Why doesn't Stellantis bring Opel to the US?
Posted by loweexclamationpoint@reddit | askcarguys | View on Reddit | 112 comments
Seems like there are some appealing Opel models, different from what Stellantis is trying to sell now.
Blu_yello_husky@reddit
Opel was already sold in the US as a captive import in the 1970s by Buick division iirc. It failed miserably, nobody bought them
1995LexusLS400@reddit
GM tried this and it failed.
The Astra, Vectra, Insignia, Mokka and I'm sure a few others were sold in the US under other GM brands, and all of them did pretty terribly.
SlyClydesdale@reddit
There’s nothing inherent about Opel’s vehicles that means they magically can’t work in this market. Volkswagens do.
It’s just that GM mismanaged Opel and could never get the production costs or product cadences right for our market. Or the marketing. Opel’s stuff was seen as oddballs, not invented here, and thus not delivered to the US with any real support or marketing focus.
There’s nothing magical about Opel that says a different company couldn’t offer them here with more success.
seanx50@reddit
Call them Chrysler or Dodge. Those dealers are starved for products
FlintHillsSky@reddit
Didi I hear someone say “Big Truck”? /s
seanx50@reddit
All Chrysler has is the old minivan. All Dodge has is the slow selling Charger and the ancient Dakota
Andre20021982@reddit
brusk48@reddit
Don't forget the Hornet, a bad Alfa Romeo product that Dodge dealers are supposed to try to service.
seanx50@reddit
Discontinued.
brusk48@reddit
It's still on their website, but yeah, looks like you're right. Good riddance.
f700es@reddit
/thread!
gthomps83@reddit
The Mokka started life as a Buick Encore and sold incredibly well here as that and the Chevy Trax, despite both having the most ungainly proportions.
The others were sold as Saturns and Buicks, but there was just nothing special about them. Not bad cars, but not great either.
athensslim@reddit
First (actually only) time I had a German trip where I was going to get to drive on the autobahn, I got to the rental counter and they gave me….a Mokka.
It was a far cry from the ultimate driving machine.
gthomps83@reddit
lol, oh no!!! Last time I was in Germany I specifically requested an Audi A3 (manual) or equivalent and ended up with a Range Rover Sport. Blessing in disguise as we ended up needing the space but it was still not what I wanted.
VerrueckterAmi@reddit
That sounds like an expensive trip fuel-wise!
athensslim@reddit
There was a line of Americans waiting for cars with automatics, I got to skip ahead in the queue because I could drive a manual. I was just happy to get anything.
bevipop@reddit
I loved my Saturn Astra, but I understand why it was a flop
rook119@reddit
It was the best car I ever owned. That car handeled so well. As far as underpowered I think its quicker than my current 2.0L 2024 civic.
bevipop@reddit
It was a very well built car. I really loved mine, I was sad to let it go, it was my first stickshift.
Very happy with my 3 series though
Cobrachimkin@reddit
Same here. Had an 08 xr 3 door and loved it, but it was not the best vehicle ever
bevipop@reddit
I had an XR four 5 door with a manual. Super fun to drive once you got it moving. Tragically under powered vehicle. It was still going strong at 165k when I got rid of it.
Cobrachimkin@reddit
It was a hoot in the corners, but my friends would make fun of the fact that an overtaking maneuver had to start about 4 car lengths back so it could drop a gear and gain some speed.
bevipop@reddit
And turn off the AC
Jdornigan@reddit
My father had an Opel that he inherited from his late father.
Opel vehicles were officially imported into the USA by General Motors from 1958 through the 1970s.
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
Yep, my first car was an Opel Kadett. Threw a rod fortunately while my dad was driving it so he couldn't blame me. Replaced it with another similar sort of thing, Mercury Capri- not the Mustang one, the English Ford one with a V6.
Then later I bought an Opel 1900 as a winter beater car. Somebody had spray painted the hood flat black for the Rallye look.
DreadpirateBG@reddit
I loved my Saturn Astra. Great car. Drove it into the ground just over 300k then had trans and engine issue same time so moved on vs fix. But was nice. I had bought a Chinese radio to get navigation and phone integration and rear camera. Nice.
Equana@reddit
Opel Senator V platform sold as a Cadillac Catera.
Holden version of the V platform sold as a Pontiac GTO and a later version as a Chevy
Intelligent-Ad-6734@reddit
I'd argue under their brand and low import numbers they did well. The last attempt at the regal was picking up momentum without a real advertisement campaign and if not for COVID, would've increased the import capacity... Then they sold it off after the updated version of the platform was used to underpin almost every vehicle they make now.
