Can Boss not give me a days off 5 months from now for Special Constable Training?
Posted by Ok_Skill5295@reddit | AskUK | View on Reddit | 103 comments
Hi all, looking for some advice because I’m honestly getting a bit stuck and frustrated with my situation.
I’ve been working at Greggs as a Shift Manager for just over a year now. A while back I applied to become a Special Constable, and after going through all the checks, interviews, and assessments, I’ve finally been accepted. My training starts on 15th May.
The training is mostly weekends (usually 2–3 days every couple of weeks) so I thought it would be manageable alongside work. When I first mentioned it to my manager, he said it would be fine and didn’t raise any issues.
Now the problem: out of nowhere, he’s started pushing back. He’s already saying that in September he “won’t be able to give me the days off” for training. That’s five months away, and he’s basically telling me now that I won’t be able to take around 6 days off in total that month.
I’ve explained that I can’t miss even a single training day, because I’d have to redo it at a later date, which I really want to avoid. I’ve also reminded him that this was discussed earlier and agreed in principle.
For context, I’m on a 5-day-a-week contract, and I’m not asking for random time off, this is structured training with dates given well in advance for the whole year.
It’s got to the point where I’ve told him I might have to either transfer to another shop or hand in my notice before September if we can’t sort this out.
Has anyone dealt with something similar? Any advice on how to handle this properly before it escalates? Not sure if I’m being unreasonable here or if I should push back harder.
Thanks in advance.
InsurancePurple4630@reddit
It's a shame you're going to be sick for 6 days in 5 months time. I hope you get better.
cloud__19@reddit
Not only have they already altered their manager but they want to be a special constable where trust and integrity are key. I don't think this is a great idea.
CrabAppleBapple@reddit
How exactly do you think they'll find out? OP's current manager isn't going to tell them.
cardiffman100@reddit
Are you sure a pissed-off vindictive Gregg's manager who has to cover a shift at the last minute isn't going to just tell the police force where OP works that OP lied in order to do the training?
TomatoMiserable3043@reddit
Never underestimate the potential bitterness of a grumpy manager.
clrthrn@reddit
If you think Police staff don't pull sickies then you're sadly mistaken.
cardiffman100@reddit
Of course they do it. And if they are caught "pulling sickies" they get fired just like in many other jobs where honesty is paramount. What's your point?
Thomasinarina@reddit
The difference is they've already advertised they want the time off prior to going sick in this instance.
clrthrn@reddit
And what a weird and unfortunate coincidence that they got sick that week! Honestly OP is a shift leader for Greggs, I am fairly sure they could go get another job pretty easily as a supervisor elsewhere and have none of this to worry about.
Thomasinarina@reddit
Yeah that isnt how it works. Misconduct outcomes are based on the balance of probability, its highly likely the OP would lose their job in this instance if the manager was inclined to pursue the matter.
I agree they should perhaps find work elsewhere.
TomatoMiserable3043@reddit
SCs aren't staff, they're police. Point still stands, though.
cloud__19@reddit
I think getting caught for it on your training is a bad look.
InsurancePurple4630@reddit
Police staff here. It's all lip service.
OdinForce22@reddit
It used to be.. but there's more scrutiny now.
InsurancePurple4630@reddit
It what's they want the media to believe
OdinForce22@reddit
Maybe your force is one of the ones not bothered then.
cloud__19@reddit
Getting caught on your training day seems like a poor start.
Ok_Skill5295@reddit (OP)
🤣🤣🤣
yes1402@reddit
Don't call in sick. He will have it on record you said you are sick, and then it will be on record that you attended the training. He can use this against you till forever, especially since you want to get into a force where integrity is key. In my line of work, that lie will ruin you. Don't do it.
Resign, or transfer to another job. Or get HR involved
Broccoli--Enthusiast@reddit
It's Greggs mate. Nobody is looking at your Gregg's attendance record
yes1402@reddit
Do you work for the police. Do you know their policies. Do you know if this person wants to rise one day to be chief constable or police commissioner. It will come to bite him in the ass. Not worth it in my books
CrabAppleBapple@reddit
You're delusional if you don't think every single chief constable or police commissioner has done worse than pull a sicky at Greggs.
