what do Balkans think of this proposed alliance?
Posted by SOHONEYSAME@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 66 comments
Posted by SOHONEYSAME@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 66 comments
GrogmarktheRag@reddit
I hope that our government ignores this. The vast majority of Greeks, even if they aren't fond of Turkey's government, DO NOT WANT MORE TENSIONS. And especially we will NOT go to war with Turkey on behalf of fucking Bibi. We want to resolve our differences with Turkey and secure our maritime zones PEACEFULLY.
Happy-Hour88@reddit
How about a deal, you give us a strip down to Alexandroupoulis so you lose your continential border with Turkey and and in return we'll give you a strip of the same size to Bansko? /jk
Lothronion@reddit
This sounds like the Evros Zone, when during the rule of the Pro-German Greek Dictatorship in Greece the Germans had specifically made it clear to Bulgaria how that specific area was to stay outside of Bulgaria’s area of policing, hence directly under the control of the Athenian Government (I mean de facto, as opposed to just de jure in the areas where there were Bulgarian forces, such as in the rest of Western Thrace). The reason for that was that it showed Turkey how the Axis forces in Greece were supposedly there just to maintain the Pro-German Greek Government in power, after kicking out the Pro-British one, and to prevent it being deposed by the Greek Resistance.
And even more with how the Maniot Greeks would surrender their border-lands with the Ottoman Morea to the Venetians, for the dual purpose of having a buffer-zone and that should the Ottoman Turks would invade, then automatically they are also attacking the Venetians, hence they would be compelled to bring reinforcements.
FantasticQuartet@reddit
Did we go to war with Iran? No. Did we go to war with Hezbollah? No. Did we go to war with Hamas? No. Then we aren't going to war with Turkey because Israel will tell us to.
Stop regurgitating Turkish propaganda on X. It's embarrassing.
gimmieshelter_@reddit
You let Israel Air force to use your airspace, which will make you party to the conflict in case Israel uses that to strike Turkey
Stalaagh@reddit
No war with Iran?
We literally sent Patriot air defense systems and our idiot Defence minister bragged about how we shoot down missiles. That’s direct involvement in the war.
And you think this government will not do exactly what Israel tells it to do?
Several-Zombies6547@reddit
The patriot defense systems have been in Saudi Arabia (not Israel) for years, as part of a bilateral agreement. I'm not fond of Saudi Arabia, but would you rather not honor the agreement and diplomatically embarrass ourselves?
pitogyros@reddit
That has nothing to do with Israel , please make a small research before you start making assumptions, the Patriot missiles were sent due to 2020 ( or 2019 I am not sure ) defence agreement with Saudi Arabia and UAE.
Thats how defence agreement works , you have to honour it
FantasticQuartet@reddit
So we shot down missiles heading to Saudi Arabia and you think this is an attack on Iran?
Spain also shot down missiles heading to Turkey. Is Spain attacking Iran? I fail to see your logic here.
GrogmarktheRag@reddit
We had no way of attacking Iran even if we wanted to. But the US did attack Iran because of Israel. We have historic disputes with Turkey and Israel is known to use its "allies" for wars that benefit them. It's bad enough that we continue to side with them even as the rest of the EU finally realizes they have to start backing away.
Also I don't even use X what are you talking about lmao
FantasticQuartet@reddit
You are comparing apples and oranges my friend. The US has attacked countries its entire history and still does. When did we last attack anyone? A century ago?
Our entire dogma is on defense. Nobody is crazy enough to attack a country 8 times our population who can easily deploy troops on our islands.
carpuzz@reddit
Can i dip my feet in my mainlands shore, komşu? or Will U upgrade 15 mile to 25 mile in 50 years unilaterally..
Lothronion@reddit
There is a huge irony here, how the Turkish President's "Mavi Vatan" maps suggest that a Greek islander living tens of miles away from Anatolia's shores, is in Turkish waters the moment they dip their toes in the sea-foam. Said map even includes far-away islands like Lemnos, Karpathos and Astypalaia.
carpuzz@reddit
Yeah there are ironies like u adamantly put battalions after battalions in these tiny islands but don't they bound to be civilian use only..?
Lothronion@reddit
There is nothing ironic about that; when a demilitarized zone is being threatened, and especially with specialized armies to capture them, such as the Aegean Army and its amphibious capabilities, then it is by default rendered no longer demilitarized, and it would be suicidal to maintain it as such by the side possessing it.
I understand that Turkey has security concerns over these islands, especially the Dodecanese, given how Italy used them to invade in 1919 AD, and constantly threatened to repeat that in the 1930s, till Mustafa Kemal made it clear that Turkey would go to war for that, but that is not Greece’s problem. And it should not really be Turkey’s problem either, given how Greece has not established there any military with amphibious capabilities to invade South-West Anatolia, and that the military presence there is strictly defensive.
carpuzz@reddit
Here is the treaties and agreements that the Greek komsu surely don't obey. Treaty of Lausanne Paris Peace Treaty
Lothronion@reddit
For theTreaty of Lausanne of 1923, Turkey agreed that the North Aegean Islands were to be demilitarized in 1936, as part of the Treaty of Montreax relating the Straits. For the Paris Peace Treaty of 1947, I explained above, you threatened a demilitarized zone, hence it is no longer that.
carpuzz@reddit
It's not convincing.. And u know it
carpuzz@reddit
.. And who's the expansionist country here.. That's the irony..
