did anyone else realize too late that knowing english isn’t the same as speaking it in the US??

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Onefortwo@reddit

I don’t know what language you speak but you’re already light years ahead of where I’d be if the situations were reversed.

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NovaKarmas@reddit

Spending more time thinking in a foreign language has helped me with it, but I still have it as I am rusty and haven't been abroad

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It's the same for native English speakers trying a new language in another country. It's just a whole different thing from learning from a book or video than actually speaking it in real life to a real live person. And it's okay. The vast majority are going to understand and be willing to work with you.

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Super_Selection1522@reddit

It's the same learning any language

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jackfaire@reddit

Yup write Spanish down, Slow down the speaking of it and I can muddle through on what I learned in high school. A conversation at speed though? I'm lost.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

I have learned French, Spanish, and Polish to varying degrees and... yeah imma need you to slow down lol. Also the brain confuses words. Earlier I said je veux un cafe por favor. I also used the Polish word for "meat" in place of the French word the other day. If anyone else is good at french-span-pol-english, we'd probably be best friends.

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no-cherrtera@reddit

the brain mixing languages mid-sentence is so real. I once said “merci gracias” and just accepted my fate. fr-pl-pl-en here, cheers.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

Earlier I told my husband there were dos Gatos en la fenetre. He took a year of Spanish and has lived in CA and FL. His Spanish isn't good at all but he understands dos Gatos. He did not understand la fenetre.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

the language mixing is sooo real. my brain doesn’t choose the right word, it just grabs whatever language is closest and hopes nobody notices

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mymbles_daughter@reddit

Pole here. Just curious why you would learn Polish? The other languages are more global. And Polish is hard.

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Chicago_Avocado@reddit

Lots of polish speakers in Chicago. I suppose you could learn polish to earn the respect of the person working the deli and bakery counter.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

My great grandparents were Polish immigrants. My grandpa didn't want to pass on the language because of how awfully they were treated for being "eastern European" (I know Poland is central euro) but my great grandmother would teach us. So I already had a bit of a foundation. I also happened to fall into a large Polish population where I live; most are bilingual but some only speak Polish so that was more motivation. I've also considered immigrating to Poland. And yes, Polish is very difficult, especially compared with French and Spanish!

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Perplexio76@reddit

Do you perchance live in the Chicago, Cleveland or Pittsburgh metropolitan areas? I know all 3 have sizable Polish populations. I've heard that Chicago is the 2nd largest Polish speaking city after Warsaw. I know there are still some AM radio stations that broadcast in Polish and until about 10 years ago or so the kids in the Chicago Public School district got Casimir Pulaski Day off from school.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

And I'm a idiot, you said or Pittsburgh metro area. Yes, that's were my family is from 😂

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paradisetossed7@reddit

No, my family is from Pennsylvania, though I didn't grow up there and don't live there. I live in the northeast and there are some towns that are just known for basically being Polish towns - a lot of shopkeepers don't speak English, but will help you the best they can. I know enough to get around now, but a Polish friend used to talk for me.

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dechets-de-mariage@reddit

I studied French for 7 years. Then I started Italian for fun and it was taught in the immersion method: not a single word of English. Every time my brain looked for a word it defaulted to French.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

Yep, though I learned some Polish as a kid from family, I formally learned French in high school. I always default to French.

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Help1Ted@reddit

Exactly! There are also varying degrees of differences depending where the person you’re speaking with is from. Growing up in Florida and learned Spanish from my Puerto Rican friends, while my wife is from Alabama and only really spoken Spanish with Mexicans. She was really confused when she actually heard some Puerto Ricans speaking to each other. She said she understood some words, but the rhythm was completely off to her. It’s a bit like listening to someone speaking British English. Although to be fair British English is really a completely different language for the most part.

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paradisetossed7@reddit

I grew up in Florida too and spend a while in Orlando; just being there you pick up some Spanish. PR Spanish is too fast for me to understand well lol

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Help1Ted@reddit

Lol that’s exactly where I’m from. It’s much faster, and almost has a musical beat to it.

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90dayschitts@reddit

German, Spanish, Arabic and ASL here! How did you not know I meant the food was delicious when I said, "Das/die/der Essen es lathithe!" While signing eat for food?

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FormicaDinette33@reddit

I have a tendency to throw Spanish into a French sentence also! 😀. I know Spanish so much more.

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HiddenStoat@reddit

french-span-pol-english

Chuck in some Germand and you've basically learnt Esperanto!

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

this is exactly it. like I can handle “textbook speed” but real conversation speed feels like 2x playback

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

same. I’ve been trying short AI conversation practice on praktika lately because it forces me to answer without rehearsing forever. Not the same as a real barista, obviously, but it does train that panic pause a bit

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mfigroid@reddit

Next thing you know I'm in a foreign land, people talking so fast I couldn't understand.

-Cheech Marin

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OneleggedPeter@reddit

This is me, and I grew up in, and still live in, south central New Mexico, about 20 miles from the U.S. / Mexico border.

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bryku@reddit

I have the opposite problem when I learned Japanese in college. I could read extremely well, but hearing it... ooof. RIP test scores.

I think it is because their grammar is a bit backwards, so when reading I could just skip ahead and see then go back. However, you can't really do that while listening and it is hard for my brain to parse.

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Yankee831@reddit

Spanish is hard AF (like most languages I assume) but I just get this so much with Spanish. Mexican but raised in the states far from Spanish speakers. Took all the classes and can get by in town but when my family starts chatting it’s just mush. No enunciation and so fast.

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wonderlustVA@reddit

I took many years of French, so learning Spanish after that has felt easy to me (words sound like how they look, dont bleed into the next word, and are similar enough to French that I can pick up on the meaning of a new word easier) But, yeah, I definitely would be lost in a convo at speed, even if I can get by reading either okay.

Now, European Portuguese? I gave up on that one. That's one confusing language when it looks sorta Spanish but is pronounced more French.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

yeah I’m slowly realizing this isn’t a “US problem” it’s a “my brain under pressure” problem. still wild how you can know a language and then completely crash when someone goes off script

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

yeah, I’m realizing that now. I think I treated speaking like a bonus skill after “knowing” english, but apparently it’s the whole boss fight

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Icy-Blacksmith-313@reddit

My friend this is the most American thing you could post. The vast majority of Americans have the same anxiety about speaking another language, regardless of knowledge of the language. My French teacher used to say "if you don't use it you lose it", so exercising that part of your brain that switches over to processing your needs and environment in a foreign language can often feel rusty. Many find it easier to read and write in another language, but speaking g can cause a lot of discomfort and anxiety! I hope the barista had compassion in sorting out your order!

