from an MK4 Golf/Jetta/Beetle in manual with a TDI.
If you're asking about the current lineup, I have no idea. I don't really know much about new cars.
ThirdSunRising@reddit
The suspension needed excessive maintenance?
ZimaGotchi@reddit
Yeah, there's bushings in the double wishbone that seem to only be good for about 40k miles. I wasn't trying to do them twice.
WeeklySky3512@reddit
Electrical issues are their Achilles heel. My Passat wagon has been fine but an intermittent steering lock problem on hot days would trigger an immobilizer at random times causing the car to not start when the temperatures went above 90 degrees and you parked it in the sun. The problem got progressively worse. I took it to a vw specialist who wanted $2000 for a new column lock and Komfort module programming. I turn my own wrenches and have access to some pretty good electronic tools but some things are out of my depth. I Finally found a locksmith who replaced the column lock with an emulator for a fraction of the price. Car has been solid ever since
IronOxide4u@reddit
2000 B5 4-Motion V6 Passat, did all my own maintenance, timing belts worn suspension parts etc. Put 368,000 miles on it before the trans went, put 2 kids thru college and 1 divorce. Miss that 🚗. Now I only have a 1965 panel van and a 1966 single cab.
One_Evil_Monkey@reddit
Umm... because it's a VW.
Electrial is not a "minor" issue.
They're German engineered. Which you would think is a good thing... well it's not. They overengineer everything. So in that context, labor costs are generally higher when it comes to repair work AND regular maintenence. Sure, stuff that's maintained generally will last longer and be reliable but compared to other brands available they are a little more maintenence sensitive and of course that costs more. People don't want something they have to deal with more often maintenence wise. Sadly, they just plop their asses down in the seat and go. Putting off stuff. VW's don't take too well that (yeah, that's an owner problem but VW's can't handle that kind of neglect). Like with many German cars, they require more specialty tools compared to something like a Chevrolet, Honda, Toyota, and in most cases, even Fords (which is their own pile of stupid).
I'm not here to talk you in to or out of a VW... it's your money, buy what you want. Just be aware that if you actually want it to last you're gonna have to keep up with the stricter servicing schedule and be prepared to pay more for it.
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Your description of Ford in particular gives me the impression you’ve worked on these things professionally
One_Evil_Monkey@reddit
I used to be a civilian mechanic in 3 different indy shops over the years and a 63B (light wheel mechanic) attatched to the 101st AIRBORNE.
Careful-Sell-9877@reddit
Its a great car. Got a slighlty used 2017 gli a few years ago, and it's amazing. Love it. Have had no issues. Ive driven across the country in it twice and use it as my work 'truck' (lol) to carry around all my tools (trunk is massive), driving down gravel roads all the time, etc.
Its been a delight. They are pretty underrated in the US. Theyre mad cool too
__slamallama__@reddit
They've always been in a weird niche but filled it very well for decades. They were quality but quirky cars for someone who would sacrifice some reliability for some style and/or performance.
Right now their whole lineup is boring CUVs that lost all the style. Then to add insult to injury they beat the whole brand to shit with the cost-cutting-stick.
Diligent-Body-5062@reddit
Oil leaks, electrical problems two liter turbo problems. If you don't like problems, don't buy a German car.
desexmachina@reddit
Because they cheat and the engineering isn’t the greatest. My 2.0 DI guzzles quarts and quarts of oil due to oil ring design building up carbon
Skid-Vicious@reddit
I have a ‘15 Passat I got in ‘18 w/15k miles off a lease from a tech company in California.
As always the first thing I do when I get a car is drop all the fluid and the trans fluid was really burnt for such low mileage, making me think it was in the Bay Area and had pretty hard hilly miles.
Since then it’s been a great car, since it’s a Wolfsburg which is apparently German for “stripped” I took the CarPlay out of a wrecked SE and other then that it’s just been been maintenance which, having had a lot of Euro cars before I stay on top of the maintenance and use what VW specs, which for oil is usually Castrol Platinum which is one of the few that meets the 502.00 VE oil spec. They do have a pretty rigorous maintenance schedule like flushing brake fluid at 20K and then every 30K etc.
