I always thought donating your body to science sounded cool, until I recently realised you’re donating it for surgical training mostly. I got a course ad for “cadaver training” pop up a week ago or so and I found it kind of creepy lol.

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TheKnightsTippler@reddit

I don't have an issue with surgeon training, but I have this stupid paranoia that they'd say loads of horrible stuff about my body.

It's not like I'd be there to see it, but for some reason it worries me.

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DoctorOctagonapus@reddit

There was also that case in the US a few years back where one lady donated her body to science and it ended up being used by the military for target practice.

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tepig37@reddit

Why is this even needed?

Like how is shooting a dead body more helpful than shooting dummies or even hunting.

Think of it this way, surgery is always risky so wouldn’t you prefer it if a surgeon operating on your spouse or child or parent practiced for it on actual human bodies first?

Training on cadavers means surgeons have more real-world experience when they go to perform it on the living. That can save lives, surgeries go wrong all the time and one reason is that it’s hard to practice for them safely.

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Tattycakes@reddit

Surgical training on real bodies is important though. You will encounter the way that real tissues behave, as well as anatomical variations that can be the source of surgical misadventures

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Yeah I have heard about that too, they keep limbs places… but again if you are dead ☠️ we currently still need trainee doctors, some say AI surgery is the future. DNA is a good data storage medium apparently, so maybe are bodies could be used as hard drives?

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bonjajr@reddit

Lol my mum thinks it’s bad because the doctors wouldn’t work as hard to keep you alive if you were nearly dead 😂

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Dannypan@reddit

As opposed to the person who's also nearly dead from organ failure and will require so much more care to maintain a quality of life due to organ donation.

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elliehowrse@reddit

I think it’s because they’ve shown it happening in medical dramas I’ve definitely seen it in grey’s anatomy before where the guy was even officially brain dead (didn’t get away with it obvs) so things like that will make people more paranoid!

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Benificial-Cucumber@reddit

Let's be honest, it probably happens. If the system were infallible we wouldn't have any concept of the phrase "medical malpractice".

The way I see it though, if the situation is bad enough that harvesting my organs is on the table to begin with, part of me wonders if I would want to be pulled back from that.

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CommonAware6@reddit

Somewhere at some point sure, but Dr's cant even see if youre an organ donor and usually dont care bc the odds of you dying and even being eligible to donate are already low. Not to mention they tend to care more about the patient in front of them than hypothetical patients. Then theyd have to convince so many other people and hope they dont get fired bc theres never 1 person saving you, its a whole team

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Silent-Assasin-@reddit

How does that make sense? Organs need to be harvested after death quickly otherwise they'll die.

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CommonAware6@reddit

After brain death you have enough time as they use machines to keep your organs alive. After circulatory death is when you need to be quick but most organ donations are after brain death

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appletinicyclone@reddit

I'm sorry but people can't be strong armed into giving their insides away

It is admirable when people do but it's a personal decision

We are almost at the point we can start organ printing and I think that will be a fantastic step forwards so these discussions can be over about who does what with their body on death

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96JY@reddit

You don't need them if you're dead, you won't even know they're gone. Why be so selfish when they could be used to help those who need them to keep on living?

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Dannypan@reddit

You've misunderstood my comment entirely. It's about people who fear doctors will let them die to harvest their organs for people who need them when people who need them are also dying and it's much more work to keep a organ recipient alive.

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SlickPillock@reddit

Lol the trolley problem at work

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VFrosty3@reddit

I had a friend at school, whose mum and dad said the same. She said it must be true because her dad was a medic in the army.

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jaynoj@reddit

My mum's convinced that the doctors will try to kill her if she has an organ donor card.

It boggles my mind that people think of these absolutely ridiculous ideas/conspiracies.

Do people have zero critical thinking skills?

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gash_dits_wafu@reddit

I know it won't be enough to convince your mum, but the doctors oath is "do no harm" not "do whatever is necessary to help your patient". Which means that doing no harm to your mum is a higher priority than finding an organ for the other patient.

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I’d really like to donate my body to my university which has a strong medical research division. But I don’t know whether I’d be better just doing the normal cremation so my organs can do to someone. Idk. I just want to help people.

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fleck57@reddit

Reminds me of the story about how body’s donated to science were used in US army experiments to see how explosives affected human bodies and the only reason it was discovered was because an explosives training video got leaked and someone recognised their naked grandma in the video

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BobbyNotches@reddit

"someone recognised their naked grandma"

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BassDude28@reddit

Yes, but I do know how it affected me and my family, and how it will affect theirs. I know I can't be certain of a single thing, but I also can't be certain of anything to the contrary.

If it's still screwing me up however many years later, I feel I should try to help others, and thus reduce the pain for their family, as well as hopefully helping them with living.

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fickle_tartan@reddit

feel I should try to help others, and thus reduce the pain for their family, as well as hopefully helping them with living.

But you're not helping anyone, this might make you feel better but invalidating someone else's feelings and their medical experience because of how you felt when a loved one died is just straight up rude. It's incredibly disrespectful to be telling someone else how to live their life, or to imply that you can give better advice than their own friends/family/doctors.

I guess you're young so you're only seeing this in a very black and white manner and probably haven't probably learned enough empathy yet to be able to imagine a situation other than your own, and I can only imagine how hard that must have been to go through at such a young age for you. But ultimately you do not know this person. You do not know their medical diagnosis, you do not know what they, or their family, are going through, and you couldn't possibly know because no two situations are the same.

