[-]

Easttex05@reddit

I drove the Bush from Garland to Carrollton for five year. I REALLY enjoyed stopping just before 75 every morning and the grinding traffic between Coit and Preston. I felt like I was being robbed every time NTTA took another $40 out.

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realhaterofbbq@reddit

Come to Austin family of 4 with 4 adults driving bill always over 700$ per month

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Impossible_Battle_72@reddit

5 mile stretch of 183 goes for 24-26 bucks during peak rush hour.

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Working_Kangaroo3467@reddit

I love how all the poor people have to make a split second financial decision while traveling very fast, like maybe you won't be late for work, but you lost an hours wage or more

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locotxwork@reddit

I can't wait for the class action lawsuit. They purposely will display a lower price and then bill you a higher one.

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CamelbackMtn@reddit

Holy cow

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bojasher@reddit

Just a quick question, but how many of y'all have been absolutely forced to take the toll road against your will and pay those prices?

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RubAnADUB@reddit

dont install a toll tag.
get license plate flipper from amazon -> https://www.amazon.com/Electric-License-Flipper-Installation-Automatic/dp/B0F9XNCBMN
when going through the tolll on or off - have a fake plate to switch to and then switch back to your real plate when you get out of the toll road.

- example of fake plate -> https://www.amazon.com/Denim-Meow-Celebrity-Machines-Seinfeld/dp/B07RJYXH1Y

Profit.

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Eltecolotl@reddit

More expensive than DART, just sayin’

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J_Dabson002@reddit

That’s the express lane no one is forced to use it

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yarmulke@reddit

That doesn’t make it insanely predatory. Especially when the tolls were sold to companies that aren’t even US-based, let alone Texas-based, so the profits aren’t used to stimulate the local economy

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Faedaine@reddit

Its not predatory. It's supply/demand. If more people get on it, the cost goes up to keep the Express Lane... Express. It starts to price people out. Thats the whole point. That isnt predatory. If youre running late to work, its on you.

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DeathByGoldfish@reddit

It is, however. Perhaps not directly, but if a person is running late for work because of the traffic, and they work retail, twenty bucks could be three or four meals at home, or their entertainment budget for the weekend (a drink and cover at a bar). They are forced to choose, “job, or other”. These tolls add up quick, and these toll companies are protected by the state, so that your license or registration cannot be renewed until you pay back tolls. This further penalizes the poor, as they will be responsible for even more fines should the police pull them over. It can also end up with extra stops per year, and higher risk of other penalties.

See the cycle? The “haves” don’t deal with the cycle of consequences. These roads only benefit the “haves”.

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Faedaine@reddit

What cycle? I rather be late to my job the one time, then apparently pay $20 and, by your example here, not pay for food to eat at home.

It doesnt penalize the poor. No one has to use the Toll ways. Look at Google Maps, see how long it will take to get to work. Take responsibility. If you are not showing late all the time, when it does happen outside of your control, no one is going to say anything. I'm sorry, but this is ridiculous. Use the normal highway if you dont want to pay tolls. Thats it.

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DeathByGoldfish@reddit

“It does not penalize the poor” - yes, it absolutely does. It is regularly shown in studies that hourly employment is much less forgiving to tardiness than salary or white collar work. Being late and not getting warned or written up is very rare in an hourly job. Losing that job when working poor can mean the difference between making rent that month or not. Missing a few meals might be a worthy sacrifice if rent can be made.

“Look at Google Maps, see how long it will take to get to work.” - Traffic apps in Dallas are regularly wrong - I drive across Dallas regularly for work-related activities, and my commute can vary wildly, and even during the drive. Dallas traffic is complicated.

“Take responsibility” - what do you do for a living? Be very careful about how you put this, as you may not be playing by the same rules forced on the working poor. Life happens, and even the most well-intentioned person can be late. Some employers are draconian about tardiness. Again, being late and not getting warned or written up is very rare in an hourly job. Losing that job when working poor can mean the difference between making rent that month or not.

I get you are all about the “personal responsibility” bit, and appear to believe that because a service is offered, it is an option, but when that option becomes the only way to keep your job if an accident comes up during rush hour, it is not longer an option -it becomes a requirement.

What this ultimately comes down to is this: The cities involved chose to subsidize construction costs by offloading additional lanes to toll companies, rather than adding lanes to the existing highways that could be used by everyone as part of our regular taxes.

This created a system which those that can afford can, and those that can’t won’t, but may have to, if issues of a severe enough nature arise.

Can you see why this matters? I fear this all falls on deaf ears, but I hope not.

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Faedaine@reddit

We can argue all day. I appreciate your view on this, and I understand everything you are saying. I just disagree on some of those items. There are always other methods to get from point A to point B without paying for tolls. I use Google maps everything morning on the way to work. My family and I have a saying of, "In Google we trust" when it tells us to take side streets, or another way to get somewhere faster.

And yes, I think people should take responsibility. If you are working at a job that has draconian rules, then you should be on the ball and not put yourself in a bad situation. I still feel that if you are late to a job once in a while, most jobs are going to be forgiving.

I do agree with you on the city choosing to subsidize construction costs by offloading additional lanes to toll companies. Shit costs money though. The money that goes to infrastructure has been used, and we are still needing additional work. How do you pay for that without doing higher taxes across the board?

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JPhi1618@reddit

People don’t understand how high the rates can go, and gps like Google maps pushes you to take the express lanes because they are faster. Before you know it, you see that sign fly by, but things are so hectic, you don’t process the insane price until it’s too late.

It happens a lot, and it’s absolutely predatory.

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3-DMan@reddit

And unless I'm missing a setting, Google Maps does NOT show a price for Texexpress

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Faedaine@reddit

You can turn off Toll paths in Google Maps.

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3-DMan@reddit

$1.84 DNT I am fine with, but not TXP rates. But Google Maps doesn't differentiate.

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Faedaine@reddit

In Google Maps, you can turn off Toll paths.

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JPhi1618@reddit

Yea, that’s annoying tho because I need to use toll roads for most commutes, I just want to avoid express/variable tolls.

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Barack_Odrama_007@reddit

You got downvoted for telling the truth.

Many don’t get variable tolls ARE SUPPOSED TO PRICE PEOPLE OUT to keep paying cars moving.

They don’t want usual shitty drivers crashing, driving too slow and other bullshit coming to the toll lanes and slowing them down after people paid for it.

Nobody makes you take a toll and genius Texas engineering ensures our highways are always multi layered with main-lanes and frontage roads. Both are free, both are options.

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Itchy_Lab6034@reddit

Everyone shits on them but no one wants to pay extra taxes to build roads. No texas based company wanted to invest so what’s the issue?

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yarmulke@reddit

What? Texans are taxed out the ass, just not on our income. There’s no reason our roads should be sold out to foreign entities.

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Top-Opportunity1280@reddit

But there’s no state income tax.

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yarmulke@reddit

Congrats on being today’s example of how 52% of Americans are below a sixth grade reading level and are functionally illiterate, I guess

[-]

Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

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[-]

Top-Opportunity1280@reddit

Hey thanks and congrats as being an example of a douche who doesn’t recognize a simple satirical comment.

[-]

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[-]

Sejbag@reddit

Dog when I moved to Texas I thought it was the tits for no state income tax. Now I’ve realized I get fucked harder because of it and get nothing out of it. God bless the “great” state of Texas.

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Ok_Software2677@reddit

I'm in Texas. Taxed federally on our paychecks. Taxed on EVERY purchase. Taxed on houses. Wife owns two older small 1500 sqft houses in Dallas and was taxed $11k last year.

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3-DMan@reddit

Complainin'? That's a tax!

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Ok_Software2677@reddit

$11k for two small homes is ridiculous. My house is double the size and four times the land size and is only a quarter that amount.

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Sejbag@reddit

Yeah it’s ridiculous. I’m looking to get out of this state and never looking back. Nothing that worthwhile in Texas to put up with it.

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Ok_Software2677@reddit

Nope, not really. With governor hot wheels in office taking choices away from us. Him and Paxton both a pieces of garbage. I would relocate, but I just have way too much set up right now.