I passed it off to my daughter when she started driving and it’s still going strong 4 years on. Only major malfunction was it cooked an ABS module which was $350 for a reman unit and another $350 to get it programmed, that would have been $3k+ at a dealer and over $2k at an indy mechanic.
It’s got ‘92 k on it now and it will need a few things when she’s back from college this summer, name shifter bushings, they’re busted and it will go into D but not far enough for Sport mode. A lot of the parts feel pretty plastic-y and cheap but if you keep them maintained IME they can be reliable. I do most everything myself though, I could see someone who had to pay to have maintenance done start to skimp on some some things and I suspect they would go to hell pretty quick.
StrongInjury3148@reddit
They are very popular still, the base Jetta is real popular but a turbocharged german car is a questionable decision at best if you're looking for an affordable commuter.
GTIs are popular enough, especially since Ford discontinued the Focus ST.
That being said new car are expensive and I think many people want something that can be serviced locally without much trouble.
Plus, I drove a rental 2019 Jetta brand new and a rental 2017 Nissan versa and the plastic feel of the interior felt really similar between the two. I wouldn't buy either if I was spending new car money, though most manufacturers are trending that way
Expert-Masterpiece70@reddit
The older VW's that were actually made in Germany were really well designed and constructed especially the GTIs. The new ones are Crap which is why their sales are in the toilet. If your looking at pre-owned I'd look for a Passat with 4motion which is basically an Audi Quattro with a VW skin. I'm driving a 2008 Audi A6 Avant with the 3 2L Normally Aspirated V6 that only had 104,000miles on it that I picked up last May for $6k the MSRP was $51,725.00 it's my 10th Audi been driving them since 1985. The wagons are usually Soccer Mom Cars so they're meticulously maintained and not driven to death. Stay away from the Turbo charged 4 cylinders like the 1.8T or the 2.0T and look for a Normally Aspirated V6 if you're going pre-owned
SirCarboy@reddit
I bought a used one (under 10yo) and it cost me $5,500 to replace the gearbox.
Minimum-Function1312@reddit
I wouldn’t buy another VW after they lied/cheated about the smog on their diesel engines.
Iser_name_@reddit
I own a 2016 VR6 Touareg which has been an absolute dream and the best vehicle I’ve owned yet. I don’t know why the Touareg had such poor sales in the US compared to Europe and Australia. Perhaps it was just not marketed well. The quality and reliability have been top notch.
3dl33@reddit
My 2016 GTI has been pretty good so far for 150k miles. Only VW I would buy is the GTI or Golf R tho, better vehicles in the other price brackets
Iamdbcoo@reddit
The MK7s are solid if you keep up with maintenance.
3dl33@reddit
And that I have, debating how long to keep it, I feel like between 150k-200k is when it starts getting riskier lol
Occamsrazor2323@reddit
They're pieces of shit.
ustupid_2@reddit
Junking a 2019 VW all track with 140K miles. It’s had an electrical gremlin since it was new where everything beeps and the speedometer stops working. Many dealerships replaced parts chasing it without success. It’s now near constant beeping. The turbo needs to be replaced (4K) ac shit out (3k) there’s a rust hole on the subframe ( no idea but likely expensive). The dealership is now saying to replace the airbag again to see if it stops the beeping. We bought it new 6 years ago and it is total trash. This car has been well maintained and we have tried and tried to fix the electrical problems but they are apparently unfixable. It’s going to carvana tomorrow for a few thousand bucks. Junk.
Explorer335@reddit
They are maintenance sensitive, they certainly have some electrical issues, they aren't terribly durable, and they can be terribly expensive to fix.
If you abuse it or neglect the maintenance, it won't last. Simple as that. I replaced a lot of vw/audi engines.
They have some weird issues like headlight LED bits burning out that cost $3k to fix, or a PCV that fails and blows oil out of every seal on the motor, or a thermostat that needs to be calibrated with ODIS or VCDS basic settings. Kind of ridiculous.