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4Q69freak@reddit

I took three years of French in HS, and with any language, what you learn in school is the proper language, but when you go to different countries there is different slang and different accents. Americans don’t speak the same English as an Australian, or an Irish, or a Brit. We can understand each other but they are really different dialects.

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Icy-Blacksmith-313@reddit

I think it's also a universal disdain/dislike of an American accent for a lot of foreign cultures. Even with casual conversation like ordering a latte or slang, they'll pivot to English in their responses. Whereas most Americans are used to, love and appreciate a huge variety of accents and hybrid English and don't get hung up on anything "proper" in conversation.

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4Q69freak@reddit

It happens in every language. Spanish has a lot of different dialects. Gabriel Iglasias says that Puerto Ricans speak really fast like they’ll run out of words if they don’t use them, Mexicans talk slow like they’re stoned, and Cubans just sound angry. Mexican slang is different from Puerto Rican slang, which are both different than Spanish (in Spain) slang.

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Darryl_Lict@reddit

I'm from SoCal, and I really appreciate the slow pace and enunciation of Mexican Spanish. I think also there are a bunch of different south and central Americans here with different accents so people tend to speak clearer to be universally understood.

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MollyOMalley99@reddit

My high school Spanish teacher was Puerto Rican and my closest friends were Cuban, so those are the dialects in which I could communicate. The first time I went to Mexico, I couldn't understand a word they were saying.

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4Q69freak@reddit

When our French club in HS went to Quebec we had a really hard time understanding them at first because their French was not always conjugated correctly and was different from the proper French we learned in school.

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mistiklest@reddit

Also, most of the time, they're better at English than we are at their language, so it's easier for them.

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plywooden@reddit

Yes, practice and exposure.

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lavasca@reddit

Agreed! I grew up speaking Spanish. I still get that sensation.

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ExultantGitana@reddit

This

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Crafty-Shape2743@reddit

I’m an English speaker in the U.S. I am a proficient writer and yet… within the U.S. there are many references that I don’t understand. The Starbucks and Subway lingo and ordering protocol is one that leaves me overwhelmed and confused. So here’s what I do, I ignore everything and just state what I want and let them figure it out.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

oh wow. thanks for sharing, that cheered me up a bit. and it totally changes my perspective.

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ocvagabond@reddit

I don’t even know what a flat white is.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

turns out I might’ve just picked the worst possible example. just double shot esperesso with milk, let's say

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ocvagabond@reddit

You did. But also that’s the difference between knowing something by the books vs practice/application. The only way to get better is to interact and speak more.

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eugenesbluegenes@reddit

Kinda like a double shot cappuccino with a thinner microfoam.

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From_Deep_Space@reddit

what

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byebybuy@reddit

You just fold in the microfoam.

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VeronicaMarsupial@reddit

How do you fold microscopic foam?!

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byebybuy@reddit

You just fold it in, David!

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elucify@reddit

With a molecular spatula

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Usagi_Shinobi@reddit

Fancy people extra strong coffee, light on the fancy cream.

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PlanetMarklar@reddit

👆

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Kenneth441@reddit

As someone who hates coffee - do you not know what foam or a cappuccino is?

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peterwhitefanclub@reddit

It is not very popular in the US at all, mostly an Australian drink. I’d say the most hipster coffee shops here would have it, but not many.

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CharlesDickensABox@reddit

It's similar to a latte, but with less milk and foam.

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ground__contro1@reddit

Sounds alright actually

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CharlesDickensABox@reddit

It's a fine drink. I recommend it for people who like a latte but want to taste a bit more of the coffee. The texture is also a little different because the foams are ever so slightly different when they're prepared perfectly, but only the real heads are going to notice that.

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Spirited_Ingenuity89@reddit

I tell them I want a medium. They can figure out which term-that-literally-means-large that actually is.

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no-cherrtera@reddit

this is the only sane strategy. I refuse to learn 3 different non-english-origin words for “large” just to get coffee

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--Miranda--@reddit

This is right. You don't need to know the Starbucks "lingo". I'm a coffee drinking Seattlelite and I don't know what a "flat white" is. Just say what you want. They don't care and will get it.

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CharlesDickensABox@reddit

Starbucks does have its own very specific lingo (my tinfoil hat theory is that it's meant to keep people going to Starbucks because their order is incomprehensible to other coffee shops), but a flat white is not a Starbucks drink. It's an everywhere drink.

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--Miranda--@reddit

Im literally from Seattle, and yes, get Starbucks coffee. You can say "20" oz instead of venti. You can say "black coffee". Starbucks employees don't give a shit.

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CharlesDickensABox@reddit

Sure. But if you order a macchiato in Italy, what you get is a little baby espresso cup topped with a dot of foam. If you order a macchiato at Starbucks, what you get is a full-blown latte with vanilla syrup. The language is different, even when the words are the same. I suspect one major reason for that is to keep people going to Starbucks because people who are used to the Starbucks menu will make mistakes ordering at other places and not realize that it's Starbucks that is doing things differently.

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mistiklest@reddit

This isn't a Starbucks thing, though. This is the difference between a latte macchiato and a café macchiato. At Starbucks they default to a latte macchiato when you ask for just a macchiato, but you can get a café macchiato, too, if you ask for it.

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--Miranda--@reddit

I'm pretty sure everyone in my city knows that. Bit thanks for the words.

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Current_Poster@reddit

You can say "black coffee". Starbucks employees don't give a shit.

Seriously. I've worked at two different places (Starbucks being one of them) like that and the whole "and then they won't move a muscle unless you talk their moon-man language to describe a simple cup a joe" meme thing is bullshit.

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catnamedpants@reddit

"Flat white" isn't Starbucks lingo. It's just not common in a lot of American coffee chains other than Starbucks. It's far more common in the UK.

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DeathByPianos@reddit

That's because a flat white is not American (it's Australian)

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amourdesoi@reddit

Yup also just disregard all the people in this thread saying you are not fluent. Keep living your life and remember most of us don’t give a shit, won’t notice any accent or whatever

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pmgoldenretrievers@reddit

Also native English speaker, born in the US. I have been to parts of the US where I had to ask the person to repeat themselves 3 times before I understood what they were saying. And they were also born in the US.

