Upgrading everything other than GPU when GPU bottlenecked
Posted by jenkemhuffer@reddit | buildapc | View on Reddit | 37 comments
Current build is a RTX 4090 with a 10900k. I play games on 1440p ultrawide (3440x1440p).
Will shortly be upgrading to 4k ultrawide (5120x2160) and will definitely be GPU bottlenecked.
However, I'm wondering if I would get a notable performance gain despite the GPU bottleneck from upgrading the following:
CPU 10900k -> 9800X3D (2 less cores, but 3D V-Cache)
Mobo with PCI 3.0 -> PCI 5.0 (3.0 potentially bottlenecking 4090)
SSD with PCI 3.0 -> PCI 5.0
RAM DDR4 -> DDR5
Would this materialize a performance gain? any clue what kind of % range?
TheOmegaFalcon@reddit
At 4k, compared to your current setup, you wont notice shit dude
jenkemhuffer@reddit (OP)
"4k ultrawide" or 5k2k is 33% more pixels than 4k
I'm wondering if the compounded gain is 10%, that's definitely noticeable.
beirch@reddit
10% gains is noticeable by reading the FPS counter, not in actual gameplay.
And I doubt you'd even get 10% at 4K UW. Maybe you'd see some 1% lows gains, but I'm 99% sure you won't see max FPS gains.
aragorn18@reddit
At your resolution, the GPU is the limiting factor in the vast majority of situations, even with an RTX 4090. Feel free to upgrade. It will help you with 1% lows. But, you won't see a significant improvement in average frame rates.
HankHippoppopalous@reddit
Not a chance you're seeing 10% gains with this. The 4090 was built for 2021 architecture. The 119000K is 2021 architecture.
gains will be there in the 1% but thats kinda it - not in your top FPS
TheOmegaFalcon@reddit
Which means it will be even more gpu bounded. At 4k and above, the cpu is almost useless
FlatImpact4554@reddit
Yea idk what he's talking about
maniacalmayh3m@reddit
You are GPU bound unless we are talking about the handful of competitive games and solo games that are cpu intensive. Ultra wide 4K will just make you even more GPU bound. Your 1% lows will improve but man… I don’t think it’s worth it.
Accomplished_Rip_362@reddit
Dude I play 5k2k with a Strix 3090 still and a 12700K. It's fine.
zman6116@reddit
Came from a 12700K to a 7800X3D. In games that are cache sensitive, it was up to a 30% improvement. The PCI 3.0 for GPU/SSD won’t make that big of a difference, but the v-cache will for gaming. The biggest improvement you will notice is the dramatic decrease of heat output by the CPU
Wooshio@reddit
If you look at the 9800X3D benchmarks here with the 4090 there was 10 FPS gain over the i7-11700KF at 4K (which performs about the same as the 10900k). So that's probably the ballpark FPS gain you'd be looking at in most games. Unless you play the few games a lot that really benefit from X3D cache like Factorio or MS Flight Simulator. But it would be hard to justify jumping platforms for 10 FPS (for me at least) especially with the DDR5 prices being what they are right now.
FlatImpact4554@reddit
How you going to be bottlenecks i do not understand ? As pixel count goes up less answer less strain is on your CPU and more and more on your GPU. Your probably more bottleneck at lower resolution than. I have buddies using 5090s and 5000 series X3D ryzens 6 core processors as long as you stay in 4k . But under that your going to be mega back in that cpu for your display opposed to using your hefty GPU
Consistent-Tap-4255@reddit
4090 can probably handle 5K2K for 95% of the games.
No-Independence3028@reddit
Up the CPU To AMD Ryzen 9600X / 7700 / 7800X3D instead, 9800X3D is not necessary
Whole-Scene-689@reddit
you know you are gpu bottleneck ed
you can sell your 4090 and buy a 5090 for maybe a extra ~$1k paid or so
instead youre gonna pay 1.5x-2x that upgrading literally everything else?
BeginningProperty436@reddit
As Gamers Nexus covered in this video, there is less than 5% gains made going from 3.0 to 5.0.
theRealtechnofuzz@reddit
it will help yes. I don't how much. If you use DLSS upscaling it will help alot more.
misteryk@reddit
PCIE 3.0 would make difference mainly for cards with only 8x lanes and low amount of VRAM like 8gb entry level card. So an 8x lane 5060 with 8gb of VRAM will hurt much more than card like 4090. If fact on 4090 it will be like maybe 1-3% so nothing you'd notice anyway.
As for SSD in most games you wouldn't even spot difference between SATA and M.2. PCIE3.0 vs 5.0 will make even smaller difference
The CPU and ram it will obviously be better.