Anything theft relevant like cluster, radio, transmission, engine computer, keys, etc can only be synced to the car with genuine ODIS online dealer tool. It really restricts who can work on the car.
ChaosReignsNow@reddit
I've owned at least 15 VWs and have never had an electrical problem with any of them.
Dr-Deedle-OnDaLeedle@reddit
Because of what happened to the j*ws probably
gavinwinks@reddit
The water pumps don’t last either. I went through 3 water pumps in the 140k miles I had my old VW.
mysteriouslatinword@reddit
“Put vehicle in service position.”
PresidentialDiapers@reddit
Fucking hate VW. It used to be you put up with high maintenance costs and associated inconvenience because they had a European flair and performance. Now they have none of that and yet they still require MB and BMW levels of attention. Lost the story 20 years ago and never adjusted.
Fantastic_Oil2353@reddit
Because there’s a lot more that goes on in a car than just an engine. Volkswagen in general seems to be pretty hit or miss with people on average. If you get a good one, they last forever, especially if you do the maintenance, but if you get a bad one, they can be absolute fucking nightmares to deal with. As a general example of the engine thing, take my recent Corvette, they are known to be very reliable cars, mine however, was nothing but a mess when it came to everything having to do with build quality. The engine was fine, but every other thing in the car certainly wasn’t. It ended up being a lemon within the first 10 months.
witfixer@reddit
Audi and VW from the 90’s and 00’s had copious electrical issues regardless of how well they were maintained. To add to that, problems often seemed difficult to diagnose for their own mechanics which resulted in a very poor ownership experience that soured many people permanently to the brands. (Land Rover was a similar case). While I’m sure they have improved, they certainly still have their issues and those earlier impressions are hard to forget.
lemelisk42@reddit
I had a Volkswagen. Child locks activated themselves. 3 window mechanisms broke. Sunroof opened but wouldn't close unless you jammed a screwdriver in. Electronic locks broke. Trunk mechanism broke. Door handles have issues. Speakers stopped working. Ac broke.
Yeah it's old, but everything electronic broke, everything. New car is a toyota.
mehmetunalb@reddit
I own a '17 passat since 2018. Currently at 100k miles. Only issue I had was the passenger side AC blower motor which was $550 to replace. No issues with the 1.8T engine and 6 speed auto (idk about the DSG transmission). I had plenty of road trips with it. Super smooth ride and quick acceleration when needed. It's slightly more refined and higher quality on the inside than many competitors around the same model year. My biggest complaint about owning a vw in the US is that dealerships and indy shops treat them as if it's a premium brand. Since it's a European make they're trying to use it as an excuse to up charge you. Other than that, I'm happy with it and planning to pass it to my daughter in a couple of years with all maintenance taken care of.
glacierfresh2death@reddit
I love vw, and have had good experiences with them. I just recently bought a Jetta GLI while shopping for a civic, it was almost half the price of an SI
Advanced-Elk-7581@reddit
Their tsfi engine burns as much oil as gasoline.
Colonel460@reddit
I’ll take they are unreliable junk for $2000 Alex .
staticchmbr@reddit
There are also a lot of mechanics that won’t touch VW or German cars in general, OR don’t fix them properly… this can lead to reliability issues also
Jamaidian@reddit
VW likes to make things out of plastic when doing so is faster, cheaper, and achieves the same goal as a metal part would. They are not alone in this, but of the vehicles I've owned, my two VWs have been the biggest offenders.
They also do things like route the intake manifold over the top of the engine so that replacing spark plugs is far more complex and risky than it should otherwise be. See MK4 2.0L engine bay.
My current TDI has what should be a relatively bulletproof engine, but it uses a timing belt instead of a chain, negating some of the worry-free longevity that should come with a diesel.
They make many decisions based on initial driver experience rather than long-term ownership. Again, they're not the only ones who do this, but here we are. Also bear in mind the expected level of scheduled and preventative maintenance varies across cultures, and I can't recall Germans ever being called inattentive.
Neither of my VWs have ever left me stranded, but they "complain" more often.