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skiing123@reddit

I've been in Dunkins drive through trying to order a frappuccino before realizing they do not have that drink or even a close approximate. Lol ya I think you are just human

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umkay11@reddit

if you’re at a common chain (especially one like Starbucks) they’re usually pretty good about piecing together what you mean. English is the only language I’ve ever known and I’ll use the app to order because it’s easier than having to say all the customizations I like (I usually will remove a syrup to add another and add foam) so don’t beat yourself up about it!

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ServialiaCaesaris@reddit

When I first came to live in the US, about 25 years ago, a guy at Subway barked at me: ‘stay or go?’ I understood the words, but… what? So he repeated more slowly and even more loudly: ‘Stay Or Go?’ and I still had no clue. Finally, with an exasperated air, he even more slowly said: ‘do YOU (pointing at me) want to stay in HERE (points at the floor) to EAT (mimes eating) or do you want to go OUT (points outside) with your sub?’ Oh. Well, go, I guess. And quickly. After a few interactions like these and learning to laugh at them and myself, I got better.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

stay or go lol. that moment when you understand every word separately but not the sentence… brutal

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ilovjedi@reddit

I’m a native speaker as well and a lawyer so lots of reading and writing. And sometimes my brain just freezes and I can’t figure out what I was just told or how to respond. Especially when the conversation isn’t going how I’d expect it to.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

“brain freezes when conversation goes off script” is EXACTLY what it feels like to me. like I had one prepared dialogue and then reality just said nope

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Illustrious-Shirt569@reddit

Same! Their very specific terminology is a mash-up of different languages, coffee cultures, and made-up stuff.

I say I want a 16oz black tea with whole milk, and my kids want a 12oz hot chocolate with whipped cream. That’s exactly what I would say at any restaurant or coffee shop. I don’t care what they call those things at Starbucks vs. everywhere else in the U.S.

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she-dont-use-jellyyy@reddit

They call those "black tea with whole milk" and "hot chocolate with whipped cream."

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Illustrious-Shirt569@reddit

That is definitely never what they repeat back to me for the tea order. Maybe for the hot chocolate (not counting the ridiculous size name instead of the actual volume).

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mistiklest@reddit

Starbucks has at least a few different black teas available, so it's reasonable to specify which one you want.

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Spirited_Ingenuity89@reddit

Except they’ll use three different words for “large” to mean three different sizes.

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quietude38@reddit

“Yeah, large is large. In fact, ‘tall’ is large, and ‘grande’ is Spanish for large. ‘Venti’ is the only one that doesn’t mean large. It’s also the only one that’s Italian. Congratulations, you’re stupid in three languages.”

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mistiklest@reddit

The point of this scene is that the speaker is being an asshole to the barista who neither controls the menu, nor really cares what words they use, though.

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Deolater@reddit

I think by now I do understand the weird Starbucks size words and all that, but I've never had a bad interaction from not using them

"A small black coffee please" has always

I've simply stopped going to Subway though.

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Murderhornet212@reddit

I’m always like, “I’ll have a whatever you call medium here iced chai latte, please”. I hardly ever go to Starbucks and I don’t understand the sizes at all.

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Ok-Attorney-5477@reddit

Yes Starbucks and the Post Office are a little confusing for me. Would you like to send that certified, receipt on delivery, insured, etc,etc.

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idster@reddit

I was born and raised in the us and have no idea what a flat white is

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Porcupine-in-a-tree@reddit

Yep, I don’t mess with the starbucks lingo. Everyone understands standard drinks and sizes.

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imadethisjusttosub@reddit

I went to Wing Stop, not a place I went to often, and I straight up didn’t know how it worked. I panicked and ordered the first thing I saw that sounded okay on the menu and tried to act like I wasn’t an alien on my first day on earth.

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BuildNuyTheUrbanGuy@reddit

You'd be lost in south Louisiana. Lol

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lost_nurse602@reddit

My sister in law moved here from another country a little over a year ago. English is her second language but she speaks multiple languages. She has a degree in teaching English in her home country. She’s very smart and well educated.

She still struggles talking to people here. Like when we go to restaurants, someone else orders for her. When was recently in the hospital, the language barrier was hard for her. I think it takes time. She’s already gotten more confident.

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MayaTulip268@reddit

you can be educated, fluent on paper, and still struggle in real conversations. that gap is basically reaction speed + confidence. i’ve been trying to fix that with quick daily speaking reps (duolingo+ using praktika rn) and it’s slowly getting better

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AshDenver@reddit

When that happens to me (Italy, France, Mexico), I just spit out “Lo siento” or “I’m sorry” in the correct language and rattle off my prepared speech, order.

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MayaTulip268@reddit

this is elite strategy. confidence first, accuracy later

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boilface@reddit

I studied French since I was 7 years old in American classrooms, then studied it more in college. I lived in Paris for a summer on a study abroad program when I was 21, and I was functionally useless in most situations. After a couple of months of walking around alone without any English speaking friends my ear got more accustomed to the quicker pace and bits of slang, and it was much easier to respond and not feel too dumb.

It just takes time and practice, and a willingness to go out and mess things up

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MayaTulip268@reddit

this is literally every language learner origin story.
“i studied for years” → “i arrived” → “i became useless”

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Thedeadnite@reddit

Online chat games, or chatting over discord or something similar. Find a group and talk about random stuff, the spontaneity will solidify the synapse and improve your response time.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

this actually makes sense. I’ve been trying to get more of that “unpredictable convo” practice lately because that’s clearly the missing piece. been using stuff like Praktika for quick convo reps when I don’t have real people around, and it kinda helps with that “respond instantly” panic.

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no-cherrtera@reddit

you can study forever but that “instant response” skill only comes from reps. I’ve been using Praktika too!! Sky is great.

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Not_An_Isopod@reddit

Idk what you’re ever asking.. idk what a flat white even is

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beepbeepboop74656@reddit

It’s just fluency. You’re not fluent in English yet.

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PuppyYuki@reddit

This. 100%. I'm from Sweden and we have pretty good English classes in school. The aim is to get you as fluent as possible by the end of high school. However, no person can get fluent by only taking classes. The fluency comes from learning the local ways of saying things, the culture that's tied to the language/accent.

