Why Montenegro 🇲🇪 has low population?
Posted by greekscientist@reddit | AskBalkans | View on Reddit | 146 comments
I see that Montenegro has only 623,000 people, being the least populated country in Europe outside of the island states and the micro states like Andorra, Liechtenstein. Montenegro didn't have any wars in the 1990s or the large scale emigration that Croatia, Bosnia or Serbia has, yet it has a low population.
What factors made Montenegro such low populated? Geography? Older conflicts? Stagnation after 1990?
teomees@reddit
Montenegrin guys are mostly hot, Montenegrin women are mostly beautiful. The conditions are actually perfect for more sex to boost the population.
riquelm@reddit
We had a large emigration in Yugoslavia, so many people moved to study and then stayed to work and live in Serbia, but also in Croatia, Bosnia, even Macedonia and Slovenia, now huge majority of them is assimilated.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
How much people emigrated to other parts of Yugoslavia?
riquelm@reddit
A loooooot, as the University of Montenegro was only founded in 1970s although some studies existed prior to that of course.
zpetar@reddit
Even during 90s MNE was very underdeveloped. I was in Podgorica back in 1994 as soldier. Serbia already had a lot of private radio and TV stations. In MNE there wasn't single one until summer of 1994. It wasn't actually Montenegro radio station, someone elwas just emitting Dutch Radio 538.
riquelm@reddit
There was no one left to develop it, all smart, educated people were moving because of the opportunities/ studies.
zpetar@reddit
Now Serbia is facing same problem. Smart and educated people are emigrating to west ..
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Like Cyprus, where until some years ago you had to go in Greece, Germany or UK for university.
Barbak86@reddit
Even to Kosovo. Our prime minister is one of your Albanians XD
riquelm@reddit
Oh yeah, now I remember, he is from Vladimir (Katërkolle)
Complex_Shine_1113@reddit
I know a lot of Montenegrins who live in Skopje. But I think everyone moved around during Yugoslavia to an extent. I know lots of Macedonia moved to Vojvodina, and lots more live in Croatia and Slovenia too.
deviendrais@reddit
How likely is it that a new wave of emigration will hit Montenegro once it joins the EU? Croatia's EU membership initially exacerbated the already existing emigration rates but in MNE's case I don't see an emigration that could be exacerbated in the first place lol
riquelm@reddit
It will inspire some for sure, but not much, almost everyone who wanted to leave already left anyhow.
zpetar@reddit
There's something like 350k people born in Montenegro or their parents born there who live in Serbia. More than 1M with some of their ancestors from MNE live in Serbia.
Proof_Television8685@reddit
No emigration? Bro 1/3 of my high school class moved to Serbia
Aware-Dragonfly4433@reddit
Montenegro is a microstate
imyukiru@reddit
You had to ask.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bosnian_genocide
OnoOvo@reddit
no wars in the 90s😶😶🌫️🫣
kerobob@reddit
It's a karst region that until recently was not really hospitable. Pretty much all Serbs in Croatia and BiH have roots from Montenegro. There is probably more Montenegrins in Belgrade alone than there is in Montenegro.
Last_Horseman@reddit
Yeah, my family are all Bosnian now but my grandfather’s side came from Montenegro a few generations back (interwar period I think), left to escape a blood feud apparently
zanimljivo123@reddit
Not from BiH. Serbs lived there for as much time as they live in montenegro. Croatia, kinda but more serbs from BiH migrated to crostia during the ottoman times
fudo1991@reddit
Actually yes, BiH:).
Beginning with 18th century onwards, Montenegrins or Serbs or call them what you want (it's irrelevant since modern concept of nation and ethnicity is later invention) migrated to parts of then Bosnian eyalet which were depopulated due to wars and epidemics which decimated local rural population.
