Can you hear "and we'll" clearly in this dialogue? (Beginner question of British English listening)

Posted by SpecialistSilent9617@reddit | AskUK | View on Reddit | 39 comments

Begginer question of Biritish English listening.

From this audio -- https://youtu.be/XJ89xlag9y0?t=77 --, how was 'and we'll' pronounced? I can hear a very faint 'll sound right before the word 'put', but I'm not sure how to catch 'and we'll' ( The sentence is ''Good, Then fire up the forge and we'll put it up together"). Can you hear "and we'll" clearly in this dialogue?

If you(native British speakers) transcribe this audio without subtitles, do you think you would write 'and we'll'? Or is it difficult to judge exactly 'and we'll' without the script?"

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WhaleMeatFantasy@reddit

He’s not saying ‘and’. He is saying ‘will’ but the vowel is lost and you’re hearing a dark /l/.

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Cilfaen@reddit

He is saying "and", it's just reduced to such a degree to effectively just be "n" - not an uncommon speech contraction in a lot of the UK.

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reddiuniquefool@reddit

This is what I hear as well. The 'and' is almost not there at all.

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WhaleMeatFantasy@reddit

There’s no phonetic value there for ‘and’, at least on my phone speaker.

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Cilfaen@reddit

It's there, it's just incredibly subtle. I wouldn't consciously hear it if I wasn't specifically listening for it.

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WhaleMeatFantasy@reddit

I’m a trained phonetician. I’m not hearing it. But as I said, it might be a speaker issue.

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Cilfaen@reddit

I can't claim to be a trained phonetician, nor to know exactly what you need to hear to categorise it as a phonetic value. I am, however, a native Englishman with family from Yorkshire. I was about to say I'm not discrediting your analysis, but that would be wrong. I am discrediting it, because there is an audible vocalisation for "and" at that timestamp. It also isn't just me, as the majority of other top level replies on this post are also identifying its presence.

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KeithLimePie@reddit

It's definitely there.

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KeithLimePie@reddit

I'm from Yorkshire and I can 100% hear the 'n'

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SpecialistSilent9617@reddit (OP)

Thank you! May I ask one more question?

https://youtu.be/XJ89xlag9y0?t=74 "Have you got the charcoal?"

Can you hear 'Have' before 'you'?

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KeithLimePie@reddit

Yeah straight away.

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SearchingSiri@reddit

I do, but it's also a bit shortened and sounds more like "uve", which is also common for that accent. I lived there for a bit so more used to it maybe. Basically skipping the H of Have, then softening it a bit to uve.

Also, this has made me realise why I often struggle more with actual Spanish speakers, even slowed down, I'm definitely not near good enough to detect any shortenings etc.

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newtonbase@reddit

My mum lives in Andalucía and their accent is impossible for me. They seem to skip lots of shorter words and also the beginning of words eg Hasta becomes 'ta

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WhaleMeatFantasy@reddit

He isn’t saying ‘have’ in full.

The audio quality is poor and I cannot slow it down properly on my phone, but it sounds to me like he’s just producing a hint of the final consonant of ‘have’ at the start of the glide into ‘you’. It’s almost akin to ‘view’.

That (as well as omitting the ‘have’ entirely) are standard in British English.

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Historical_Panda9701@reddit

He is not saying "will". It's "we'll" with a Yorkshire accent. I'll agree there's no 'and' though.

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WhaleMeatFantasy@reddit

Sorry yes thats a typo.

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Jayatthemoment@reddit

Yes, it’s very clear to a native speaker. Modal verbs such as ‘will’ are contracted and not emphasised much at all.

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Pockysocks@reddit

The "and we'll" isn't enunciated but it is clearly heard and understood as it is how it would typically be said in regular conversation.

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DameKumquat@reddit

It's more 'fire up t'forge 'n'we'll put it'- there's a definite glottal stop in there indicating the 'n'.

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Plaisteach@reddit

Not answering the question but is that the voice of Sean Bean?

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chris_282@reddit

No, it's actor Matthew Wolf.

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No_Ring_3348@reddit

Hello dear beginner listener, please watch this excellent short video from esteemed linguist Dr Geoff Lindsay on 'weak forms', which will explain exactly what you're hearing, and why native speakers don't actually pronounce the words that they should: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EaXYas58_kc

Believe me when I say this will make something click in your brain.

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Sad_Cardiologist5388@reddit

Drumming up hits for these videos again...

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Suitable-Tough5877@reddit

Youve got some confusing replies....so I may as well add to them...

Firstly, my hearing is not that good, this is the sort of thing I really struggle with when learning foreign languages myself. I had to play the clips numerous times to try and identify the sound. As often with language learning dialogues, it seems to be a combination of unnaturally slow and stilted longer sentences, and carelessly enunciated but authentic sounding shorter sentences.

Fwiw I heard the sounds as a short "w'll" like a shorter "wull" (and no "and") and "vyou" - no "have" or any preceding vowel, but the answer saying it was "h'yuh" is certainly plausible English.

Tbh I don't think there is any way to expect a language learner to identify these sounds just from listening.. you basically need to have the language model in your head already.

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Sea-Still5427@reddit

Native English speakers, even with different regional and class accents, often barely pronounce unstressed words and syllables. Here, the sound is reduced to something like 'n w'l'.

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Alwayslearnin41@reddit

I'm hearing "fire up the forge an'w'll put it all together" which is 'and we'll ' said very fast and in an accent. As a native speaker I would hear 'and we'll' even though he says it like that.

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Spiritual_Process_50@reddit

Yep this. I had to listen to it twice to make sure I wasn't adding and we'll into the sentence without hearing it. Just be happy its not a yorkshire accent

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littlehamster_@reddit

I'd write this as "and we'll" but since he's saying it with an accent he's actually not saying all the words fully and out loud. It's more like "n-w'll" with the "n" barely noticeable and used as a leading sound into "we'll" - we know it's there because otherwise we would hear a more clear break between "forge" and "we'll". It's very common for whole words to be skipped in British English especially certain accents, shortened to just one letter or sound or replaced with a glottal stop.

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SpecialistSilent9617@reddit (OP)

May I ask one more question?

https://youtu.be/XJ89xlag9y0?t=74 The sentence is "Have you got the charcoal?"

Can you hear 'Have' before 'you'?

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Ziphoblat@reddit

It’s there but it’s extremely subtle. It’s just the v sound from “have” which is present, leading into the “you” (which again is a little shortened to more of a y sound). v’y got

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littlehamster_@reddit

Yes it's definitely there, but again this word is being used to soften the beginning of "you". I can hear a very slight utterance before he pronounces the "Y" in "you" - that's the "Have". It's being pronounced more like "h'yuh" instead of "have you", which is really common in many accents.

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Opening_Nose_2347@reddit

Some UK accents pronounce "we'll" like "wheel" others like "will", the later can be said very quickly. You are right, it is only just voiced but it is there, just said very quickly and quietly. As you improve, you will begin to lose the need to refer back to the written word; speech is much less perfect and more variant.

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