How important is it that center of gravity is inline with barrel?
Posted by arstarsta@reddit | Firearms | View on Reddit | 22 comments
Saw a marketing gimmick where a gun was standing on the muzzle brake to demonstrate the gun was well balanced.
The reasoning was that if the center of gravity was inline with the barrel the recoil goes straight back and have less up and down movement. How true is that and would a shooter feel a difference if the center of gravity where say one inch under the barrel all other things equal.
sobrietyincorporated@reddit
Was this the Rhino? A revolver is going to be 20x more recoil no matter what.
Special_EDy@reddit
There are several important factors which relate to muzzle rise. They can probably be divided in to two torque forces:
Bore Axis over Center of Gravity, and the Moment of Inertia. If the bore is directly in line with the center of gravity, there is no torque when fired, and the firearm is propelled directly backwards with no muzzle rise. This isnt usually the case, and even if it was, CoG would change as the magazine depletes. So the angular velocity or muzzle rise of the firearm is the distance above the CoG the bore is, multiplied by the moment of inertia. Moment of inertia is the distribution of mass away from the CoG. On firearms, a muzzle brake, brass/steel magwell, frame-weight, flashlight, or compensator will add mass at an extreme end of the firearm far away from the CoG, this greatly increases the Moment of inertia. Like swinging a hammer by the head instead of the handle.
Bore axis above the center of rotation of the shooter. The firearm is not freely floating in zero gravity, but is instead being gripped by you. The recoil impulse could be directed perfectly rearward, but this force will ultimately be absorbed by the shooter's hands, wrists, shoulder, abdomen, and legs. With a pistol, the bore is always above your hands and wrists, and the recoil will always try to rotate the shooter's hands, wrists, and arms upwards due to the resulting torque. With a rifle, the vector of the recoil force is imparted on the shoulder. If the bore us above the center of the shoulder pad, the rifle will rotate upwards when fired. Even if all other torque are neutralized, the force is pushing rearwards on the upper body of the shooter, and this force is trying to tip the shooter over backwards or their feet.
JustSomeGuyMedia@reddit
Not really important, but you do notice if a weapon is particularly top heavy.
Leroy1864@reddit
Yeah it can get tiring to hold a super light gun with a heavy scope.
EstablishmentFull797@reddit
Recoil always goes “straight back”
Muzzle rise happens when the bore axis is above where the gun is being supported/held, causing it to rotate.
The AR-15 has little muzzle rise because the bore axis is in a straight line with the stock.
If you want a demonstration of this. Shoot an over/under shotgun one barrel at a time and you’ll see which barrel causes more perceived recoil and muzzle rise. (There is a reason that when you are shooting doubles that you fire the bottom barrel first)
RacerXrated@reddit
It certainly effects things but beyond something like a Hi Point, I don't really concern myself with it.
Kromulent@reddit
i'll disagree with almost everyone here and say, sure, it matters in a handgun
push something in line with the center of gravity and it moves straight back. push it out of line with the cg and it rotates
how much it matters is harder to say because there are other factors involved which might exert much more of an influence. the cg of the entire system - gun and hand - is what really matters, and biomechanical stuff has a large influence. in plain english, if the gun comes back comfortably into the hand, it's right, even if the gun's cg was not directly in line
Pafolo@reddit
The center of gravity on the rifle and where the bore in relation to the center line of the stock is are two different things.
arstarsta@reddit (OP)
As it balances on muzzle it's center if gravity and not stock.
HALF-PRICE_@reddit
No it is center of bore. Not stock.
arstarsta@reddit (OP)
Yes center if gravity is on center of bore.
Sweet_Swede_65@reddit
In theory, it would help, but probably not noticeably. The main force acting against recoil is the shooter's shoulder pressing into the buttstock, so the moment arm between the buttstock center of effort and barrel center of effort will be the most important factor. After that, the mass of the gun will do a lot more to extend and lower the recoil impulse. I don't think the mass could be practically large enough to appreciably notice a difference, since it would also lower free recoil.
Proper shooting techniques/grips are much more important and muzzle devices can be used to tune recoil rise, which would be prefereable to any compromises in gun design to get the center of mass aligned with the bore.
sheafflestout@reddit
Ah yes! It's all about the angle of the dangle.
-PringlesMan-@reddit
It is a neat party trick, I guess. But also not that special. The real trick is balancing one on its stock, and then putting another one on top of it, muzzle to muzzle.
Agammamon@reddit
Not at all.
What is important - insofar as its important - is that the *recoil is in line through the gun straight into the shoulder*. This is for recoil control and means less muzzle rise. Its why the AR pattern rifles of any caliber are so nice compared to the older style of stock that dips down, raising the rifle (and thus the line of recoil) above the point where the stock is braced against the shoulder.
gameking514@reddit
Yeah look up videos of people shooting rhino revolvers those actually use that same concept and cutout a lot of the muzzle rise by making where the bullet comes out of lower on the gun so it’s closer to your hand and goes backwards instead of flipping up as much as
arstarsta@reddit (OP)
The question is if that is because of the gun or more because of the wrist.
HALF-PRICE_@reddit
Here is your problem. My wrist or yours. The mechanics are different for every shooter.
ceapaire@reddit
That's not center of gravity though, that's bore height.
gameking514@reddit
I think it does something similar that or its just something that helps when you put a can on it to make the gun equally balanced so it doesn’t feel lopsided in your hands to hold then🤔
Alita-Gunnm@reddit
It will help reduce muzzle rise, but there are other ways to do that as well.
Winner_Pristine@reddit
Sounds like marketing BS to me.