Moving to Munich, Germany from California, US

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The-American-Abroad@reddit

Despite what people or stats tell you, this isn’t a lot of money for Germany. I can’t tell from your comment but I assume you mean you’re making 4x the 100k euros currently, so 400k usd?

No chance I’d turn that down for 100k euros in Germany. Just work more now and save up, then retire or visit the EU on vacation.

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

Sorry for the confusion, this is just base salary. I edited the post. My RSUs and bonus don’t change doing this internal transfer.

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The-American-Abroad@reddit

In that case it might be worth it. Depending on where you are in the US 160k isn’t a ton of money. And 100k is solid in Munich but not rich or even upper middle class.

So the modest hit might be worth the move to a place with better healthcare, nature access, etc.

For me personally it would come down to long-term income (stay in US) and retire sooner vs. plan on staying in Munich long enough to become a citizen. I wouldn’t go to Munich if you don’t intend on staying long enough for that.

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Long_Relationship578@reddit

I live in Munich, it will be more than enough to live confotably. Although I would really suggest trying to learn German, even if you can work in english, you will be constantly on a massive disadvantage if you dont speak the language from finding doctors/ banking and investing/ finding housing/ ect...

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

I’ve been told. Actively learning the language. Thanks!

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elijha@reddit

€100k is an extremely generous salary for someone who doesn’t seem to have a basic understanding of percentages

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Midnight_Will@reddit

He just misplaced the “less” but I get your confusion

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

Precisely this..

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Hellsticks@reddit

You should be able to live comfortably off that. If not you are doing something wrong.

Most expensive will be your apartment for sure.

My wife and I live off 75k combined salary very close to Munich (like 15 minutes by train)

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

Thanks for sharing yours! I’ve heard apartment hunting is quite rough, any recommendations for housing? We were planning to do Mr. lodge or airbnb for initial 6-8 months and do a proper apartment hunting after we move there and get familiar with the city.

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Hellsticks@reddit

Yeah, the housing market is not fun at all. Expect to pay somewhere around 1.5k euros for a 2 rooms + kitchen and Bathroom. The biggest problem is usually the absolute abundance of people showing up for apartments.

Your plan should work. I think 6-8 months is enough to find an apartment. Germans tend to want a lot of info, even some stuff you technically don’t have to provide. Usually when looking for an apartment, I have real applications for that. Just for describing who my wife and I are.

It’s annoying but it helps finding a place

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Ok-Test-7634@reddit

around 1.5k euros for a 2 rooms + kitchen and Bathroom

yeah, that's unrealistic for Munich, it's more like 2.5k euros

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starwyo@reddit

Ask them to support finding an apartment and costs in your contract.

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aroused_axlotl007@reddit

100k€ a year puts you in the top 5% of earners in Germany, so you should be fine. However, Munich is the most expensive city in Germany, so be prepared for high rents (from a European perspective)

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SellSideShort@reddit

100k a year is 62k after taxes. Being in the top 5% means nothing in Munich. Gotta be the worst place live in Europe. Weather sucks, food sucks, the people the language, forget about it.

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Midnight_Will@reddit

You must be a troll.

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SellSideShort@reddit

Not trolling. Speaking the truth. Like I said I’ve lived in Zurich since 2018, ask any expat in Zurich is they would ever consider living in Munich, the answer is always no, and it’s not even close. Lot of people in this sub have never even been there let alone lived in a European city enough to understand which European cities are good/bad and why.

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Midnight_Will@reddit

And ask any expat in Munich whether they’d live in Zurich, same answer. Do you actually have any rational arguments I can proceed to debunks as to why Munich would be the shithole you mention, or are you just blowing off steam against a city you clearly don’t like?

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

These rankings of “high quality of life” are such bs. I know many people who moved to North of Europe (arguably the region of the world with the highest quality of life in the planet) and they’re fucking miserable and depressed.

The weather is so shit, the food is shit, people are very cold and anti social, mentality is very conservative / backwards in some of these regions and just their way of living is very hard from someone that comes from a warm country or a warm region of the world. I live in north of Europe myself and I can’t wait to move to California US too (and I’m not American).