I'm also not able to give blood, received blood at 10 days old and that's that which is frustrating. I'm also in progress with a diagnosis for a neurological condition. It doesn't prohibit organ donation alone (unlike blood and bone marrow) but does assess suitability once the time comes. I have heard people with this likely condition can donate their bodies, especially their brain/spinal cord to future research. At least I can potentially be useful 50 years in the future if I can't be right now.

I am currently an organ donor on my driving licence and decided to opt in for everything.

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Ok_Young1709@reddit

I can't give blood either because I received some. They wouldn't want mine anyway, it's shit.

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Linkyjinx@reddit

Pick and mix lol 😝🫶

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jajwhite@reddit

I gave 19 units of blood when I was 17-18 then they told me I couldn't give it because I was gay. Despite the fact that I didn't touch anyone in that way until I was 22, I was excluded.

Familiar-Donut1986@reddit

I think you can still donate your corneas, although I could be wrong.

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Tacklestiffener@reddit

My friend had heart surgery, dementia, cataracts and whatever but he donated his body to science. When he died (85ish) his body was just collected from the hospital. The thing is, you don't know if you're going to be helping cure dementia or used to test explosives or gunshot injuries.

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Beard_X@reddit

You do in this country. We aren't using donated cadavers for weapons testing.

The US however...

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FigKombucha@reddit

Register to donate your organs and tissue to scientific research.

Unfortunately, organ donation for research is not organised centrally via the NHS, like it is for transplants. You have to register specifically to your local biobank.

You can find one and register by searching on the Human Tissue Authority website.

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LemmysCodPiece@reddit

The same for me. I had cancer and needed several blood transfusion. I wanted to give blood as a way of saying thank you, turns out I am not allowed to.

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Bitter_Tradition_938@reddit

You can donate your body to science. It’s a win-win, you will do good for the future of humankind and you will spare your loved ones from having to spend a fortune. I’ve signed myself up already, even though I don’t have any indication that I’m going to go away any time soon.

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PGMOL-Cleaner@reddit

For sure there will be a chance at being useful for medical students to practice on! Or some bodies (not sure how they decide) are used for carefully preserving.

There’s a cool instagram and YouTube channel that has videos of such bodies and teaches about them. I think it’s institute of human anatomy. Not in the UK but I’m sure we have similar.

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phatboi23@reddit

Not a really opted out. I had cancer when I was in my 20s, and now I can't GIVE my body parts away! Can't give blood either!

same but 15-18.

Yes and I was geniuenlly annoyed with my wife when she told me she had carrying an organ donor card.

Scenario: Car crash, things aren't looking good. Rather than focusing on what they can do they focus on what your parts can be used for.

On life support it's often used as a reason to take someone off

around 6% of hospital patients are misdiagnosed

How many people are wrongly told information from mecidal professionals?

In rarer circumstances, how many people are declared dead and aren't?

genuinely

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NoFewSatan@reddit

Scenario: Car crash, things aren't looking good. Rather than focusing on what they can do they focus on what your parts can be used for.

Swimming-Lie5369@reddit

Oh god, I want to undo it now

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ric_mcc1766@reddit

This person is talking nonsense, if you look at their recent posts they posted elsewhere about organ donation:

'I won't be donating my organs ever since I learnt you are still alive via artificial respiration (heart lung machines) when the donations take place. You are declared a "beating heart cadaver". People who were declared "brain dead" have also woken up prior to surgery for said organs. (I'm sure someone will come along and link the NY Times article about this).'

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IndividualCurious322@reddit

You can go further back in my posts (which arent and have never been hidden) and see I've mentioned this person prior.

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ric_mcc1766@reddit

So you go back and forth between knowing them, and hearing about it happening... Oh yeh, that makes it totally more believable....

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VickyAlberts@reddit

Which part is it that you don’t believe? I can’t see anything in the comment you’re referring to that is incorrect.

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ric_mcc1766@reddit

I don't believe the poster personally knows someone whose wife was asked about organ donations whilst they were braindead but who then came back to life. It's the sort of fantastical thing that used to be discussed in the playground or in shock magazines before the rise of the internet.

It's always a friend of a friend that these things happen to.

"Withdrawal of life-sustaining treatment, such as ventilation and/or medication to maintain blood pressure will have taken place in either the theatre department or the intensive care unit."

Saying "none of this is correct" is a lie.

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Valuable-Hand-326@reddit

Referring to ‘being alive on artificial respiration’ is fundamentally incorrect. DBD donation happens after death. The heart continues to beat but the patient has died.

All families of donors are counseled as to the organ donation process. There is no conflict of interest pertaining to this.

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Arob2311@reddit

This is not true. There is donation after circulatory death and donation after brain death. Donation after brain death is what people typically think of in organ donation, whereas donation after circulatory death (DCD) is after the heart had been confirmed to stop.

https://www.organdonation.nhs.uk/about-organ-donation/get-the-facts/

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IndividualCurious322@reddit

Heart lung machines are used during the donation process though, and the medical term is a "beating heart cadaver" ( a body that is pronounced dead in all medical and legal definitions)

So how is it "not true"?