Landholders of the time, bosnian muslims (Bosniaks in contemporary meaning), beys and agas introduced/invited/accepted families (or parts of clans basically) to settle their lands. Later on, especially with decline of ottoman rule and further instability (especially in border areas with Montenegro and hajduk/looter/robber activities) which led to further depopulation or domestic population (of all religious groups but muslims lost most of the number due to their military obligation and losses stemming from that and ofc don't forget epidemics - last plague epidemic in first decade of 19th century was quite deadly especially in urban places) and immigraton of landless, poor and groups of people that, due to harsh life in Montenegro, emigrated to nearest other areas/countries. I can write basically a novel length of comment to add and explain other factor and social and political circumstances that led to Montenegrin emigration to BiH and then another novel to start with events in 20th century.
Basically a lot of contemporary Serb population, especially in East Herzegovina and East Bosnia (a looot in Foca, Čajniče and further south towards Gacko and Bileća) can trace their roots to Montenegro.
This is NOT denying the fact that orthodox population of BiH (primarily parts of contemporary Serb declared population in East Herzegovina and East Bosnia) lives here for centuries and longer.
In the end, without any need to measure who's nation or ethnic group has "strongest" "claim" to areas that are todays BiH, Croatia, Serbia, Montenegro etc., just to add that all of us (exyu minus Slovenia and Macedonia Slavic peoples) are historically soo intermixed with each other, soo many migration cycles and routes.
Our contemporary national and ethnic self identification is another thing (which should be respected and respecftul)but it is not supposed to be a cause for conflict or some heated online debate.
Peace Živio!
zanimljivo123@reddit
Not true at all, serbs live on the territory of herzegovina at least since 630s, and on territory of bosnia at leasr since 10th century. At one point serbian country was more west than east from the river drina. Also, saying that many people from eastern herzegovina can trace their roots from montenegro is not true in a way that you presented it. Can most of us trace ONE of our family lines to montenegro? Yes. But having 1 great-great grandmother who was from montenegro doesn't mean that we came to existance by them settling here. We simply intermarried a lot.
fudo1991@reddit
In literally said that quite a lot of contemporary Serb population (orthodox population that identifies as Serbs)in East Herzegovina and Bosnia lives here for centuries.
We are all intermixed with a lot of our ancestors coming and going throughout our countries, migrated here, migrated there, converted to that religion, converted to other religion, being under several rulers and states in one lifetime etc etc etc.
zanimljivo123@reddit
They were serbs too 🙈 btw, not as much as people think. Just because countless foes have been here through the ages doesn't mean that we are so mixed with turks, germans, austrians, hungarians, greeks etc. People forget how much of a barrier language was for marriage and family. Especially people from mountanious regions are mostly genetically "pure" if we can call it that, because they were not too exposed to those in their surroundings.
fudo1991@reddit
I'm saying we (BHS) are intermixed
zanimljivo123@reddit
Regionally, yes
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Really? I didn't knew its so common. Like Ireland and Galicia (huge number of descendants in America due to unfortunate history, Portugal in Europe due to poverty).
WinduCodes@reddit
Montenegro had significant emigration throughout its history. There are a lot of Montenegrins living in Serbia. Plenty in Argentina as well.
Besides that we do have a very low fertility rate (but that's something thats a global trend): 1.7-1.8 meaning if this continues we will likely be a thing of the past in the next 100yrs or so which is sad.
AcanthopterygiiOk752@reddit
Believe it or not, at 1.8 we are in the top tree European nations ( with Bulgaria and Georgia) when it comes to fertility... I do hope we are not going anywhere, as that would be too said.
WinduCodes@reddit
I hope so, but something has to change. I for example do not have children. I would love to have children - If I knew I could provide enough for my family. But with these prices where I cannot afford a roof above my head that's highly unlikely.
AcanthopterygiiOk752@reddit
Me neither, i was studying, working... Couldn't achieve both.
WinduCodes@reddit
What's stopping you now if it's not too much to ask? IMO The system just does not favour the ones who want to commit to family. It's sad and frustrating.
AcanthopterygiiOk752@reddit
By now, age 🤦♀️ It would be too risky. I should look into other options though ( but, honestly, also the fear that I might not be able to give to my hypothetical children everything they might need... The disparity in our society is huge too.)
WinduCodes@reddit
I'm really sorry to hear that. Maybe a cliche to say but hopefully with all the new tech age can become just a number (at least up to some point).
And I agree with the disparity part.