I've heard the reliability of Toyota and Volvo compared as follows:
A Toyota is reliable in that nothing ever seems to go wrong. A Volvo is reliable in that no matter how many parts fail, it won't stop running.
That has essentially been my experience with VW. It's a love-hate relationship.
EddieKroman@reddit
VW’s are fun to drive, but the fiasco I’ve had with repairs caused me to all but abandon them. Their dealer service departments have been mostly disappointing. I now have a Toyota 4Runner and a Subaru Forester. Both have been far more reliable than any VW I’ve owned in the past 25 years. On a side note, I have air cooled VW’s for years, they were reliable if maintained correctly and treated reasonably.
Conscious_Dog3101@reddit
Cos Hondas and Toyotas have the mainstream import market on lock here in us. Both don’t make cars like they used to but more often than not, People who buy a Honda or Toyota will buy another and then another before they even look at anything else let alone a vw.
Anything_Normal@reddit
Pre diesel gate was a better era. They haven’t been the same since
shredlikebutter@reddit
Cuz they are shit AND expensive to fix when they shit
lavardera@reddit
maybe because they lied about their emissions and sold hundreds of over-polluting cars in the US, and sensible people would never trust the brand again.
resident_alien-@reddit
I’ve had five Volkswagens, and have never found any of them to be particularly unreliable. However, I have also had two Audis I wouldn’t touch another one with a 10 foot pole
tigress666@reddit
I had an old bmw 325. Before I bought it I asked a bmw forum why the 3 series, a cheaper series, was now worth more then the more expensive 5 and 7 series of that age. The response? Less electronics to go bad. And after having that bmw which had a lot of random small electronic problems, I completely understand.
I love my Toyota that just works and doesn’t get random small issues.
b8nmsguy@reddit
I have switched from a Volkswagen Passat, I was originally in a Camry. Based on what I’ve experienced, I would not own a Volkswagen if I wasn’t a car guy because they demand a lot of maintenance, most that the public isn’t even informed about. PCV valves, carbon cleaning, transmission services, stuff like that. They also use specific oil types (mine uses VW 508 00 which is almost impossible to find in the United States) and all of the parts also cost more.
It’s also engineering philosophy. German people generally stick to schedules and obey the rules. They build a car like that, it’s a machine that will break if you do not give it attention. If you DO give it attention though, it will drive incredibly and feel much nicer for longer. On the other hand, Japanese engineers make a car that will last long even if people don’t obey the maintenance schedules and they try to make everything as simple as possible, which affects the driving experience but also makes them significantly more reliable.
Alchemist59@reddit
Not sure about vw specifically but since they make Audis every single one of the my friends that have owned them have broke down and are beyond expensive to repair, last good looking vw I gotta say is the 2014 CC especially lowered, besides that they look like basic npc cars
pugster2020@reddit
VWs, European cars in general, are significantly more expensive to maintain as well.
Iamdbcoo@reddit
I had a MK7 GTI that I ragged the fuck on for 120K miles and never had a single issue. Maybe it was special though.
Manwombat@reddit
All I know is older Tiguans are absolute shite. My old man’s one has just had the motor replaced and other major work. Way over the value of the car, but he won’t give it up. Still drives like crap, the gearbox is just fkn awful.
ResponseContent8805@reddit
I had a vw toureg and i constantly had electrical problems. I went theough over 150 lightbulbs that would burn out. I bought this car brand new and it only lasted four years. I promised never to buy a pos like vw again. Worst cars ever!!!
kevin_kil@reddit
Cost of parts and labor and most shops don’t like working on them
bceagles182@reddit
I’m all good on the Hilter car, thanks.
TantasStarke@reddit
I haven't put much thought into the German brands. A friend of mine has a golf and while it's nice, I've seen the process required for basic maintenance and it's not something I'm interested in
extrvnced@reddit
What process is that? I have a golf and maintenance has been pretty standard imo
TantasStarke@reddit
For example all of the Japanese cars changing the engine air filter is just a couple clips, on her golf you have to take the plastic cover off the top of the engine, unscrew the filter, etc. it's just overly complicated
extrvnced@reddit
Ahh okay I see what you’re saying. I agree that the engine and cabin air filters require one or two more steps than I would like to do. Thankfully I haven’t run into anything that takes more than an extra couple minutes than normal and I’ve gone as far as a turbo swap to replacing an axle
ms_merry@reddit
Same here. My two VW and my two Toyotas. No difference and I was mostly broke from 1979-present, so I would notice. Bought them all a couple years old. Kept each at least 11 years. My current VW I’ve had 15 years so far.