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Arob2311@reddit

That’s not the UK term and the heart would not be beating during donation after cardiac death. UK practice is that death is only confirmed 5 minutes after the last heartbeat. That does limit the amount of time the family can spend with their loved one after death. As others have said, donation will never go ahead in the UK if the family object, even if the person had made their wish to donate clear.

There are some techniques that can help allow more organs to be donated by stopping damage or allowing more time to see if they’re working ok. They’re not used in most cases of donation in the UK at the moment.

One example is a machine to help keep a donated liver in the best possible condition. https://www.leedsth.nhs.uk/patients/resources/machine-perfusion-of-donor-livers-normothermic-perfusion-and-hypothermic-oxygenated-perfusion/

Another technique is called normothermic regional perfusion where a pump keeps oxygenated blood circulating around the organs in the abdomen. The heart isn’t beating and the aorta is clamped. This technique was used in under 25% of donations after circulatory death in the last UK report.

All of the UK policies, procedures and reports can be found at https://www.odt.nhs.uk/retrieval/policies-and-nors-reports/

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IndividualCurious322@reddit

It doesn't matter if the term is or isn't used in the UK when it means the same thing. Eg, a body that's clinically dead, but kept alive via machines until organ transplantation can occur.

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um_-_no@reddit

I still don't get why if you're going to die, can't recover (very very rare instances aside where also you would likely still be taken off life support in that condition and therefore regardless of organ donation outcome would be the same either you suddenly wake up or you die) why would you be bothered?

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Short--Stuff@reddit

😳

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PerambulatingPython@reddit

Pretty much this. Anecdotes aside. You’re “dead” so no anaesthetic for you! You’re “dead” so no need to be careful, time is of the essence. It’s a blood bath. Impressive, technically organised, competent blood bath. You’re dead.

💯 this thread was only started so the contrarians of reddit can lord it over those who dont share their views. Or organs.

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EndearingSobriquet@reddit

treated like conspiracy theorists.

I said no to the corneas for ages because it freaked me out.

Then I realised I'd be dead and it doesn't matter

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colin_staples@reddit

My Mum was an organ donor who specifically spoke about donating her corneas

After her death they weren't able to use her organs due to chemo... except for her corneas, which they were able to use and which allowed some people see again

I will never know those people, but it fills me with immense... love(?) that she did this

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No_Improvement2317@reddit

Same thing with my mum. She was very adamant about being an organ donor, and reminded us of this frequently. Sadly, due to sepsis on multiple occasions, along with chemotherapy and radiotherapy, the only organ that was usable was her corneas, but I know this would have made her happy to have helped someone after she passed. I'm the same way and I've been on the register since I was 18. My children are a bit too young for that conversation, but my brother knows my wishes and will make sure that anything usable is donated. It won't be any good to me once I'm dead!

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f23n09fnu0w@reddit

The fact that your mum was able to help out one last person, right at the end, makes her a super cool person to me. The gift of sight is no small gift and now can someone literally see because of her. Shout out to Colin's mum :)

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Mukatsukuz@reddit

Same with my mam. Got a letter saying they were able to improve the life of one person due to the cornea donation. Strangely, my mother hadn't registered herself as a donor yet I remember her scolding me for not doing so (which I then did due to this) and my dad being unsure whether or not she wanted to be a donor. The choice came down to me and I am glad I made it but I'll be forever perplexed as to why she hadn't registered yet told me to.

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Prior_Garlic_8710@reddit

A mixture of warm pride and wistful grief with a touch of awe at her and goodness that does exist in the world??

RafRafRafRaf@reddit

Same but weirdly the opposite almost?

Thank you so much for changing your mind. Your logic is sound, in my opinion.

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Dry-Magician1415@reddit

Then I realised I'd be dead and it doesn't matter

They should offer people the opportunity to opt out when the situation is exactly relevant: when you're dead.

grieving family members who don't want their dead child whisked away for organ removal

Can a child consent to organ donation? Wouldn't it always be the family?

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DaughterOfATiredMech@reddit

Really? I didn’t know this

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goficyourself@reddit

Really.

If you would want to be an organ donor, tell your family so if the worst happens, they’re not wondering what you would want.

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Plumb789@reddit

I've been a blood donor since the age of 18 (donated nearly 80 times now), and always had my name down as an organ donor. In the early years, it was tremendously important to make sure your family were fully aware of your intentions, because even willing donors wishes were often stymied by relatives after their death.

Nearly 50 years ago, we were encouraged to try to persuade friends to come along and donate. They don't try to get you to do that now-possibly because of the reactions of people. Some people were really disgusted by the mention of blood donation. "Ew! No THANK you!", or "Urgh! Do you mind! You nearly made me heave up my breakfast!" One woman said: "you're the second person who mentioned blood donation to me. Honestly, I think you've only brought it up to appear superior."

Having said that, a few people did come. My proudest achievement was a friend who was "O neg" (the "universal donor"). He gave for a while-until he resettled in Australia, and was told that, having lived in the UK during certain dates, he was a risk for CJD. They wouldn't take his blood! Yikes!

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Inner-Marketing4591@reddit

Spiritual reasons mostly, I have arranged a natural burial when I die, no embalming, no coffin etc basically composting myself. When I die I want my entire being to be returned to the earth, so my energy can be used for nature. Would probably be seen as selfish by most but I don't really like humanity as a whole, and would rather my energy be given to nature than the most likely possiblity of my organs being chucked into a bin, as they most likely won't end up being used for transplants anyway

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OrganicPoet1823@reddit

Your body your choice you don’t need to justify it

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Winter_Cabinet_1218@reddit

I personally think it's the implied concept that your body is no longer your own and is fair game to be harvested to repair another worker drone. Opting in made it a decision, opting out makes it a preference.