I wasn't fluent in English after high school but I was proficient enough to speak it fairly effortlessly. But having a boyfriend (now husband) from Texas helped me get fluent in English because it's this everyday speech that gets you fluent. I'm just not quite there yet when it comes to the accent though haha. Not to mention moving to Texas also helped a bunch.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

this is such a good example of what people underestimate. classes get you like 70% there, but that last 30% is just real conversations over and over. I didn’t have people to practice with so I started doing some convo exercises on my phone, mostly praktika, tried italky too lately. better this than nothing

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boldjoy0050@reddit

It's more than that. I'm a native speaker and I can't understand some UK English accents. And the words they use can be foreign to American English speakers.

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airmantharp@reddit

*North American English.

You can still learn it and find Commonwealthers incomprehensible, or vise versa.

They barely speak English in England as it is lol

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byebybuy@reddit

"Why can't the English teach their children how to speak?"

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SpicyMissHiss@reddit

Norwegians learn Norwegian and the Greeks are taught their Greek.

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PAXICHEN@reddit

Do you like dags?

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MalcolmReady@reddit

I like caravans more

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booglechops@reddit

True - very different definitions of words like freedom, education and health.

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NH4NO3@reddit

I don't really think it is possible to know any variety of North American English to an extremely proficient degree, and just find most English in the UK/Australia/NZ/Ireland incomprehensible. 99-98% of the vocabulary is the same (some differences in preference/usage), and the pronunciations aren't wildly different either. There are some quirky, little differences, but they only come up occasionally. You are only really going to run into problems with old farmers in the UK/Ireland with strongly regional accents, and even then a lot of them are quite capable of speaking in a more understandable, mainstream way when they want to get a message across.

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airmantharp@reddit

Not disagreeing, having been to the Isles somewhat recently, and I am absolutely guilty of using a bit of deprecating hyperbole - but as you state, strong regional accents and dialects can make communication between very similar languages very troublesome!

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Ratatoskr_The_Wise@reddit

We don’t use “flat white” in the States at all.

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Prestigious-Comb4280@reddit

I don't drink coffee and wouldn't understand "coffee speak" and I am a native speaker.

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DarceysExtensions@reddit

Time and practice help.

I am a native German speaker and after many years in the US, I am now more comfortable with English than German. I dream exclusively in English these days.

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Formal_Employee_1030@reddit

For what it's worth, I'm American and when I was in London, several salespeople asked if I had a store loyalty card and I always had to ask them to repeat themselves. It's like a went into a mini-fugue state because we'd gone off script.

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pastrymom@reddit

America is full of people learning English. I can almost guarantee the barista didn’t give you a second thought. Starbucks is not English. My husband has to rehearse my order and still can’t get my order correct.

I have tried most of my life to speak Spanish. Language is difficult.

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Aromatic-System5258@reddit

As an American, if someone who is not a native English speaker can get a few key words out then I can figure out what they need. It’s a little harder way of communicating but not nearly as hard as it is for the non native speaker. I can meet you halfway.

I’ve been to many countries and met incredible people who helped me along the way.

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SoundsGudToMe@reddit

The number of uber drivers ive met who do it just to practice speaking as much as possible is double digits

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danielfrom---@reddit

Flat whites are a lot less common here and I often have problems trying to order one.

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DearDarlingDollies@reddit

I had almost this exact same experience practicing Spanish on a server in a Mexican restaurant. He went off script and rapid fire. I went pale. I was so embarrassed that I got caught off guard.

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urfriendflicka@reddit

I'm a native English speaker who practices my order before I order. I, too, get flustered when the person taking my order goes off (my) script. I just stare at them, they stare back, and if I don't reboot in time, they ask the question again but in words they hope bring me back online.

Having worked the other side of the counter (and table), I've seen plenty of other people do the same thing.

But also, yes, understanding and even being able to speak a language is very different than understanding someone who speaks that language as their first language. We tend to speak our primary languages faster and less formally than anyone learning it as a second language is taught. Add in regional accents, colloquialisms, slang, etc and it's even harder.

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Sitcom_kid@reddit

I am an interpreter and languages are funny things. I wouldn't have a job if people could use a class to get around needing services. Immersion is required to even visit any level of fluency. A rudimentary fluency is still wonderful. You are probably well beyond that, but eloquence is hard to achieve if your English experience is mostly from visits.

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soulsista04us@reddit

Don't be so hard on yourself. Native English speakers know English is difficult. Hell, half of us can't even speak it without going, "Uhhhh" or "huh" all the time!

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Ok_Coconut4898@reddit

Formal language is always different than real, colloquial language. I was fluent in Spanish the first time I met my mother-in-law, who is from rural Mexico, but I only understood about 30% of what she said. It took living in Mexico for a few years and also getting to know her better to be able to really communicate effectively with her and my father-in-law.

People don’t speak formal language in most day-to-day interactions and there is a lot of variation in how people speak depending on region, age/generation, education level, situation, and sometimes even ethnicity and social class.

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notrobert7@reddit

It is one of my great joys to show my foreign friends American memes gor the first time and watch them laugh.

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Impedimentita@reddit

I also like to order flat whites, and half the time the barista has no idea what that is. Regional, I guess.

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guacamoleo@reddit

I went to Japan recently. I knew the words people were saying. But only like 30 seconds after I already completely bombed the interaction. Every single time lol

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Tommy_Wisseau_burner@reddit

This isn’t English or American specific. This is what happens when you are using a separate language from your own without being entirely fluent and/or using it everyday

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Turdle_Vic@reddit

This is not an American issue, this is a personal skill issue that happened with literally everyone to an extent, including myself with Spanish

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BearFLSTS@reddit

You’re making an effort to learn English. As far as I’m concerned, you’re alright! Anytime I hear someone having difficulty with English but still trying and not giving up, I’m going to help if I can! As Americans, we don’t always respect the effort required to learn our language and with so many who come here and expect us to adjust to their culture, it’s so very important for us to support and help those who respect us enough to try to assimilate our culture even a small amount!

Thank you for learning English and coming here, to our wonderful country!

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The_Max-Power_Way@reddit

I teach ESL to adults. I didn't realize how bonkers English was until I had to learn the rules I always instinctively knew. Whenever I teach adjective order (why we say "a small green metal teapot" and not "a metal small green teapot") my students are frustrated and amazed. At no point as a native english speaker did I consciously learn the rules, but the rules definitely exist.