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Necoras@reddit

Our taxes are about middle of the road for the US. Yeah, we're taxed more than states like Alaska (which has few people, and taxes oil production) and Florida (which has a ton of tourists who pay taxes instead). But we aren't "taxed out the ass". We're in the bottom half of states.

Now, our taxes are quite regressive, which means you and I pay a higher percentage of our income to them than to the very rich. That's very intentional. There's a reason there were recently a ton of "Ban X tax!" constitutional amendments passed. Every one of those would have been a way to progressively tax billionaires. But hey, we banned taxes, so that must be a good thing right! Sure convinced enough people to vote against their best interests.

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deja-roo@reddit

So... you're saying you don't want to pay extra taxes?

I don't understand your line of logic here unless you're just literally agreeing with the post it sounds like you're arguing with?

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Snobolski@reddit

Why didn't Texas companies bid on the toll roads?

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Ok_Software2677@reddit

Yes, those fuel taxes will really add up. You just don't think about it because it's automatically included in the price.

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ChodaRagu@reddit

You’re right! It’s known in Texas Transportation Industry circles, that Texas has historically under-charged county registration fees for 50 years or more. They’ve never paid for the actual cost of building/maintaining roads.

For example, it’s like $76 to register my car in Denton County. It was $60 when I was in high school, 30 years ago!

Living in another state that does charge the appropriate amount (AZ) the past 20 years, ($250 every 2 years) we have the luxury of NO TOLL ROADS and new highways being built and/or expanded all the time.

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tengris22@reddit

Yes, having lived in AZ the last two miserable years I can attest that there are no toll roads. There are ALSO no roads that won’t tear up your car if you are so ill-advised as to drive on them. The amount of money I’ve spent on vehicle repairs directly attributable to road problems, I’d much preferred to have spent on tolls.

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ExtensionPromotion80@reddit

Wait there’s no tolls?

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MephistoHamProducts@reddit

AZ also has functional HOV lanes that just exist, without miles of concrete barriers or those stupid posts, on the freeways. And people who don't have an extra passenger just, get this, don't use them because the fine for doing so if they get caught makes it not worth it! How crazy is that?

I miss living in Phoenix sometimes.

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-Nocx-@reddit

This comment is going to probably piss people in this sub off - but where else is the money supposed to come from?

Like people already complain incessantly about property taxes in literally every Texas subreddit. I could write an essay about how much people complain. The idea of a personal income tax appears to be a non-starter for every one that doesn’t actually own property- which is an increasingly large number of Texans.

The federal government isn’t going to issue Texas any more money for its roads, and the state is experiencing record growth basically every year at this point. There is absolutely no way the already shitty infrastructure is going to keep up with all these transplants.

Most of the state’s budget is ironically already spent on healthcare and education - like literally 80%. Most people are probably wondering how, but it is the truth at the end of the day.

The state even uses Gross Receipts Taxes instead of a flat corporate income tax that arguably brings in more revenue than if they just had a corporate income tax. Like as far as corporate taxes go, Gross Receipts is relatively predatory - they apply even if the company is operating at a loss.

As critical as I am of the Texas government, at some point people are going to have to realize that a lot of the problems come from we just suddenly have too many people. The reality is it would require a massive overhaul of the tax system (mostly around capital gains and an introduction of a progressive state income tax) that I don’t think even “regular” Texans are going to agree to.

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CowboyFred@reddit

Lol the rant fails because the State of Texas doesn’t keep the profits from the tolls.

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-Nocx-@reddit

I don’t know why this thread has constant misinformation around this topic. TxDot owns the roads the tolls are on. NTTA and HCTRA are both government owned and their toll revenue goes directly back into road infrastructure. To say “the state does not keep the profits” is a bit disingenuous in that sense, because the profits automatically get re-invested into the road projects.

However, the state needed more money to build more infrastructure, so they made a public private partnership called a CDA to raise funds to do it. This means for a period of time a private company gets part of the tolls in exchange for financing the construction. The Spanish company is not the only company that raised equity - of the 2.7 billion spent on the infrastructure project, 700MM was through private equity. And there are eight other partners, including the Dallas Police and Fire Pensions.

This is no different than what the federal government did with federal student loan financing - a public private partnership to leverage money that the government didn’t have. Private equity put up the collateral, the government insured that they couldn’t default.

So once again - my point is exactly correct - where is the money going to come from. People on this sub constantly complain about symptoms without having any idea what the actual cause is. They read one article around a complicated problem (to be fair, at least they read more than the headline) and try to reduce it to incompetence when the problem is clearly more nuanced. The “simple” answer is the tax system has to be significantly revamped, which is not a “simple” answer. Because the moment that any Texan hears tax of any kind there is going to be push-back.

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hoyeay@reddit

Only applies to businesses who have to pay franchise taxes (revenue > $2.4 million).

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BranSolo7460@reddit

but where else is the money supposed to come from?

The fucking Aristocracy, that's who. This state alone makes more than enough revenue to ensure not only non-tolled roads, but the building of a usable and sustainable public transport system to liquidate the need for more highways all together. The money is there, it's just not being harnessed because the people in charge of everything, are the ones hoarding it for themselves.

The answers are there, you just gotta look.

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Necoras@reddit

I'd argue it's less about too many people, and more about decades of lack of public investment. That and crappy mindsets. We could have had good public transit, but Texans "like their cars." That's a quote from a TXDOT official. Similarly, Japan builds and repairs roads FAST. Like, within a week, sometimes in less than 24 hours. We take longer because politically that's acceptable. And because to go faster would cost more. The latter is generally an American problem than a Texan one, but you get the idea. We don't tax the rich in America (well, most of the western world, but especially in America, so things take longer, and cost everyone else more.

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spongyguy24@reddit

Fair, but I interpret the predatory as 'its very easy to accidentally be on the hook for a $20 toll you didn't want'.

Kinda hard to say git gud to people unfamiliar with that specific stretch of highway when the express lanes can be confusingly marked in the case of many on-ramps to them. Also when many of the express lane on-ramps are forked fly-overs w/ other exits built onto them.

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AdorableZeppelin@reddit

I think there are a few problems with the NTTA toll roads that people like to either overlook or ignore:

Toll roads make up the majority of the highways in the northern part of DFW. I live in the "triangle of sadness" between DNT, 121, and Bush. If I want to get anywhere, I either take a surface street or a toll road
Toll roads are relatively expensive. Last I checked they average something like $.35 per mile driven on them
NTTA, a private company, can withhold my government managed and mandated vehicle registration if I don't pay them. Honestly fuck everything about that
There's already a tax that $.75 of every dollar goes directly to roads -- the gas tax. $.15 of every gallon of gas sold in Texas goes to road maintenance. If the gas tax was equivalent to what toll roads change, it would be something like $7 per gallon (20mpg x $.35 per mile). Raise this to a reasonable level that covers road maintenance and stop giving out toll road contracts to foreign entities

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cramothmasterson@reddit

Well, you said yourself “sold” which means a large payment was made to the transit authority/local government. And there is often a revenue share mechanism. And the construction and maintenance of the road is the responsibility of the operator not local the local government. So your taxes aren’t going to be used to build or maintain it. And you don’t have to use it. So overall this is at least neutral if not net positive for you and your local government!

For clarity I’m referring to managed lanes like the texpress. DNT is a whole other thing.

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jazzeejeff@reddit

NTTA roads are not profitable and the debt incurred to build them is not projected to be paid off until 2048. This assumes no additional maintenance or updates. In summary, it operates at a loss and makes zero money that can be used to stimulate the economy. Source: NTTA financial disclosures and https://www.ntta.org/sites/default/files/2025-06/HB%20803.pdf

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arlenroy@reddit

I would like to think this is common knowledge at this point, maybe not. That's been my biggest gripe, if I'm spending $40 a week on tolls (I don't have to, but it cuts my home commute time in half) at least keep that money in Texas. Unfortunately, the Republican party of for the people, is only for people who can make them money. Bonus points if its old white people.

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Responsible-Agent-19@reddit

Don't use it.

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Ddyxbby1031@reddit

It must be difficult containing all that stupidity.

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yarmulke@reddit

Look at mister fucking big brain over here

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yarmulke@reddit

I’d also like to think it’s common knowledge, but I know that most people live in blissful ignorance.

