Brother has no GCSEs and kicked out of college, what should I do?
Posted by antiglow@reddit | AskUK | View on Reddit | 176 comments
[removed]
Posted by antiglow@reddit | AskUK | View on Reddit | 176 comments
[removed]
continentaldreams@reddit
Babe stop feeling like you have to mother your brother - this is not your responsibility. He's old enough to sort himself out.
CoffeeIgnoramus@reddit
I'd go even further and say you'd actually be doing more harm by looking after him. It's better he sees how bad things get if he doesn't do anything at this age than later.
il0vOxy@reddit
It’s “bear” a resemblance, meaning “carry” it. Also “bear in mind”. The verb “bare” means to expose or make naked.
Amazing-Heron-105@reddit
this man does bear english
cwright017@reddit
This is a pretty inconsiderate answer. I agree it’s not ( or shouldn’t be ) her problem. But the fact is she is calling out issues in how her mother is dealing with it and trying to find a solution. If more people behaved this way maybe fewer people would fall through the cracks, rather than just think ‘meh, not my problem’
continentaldreams@reddit
Why is it inconsiderate? I don't think it's her responsibility to ensure he's bettering himself when he's been kicked out of school and is quite happy to work on the farm.
UpsetKoalaBear@reddit
Do you have any younger siblings?
Watching your sibling grow up for 16 years and effectively crash out isn’t something you can just ignore.
It isn’t mothering to ask for help because you care about your little brother.
Dutch_Slim@reddit
As the partner of someone who left school at 14 and didn’t have a “proper” job until he was 39 (but did have 3 older sisters to baby him) u/continentaldreams is actually spot on.
I spent a long time trying to get him in a better position but it actually only happened when I told him we were done if he didn’t fix up.
cwright017@reddit
You’re right, it’s not her responsibility, it’s her parents. But she is clearly worried about and cares for her brother and is trying to help. She doesn’t want her brother to throw his life away, and then in 10 years when he’s older and realises his mistake wish she’d done more to help.
Imagine your mum is a raging drug addict. Technically it’s not the child’s responsibility to parent the parents… but I’m sure you’d want to help in that situation.
cloud__19@reddit
You can't help people who don't want to be helped.
cwright017@reddit
This is a pretty defeatist attitude to take, of course you can, it’s just not that easy. And the least you can do is be there to support them.
Again, I understand that it’s not easy, and I see where the sentiment comes from. I’m sure many people have spent years trying to help loved ones who threw it all away in addiction spirals etc.
continentaldreams@reddit
It's not defeatist at all, it's reality
cloud__19@reddit
You can be there to support them when they want that but you can't force people to accept help. If they don't want to change their lives then they won't. You can call it defeatist if you want but it's how it is and you'll save yourself a lot of mental anguish if you accept that. Your power over other people is limited.
cwright017@reddit
No I agree you can’t force them to accept help. I do believe you can convince people ( I mean it’s what the advertising industry exists to do ) to take a certain path, but that’s not always the right thing to do.
birchblonde@reddit
The thing is that he doesn’t want help and OP will get no support from her mother - in fact, the opposite. So interfering will only cause friction and damage to OP’s familial relationships, and stress to herself.
Daveddozey@reddit
Sounds like the mothers been enabling him for years.
Funny-frog500@reddit
Babe, you need to block his number and move on.
HonkersTim@reddit
What the fuck sort of attitude is this? He is her brother FFS. Of course she wants to help him sort himself out.
continentaldreams@reddit
I didn't say they should disown him, did I? But he's on a course and he's working on the farm - what else is she meant to do for him here?
qbnaith@reddit
He got kicked off the course
continentaldreams@reddit
That just supports my point even more - he's been handed opportunities on a platter and he hasn't taken them. Sometimes someone needs to be allowed to fail - but is he failing if he's enjoying the work on the farm?
LIKE-AN-ANIMAL@reddit
Did you even read the original post?
continentaldreams@reddit
Take off the bit at the end and my point still stands.
Top-Cat-a@reddit
Its fine to encourage him to sort himself out, but often people who try to help are sucked into the same hole.
OurManInJapan@reddit
16 is not old enough for anything. Also why are you criticising someone for wanting a better future for her brother?
continentaldreams@reddit
16 is old enough to know better. And why is it not OK that he's working on his family's farm?
ShelleysSkylark@reddit
Sixteen is old enough to know better than to get himself kicked out of college for being rude and disruptive. He's not a little boy.
Winston_Carbuncle@reddit
Yeah what a weirdo OP trying to help your family set themselves up for a happy and successful life
Can there be some kind of memo to reddit users that people in the real world generally try to help others, especially close friends and family, where possible?
TheNathanNS@reddit
This is UK reddit, here we don't give a fuck about helping anyone else, family or not.
continentaldreams@reddit
Correct, I hate everyone - including my entire family! Great deduction skills.
continentaldreams@reddit
He didn't want to attend school and is happily working on the farm. I'm not sure why OP needs to step in. If he fails, he fails - it's life. People shouldn't need to hold your hand.
HonkersTim@reddit
I wish I could downvote this more than once. This fucking selfish attitude, what a load of fucking shit.
Winston_Carbuncle@reddit
Nobody needs to do anything but sometimes it's nice to have someone in your corner. Particularly when you're not really clued up on the world
Targettio@reddit
There is a difference between being supportive and helpful and having it to fix it for them.
The op's question is about how does the op make it right. The answer is, they don't. Sure support and encourage the brother, but there it is not the ops problem to solve.
continentaldreams@reddit
He quit school, he got kicked out of school, and his mother enrolled him in a college course. What more can they do at this point? If he can't stay in education that's on him, no-one else.
Technical_Win973@reddit
A lot of Reddit comments feel fairly spiteful in some of the advice they give and honestly I'm concerned at how eager some of them seem to be to cut someone out of their life.