I had a tourx, loved it, and everyone would ask wow that's a beautiful new Buick! They're making cars and wagons again? Ummm they stopped making this 5 years ago sorry.
It was nice, torque vectoring rear, a skid plate better than z71 trucks and the 2.0L was great, awesome after I got it tuned.
Former_Mud9569@reddit
I almost bought the TourX. The dealer and I were a bit apart on price so I walked. I figured he'd call me back at the end of the month when he needed to make his numbers. Then GM killed most of their sedans/small cars and had a "you can't turn this down" discounts on the Chevy Volt. I got a loaded Volt for $20k off MSRP....
The Buick dealer called me back the instant I was rolling away in the Volt.
KiraDog0828@reddit
I thought the Tour-X was pretty cool. I test drove one on my way to buy a Mercedes wagon. Of course, the Mercedes was nicer, but the Buick would have been a better value.
I wonder how much the model’s odd name worked against it.
uhbkodazbg@reddit
I have a Regal (Insignia) and love it. It’s so different from the other Buick models that were available at the time. It’s not the floating boat that so many Buick owners were expecting. My previous car was a LeSabre and I loved it as well but they’re two totally different cars. The Insignia shouldn’t have been a Buick.
Majsharan@reddit
Actually hard disagree they were considered some of the best gm models in the us market at the time. But Stellantis already has too many brands imo.
jstar77@reddit
The original line up was great, ground up innovation, but left to languish. Later models and model refresh were just rebadges with no innovation.
Majsharan@reddit
Buick became opel in disguise essentially and that was one of the best periods for Buick imo
jstar77@reddit
Oops I must have replied to the wrong thread I was talking about Saturn.
Cynyr36@reddit
I keep arguing that saturn died on 2002 when the s-series stopped.
ashyjay@reddit
As much as Stellantis deserves the shit they get, as soon as they bought Opel/Vauxhall, Opel/Vauxhall made their first profit in decades, despite GM pumping so much into them and being GM's longest standing European brands.
https://www.drive.com.au/news/opel-vauxhall-returned-to-profit/
1995LexusLS400@reddit
Being the best doesn't mean they're financially viable. Saab is a fantastic example of this. Saab didn't have a bad model, but they couldn't turn a profit. Ford non-SUVs /Mustang in the US as well. Those were pretty good, but they weren't making enough money, so Ford stopped selling them. Opels in the US (even under different brands) weren't financially viable.
Stellantis is struggling quite a bit financially right now. They could bring Opels to the US, maybe even Peugeots/Citroens as well, under the Chrysler brand. But it's already proven that it won't work out too well.
Majsharan@reddit
Yeah Chrysler needs complete rebranding essentially and Stellantis announced which brands they were focusing on and Chrysler wasn’t one of them. So I would really be suprised if Chrysler gets much of anything beyond the Pacifica a shared platform with a new Durango and maybe a third thing.
Green_Temperature_57@reddit
I had a Saturn LW200 back in the day. Was Opel Vectra station wagon. Ok car but nothing special and was not the Japanese fighter they were hoping for.
SlyClydesdale@reddit
The Saturn L-Series was based on the Vectra, but shared no body panels with it. In truth, the two cars were pretty different.
Sudden_Hovercraft_56@reddit
because they are all shit cars.
Individual-Fail4709@reddit
No one would buy them. Fiat is and has been struggling. Doesn't make sense. In top of that, none of the vehicles are homologated to US standards. It would be a giant waste of capital.
Cpolo88@reddit
Saturn aura and Saturn astra were nice to look at. But they did not sell well. Shame. I really enjoyed the hot version of the Astra. But I got my Saturn sky which even though not an open, opel did sell the rebranded version so in a loophole, it's an openl 😂
Weak_Equivalent6518@reddit
Because Stellantis is rapidly declining in the US and they'd already be dead if it weren't for Jeeps and RAMs selling like hotcakes.
UnEstablishedViking@reddit
Selling like hotcakes is a bold statement.
badtux99@reddit
They sold 276,000 JK Wranglers in 2017 and roughly 156,000 JL Wranglers last year. Yeah no they aren't selling like hot cakes.
UnEstablishedViking@reddit
It's been pretty well reported that Ram and Jeep have been near the bottom in sales across most of their model categories. Jeep is only surviving because they have a cult following (which is dwindling) and Ram only because they have the Cummins engine in the medium duty trucks.
dxrey65@reddit
...and you could add to that - bringing Opel to the US sure as shit wouldn't save them, it would just speed up the collapse.