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cryptotechnobeat@reddit

yeah that's pretty wild. I was one of those people. just thought the toll was to pay for the road. that's why I see people say they just don't ever pay the tolls lol

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Snobolski@reddit

Starbucks charged me the price listed on their menu for my super giant cup full of sugar and ice. Then the profits went to Seattle.

So predatory.

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TexasCoconut@reddit

Oh, are local DFW taxes going to Starbucks in the same way that local taxes are going to support DFW infrastructure? If not, then that comparison doesn't apply.

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Snobolski@reddit

Y'all have no idea what "predatory" means.

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TexasCoconut@reddit

Well you don't understand private vs public spending, so which is worse?

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Snobolski@reddit

The comment I originally replied to was about "predatory" tolls so you tell me.

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TexasCoconut@reddit

Probably going out of your way to make a comment with an analogy that doesn't apply, since you didn't add anything to the conversation except negativity and confusion.

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Snobolski@reddit

At least I'm not confused about what "predatory" means.

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TexasCoconut@reddit

well, you never proved that, you just proved that you don't understand the concept of public infrastructure.

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No_Lifeguard259@reddit

The express lanes are designed to keep traffic flowing around at least 50mph. If there are too many vehicles on it, the prices goes up until it prices enough people out to where the traffic keeps flowing that speed

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Lyuseefur@reddit

The retirement funds of Spain and Brazil and other places thank you for your contribution.

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Necoras@reddit

It's not intended to be predatory. It's intended to keep the express lanes moving above X miles per hour. The whole point is to keep enough people off the express lanes that those who will pay for it are going as close to highway speeds as is reasonable. If enough people willing to pay $5 that the express lanes are full, then it'll bump up to $7.50. If enough people are willing to pay that, then 10. And on up until it reaches an equilibrium with price vs number of cars.

The algorithm setting the price doesn't care what the cheap (of which I am one) or poor people think is fair. It cares about maximizing throughput.

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Homey-Airport-Int@reddit

If it was a flat $5 during rush hour it would just be as packed as the main road.

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SnooHabits3911@reddit

Still stimulates to local economy. They don’t fly in all their equipment and crews from Spain to build the roads. The headquarters is in Dallas.

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unabnormalday@reddit

This only applies to Texpress lanes. Everything else is owned by NTTA

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yarmulke@reddit

635E is operated by the same Spanish-based Cintra group. I addressed that in another comment.

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boning_my_granny@reddit

The highway in the op is not the same as the one you’ve posted. Also that Spanish company paid to build the toll road portion.

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yarmulke@reddit

Any tollway with that signage and those fluxating prices are operated by the same Cintra group. Here’s the DOT page about the 635 Expressway. It’s listed under the Private partner section

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boning_my_granny@reddit

Wow I had no idea. Thought the 35W was the only private one. Valid point.

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LetMePre-Say@reddit

Especially when the tolls were sold to companies that aren’t even US-based, let alone Texas-based

OK this is a vastly misunderstood topic that's an inaccurate representation of how these contracts work though. The concessionaire is the company that paid for the building of the road. The total price of the 635 Managed Lanes project was estimated around $1.16B, for which TxDOT only paid $490M - the estimated cost to construct the new General Purpose (read: free) lanes. The rest of that money ($672M) came from the concessionaire group, and was the portion of the contract needed to construct the Managed/Express lanes and all of those connections. The concessionaire group recoups this $672M by collecting the tolls on the managed lanes.

So ultimately TxDOT is getting a $1.16B road improvement for the 42% of the cost it would take to have built it.

Point being - they didn't "sell" the tolls to anyone

[-]

vinigrae@reddit

We live in a society

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oaxacamm@reddit

Only 36 more years and it’ll be free like the DNT. IYKYK 🤦🏽‍♂️

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TheWizard@reddit

Technically, they are, since they are using space that should had been used to reduce traffic on 635.

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yarmulke@reddit

Should’ve been a train

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Initial_Job9323@reddit

I don't understand why we can't build a train that travels the entire state and connects all the major cities. We're so behind in this country!

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James-the-Bond-one@reddit

So... The cars would ride on rails?

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TheWizard@reddit

Texans are completely clueless about a proper rail service.

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Other-Grapefruit-880@reddit

laughs in dallas

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J_Dabson002@reddit

More lanes doesn’t reduce traffic

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TheWizard@reddit

Yet they did use the space to build more lanes (and extort based on whim)

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howjustchili@reddit

“Using space that shouldn’t have been used to reduce traffic” doesn’t necessarily mean “add more lanes.”

Not when the intersections appear so poorly laid out that they contribute to traffic congestion and make the express lanes more appealing. All the construction around 635-35, and this is best they could do? I’ll never believe it.

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8Narow@reddit

Just 1 more lane

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yarmulke@reddit

Many of us know that but that’s the intent that the car-brained dolts have.

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Vhentis@reddit

I don't even touch it. I leave early for work through

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BranSolo7460@reddit

There's always someone who loves being robbed, sharing their unwarranted, boot licking opinions.

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J_Dabson002@reddit

Nah just someone with common sense which is severely lacking within your brain by the sound of it

[-]

Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

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[-]

Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

Your comment has been removed because it is a violation of Rule #3: Uncivil Behavior

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Send a message the moderators if you have any questions. Thanks!

[-]

Barack_Odrama_007@reddit

But it’s reddit. Where people are entitled to everything. Nevermind the fact that we have multiple layers to our highways (frontage roads and mainlines) that they can choose from if the tolls are too expensive!

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aeiou-y@reddit

Instead of building roads to support traffic they have ONLY been adding express lanes and charging ridiculous sums. They are often not even just an option any more and it’s only getting worse. In Fort Worth every freeway is under construction. Not to add badly needed lanes that people can use but to build more express lanes that they can gouge pricing on.

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TeknoBlast@reddit

What you said is what pisses me off.

When a new toll road is built, a free road option is not built along with it. It's the toll road or nothing. Fuk them guys!

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GettingBy-Podcast@reddit

You have it backwards. Roads dont support traffic. Traffic builds on roads.

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Itchy_Lab6034@reddit

We don’t have the money to invest in the roads that exactly why it is the way it is

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Developesque1@reddit

lol stfu, shit was supposed to stop being a tollway years ago. Bootlicker or bot?

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ice-eight@reddit

Yeah but if you live anywhere near there, you spent almost a decade being forced to deal with the traffic clusterfuck created by building those toll lanes that nobody is forced to use

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toyz4me@reddit

Different state but we are paying $6 for each 2-3 mile segment on our toll lanes. And the toll company is an out of country, Saudi backed invested group with a 50 year contract.

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IsiMan84@reddit

I exited the express lane on 183 West when I saw the next segment was over $9. Came to the next entrance and the following segment was $24 with a $12 HOV rate. Stayed in the free lanes which promptly added 20 minutes to my drive. I would have considered paying $7 at that point.

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The-Real-Jax@reddit

FUCK NTTA

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grand305@reddit

I’ve seen $8+ range. this is not even the final form.

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dirkdingling@reddit

183 to 820 west hits $20 at 5pm.

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EgretMaximus@reddit

Where the hack our tax money is going? Now a days all cities making inside city highways with toll.

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txaaron@reddit

Thanks Republicans/GOP for selling our roadways to the highest bidder instead of actually improving our infrastructure. (Before you say anything Republicans have been in power for over 30 years, can't blame Democrats who have no power here.)

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ericader@reddit

Yeah lets build like california instead lmfao. People need to vote for actual change not "other side bad"

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txaaron@reddit

California actually has pretty nice highways. And none of the for-profit price gouging express lanes.

But that's beside the point, why bring up CA? Republicans are the ones to blame. If you can't see that, you have blinders over your eyes.

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Substantial-Work-109@reddit

And did you vote for this? The GOP screws you again and yet you still vote for it. Not voting is bad also.

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Parzival225@reddit

lol 7.50 is nothing. I’ve seen these be 22$ or more.

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NuthinToHoldBack@reddit

And I’ve paid $15 before (things you’ll do with an infant in the car)…

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sneakycatattack@reddit

Get a passenger pass so you get HOV pricing when your baby is in the car. I’m pregnant and in Texas that counts for the HOV so I have one

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bugsabaris@reddit

What is this cheat code you speak of, passenger pass? How does one acquire it?