I almost feel sorry for those commenters if they don't have anyone in their life they want to help and protect.
continentaldreams@reddit
I'm not telling them to cut someone out, wtf. I'm saying it sounds like the kid has had ample opportunity to do good things and it's not his sisters responsibility to make sure he does well in life if he's unwilling to stay in education/gets kicked out of school. There comes a point where you need to strap on your big boy pants.
EndPsychological2541@reddit
Babe, how dare you care about your brother and his future, he's 16, he's practically a man now, in fact, you should probably get your mum to kick him out of the family home and stop him working on the farm, fuckin nepo babies make me sick.
Good on you for caring about your brother and I hope you help to find a steady path for him to take
continentaldreams@reddit
LOL what the hell is this reach
anabsentfriend@reddit
He has to want to study and take exams, you can't make him do them until he wants to. Has he ever had his mental health / behaviour assessed by a professional?
OutlandishnessOver59@reddit
I was kind of like him when I was 16, the only way I learnt was by getting burned by my own decisions. However I never had someone like you around me so I’d recommend keep trying and keep having deep meaningful conversations.
roddz@reddit
If he like the machinery more than the farm itself try nudging him to get qualified to drive diggers/forklifts/other heavy machinery and do contracting
antiglow@reddit (OP)
He already does all that tbh so he should go and get the proper licenses for them so he can do this! I’ll suggest it, thank you
TransportationNo5529@reddit
Agricultural colleges teach farm mechanics, very VERY good work out there for a good mechanic. You get to play on all sorts of equipment ALL DAY and such a transferable skill. Most ag colleges will fo a level 3 in mechanics for free for under 18s who don't have any further education. I went to agricultural college after dropping out of school to study horticulture and I never looked back. There'll be open days around, see if you can find one, he might just find something he likes! My dad had the foresight to take me to one and it was such a good experience.
Phenomenomix@reddit
He’d have to be 18 for most sites to consider employing him and he’d probably need a full driving licence to go with it. Courses aren’t cheap either
Tvdevil_@reddit
he sounds a total waste.
you made an effort. better effort than your mum who should be the one telling him to buck up
I do not look forward to paying for this mans lifestyle and benefits in the years to come
Vegetable_Complex_21@reddit
My brother is 32, has been without a job for over 10 years and still lives with my parents. Refuses to claim any benefits etc and relies on my grandparents to give him a few hundred every two weeks… a long time ago I realised I could lead a horse to water but can’t force them to drink. Focus on yourself ☺️
llamasncheese@reddit
As a guy with some similarities, two older sisters, hated school and only went in to college to see my friends (didnt go to lessons). Leave him be. The education system isnt designed for everyone, and not everyones ready to start taking their life seriously at that age. Also, youre not his mother. My sisters "mothered me" and it had the opposite effect to what they wanted, it actually slowed me down in "developing" in the way they wanted, it compounded all the things i didnt like.
Be supportive, and leave him be. Let him grow at his own pace, and eventually, most people, will grow into a fully fledged adult. If you pressure it, youll just slow it down. You can gently encourage him to try things like a supportive friend, but dont mother him.
Mr_Bumcrest@reddit
Nothing. It's not your problem. It's your mother's and your brother's.
fergie@reddit
Having the possibility to take over a farm, even if you are not super into it is a huge privilege, especially for people like your brother. Sometimes people have to sort of be pushed by their life circumstances into their career.
ReplacementFrosty641@reddit
Stop worrying if you can. You have done all you are able to do. My son was very similar at this age. He is now in a career that he enjoys.
sneddsdead@reddit
If he's hands on and can fix things he will be fine, if anything he will probably earn more than someone with a degree if he ends up being a mechanic, plumber or similar. I wouldn't worry he just sounds like someone who doesn't like a classroom environment and prefers learning on the job.
DrinkMyPink@reddit
Nothing.
He has a job, he enjoys it. What's the issue?
Not everyone has to be an academic.
Caddy666@reddit
do as ya mum says.
its not your problem,
yellowrea@reddit
He'll thank you one day. Help him.
Yippym@reddit
I probably get alot of red arrows but have you consider that maybe your brother is maybe neurodiverse?
Does he have problem getting good grades during school, does he get sensory overload when being at school. You mentioned that he hated going into school, maybe work on what could trigger him?
He sound like he tried going into college course and he had a melt down. Even though he does in 1 day a fortnight, what could honestly annoy someone that much....is a given sign.
I would say that him working at the farm is better than being isolated in his room. No matter how you force someone to do something it's rather difficult unless he accept he has a problem.
Overall you are trying your best for your brother, but I'm not sure if you have considering seeing the issue mentally.
Sorry if this sounds rude.
EmmaInFrance@reddit
I was also going to ask this!
School refusal is pretty common amongst autistic kids, kids with ADHD, and kids who are AuDHD.
PDA (pathologic demand avoidance, but often called extreme demand anxiety or pervasive drive for autonomy - by those, like me, who have it) can make it even harder and boys, especially, can often present as rude and disruptive, when it's actually their brains shutting down because they just can't cope with any more demands.
Sensory overwhelm, due to the school environment, often makes everything even worse.
My AuDHD with PDA son has just turned 17. He gets home from school completely exhausted and he's often asleep by 8pm! Fridays are always the worst and, if we're not careful to give him enough space (both literally and figuratively), that's when he sometimes has explosive meltdowns. Normally though, he just heads straight for his room and we don't nag him or fuss at him.
He has had issues with school refusal throughout his time at school, but it got better as he got older. Unfortunately, he has an absolutely awful (genuinely, I've met him!) physics teacher this year and he's refused to go to just his lessons, so he does the work in a study room instead.
Has he ever been assessed for dyslexia, dyscalculia, and dysgraphia?
The fact that he enjoys working with his hands and is happy to work on the farm suggests that he's not actually lazy, contrary to how other posters see him.