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SpicyMissHiss@reddit

I guess someone was offended by the My Fair Lady song reference (Why can’t the English)… whoever posted it, I got it and appreciated it.

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norecordofwrong@reddit

That’s pretty common in all foreign languages.

I forgot so much of my Spanish. Now my conversations derail pretty quick if I need to stop and think about a response.

It used to just come naturally. I even had dreams in Spanish.

But if you aren’t speaking it nearly daily it falls off pretty quick.

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LunaTheNightmare@reddit

I get the same thing trying to learn spanish, only thing that helps is conversation sadly, luckily my fiance is fluent

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RobotShlomo@reddit

I had to look up what a "flat white" was. It's probably called by a different name in the US.

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Avbitten@reddit

i took 9 years of spanish classes. spread from elementary school to college. and after all if that i could not hold a conversation in spanish because of the same thing. i never practiced irl interactions so my brain never had to try to speak at that speed.

Then i got a job at a dog grooming salon as a receptionist. the clients spoke english but all the groomers and bathers spoke spanish. a large part of my job was translating grooming instructions from the client to the groomer. What type of haircut they want, what the client didnt like last time, medical concerns, etc. and translating dog behavior problems back to the client. Within 6 months,i was able to think in spanish. i worked there 6 years.

I now consider myself fluent, but ONLY when talking about dog grooming. My spanish vocab is advanced in that area but any other topic and i turn into a fish out of water.

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Hylian_ina_halfshell@reddit

Not just American. Played golf with a Scotsman last week. I had zero clue what he was saying half the time.

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jrhawk42@reddit

Communication is complicated and this happens to native speakers also. Don't worry about it. Just keep doing conversations, and it'll happen less and less.

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Charlesinrichmond@reddit

practice helps. You can't learn languages out of a book.

U.S. is great for practicing because we don't care if you get things wrong. We will do our best to capture the gist.

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dobbydisneyfan@reddit

I’m a native American English speaker and even I will get confused by all the different names for the same thing across restaurants. It’s even worse when I travel out of my state.

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OkTop9308@reddit

My friend who moved from Mexico to the US and became fluent said using English in daily life was the only way to get fluent. She said not to be afraid or embarrassed. She offered to talk to me a few times per week on the phone in Spanish.

OP - American coffee language is tricky! Don’t feel bad.

Can your American relatives talk to you on the phone in English on a regular basis? This will help you.

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confusedrabbit247@reddit

That's just how learning a language goes.

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Interesting-Long-534@reddit

I was born and raised in the US. I stress out going to a new coffee shop because each coffee shop speaks their own version of English.

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LastOfTheAsparagus@reddit

I’m American and that happens to me at times. 🤷🏽‍♀️😂

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tcspears@reddit

It’s like this with every language. I grew up speaking English (New England dialect) and French Canadian.

There are times I go to the west coast or the south and I’m not familiar with some of the dialect in English, and it will throw me off. Same in French, if I go to France (especially Paris) I’ll get completely lost sometimes. And those are languages I know!

I studied Latin, so I can read Spanish, Portuguese, and Italian fairly well, and can understand them when spoken to a degree, but I’ll rehearse lines in my head ordering a coffee, and they’ll say something I’m not expecting and I’ll get locked up, same as you. This is very common when learning a language.

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RedDemocracy@reddit

What helps is having those unprepared off-script conversations with natural English speakers. Try and see if you can find a way to have conversations with native speakers, or even just with other students about everyday stuff.

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kbell58@reddit

TBH Americans have issues speaking fluently in other parts of the US. Regional accents and slang can sound like a foreign language. Thinking of Boston vs Austin as one example.

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Murderhornet212@reddit

I don’t think we say flat white here. I think that might be British or Australian. I don’t really drink coffee though so I might be wrong.

I was so excited when I had a layover in Germany and a flight on a German airline because I could finally use my high school German! Forgot every. Single. Word. the second I was in front of a German speaker. 🤦🏼‍♀️ It came back about an hour after I got home. I don’t know if it was nerves or what.

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Mustang46L@reddit

I went to France as a teenager after taking French class for 4 years. I ordered a steak frites at a food truck and then couldn't understand the question the lady was asking me. She asked three times.. before I realized she was speaking English. 🤣

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DarkSquirrel20@reddit

Opposite, I'm from the US, I experienced this living in Costa Rica. I had to let go of the rehearsed perfect Spanish and just let it flow. I assume I sound like a grammatically incorrect redneck speaking Spanish but people can understand me and I don't do that pause anymore. Oddly enough drinking alcohol and speaking Spanish helped kind of get over the hump, liquid courage to just let the words out.

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SaltyTrollop@reddit

I have that problem with ASL and anytime someone speaks Spanish to me. I thought I was passable speaking Spanish, but unless people talk to me like I'm literally a child I have no idea what they're saying.

Also, even if you were completely fluent and the most perfect speaker ever, sometimes our brains just decide they want to get anxious and we shut down.

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WthAmIEvenDoing@reddit

Watch tv in your native language but have on English subtitles. This helped me when I was learning another language. If there was a phrase or word I was unfamiliar with, I would add it to a list I kept to look up the meaning.

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Lefaid@reddit

This happens every time I try to use Dutch. It is a part of the language learning experience.

I would suggest saying your reheresed line anyway and hope for the best.

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gremlinguy@reddit

This is not unique to the US, but any language. Your mind is not accustomed to processing novel information and then having to produce intelligible feedback in real time. I live in Spain and am a native English speaker. If I haven't spoken Spanish all day and suddenly I need to interact with someone in Spanish, it is jarring. My mind has to warm up. Normal

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Milasnowxo@reddit

Absolutely. School taught me English, America taught me panic speedrun English.

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What___Do@reddit

As a native English speaker born and raised in the U.S., I also repeat the name of the drink to myself and get tripped up when the barista changes the script on me. So, I think you’re doing fine.

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amourdesoi@reddit

Nah this is because Americans don’t know what a flat white is. You’re good, I guarantee it. Rest easy in the knowledge that the average American has spent less than a quarter as much effort learning your language as you have learning theirs.

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GoodCallMeatball@reddit

Had similar experiences when I moved to Germany. You go in knowing what to say and generally have a grasp of the language, but when interacting with someone I would go in circles in my head switching between thinking "I need to respond" and trying to actually formulate a sentence to the point where you just draw a blank. Totally normal especially when you're not fully comfortable in a language yet.