I think you guys just got delusional about north of Europe with these rankings that have metrics about very specific things. Yes work life balance is better in the EU than California but life is more than that. Nothing replaces living in a sunny warm environment with so much biodiversity and great amazing spicy food and people who are very social.

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Midnight_Will@reddit

Yeah, why do we have high quality of life rankings when we clearly have you holding all the knowledge of the “many people you know”. Let’s stay on the example of Germany. Weather? I know what bad weather is. I’m Italian, lived in Ireland, and Munich weather is VERY good.

I personally don’t give a crap about the “sunny weather in California” where right at my doorsteps I have countries like Italy, France, Spain, with more history, cultural and culinary diversity, and better weather than your beloved California ever could aspire to have.

Seriously, you don’t like it here, go back and enjoy the 10 days vacation a year plus the unhealthy food.

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

I see you’re very hurt by people having different options than yourself. And the thing about southern Europe is yes the culture and weather is amazing but salaries are dog shit low. I guess that’s the reason you moved to Ireland and then Germany instead of staying in Italy right? There’s no point in living in such countries if you don’t have the money to do anything.

California in the US doesn’t have this problem. Highest paying jobs in the world, biggest market, amazing weather. You can go surf, swim, skiing , go hike on the mountains or the florest or go to the desert all in the same day.

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Midnight_Will@reddit

the only thing that happens is I’m ticked off by entitled Americans who think they know best. You don’t. Your country is 400 years old, your president is holding the world hostage because as a country you have failed to remove power from a senile old man the same way you would take an old man’s driving license away. You have a fundamental lack of democracy, you have rampant racism, poverty, obesity, mental health problems, a joke healthcare system, speak only one language and are fully unable to learn another one even for the basics, yet you feel entitled to come to Europe, spend 1-2 years here for the ‘gram, and think you can pass judgment.

Trust me, you can’t. So don’t tell me California is the perfect place and Southern Italy is, because you’re just being blind to all the stuff I said above. By contrast, I do acknowledge the problems of our countries, while acknowledging that there’s no single perfect place.

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

Your assumptions are so wrong you don’t even understand. First of all I’m not even American, I was born and raised in southern Europe. I have lived and experienced the reality in southern Europe, North of Europe and California and I can tell you from my own experience I was way happier and content in California than north or south of Europe, because California has the best of both worlds.

But continue to ramp and give hate for no reason. You have no ideia what you’re talking about.

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Midnight_Will@reddit

It doesn’t really matter if you’re American or not. America - and that includes California - has a plethora of issues - which I’ve only begun to describe. So again, don’t tell me California has the best of both worlds when you’re willingly ignoring the glaring issues I’ve brought up. Yes salaries in Italy are shit, yes people in Germany can be rude and cold, but I’ll take that any day now over a collapsing society. So you’re the one with the head under the sand, not me.

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

You say the US is collapsing (yes it’s true) but you’re blindly ignoring that Europe is collapsing as well. Young people can’t afford to move out of their parents house, houses are expensive through the roof, cost of living is extremely high for the low shit salaries we have, taxes are insane, and Europe is so dependent on everyone’s resource (China, the US and the Middle East) that just one thing collapsing (like the strait of Hormuz with Iran blocking it making everything from oil to gas to fuel extremely expensive) will collapse their entire society.

This current administration is just temporary and won’t last forever. And the US has more than enough resources to not dependent on others countries (they have gas, oil, fuel , strongest army in the world etc). What Europe has? Only regulations.

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

I live in Sweden and Europe and America are just designed to be very different. Agree that does ”high quality of life” surveys are very theoretical. Have relatives in Southern California that immigrated from Iran (I’m originally Iranian) and they’re very happy! I love it there everytime I go to visit

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SellSideShort@reddit

Of course they’ll say that, they don’t have the option to live/work in Zurich where they’ll make 50% higher salary and have lower taxes, cleaner city, and a strong currency. Instead they hang in Munich making slightly more than the sea of migrants from the Middle East on Bürgergeld. Place is dirty, high cost of living, low salaries, high taxes, increasingly high number of population from the Middle East on unemployment benefits. Go ask in any European sub if they would leave for Munich, it’s not just the Swiss that wouldn’t. Place is a dump.

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ButterscotchSilver15@reddit

Munich is the worst place to live in Europe? Funniest thing I read today.