My brother is AuDHD woth severe dyslexia. Your brother reminds me very much of him. He loves anything mechanical and practical.
OP, I must stress though that you need to set boundaries for yourself!
Taking care of your brother is not your job!
Yes, of course, you can help him somewhat but you also need to live your own life.
There are some excellent online screening assessments for every neural development disorder that I've mentioned, created by actual specialist clinics and experts in this field.
You could read through these, as well as articles that discuss the relevant traits, and see how much they relate to your brother perhaps?
Getting through to your mum about any official route to diagnosis is another matter.
Perhaps talk to your brother first and see if he will complete some of these screening tests? You could then have something more concrete to take to your mum to back you up.
You role in this, as a supportive sibling, is to start the discussion and to signpost your mum and brother to the relevant resources. It's not to do the work that follows for them.
Regarding labels: there are so, so many good reasons to seek official diagnoses, one of which is just having the answer to why you feel broken and not like 'everyone else'.
It means that we get a recognised label that can help us access support and accommodations.
We always get labelled anyway - weirdo, lazy, rude, oddball, etc.
Why not use the correct label for ourselves instead?
antiglow@reddit (OP)
Yes he probs is. I think we all are in my house tbh
Very true! And didn’t sound rude don’t worry
Stratix@reddit
I agree with this commenter, neurodivergence is seriously worth considering. Your brother's experience is very typical of people with ADHD (sometimes with, sometimes without Autism).
Scrolling through the other comments and I can see many of them suggest tough love. Tough love does not work well with things like ADHD. You can't shame them into fixing their executive dysfunction, and it's more likely to bring lasting trauma.
2 years ago, I found out I have ADHD. I'm in my late thirties. My brain's reward functions don't work properly.
I was lucky enough to be academic, so I managed to get through school with decent grades even though I did the bare minimum homework and almost no study. Doing things that I can't find interest in can feel like absolute torture. I started medication recently and it's been lifechanging. I wish I had had it during school, I would have done so much better.
Your brother is never going to be academical, he doesn't find it interesting enough. It was good of your family to set him up with something that requires the minimum of that sort of study, and I'm almost certain with a diagnosis and the right meds he'd find it a lot easier.
Yippym@reddit
Everything make sense now, your mum probably already knows this and rather not prefer that her son/your brother be branded with ADHD, Autism etc. She rather protect him from it all, than to kick him out.
Your brother sounds like he's is trying his best to fit in, being able to work on the farm is way better than being on the dole.
Alot of people here are being mean to your brother, maybe get the support by getting your brother to do some test and ask your GP to get the ball rolling.
Problem is in the Midlands, the ADHD pathway is blocked. Too many people are applying and they have stopped accepting new referral, so I've heard.
Alouema2@reddit
Along with what others have said, there's a lot of lads who spend their teenage years like this, then just sort of grow up. Its like they need that extra bit of time to mature. If he's working a farm he is definitely capable. Going on at him probably won't help but equally, if your mums still doing everything for him in the home etc, that's unhelpful too.
AttackOwlFibre@reddit
I kind of disagree here. Even the most immature child knows they need GCSES at a bare minimum.
He's not even been able to do that. The bare basics.
MadThingsDoMadStuff@reddit
I did get my GCSEs, but dropped out of college at 17, I went back last year to do an access course and met people who did their foundational skills (GCSE equivalent) the year prior, they ranged from 18-30s, people mature and grow at different rates. It took me until 21 to realise I needed to do more than bar work and getting royally f’ed up on whatever I could, there’s a lad in there who’s smarter than I am at 25, no doubt he could’ve easily smashed life out earlier but for whatever reason, he didn’t, and that’s alright.
Life’s a marathon, not a sprint, it might just take OP’s brother a few more years to recognise that he’s capable of more than just being a farm hand for his family, we all go at different speeds and there’s no harm in taking longer to learn to appreciate that you’re capable of doing more.
Due-Presentation4344@reddit
Agree - I had this mentality as a teenager, I don’t think I really matured until I was my early 20s
Meatball-Magnus@reddit
I didn’t get my shit sorted until I was 25 then brought a house and got a great job all in the same year. I think blokes just grow up differently takes a little longer to hit their stride.
No_Ring_3348@reddit
This, he is still cooking. If he's still on his arse at 25 then I'd worry but I was the exact same when I was 17-18 because I didn't know anything about anything, and I've turned out fine.
GlastoKhole@reddit
I did also live this life a bit, but I got all my qualifications despite being a little dickhead. The issue he faces is when it’s time to grow up, if he waits to long it can be a real pain the ass to get into college or uni or anything without qualifications and work experience In relevant fields. Whilst you can fuck around at that age for a bit you definitely need to have GCSEs at a minimum.
escapingfromelba@reddit
Yep, not uncommon.
Often the cure is a girlfriend or mates wanting to do a lads holiday or the limitations on the social life coming home to roost i.e you realise you need to start earning to enjoy yourself and/or see others getting out there doing it.
snavej1@reddit
Some people just don't want to help themselves. My uncle became a gambling addict fifty years ago. People tried to help him but he carried on regardless. He loved the thrill of it. He worked hard and earnt well but still lost most of his money. Now, he is 80 year old and busking on the streets of London. I won't help him anymore.
HollowForgeGames@reddit
Nothing. Do nothing. He's a big boy and can make his own decisions
Not_That_Magical@reddit
He’s 16. Boys that age go through a time where they struggle to stay in education. He’s got plenty of time in his early 20’s to catch up if he wants an education.
teahorza8@reddit
I was in a similar situation as your brother and for various reasons left school without any GCSEs. I was also encouraged by my mum to attend a college part-time college course, which I did. I had little interest in the course and dropped out after a few weeks. This was really inevitable because my heart was not in it.