[-]

TTUporter@reddit

https://support.gocarma.com/en/articles/3195127-what-if-someone-doesn-t-have-a-smartphone

It is like a cheat code. I only know about it because my wife saw it in a facebook mom group.

It's a little bluetooth puck that you put in your car. It connects to the HOV app GoCarma and counts as a 2nd rider to get the HOV discount. It's intended for people who have little kids who don't have a 2nd phone.

[-]

Twisted9Demented@reddit

Mind blowing.. I neve knew toll authorits track how many occupants are there in a vehicle when you're on a HOV Toll lane... How do they track All I have is my sticker and myself I don't have a ntta app not do my family members.

[-]

NuthinToHoldBack@reddit

I signed up yesterday to try it out. You create an account, add your vehicle using the license plate and then add the toll tag from that vehicle.

After it’s added, you then confirm the connection when you’re in the vehicle, I confirmed mine via CarPlay.

It uses precise location services in the background during the defined peak hours and looks to see if 1) at least two smart phones (or one smart phone and one occupancy sensor) are in the vehicle and 2) if the vehicle (license plate, tolltag, and Bluetooth id) are in the texpress lane.

Data kept is minimal (complies with new Texas data privacy law) and only for 60 days. You confirm discount in your tolltag statement.

[-]

TTUporter@reddit

Then I don't think they're tracking it at all, you're not getting the discount.

Going off the TxDot website, the only way to get the 50% rush hour HOV discount is for at least 2 people in the vehicle to have that app on their phones.

[-]

Twisted9Demented@reddit

@TTUporter; Thanks but my thing is How would they know or track that. Do they use a camera do they use a sensor of sort that looks for cell signals.

I personally I'm clauster phobic and I feel stuck in a HOV lane and I never use it. Irrespective of who or how many people are with me in the car.

Again " Thank You " I mean it

[-]

Ellie8437@reddit

Wait, so if you have 2 phones you can travel in the HOV lane? Asking for a friend

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TTUporter@reddit

Yeahhhhh. As long as you and your friend both have the GoCarma app and have cell service.

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starfrenzy1@reddit

AND you have to give the app location permission always, so that it knows when you (and your companion or your kid's puck) are on the toll road.

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permalink_save@reddit

What is gocarma? Does it not let you get hov rates if nobidy installs an app? I refuse to install apps unless strictly necessary and sounds somehow discriminatory to require one, like two older people in the car that struggle to use phones.

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EightEnder1@reddit

Its all a lie anyway. Most of the time, there is zero discount, look at the posted prices, they are usually identical except for maybe an hour a day.

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sneakycatattack@reddit

HOV discount times are Mon-Fri 6:30a-9am and 3p-6:30pm

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sneakycatattack@reddit

I suppose you could see if they’d let you get away with 2 passenger passes but yes it’s a phone app that ordinarily works by having 2 people in the same car. You register what car that is on the app.

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TTUporter@reddit

https://gocarma.com/dfw

I believe it is the only way that you can access the HOV discounts.

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peachtreeparadise@reddit

WHAT!? WHY!?

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permalink_save@reddit

That is insane... There are legitimate reasons people don't use apps.

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prereqs@reddit

yeah. some people are very paranoid so this is bad for them

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permalink_save@reddit

I know someone that, even when she did drive around and had zero issues doing so, phones are above her technical capabilities. Some people are poor as shit, probably because we make them pay for basic services like roads, and we make them own phones. And yes some of us care about privacy, and it's a legitimate concern, but the benefits still outweigh anything else so I have one. It's also a security issue installing apps for everything. It's a problem that was solved before smart phones existed, same for parking and all this other shit startups are pushing.

[-]

bugsabaris@reddit

This response could easily make you some money on the downlow. Thanks for sharing!

[-]

demon_twink_gockie@reddit

Has to. They have personhood rights to a fetus so they can strip away women's rights to bodily autonomy. Enjoy it, baby incubator!

[-]

justonemom14@reddit

Ok but I've only ever seen the HOV pricing be identical to the express. When is it cheaper?

[-]

sneakycatattack@reddit

During rush hour, the TEXpress defines that as Monday – Friday, 6:30 a.m. to 9 a.m. and 3 p.m. to 6:30 p.m

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Yak-Electrical@reddit

Its cheaper all right a whole .20 or so lol

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EightEnder1@reddit

I know! So many times I've seen its the same price.

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

The sign shows the same price !

[-]

sneakycatattack@reddit

Yeah HOV pricing is only during “surge” times, so rush hour. Which is bullshit because they’ll still surge the dang price outside of regular commuting hours.

[-]

Emergency_Ad1152@reddit

How do you get one? I have my kids in the back and my windows are tinted.

[-]

TTUporter@reddit

https://support.gocarma.com/en/articles/3195127-what-if-someone-doesn-t-have-a-smartphone

Request one here!

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Emergency_Ad1152@reddit

You're awesome, thanks!

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ooglesnoopleboop@reddit

There are times I’d gladly pay to drive it, glad it exists to some extent.

[-]

demon_twink_gockie@reddit

Is that why they drive 90+ on the access roads by these things? I lie though. I was doing 90+ and getting run off the road, honked at, and flipped off

[-]

Some1getmeablanket@reddit

DC would like a word

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Any-Air-3001@reddit

For real was just gonna say, try 37+

[-]

Plane_Note8702@reddit

I once left my car with a friend for the weekend while I was out of town, and his car was in the shop. He took my car through the express on a Friday night for $35 because he was late for a date. I also came home to an empty tank. He never repaid me.

[-]

Kuchufli@reddit

30 years ago... but still relevant to shitty friends... Lent my truck to friend to see a girl... 3 days later no sign of him or my truck, finally track down his ass. He abandoned it after it broke down about 40 miles away. Had to get a tow, I don't know what he did, but it wound up needing a new engine. He left me walking for about 6 months before I came up with the money to get a used engine. He never repaid or even said sorry, it gets worse.

2 weeks after he borrowed my truck he got arrested for murder. He murdered the old lady he lived with and took her truck, he got caught and serving life in prison.

Maybe I was lucky he just abandoned my truck and didn't off me. They never found the old lady's body.

[-]

Zealousideal-Lie7255@reddit

When you found out your truck needed a new engine did your murderer/friend say he couldn’t give you another engine but he could give you “used parts?”

[-]

Kuchufli@reddit

Unfortunately I had a Dodge Ram 50 and he was found driving a Toyota... In reality he was a coworker because I never talked to him outside of work. Weirdo Red head.

[-]

starfrenzy1@reddit

oh my gosh

[-]

gruuvey@reddit

former friend

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Zealousideal-Lie7255@reddit

I’m not validating high toll prices, but the express lanes are supposed to keep moving at 45mph or higher. So their algorithm outputs a price that will get those results. At least that’s what I assume they’re doing.

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bigmad168@reddit

Highest I’ve seen so far is $24 in mid cities area. It’s wild.

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HistoryNerd101@reddit

Certainly not a burden for the weather. These toll roads are meant to clear the traffic so the wealthy can get from Point A to Point B without having to rent a copter like Kobe to get through traffic

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Initial_Job9323@reddit

Yep, they've turned into lanes for the wealthy.

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millrro@reddit

I saw it at $25 going from Dallas to FW

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here4pain@reddit

It's $25 almost everyday on 820 express west (I know it's near Ft. Worth but it's still metroplex)

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spongyguy24@reddit

and is that a good thing?

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strugglz@reddit

I swear I saw one at $63, but usually the highest I see is $28.

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moremorgan_@reddit

I was about to say, this is rookie pricing. 183 express lanes scoff at this cheap of a rate

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kartik042@reddit

I moved to Toronto from Dallas. These numbers look cute when you look at 407 ETR toll prices.

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Trespeon@reddit

Seeing them higher doesn’t make these prices ridiculous. It just makes the even higher ones worse.

Let’s not justify or make these kinds of tolls ok.

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ForeverOk7505@reddit

Yes! I’ve seen $20+ as well and almost crashed my car in shock 😩

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beetlejuicemayor@reddit

Yes! It’s been about $20.00 heading to Fort Worth 😢

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fuelvolts@reddit

Yep, Tarrant County mid-cities 183 bypass during rush hour is $20 for toll tag. That means $40 for people without. Insane!