DemonScourge1003@reddit
They’re expensive to maintain
boiled_chud@reddit
I love my VW as my daily driver/commuter/beater car. Other than a very reliable engine (2.5L 5 cylinder) and manual transmission it is a piece of junk. Literally every single light on the dash is illuminated except the check engine light. Traction control, ABS, cruise control; nothing works except the radio. It has the climatronic hvac and the AC only works when it is above 85F and the heat only works when it is below 30F. It just blows ambient air in between those temp. I've tried reseting the climatronic system several times and it still behaves as described above. I've accepted those quirks and this car doesn't owe me anything. It's got 250k miles on it and I'm going to keep driving it until it self destructs.
hangout927@reddit
They’re garbage cars
Senior_Dragonfruit79@reddit
There are a whole load of people in this thread spouting complete nonsense.
German cars do not tolerate lack of maintenance as well as Toyota or Honda. That's generally true.
Parts cost is roughly equal between the two unless you're getting into very old German stuff that's hard to find.
They're sure as hell of a lot more fun to drive though. I've had an Audi RS3 for 8 years and it still looks new. It doesn't live an easy life as it makes 600hp on ethanol.
Katalopapi@reddit
I haven't considered VW since the turbo diesel scandal
TellemTom@reddit
They’re overly complex and not incredibly well built. The juice ain’t worth the squeeze.
Minimum-Reward3264@reddit
Because they cost like Audi to repair without any of Audis features.
TRex_Chef@reddit
Leaka. Every vw i work on has leaks on the drain pan, drain plug, engine seals. Everywhere.
I see it daily
RustBucket59@reddit
I've noticed that in American car magazines, VWs have lousy reliability. In UK car magazines, VWs are considered super reliable... but they're comparing VW to Citroen, Renault, Fiat, etc.
engmadison@reddit
I bought a used 2019 Jetta a year and a half ago. So far Ive only performed oil changes myself, but im coming up to brakes and a few other maintenance intervals soon. I guess I lucked out that a tool set ive owned for a decade already had triple hex screws so I havent had to buy any special tools.
Theres one store near me that sells oil meeting its oil spec, so I havent had to buy expensive Liquimolly or anything.
When I was considering this vehicle, I heard to stories: 1) Don't buy VW, they always break down and are expensive. 2) Theyve been the best car Ive owned (often they owned cars through several generations).
I guess we'll see what happens as I approach 100k miles in the next couple years. So far I really like it.
ms_merry@reddit
GL. I loved my Scirocco and am loving my Golf. Fun to drive.
sa09777@reddit
I had 2 Volkswagens. A Jetta TDI sportwagen which was one of the best cars I’ve ever owned. The only problem that car had was a noisy panoramic sunroof that made noise. I also had a Passat VR6 4motion wagon which was about as big a shitbox as my jeep was. That car was religiously broken and cost at minimum $1000 every time it broke
ms_merry@reddit
What I same reading here is mostly hearsay. Might as well admit you don’t really know.
Total-Improvement535@reddit
High cost of ownership maintenance wise, not super easy to work on, and they don’t take neglect or abuse well.
Japanese cars and most American cars are the exact opposite.
I’ve owned both a 19 Audi A3 (basically a VW Golf with a bigger engine) and a 17 Passat 2.0t. They were both excellent cars in terms of engineering and capability but the finicky-ness and cost of maintenance leads me to planning to never own another one.