Stableclose367@reddit
Calling in sick to Greggs is not going to affect a potential promotion within the police in a decades time, Jesus Christ lol.
Bert1701@reddit
I can imagine the scandal now "Police Commissioner ABANDONS Greggs to train as PCSO". He'll never recover from such bad publicity.
Sgt_major_dodgy@reddit
Oh bloody hell!
He'll never get that stain from his record, he phoned in fake sick at GREGGS (of all the places he should have known better) it'll follow him for life.
Get a fucking grip.
EasilyExiledDinosaur@reddit
Honestly its sad, but this is probably the way...
Prologic87@reddit
You would have to check the companies policies as well as your own holiday allowance.
It definitely seems like your manager is being unreasonable, but it's hard to say if they are still acting within company policies.
Certainly if you have earned holiday you are entitled to take it before the year is over. But as far as I understand you don't have a right to take it at any specific time legally speaking.
Tbh you work at Greggs. If you are interested in the police then just join as a regular. It pays a lot more and has significantly better career progression. I'm not sure why you would want to be a volunteer for a job that would hire you full time and pay you more than you get now.
TomatoMiserable3043@reddit
To see if you like it before joining full time, which is something a lot of specials do.
Prologic87@reddit
Fair answer, but tbh if I worked at Greggs I'd probably already be confident that I'd like the police more.
TomatoMiserable3043@reddit
The grass is always greener. Sometimes, I'd rather handle pasties than some of the things I have to put my hands on.
Background_Rule_2483@reddit
Honestly, you’ve given him over 4 months notice and it’s for public service, so I’d take that top comment’s advice and go straight to HR to check their actual policy before letting him gaslight you. And if that fails, a sudden bout of illness for those 6 days is a classic backup plan for a reason.
Lazy-Objective-1630@reddit
I wonder why he's done a U turn. Especially this far away from it. Have you upset him in some way? Or I wonder if he's gone to clear this with higher ups and they've told him he should never have agreed to it or something, or maybe one of his preferred mates now wants that time off and you've been pushed out. Seems like there's more to this story.
Put the request for that time off in writing and keep a copy. Make sure you put in the request that you would like the decision in writing too, so whatever reason he gives he has to give you a hard copy of why or why not. If it's bullshit - such as him trying to say you're short staffed or there are already too many off or blah blah when it's clearly not the issue then you can take it up with HR. Might also be an idea to request (if you haven't got one) a copy of the company employee handbook or a copy of the company holiday request rules. If HR take his side then you can contact ACAS and see what advice they can give you.
Of course all of this will put you at odds with him from now on so be ready for that, but if he's being a twat with you now anyway then you've lost nothing.
No-Jicama-6523@reddit
He can, employers can dictate exactly when you use your annual leave.
Even if you’d booked the exact days, he could cancel the leave with sufficient notice, which at this point is all of the training days.
It’s impossible to know if he is genuinely aware of issues in September (perhaps he expects some young employees to be moving away) or has somehow decided he doesn’t want you to be a special constable.
Greggybread@reddit
Ultimately, this is a stop-gap job, your Special Constable Training is your future. And as somebody below said, if you've been there less than 2 years and they are being tossers about it, they can get rid of you. Remember how little they care about you when you make your decision. You owe them nothing.
TomatoMiserable3043@reddit
I hope not. SCs are unpaid volunteers.
escapingfromelba@reddit
It can be a good way into the police and frankly if you don't go down that route, it's more than likely to be good in interviews compared to Greggs.
Greggybread@reddit
Whoops, edited. Thought it was police training.
Y_ddraig_gwyn@reddit
Find out what Greggs’ policy is on public-service opportunities such as this, if necessary by asking at regional or national level.
Helpful_Elderberry91@reddit
If the rest of the suggestions here fail then can't you book them as holiday? Be pretty hard for your manager to justify not approving the holiday 5 months out.
ci_newman@reddit
The OP wants to book three or four consecutive weekends off in a single month. That'd be a hard no from me as a manager too as it places an unfair burden on the other staff and likely against company policy anyway.