After working in factory jobs for a few years, I spontaneously made the decision on my own to go back to college when I was 19. It turned out, much to everyone's surprise, that I actually loved studying. I eventually went on to get qualifications and attend university as a "mature" student (at the grand age of 20). After that, I went on to have a great career and my lack of pre-degree qualifications has been a complete non issue.
So based on my own experience, I think it's important your brother doesn't feel forced to go back to school - it just won't work if the decision didn't come from him, because his heart won't be in it. In my case, what prompted me to want to go back into education was the following:
- New-found love of reading about a variety of different topics
- Boredom with my lifestyle and mundane factory jobs
- Seeing friends of my own age going off to university or travelling on gap years - probably the biggest factor honestly
What my parents/siblings thought I should do or what they said to me had absolutely nothing to do with my decision to return to education.
So with all that said, what I personally think would be best would be to talk openly with your brother about what his hopes and dreams are and basically be supportive and a good sounding board for his ideas, but without trying to force him in any direction in particular. Whatever he chooses to do will only work if it's his own decision.
HawkwardGames@reddit
He’s 16, not ruined. The bigger problem is your mum letting him drift with no pressure or structure. If he hates school, fine, but he still needs a route in. Apprenticeship, mechanic, trade, plant work, anything practical. No GCSEs at 16 is recoverable. Doing nothing for years is the real danger.
ClarifyingMe@reddit
Has he ever had an assessment for learning differences?
Melodic-Variation916@reddit
It's not ideal but I think there are some positives. He is working, and will be building a CV of skills that he can refer to in the future. Education is always available to him to him when it's ready. Maybe invest time in doing positive things with him, and model the behaviour that you want to see in him. Expanding his horizons through different experiences and meeting new people might be the way to go
Assassinsaj@reddit
I find everyone in this thread a bit dismissive, honestly. You don’t have to be a parent to your sibling, but at the end of the day, family (as long as it’s healthy) is important. I’ll always be there to help my sister out—she’s one of the people I love most in my life. If you’re willing to go the extra mile for people you care about, let it be your sibling.
You can lead a horse to water, but you can’t make them drink. Maybe spend some time with your brother and ask him what he wants to do. He’s probably sick and tired of being told what to do or being forced into things, but he might just need someone who can see the world the way he does. You’re in the best position to do that since you had a similar upbringing.
Find out what he likes. Maybe spend some time with him every week, just chatting and exposing him to new things.
Rather than pushing him, try explaining what lies ahead. Like others have said, he might grow out of his behaviour—or he might not. Personally, I see it as a sibling’s duty to call them out but also accept their decisions. I know I wouldn’t sleep easy if I didn’t at least try.
Shinjirojin@reddit
Tell him to stop being a tit and get some education then he can decide if he wants to work on a farm
SpeechWeird5267@reddit
I'm just curious and cannot really say much as I'm adrift too, being coddled and entitled*, but what does he like to do? What are his interests and hobbies?
(I need to get out of my privileged and entitled position. But it is difficult to just get a job. )
antiglow@reddit (OP)
He taught himself to play the electric guitar, he loves old 80s rock and old movies, and has started reading Stephen King. He's a bit of a character tbh he could be in a movie lol. He's quite introverted though so I don't think he'd go into a creative field. He does love the tractors/forklift and other machinery so maybe some sort of mechanic is the way to go
stealth941@reddit
WIth the others on stop babying him and tell your mum to also stop but you mentioned he likes fixing things and vehicles... maybe the best course is for him to do an apprenticeship that's manual labour, think electrical, plumbing, automotive, etc.
DapperDouble666@reddit
He'll likely figure it out when he's ready, but your mum coddling him isn't doing him any favours.
Phenomenomix@reddit
Mum is coddling because she’s getting paid to keep him (child benefit) and the farm benefits from the free labour
antiglow@reddit (OP)
She doesn't get child benefits for him anymore but yes the farm definitely benefits
th35ky@reddit
It is clear to me as an outsider that your mother had always planned for him to do farm work as he is not academic and she had that expectation for him. It would appear as though that is not something he is wedded to. This is the problem, this gap was never talked through.
If he has an interest in vehicles and maintenance that should be the route he pursues as he should look for apprentice work in that field. I am sure there are plenty of independents looking for free / cheap labour.
but quite frankly, someone needs to tell him to focus and lock in. Education is a safety net more than anything else, you can continually fuck up your jobs or prospects but because you have those qualifications, other people will take a bet on you, without them, you only have a few chances so he needs to take them.
hkw240595@reddit
I’m a qualified careers adviser working with 16-18 NEETS. Your local authority should have a dedicated NEET careers service, so have a google and see if you can find who they are and how your Mum can refer in. College should have immediately referred to the service but this rarely happens.
We only find out about NEETs from the education establishment they have left, by other professionals working with the young person, or by tracking “not knowns” through phone calls and door knocking.
There is dedicated help out there for him but we need to know he exists first!
Please feel free to message me for some guidance if it would be beneficial.
Redditisarsebollocks@reddit
Tell him to start sucking dicks to make a few quid.
Ok-Visual-8971@reddit
Not all is lost at all, Here are few options, construction - tell him he'll start as a labourer at first, but he can learn things on the way, mechanic - same deal, depending on you how feel, the army, he could become a personal trainer, I hate to admit it but an influencer as a young man he could get quite a sizable following as long as he's either interesting or informative, although you said the farm isn't doing too well he could take on a more hands on approach to the farm, visit other farmers, go to farm meetings, start a farming council, etc. There are loads more.
School is not the only way, or there are many ways to skin a cat.
Don't be fooled into thinking, if he doesn't go to school get a degree get a job his life is over, on the contrary, if he goes about it in the right way his life can be very productive.
Important-Engine-101@reddit
At least he is working. Farming is a career, whether that is labouring or running it etc.