What_Is_This_1@reddit
Japanese built cars knowing most folks would forget to maintain them regularly. VW didn’t. That’s the problem. Plus doing regular maintenance on a VW for urself is a ridiculous time wasted endeavor. At least that’s what I’ve been told.
ms_merry@reddit
Not first hand, so.
scrappybasket@reddit
Rankings mean nothing man. Every manufacturer makes good and bad cars. And every car has their own issues (some more than others…)
My opinion is to just get the car you enjoy driving and stick to the maintenance schedule. You’ll be fine
Sad_Construction_668@reddit
VW has a penchant for making unique propriatary plastic doohickeys integral to almost every system, (lol @ timing chain glides on a 4.2 V8)and they have a history of not supporting the replacement parts industry that arises to meet the needs of people who are trying to get their 5-15 yo VAG vehicle to operate correctly.
Unique tools, deformation bolts that have to be replaced every time, hostility / neglect to the aftermarket industry , expectations that maintenance schedules will be followed religiously- it all adds ip to easy to damage, difficult to repair.
challenger_RT_@reddit
They are just mediocre. Higher maintenance costs over the competition.
Boring cars. Etc etc.
That said they some of the cheapest leases you can get.
Miller335@reddit
German car with all the German problems without the flare of a BMW, Audi etc.
ms_merry@reddit
That’s their charm and appeal
Due_Ad_6085@reddit
Maintenance of a BMW, reliability of an Audi, luxury of a Chevy
WonOfKind@reddit
I had the TDI Passat. I LOVED it. Everything about it felt well built. They had to pay through the nose with the dieselgate and I got way more than I should have to turn it in to them. If my family hadn't grown where I really needed a third row, I'm not sure I would have turned it in. I even test drove the Altas when shopping because I was so fond of the build quality. Unfortunately the atlas was brand new and I was shopping for used
Naerven@reddit
I've had three Volkswagens and all three have had electrical gremlins. As vehicles get even more tech loaded that just doesn't seem to be a good thing.
osmiumblue66@reddit
To be fair, they're a lot better in terms of repairability than, say, a 4.2L Audi V8. Look up timing chains on one of those. Really good times replacing it.
FE1-and-done@reddit
I think car and driver picked volkswagon as car of the year
Fuzzy_Yossarian@reddit
I bought a VW and it needs one of everything..
Rebel78@reddit
Shit cars and a shit company..........
ms_merry@reddit
I bought used 2008 Golf/Rabbit in 2011. I’ve driven it about 40k miles. Oil changes, tires, battery. Almost 15 years and loving the car.
jmardoxie@reddit
I think they are decent vehicles but Toyota and Honda are better options.
Medical_Help9111@reddit
Vw started down hill the day Audi bought them in 1968,there just crap
throwaway9099123@reddit
laughs about strict maintenance bruh the original engine is at 436k in a 1997 GMC Sierra...if I change the oil every 15k it's a miracle. The transmission fluid got changed because I wrecked that 30k miles ago.
Foreign cars often need specialized tools that are super pricy for mechanics, they aren't as easy to fix unless you take them to the dealership.
Also VW burned a lot of people a decade or so ago with some sensor that could fool emissions or something...boss had one. They had to like buy them all back or something don't remember what just know the boss lost her Jetta.
lookingatmycouch@reddit
I often just browse tools and have often seen specialized tools for certain applications for foreign and domestic, like odd-shaped spanners to reach an alternator or starter bolt or something. My '95 Saab, I just needed a basic metric tool set.
Agree a shop mechanic may not have that one special tool in the shop, but with the internet anymore they're readily available.
PowerSpool@reddit
If its not a Honda or Toyota people will tell you to avoid it. Its a damn shame everyone gets to call themselves mechanics but everything thats not the ABCs of working on a car is basically worthless junk.
At least thats just the mindset in the US. You see dudes in foreign countries buy actual junk cars throw parts at them and keep fixing it lol.
seabornman@reddit
VW put the water pump in a plastic housing in my GTI and many other cars. The plastic warped, and its a $1300 fix, for another plastic water pump.
clintj1975@reddit
Go browse r/Volkswagen, r/Jetta, and r/TDI for a while. The dash being lit up like a Christmas tree is a meme at this point. I had a Mk 4 TDI Jetta, and it was reasonably reliable and easy to work on for the most part. Except the alternator. Whoever placed it there needs a suitable curse placed upon them like stepping in a puddle every time they put on fresh socks. The 4 speed auto finally went out, and I just don't feel like spending the couple of thousand at this point to track down a 5 speed swap kit or parts donor car. I've got other jalopies that are less work I can drive around instead.