St2Crank@reddit
Personally don’t see the issue, especially being so far in advance. They have to take them at some point and this means there’s less competition the rest of the year. One of my team took basically all of October off last year, no issues. Might have been different if they were asking for August as that’s a busy time everyone wants holidays.
I think the issue here is OP, seems to have mentioned some holiday they’d want months ago, but is now asking for days off with basically 3 weeks notice
kelleehh@reddit
I do wonder if OP had put it as holiday and not said what it was for which then would it have been approved?
Skulldo@reddit
I'm assuming that's what they are doing isn't it?
dandanjeran@reddit
lmao bro you shouldn't give a crap what they say at this point. Your boss is just seething with jealously because they have to be a Greggs wench forever while you're doing something bigger with your life.
Same kinda stuff happened to me while I was working retail after uni before I got a professional job, it's complete crab bucket mentality.
Just go to the training anyway and give it your all, you've already been accepted, worst case they sack you and you sign onto the dole and have to tighten your belt for a while.
In a year's time your old boss will be an annoying footnote in your life and you'll be onto bigger and better things.
Legitimate-Dream-111@reddit
It's funny, you don't talk like a professional, you sound like a petulant child.
dandanjeran@reddit
What a sad little life, randomly generated reddit name
ChanceHovercraft1754@reddit
In a years time ops boss will still be their boss and having told them to sod off won't make that any better.
behemuffin@reddit
Special constable is a voluntary, unpaid, part time role. They're still gonna be working at Greggs!
barrowbyman@reddit
Speak to H. R I think they should be pleased regarding your desire for Public service. If they don't, any publicity would be detrimental.
Carvery@reddit
I don’t fully know your situation so maybe this isn’t possible. But drop that Greggs job on its head. You’ve got a good shot at decent training and career ahead of you. Don’t let fast food & sausage rolls get in the way of it. If you can find ANY Monday to Friday job that allows you to continue training that just do that instead. Follow your heart and don’t look back. When you look back on your life will you be pleased you stayed at Greggs? I’m not knocking anyone that works there, but fuck letting it get in the way of something you want.
ci_newman@reddit
Special Constables are an unpaid, volunteer role. It definitely isn't a future career move.
Carvery@reddit
It can lead into a career in the police though right?
CantaloupeThis1217@reddit
Sounds like you've got to go full diplomatic but firm, mention HR and see if Greggs has a corporate policy that overrides your manager's whims.
spiralphenomena@reddit
Unlike reservist training, special constable training isn’t protected under law, I would say you’re only option if he isn’t being reasonable is to transfer to another location
EasilyExiledDinosaur@reddit
Interesting fact that reservist training is protected by law and employers cant do anything about it. Kinda cool to know.
Substantial_Day7447@reddit
Sort of. Employers have no obligation to allow reservists time off for training. They just cannot discriminate/make redundant because of training or deployment.
EasilyExiledDinosaur@reddit
Basically, you can't be fired for saying "i have reservist training for 3 days next week and cant come to work" and if they proceed to fire you supoodedly for another reason, you probably have pretty good grounds for a tribunal.
Jezbod@reddit
It also does not affect your benefits, I was claiming when I first joined the TA, and I just had to declare the income and time worked.
EstoppelByWaffle@reddit
While it doesn’t help OP now, there is work being done to change that.
https://asco.police.uk/our-work/s50/
spiralphenomena@reddit
It would be nice if they could roll other emergency service voluntary roles into it too; RNLI, FREC etc
lovinglifeatmyage@reddit
Can’t u book annual leave for those days?
becooldocrime@reddit
I’d escalate it up the chain, and I’d go from the “it’s unfortunate that Greggs doesn’t support staff to donate their time to such an essential role for the public good” angle.
Silvagadron@reddit
I agree. It's not like you're going off for training at another corporation; it's a public service job. The rags would go wild over a story like that and OP could end up gracing r/compoface if they're lucky!