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Extension_Point5466@reddit

So occasionally you hear stories of crises that were averted

A man declared dead almost had surgery to donate his organs, but he was still alive : Shots - Health News : NPR https://share.google/PuBwuvga861aDeDbx

You don't hear about the ones where no one noticed the person wasn't actually dead

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midnightspaghetti@reddit

I have been dealing with hard to navigate health issues from a year and it’s been a shitshow.

Between that and my past NHS experiences, I am sorry but I don’t trust them not to fumble it.

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Tsarinya@reddit

This is why I want to opt out. I signed up as an organ donor when I was a teenager, before opting out was a thing. But these stories combined with my several bad experiences with NHS medical staff is making me seriously consider opting out. Plus I dislike the whole opting out method - it makes out that the government owns my organs and I have to apply to get full control over them.

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Dramatic-Ad-4607@reddit

(Also the high moral ground people who are fervent about organ donation place themselves on really irks me, as displayed in this thread).

Exactly how i feel. When my grandad lost his sight many years ago me and my mum both begged the Drs to take one of our eyes (we were naïve and just trying to find any solutions) to help him see.. my mum il never forget cried "but i have my dads eyes look its the same colour and everything please take them" but his eyes were completely destroyed and it would not of helped him.

I wanted to give my organs all of them my eyes included all of it to stop people from feeling that feeling we felt but my experience with the nhs the past few years and the cold nasty attitude that has come out of it and the stories you see from people who wanted to donate has really put me off. I have not opted out yet as im still very much wanting to help people but can i trust those in the nhs to do this the right way and no leave my family devastated and not lie and say im gone so they get my organs regardless if i put through or not. Il most likely get hate now and attacked and told i shouldnt be allowed a organ if i need it and all that shite but it doesnt do anything but push me further away from wanting to donate. I dont trust the NHS especially right now. If it had of been a good few years back id be happy to do it but now ? i cant trust them.

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OrganicPoet1823@reddit

When I’m dead help yourself. Never doing a live transplant though

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ChairmanMeow52@reddit

The reason why I opted out is because I strongly feel that an opt-out system is morally repugnant, as it implies that the government inherently has ownership over my body unless I explicitly tell them otherwise. Consent (as far as I’m concerned) should always be expressly given, never assumed.

I've never understood this take. "It's tantamount to saying they own our bodies!"

That may be part of it. I just don’t like how I have to be dead whilst alive people pick me apart salvaging my corpse, thinking nothing of me but a vessel to pluck from. Then they go home have their dinner and wouldn’t even remember the slightest detail of my face.

I have a personal belief that the body should be respected in death and removing organs violates this.

Ideally I'd like to be buried in the middle of nowhere when I go but in a shallow grave and returned to the earth.

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Digginginthesand@reddit

No, there really isn't communication.

Early in my career I was a junior doctor brought to be an extra pair of hands at a kidney transplant (family member to family member) and an alert came in during it that an organ was available and would be there in x hours, receiving patient was on the way. Someone mentioned it was to be helicoptered from the South Coast, we were in London. I asked a lot of questions but nobody knew the answers. They allocate based on donor-recipient match, place on waiting list and geography (but only slightly and that might have changed - they wouldn't send an organ somewhere far away because it might deteriorate too much en route).

Now it might occur that a donation coincidentally happens in the one hospital but that decision is made by the transplant committees and isn't made until the donor has already been declared, so the deciding team cannot possibly know that their patient is going to benefit in advance. I've never heard of it happening, tbh.

As to tipping the dial.. no. That would be murder at worst and criminal negligence at best.

I'm aware of alleged cases in the US but in the UK the doctors get no financial benefit from the organ donation and they may never meet the recipient.

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RafRafRafRaf@reddit

Oh good grief, there is, of course, a difference between a neurosurgeon acknowledging to themselves that the best outcome from a catastrophic, unsurviveable brain injury is that their patient might end up saving 8 other people’s lives (which an individual clinician may well notice quite early doors) and the processes around the provision of care.

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itsfourinthemornin@reddit

My Dad was brain dead after an accident, it was very clear he wasn't coming around by the end of the day, but they gave us the day to spend with him at the least and see if he improved - during the day, he still had signs of life. No point did the ICU staff or any other staff mention organ donation, his passing or anything else to us, whilst we spent time with him. They asked about his life and us, cooed over my son (9mo).

Other than when we arrived and them letting us know his condition and us any of his medical info, outside of checks they mentioned nothing else related until much later in the day and that was about our decision to keep/remove him from support - no pressure to remove him, in fact the opposite as at first there was chance for survival.

Into the evening they spoke to us going home for rest, I elected to stay. They spent the evening taking handprints for us all, hair, etc. and making a memory box. He came off support before everyone left in the late evening and lasted into the early morning of the next day (to pass on his birthday, stubborn drama queen in death as he was in life), again not once had donation or similar been mentioned to us/me. ICU staff had kept me company most of the evening whilst it was just me - they were lovely. Still no mention of donation.