Friend at work has a Mk 5 TDI. The headliner is sagging and flapping in the breeze. He hit a pothole and six warning lights came on. The clutch release bearing ate itself so he swapped in a new clutch assembly. A month later the dual mass flywheel went out so he had to drop the transmission a second time. It always thinks one headlight and one brake light are dead. A wheel speed sensor quit working and triggered the traction control system into engaging at highway speed one day. He despises that car, but it gets ridiculously good highway fuel mileage.
bobqzzi@reddit
Jettas are awesome cars
Nearby_Knowledge8014@reddit
Co worker bought his 2020 Jetta new. We all told him not to.
Dealer serviced first 4 years, then to an independent VW specialist.
Now the airbag light is on, and even the VW specialist wouldn’t touch it. Dealer only. $4600 to fix.
A whopping 81k on the odometer.
Independent_Guava694@reddit
Maintenance costs. A bad reputation for a very long time of electrical gremlins.
I drove a number of VW vehicles. I had 3 B5 Passats all make over 200k miles. I had a Jetta that I bought with 200k on it and sold it still running perfectly fine with 265k miles on it.
None of them ever cost me that much on a single repair and I never broke down in any of them. And they all drove damn nice even with higher mileage. I may have just been exceedingly lucky, but I also take good care of my vehicles.
PreMixYZ@reddit
Back around 2012 my buddy got sick of his 4motion Passat Wagon. The KBB was $17,000+. The car only had 60k miles, he listed it for $15,000, he also put a picture and for sale outside his office. The scratched through the $15,000 and wrote $13,000 then scratched through that and said $11,000 then took the sign down. Someone offered him $8,000 and he took it, which is what the Toyota dealer originally offered him on trade for a Sequoia. He paid nearly $40,000 for that car and had it maybe 5 years, I think less.
JonboatJohn@reddit
Parts are expensive
Sweatyfatmess@reddit
German design. Mexican assembly. Maintained by Bubba.
WillHuntingthe3rd@reddit
You answered your own question.
TNShadetree@reddit
My son worked quality control for VW.
But he didn't actually work for VW because VW outsources their quality control to outside vendors. Let that sink in.
comfy_rope@reddit
German cars usually get a bad rap for maintenance costs, parts being expensive, sensitive to owner mistreatment, not easily/readily DIY for newbies,
CMDR-Kaiju@reddit
I swore them off after they got caught red handed in that emissions scandal. Incompetence is one thing but they are straight up corrupt criminals so I have zero trust in their organization.
Careful_Thought_8386@reddit
Had a Jetta downshift going 75 on the interstate instantly blowing itself up. After I considered that attempted murder by VW I've never touched the make again. Btw electrical issue.
Hash-82@reddit
VW (and Audi / Porsche) fell off the quality cliff almost 20 years ago.
The interiors fall apart in 5 years or so, the gremlins absolutely trash the electrical sytems, windshields leak into $5000 infotainment systems, the gas engines have problems no other manufacturer ever has...
It's a looooong list.
MeyersonAdam@reddit
I was a VW mechanic from 1999-2008 at a dealership. Most of the problems are like you said, small annoyances. The engines and transmissions were pretty good especially if you changed the oil and used the correct coolant and fluids. Problems come from people who don’t work on VWs and just dump green coolant in or regular power steering fluid or automatic transmission fluid in them. The interior trim has its own logic to it that’s different than Japanese and American cars so mechanics that aren’t used to VAG cars break stuff. The mechanic who worked next to me had his Jetta finally blow an engine at 500,000 miles because he didn’t add oil - it was burning a quart every 1,000 miles at that point. The turbocharged engines are pretty highly stressed and not well suited to slow town driving. Parts are expensive and competent mechanics are hard to find, but if you have a good mechanic, you take good care of them, they will last a long time and are, I think, very nice driving cars. They definitely cost more to keep up because of parts and labor on repairs.