ElusiveCrab@reddit
Its greggs lmao just tell them youre doing the training and if they sack you just walk into one of the other 500 retail jobs on the same street
Willing_Coconut4364@reddit
You've given plenty of notice, just forward this to HR and let them know you won't be working on those days and your managed initially agreed. He has plenty of time to get cover sorted. Then just go to your training.
ci_newman@reddit
This is awful advice. Businesses have the legal right to reject leave requests for non-protected reasons. SC training is NOT a protected characteristic. This behaviour is likely to result in him being sacked.
SomeHSomeE@reddit
Good way to get sacked tbh
ShowmasterQMTHH@reddit
If he's a branch manager, then you may need to givd him the benefit that he may be out of his depth and not looking for a bit of guidance. Tell him again that it's 6 months away and suggest that he should talk to his regional manager or HR dept and ask what help they can offer the branch to cover the leave. Try to sound empathetic to him. If he's being a dick about it, then you can make a decision to either look for a move, or change Jobs, or maybe you ask your HR dept what their policy is on this kind of specialised leave with such a long lead time.
chin_waghing@reddit
Push it to HR, and also speak to your force about employer supported policing. It’s a “partnership” where you get days off for policing.
Days off are not protected by law so it’s a shame, but best bet is HR opposed to manager
Zestyclose-Turn-3576@reddit
"Gosh, I wouldn't have thought you'd want the branch to be known as being unfriendly to the Police"
Chargerado@reddit
He’s obviously a criminal, get your police colleagues to investigate him.
spokenwealth@reddit
You've given enough notice. You're planning to leave anyway. Push back and be firm. Don't take shit from these people.
BDbs1@reddit
Legally. OP doesn’t have a leg to stand on.
IhaveaDoberman@reddit
"Give me these dates off or I will leave" is very much a leg to stand on, and equally legal.
BDbs1@reddit
Of course, completely agree. And they can then legally say “fine bye”.
silverfish477@reddit
What insanely stupid advice.
Odd_Scar836@reddit
I would speak to other shift managers now and ask them to cover for you on those days in advance and then just swap shifts with them when the time comes
Iforgotmypassword126@reddit
I’d reach out to HR.
If he and they push back and say time off in September it’s approved, say no worried you’ll speak to the police and sort something out.
Then hand your notice in literally just enough time so you can have that day off, focus on finding another role in the meantime.
SomeHSomeE@reddit
They have no legal obligation to allow you time off for volunteer work. If your contract requires you to work shifts at reasonable business request, and you can't or won't, then refusing to do so can be disciplinary and ultimately grounds for dismissal. Even easier if you've been there less than 2 years as they don't need to bother following a fair process.
As Greggs is a big corporate entity see if you can find somewhere if they have volunteering policy. Lots of big companies do and may provide a hook to argue for it.
Junior_Lab1650@reddit
But if he is simply booking holiday and they refuse then he can engage HR.
SomeHSomeE@reddit
Employers can turn down holiday requests. They can even dictate when you take your holidays (although very few do).
Hazzadcr16@reddit
Depending on OP's contract the job can reject your holiday request though. They can bring it up with HR, but if there's a business justification work can reject holiday requests.
Inevitable-Chance-8@reddit
Can uou not book leave in advance? Check with ACAS but i believe there is a formula for how much nitice uouu need to guve and whilst yhey can reject with good reasiin itnis not often that a business will stop you taking leave with 5 months notice inless other staff are already off
box-o-locks@reddit
Doesn't it feel like you're getting a sore throat?
Ok_Skill5295@reddit (OP)
🤣🤣🤣
SkeletorOnLSD@reddit
Can you not put holiday days in? They should allow that.
kelleehh@reddit
Sounds like the boss doesn’t want you to go and is trying to keep you there. Either move on or just go sick. Your boss is being selfish and only thinking of the impact on them.
TheRiddlerTHFC@reddit
Seems quite simple to me.
Request the holiday. If they say no, hand in your notice and see how they do without you completely.