It was the morning - 24 hours after he was admitted and we were made aware - I met the transplant coordination, dad was barely hanging on (breathing slowed, no brain activity, etc.). Considering some of the situations they must witness, they were absolutely lovely. They didn't delve into it straight away, again asked about my dad first and mostly with the nurses alongside me, they asked if it was something he would've wanted rather than something we'd agree to. We had a belly laugh as I had to genuinely ask them if he had organs that could be donated (alcoholic most of his life, heavy smoker, etc).

I think it was 2023-2024, only 8 people donated organs at my local hospital. Eight. My local hospital does a little event for families of those who have donated, I took my son a few years ago, as he's got older he is of course more curious about his Grandad he met but doesn't remember, he loved it and he met a few of the nurses who cared for my dad. They did have a public record of those who've passed and donated you could view (we did when we visited for the event), but not sure it's still there since some redevelopment.

Zealousideal-Low3388@reddit

So when you go to the doctor, you’re worried that your they would murder you to what, help another doctor meet their NHS targets?

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Civil-Koala-8899@reddit

This is what confuses me about this opinion, as a doctor myself. Surely if I keep letting my patients die, so that someone else's patients can live, that would just make me look like a really bad doctor lmao?

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Vast-Slip-@reddit

Fine_Analyst_4408@reddit

That they were opted in against their consent I guess. I find it just as confusing.

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ToughImprovement276@reddit

I guess I can kinda, somewhat understand that? Ish?

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doyouevennoscope@reddit

"I feel like washing the dishes, so I will wash the dishes."

"Son, wash the dishes."

"I don't want to wash the dishes anymore."

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Midnightraven3@reddit

Would they still feel the same if it made them ineligible to receive an organ I wonder?

Or if people could state they only want their organs to go to a registered donor?

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Fine_Analyst_4408@reddit

I think they would, pretty stubborn pair

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Midnightraven3@reddit

We all know lots of those sadly

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solnyshka@reddit

I watched a programme recently where a woman chose to donate her organs, and I have to admit it put me right off.

They whisk you away immediately after death, which makes sense obviously. I couldn't help think how upsetting it would have been after my own Mum died, not being able to spend another hour with her body processing things and saying goodbye after she'd gone.

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solnyshka@reddit

Yes, very odd! I think afterwards I would find comfort in the fact that they had helped people stay with their own loved ones for longer.

The time of death though, is a very heady and visceral experience. I think I could only cope with them being taken away by knowing their body would be returned and I'd see them again. It was hard just leaving the room after my mother died.

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Cheap-Vegetable-4317@reddit

I have a dear friend who spent years of our childhood on dialysis, which was grim, who has had 3 transplanted kidneys. I'm grateful every day to the donors and their families who have given her a life. She's nearly 50 now and she should have died when we're 9.

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Lunaspoona@reddit

Your dad is a hero.

My uncle had a heart transplant. It gave him 10 more years. He was able to live again. Spent time more time with his kids. Got to meet his new grandkids and created so many memories with them as well. My aunt had cancer, he was her rock through that. They passed within weeks of each other. Family man right until the end.

We are all on the register, hopefully we'll be able to give another family what we were given because we are forever thankful for those 10 years.

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Hardie1247@reddit

As the person below mentioned - think of the good that it does for people requiring an organ donation - I agree at first it would be difficult not being able to grieve in a way you would like, but knowing afterwards that this act of selflessness has allowed potentially multiple people to keep living, is healing enough on its own I feel.

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Have you considered that you might not be able to predict your time of death? Accidents happen.

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Idfkw2c@reddit

Of course, but it’s usually long illness like cancer which strikes in my family, nothing really sudden.

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captain_corvid@reddit

What if you get hit by a car tomorrow?

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Idfkw2c@reddit

What if I don’t? I tend to look both ways before crossing.

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captain_corvid@reddit

Unfortunately that doesn't mean an accident won't happen.

The government does not defacto own my organs. I am not the property of the state.

I will volunteer my body parts of my own volition but I will continue to "opt out" until I am once again permitted the respect of being asked to "opt in".

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Imaginary-Advice-229@reddit

You're gonna be so proud in that casket actively knowing your choice potentially stopped the saving of several lives. You'll be dead and rotting, why does it matter what happens to your organs especially when they can save lives?

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WhyN0tToast@reddit

You have chosen a hill to die on that benefits no one.

May I suggest "rigidly rigid in life, and in death" for your obituary

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Bismuth88@reddit

You are free to suggest whatever you wish. It's still my body and I expect to be sovereign over it as far as reasonably possible until I am dead. Once I am dead my remains belong to my wife who can do with it as she wishes. She would donate my organs, I would be happy for her to choose this.

I will still happily donate my organs if it's something I get to actually choose to do rather than an external entity deciding they are taking them regardless.

My hills I choose to die on are my hills, I don't know if I agree with the suggestion that they have to benefit someone else to be valid.

, I believe in bodily autonomy and the individuals right to choose.

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WhyN0tToast@reddit

So you chose to opt out because they didn't give you the option to choose, does the hill at least have a nice view?

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Bismuth88@reddit

Are you going to try to engage with the argument or are you going to keep throwing sarcasm at it and hope it sticks?

It's fine, we have a different opinion. Hope you have a good rest of your day.

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Nicricieve@reddit

I've never thought about it as the state owning me to transplant me according to their desires, which aren't always in good faith. Hasn't so far changed my mind, though, as I will be dead

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Ok, the op asked a question, I answered. Typical that a rando judges me.