Channel_Huge@reddit
Does anyone actually love Stellantis?
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
I love my Pacifica and my dearly departed Town and Country. My friend and his wife love their Grand Cherokee and even their Patriot, their umpteenth Jeeps. But Stellantis the corporation? Nope, not a bit.
el-art-seam@reddit
Because they don’t make 6500lb 3 row SUVs or pick ups with V8s
badtux99@reddit
This. American car execs are convinced that nobody buys cars at the same time that every foreign car make is selling millions of them in the US.
SlyClydesdale@reddit
Are they gonna add another brand to CDJR/Alfa/Fiat dealers? Or go to the time and expense of starting their own Opel dealer network?
Are any of the compelling Opel models in market segments that are in high demand in the US?
Is Opel making their vehicles cheaply enough to allow them to sell those vehicles in the US at prices the market will bear?
What would be the benefit of offering those vehicles under the unknown Opel brand in the US as opposed to badging those models as Chryslers or Dodges, which do have brand recognition?
Intelligent-Ad-6734@reddit
They could just use Chrysler 🤷♂️
SlyClydesdale@reddit
Right?
But the fact that they don’t means that there are additional reasons why Opel’s vehicles aren’t offered here, even under existing brands.
badtux99@reddit
Certify them to meet US emissions and safety standards would cost a fortune and they are cars. Cars don't sell, trucks and SUVs sell.
notapunk@reddit
I would assume they'd just rebadge them if they did import a model. No sense in trying to (re)introduce a whole new brand.
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
Yeah, that's what I was thinking: add them to Chrysler or Dodge which as you say doesn't really have any models. I don't think there's any point in bringing back the Opel nameplate, just the cars themselves.
Intelligent-Ad-6734@reddit
Honestly what's going on at the big three sometimes sounds like corporate espionage.
Chrysler could've still had the 300, wagoneer honestly shouldn't be a jeep product, and the minivan keeps rolling.
The price to import European models is basically what doesn't help.
Having a quick look at the current Opel lineup... It would fit better under the Dodge side perhaps... All very small cars and what the US has as the pro master under ram.
Chrysler might still try to be a more luxury type arm in the US than small gettabouts.
PresentIron5379@reddit
It's been done once when GM owned Opel and it didn't work that well. Some examples of rebadged Opel models brought over here were the Saturn L series, Cadillac catera, Saturn Astra, Buick sedans during the 2010s, and GM sold Opel cars like the GT at Buick dealerships during the 70s.
badtux99@reddit
You forgot about the Chevrolet Chevette lol. GM's longest lived model in the Americas other than the Express van, laboring along unchanged from 1976 to 1988. Basically an Americanized Opel Kadett C. Though heavier due to the 5mph bumpers and infrastructure to support them, and less horsepower due to the emissions controls, making it a real slug on the road. But it was better than the VW Beetle lol.
PresentIron5379@reddit
The t platform was an Isuzu and Opel/Gm collaboration. If you truly wanted to get into it, the Brazilian market got Chevy chevette in 1973, 6 months before the Opel kadett C in Europe, but the, US still didn't get the chevette until 76 model year.
smuckola@reddit
i'm confused, nay, bewildered, because nobody's mentioned Saturn Vue in this thread yet. The second generation of Vue in 2007 is a rebadged Opel Antares which was rebadged as the Chevy Captiva Sport (fleet series for corporate and rentals) and remodeled as the Chevy Equinox. That swoopy European design of interior and exterior totally took over America and killed the sedan.
I have the 2008 Vue green line (mild hybrid) and it looks astonishingly exactly like most mini SUVs on the road. Especially Hyundai.
I just don't understand how there's a whole thread here about how all that somehow didn't happen.
Sideburn_Cookie_Man@reddit
You missed all the Opel cars that GM has sold into other markets over the past 30 years?
Snoo_87704@reddit
But they have flow-through ventilation as standard!
https://www.hemmings.com/stories/buick-opels-cute-tough/
Dopehauler@reddit
I had a 1968 Opel Record, 6 cylinder straight 250 ci auto, I think it had a turbo 350 on it. It was a good car.
Engineered_disdain@reddit
Stellantis is having a really hard time keeping their current brands alive in the US
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
Right, I probably should have put the question differently. I really meant rebadging like Buick did. Chrysler is suffering from no models. Jeep is too one-note. And Fiat is just not what people want.