Dogman458@reddit
Try and help him see examples of people you know on both ends of the spectrum. E.g. person A was like him and now does a difficult job/has no job for minimum wage/on JSA. Person B pulled themselves together and did course X and now has an easier life with better pay and a nice car etc. This could help him understand and be motivated to pull himself together. As his older sibling, you’re exactly the right person to be having these conversations with him so well done for wanting to do so
goldsparkleoat@reddit
Idk I see adverts for farmhands and herdpersons on Indeed often and the pay looks pretty good! Who’s to say working on the farm isn’t going to be useful experience?
antiglow@reddit (OP)
It will be! I just mean that he's never been bothered by it but seems to be doing it as its the easy option, so I didn't want him to pigeon-hole himself if in future he realises he doesn't love it and doesn't want that as a career, when he has access to college for free now
Werenotreallyhere86@reddit
He’s 16 sometimes it takes longer for people to find themselves.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
100%, and what I wanted to do at 16 is completely different to what I do now as a career. I think I just worry that college education is no longer free after a certain age, so I think he should at least do a course/apprenticeship and get his GCSEs now to figure himself out a bit. Also for his own personal development as the farm is very rural and he doesn't see any friends or anything, think the life experience would be good for him. But I don't think he needs it all figured out right now
bopeepsheep@reddit
Adults with no higher qualifications can do Functional Skills at any age. There are loans available for Access courses, and free funding in various scenarios at any age, so he's not locked out of going back at any time. https://www.skillsforcareers.education.gov.uk/pages/common/money-and-learning-costs-support
Impetuous_doormouse@reddit
You're his sister, not his mother. I understand that seeing a sibling essentially stagnate is hard (I've been there), but beyond what you *have* done, there's not much you *can* do.
He needs a dose of reality and so does your mum, but as hard as it is to step back, you're going to have to for your own wellbeing and also his.
Due-Presentation4344@reddit
Yes he may do, but good on the OP for caring and being a top sister.
Impetuous_doormouse@reddit
Oh, for sure. No shade on her for caring at all.
Agitated_Ad_361@reddit
You are not mother. I appreciate you want to help but Mum and Brother will (or won’t) learn the hard way.
butwhatsmyname@reddit
Think of it this way:
I'm in my 40s. I've... seen some life.
Probably the best thing that could happen for him is:
Sadly I've seen a lot of young men, enabled by short-sighted parents, who would happily have lived at home being cooked and cleaned for forever, but who were only motivated to change by one good girlfriend (or boyfriend).
It shouldn't be the responsibility of young women to be the reason young men get their lives together, but sadly this is often the case. Especially when their mums secretly want to keep them at home forever.
One thing I will say: buy him a bulk box of condoms. Do it tonight.
Right now he's not very mature, not very responsible, and not thinking about the consequences of his actions. Shower him with condoms. Don't let him fuck himself up even further before he's had a chance to grow up a bit.
volster@reddit
it's natural you'd want to try to help them as best you can, but ultimately you can only help those who want to be helped.
Frankly, the single best thing for your brother would be a short sharp shock of finding themselves unable to get a job and thus afford to live.
Sadly your mother is enabling their behaviour by shielding them from reality - This is unlikely to change any time soon.
If he likes working on vehicles then a mechanic's apprenticeship might be a good fit.
... Although, that seems likely to still run into the same issue as the farming college did with the fundamental problem being their attitude more than anything else, since only having to go in 1 day a fortnight was a pretty cushy number and i doubt anything else would be half so accommodating.
From the way things sound, that seems like the likely scenario - Hopefully they might have a wake-up call at some point, and it's still possible to pursue an education as an adult.... It just becomes harder to fit in around everyday life, and stops being free.
Eventually though you just have to accept that you're not your brother's keeper and it's ultimately his life to squander if he insists on doing so.
After all, if the farms already not exactly doing great - odds are it will be much the same story in the future.... It might improve, but there's been no shortage of farms forced to sell up over the years as the economics have increasingly shifted from family farming to "agribusiness".
Likewise, while not something any of you want to dwell on (and frankly bringing it up would likely be a bad idea) - The simple fact is your parents won't be with you forever. When they pass, even if the farm doesn't get hit by inheritance tax forcing a sale, it's still going to end up being split 4 ways..... Unless their plan is to just disown you and your sisters so they can have it.
As such, the farm is likely not to be there forever, even if they threw themselves into it wholeheartedly ".... what's the plan?"
Hopefully sooner or later they'll come to realise just living on the farm isn't going to be a permanent solution and / or find something they have a genuine interest in.
You've tried and been shot down by your mother, ultimately all you can do is try and be there for him if and when he decides to listen.
Top-Cat-a@reddit
Make sure you don't set yourself on fire to keep him warm.
You can talk to him about it but that's about it. He is required to stay in education till 18 I believe
CR1SBO@reddit
He's got a good few years left before things really set in, but were it my family, I'd encourage learning to either repair equipment, or fabricate things.
Welding is always useful, and farms tend to have equipment that needs fixing
keishajay@reddit
Live your life. I’m sorry for your brother but you are not his parent and I doubt you can override the babying that your mum is giving him.
ClubControlla@reddit
What was he studying at college? I'd suggest a qualification/apprenticeship related to his interests as he'll be far more likely to engage. If he's interested in the machinery/engineering aspects of farming, are there any colleges locally offering Level 2 or 3 Agricultural/Land Based Engineering courses? A quick google should show you options close by.
He'd need GCSEs in Maths and English (and likely one or two others) though. Hopefully he'd be more motivated when working towards a specific goal?
If his interest in machinery extends beyond farming then broader mechanical engineering courses/apprenticeships may be an option too.
I saw someone mention heavy machinery driving courses too which is another good option given his interests.
CodeToManagement@reddit
Look it’s not your problem. Leave it at that and let him sort himself out. If he wants help be there but other than that leave it
I had a pretty rough time with school and missed a lot for various reasons. I left with pretty much no GCSEs, struggled to find what I wanted to do at college and dropped out more than once.
