ASUS Equalizer - The 12VHPWR Solution? - YouTube

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KARMAAACS@reddit (OP)

Can we just scrap 12V-2x6 and just move onto a new connector? I'm just so tired. PCI-SIG have done nothing to improve things really since 12V-2x6, it's clear the connector needs another spec revision, we've seen plenty of 50 series cards melt. I've never seen so many "solutions" that do basically almost nothing to improve a damn plug in my life. It seems to have any level of safety with this dogwater connector, you need a WireView II Pro or a new PSU with per pin sensing like MSI's ones, with a cable that has thermistors to cut power if it detects heat. All these "solutions" and we're at the same stage as we were months ago.

I imagine everyone will watch this video and talk about the 16AWG wire on the ROG Equalizer. But if we do that we're ignoring that the pins are the problem with this connector's spec and they can't really handle or are rated for more than around 10 Amps on a standard connector. I have absolutely no idea what the ROG Equalizer has done to improve the pins because Der8auer or no one else has investigated, but unless the pins also can take 16 or 17 Amps, the pins will likely melt before the wires do, the "solution" is basically useless imo, this cable is barely any safer. You can make the wire as thick as you want, you can equalize the load all you want BEFORE the pins, but it's pointless unless each individual pin can handle the power of 204W minimum (17 Amps at 12 Volts) or if they can withstand the heat of bad contact. As is, the spec for 12V-2x6 has a per pin rating of 9.5A and that's if every pin is operating perfectly, in the real world it's probably a little lower the load on each pin with good contact somewhere around 8 to 9 Amps, but there is basically no safety margin at all with the pins, get a single pin going to 12A or 14A and it's GG, it will probably melt.

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battler624@reddit

Whether you like it or not, the cable itself isn't an issue. Its the lack of shunt resistors on the PCB on the GPU side.

3090Ti had the 16-pin and didn't have any issues, it had 3 shunt resistors. Every other card that uses the 16-pin has a single shunt resistor. Why? Cost savings, I do not believe the spec forces this. Correct me if i'm wrong.

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KARMAAACS@reddit (OP)

Whether you like it or not, the cable itself isn't an issue. Its the lack of shunt resistors on the PCB on the GPU side.

I respectfully disagree and here's why: If the cable isn't an issue, then why do you need shunt resistors on the PCB? We never needed them as a hard set requirement, with 2x8 Pin or 4x 8 Pin setups because the connector was adequate, had enough safety margin and simply put, the AIBs put enough connectors on there to deal with the power load and distribute the power. The truth is, the 12VHPWR and 12V-2x6 connector is poorly designed and doesn't have enough of a safety margin to do it alone, if you had multiple connectors, then sure maybe then the connector would be fine, except even 5080s and 5070 Tis have melted connectors using 300-350W. Having shunt resistors on the PCB is a band-aid "fix" for the poor design of the connector. All the shunt resistors on the PCB will do is basically shut off the card or limit it's power if the pins have poor contact, sure it won't burn then, but it's not reliable then as a connector either.

The connector is simply imo garbage, plain and simple and it needs to have another revision or a re-design altogether. I like the idea of having a single connector, it's nice to only have to deal with a single cable, so the idea is fine, but the execution is poor.

3090Ti had the 16-pin and didn't have any issues, it had 3 shunt resistors.

It also only pushed 450W through that connector, the 16 pin connector was basically exclusive to the 3090 Ti FE with that level of power and you couldn't increase the power slider beyond 450W either. AIB 3090 Ti's tended to use multiple 8 pin connectors. So sure, the PCB was better on the 3090 Ti than the 5090 with regards to the connector, but we're also not getting an Apples-to-Apples comparison with regards to connector safety. I mean 3090 Ti's were pushing 450W or 520W at most, not 600W or 660W like many 5090s are. Even 4090s it was the same, the default power limit was 450W, but some models allowed the slider to go beyond that and went as high as 600W like the FE model did.

Every other card that uses the 16-pin has a single shunt resistor. Why? Probably cost savings, I do not believe the spec forces this. Correct me if i'm wrong.

The spec has no requirements on the PCB AFAIK, so you're correct it's not specified IIRC. Regardless, the PCB as I said is a bandaid fix, the connector is poorly designed to the point you need to basically instantly shut off the card to prevent melting or burning if there's poor contact at the pins and there's resistance. I don't know why you think it's so controversial that I said that the connector is poorly designed, we didn't have these sorts of issues before for years with 6 and 8 pin connectors and if we did they were in far lower incidence than the 16 pin connector has problems with.

As I said earlier, I am not against the connector entirely, I like one cable, but there needs to be a spec revision or a re-design to improve the safety margin of the connector or to just abandon it entirely and move to something more robust like the XT90 connector which might be double the size, but it's far more reliable and has wider safety margin.

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finakechi@reddit

I seriously do not see the wisdom in this cable.

