ULPT- how to get even with a customer who stole $1500 worth of labor
Posted by Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit | UnethicalLifeProTips | View on Reddit | 63 comments
Hello fellow petty people-
So here’s my story. Customer hired my small business to do a home renovation and we gave her a quote which she agreed on. As we were halfway done she added an extra $1500 worth of labor and materials, to which we told her we would have to total up the extra stuff she added and send her a new invoice. We sent it to her 10 days before her project was completed. She was disgruntled about the price and said she wanted everything completed before she would issue the final payment. Well, we finished it, and now she is refusing to pay saying that she’s having an insurance adjuster come and will have to do a reconciliation of costs (insurance adjuster? For what? It was flooring and painting and countertops? That is a lie she’s just trying to intimidate me) and I can tell she runs all her messages through an AI chatbot and disregards everything I have to say and only focuses on what she wants to talk about instead of the fact we did a weeks worth of labor for free basically and cut her a huge deal already.
I drafted a demand letter, and am threatening court but she’s just ignoring all my messages now that she got her new updated place for a fraction of the cost. She intentionally strung us along about paying and now she’s being a bitch. I want to piss her off and make her life miserable for all the stress she put us through and all the money we potentially lost on this job. I have never met such a scammy, ungrateful pos in my life. Thanks in advance for your suggestions!
Popular-Drummer-7989@reddit
Put a mechanics lien on get house
SurrrenderDorothy@reddit
It doesnt work. You have to renew it yearly.
Popular-Drummer-7989@reddit
It works tolo screw her credit
LoomLove@reddit
I would pay that $200 every year out of spite.
Kwynn84@reddit
Absolutely file a lien. Consider doing this as a standard part of your contract, by starting with a preliminary notice advising the measures that will be taken should they not pay upon completion. Add a clause for any change orders that come up during the project etc. Do not eat this!!
ironicmirror@reddit
Make sure to reference finance charges on the lien.
Foozoolalafdarian420@reddit
May I ask why is that important?
ironicmirror@reddit
I'm not sure if it's enforceable, but the longer it stays unpaid, the more the finance charges build up and will eventually cost the homeowner.
scottb90@reddit
Does it cost money to keep the lien in the house? My dad always says he wouldnt do a lien cuz it costs too much an it could take years to ever get paid. Hes full of shit on a lot of things though so I duno what to believe
RivenRise@reddit
In California a mechanics lien is under 200 iirc and as far as i know there aren't any ongoing costs. The expensive part is the lawyers to make sure stuff is on the up and up before filing if you choose to and the lawyers when the house sells to help recoup if you choose to. Not sure about other states but sounds like your dad is misunderstanding something, like those people who say they don't want a raise cause it'll bump them into another tax bracket and they'll make less lul.
Popular-Drummer-7989@reddit
Ooh good one!
BBorNot@reddit
I am so disappointed that nothing unethical is needed. Do this, OP.
DaftPump@reddit
I'm not. OP chances of getting their money is this route not revenge.
EntertainmentBig8636@reddit
This and pissdisks
Chris_Reddit_PHX@reddit
And record the lien with the county recorder's office in the county the house is located within.
It will show up on a background check/public records search so she may want it off right away (you'll have to record a notice of satisfaction but the record of both will be there for a very long time).
The if she ever wants to sell or refinance the house she will have to pay off the lien.
This is not an unethical life hack, but rather just using the justice system in the way it was intended.
But research the process and requirements in your county, and maybe hire a legal document preparer to do any filing. They can also advise you on whether you can include their fees in the lien amount.
Aggravating_Act0417@reddit
Ugh sorry, hope u learned don't do work that isn't paid for, first.
Miami_Mice2087@reddit
she's not talking to you because lawyers are involved. from now on, you need to talk lawyer-to-lawyer. stop contacting her yourself, you're going to mess up your credibility when this goes to court.
i don't know if $1500 is over or under the limit for small claims court. Talk to your lawyer.
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
Absolutely 👍 I haven’t spoken to her since her last bs excuse. And I have a ton of photo documentation, text message proof, contracts, estimates.. if I had been paid by the hour for talking to this woman I wouldn’t even need the extra 1500! Relentless about what she wanted, radio silence on her end of the deal.
Miami_Mice2087@reddit
yeah she sounds like a real problem customer. I hope you get it all back plus legal fees and lost time.