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beetlejuicemayor@reddit

Yep that’s the way we have to go to get home. Completely insane! I wish we could fix this issue because traffic is a nightmare.

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JayScramble@reddit

Yeah, it was $20 a few weeks ago. That hurt.

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TheRaveChef@reddit

It's getting ridiculous! I got charged $10.50 for a 2 mile stretch of 35 south texpress the other morning. And of course you don't get to know the goddamn price until you're trapped on it! This has to be illegal

[-]

friendlyopinionshere@reddit

Ridiculous. Just more consumer gouging

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demon_twink_gockie@reddit

Pro tip: don't have a license plate and run that shit. I've also driven through with out of state plates. They had no exits after the first sign for it and no toll both so no way I could possibly pay. Never got shit, not that I'd have paid a fine since the toll both was closed and there was no way to get off. 🤣

[-]

hobbs_46@reddit

That's pretty normal😂

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Alpha_Papa_Echo@reddit

The rich charge what they want and we pay. We need to stop. Stand up people.

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Coldfang89@reddit

I love how the toll roads were supposed to become publicly owned once paid for yet that's well past due and they're raising prices. Yet nothing is done about it

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Alert-Boot-4827@reddit

Be thankful this is not California

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Twisted9Demented@reddit

This is shocking because I haven't seen these prices in Dallas are...

RIP I feel Sorry for those who stay in Tarrant county

[-]

Twisted9Demented@reddit

Election scams & false advertising cost money too. How do you think our leadership is paying for all those campaign ads?

[-]

Turboteg90@reddit

Bro 183 express can get up to 24 dollars in the afternoon.

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cometssaywhoosh@reddit

Can confirm, last month I drove from Richardson to Possum Kingdom Lake for the weekend and spent like $55 riding tolls from 635 all the way to 183 and 820 lol. But I saved like almost one hour of traffic. Pricey...but worth it.

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starfrenzy1@reddit

Only if you make $55 an hour or more.

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playballer@reddit

Hate this take. Not all time is worth the same price. And how much you make has nothing to do with convenience

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cometssaywhoosh@reddit

Yeah in this case I was driving on a Friday afternoon trying to make it to the lake (where there is basically zero lights on the road during night)

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NuthinToHoldBack@reddit

I’ve seen higher there as well

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Late-Union8706@reddit

Same, seen it hit 28-ish for a 4 mile stretch to 820 due to an accident.

Literal highway robbery.

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Sguidroz@reddit

I see what you did here

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Barack_Odrama_007@reddit

Good! The higher it gets the more the main-lanes are fucked up due to shitty drivers

They need to price people out of the toll lanes to keep them moving.

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Initial_Job9323@reddit

I think $10 still prices a ton of people out.

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playballer@reddit

As a daily commute sure, but if you have the need to get somewhere fast it’s an accessible option for most

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Initial_Job9323@reddit

Agreed

[-]

cramothmasterson@reddit

That’s exactly what they are designed to do. Managed lanes like these usually have a minimum average speed requirement and the dynamic pricing is designed to keep the volume of cars in the lane at a level that will maintain at least the minimum speed requirement.

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playballer@reddit

What slows it down is the exits that back up into the express lanes. The Preston exit and midway exit as example around this time of day are likely causing at least 10 cars to be parked on and blocking the right express lane. Will all the billions they spent on these things I’m pretty sure they purposely built in insufficient queue space to ensure the rates would spike easily

[-]

Look_b4_jumping@reddit

I see a lot of commercial trucks getting on the express lanes. Do they pay the same price as cars ?

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playballer@reddit

Read the sign. It has the answer

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DMTryp@reddit

At thats just for One stretch/checkpoint. Thats not even your whole trip!!

[-]

ReadyFromTheGecko@reddit

It was $11 last night around 6:35pm!!

[-]

pobox01983@reddit

Came here to say this.

[-]

dallasdude@reddit

From plano to downtown is now an $18.20 round trip on the DNT.

For a commuter that would be $4,550 in extra tax per year.

[-]

Jesus-Biscuits@reddit

This! I live in Addison and work Downtown, basically the only way to get to work is with the DNT or PGB to 35. And with the construction on 35 the traffic would force me to leave an hour earlier.

All the more frustrating knowing my money isn’t going towards the city but lining some company in a completely different country.

AND THERES STILL TRAFFIC ON DNT!!!

[-]

mPisi@reddit

AND THERES STILL TRAFFIC ON DNT!!! I agree, they need to raise the peak hour tolls A LOT, get things free-flowing 24/7. Late-night tolls should be lowered. The demand-driven Express Lane system really is pretty good for this.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

Not sure if you're implying that DNT tolls go to a company in a different country, but they do not.

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Jesus-Biscuits@reddit

You know, I was implying that but upon further research I realize I’ve misunderstood the article I originally read about the topic. Companies in other countries do have deals on some express lanes but NTTA is all statewide.

Still wild that express lanes in Texas brings profits to companies outside the US but definitely not as bad as a mandatory highway commute for some folks.

[-]

permalink_save@reddit

And are billionaires paying the brunt of it?

[-]

Barack_Odrama_007@reddit

There are 2 train lines that go from Plano to Downtown Dallas. Day passes (round trip is $6). Monthly is $126 which is $1,512 a year.

Y’all have options….

[-]

dallasdude@reddit

That particular route is only served by bus. Which does exist, to be fair.

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lobohog@reddit

I don’t think this is correct but could be wrong. Looking at the toll gantry calculator, if you get start from Legacy in Plano and get off at Harry Hines in downtown, and then round trip, I’m getting about $12. Which is still expensive but considering it’s ~40 miles round trip, that’s 30¢ per mile. Way way cheaper than these express lanes that are often upwards of $2 per mile.

[-]

dallasdude@reddit

you might be right, I could be remembering the toll that showed on Google which is the opposite of accurate. I try to stay off the toll roads!

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3-DMan@reddit

I'm sure your job will compensate you for that!

Awkward silence

Entire room laughs

[-]

digitalquesarito@reddit

That’s my daily commute, it’s wonderful /s

[-]

TheSpivack@reddit

And the DNT is much harder to avoid if that's your commute. Not like it's an optional toll for an express lane.

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DarthJahona@reddit

Toll Tag cuts that in half. Those taxes though go right back into upkeep and maintenance on the toll roads, unlike Express Lanes that are making a Spanish company money. In Plano at least, you also have the option of 75 or even taking Dart into downtown if you want to avoid the DNT.

[-]

matt_havener@reddit

Plus another $10k/yr to own and drive the car https://www.kbb.com/new-cars/total-cost-of-ownership/

Cars are expensive, but they're great if you're rich

[-]

NWOKingandqueen6799@reddit

Wow! Never seen anything over $16

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GenomeXIII@reddit

laughs in MoPac

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Suziannie@reddit

It’s dynamic. That process will change throughout the day.

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SleezyQueezy@reddit

Better pay for $50 bill or face $300 in late fees 😂😂

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ConsistentStyle5015@reddit

The only thing we can do is stop using them and hurt their pockets.

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NationalCaterpillar6@reddit

It pays the UBI for retired Dallas Firefighters.

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darealest__1@reddit

I’ve seen worse. From like miller westbound to the tollway used to be $10 bucks in the mornings. My toll bill skyrocketed.

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Prowling_Owl@reddit

Should’ve never voted for that garbage bullshit in the first place you morons…..

[-]

sband3@reddit

Yeah, the thing is that we’ve already paid for this road with out property taxes. We shouldn’t have to continue paying for it

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throwawaysscc@reddit

Please channel into rage against lack of effective public transit.

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Ok-Yam-536@reddit

Well that's the whole point! If the toll during rush hour was cheap then it would be backed up like all the other lanes.

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Man_Bangknife@reddit

on 183 it often goes to 10-20+ bucks. The comedy of that really comes when ya get to the single-lane only portions behind a giant truck going 55.

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adjust_your_set@reddit

And science forbid there’s a wreck or broke down car in front of you. Then you’re stuck for 3 hours.