As for performance if i had to guess, if you run 4k native i wouldn't be surprised if you'd actually lost performance (fps) compared to 10900k in 1440p as you'll most likely will be GPU bottlenecked anyway in 4k
but even in bottleneck 9800x3d would help with 1% lows so it's not like it's a total waste
I found 1 guy who actually tested this combo, 10900k would be more than enough for 4k 4090 https://youtu.be/7_MOzBZCXZM?si=POwqaMaASqd9tn6f
jmc0053@reddit
I can say for sure the only advantage my m.2 has over my sata is the read write speed for downloading games and updates. For the actual gaming performance side it’s pretty non noticeable
StealthXpress94@reddit
I don't understand the 2 less cores thing, the 10900k is 8 cores and the 9800x3d is 8 cores too.
jenkemhuffer@reddit (OP)
10900k is 10 cores. i9 was changed to 8 cores for 11900k.
StealthXpress94@reddit
Ah my bad, core count doesn't matter as games rarely use above 8 cores. Plus you don't need pcie 5 ssd's produces more heat and you're paying more than just using a pcie 4 ssd.
VersaceUpholstery@reddit
Pcie version is not making a performance difference at all
Faster SSD is not impacting loading times or game performance
RAM upgrade is irrelevant because it’s not a cpu where you could use either, like Intel 12th-14th Gen. you’re buying it because you’re forced to buy it because you need it for the new cpu, which:
The 9800x3d might give you better 1% lows, but that’s about it. The fps gain will not be drastic or noticeable
iam-X@reddit
No meaningful gain imo
definitlyitsbutter@reddit
It depends on expectation, games and resolution.
If you run native raster in wqhd or 5k2k, For the money you spend, your gains will be rather small, but you will get them. What you will get will be much better 1% lows with the x3d cache, so even if your average fps will not go up, it will feel much smoother.
But as soon as you activate DLSS, your gpu renders internally in a much lower resolution. So even if your display is in 4k for example, the game is internally rendered in 1440p or 1080p, depending on your targeted fps. And here you will see bigger gains.
So you will get more performance, but propably not as much as someone spending that money to go from a lowend gpu to a highend one.
If you pull the trigger, run before and after benchmarks, with and without dlss to give orientation for others...
Powerful-Ad2869@reddit
correct me if im wrong but im pretty sure changing from pcie 3 to 5 on a 4090 is like 1% extra performance
ime1em@reddit
Depends on the game.
But according to this, expect around 10fps difference give or take. https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-7-9800x3d/20.html
jenkemhuffer@reddit (OP)
Thanks for this.
I've cross referenced another of their benchmarks (here)[https://www.techpowerup.com/review/amd-ryzen-7-7800x3d/21.html] to see that 10900k and 11900k are basically interchangeable for comparison purposes.
With that, the performance uplift from 11900k to 9800x3d at 4k is >8%.
ime1em@reddit
If u play cpu dependent games like MSFS, the cpu upgrade should benefit greatly
MISSINGPLUGDOOR@reddit
At 4k you are not fixing a bottleneck but you are fixing the gap in requirements Take battlefield as an example ..the recommended requirement for ultra 4k is a 12900 and 14900 for competitive 4k
Bottleneck is not the problem
Lunam_Dominus@reddit
9800x3d crushes 10900k in every workload, the 2 less cores is quite irrelevant. Upgrading your cpu probably will get you better performance because of overhead.
SSD speed doesn't matter in typical situations - you'll only notice it when copying and loading huge files (and I mean HUGE). It's nice to have, but I'd stick to PCIe 4.0. It's quite a bit cheaper, size is much more important than speed.
CtrlAltDesolate@reddit
1% lows will be a little better, don't expect more than a handful more average fps though
Beneficial-Ranger238@reddit
Probably not a $1000+ worth of gain, but I guess if $80-100 a frame is worth it to you, then by all means.
Like others have said, probably more of a higher average by bringing up lows, but your cpu is doing little work in 4k.
I think you’re in a strong enough position to wait out the next gen of amd.
9okm@reddit
Might help with 1% lows but I doubt very much.
Get the new monitor first and see how it goes.
AwayReplacement7063@reddit
You’ll definitely see a gain. Most likely at 1% lows and a little bit on overall frames, if you already play 1440 or 4k
Yoruha01@reddit
Idk if anyone can tell you how much of an increase you'll get but yeah the 3d v cache of the 9800x3d should net you big gains. Not to mention your doubling your ram speed.
dataset-poisoner@reddit
bro's a hammerhead shark