Imaginary_String_814@reddit
That’s wild, while I support advancement becoming invincible in this world sounds like a torture for the wide majority.
and I don’t think that money is the real factor why people don’t get kids, it doesn’t match data since you have more kids in poorer families and regions by quite a margin.
I think it’s the heavy focus on ourselves, we are in a time of individualism.
WinduCodes@reddit
I csn only agree on what you have said.
xowolf16@reddit
come on now, i had my first at 21 while in college. its actually doable when you are young because you have a lot more energy and gaving a kid FORCES you to find a way. like a crackhead always finds money for drugs😂 (i would rather speak on montenegrin but i dont want this comment deleted so)
WinduCodes@reddit
Well I could write in what ifs now but its futile. I do. think its much easier when you are young.
VeryLazyEngineeer@reddit
It's 2.1 for 2025 now.
Hidrogen_Cosic@reddit
Najveća kita u porodilištu
Sandzakguy@reddit
Shouldn’t kosovo be on top somewhere too?
AcanthopterygiiOk752@reddit
That's the official statistic i found 🤷♀️
jamesmb@reddit
Argentina is the unspoken Balkan country.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Its rather high for EU levels. Its true that world wars caused huge losses in our region.
Why Montenegrins went to Argentina?
WinduCodes@reddit
Argentina was once a promised land. Some saw it as financial opportunity and some as an escape from war destination.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
I know that once Argentina was very rich, thats why they attracted a lot of Italians, Spaniards, even Jews who mostly went to United States (Argentina used to have 300,000+ Jews in the past).
But Balkan emigration to Argentina (except maybe Croatia) wasnt high, hence I was surprised.
ilijadwa@reddit
yeah there was a huge number of Croats that went to Argentina, on both sides of my family like half of my grandparents siblings (they had big families) went to Argentina (and also Chile)
AcanthopterygiiOk752@reddit
It's so moving, they kept Montenegrin names in diaspora, they still remember their roots. We do what we can to keep that connection. One of the main squares in Podgorica is called Argentian square.
_Caligulean_@reddit
I'll fix that. Ladies, respect the line, please
casual_philosopher02@reddit
I would offer to help but I'm not about to be in a harem... I'm out
_Caligulean_@reddit
Harem? I'm not a Turk! You'd be assigned a proper wife number and that's it
int23_t@reddit
You meant concubine number didn't you?
_Caligulean_@reddit
Wife number 69 sounds more romantic than just calling her a concubine.
casual_philosopher02@reddit
wife number 69 has a pantofla size 40, shooting for your head
_Caligulean_@reddit
We already started the dirty talk, nice
Efficient_Resource15@reddit
You would give up on hellas for montenegro?
casual_philosopher02@reddit
I mean if it has better economy? MONTENEGRO HERE I COME
More_Ad_5142@reddit
Eat, sex, 💤, eat, sex, 💤
Stepaladin@reddit
Username checks out
_Caligulean_@reddit
Who else but me, right bratko?
shqiptarski1444@reddit
qina ma shum
SeriousStart3221@reddit
They moves to Belgrade. Or UN...
PasicT@reddit
The terrain is very mountainous and the size of the country is too small to have 1+ million people.
Markomannia@reddit
Malta is two rocks in the sea, population over 500.000.
PasicT@reddit
Malta has less inhabitants than Montenegro.
Markomannia@reddit
The populations of Malta and Montenegro are surprisingly similar, despite Montenegro having a territory over 40 times larger. As of early 2026, Montenegro has an estimated population of approximately 626,000–628,000, while Malta has approximately 549,000–550,000.
PasicT@reddit
Yes and?
Markomannia@reddit
Obviously one can fit 1 million people in Montenegro.
PasicT@reddit
Not with their terrain and overall size.
Markomannia@reddit
Yes. With this terrain and overall size. Podgorica alone could host 500.000+ people with no problem, if planed and developed smartly.
PasicT@reddit
It's surrounded by mountains which halts urban development and expansion.
Markomannia@reddit
I am very well aware of where it is.