Not sure where in the US you are visiting but at least where I live in L.A. and in many other places it's not uncommon at all to come across people that either don't speak English or are not proficient (also common in many other english speaking countries), so I wouldn't worry too much about it and just do the best you can. People will be happy to work with you!

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No_Importance_750@reddit

This happens when learning a new language. Same thing has happened to me while I’m learning Spanish. Just means ur not quite fluent yet but you’ll get there.

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DBL_NDRSCR@reddit

every language is like this. i know a bit of spanish but sometimes when i order food and they ask me something i didn't prepare for answering i gotta give it a few huhs and sometimes they used to just switch to english

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Zephyr_Dragon49@reddit

The Cajun dialect still fucks me up and I've lived in the country the whole time. I can do rural Arkansas dialects, northern Louisiana, all of Mississippi, northern midwest, but south Louisiana is tough unless you're from there.

I've experienced that brain stall too. My coworker saw me practicing Mandarin and asked me to say something. 404 brain not found

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fraurodin@reddit

I think the English that is taught doesn't prepare you for way Americans talk- we use ever changing slang, have nonsensical coffee talk jargon (I don't speak coffee talk either, I would have sweating trying to figure out how to order), I think that could be said for anyone that isn't a native speaker and they meet a person fluent in that language and try to converse.

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Total-Improvement535@reddit

I’m a native english speaker and even I get tripped up sometimes when they go off script

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athenank@reddit

Hahaha same

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GooseinaGaggle@reddit

Conversation is the only way to get over that threshold. I can study a language all i want, learn the grammar, words, and practice phrases by myself all day for years.

The biggest hurdle is putting all you learned to the test with a native speaker

By the way you messing up with a few English phrases would mean you put more time and effort into learning and speaking another language than the average American born American who only speaks ¾ of a language

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redjessa@reddit

I was in Mexico awhile back, in line at Starbucks, rehearsing how to order a grande sugar-free vanilla soy latte, in Spanish, in my mind. Over and over. I speak pretty good Spanish. I learned in college, read books, wrote papers in Spanish. The barista asked me how many shots of syrup in the latte and would I like something to eat. I froze as I translated what she asked my head and tried to spit out my answer. Which was a very simple answer. So, I get it.

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LetterheadClassic306@reddit

i ran into this same wall living abroad. written exams don't train your brain to skip the rehearsal step. what helped me was shadowing technique with short audio clips - repeating right after the speaker until my response time dropped. also the conversation simulation app for ordering coffee scenarios specifically. took about 3 weeks of 10min daily before that pause shrank.

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SabresBills69@reddit

this is the case with all languages. reading is easier than understanding verbal. you are natural going to be slower to translate words.

my ex gf was from South America and came to USA at around 18. she learned some English during school but she didn’t know complex words. and still doesn’t know the longer “ adult” words that you might run into rArely but native English speakers know the word. I told her if you don’t understand a word please tell me. her sister told me that if they ever need to read directions or important documents that she prefers to read it in Spanish because she knew those complicated words.

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AdmiralMemo@reddit

Two weeks.

(This is a Total Recall joke, if you were unaware.)

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peterpeterllini@reddit

If it makes you feel better, I was ordering at a fast casual restaurant and the cashier asked a question and I thought she was asking for my name, and I said "peterpeterllini" and she said "no..is that all?" I laughed out loud because it was like my brain stopped understanding for a second lol

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Snezzy_9245@reddit

Local dialect? In Massachusetts we say "coffee regular" and that phrase confuses non-locals and even locals like me who don't drink coffee.

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Spirited_Ingenuity89@reddit

Coffee orders are incomprehensible to non-coffee drinkers.

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johannaishere@reddit

So I am a native English speaker but I have this experience in French. In my first year of college I tested into level six French which was considered fluent enough that I didn’t have to take any more classes. Then I went to Paris for study abroad and I spent all my time talking to French people. I thought I spoke really good French.

In 2013 I moved to France for a job as a nanny and had to interact with a lot of words I didn’t know before and also small children still learning how to speak and the first time I was tired and someone asked me a question my brain went “Bzzzzzt”. I looked so stupid.

The mom of the family I worked for told me something like “the worst thing you could do is panic and stop talking.” I had to just keep talking until I got my point across. And honestly it’s the best language advice I’ve ever gotten. Even if you’re trying to convey something where you have to describe the word you’re trying to find just keep going. I’d be like “I went to the place where the email was” and they were like “Computer.” They thought I was an idiot. But I learned fast and so will you and you just have to keep running at sentences until you feel confident.

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_gooder@reddit

I've had that experience in several languages!

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No_Seaworthiness8176@reddit

English speaking American here. Learned Spanish working in a production facility at night. The main thing is to drop your self consciousness. Relax. It will flow more easily if you're not rehearsing and practicing in your mind.

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Calor777@reddit

Real language proficiency comes from having conversations. We really learn a language (any language) when we practice speaking it with people because speaking is more than just having a bank of vocabulary and grammar.

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smokervoice@reddit

Yeah i had this experience learning another language. There's a period of very high stress while you learn to respond to spoken language at natural speed.

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catnamedpants@reddit

Order a flat white when you're in the UK, OP. They aren't as common in the US.

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Kindlebird@reddit

It’s been on the core Starbucks menu in the U.S. for over 10 years at this point.

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Plato198_9@reddit

I experienced a version of this just moving from the northeast to the southeast

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Ok_Salamander6797@reddit

WTF is a flat white

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Either-Youth9618@reddit

I'm an American who lives outside of the US. This has happened to me too! I got used to the Starbucks products where I live and the US has slightly different names/products. So, when I went to order, I completely blanked and got very flustered. The barista was really nice and gave me a paper menu so I could figure out my order.

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ian9921@reddit

It's interesting to me that this comes as a shock to you. I expect this when I'm learning a language.

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rattlehead44@reddit

What is a flat white? Genuinely curious.

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she-dont-use-jellyyy@reddit

I mean, I grew up here so no, I don't have that problem. I'm confused about who this question is actually for.