Hungry-Job-3198@reddit
Lmao are you kidding me? Most of the problems are because of bad maintenance? So my customers who had a turbo diesel toureg who are meticulous about maintenance. Literally open checkbook. When their electricital issues started at 40k miles. Then the transmission failing at 46k miles. These are the customers fault? I can go and on with different vw vehicles over the years that are total garbage. Yet you actually just said that? Lmao ok
Equal-Fee770@reddit
Because the company was started by Hitler
DryFoundation2323@reddit
The scandal where they were cheating on emissions was certainly not good for them.
AVLLaw@reddit
Cheap components: the impeller on the water pump is plastic instead of brass. It’s $1000 labor to change the water pump when it fails because you must drop the engine on a Jetta to access it. When the water pump on our 2009 Jetta failed under warranty, asked the tech if he could replace it with an improved water pump that had a brass impeller. He said yes, but then I would have to pay for the whole job because it wouldn’t be covered by warranty. Also, most of the insulation on the wiring for the lights started failing, cracking chipping and falling off within 10 years.
Hersbird@reddit
Complicated, expensive maintenance and repairs that occurs more frequently than most other cars. They cost more initially, have poor resale, and don't offer anything special over other cars that cost less.
NotYourNativeDaddy@reddit
We have a 2020 Jetta with 95,000 miles and just had some emissions work done. It’s been running great and is an excellent investment. Hoping it will get us to over 300,000 miles.
idownvoteanimalpics@reddit
I have an mk4 TDI with the ALH engine, which is almost universally lauded as one of the most robust and reliable engines ever made, easily able to get to 300k miles without much drama.
Engine is great, rest of the car falling apart.
swangdb@reddit
My 2013 Golf (2.5L, manual) is the best car I’ve ever owned. It’s at 128k miles. I do the routine maintenance. Alas, this car is no longer sold new in the USA. I don’t want a Taos and don’t want to pay for a GTI. I’ll keep driving my car until it’s time to quit.
VW has a better selection in Europe. I’m a little jealous.
Willing_Sink_3623@reddit
They make poor engines, use poor grade materials, have poorly designed chassis, and cost as much as cars that don't suck. Vw has been a worthless car company since day 1.
BeignetsAndWhiskey@reddit
Most people that buy a car that costs similar to a Honda or Toyota expect the maintenance to also cost the same
AudieCowboy@reddit
I always recommend them, they come standard with more luxury features than competitors, and I like the way they drive, better transmissions as well
KostyaFedot@reddit
They looks nice for some.
I liked it until I have tried to fit in few years ago.
Missing old fashion Passat from nineties... And Caravella was good. Drove both. At work.
RT023@reddit
Own one for 100k miles and see what you had to spend on stuff
Beneficial_Try9602@reddit
Older ones can be reasonably reliable but in general are still more to maintain than Honda/Toyota. Dieselgate don’t do them any favours.
New gen vehicles are similar to others in the VW Group brand - for maintenance costs etc but without an Audi luxury/performance. Many vehicles in the same overall company brand have almost the same basic chassis and engine. The result is VW cost and maintenance similar to an Audi or similar without the benefits while comparing to Honda/Toyota.
Annual-Duty-6468@reddit
I have owned old and new VWs. Their longevity is tied to proper maintenance, but I don't see any substantial cost difference for that. I follow the interval of 1 year 10k miles. Never had any issues. I had two of them close to 200k before selling.
Repair is more expensive. After warranty is out, you need to find a good euro mechanic, or invest in some tools to do it yourself. VWs use these stupid triple-square bolts and screws.
Far-Volume-7424@reddit
Their not Honda's, they need upkeep. Why spend your money if your not going to maintain it. Iv had a few jettas a GTI and now own a beetle.theyre great cars fun to drive, just have to maintain them like anything really.look into how many car company's Volkswagen owns. You'll be surprised.
Slalom44@reddit
My experience is that they are good cars, but various electrical problems would crop up that were hard to diagnose and fix as a DIY.