Saying no holiday for a whole month is insane
TheTreeDweller@reddit
As someone else is suggesting, try approaching the manager again, but offer a common ground, if youve already told them the reason and they know they'd potentially struggle whilst you, assuming a key team member is off, suggest you're happy to do your other shifts on the remaining days at longer hours to try and be reciprocal in helping out. Also ensure you communicate it in a way that can be recorded if anything unfair or adverse is coming from it ( email/text).
Obviously if it doesn't go to plan, you then raise it a level above or with HR.
I know people are also saying don't bother the manager has shown their colours, but ultimately, the managers job is to tender to the needs of the business, and unfortunately, holiday requests aren't binding without permission.
But yeah, try to work together for an easier life and less friction, goes a long way.
geeered@reddit
Mostly weekends? I'm not sure how it works for Greggs and guess it depends on your location - but a lot of food and retail places expect all staff to work a certain number of weekend days a month. Someone mostly having weekend days off as holiday means other staff have to work even more weekends themselves.
Though, I also wonder if it's actually because your manager might have to work more weekends themself.
Do you know if other people have booked holiday off in September already?
It's also commonly 'first come first served'. When I've been in jobs that it mattered, I'd often get important dates in on January 2nd, to the annoyance of someone who thought they were being proactive and booking their holiday dates in February.
Gorpheus-@reddit
Happened to me. Boss didn't want to cover my holidays. I handed in my notice and got another job. The boss had to cover the shifts that I wanted off, and all the extra ones until they found a replacement. Likely took a few months.
Lonely-Job484@reddit
Are you trying to book 6 days of annual leave, or are you trying to get some kind of other leave for this?
I can't imagine September is a particularly crazy month for Greggs, so I'd be asking what the business reason for not approving the leave is... Obviously there might be some - e.g. student casual workers disappearing for college/uni, others having planned leave on same days, etc etc, but they should be able to articulate them if they know they can't approve.
allthingskerri@reddit
Push through greggs HR - submit your dates first have them declined. Go to them and say 'i have asked for x days off to support training needs. If I can not have these days as holiday I would like to discuss alternative options with a hr representative as I do not believe my manager is up for a discussion' Greggs is a big business and while the HR is there to protect the business they won't want managers acting to their own rules.
Lion-Resident@reddit
Are you using your annual leave for these days off or just asking for the days off and expecting to be paid?
hhfugrr3@reddit
I had this when i was at uni. I wanted some time off to study for my final exams. Manager told me that it showed I wasn't committed to the job - I worked part time in a DIY shop. I had a chat with a manager at another local shop and arranged to transfer there. Unless you're looking to make a career at Greggs, I'd prioritise the special constable training personally.
Available-Spray2576@reddit
Can't you take holiday you will have earned by then?
clrthrn@reddit
I'd try one more time with the manager and if no luck, try HR. But if you do that, the manager will be a prick to you for going over their head esp if they have an issue with police. Start looking for another job but make sure you mention the training at the job offer stage so they take you on with their eyes open.
Whithorsematt@reddit
Manager is already being a prick though. I'd try and have a conversation about why the availability is so bad - other colleagues might already have the time booked. I might also have a bad cough coming on, that might take e.g. 5 months to get really bad.
clrthrn@reddit
FWIW, I worked for Tesla back in the day and one of my colleagues was a Special Constable. If Tesla, (a company so tight with staff time that they got upset that I intended to use all my maternity leave), can allow the time for an SC to train then Greggs can manage it.
octoberforeverr@reddit
Unfortunately they can dictate your holidays, as long as it’s in line with your contract and they give you the correct amount of leave, they can choose when you take it. They could tell you to take all your leave right now and have none for the rest of the year — terrible management, perfectly legal.
That said, a decent manager who doesn’t want to lose their member of staff should try to work with them to come to an agreement.
If not then you’re right that your options are to resign or find another role that will permit you the leave.
my_peen_is_clean@reddit
greggs won’t care about specials mate, either swap shifts or leave. customer service jobs are replacable
a-liquid-sky@reddit
You need to look at your company's policies and/or speak to HR. Not ask reddit.
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