44mac@reddit
Don’t we have enough problems already?
ccrush@reddit
I had a 2012 Buick Regal. It was a re-badged Opal Insignia.
captstinkybutt@reddit
I had no idea that Stellantis owns Opel now
itsjakerobb@reddit
I’ve had two rebadged Opels:
Of the 20-ish non-project cars I’ve owned, these have been my favorites. I’ve never been a crossover/SUV guy; sedans and wagons are my thing.
I would definitely be interested if Stellantis brought some Opels to market here, although I’d be super wary because Stellantis.
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
I recently tried a 2018 Cascada when shopping for a boulevard cruiser. Was very impressed with what it offered for a sub 20k car, both miles and dollars. Also had some favorable experiences with Buick rentals a few years back, and I bet those were Opels.
For me one big motivation would be getting the Cascada to market to the Sebring crowd: senior citizens who want to cruise in comfort with the top popped and can't quite afford a Beemer or Benz.
Avery_Thorn@reddit
I say this as a huge pentastar fan:
Stellantis can't get Chysler or Dodge to work in the USA. They are having trouble with Jeep and Ram.
They sold 3,000 Alfa Romeos in the USA in 2025.
They have a serious problem with not having enough models or variety available on their lots. One would think they would realize that they need to have models on the lots in order to sell them, but... they haven't figured that out yet.
One would think that introducing models from other lines that they own would be a win, but... Fiat is basically dead in the water in the USA.
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
That's a good analysis. A friend works at a combo Stellantis-Kia dealer. Jeep, Ram non-commercial, Fiat, Alfa, Chrysler, Dodge. They sell way over 100 Kias per month, a few dozen Ram & Jeep, less Chrysler & Dodge, a couple Fiats and once in a while an Alfa. He says they get some customers who are excited about Alfa but usually wind up buying a different Japanese or German luxury brand in the end.
A big part of the problem is that Stellantis had only Fiat & Alfa when they developed the current franchise scenario. In retrospect, shouldn't have bothered. The Fiat 500 is way too much of a niche vehicle in a very small niche.
04limited@reddit
American badge, European cars have never lasted here.
Cadillac Catera was a rebadge Opel Omega. A bunch of Buicks were rebadge Opels(Regal, TourX, Cascada). The Pontiac GTO was a Holden(Australian but still not American). The Dodge Dart was related to the Alfa Giulietta, Jeep renegade was a Fiat 500x, Dodge Hornet is an Alfa Tonale.
smallcarbro@reddit
The Ford Focus did pretty good for a while.
DiscoCombobulator@reddit
Stellantis shouldn't sell any vehicles, let alone more variety of them
espressocycle@reddit
The Grandland would make a good Chrysler.
IAmBecomeTeemo@reddit
They're already barely selling the tiny amount of models they do attempt to sell in the US. Bringing Opel and more models to the US to also not sell doesn't make a ton of sense.
smallcarbro@reddit
Americans have horrible taste in cars.
Thereelgerg@reddit
Demand
eddyb66@reddit
US auto market is cooked, crappy SUVs are the new sedans and pickup trucks are the minivans. Yes I don't care about frail egos pickup trucks are ass, 90% of them on the road are not used for actual work. Nobody is going to toss crap in the bed of a 150K lifted glam wagon.
weirdoldhobo1978@reddit
Because the segment of cars they produce is already dominated by the Japanese, who have decades of brand loyalty built up
411592@reddit
Because they’re dumb. There’s so much Stellantis could do, but they won’t
Australian_PM_Brady@reddit
This is how I learned GM sold Opel in 2017.
drifts180@reddit
I came in here and had to check myself and do some scrolling before I said "because it belongs to GM"
beaushaw@reddit
Hey, me too.
GuairdeanBeatha@reddit
I’m not fully versed in the difference between US and European emissions standards, but retooling the European system to meet Federal standards could be a deal breaker. Plus, parts distribution can become a big problem. Case in point is the Capri back in the 70s. Many of my friends bought them, and soon found them sitting in the shop waiting for parts. The universal joints were a weak spot and replacing them meant replacing the entire driveshaft. Replacement driveshafts were few and far between. Add in mechanic training, warranty work (especially if parts have to be retooled to meet US standards, and you have a huge backend cost for a new model.
Germerican1@reddit
Because they're meant for a totally different market, and likely don't meet American import standards, and wouldn't be competitive with American markets after the costs of import.