Lothronion@reddit
The one whose President is standing in front of reversionistic and expansionistic maps, like the one I presented above, and then threatens his neighbour country with bombardment and invasion.
Lothronion@reddit
If there were to be a Greco-Israeli alliance, like the one that is speculated, then it would mostly serve in the same manner that the Greco-Turkish did during the Interwar Period, against Bulgaria, as a reaction to bilateral fears of Bulgarian aggression. In this manner, because Greece feared that Bulgaria would invade Western Thrace and Eastern Macedonia (and almost went to war in 1925 due to this paranoia, legitimate or not), and Turkey was weary of the possibility of Bulgaria invading Eastern Thrace and capturing Istanbul (a major reason why Ankara became the capital), they formed a block against that country. And it did work, it only took Nazi Germany with a million troops to break that alliance, and firm promises from their side towards Turkey that they were not invading Greece but merely expelling the Pro-British Greek Government.
There is no reason to believe that Greece is going to "go to war with Turkey" on behalf of Israel, especially given how since 1925-1926 no Greek Government has even contemplated to engage in revisionism over the Greco-Turkish border, treating the Lausanne Treaty of 1923 (and Greece’s interpretation of it) as gospel and manual handbook on how to deal with inter-state affairs. For a century the military dogma of Greece pertaining the Greco-Turkish border is strictly its perpetual maintenance and nothing more than that. To say the contrary, especially for attacking Turkey for the sake of Israel is on the level of conspiracy theories, while if Turkey invades first, they were already going to do so anyways (like the Axis doing so with Greece in WW2, for being too “Pro-British”, despite Metaxas’ promises for Greece’s neutrality being responded with demands to deliver territory to Italy and Bulgaria).
BlokZNCR@reddit
Türkiye: Oh, Azerbaijan, bro?
Fred_Neecheh@reddit
I will never refer to Turkey by any other name in English.. I am sure I am not alone in that.
KuroNekoX3@reddit
Country supposedly representing you will though?
VerkoProd@reddit
absolutely shameful and ridiculous. why fight for israel and the u.s.? they bring nothing but political chaos, mass deaths and irreparable destruction everywhere they intervene
carpuzz@reddit
Greek armies once invaded Anatolia by the aid and mandated by British.. Why not? now by Israel
VerkoProd@reddit
whats ur point? western-backed offensive wars were wrong then and are wrong now. how have we not learned this by now through our own history? their interests aren’t ours.
also, at least greece benefited territorially then. there was some form of popular nationalist support for attacking turkey. what greek would give up their life today in the interest of an imperialist superpower and a genocidal colonising state?
carpuzz@reddit
Hope ur right.
bosnanic@reddit
lol a "die for Israel" alliance. What does the UAE or Azerbaijan get from antagonizing their neighbours and becoming the main targets for future attacks from much larger military powers?
I don't see "get yourself bombed so Israel can sit back" as a good deal.
alkorisno@reddit
Who cares what modern nazis think
ZemlyaNovaya@reddit
Not really surprising, both india and greece share the same fascination for zionism and israel. Shows how shallow israeli government’s world view is though since turkey and iran are rivals both historically and politically. They have an uneasy respect for their border at best and proxy wars against each other at worst.
SaltBuster@reddit
Yeah this seems like some wet dream at best since Azerbaijan and Turkey have close ties and they both are rivals of Iran.
Truth is Israel is trying so hard to paint Turkey as a friend to Iran but anyone with half an IQ can see what’s what. Idk why Greece is aligning themselves with Israel though especially at a time like this when there is an active and ongoing genocide. One would figure they would want Turkey to stay in NATO unlike Israel who needs them out so bad, but I guess Greece has border ambitions of its own especially in maritime waters if they need Turkey alienated from NATO this bad.
ZemlyaNovaya@reddit
Yeah in terms of zionist fascination and obedience I’d say greece is the argentina of balkans (if you know you know)
GrogmarktheRag@reddit
While our government has allied with Israel, the vast majority of Greeks have no love for zionism and Israeli expansionism. If allying with Israel means getting closer to open war, nobody will want it, most Greeks nowadays just want stability and a good economy. The dream of reclaiming lands in Anatolia died 100 years ago and we have accepted that.
DueAppearance8008@reddit
Part of that siding is i guess because Turkey is becoming more Armed each year but never know how Greeks saw their relations with us.
Stalaagh@reddit
Please dont put ordinary Greeks in the same bag as our corrupt, incompetent and sold out politicians. Most of us strongly condemn Zionism and Israel!
DueAppearance8008@reddit
They wanna alienate us from NATO by saying we are collaberating with Iran. But truth is(i live on iranian border i can literally saw İran) even we are seeing them as rival. Yes while we support İran's Side for humanitarian way. We hate them as a geopolitical actor. They are acting like Isreal too when given a chance we are actually so happy from this War. It weakens Iran while f*cking up İsreals reputation around the world
FuelTheRadiance@reddit
Azerbaijan is playing both sides.