The thing is your brother isn’t even just not sure what to do - he got kicked out because he was being rude and disruptive - that’s a huge issue.
If he wants to get himself together he has options but if he cba then to be honest he gets what he gets out of life. But he has to be the one to want the changes or it will never happen.
evenifihateit@reddit
You should do nothing. He's in education and his parents are satisfied with the current situation.
SignNotInUse@reddit
He's not your problem. I hated school and left with basic GCSEs and failed A-levels. What sorted me out was starting an apprenticeship. Adult education and access courses exist if he ever wants to gain formal qualifications. If not try and nudge him towards practical apprenticeships, one of the best welders I've ever seen could barely read or write but if you gave him a technical drawing he could tell you exactly what sort of weld was needed and all the procedures involved.
SusieC0161@reddit
Just make sure it’s clear that he is not, and never will be, your problem. Set your boundaries and stick to them. It’s not unlikely that at some point in the future your parents will ask you to go out of your way for him purely as a result of him being so dependent. Not your problem.
MinaretofJam@reddit
Have a chat with him. Sounds like he’s not interested in classroom learning and just a bit directionless. Hard to watch someone you care about just float, but he’s probably a bit scared of not knowing what to do. He might enjoy becoming a farmer and a soul destroying job that keeps him cooped up might be worse for him, despite the experience. You said he likes the machinery and fixing things, so maybe ask him to ask neighbouring farmers if he can help them out. Or a local garage. Good luck and good on you for looking out for your brother. He’s still a kid at 16 and we’re meant to help them as older siblings, even when they’re the most annoying people we know :)
Cocobean0875@reddit
My son developed social anxiety and refused to go to school. He doesnt have gcses either. After a few years of being home he has now decided he wants to get out and work. We have found an apprenticeship is the best way forward for him he has decided bricklaying is what he wants to do so is currently pursuing an apprenticeship in bricklaying. He will have to go to college once a week to do his maths and english but its better for him this way and he seems pretty keen to pursue it.
Bright_Arm8782@reddit
Nothing. This isn't yours to solve.
Some people have to learn the hard way and some don't learn at all.
Competitive_Test6697@reddit
Advice is; you've reached a time all older siblings reach when we think we are a surrogate parent that knows everything and needs to advise mothers and siblings on what they should be doing.
They are 16, let them find their feet. Whether that's working a farm or getting an apprenticeship or whatever.
And you can enjoy your life with a little less stress. (Until they really mess up, then be there)
TachiH@reddit
It will be picked up and reported by his school anyway. Secondary schools now have to report where their leavers went. As legally you have to stay in education until 18 now. His college will have done it too. Eventually letters will start turning up asking why he isnt in education, that will be sent to the Mum. Sisters job is to pick on him about being lazy 👌
Competitive_Test6697@reddit
If he's working 20 hours a week then he's fine to leave.
Plugpin@reddit
Only if he's also training while working (apprenticeship).
That's the legal line, in practice it's rarely enforced.
PM_ME_BEEF_CURTAINS@reddit
Very difficult without English and Maths GCSEs
Plugpin@reddit
Lower level apprenticeships (level 2 and 3) will make you take Functional Skills in English and maths if you don't have a pass grade. It's very common and not a barrier to access. The challenge is motivating him to apply and give a crap to invest himself in the learning, assuming he gets accepted.
c-e-r-y-s@reddit
If the candidate is good enough and willing, a lot of apprenticeships offer English and Maths resits/courses in addition to the main course. Source: I had a lot of mates who had very little GCSEs.
Own-Self7619@reddit
My mates a farmer/tractor driver and probably the happiest person in my friendship group. Shit normal hourly rate but double time overtime and he does as many hours as he can, because of this he’s the most well off person in the group too.
HugsandHate@reddit
Well, there's no bloody jobs these days. So I say let him be a farmer. Perfectly fine profession.
niall626@reddit
Apprenticeship
kanben@reddit
Give up, find something better to do with your time
NecessaryCat503@reddit
Maybe he'd be interested in learning a trade? Just ask him what he wants to do and see what he says. I'm sure he'd be able to take on an apprenticeship.
UnIntelligent-Idea@reddit
This sounds almost identical to my brother's life path.
My parents did make him work for my Uncle and he's now a JCB driver. However still lives at home, has a wife and children but proudly boasts he's never changed a nappy.
His life is not your responsibility.
Ponichkata@reddit
16 is still so young.
My older sister was a bit of a wild child and didn't figure out what she wanted to do until her 20s. She worked in retail then decided to go work on cruise ships for 2 years which completely changed her.
She came back and went to college, got a degree and a post-graduate from the open uni and has a steady job and her own house.
Some people take longer to find their own path.
apple_kicks@reddit
Sounds like he would be happier as a mechanic. Or learning how to manage and repair things at farm or elsewhere
But he’s at an age where you should ask him. Treat him as bit more grown up but with experience or guidance needed to go where he wants to explore. If he wants to explore mechanics maybe see if theres hobby groups or training at his age to support him. If it’s something else support that see how it goes in few months
D-1-S-C-0@reddit
You should stop making him your responsibility. People can only be helped if they want to be helped. You'll waste your time, energy and stress hormones.
If he asks for your help and it's something you can do without harming yourself, do it. But otherwise you should let him live his life.
My life was a joke at 16. It was still a joke for several years until I finally started getting my shit together in my 20s. Some people take longer to find their way.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
I can’t help but feel responsible because I care a lot about him and my family. I also have the eldest daughter trope of first in my family to move out the hometown, to go to uni etc so I know what’s out there for him. But yes wanting to conserve my own wellbeing at the same time lol
Hopefully he finds his way!
D-1-S-C-0@reddit
I understand completely. My advice is based on making the same mistake myself, not judgement.
It took me a long time to realise that I should keep my nose out of it and only help when called upon, if it's a reasonable request.