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Hardie1247@reddit

When you die you will likely be subject to a post-mortem examination anyway, which results in you being opened up, organs removed and examined anyway, then everything is put back and you are sewn up to undergo your funeral rites etc. So being truthful you will likely be "chopped up" regardless of your status of donor/non-donor.

The only difference when it comes to donation, is that you donating might mean that someone else gets to live a longer life, spending more time with their loved ones because you chose to be selfless, rather than letting your organs rot in the ground/be cremated along with the rest of you.

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doyouevennoscope@reddit

everything is put back

Good as new, then.

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glamdring_@reddit

The idea of my organs being in someone else’s body gives me anxiety, which negatively affects my life.

It’s not a rational fear but I think that my comfort while I’m alive is more important than potentially (maybe, possibly, who knows?) saving someone once I’m dead.

If I change my mind later I’ll opt back in 🤷

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brutal_and_beautiful@reddit

I was born with my organs I want to be buried with them.

I am not against organ donation, but I would only want to be a living donor for someone I know and would trust with my organ.

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captain_corvid@reddit

Out of curiosity, would you accept an organ donation from a recently deceased donor if you needed one?

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brutal_and_beautiful@reddit

I've never actually thought about it to be honest as I hope to never be in that situation.

The idea of keeping dead people hooked up to machines to harvest the organs is really dystopian in my opinion.

Bitter_Tradition_938@reddit

You’re joking, right?

I’m an atheist, but let’s go with religion here. Your presumably immortal soul has nothing to do with the vessel that contains/contained it.

Your spirit is not “stored” in an organ.

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Jarv1223@reddit

You’ve just offended millions of dead ancient Egyptians

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MathematicianOnly688@reddit

. i have unsettling thoughts of being stuck in purgatory until everyone who recieved my organs dies

That sounds horrendous, I’d never even consider that angle. What if something you donate is given to someone young? You could be there for decades.

I’m assuming then that if your kidneys failed and you needed a transplant you’d say no for the same reasons.

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ice-lollies@reddit

I can understand it to be honest. I’m fine with donating my organs but I think I would struggle with donating my children’s.

I know it isn’t a rational response, it’s emotional. Not religious either.

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thecatwhisker@reddit

I think it’s a timing issue - Especially with children - because the topic is obviously broached with just before the death of just after and while they say it’s ’in a sensitive’ way there’s only so many ways you say ‘So you have some spare parts there now and we could do with them.’

Logically, I know dead is dead, and dead feels nothing but emotionally I don’t I could make that leap from ‘I must always protect them and keep them safe’ to ‘sure take them I’m done with them now’ in a hour or two.

It’s not about the organs really it’s about being able to let them go and accepting they are dead and won’t be needing their organs anymore, and especially if the death was unexpected.

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ice-lollies@reddit

Agreed. I’d like to think I would be generous enough to donate them but I’m just not sure. And my kids aren’t little anymore - officially I don’t think I would have a say.

The topic will be ‘people who kill dogs; why?’

And the majority of replies will be;

“I’ve never killed a dog and don’t know who would”

“Why would someone kill a dog?”

“My cousin knew a guy who once killed a dog but I’m not sure why he did it”

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compare a handful of cases, some which are unverified worldwide over the span of recorded history compared to the thousands that die every year from lack of donors, I think its probably worth risking?

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Valuable-Hand-326@reddit

None of this happens in the UK. Deceased donation is incredibly thoroughly regulated by the Human Tissue Authority (HTA).

There is no mechanism for wealthy people to ‘skip the queue’ for organs here. Matches are based on clinical need.

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Wizard_Tea@reddit

.....as far as you know

people used to swear blind that meat in the UK was iron clad safe, then there was BSE and horse meat scandals.

Number60nopeas@reddit

If we are being realistic, they are slightly different because you have to go out of your way to donate them.

But, if there are people who have the opportunity to easily donate those things but flat out refuse to then yes, they also shouldnt receive them.

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Tsarinya@reddit

That’s not how the NHS works though. We could argue that if you smoke, do extreme sports, drink, eat unhealthily, etc then you shouldn’t get care because you out yourself in that position.

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TheDaemonette@reddit

We don't manage the organ donor list based on anything other than medical criteria. If you demand that only organ donors are the only people who can receive transplants then you'll suddenly find a lot of people signing up just at the point when they need a transplant and are you then going to have rules that say they need to be registered as a donor a year before? Or two years? And then there will be people who fall foul of those deadlines by just a day or two, by coincidence, and suddenly your quid pro quo rules are fucking innocent people over because of bureaucracy. All because someone thinks that people who don't want to donate an organ should be 'punished' by being allowed to die when they could be saved.

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Raven_Blackfeather@reddit

Tell that to all the LGBT people who were demonised as having dirty blood and organs all the way up to 14 June 2021.

Gross.

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Elephants_and_rocks@reddit

Mate I opted out but I donate my blood (the type which people take in ambulances) every time I’m eligible. I’d give you my blood without hesitation and without trying to enforce some weird moral code on those who need it.

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Number60nopeas@reddit

Would you expect an organ from somebody else if you needed one?

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Elephants_and_rocks@reddit

Why would you expect blood if you don’t donate it? Or stem cells or etc

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Number60nopeas@reddit

I didnt say that you should.