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rolyoh@reddit

Plenty of US native English speakers (myself included) get confused as hell in Starbucks, or frankly, in many other places where you're ordering from a big overhead menu and there's all sorts of noise and people rushing about, and you're not super familiar with everything. It isn't any reflection on your mastery of English. Last time I went to a sandwich place I hadn't been to in a few years and I'm sure I sounded pretty stupid while trying to order, and my confusion also confused the order taker. And both of us American native English speakers. So you're doing just fine. 🙂

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Mauser-96@reddit

With a second language there is an order in gaining fluency. For me, it comes in this order: reading, writing, hearing, and finally speaking.

Hearing requires getting used to accents, enunciation, detecting where words start and end in the sound continuum. Speaking requires almost instant processing inputs and formulating a verbal response. Both require a lot of practice to become automatic.

Then there is the din in public places that makes hearing difficult. In these cases I just ignore trying to figure out what was said and just launch into “hi, may I have…”. It works most of the time.

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Barefoot_Eagle@reddit

Happened to me long time ago when the person at McDonald's asked: "Itin or tekot?" Fortunately he said afterwards "do you want it to go?"

In another restaurant i was asked "soup or salad?" and i responded "yes, super salad is fine"

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yzerizef@reddit

I grew up in the US and moved away 15 years ago. Even now when I go back, some things have changed that are just slightly different and it gets a bit confusing for me. Ordering is definitely one of those areas where there’s a combo of specific lingo, pressure of other people waiting for you to order, and employees who are trying to juggle several things at once that just gets really stressful. I find myself saying “I don’t know what that means” a lot when I’m ordering and get asked questions. It usually works out in the end, but it’s not easy.

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lorribell1964@reddit

I do not fit those parameters. However, I wonder if its like learning Spanish in United States and then going to a Spanish speaking country. I think Mexico is different than Spain, and that is different than Argentina. I believe you would have the same issue going up North, or deep south. A single shared language isn't really realistic.

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SenseAndSaruman@reddit

This is the same with any language. You just have to use it all the time. Immersion is the best way. Once you start thinking in the new language, it’s a lot faster.

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Traditional_Trust418@reddit

This is how it is with learning any language. You always might feel confident in it... until you try and communicate with native speakers.

It's just something that you have to learn overtime by continuing to speak with native speakers

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321liftoff@reddit

My sister lived in Spain for a few years teaching English as a second language.

She said the best way to overcome this fear is to go have fun with native speaker friends at a bar and get get a touch sloshed.

The nervousness of messing up reduces, and everyone else is drunk so they don’t particularly notice or care if you make mistakes.

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avicia@reddit

American conversational english being so dependent on idioms is rough for everyone new to the country. You're doing great!

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Throwaway-ish123a@reddit

Is certainly is not limited just to English It's with any second language. It happens to me all the time. I want so badly to converse with my friends in that language but I just can't process it in my head fast enough to respond in real time. I don't know if I ever will be able to, I don't know what the secret to fluency is.

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MakeStupidHurtAgain@reddit

This is the case in every language. I have two native languages, English and French (have spoken both since I was able to talk) and if I’ve been talking in French and someone slips English in there, my brain blips out for a moment, even though I speak English completely fluently.

What I’m saying is, don’t crash out over it. It’s normal, and I’ll be honest, if you pause for a couple of seconds to let the audio permeate your brain, no one will think it’s weird. They’ll assume you were woolgathering - which you kind of were.

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hail_to_the_beef@reddit

It’s part of speaking in another language. I’m great in German when people ask me the questions I am ready to answer but when you blindside me the vocabulary takes a minute to pull from my brain - I have to think harder, process, then speak.

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andmewithoutmytowel@reddit

I spent 9 months learning Italian, and got along fine with written Italian, but in person in Italy, it was hard to get anything out. I felt like an idiot who wasted hundreds of hours.

Cheers though to the waiter in Venice who let me order the entire meal in Italian. There was a couple from New Jersey next to us, guy whose grandma was Italian, mom grew up speaking Italian, he (says) he spoke a decent amount, and was curious how I learned. He said I did great for what it was

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Gazas_trip@reddit

Hinestly that doesn't even sound like a language barrier but more of a coffee culture issue. https://youtu.be/MOm7Gr-1BUc?si=HVD6PCw-rsqxG99z

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BoSKnight87@reddit

That’s for me right now as I’m learning Spanish. My responses don’t just roll of the tongue like English lol

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donuttrackme@reddit

It's the same no matter what language you're trying to speak.

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captainstormy@reddit

This is true for any second language. I took Spanish for 11 years from 7th grade through college. I know it pretty well. I've been to Mexico a few times, I've lost count how many but i think it's 10ish. I've been to Spain 3 times.

The first day or two I'm there I'm very slow to respond and have to really think about what I'm saying. I'm still thinking in English in my head so I have to translate everything. Eventually though it clicks and I start thinking in Spanish.

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min6char@reddit

This is just the difference between classroom language learning and using it in the field. I had the same problem in all the not-English languages I studied. It passes quickly, but its rough and you just have to withstand the embarrassment.

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Troutmandoo@reddit

There’s also the matter of regional dialects. I’m a native speaker from the Pacific Northwest. I have a hard time understanding deep Appalachian accents and heavy Southern accents. People from New England sound nothing like people from Texas, etc. If you’re learning it’s a challenge. Then, we run words together. If I say “I’m going to go to the store”, I would pronounce every word for you, but if I casually say it to my friends, it sounds like, “Imma guh tuhduh store” and it would be much faster.

That happens in every language though. I’m learning Spanish. It’s one thing talking in lessons and online. When you actually speak with a native speaker and they just start chatting like they would with their friends, I just can’t keep up.

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CharlesDickensABox@reddit

Practice practice practice. If you want to learn to speak a language, you have to speak the language. It's as simple as that.

Presumably if your family is located in the US, they speak at least basic English, right? Practice speaking English with them during your visit rather than your native tongue. You won't have to be embarrassed about struggling, because they know you're still learning.

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Neither_Internal_261@reddit

Can I ask what you meant by a "flat white"? I am not a barista so I have no clue what you meant.

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PurpleLilyEsq@reddit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_white

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Neither_Internal_261@reddit

Dang I know what I'm ordering from now on

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Many_Inevitable_6803@reddit

In your defense, a flat white is a made up Starbucks language

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PurpleLilyEsq@reddit

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flat_white

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clekas@reddit

No, it’s not. The flat white has been around in New Zealand and Australia for 40 years.

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nkdeck07@reddit

Yeah but it's not like standard US coffee lingo

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clekas@reddit

I didn’t say it was, just that it’s not made up Starbucks language.