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jonnybanana88@reddit

Had exactly this happen to me once a few years ago. On my way back to my shop in west Ft. Worth from Dallas. Literally sat there for 3 hours because a car hit the barricade and then got rear ended

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justawoman2026@reddit

Highway robbery.

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Toastjoey76@reddit

It's $32 here in some places in the DMV

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Hadrian98@reddit

$7.80! DAMN! I better get some sucky-sucky with that! - Loc Dog

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Adorable-Composer358@reddit

i just moved here from FL can one of yall break it down for me bc i thought you paid the price one time to get on express lanes but i got a ticket in the mail for 400$ and was so lost dude

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starfrenzy1@reddit

I've seen one heading west on 183 in the mid-cities that said $12 or something. Insane.

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No_Image_3849@reddit

Toll roads should be illegal. State funds built road near the toll should eminent domain the roads from those companies

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droys76@reddit

That’s not bad. I’ve seen $24 getting on 121/183 westbound during rush hour.

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Initial_Job9323@reddit

The tolls in this city are absolutely out of control. There's no way the state should let them charge this much, but they've corrupted the entire thing. Honestly, without those corrupt deals, we wouldn't have roads half as nice as we do now.

There should be a limit on the amount of time (in years) the toll authority should be able to charge these crazy rates.

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PhoenixAquarium@reddit

Just wait til the World Cup. The prices will be out of this world.

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ChuckWeezy@reddit

That’s nothing. I’ve seen it over $25 before in 183.

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

Jesus can't you imagine 25$ for every car going thru?! Those admins are licking their chops. Unfucking believable.

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ChuckWeezy@reddit

It’s ludicrous.

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JacketStraight2582@reddit

It's only $7.80 plus tipping would be good enough for a living wage.

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

Damn straight!

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MHJ03@reddit

So don’t go that way

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

I don't! The problem is that they are price gouging for an already paid road and don't give me shit about maintenance and expansion excuse. Somebody is making a killing with these prices and it ain't you or I.

[-]

jazzeejeff@reddit

Toll roads and managed toll lanes are optional - FYI. If you don’t like the prices don’t drive on them. Heavy traffic on the non-toll roads and toll lanes are what drive up the prices. Don’t blame them, it’s all business. It’s no different when a big an event comes to town and hotel prices skyrocket.

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

This has to be the worst pro toll roads argument in this thread. JFC.

[-]

Excellent_Bet3931@reddit

Its not lol! This has become a huge problem on top of high gas prices. please someone tell us something we can do to fix it.

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barmen03@reddit

The Tarrant county ones regularly get over $20, it’s ridiculous

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Gold_Painting_7941@reddit

🤮

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duncandreizehen@reddit

what’s funny is that people talk about living in Texas is good because it’s low taxes but the reality is you’re going to pay

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johnnydfree@reddit

Express lanes on otherwise free roads. Live here, seen that. Never used them.

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TechComedian84@reddit

dynamic pricing is awful, and it should be capped at $5-$10

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swiftie-42069@reddit

Express lanes are pricey. I avoid them unless it’s a big mess.

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Nemesisguy214@reddit

Today I saw $9 and $18 from loop12 to hillcrest to wherever but just ripoff

[-]

NeoRa3rdEye@reddit

So do americans really feel comfortable and fine paying to be double taxed on roads that are rightfully ours paying someone you’ll never see or meet to drive your paid for vehicle on concrete in America and you okay paying someone in spain?

[-]

sooner_25@reddit

I only ride the toll roads about once a month when I’m going up to Oklahoma to watch college football. If it saves me an hour on that drive it is totally worth it for me, especially if it’s a Friday and I’m not wanting to get into town exhausted.

I would hate to have to do this every day though and completely understand where people are coming from

[-]

poscarspops@reddit

You should see the variable tolls in Austin. I’ve seen them as high as $18

[-]

Big_Wave9732@reddit

Three cheers for "dynamic pricing"!

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Visual_Consequence24@reddit

Just don’t pay them, duh, it’s a Spanish company not a state run business. Austin & Houston is where you want to worry.

[-]

liquidm3t4l@reddit

it was 10.70 Friday afternoon 2 weeks ago 💀

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PuppiesDntPout@reddit

I literally just paid $18. 😭

[-]

KDFWCenterline@reddit

So dont take the toll road

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

I didn't say I did take the toll road and I don't out of principle. Like someone mentioned here, it's literally highway robbery.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

Robbery is when you take something from someone against their will.

You have to choose to pay this, which is the literal exact opposite of robbery lol

[-]

permalink_save@reddit

It's our city to service us, not pay a company in another country to use what should be public infrastructure. Billionaires should be paying for this shit not us and we have plenty of them here that could be taxed.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

lol?

You think public services should just be free and not cost you anything? Billionaires can't pay for everything.

[-]

permalink_save@reddit

I think we need to stop lying to ourselves that the working class should shoulder a lot of the burden when billionaires pay relatively way less taxes and at the same time stall our wages. I never said free, you did, we can definitely tax the rich to cover these gaps instead of further taxing the working class. Billionaires have to pay for something, they are just freeloading off society at this point.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

??

Billionaires are paying considerably more of the tax burden than you are. Like way more.

[-]

RayTargaryen26@reddit

Who cares? They earn a lot more and wages have not gone up. They should pay more. Bring back FDR Tax rates for the rich! Even if they super high taxes they would have millions if not billions of dollars to live on. Pablo down the street who can barely afford rent shouldn't get more taxes, he should get taxed an even smaller percentage.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

Wages have definitely gone up though?

Bring back FDR Tax rates for the rich!

Does this mean also bring back the accompanying crazy tax code where way more could be deducted and deferred, or do you think that high tax rate (that almost nobody actually paid) is the only difference in the tax code?

Pablo down the street who can barely afford rent shouldn't get more taxes, he should get taxed an even smaller percentage.

I presume you're no longer talking about property taxes, given the FDR comment. Someone who barely can afford rent is probably already paying a near-zero tax rate. It'd be tough for it to go any lower. In fact, the rich today pay a greater portion of the tax burden than they did 60 years ago.

[-]

RayTargaryen26@reddit

Let me simplify it. I want the rich to get taxed more than right now. I don't care if they pay more taxes than the rest of the population, they should. I will continue voting for Democrats until it happens. Tax the rich until we can't tax them anymore.

[-]

permalink_save@reddit

You need to go look around brother. For one I said relative but there are billionaires paying hardly anything. I'm sorry if you don't see how stacked society is against us.

[-]

deja-roo@reddit

For one I said relative but there are billionaires paying hardly anything

Are there though?

[-]

Itchy_Lab6034@reddit

I’m pretty sure someone getting robbed doesn’t have another option.

[-]

GettingBy-Podcast@reddit

Friedrich Nietzsche would disagree.

[-]

halfbrit08@reddit

Seriously. On the rare occasion when I pay money for a toll road, I want it to be actually fast. Like when I take the sub terranean 635 toll road to the airport it's full speed the entire way with no braking. You bring those rates down below $5 and everyone will take the tolls, and they'll no longer be significantly faster.

[-]

boxofdem0ns@reddit

How may inches of boot can you throat before you gag?

[-]

Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

Your comment has been removed because it is a violation of Rule #3: Uncivil Behavior

Violations of this rule may result in a ban. Please review the r/Dallas rules on the sidebar before commenting or posting.

Send a message the moderators if you have any questions. Thanks!

[-]

Decapitat3d@reddit

Less than your mom, that's for sure.

[-]

deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

[-]

Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

Your comment has been removed because it is a violation of Rule #3: Uncivil Behavior

Violations of this rule may result in a ban. Please review the r/Dallas rules on the sidebar before commenting or posting.

Send a message the moderators if you have any questions. Thanks!

[-]

ghostymost2@reddit

Toll road defenders are wild

[-]

Dysanj@reddit

I've seen worse.

[-]

Prestigious-Arm-8874@reddit

I like to know what determines the “price “ and who adjusts the number .

[-]

Brave-Statement-8810@reddit

And yes, the Texas legislature sold this project to a foreign company, so they paid to build the express lanes instead of using taxpayer $ so now they get the tolls forever (idk, something like 50 years?) whenever anyone uses it to make their money back. But I’m pretty sure there is a rate structure and a cap, they can’t just charge anything they want.