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disgruntledchump28@reddit

I said no because I have lupus. They outright told me I can't give blood because of my illness, but for some reason my organs are ok...? Given nobody yet quite know what causes it and it's autoimmune, I'd hate to think that some oversight in the system caused my organs to give someone an autoimmune disease after my death. Irrational perhaps, but it weirds me out.

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TrigWaker@reddit

Still using them..

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celaconacr@reddit

I didn't know this but have just read up about it.

When it was opt in people actively chose the option so their families knew their wishes. If I remember rightly one place they got this was when getting a driving license.

Now its the default families are unsure if they really wanted to or not, and they get the final say. It only takes one family member to say no and the rest of the family will likely go along with it.

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leah_amelia@reddit

I've said they can have whatever they want except my eyes. Call it a religious / spiritual thing but feels like my soul is there, so no one is having them.

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quite_acceptable_man@reddit

My personal opinion is that the organ donation scheme is something you opt in or opt out of entirely. If you opt out of the scheme, that's fine but you opt out completely, as in you opt out of receiving as well as giving.

Also, being opted in should be the default - it means you would be, by default eligible to receive donated organs, and in return you donate yours. If you don't want that, you opt out.

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SaraReadsMuchly@reddit

I previously opted out after reading an awful news story about someone who woke up as they were starting to harvest their organs in the operating theatre and then subsequently expired. I did opt back in a while later when I realised it was unlikely to happen to me. (fingers crossed)

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bonuce@reddit

I don’t think people should have to justify it really. The only thing in life we truly “have” is our own body, and if people don’t want to give parts of it away, even after death (for whatever reason however small or silly it seems), it’s their choice. Maybe it’s an irrational one but so what?

Would I like for myself and loved ones to have transplants and survive? Of course, I’m very selfish and want them to live as long as possible.

Are we owed other peoples bodies and do we get to tell them they’re silly for saying no? No.

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Own-Perception1050@reddit

flat eartherters/brexiter brain.

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SituationMundane5452@reddit

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leyland_gaunt@reddit

So we let everyone in the country make their own value judgements and let thousands of people each year either die or live lives blighted by illness that could potentially be stopped or at least eased by stopping people keeping organs they no longer need cause they are dead? If I was dying and one of your organs was passed by the medical profession I think I’d give it a go. It may not be a perfect system but it would be a hell of a lot better than what we have now.

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RaspberryJammm@reddit

For most illnesses this is the correct approach but my illness is misunderstood by the medical establishment to a ghastly level for many historical reasons so I cannot trust them to make the call.

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Portas30k@reddit

If someon else has my heart what will Anubis weigh against a feather?

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Same here. And rates of certain chronic illnesses have gone up massively since 2020 (I'm thinking of ME/CFS caused by long covid, been hundreds of thousands new cases )

Until we know more about ME/CFS i am holding back on donating organs. It affects so many different bodily systems and is often severely disabling.

I don't trust an ignorant medical system not to decide that ME/CFS isn't particularly serious and then go on to ruin somebody's life by giving them my organs.

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itsfourinthemornin@reddit

Same here, I can't donate blood (due to having had cancer in the past) but I can donate organs - except corneas, as those were affected by the cancer.

I know a charity was trying to change the blood donation rules in relation to those with my condition. It's been a while so may misremember finer details, but our blood is no longer affected once were in the clear meaning you can actually donate, it's just the 'rule' that stops us - and most of us want to donate!

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deltree000@reddit

The rules are different when it comes to organ donation. For instance I cannot donate blood because I have Crohn's and have had cancer. However I can donate my organs.

Check out https://www.organdonation.nhs.uk/about-organ-donation/who-can-donate/

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Quiet_surprise79@reddit

Same for me

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Digital_Palpitation@reddit

in my case it's that I spent a lot of time in Mexico as a child, and I forget what it is about that puts my blood in a higher risk category.

(Funnily enough I'm from the US and I can't donate here because of that, but I also can't donate in the US because they're cool with me having been to Mexico but not the UK during certain years because of some cow disease I think.)

I'm terrified of needles so it's a nice little cop out in life, if they can make use of my organs in death I don't really care.

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My daughter had a liver transplant at 18 months. She was saved because a family made the choice to donate their child's organs when they died. They saved two lives at least, as half the liver went to my kid and the other half to a kid in Oxford.

I get why people don't want to donate though. The whole process is done in grief, often even before the shock of losing someone is done, those high stress situations mean you don't think straight.

Whatever decisions you make, might not be the same you would make with a clear head and a whole heart.

I will always been an advocate for donating blood, organs, bone marrow even if I can't myself, but I get why.

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Theallseer97@reddit

I've said no to corneas and brain? I think. But everything else is fine. Though I highly doubt much of my body will be useful tbh.

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Akmunra@reddit

I signed up just said to wife to make sure they don't pull the cord early just not get my organs early.

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CellistNarrow5069@reddit

Because I don't trust people in general and medical professionals in particular

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Bennjoon@reddit

I have stage 4 endometriosis so there’s a real chance if someone got my organs they’d get uterine cells inside them and then it’s over 😭

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decidedlyindecisive@reddit

I think my cornea's might be ok.

Lol I'll take em

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the-holy-one23@reddit

Because they're my organs! /s

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Raven_Blackfeather@reddit

Because I'm a trans woman and for years we were labelled as MSM and treated like our blood was dirty, when it was the cishets who spread HIV. so if my blood i snot good enough then surely my organs aren't good enough.