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biggamax@reddit

Correct. UK as well.

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Appropriate-Food1757@reddit

Growing up here it’s just natural, but when I’m in Mexico speaking Spanish o feel your pain

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Bluemonogi@reddit

I’m American but don’t speak coffee shop English. I don’t drink or order coffee. I have no idea what a flat white is.

If I have to make a phone call to make an appointment or something I usually figure out what I am going to say in advance and it might throw me off if someone started saying things I did not expect.

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Snoo_50786@reddit

It's the same for most languages. The best way to practice is to just keep having real conversations and not being afraid to ask them to clarify or repeat what they said. VRchat can be useful if you don't want to get out of the house

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Mirabeaux1789@reddit

“ I was in my family in the US every year, but I’m not a native speaker”

Could you elaborate on this? I’m very curious.

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Friendly_Side3258@reddit

Maybe watching movies and shows in English would help?

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PurpleLilyEsq@reddit

As an American from NY, one of the things we had to pass the foreign language high school regents exam, was hold a conversation with the teacher on a random scenario. Did any of your exams have anything like that? It was really the only realistic part of learning and demonstrating i knew any Spanish. I remember my scenario was that I broke something in a store.

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mickeltee@reddit

I do this with Spanish all the time. I hear it and I understand it, mostly, and then I need to process what was said and then I have to think about the proper response and how to say it in Spanish and then I can say it.

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ericbythebay@reddit

Yes, every time I order at McDonalds in a foreign country. I rattle off my order like I would in the US and the person working the counter has a blank look.

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RichardRichOSU@reddit

If you don’t emerge yourself in a country that speaks the language, it will be incredibly hard for you to gain the ability to speak the language. You also lose the ability really quickly if you stop the practice. This is true for any language.

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Ryan_TX_85@reddit

Most people outside of the Western Hemisphere learn British English. And probably what you're finding is that US English is very different from UK English.

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AppropriateDark5189@reddit

I'm from the US but I'm the only person out of 20 on my team that first language is english. I meet with them every day. On calls, I always give a pause to give my coworkers time to process. Everyone on the call speaks english but the accents take me time to process too. Sometimes because the accent could be French, Filipinos, Mexican, one of many different Indian accents, or some other part of the world.

I know some words in other languages but I only really know english. I totally respect how well all of the team members speak english.

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dth1717@reddit

My parents are English I was born in the us, I grew up around every ethnic group poles, Germans, scots, anybody who played soccer. But I have a problem with Irish accents. For the life of me I have to concentrate to understand wtf they are saying. So don't worry about it. It'll come sooner or later

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PokemonLadyKismet@reddit

Just practice! Using it regularly will help the most and immersion in any language helps a lot! I am sure you are doing great!

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Carinyosa99@reddit

The best way to fully become fluent (or really close to fluent) is to immerse yourself in the language with actual native speakers. I felt very similar with Spanish. I had studied the language from the age of 13/14 and my last year of university, at age 20/21, I went to Mexico City for a semester. I had all this knowledge under my belt, but when I stepped off that plane and heard the language actually being used, I was petrified. But just a couple of weeks completely immersed with no English backup, I started becoming comfortable.

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Cant-Take-Jokes@reddit

If you have an accent and ask someone to relay again most Americans are understanding. As long as you try, they’re usually understanding unless it’s very busy and they’re very stressed.

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Fit_Poetry_267@reddit

I have the same problem with my second language - keep practicing! :)

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miketugboat@reddit

Repetition and experience. Living in a big city i meet a lot of people who speak english as a secondary language so their vocabulary isn't as broad and they are a little slower to process and speak. They aren't dumb by any means, just not quick with english and that's totally okay.

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ehunke@reddit

For one we speak "American English", you most likely learned British English...its not the same language all the time. Also factor in we are a land of immigrants so we have influence from everywhere in everything. For the most part when we go to coffee shops, unless its like starbucks or other crappy chains, you usually order the drinks by the Italian, English, or French name or an Americanized version of it. In England its a "flat white" in the US its a "cortado". A better example earl grey tea with sugar and steamed milk: UK "Earl Grey Latte", US/Canada "London Fog". The general problem your facing is your learning the proper/formal form of the language and then trying to use it in an informal setting where you are not familiar with regional dialects or slang. I would encourage anyone trying to learn a new language, put down the text book, unenroll from the formal classes, find a conversational class or conversational tutor, learn by doing

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biggamax@reddit

You'll pick up the minor variations in no time. Lived in UK for 14 years, recently repatriated. I miss being able to ask for a flat white. Or for takeaway options.

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jessek@reddit

I’m sure I’d have a similar experience ordering in Spanish

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DOMSdeluise@reddit

every foreign language learner encounters this. there is nothing magic about English.

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jeffreyaccount@reddit

There's a ton of dialects too, even in just one city.

Your example of a coffee shop is also the total worst place to hear someone. I can't hear well in restaurants where there's a counter and open kitchen.

I've worked on five languages on my own only to discover conversational takes the most work, time, and so many situations that make practicing hard and costly. It's the hardest part to long study hours.

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Longjumping-Oil-7419@reddit

Most countries learn UK English which doesn't always translate to US English.

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

that's SO true.

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rhb4n8@reddit

You know English better than I do and I'm American

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EmbarrassedMilennial@reddit (OP)

haha thanks man

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Posiden100@reddit

Im gonna assume you mean stuff like how texans say yall instead of you all or you're all. Moved to the US almost a year ago. Most of it is just culture. Linguistically it means something completely different but it's also used as something else locally which wouldn't make sense to anyone that's foreign.

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sneezhousing@reddit

Practice

Real world practice

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Maronita2025@reddit

So was your problem that you learned British English? If not the problem then I guess I don’t understand what the problem was.

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dontforgettowriteme@reddit

Is this experience not applicable to all the other countries where English is spoken? This is just a difference between proficiency and fluency. You know the mechanics of English and can speak it, but you're not yet fluent/able to react on the fly. That's totally normal for a second language. I'm like this with French!

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Mental_Freedom_1648@reddit

This doesn't have anything to do with America. Everyone who is learning a new language goes through this.

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FuckIPLaw@reddit

Not in English, because we're native speakers. I've had that experience trying to communicate with Spanish speakers, though. I know about enough Spanish to successfully order food at a taqueria, but just barely and there's a fair bit of mental load involved.

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