Also, Turkey is a threat to plans Greece, Cyprus, Israel have made to put down deep underwater electricity cables. They're claiming what the trio wants to do isn't permitted because it goes through Turkish territory. But that "territory" pretty much was underhandedly put together by Turkey making deals with Libya and signing them on. It's some envious mobster type shit.
DueAppearance8008@reddit
Playing both Sides doesnt gonna stop the Azerbaijanis form joining Turkey on this matter. Do u really they would leave their ONLY ally in the WHOLE region who supported them in Karabagh War in 2020 plus we are literally the Same race with them dont think they would choose Isreal over Turkey especially when Isreal will probably attack them anyway
FuelTheRadiance@reddit
I mean I don't think Azerbaijan wants to choose. But like any state, national power and sovereignity comes before any sense of "brotherhood." Russians and Ukrainians were also brothers, until Ukraine's national interests diverged completely.
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GrogmarktheRag@reddit
While our government has allied with Israel, the vast majority of Greeks have no love for zionism and Israeli expansionism. If allying with Israel means getting closer to open war, nobody will want it, most Greeks nowadays just want stability and a good economy. The dream of reclaiming lands in Anatolia died 100 years ago and we have accepted that.
im_not_creative123@reddit
Egypt and Ethiopia in the same alliance? Azerbaijan against turkey? This whole thing is a fever dream
yalnzaylak@reddit
Delusional if true
Ill-Dragonfruit4394@reddit
Meme si la turquie et la grece ont des differents dans les mers nos peuples sont unis par l’histoire, comme les armeniens et turcs et les problemes familiaux se reglent dans la famille. Degage israel
Careful-Evening-5187@reddit
Greece's government is "occupied Israeli territory".
This is not the wishes of the people. A generation ago PASOK was the most Palestine-sympathetic government in the world. What changed.
vaniot2@reddit
For fucks sake. Let's make things worse because there are no tensions politically with us and Turkey...
Bibi wants to "help" Greece by making us buy every freaking missile system Israel and the US make for the next 100 years. Thank you Bibi... /s
EmreTaptukYunus@reddit
Please, not Uganda. Please, not Uganda.
Bobinho4@reddit
I will be beyond shocked if the Azeris betray the Turks.
theboltT@reddit
Epstein Alliance
Self-Bitter@reddit
Oh please....
DriveByAtanCivciv@reddit
Azerbaijan and us are allies both as public opinion and on paper so rule them out, Ethiopia is doing a kind of balanced policy between powers I don't expect them to take on a single side, we literally cannot guess how the Emirati and American relations be like after the iran situation is eased, Egypt doesn't even know what it's doing also who invited the moroccans ok bro we are not recognizing West Sahara chill. In the case of Greece and Cyprus the tension is increasing especially with the things happening in the last few weeks both as greko-turkish relations and relations between us and Europe, ı hope for a de-escalation but seems like some politicians in europe are doubling down with anti-turkish statements.
lazypt@reddit
What happened to the gold alliance of usa and israel?
Lothronion@reddit
I feel like I am the only person who has noticed the connection between the usage of the term "Hexagon" and how a Star of David produces that shape if you connect all of its six rays. Which is funny, because Netanyahu insists on the use of this phraseology, but has still not decided over which “African ally” and “Asian ally” he is referring to (nor is it clarified if said “allies” are also supposed to be allied with one another).
Which means that we should not really be taking it seriously, as it is a “concept of a plan”, and that it sounds more like a domestic and internal consumption talking point, just like Netanyahu's insistence that there is an official Greco-Israeli alliance, in order to show how Israel is not diplomatically isolated due to the Middle East Crisis since 2023. As such, people taking it as a reality are merely just validating Netanyahu’s ploy.
Bugatsas11@reddit
Hopefully we will not. This is the equivalent of selling your soul to devil
GORDONxRAMSAY@reddit
I think INDIA, IRAN, TURKEY and PAKISTAN should form an alliance.
FuelTheRadiance@reddit
You think India, one of the most islamophobic countries on the planet, led by far-right Hindutva guys, should form an alliance with three of the most Islamic countries on earth?
Erozbey@reddit
Good luck with that.
OldYogurt7161@reddit
Literally each country in this map follows different real politik. Like half of these countries on opposite sides have good relations. Just Cyprus, Greek and Israel can have a pact against Turkey. I dont think this will go any further from weapon puchasing. And Turkey is a rival of Iran in middle east.
Krasniqi857@reddit
Arabs as hinted members?
FantasticQuartet@reddit
First time I'm hearing this and I follow the news here regularly.
Final-Nebula-7049@reddit
lol that looks like the shittiest proposal i have ever seen
KillerPalm@reddit
Azerbaijan vs Turkey? Alright bro
pitogyros@reddit
Azerbaijan in alliance against Turkey , yep that totally makes sense ( in some HOI 4 session )
the_reeee@reddit
Neutral. If there was a power block, its only natural that an oposition would prop up.
FuelTheRadiance@reddit
The drama between Israel and Turkey is very amusing.