The reason that kid is going to die, the reason that mother will die and not see her kids grow up is because LGBT people were labelled with dirty blood and it only just recently decided to give cishet people the same risk levels as LGBT people.

It's worth pointing out that this problem is twofold.

The question is focused on a specific group, but not only are the wrong group answering, people are downvoting those who opt out, largely because they don't like the answer they gave, and upvoting those who opt in simply because they agree with the decision to opt in.

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PsychologicalDrone@reddit

I used to believe that if my organs were harvested then I would be ‘incomplete’ in the afterlife.

Now, I’m no longer on the meds that were putting me in a weird headspace and can actually think like a rational person, so I’m now on the donor list

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ArticleAmazing3446@reddit

I’m not sure I know the true answer to this question. Back in the late 90s/early 00s when I was in school, this was a very live debate, then seemed to fizzle, then was introduced and now doesn’t seem to be having the desired effect.

Back then, one of the big issues was whether the involuntary responses that often happen during organ donation after death might be pain responses. At the time, this was pushed as a reason for not donating, especially because anaesthetic after death was not regular (it is now). The medical consensus is now that deceased organ donors cannot feel pain because the parts of the brain required to process sensation have permanently ceased to function. In brain death, the cortex is destroyed, meaning that while the spinal cord may still trigger involuntary reflexes (like a racing heart or muscle twitches) in response to a scalpel, there is no conscious mind to perceive them. In circulatory death, patients are given heavy sedation and painkillers for comfort while dying, followed by a mandatory waiting period after the heart stops to ensure the brain is fully inactive before surgery begins. To ensure absolute dignity and to block any remaining physical reflexes, doctors now standardly use anaesthetic agents during the procedure itself.

I half wonder whether people remember these debates, think the pain response/lack of anaesthetic is still a thing, and opt out?

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BlackStarDream@reddit

Because I want to try cryonics and that's mutually exclusive because the methods used to attempt to preserve the body run counter to the donation process. Even if I was to only cryopreserve my head or brain.

I'm essentially donating my body to experimental medical science in the hope that death itself, as we know it currently, can be reversed in much the way it used to be believed that death was when your heart stopped beating. Doing research into the whole process and what it could mean if done successfully (or even half-successfully since it's a step towards success), I believe it's of a potential far greater long term benefit for humanity than the immediate small number of lives my organs might slightly improve if at all. Possibly even negatively impact worse than no organs at all.

Because I have Ehlers Danlos Syndrome. Every one of my organs isn't going to be a good idea to stitch into/onto or mash/grind up and apply to somebody else because of the higher risk of complications. EDS is horrendously under diagnosed so it's guaranteed somebody has already gotten a less than ideal organ from somebody with the condition already. I don't want to give somebody that hope just to rip it away.

And the whole opt out instead of opt in thing is something I oppose. Only people that actively show that they wanted to donate in life and have been screened as part of that process should donate. Both for the safety of the recipient and clarity of consent and fitness of the donor.

I also believe a lot of the push for (or against post opt out) organ donation is pure propaganda that relies on keeping the general population uninformed. So even the consent of "willing" donors is dubious.

For example they liked to use children as the face of organ donation promotion before the switch to opt out, such as "are you going to let her die". But in reality, most (not all but generally the ones that actually keep people alive) adult organs can't exactly go to kids that young. Only other kids' organs can.

And for those that do know, it was basically guilting parents into making their own child a donor. Even if the child themselves might not have wanted it. Opt out is also not taking the consent of children too young to advocate for themselves into account.

I don't want to support the opt out system, full stop. It's a disaster that has already happened. The general public just won't hear anything about it because of the social pressure to be for it.

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Super-Surround-4347@reddit

I didn't like that a lot of religious groups opt out of it, but do happily take.

However I got over it.

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trippykitsy@reddit

I opted in way back when. Still have the piece of card. Didn't realise it's opt out now.

if my family decide to opt me out, I would understand, but it is my preference my body parts get a second chance at life even if my mind can't join them. My mother has some spiritual beliefs.

Key_Butterscotch1009@reddit

Because I don't think my body will be used to save someone's life.
It will be used by some student, sold to company offers the most money for my bits for testing , or rejected because it is unsuitable.
I like the idea of my kidney being reused to keep someone alive but the vast majority of organs are discarded as they don't meet the criteria.

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Bitter_Tradition_938@reddit

“used by some student”

I honestly think by the time it comes around to me croaking that we'll have alternatives, be it artificial means or more pass produced natural alternatives.

One of the reasons will be that medical knowledge has advanced, and some potential diseases can be identified without the person having ever shown symptoms, but it may automatically rule them out as able to donate.

One example is bone marrow. If the potential donor has certain gene mutations that are markers for MPN blood cancers, for example, even if they haven't been diagnosed with a cancer, then the bone marrow can't be used.

At least one of the MPNs was only reclassified as a malignant cancer in 2008. One of the mutations was only discovered in 2013. It's very "new" knowledge. So until that point, people with the mutation but no symptoms or diagnoses would have been able to donate, but now testing would pick up up and they can't donate anymore. That's just one example. There will be others that have impacted donation eligibility, and I don't think medical advances are the only reason, but it'll likely play a part.

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