Best of luck to you and your brother. He's still a kid with a lot of growing up ahead of him.
Zealousideal_Bad7664@reddit
My younger sister was like this, I was an overachiever. Now she runs a successful business and I can't afford groceries. GCSEs aren't the be all and end all of anything
Aromatic_Lettuce5603@reddit
I left school with no gcses was kicked out for being a little knobhead but that was because of abuse at home and I suppose was projecting at school and secretly asking for help. I left school at 15 and got a ferry to the isle of wight and grew up fast and learned "street smarts" quickly. Got into a bit of bother then suddenly realised if I wanted anything I had to rely on myself. Got a job had kids and grew up. Now disabled so can no longer work but when I did work I worked 6/7 days a week to provide for my family as a builder. All without 1 gcse to my name. Have my own house and am a proud father of 3 and happy. I guess what im trying to say is that your brother will hopefully sort himself out and probably will. If I can without the leg up of having the farm he will too. So stop worrying yourself and concentrate on you and making your life as happy and fulfilling as you can.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
Hope so! And there’s many successful people out there with no GCSEs but they all have that drive which my brother doesn’t really. But he’s still young so maybe it’ll change
kebabish@reddit
Not your problem. Let yourum deal with it. Then when she passes away let him find out.
I speak harshly because I've watched my wifes family consumed by the same dynamic. Youngest son coddled by his mum and now thinks the world is owed to him, lives abroad while his wife pays for everything yet he sends messages to everyone all the time telling us how we never support him. I hate that loser and feel sorry for his wife. Both of them are idiots for finding each other to be honest.
Due-Presentation4344@reddit
In a similar situation with my SIL, 33, doesn’t drive, lives at home, spending her salary on holidays and handbags.
You can only tell the MIL to be more disciplined but if they aren’t going to lesson there isn’t a huge amount you can do.
However, it’s nice to see the OP care.
kebabish@reddit
Yeah for sure you at least have to try right. I opened my home to my BIL when he was hurting but he took advantage. Started the same drugs and nonsense in my house. Couldn't trust him around my kids and I had to tell him to get out in the end. Now after years of non communication He sending threatening text about how
Realistic-River-1941@reddit
Sounds like he's going to inherit a farm while his educated sisters get replaced by ChatGPT...
antiglow@reddit (OP)
Maybe. Though one of my sisters is a farmer too but she’s branched out and has her own animals, so the farm will probs go to them two
Rough-Sprinkles2343@reddit
I always say a lot of the uneducated people in society is because of shit parenting.
Anyways there’s only so much you can do. He’ll wake up one day realising he’s fucked it because he can’t get out of his shit minimum wage job and is stuck for life.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
My Mums parenting is great tbh. Two of us gone through Uni, we all work, its just my bro she’s been so relaxed with for some reason
Ahh I hope that won’t be the case for him but let’s see
danieljamesgillen@reddit
The technological singularity is well under way, in 1-8 years all human labor will be completely replaced by machines, only the most stand out and intelligent will be able to escape the permanent underclass techno-slavery. Your brother will live till the heat death of the universe, but having a few GCSEs won't make any difference at all.
cooky561@reddit
He should probably invest in skills courses and start a trade. Well paying work that will always be needed, and you don't need a degree to get started.
Reverend_Vader@reddit
Until you see that your mum is the issue nothing will change
Parents enable kids in the way your brother has been so they dont leave the nest (because they can't)
The issue here is not your 16 year old brother
I went through this with my kid, it took a whole lot of effort to get her back into school, then through uni because her mum wanted her around to keep her company (divorced), so she missed an entire year whilst her mum encouraged her to sit around doing nothing and drop out of school
Imagine having one house where "education or job, also do your chores" against, "you just stay here and everything will be done for you"
What do you think a 16yr old will choose?
She was 19 before she was mature enough to see what her mum was doing was 100% for her mums benefit and not hers
Problem is, kids will go to the path of least resistance, so a parent that doesn't encourage learning and career goals, will often win over anyone else trying to get them into the real world where lots of effort is needed
HouseOfWyrd@reddit
All you can do is tell him he should sort his shit out. Beyond that, this is up to him.
Pink_Flash@reddit
He's 16 and its clear from his behaviour hes not going to take advice from anyone.
Its not your responsibility either. Let him grow up first, theres a good chance he could go back to college later for qualifications.
Sluggybeef@reddit
You are right to worry but also there isn't a huge amount you can do. Met a surprising amount of young lads recently that have given up with school to go back on their family farm.
Your parents are coddling him, without English and maths and some degree of education how does he expect to run the business side of things? Unfortunately ro run a succesful farm now you need a lot more than just the ability to work hard
Glittering-Round7082@reddit
You don't have to parent a sibling.
Bennyoj@reddit
“Not interested in the family farm” I’d murder for that opportunity.
Long hours sure, but not the same mundane job day in day out.
For someone who left school with no GCSE’s and was given the opportunity to go to Moreton Morrell college to learn about agriculture I dreamt of being born into a farming family.
I now work 9-5 in finance and it’s boring as shit.
As for helping your bro, another thing I learnt in life is you cannot help anyone who isn’t willing to help themselves.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
Yes the older I get the more I realise how lucky I was to grow up on a farm. Maybe now he’s working on it full time he will get more into it
Sea-Still5427@reddit
A lot of older siblings feel like they have some parental responsibility, but involving yourself can come across as stirring and risks make things worse. By all means talk to your mother but it's her job, not yours. You don't mention your father - is he around or does your mother run the farm on her own?
Not everyone gets on with school. He's only 16 so his brain has another 8-9 years of maturing to do. It sounds like he's keeping himself occupied reasonably productively, not sitting in his bedroom all day gaming, watching inappropriate stuff online and self-medicating with substances, or going out doing antisocial things that might lead to trouble with the police.