AI_abuser@reddit
Until even a few decades ago Montenegro area was very poor and underdeveloped even for Balkan standards, mostly due to mostly mountainous terrain, soil and climate (large scale farming is impossible), but also due to poor infrastructure, wars in the 20th century, tribal mentality (blood revenge), organized crime, low social mobility, almost no industry... Many would historically rather relocate to other parts of Yugoslavia or even America than stay. The equation changed with large-scale global tourism and now Montenegro is far more prosperous than some parts of Croatia, Serbia and Bosnia. Previously abandoned villages are becoming tourist destinations, Adriatic coast is seeing rapid development and investments but it will take a while before its population begins to increase.
BigSignificance1231@reddit
it’s russian.
ninjaMNE@reddit
a cutite bogalji jedni veze nemate
Captain3007@reddit
Its literally a rock
Rhumorsky@reddit
Black Rock Mountain
ButterscotchOk7553@reddit
Lazy for sex
Accurate-Beyond-9956@reddit
My local store beggar that is from Montenegro says he is from Monaco. Surely will screw up the stats if everyone does it.
Abdullah715279@reddit
Take people from South Asia.
raoulbrancaccio@reddit
It's very small and, as the name suggests, very mountainous. I think Podgorica lies on its only major valley.
blitzfreak_69@reddit
True but Lebanon is even smaller and also has a LOT of mountains
billups77@reddit
But Lebanon has existed for 9000 years, and was very rich at a quite long period of time where they putted infrastucture in place to reach all those mountains regions and connect to other parts of the country, as all the opposite was in Montenegro, very poor and war demolished country with no real need to connect to all those mountainous regions
raoulbrancaccio@reddit
True true, its size and relative ruggedness only explains why it's less populated than other balkan countries, which is itself not a particularly dense region and which shares Montenegro'a history, soil fertility etc.
Of course it's not unheard of for regions to be small, rugged AND highly populated.
spallettioutista@reddit
Fra but the flair southern Italy where did you find?
raoulbrancaccio@reddit
I made it fra, you can change the flair's text when you set it.
spallettioutista@reddit
Ah ok grazie bro 🤜🤛
raoulbrancaccio@reddit
Figurati, però Spalletti è la 🐐
Orqee@reddit
Having babies is too much work
Hidrogen_Cosic@reddit
Little to no arable land.
No_Designer_8203@reddit
I think that over 50% of population in central Serbia has ancestors that at some point in the past came from Montenegro / Herzegovina.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Was Herzegovina having similar conditions (inhospitable land) like Montenegro as people said?
zanimljivo123@reddit
Like 30-40% of montenegro was herzegovina before. Niksic, herceg novi, tribe of piva, tribe of drobnjak etc. Either way we are really similar to each other and we both have one of the oldest states on the balkans formed during the reign of byzantine emperor heraclius, zachlumia and diocletia. Customs and traditions in herzegovina and montenegro are pretty similar, and we fought numerous battles together through out the history. We were kinda inseperable. But over time, montenegro strived for it's own nation while sadly people from herzegovina are still loyal to serbia
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Is it the other way round? Herzegovina is mostly Croatian and Serbian in Trebinje, Montenegro instead has a lot of people closer to Serbia and identity is an issue there.
I would like to know more about the similarities of Herzegovina and Montenegro.
zanimljivo123@reddit
Half of herzegovina today belong to croats (western) and half to serbs (eastern), even though croats heavily outnumber serbs in this region. Many serbs from western herzegovina were forcefully converted to roman catholicism in ww2, many killed and 45.000 expelled 1992. Serbian cities/municipalities are trebinje, bileca, gacko, nevesinje, kalinovik, ljubinje, berkovici. We are simply similar, extremly close, you could say identical dna, behavior, mentality, historical struggles, traditional clothes from herzegovina and montenegro are extremly similar. We were always proud of each other but relstionshio worsened when king, back then knjaz nikola came to power, he used people from herzegovina for his own selfish desires and then he basically sold them to austro - hungary, betrayed the greatest hero from herzegovina, put his man to power in herzegovina as some kind of a governor who was spreading propaganda and imposing montenegrin rule over herzegovians (who are even lesser in number than montenegrins, and by far). The main difference today is that half of serbs in montenegro do not consider themselves serbs, while serbs in herzegovina are die - hard serbs loyal to serbia, sadly
Sad_Philosopher_3163@reddit
Give me a source claiming that 45000 Serbs were expelled from western Herzegovina and that some number converted and remained Catholic, even though national identities were already firmly established at that point, but they somehow forgot that they were Serbs. I am referring specifically to Široki Brijeg, Ljubuški, Posušje, Čitluk, Grude, Duvno, Mostar, so strictly western Herzegovina.
