Engine swapping A320neos
Posted by beezxs@reddit | aviation | View on Reddit | 20 comments
If an airline such as American were to buy ex spirit A320neos, but wanted to put CFM LEAPs on them instead, would they be able to purchase the airframe and purchase new engines, while selling the old engines?
Also, is it possible to have one of each engine on the same aircraft?
Clement_fandango_jr@reddit
They would also have to swap out at least the entire wing leading edge wiring harnesses as they are engine specific, however as the company i work for is the sole supplier of those harnesses that would be great.
Boris_the_pipe@reddit
No, it's not possible. There are more differences than engine itself. Such as switches in the cockpit,system software and engine control computers
ItsMeOnly3@reddit
Off the top of my head: the first 777 had this done. Flew with PW4000 engines, then it was modified for RR Trent and used by Cathay Pacific until retirement.
Also Boeing addressed it in Dreamliner with so-called Common interface and advertised that type change can take no more than 24 hours. But obviously it was never really done as of today (I believe Norwegian Long Haul was close because of RR fiasco, but it went insolvent before they even tried).
beezxs@reddit (OP)
Could an airline potentially upgrade the engines on the A320neo from the -271 to -272 platform?
Difficult_Camel_1119@reddit
Changing between the different versions of the same engine is usually only paper work and software update, so that could be financially worth it (I think it was done on some A320ceo)
badkapp00@reddit
I'm not sure if going from the -271 to the -272 is an upgrade. -272 are less powerful engines.
Nevertheless this shouldn't be a big deal as it is the same engine type, just a different variant. A lot of software updates to reflect the engines in all the equipment has to be done.
mikepapafoxtrot@reddit
And when airlines such as Air New Zealand had enough of their 787s with Trent 1000 being unreliable they just ordered a new batch with GEnx.
Difficult_Camel_1119@reddit
Apart from prototype and testing airplanes (that sometimes get into normal service after successful tests), I think I heard that it was done on a few planes of one of the older Boeing models
spacecadet2399@reddit
Not financially viable as there's a lot that goes into an engine swap. And these are relatively new engines you're talking about. You're not talking about re-engining a 30 year old airframe. It'd be like buying a car that's a year or two old and then immediately replacing the engine. It wouldn't make sense.
As for using two different engines on the same plane, no. Honestly I'm sure there is some kind of regulation against that but I can't point you to it. But I know the FMS software/hardware and airline training are not in any way, shape or form designed for that. There's no way it could work. (Yes, I know there have been cases where different engines are installed on the same plane for *testing* purposes. That is a whole different thing.)
drone_driver24@reddit
I worked on UPS 727’s that had been re-engined with Rolls Royce Tay’s. They also got a glass cockpit, Hud, GPS. They were pretty cool airplanes.
MixDifferent2076@reddit
An engine type swap would involve a master change which is prohibitively expensive. The better option is to acquire an aircraft fitted with the desired engine choice.
quackquack54321@reddit
God I hope they do, as my company is depending on it.
Fisheye4848@reddit
Spirit will more than likely part out their planes. They will get more for them that way. Whatever is left gets scrapped.
ThirdSunRising@reddit
Engine swaps aren’t as easy on a jet airliner as they are on your Silverado. Yes all the wiring and plumbing needs to match as do the mounts, but that’s assuming the airframe is already certified for the engine you’d like to use.
prof-bunnies@reddit
They did things like this in the past but there are large inventory of parked aircraft and cost wise in time & money make it a no go for the most part.
Identify what model you are looking for and check the times on parts. See if it needs a B or C check, change the interior if needed and change the logos, etc. line up the purchase or more likely lease and 2-4 weeks you have a "new to you" plane on the line.
With airlines it is always about the cost and how fast can we get this back into the air to make money.
gyzmo1981@reddit
To answer your questions: no, it's forbidden to have two different types of engines on a commercial aircraft. Furthermore, changing the engine alters the aircraft's certification and therefore incurs a significant cost, purely from an administrative standpoint. Add to that the actual modifications to the aircraft itself: engine, pylons, electronics... In short, it costs more than buying a new plane. The only cases I know of where modifications are permitted are on military aircraft, like AWACS or supertankers. But since it's military, the rules are different.
SubarcticFarmer@reddit
Fedex re-engined their 727s while they still had them.
It's incredibly rare, but it does happen. And yes, it's expensive, but the approvals can be done as an STC so basically that part of it might only need to be done once.
gyzmo1981@reddit
You're right to point out that it's a change to the STC. The problem is that this change has to be made in each administration of every country the aircraft plans to overfly. In the example you gave (the 727s), they never applied to EASA and therefore didn't fly transatlantic flights.
Exact-Occasion-6204@reddit
727 doesn’t have the range to fly TATL with any meaningful payload.
Disastrous-Wall-6943@reddit
It's possible to re-engine an airliner but it's a big engineering endeavor and financial obligation.