Comprehensive-Fun623@reddit
Stalk her social medias, find out where she works, contact her employers. If they’re reputable they won’t like the bad publicity of an employee being unethical and shady, especially if she deals with customers at her work. Check registry of deeds and see if you can see if or who her mortgage lender is. Send them a letter informing them of her lack of payment and steps you are taking towards placing a lien on the property. Banks won’t like that
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
She works for a non profit, I was considering looking her up on LinkedIn and finding her work email and then signing that email up for EVERYTHING
xela2004@reddit
Sometimes registered mail with an official looking letter demanding payment or a Lein will be applied works! I know it did for us when we got one from a local building supply store! Apparently our contractor hadn’t paid for the supplies he used on our house and we paid him for !
Barrettbuilt@reddit
A lien for $1500 isn’t worth dicking with court. I would just plant some mint in there yard and call it a day.
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
This is the petty advice I was looking for 😂 I also have her email and phone number and thought about writing the church of Scientology, and signing her up for cat facts, and every political campaign, religious newsletter and insurance quote request I can think of
Former-Increase-9165@reddit
So are you looking for someone to suggest you make your way into her home and undo all the extra work you performed ? I would say go repossess your unpaid product, but we both know you’d end up in cuffs, way I see this, your only recourse is either legal route, or stalk her socials, and find her friends and family, and shame her into paying, a unethical person would find some unscrupulous visitors to pay her a visit and force a scummy human to pay her debts,,,,,,
vcf450@reddit
Like others are advising, file a lien.
Often there are short time limits so don’t delay. Get it done.
If you’re not familiar with this type of lien, see a lawyer asap. If filed improperly or too late, the lien isn’t valid.
LoganLikesYourMom@reddit
Go back to her house and reclaim all of the materials from that $1500 of labor.
DaftPump@reddit
Bad advice. Homeowner can not let them on property. If OP trespasses it's legal hot water for OP.
LoganLikesYourMom@reddit
Perhaps it wasn’t clear with my tone but I was very much joking. “Reclaiming” in this context basically means demolishing parts of her home.
Aetheldrake@reddit
When it comes to money, never be unethical. Never fuck with the money. Money is the only thing everyone takes seriously.
If someone wants to add extra stuff shouldn't you either have them pay up front or complete the job and then do the new stuff entirely separate?
robble808@reddit
I hope you have a valid contractors license or you’re SOL. If you do, take them to court.
lr99999@reddit
In some states, general contractors don’t have to have licenses.
suckerbucket@reddit
This is what mechanics liens are for.
dub599@reddit
Look on YouTube for how graffiti artists use fire extinguishers.
mamabear-50@reddit
I don’t know if this will work for you but something similar happened to my ex who was a concrete contractor and a big Polynesian guy. My ex built a long, 6’ tall block wall for a customer who refused to give him his last payment. He went to the client with his best friend, an even bigger Polynesian guy who had recently been rated 2nd in the world for power lifting. He told the guy if he didn’t pay he and his friend would be taking the wall home with them. I guess the client believed my ex because he paid on the spot. FAFO
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
God I wish. I’ve been daydreaming about doing something similar (like returning her carpet and hardwood floor we took out 😈) but she is a coward, hiding behind ai and her dad and this imaginary insurance adjuster, and won’t answer our calls she has a ring doorbell if we showed up I’m 100% positive she would not answer the door.
b1ondestranger@reddit
Does her neighborhood have a Facebook group or next door app you can post to? I would post a public notice of attempt to collect debt.
chuckaholic@reddit
Repossess to counters and floors. If she didn't pay for them, she doesn't own them. You can just walk right in and take them. She gave you access to the property when she hired you, so you aren't trespassing.
Make sure to leave a final receipt when you leave.
Demolition and estimates are paid in full.
Note, *customer declined all other services.
tidyshark12@reddit
Always put a lien on the property in the contract for failure to pay and an executable date at which you take property ownership.
Huge hassle if it comes to this point, ofc, especially if they allow it to get to the point you actually take ownership as you them have to evict them and everything.
In the meantime, you have major leverage against them, though.
In this instance, you have to just wait out the inevitable court decision in your favor, assuming you both signed a new contract for the extra work, ofc.
BasketBackground5569@reddit
Any chance you know her insurance company to inquire with?
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
No, unfortunately I don’t. ☹️ I wish!
DaftPump@reddit
Don't worry about that right now. I'm on the lien thing followed up by small claims if it comes to it. Oh, and all time and court expenses, make sure this is reimbursed to you after she loses.
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
MsTerious1@reddit
Mechanics lien, renew as often as necessary in your location.
WesTxStoner425@reddit
Can a lien be adjusted to include continually growing finance charges? If so, after placing the lien, send occasional updates as to how much the owed amount has grown. Might get her to cut her losses and pay up sooner.