https://hr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Popis_stanovni%C5%A1tva_u_Bosni_i_Hercegovini_1931.
zanimljivo123@reddit
Operation cagalj 1992, lowest estimated put number of expelled serbs at 25.000, but most objective estimates put it at around 45.000. It's not something that i made up and you should not feel bad about it it's history and it's behind us. Except for if you participated in it. And it's well known that serbs in ww2 went through a process of forced conversion to catholicism, and serbs from western herzegovina were one if the targeted ones. I personally know a man whose extended family went through the same process, today they declare themselves as croats. History is sometimes cruel
Sad_Philosopher_3163@reddit
Brother, we have population census from 1991 and 1931... You can literally look up the demographics of Široki, Duvno, Grude, Posušje, Čitluk, Ljubuški in a couple of clicks... This is actually sad.
zanimljivo123@reddit
Vucic isn't from BiH 😂
Barbak86@reddit
He is from Kosovo
zanimljivo123@reddit
Ah, denying your crimes again even though i didn't convict you of it or show any resentment. Typical behavior.
Sad_Philosopher_3163@reddit
You are straight up lying. Go look up the demographics of the mentioned cities in 1931 and 1991. Stop embarrassing yourself.
zanimljivo123@reddit
Brother it literally happened and is a well documented operation of croatian forced that took place in spring and summer 1992, it didn't happen 500 years ago for us to argue about it's legitimacy.
Sad_Philosopher_3163@reddit
Ljubuški: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10626
Grude: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10405
Posušje: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10731
Duvno: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10308
Široki Brijeg: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10570
Čitluk: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10260
Čapljina: http://www.statistika.ba/?show=12&id=10243
zanimljivo123@reddit
You left out some cities/municipalities but okay, either way as i told you no need to feel bad about what your countrymen did, and no need to deny it. Because it happened, i personally know few people who were there, and the operation is well documented. I don't know why croats feel so butthurt whenever someone talks about their crimes. In a few months you will deny operation storm too, as you do every year, even though it is an extremly well documented event, you will again say how serbs left on their own, and they weren't endangered. Let's finish here, because we aren't doing any good out there with this. You believe your story if you want, i don't care
Sad_Philosopher_3163@reddit
Who did I leave out from western Herzegovina? The western part of the Mostar municipality? Mostar, the town itself, is not western Herzegovina, but central. I don't care about the war, otherwise we could talk all day about how many people Serbs expelled, I'm referring to the claim that supposedly at least 45 000 Serbs lived in western Herzegovina (Ljubuški, Duvno, Široki Brijeg, Grude, Posušje, Čapljina) and were expelled or converted. You can literally look up the numbers and I have linked them. This isn't my story, it's based on census data.
WinduCodes@reddit
What a bunch of horseshit.
Rhumorsky@reddit
I'd say Montenegro and Hercegovina are much closer in mentality and language than Montenegrins are with any other slav region.
zanimljivo123@reddit
100%, herzegovina and montenegro are like twins
zanimljivo123@reddit
Red part is modern day montenegro. It was considered herzegovina until late 19th century.
No_Designer_8203@reddit
Yes, very similar. The people there are very similar to Montenegro in terms of customs, mentality etc.
deviendrais@reddit
I'd be surprised to meet someone west of the Morava who doesn't have at least one ancestor from Montenegro
alkorisno@reddit
I heard somewhere that there are more Montenegrans in the capital of Serbia then in thier capital. It used to be a same country until very recently, it is still weird to me that someone considers themselves a different nation.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Yes, Montenegrins are majority only in Cetinje and surroundings.