[-]

Brave-Statement-8810@reddit

It’s based on traffic congestion. The idea is to keep the express lanes moving at a minimum of 55mph. So when traffic gets worse, so does the price of taking the express lanes. These are totally optional lanes unlike the all of DNT being toll lanes

[-]

HerebyGuy@reddit

Its so fun though. 😅

[-]

zhallrr@reddit

These aren’t toll prices. These are express lanes.

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Brave-Statement-8810@reddit

Yes, and the prices factor in traffic to make sure they stay “express”

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Glad_Air8204@reddit

Those are rookie numbers , I’ve seen them in the 20’s 😭

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darkhorse21980@reddit

You haven't seen some of the Tarrant County tolls, have you?

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kaptainkkk@reddit (OP)

I have not, I don't travel there very often but based on the comments posted, what I saw on 635 is chump change compared to Tarrant county tolls eesh!

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darkhorse21980@reddit

I've seen $20+ posted tolls on Airport Freeway...literal highway robbery.

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peachtreeparadise@reddit

Y’all I’m embarrassed to ask this but fee for your entire express trip or charged after each exit passed? 👀

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wildgunman@reddit

Why are we doing this again? Complaining about the economics of express lanes is like complaining about gravity. Big, dense stuff is heavy. Dunno why we need a monthly thread devoted to it.

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Houstonontheroad@reddit

I will vote for any candidate of any party that will fight back against toll costs

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TheFeedMachine@reddit

In 1991 Texas raised the fuel tax to $0.20 per gallon. It has not changed since then. It is the primary way roads are funded in the state. In the following 35 years, inflation has made it so that $0.48 per gallon is needed to match the 1991 fuel tax rate. Cars have much heavier and much more fuel efficient relative to their weight. Roads are getting much more wear and tear per gallon of gas used. Combine that with inflation, and we are looking at a severe shortage of funds used to build and maintain roads. The state turns to toll roads instead because fuel taxes are incredibly unpopular. The solution to this is increased public transportation, increased fuel taxes, or both.

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noncongruent@reddit

Raise the gas tax 150% and see what happens to our economy. Employers will have to give out double digit pay increases to retain employees, and more likely is that both will simply leave for states with lower costs of living, including gas taxes.

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TheFeedMachine@reddit

If your car gets 25 MPG and travels 15000 miles per year, going from $0.20 to $0.50 per gallon gas tax increases your total cost by about $150 per year, or $12.50 a month. Going from Legacy West to Downtown Dallas is $4.90 each way, so it is 1.5 roundway trips from West Plano/Frisco to Downtown Dallas per month in extra cost.

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noncongruent@reddit

As soon as I can figure out how to get the money I want to get a plug-in hybrid, especially a Volt or Prius. Until then I can't get one.

Also, something's wrong with your numbers. 25mpg and 15,000 miles is 600 gallons burned. Going from $2.13 to $3.59 is $876, or $73/month.

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TheFeedMachine@reddit

Fuel tax is $0.20 per gallon. Going from $0.20 to $0.50 per gallon increases fuel prices by $0.30 per gallon. $0.30 * 600 = 180. It is $15/month not $12.50/month. I got 150 in my head instead of 180 and messed up subsequent calculations. Increasing the fuel tax by 150% doesn't increase gas prices by 150%. It increases them by a fixed amount as the fuel tax is a constant amount, $0.20 per gallon.

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noncongruent@reddit

Whoops, forgot we were talking about the tax only. The increased tax does disproportionally affect people at the lower end of the economic scale as they are more often living further from employment simply because they can't afford to live closer. This increases their dependence on a vehicle, and transit can't pick up the slack even remotely due to the last mile problem.

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DigitalArbitrage@reddit

The problem is politicians put a cap on taxes funding transportation into the state constitution back in the 1990s. We need to amend the state constitution to raise highway funding to where it needs to be.

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GettingBy-Podcast@reddit

But subsidize healthcare, and that's communism.

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shwampchicken@reddit

No one should ever take those stupid express lanes. They shouldn’t even exist in the first place

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Comfortable_Fruit847@reddit

Get on 183W around 5PM going through Euless and Bedford, it’s $22-$24

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Ineedfunding007@reddit

How can I use my toll perk points I got a billion

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EuphoricRent4212@reddit

You should see the one on 183 through the mid cities to 820

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hellasalty@reddit

Not defending HOW they use the money generated from these tolls, but this is actually by design. its variable rate depending on traffic. If it was always cheap, everyone would take the toll road and it would be just as congested as the main highway, defeating the purpose of the express lane. By increasing price with traffic, it ensures that any one vehicle in the express lane can maintain an average speed of 55mph. What really needs to happen is ban any vehicle with more than 2 axles from using these lanes. It's extremely frustrating to pay $5+ dollars to use a road and being stuck behind a semi going 40mph, watching the main highway traffic pass you

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Magnusprim3@reddit

Stop voting for republicans who give our roads to the toll companies.

In fact almost everything wrong with this state is because people keep voting for republicans. 31 years - 3 republican governors.

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mmmarklar@reddit

i wish Texans would wake up to this. They vote against their own interests so much bc they can't vote for the welfare queens, transgenders, Mexican gangs, or whatever fox news has programmed them to think. Trickle down economics is a fairy tail and has been proven as such. it's just so stupid.

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No-Doughnut324@reddit

Ive been avoiding the tolls, I can technically afford it but it just pisses me off so much I dont want to gove them any of my money

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Jazzlike-Mission-172@reddit

And then people get in the left lane going 65mph

MOOOOOVE

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fouiedchopstix@reddit

Is anyone following the guy on TikTok attempting to get us a class action lawsuit against NTTA?

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Anuud_man@reddit

Lol yes, yes I am traffic is no fun I like to go zoom zoom

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cfpresley@reddit

Congestion based pricing

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notnotluke@reddit

This. At least when you pay the toll you move quickly. Some toll roads a you pay and sit in bumper to bumper traffic. Sometimes the $20 express lane is worth it (not be late to an important meeting or appointment).

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chardeemacdenn@reddit

Where’s the French 75 when you need them

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Upsiderhead@reddit

Good, then it's working as intended.

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CaptainZhon@reddit

The same system that creates the traffic congestion issues on the highways is the same system that allows for toll roads to be built and the toll companies to charge based on traffic congestion. Make it make sense.

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FiftyShadesOfBlack@reddit

During rush hour the tolls are always at $20+ on 121W around Bedford 🥲

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gottheronavirus@reddit

I just ride my bike, tolls don't apply

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Typical-Promotion470@reddit

I got charged $24 using the toll road on 121. Just to get from Central to 820! Oh yeah, I was stuck in traffic while the non toll payers were flying by next to me.. so irritating lol

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Upbeat-Lobster-4977@reddit

Stop driving on them and the prices will go down. Especially the for profit lanes that Jack the price up to buy another vacation home with the money you needed just to get to work! Roads in DFW with private profit built in 1) North Tarrant Express (NTE) – Fort Worth core corridors Includes: I-820 (NE Loop) SH-121 / SH-183 (Airport Freeway) I-35W TEXpress lanes Who gets paid: Cintra Meridiam Dallas Police and Fire Pension System Structure: 50+ year concession Private consortium runs it They collect tolls and profit after costs/debt 2) LBJ Express (I-635 TEXpress lanes – Dallas side) Who gets paid: Cintra Institutional investors Structure: Long-term concession (~50 years) Private operator keeps toll revenue 3) SH-130 (Austin area – important example) Why it matters: Fully privatized model (originally) Investors lost money → bankruptcy → ownership shifted 👉 Proof that: These are real profit vehicles But they can fail hard if traffic projections are wrong ⚖️ Contrast: NOT profit-driven (NTTA roads) Examples: Dallas North Tollway President George Bush Turnpike Sam Rayburn Tollway These are run by North Texas Tollway Authority Key difference: No shareholders But still pays billions in bond interest to investors 👉 So money still leaves the system—just indirectly 🔍 Bottom line (no fluff) True “profit-taking” roads in your area: North Tarrant Express (your Fort Worth lanes) LBJ Express (Dallas) NOT profit-taking (but still paying investors): NTTA roads

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TeknoBlast@reddit

This is just crazy. I know traffic is horrendous, but unless I'm a super super in a hurry, I'm tough out the traffic. Fuk them rates.