I miss the old Opel, the pre 1975 opel that made goofy little sports cars and rally cars. Those were fun. And now they're all dried up in our markets here in the states so they go for way too much money. Real shame.
Wheres_my_ACOG_Ubi@reddit
Why only pre ’75? They made the Manta B (which reced in group B) till ’88, the Calibra after that untill like 2000 with the option of having a 2.0T 200hp awd version and they even sold a Lotus Elise S2 side grade with the speedster. I want THAT Opel back.
Germerican1@reddit
I live in a state that has a smog cutoff of 1975. Meaning any car made after then has to meet strict emissions standards. The exact same standards most European cars couldn't meet back then, which is why they stopped importing them at the time(that and higher safety regulations for imported cars than domestic ones, that's what killed the VW Thing here).
Opel still made cool stuff into the 80s, but we got exactly none of it here. And I prefer the simplicity of earlier cars, even into the 70s they got ugly with larger bumpers and such, the 60s really were their peak for my preferences.
Wheres_my_ACOG_Ubi@reddit
Gotcha, sucks that you guys missed out on a lot of cool stuff though.
Sessile-B-DeMille@reddit
I had an Opel Manta Rallye as a teenager. No power, but a very nice chassis, and very fun to drive. Small sporty coupes were popular back then, now they'd be hard to sell.
SailingSpark@reddit
My father had an actual Kadette Rallye thst he bought in 1968 when we lived in Spain. It was not the tape and spots version, but the actual homogulation special. That was a fun family car.
Germerican1@reddit
Yeah I still got the head for a 1.9l 4 cylinder in my shed, they're just rock solid little cars that won't give up. Just a shame there's so few of them around now. I've always wanted an old Kadett but seeing as they're $20-30k now when they do turn up I don't see that happening lol
beaushaw@reddit
My mother's first car was an Opel Kadett.
And my son is named after a very famous Opel Kadett that once drove across Botswana. If you are a big enough car nerd you will know exactly what I am talking about.
Germerican1@reddit
Ahhh Oliver. Lived vicariously through that one, good series.
f700es@reddit
OMG they went from a GM brand to Stellantis? Talk about falling from the bottom to even lower.
Lonely_Apartment_644@reddit
Maybe fuel mileage and safety standards. US doesn’t car about quality and longevity but better get 50mpg and have 10 airbags.
Gunk_Olgidar@reddit
GM has been there and done that.
Didn't work well for them.
TheCarcissist@reddit
Stellantis is struggling with the vehicles they already have here, why complicate it
loweexclamationpoint@reddit (OP)
Because they don't really have cars. Well, Fiat I guess
Daqgibby@reddit
I’d rather have Citroen
Rough_Cancel7265@reddit
Remember the last gen Buick Regal? That was an Opel. You could get it as a sedan, wagon and they even had a high performance Regal GS. That car was pre pandemic and the economy was good at that time. NO ONE bought them and I'm sore a lot of people still don't realize it even existed
Sad-Corner-9972@reddit
I test drove a Regal with a 6 speed manual. It was fun and I’m sure it was a rebadged Opel.
Minimum_Persimmon281@reddit
Opel isn’t a known brand in the US, so i think it would flop.
Opels actually were sort of in the US under GM, though. GM USA used Opel engineered engines and platforms in their cars and rebadged quite a few models, and it worked reasonsbly well. I guess Stellantis could rebadge some of them under the Dodge brand, like the Grandland for example.
not4wimps@reddit
I have a 2028 Buick Regal Tour X station wagon. I think it’s an Opel ?
Syncrion@reddit
The cost would way outstrip the benefit. There is basically no Opel brand awareness amongst the general public and they would have to change a whole lot of dealerships to add Opel to the lineup.
Then you would need to re-tool your Opel production lines to provide a US compliant version of the Opel vehicles to ship overseas.
And if you have done all that there is no guarantee it's a success even if it's a vehicle in the popular segments like mid size crossover.
Oh and don't forget tarrifs.
More than likely they may take some current Opel platforms and use them as a basis for American vehicles. If terrifs drop they might try and rebadge some as Dodge/Chrysler. Hard to say though, that's still a fairly big production line change.
curiousretired@reddit
Because the margin is too small on these vehicles, they got to charge you 50-100k on every sale
Finnegan_Faux@reddit
Stellantis is concentrating on Jeep and RAM in the US, plus Peugeot and Fiat in the EU. The other 10 brands will get badge engineered versions, and Opel is one of those 10.
Ironically Peugeot had set up a US HQ planning to return to the US market just before the Stellantis merger.