AcanthocephalaSea410@reddit
They sleep too much and don't have time for other things.
ZAMAHACHU@reddit
Sex is too much work.
No-Championship-4632@reddit
The more mountains, the less population density.
SpadeGaming0@reddit
Mountains and centuries of ottoman encouraged and forced migrations.
rawrr9@reddit
Montenegro - a country in which Montenegrins are not the majority, and a country in which fewer Montenegrins live than outside of it.
Rude-Violinist9724@reddit
Same to Azerbaijan kinda
jamaljackson1@reddit
Interesting question. I've asked chatgpt what the average population per km² in the Balkans is, results below. Montenegro does seem to be the lowest, but not that far off from it's neighbours.. Kosovo is very densely populated to my surprise
Quick comparison (highest → lowest) Kosovo: ~165–170 Slovenia: ~104 Albania: ~100 Romania: ~84 North Macedonia: ~83 Greece: ~80 Serbia: ~73 Croatia: ~68 Bosnia and Herzegovina: ~64 Bulgaria: ~62 Montenegro: ~45
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Balkans had bad history and a lot of problems in the last century.
The two world wars had a huge death toll in Balkans. Especially in Yugoslavia and Greece.
With communism all the people's of the Balkans had safe future, high quality education, free housing and healthcare, stability, so the living standards approached Western European levels for the first time.
Then with the counterrevolutions of 1989-91 and the wars a huge amount of people were killed in the Balkans or migrated.
I believe that Bulgaria and Serbia would have more than 10 million people if communism never fell, Romania around 28 million, Greece roughly the same, Albania and Kosovo would have roughly 8 million people together instead of emptied out.
Balkan history is big reason for this population deficit.
Defiant-Dare1223@reddit
Communism was great aktuwally
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
Communism was great, that's why they had a solid population growth for the first time.
Before it was slow, and wars costed huge amount of people.
Defiant-Dare1223@reddit
You say "that's why" but if you look at the countries today with a solid population growth it's objectively some of the poorest and most troubled places in the world.
Top 5 fertility rates:
Chad Somalia DR Congo Central African Republic Niger
Now i know that's not exactly the same as population growth, but it'll be a very high correlation.
greekscientist@reddit (OP)
I mean, Bulgaria, Yugoslavia, Romania had low mortality and good birth rates under communism. Death rates drastically declined in Romania in the first years of communism, in Moldova even more.
jamaljackson1@reddit
Yeah sorry this is where the exchange ended for me lol
Odd-Value-4101@reddit
Only men.. women left long time ago
Kovalski94@reddit
All of them are in Belgrade city center, drinking coffee all day.
99kemo@reddit
I’ve driven through Montenegro; beautiful country, friendly people but not a lot of farmland. It’s very mountainous without a lot of flat land. There is some around Podgorica but that’s about it.
EastWing6521@reddit
Rugged mountainous terrain.
Miserable-Ground-379@reddit
Too lazy for sex😅
CryptoStef33@reddit
This is the Montenegro way
Inevitable-Theory901@reddit
They are too busy sleeping
oldschusteman@reddit
That is impossible
Young_Owl99@reddit
Actually it is quite an effort unless it doesn’t take much time.
Active_Unit_9498@reddit
I was on the highway between Niksic and Ostrog and passed a car parked in the middle of a lane, driver asleep, with his feet kicked out the window.
Upstairs_Ad6024@reddit
Too lazy to fck
wikimandia@reddit
People have mentioned geography and low birth rates, but you also need to factor in life expectancy.
The difficulties for older generations meant life expectancy was much lower than it is today. So Montenegro has a smaller population of older people than other countries. You could have the highest birth rate in the world but still a small population if the majority die young.
Under 20% of the population in Montenegro is over 65.
wikimandia@reddit
Compare to Greece 🇬🇷
wikimandia@reddit
Compare to Japan 🇯🇵
SamoSaki@reddit
They relocate to Vračar hystorical, thats the goal for every person from Montenegro.
shqiptarski1444@reddit
Mountainous, tribal society
ilovemangos3@reddit
watch out world, there will be many little caliguleans running around
FuckTheCake@reddit
few fertile land