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RoundAd4247@reddit

I hope you’re not working with numbers. 160 000 US dollars is approx 135 000 euros. How do you get “less than 25 %” of your current salary if you’ll be pis 100 000 euros?

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ButterscotchSilver15@reddit

Why are you asking me?

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akie@reddit

Ok so either all the international rankings are wrong or you are wrong 🤔

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SellSideShort@reddit

Lmfao man you are in for a rude awakening, but don’t worry it’ll be a good one. No better way to get a swift slap back to reality of the US being one of the best places in the world than to go live in one of the supposed best places to live according to Reddit. I’m American and have lived in Zurich for the last 7 years and trust me when I tell you that Munich is an absolute sh*t hole. Not to mention that 100k there is 62k after taxes.

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blackkettle@reddit

Southern Californian 13 yrs in Zurich. I love Zurich. Munich is great for Oktoberfest. I would not want to live there.

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

Zürich is so fancy for real🩷, used to take the flixbus there from Freiburg when I was in my exchange semester ☺️

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Midnight_Will@reddit

Go back to the US and get shot in a school, accosted by ICE, bankrupt for an ambulance, or stabbed on the bus then. You absolute delusional person

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SellSideShort@reddit

Maybe lay off the media for a bit?

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

What is the percentage of Americans where this happens?

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Midnight_Will@reddit

This guy is saying Munich (one the cities in the world consistently ranked for highest quality of life) is a shit hole and you challenge me on the percentages?

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

I’m Iranian/swedish and everytime I go to Orange County to visit family I don’t want to go back to Europe 😭

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

Money wise it’s not going to be an advantage, why are you interested in an internal transfer?

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

I’m aware of the downward adjustment, but I just wanted to ensure that the adjustment is fair to me.

Regarding the why: personally me and my wife are tired of the live-to-work hustle culture, the long visa wait times in the US (we are not US citizens), and we always wanted to experience living in EU.

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proof_required@reddit

Have you read about how pensions work in Germany? It's a downgrade in so many ways. Higher taxes, bad pension system, low salary, language barrier. I hope your 401K is good enough already.

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

Basically EU comps your education and medical bills in exchange for a cut in your paycheck. You will not have as much money in your wallet as in the US but there isn’t a big consumer culture here as well. Germans are very known to be cost aware so you won’t be looked down upon for bringing lunch boxes to work etc. Munich has amazing nature and close to Central Europe so you can easily make weekend trips

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akie@reddit

Germans are cost aware in general yes, but this is Munich. People are fancy.

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

Still German! I know fancy Germans (lived in Freiburg) and they’re still quite humble when it comes to spending

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

I can’t believe you’re leaving California one of the best places in the world with best weather and higher salaries and career opportunities (and people are very social and warm) and Mexican food to fucking Munich Germany where the weather is shit, food is shit, salaries are lower and taxes are insane and people are very cold.

Really, what is the thinking process here?

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Indiansummerxx@reddit

Sounds depressing.

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FinFreedomCountdown@reddit

SF Bay Area has the best weather in the world. Can’t believe you would sacrifice that for lower pay moving to Munich.

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Uncle_Richard98@reddit

Exactly

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Midnight_Will@reddit

I think the conversion checks out. I am married too and my salary is around 80k + 10% bonus and benefits/stocks. Not happy with it but it’s well above average.

Does your wife work too?

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BitLox@reddit

Salaries in Germany are always quoted as "after tax" - is this 100k€ after tax?

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all-and-nothing@reddit

No, they're not. They couldn't even if they wanted to, since your tax rate highly depends on your private circumstances which your employer is not supposed to be aware of.

Source: I was born and raised in Germany and still spend over 6 months a year here.

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BitLox@reddit

Ah, it's been a long time since I lived there so must have changed. I just remember early 90s it was always quoted as "netto"

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That_Quality_8957@reddit

Finding decent apartments in Munich is hard many have roommates and pay 6000€ just for a room so if your company can help you out with that you will have more money at the end of the work day. MUC is really expensive unlike Berlin

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Roadterror@reddit (OP)

Yikes! That’s a lot! Any recommendations or tips for apartment hunting? We were planning to do Mr. Lodge or Airbnb for initial months. My company will not be able to provide temporary living as it’s an employee-requested internal transfer.

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