Let him find his own way. From what you said, farm machinery might be the way to go, eventually being able to do contract work as well as that side of the farm. No man is happier than digger driver.
antiglow@reddit (OP)
My step dad runs the farm and he is not bothered. It’s quite a traditional family set up where my Mum runs the household alone, and he does the farming. He has O Levels but has also worked on the farm all of his life so he has typical farmer mentality and doesn’t really get out into the world. But he is very passionate about farming whereas my brother never has been which is why it feels a bit different
ZanzibarGuy@reddit
It's something he has to realise himself - it will probably happen in a couple of years and that's the time he would benefit most from any help offered (e.g. like finding the course at the farming college and resitting English and Maths GCSEs). But the whole problem at the moment seems to be disinterest and not wanting to do it, which has resulted in the situation he's in, and there's not much you can do about that until he's at the point where he wants to do it for himself.
GrabbedByTheGhost@reddit
This isn't your problem to fix.
It's on your parents and it's on him. Consequences!
Forsaken-Original-28@reddit
As long as he's not doing anything criminal or getting into drugs I wouldn't be overly worried
antiglow@reddit (OP)
Yeah otherwise he's a really good lad, dead cool and caring. I am the textbook eldest daughter/sister so I'm probs just stressing for nothing haha
ross-dirext-words137@reddit
The good news is he has some life skills. Farming is not going anywhere even without qualification he going to have work available. The issue is the money and hours are brutal and when he is 50 it's going to be a issue
stueynz@reddit
Wait a decade ;. Focus on being his sister;
TheDaemonette@reddit
Your brother’s life choices and prospects are not your responsibility to manage. Everyone has enough to do to keep their own shit together without having to organise someone else, probably against their will. Let him fail. Failure is a valid lesson. As is watching you be successful. The best you can do now is try to get a good example so when he hits bottom and asks you, you have been demonstrating to him all along what ‘good’ looks like.
BusyBeeBridgette@reddit
I hear the Armed forces are recruiting.
pajamakitten@reddit
He still has to want to do that. He will just quit early on if he joins half-heartedly.
Maleficent-Win-6520@reddit
They want skilled people. The days of cannon fodder is long gone.
BusyBeeBridgette@reddit
They still recruit for the combat regiments. Regardless they actually teach trades there from the ground up. It is actually a great way to learn a trade essentially free of charge. Especially if you want to be a mechanic or electrician.
Ok-Middle8656@reddit
Exactly - the military will knock some sense into him. The problem is he sounds like the kind of person who wouldn’t stick it.
hurrdurrswit@reddit
Just help him not grow up to be an angry young man out of work and education who blames others for his own shortcomings
continentaldreams@reddit
Why does a woman have to do that?
thespanglycupcake@reddit
Where does it say a woman has to do that? They say 'help him'...that doesn't mean 'do it by yourself.
MercatorLondon@reddit
He just need to find that one thing that he will be able to do well and comes with relatively low treshhold of entry. You said that he is good with hands/fixing things.
For example welding - quite in demand and relatively well paid. Welding is one of the better-paid trades without needing a degree, and skilled welders are in short supply.
A basic practical welding course is very affordable £100-200? Professional training is not that expensive (under £1,500 for most short programmes) often subsitised by local gov.
DameKumquat@reddit
Just take him out occasionally and do sibling things with him and chat. If you are doing cool stuff because you have money, drop it into conversation. Or if you happen to see an ad for any course he might be interested in.
I assume he can physically get to where courses are?
But otherwise, butt out.
mu5tbetheone@reddit
This isn't your child or your fight. Only he can motivate himself to do better. Your mother clearly isn't interested in rocking the boat and she may have reasons you're not aware of. The only thing you can do is focus on you and make it clear you won't be supporting him financially when he can't get a job in the future.
WaltzFirm6336@reddit
“You can lead a teenage boy to education, but you can’t make them learn.”
Drop the rope. Just make it clear you aren’t going to step in as a financial back up plan in 5,10,25 years. Tbh there is a good chance he’ll return to education once he grows up a bit and can see it’ll earn him more money. But until he wants to do it, there’s nothing you can do.
spynie55@reddit
I think you just have to keep trying and trust that he'll mature and eventually figure out what he wants to do and gets motivated to achieve it. It needs to come from him though I think. Keep the relationship with him, keep giving him suggestions, and keep listening to what he says himself.
DigitalStefan@reddit
Nothing. You do nothing. He’s a big boy now and he has to wear his big boy shoes and tie his own laces.
His success or lack thereof is his business.
Also success isn’t happiness, which not everyone has the ability to grasp as a concept.
If he wants help now, he knows how to ask.
Separate-Frame-7038@reddit
First off I'm going to say it's good that you care and worry about him, country to what other's say. Secondly, you can lead a horse to water, but can't make him drink. A more successful way is to use motivated interviewing style questions, "what do you want out of life?", "And why is that?", "And how are you going to get there?", "Is what you're doing now conducive to that goal?", he needs to feel like it's his decision to take ownership of it, if you or anyone else badgers him he'll feel nagged and do the opposite.
poptimist185@reddit
If your mother tolerates it then there’s pretty much nothing you can do. She needs to be on the same page about not letting him do nothing.
Since he likes fixing vehicles the obvious suggestion could be a mechanic apprenticeship?
No-Championship9542@reddit
Probably need GCSEs but tbh the value of a farm isn't at all in farming, it's the land and the ability to use it to make money, fuck farming. Glamping, campsite, weddings, events, farm shop, cider bar, etc, etc are all valid buisness, your brother has to work out what he wants to do and it makes the most sense from a diversification standpoint to use the resources of the farm to make that happen, farmers are typically generalists and are pretty good at making businesses out of anything. Hell shipping container storage is money for old rope, these are all more profitable ventures than any PAYE job.
LittleDiveBar@reddit
Wild one
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