EstherJester@reddit
small claims court
YSoSkinny@reddit
Lein.
UnbelievableDingo@reddit
You can put a lein on her house.
She doesn't pay up, you can take her house.
Pretty good leverage I'd say.
BasketBackground5569@reddit
Never threaten. Just do it. I won't take a threat seriously, either. Sounds like you can't afford a lawyer making it an easy win for me.
wastedfate@reddit
Lol. The ethical way to get even is also the best way to get even. Take her to court, if she refuses to pay you can put a lien on her house. That's way better than whatever petty stuff you were hoping for.
Deny-Degrade-Disrupt@reddit
Maybe give her notice of repo of materials due to refusal of remittance of payment for services
Gemini slop:
NOTICE OF INTENT TO REPOSSESS MATERIALS Date: [Date] TO: [Client Name/Company] FROM: [Your Name/Company] RE: Notice of Default and Repossession of [Specific Materials] This letter serves as formal notice that you are in default of the agreement dated [Contract Date] regarding [Description of Services]. To date, we have not received the required payment of $[Amount], which was due on [Original Due Date]. Due to the refusal of remittance, and pursuant to Section [Number] of our Agreement, we are hereby exercising our right to repossess the following materials: [Item 1] [Item 2] Action Required: To prevent the repossession of these materials, you must provide the full outstanding balance by [Time] on [Date]. Failure to remit payment by this deadline will result in [Physical pickup/Digital deactivation] scheduled for [Date]. Please ensure all materials are made available for collection to avoid further legal action or additional recovery fees. Sincerely, [Your Signature]
Low_Trust2412@reddit
OP if you are considering doing this please consult a lawyer. She probably will not let you in to her house and you may end up getting arrested if you force your way in.
Free legal advice: include a provision in your contract that entitles you to legal fees and all other costs if you need to sue your customers for payment. Then you just turn it over to your lawyer and she ends up paying for your trouble.
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
That is a great idea adding that into my contracts. I sent her a demand letter priority mail for payment, essentially saying you can pay this bill or we can let a judge decide who is in the right. This has been an expensive lesson in social pressure and trusting people. The way she handled this basically had our back against the wall- do everything on my list, including the stuff I’m hinting I don’t want to pay for, or else I won’t pay you. What I SHOULD have done was just stopped working there until she signed the change order and paid for the materials at least. But.. people make you feel like you have to to avoid the relationship going sour, and so you do it in good faith, and then the fuck you over. I will NEVER make this mistake again.
smokinXsweetXpickle@reddit
At least it's only a $1,500 lesson and not a $15,000 lesson. I hope you get your money and remember this next time someone tries to take advantage of you or pressure you to do work that has not been paid for yet.
TheOuterEdge@reddit
You should send that letter as a certified letter so there is proof she saw it for the courts. Definitely retain a lawyer who will guide you thru the process in a way where she can not win.
Deny-Degrade-Disrupt@reddit
It'll cost you time and labor to remove the materials, but it'll feel good
BaconLibrary@reddit
You're a small business, you don't get to be unethical if you want to get your money back. Anything you do is going to make other customers think "Is this how they're going to treat me, too?". Stay in bounds of the law and you'll have her by the ass, do anything shady and she'll get away with it.
Is she has home insurance, perhaps you should contact them. If she's trying to say something happened that ends up with them footing the bill for an insurance adjuster to do an evaluation, they just might want to know your side of the story.
Fabulous_Potato_5012@reddit (OP)
I knowwwwww 😩 that’s what I keep telling my husband too, but man I’m so mad about being taken advantage of!! and I’m so tired of people taking my good will and exploiting it. People suck!! I sent a demand letter, we’ll see how that goes
notcontageousAFAIK@reddit
We've had a couple of customers pull stunts like this. The first one responded immediately to a letter from our lawyer. The second one is about to have criminal charges filed for bouncing a check.
A small business needs a good lawyer. Not UPLT, but find one who loves to go after jerks.
anotheritguy@reddit
Put a lien on her property, dont forget to add late fees and any interest accrued. I believe if she doesnt pay then you take her to court but she cant use the place as collateral or sell, refinance etc till this is satisfied.
wildyLooter@reddit
Well this is ULPT…Next time you install, add some remote activated tannerite. No pay, boom boom. Liquid ass for good measure
f1ve-Star@reddit
Talk to your business lawyer. Don't have one, get one.
iIdentifyasGrinch@reddit
Small claims court. And don't leave until you have a settlement on record.