But of course, they'll never adjust the rates because there are people that are willing to pay those rates.

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cfbswami@reddit

huh?

That 4 mile stretch on 183 - Euless to Hurst - is often $25 afternoon rush hour

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Defiant_Salary6711@reddit

Don't pay it.

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scatmanjack6120@reddit

They also got it written into law that they can charge for any vehicle on the tollroad- including your totaled vehicle that is being transported on the back of tow truck after an accident… (gotta add remove your plates to post accident checklist…)

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DFWTrojanTuba@reddit

I’ve seen $34 on the I-66 toll in Northern Virginia. This is nothing lol.

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Danilo-11@reddit

The solution to reduce traffic on toll roads is to increase prices (remove poor people out of them)

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SlackBytes@reddit

Toll roads are amazing if you’re rich

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vacation_bacon@reddit

Or bad with money and chronically late (comme moi)

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SlackBytes@reddit

For example. Say you’re rich and your hoa or some organization is saying you can’t do this or it’s a fine. Well the rich guy can just eat fines. Meaning the law affects everyone in the neighborhood except him.

Tolls are the same. Rich can take them everytime not just during emergencies.

HOV lanes is the best solution imo.

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TheSpivack@reddit

Just like how Jeff Bezos pays $1000 in fines per month because he wants his hedges and fences to be higher than the city allows.

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justonemom14@reddit

So basically your average person couldn't afford to be a Bezos hedge.

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jvon24@reddit

This is why I tell people Texas isn’t a cheap place to live….

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Dapper_Connection526@reddit

more than minimum wage lol wtf

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PomeloPepper@reddit

When they first started an acquaintance of mine stopped on the highway in an ice storm. Bumper to bumper traffic was barely moving, and the Express lanes had surge pricing of $22. Completely empty.

He finally figured out he was being needlessly frugal in that case, since he'd barely moved in 30 minutes. He took the Express lane to get home, then watched the still ongoing traffic jam on the evening news.

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imperial_scum@reddit

I've seen $25 on 35W coming from Arlington

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mansonsturtle@reddit

Yay free market capitalism and privatization of everything!

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I_SmellFuckeryAfoot@reddit

stop using it?

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SnooHabits3911@reddit

Then don’t use it

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rickcinbigd@reddit

Winning

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nandrizzle@reddit

Back in my day the damn tollway costed a damn .25

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kmelby33@reddit

But no state income tax! Lol

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NonFungibleTokenism@reddit

no it isn't, its in control! the whole point of the dynamic toll is to have fewer people find the price acceptable so you dont have the toll lane also get congested

Would you rather pay 2.5$ to sit in traffic the exact same as if you'd paid nothing?

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thatsoonerguy@reddit

The Express is an absolute last resort

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jaslr4@reddit

Welcome to TX

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WHATTHEFUCKZGOINGON@reddit

Tolls are scams.

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deleted_by_reddit@reddit

[removed]

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Dallas-ModTeam@reddit

Your comment has been removed because it is a violation of Rule #3: Uncivil Behavior

Violations of this rule may result in a ban. Please review the r/Dallas rules on the sidebar before commenting or posting.

Send a message the moderators if you have any questions. Thanks!

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UnknownQTY@reddit

This isn’t a toll lane, it’s an express lane.

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DragonChowhound@reddit

Try the toll stretch on 121 through Bedford

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ChosynLabs@reddit

That’s nothing. Virginia tolls go up to $60 one way.

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carabear85@reddit

Fucking ridiculous! That’s more than minimum wage!

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Sturdily5092@reddit

The HOV was meant to encouragee drivers to ride-share and save on gas but these prices are more than double the price of gasoline even at today's prices. So what's the point?

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txstubby@reddit

Have you seen how complex it is to get an HOV discount, everyone in the car needs the GoCarma app on their phones, and the discount only applies to certain TxEpress lanes and then not during rush hour or at weekends.

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txstubby@reddit

My understanding is that the toll authorities in North Texas try to keep the speed on the toll road above 55 mph, if the speed on the toll road drops below 55 mph they increase the toll to discourage people from using the toll road. Unfortunately this has the opposite effect, people see the high toll and assume that the non-toll road is severely congested and take the toll road.

One thing not a lot of people realize, in most cases maintenance of the non toll road is paid from the tolls, however I'm certain that when designing a toll road they deliberately create choke points on the non toll road to ensure that the toll road gets used.

I will agree that the tolls can be excessive, driving North on 35W from Ft Worth at 10pm on a Sunday night, the toll road was something like $2.45 but there was minimal traffic on 35w and no delays. Earlier on the Sunday evening, at around 6pm, going south on 35W towards Ft Worth the toll was something like $7.50 and that saved me around 10 minutes in traffic.

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LAJimm9@reddit

Texas - the home of regressive taxation

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BranSolo7460@reddit

Yup. In an economical system where everything we need is commodified for profit, this is the inevitability.

If we can get enough people to ditch their toll tags and refuse to pay, we can force prices lower, or to phase out the tolls all together. We, the working class people who have to commute have more power than they do, we just need to organize.

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TransportationEng@reddit

If only everyone boycotted the managed lanes...

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holdbold@reddit

You can get a day pass for DART if you want to

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Realistic_Strategy44@reddit

stop moving

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LandlordTiberius@reddit

Because FUCK YOU, that’s why

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Curtisaarond@reddit

There's no reason why the cost of the toll should go up

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El_alacran214@reddit

Looks about right 👍🏽

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JRLDH@reddit

That’s the best idea for this type of luxury road. It’s basically always “Express” because it keeps the masses out. Including me, most of the time.

But it’s great having the option bypassing significant traffic in a (even minor) “emergency”.

They should make it $50 or $100 so that it’s guaranteed to be available if it’s actually needed.

If it were $1, all you’d accomplish is ruining the “Express” part as it will be bumper-bumper just like the DNT.

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yarmulke@reddit

Or, how about we invest in some actual infrastructure that is proven to reduce traffic, and is also much safer, like public transportation!

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JRLDH@reddit

Well, yes, but that isn’t about that.

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yarmulke@reddit

Any post about frustration with transportation is about that.

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JRLDH@reddit

That attitude ruins discussions like that because you can always bitch about lack of public transportation in Texas especially. So what are you adding to this particular discussion?

I at least gave a reason why higher fares can be beneficial. You’ll understand this if you happen to be in a situation where you HAVE to be somewhere and traffic is bumper-bumper but for $20 or so you can bypass it.

Not sure why this is difficult to understand and how your rant about public transportation is useful. There isn’t an express train under 635.

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Faedaine@reddit

Its based on demand. If more people get on it, the cost rises so that other people stay away. Thats the whole point. It keeps the express lane ... express.

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Ok_Education9679@reddit

but we don't have a state income tax so it's fine /s

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Barack_Odrama_007@reddit

It’s doing its job! You don’t have to pay this if you stay on the mainlines. If y’all fuck up the mainlines as y’all RELIABLY do, then they will raise the toll lane prices because they need to keep it flowing. They want to price you out to keep paying cars moving.

Stop fucking up the main highway and they wouldn’t have justification to jack up rates.

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Tiiimmmaayy@reddit

So annoying because Google Maps doesn’t prices these express lanes in. I don’t mind taking the DNT or Sam Rayburn so I don’t want to hit “avoid tolls”, but whenever I head over to Fort Worth I’m like cool, no traffic and should only cost $2.

Then google tells me to get on the express lanes where it’s like $7-$10. I avoid it and then sit in bumper to bumper traffic until I cave and take the express lanes. I never learn my lesson. Thankfully I rarely head into Fort Worth.

I technically don’t even pay for tolls; my company reimburses me. I just don’t like paying those absurd prices on principle.

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poop_pebbles@reddit

You just move here or something?

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SimpleVegetable5715@reddit

It’s dumb, especially with how much property tax we pay. We could afford decent roads.

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Current_Analysis_104@reddit

That’s crazy! I use to be able to go all month on $40 for tolls but that’s doubled. NTTA is government owned nonprofit so the profit is supposed to go back into roads and bridges. NTTA made $712 million in profit last year. I guess that toll way extension is pretty expensive!

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