I cannot think of a good reason to use multiple smaller wires as opposed to a single larger one.

We've been getting away with it for years because the power requirements were small enough, but this just seems reckless.

Why complicate PCB design for this?

I'm not an EE, so maybe someone smarter could provide some insight.

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KARMAAACS@reddit (OP)

Whether you like it or not, the cable itself isn't an issue. Its the lack of shunt resistors on the PCB on the GPU side.

I respectfully disagree and here's why: If the cable isn't an issue, then why do you need shunt resistors on the PCB? We never needed it with 2x8 Pin or 4x 8 Pin setups because the connector was adequate, had enough safety margin and simply put, the AIBs put enough connectors on there to deal with the power load. The truth is, the 12VHPWR and 12V-2x6 connector is poorly designed and doesn't have enough of a safety margin. Having shunt resistors on the PCB is a band-aid "fix" for the poor design of the connector. All the shunt resistors on the PCB will do is basically shut off the card or limit it's power if the pins have poor contact, sure it won't burn then, but it's not reliable then as a connector either.

The connector is simply garbage, plain and simple and it needs to have another revision or a re-design altogether. I like the idea of having a single connector, it's nice to only have to deal with a single cable, so the idea is fine, but the execution is poor.

3090Ti had the 16-pin and didn't have any issues, it had 3 shunt resistors.

It also only pushed 450W through that connector, it was basically exclusive to the 3090 Ti FE that level of power and you couldn't increase the power slider beyond 450W. AIB 3090 Ti's tended to use multiple 8 pin connectors. So sure, the PCB was better on the 3090 Ti than the 5090 with regards to the connector, but we're also not getting an Apples-to-Apples comparison with regards to connector safety. I mean 3090 Ti's were pushing 450W or 520W at most, not 600W or 660W like many 5090s are. Even 4090s it was the same, the default power limit was 450W, but some models allowed the slider to go beyond that and went as high as 600W like the FE model did.

Every other card that uses the 16-pin has a single shunt resistor. Why? Probably cost savings, I do not believe the spec forces this. Correct me if i'm wrong.

The spec has no requirements on the PCB AFAIK, so you're correct it's not specified IIRC. Regardless, the PCB as I said is a bandaid fix, the connector is poorly designed to the point you need to basically instantly shut off the card to prevent melting or burning if there's poor contact at the pins and there's resistance. I don't know why you think it's so controversial that I said that the connector is poorly designed, we didn't have these sorts of issues before for years and if we did they were in far lower incidence than the 16 pin connector has problems with.

As I said earlier, I am not against the connector entirely, I like one cable, but there needs to be a spec revision or a re-design to improve the safety margin of the connector or to just abandon it entirely and move to something more robust like the XT90 connector which might be double the size, but it's far more reliable and has wider safety margin.

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-WingsForLife-@reddit

Is 16/17amps per pin even enough? If for some reason 2 pins next to each other carried 10 amps each wouldn't it still melt?

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Zone15@reddit

Corsair just came out with a cable that apparently does the same thing, odd thing is, it even looks the same as far as the exact same sleeving and has a cable comb and a two toned connector. I wonder if they are being made by the same company and just licensed out to companies like ASUS and Corsair.

https://www.corsair.com/us/en/p/pc-components-accessories/cp-8920472/corsair-thermalprotect-pcie-5-1-600w-12v-2x6-cable-cp-8920472

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SJGucky@reddit

It does not the same thing.
It has a temperature probe at the bulky thing and shuts off power when it reaches 100°C.
Since it works mechanicly, you won't need software and it is compatible with any PSU.
And the cable resets after cooling down, meaning it is not a one-time solution.

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splendiferous-finch_@reddit

Ok my very uneducated prediction is that in 6 months we will see more burn connectors even with these cables

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Asleeper135@reddit

Not only do I think they won't help, I think they'll make things worse. When there is a current imbalance due to a poor connection, forcing the normal amount of current through that bad connection generates far more heat than just letting the current be imbalanced, even if the imbalance overloads other pins. To make matters worse, that extra heat will be largely focused on the bad connection. Do not use this cable!

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UlteriorMotive66@reddit

Is the burnt cable issue only affecting the flagship GPUs (90s)? Or does it also affect the 80s, 70s and 60s?

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-WingsForLife-@reddit

Burnt cable is more common above the 300w range basically.

So far the only 5070 example I've seen was one with a pin that simply missing from the socket so it burnt up.

Basically it's harder(not impossible) to get the dangerous current levels since you need a single wire pulling around 10 amps for that or around 120watts.

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splendiferous-finch_@reddit

Burned connector effects the whole range I have seen 5070ti with it as well as 9070xt cards, it seems more likely to happen when using pigtail adaptors and the probability seems to go up with total power which is why it's more common with the xx90 cards since they have a significant higher power limit.

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