The Top Trade Partner of Every European Country. Did you expect this?

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

Greece "embargoed" North Macedonia (in 90's) I believe over the flag, & they changed it to that... weird shape of theirs.

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Kooky_Resource6348@reddit

That’s correct but what does that have to do with this post, sorry I’m confused 😅

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

North Macedonia (according to this map) is, still, heavily "dependent" on us.

(they should probably "diversify" at least from a perspective of a North Macedonian nationalist, lol).

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

eh?

lol.

y wouldn't we?

current "trade relationship" is favourable, for Greece.

I'm saying, from a North Macedonian nationalist perspective, it makes no sense to "continue" it.

one of the reasons Greece "pushed around" North Macedonia is the (rather extreme) trade imbalance.

(then again, North Macedonian nationalists also dislike Bulgaria...).

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markohf12@reddit

Current trade relationship is favorable for both of us, I would say it's more favorable for us than it is for you.

One of the reasons why the naming dispute was resolved is due to the trade relationship, if we had little or no trade relationship both sides wouldn't budge, like it is currently we Bulgaria, nobody really cares about Bulgaria here and they also don't really care about us either.

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

North Macedonia is irrelevant, for us. (as long as they don't try, like, unilaterally changing the agreement, or something crazy like trying to annex "Solun" or whatever).

it's favourable, for u, in the sense that the trade w/ Greece helps ur economy.

it's favourable, for us, for both economic/trade & also geo-political reasons.

however, for North Macedonian nationalists - being "dependent" on Greece means North Macedonia has, practically, 0 leverage, over Greece.

(whereas for instance, if economic interactions w/ Bulgaria r fewer, Bulgarian influence is minimized, like u said).

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markohf12@reddit

North Macedonia is irrelevant, for us.

Yes it is, it's super relevant for you on national security grounds, if there ever is an armed conflict between you and Turkey, you want the country 40km away from Thessaloniki to be on your side, which side we support can basically change the outcome from a multi year stalemate to a 24 hour military operation.

Your gov. knows this which is why it tries to build positive relations with us, we know that as well which is why we used to build positive relations with Turkey.

as long as they don't try, like, unilaterally changing the agreement

Both sides want the agreement, both sides claim they want to abolish it, Mickovski and Mitsotakis keep saying the same thing, it's called winning nationalist politics and yet no one did anything.

or something crazy like trying to annex "Solun"

You have to be insane to think that the possibility of something like this happening is higher than absolute 0%.

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pitogyros@reddit

I think you overestimate the significance of your country in terms of Greek / Turkish conflict , you certainly can’t change the outcome from many years to few hours , not even from 5 years to 4 years.

Yes you are close to us but with insignificant military power which is no serious threat for Greece and especially for Turkey in case you decided to fully support Greece.

On the other hand in such bad scenario ( conflict in Balkans ) you should pursue fully neutrality to avoid getting caught in a mess that could potentially cripple your country for decades.

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markohf12@reddit

I am not estimating it biased on our military power, it's irrelevant, I am estimating it based on our geography and proximity to strategic Greek land.

Scenario A: We are neutral or support Greece - Turkey can only do a land invasion through Thrace which is a mountainous narrow long terrain that can easily be defended. They would also have to use Air+Sea power for the rest, making landings island by island until they reach the mainland. This makes your entire country basically an island, an advantage the UK and US have.

Scenario B: We support Turkey - Turkey moves massive amount of their troops near Gevgelija and Bitola, maybe even build a couple of military bases there. On the Gevgelija side they can speedrun through the Vardar valley which is difficult to protect, empty and flat and basically cut your entire country in half within hours, all while Scenario A is still in motion.

See how big of a difference that makes?

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pitogyros@reddit

So in your scenario you are gonna make your country a battleground for Greece and Turkey and make your cities into rubles by being bombed non stop just to say “ ha-ha “ to Greece ?

There is no way in any scenario your country is gonna put itself in that mess by supporting either Turkey or Greece , especially since you are in nato now , this scenario is science fiction.

150% you ll be neutral

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markohf12@reddit

Ehh, all of what I wrote is a hypothetical what if example, this is also very extreme and would probably need a chain of very negative events (including hostilities) for this example to happen, think of Azerbaijan and Armenia type of negative relations to even make this situation plausible.

You are thinking of the current situation, our relations are positive (the gov. state <> state ones, not the people relations, we hate each other cuz nationalism). I don’t think it will be neutral, I believe we will probably support you.

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SOHONEYSAME@reddit

first,

NO Greek (well except some delusional people, like the virgin, above, who cares more for Palestine than his own country, lol) believes North Macedonia side w/ us.

we know North Macedonia (& Albania) would side w/ Turkey, (Bulgaria, I'm not sure).

the North Macedonian "hate" of Greece is fundamental, (amongst nationalists) cause of propaganda.

"can basically change the outcome from a multi year stalemate to a 24 hour military operation"

exaggeration, lol.

yes, it would be "harder" obviously but if u think Greece would collapse within 24 hours u r beyond delusional, lmao.

I don't think u realize how capable/strong of armed force Greece has, (our air-force is, currently, ahead of the Turkey one, in terms of quality).

"Both sides want the agreement, both sides claim they want to abolish it, Mickovski and Mitsotakis keep saying the same thing, it's called winning nationalist politics and yet no one did anything"

show ONE instance of the Greek PM saying this. (that he will unilaterally change the agreement).

Greece is a serious country, geo-politically, believe it or not.

(this is the same shit Turkey does, where they claim that we "plan to attack" them or whatever bs).

"You have to be insane to think that the possibility of something like this happening is higher than absolute 0%

I don't think it would.

however, 2 things.

I can go to ur sub, & find loads of posts mentioning "Solun" being "occupied" etc.

u can't do the same for ANY North Macedonia place, cause no one has any imperialist ambitions against North Macedonia. (not even actual irredentist).

it's ur government that, before the agreement, included de-facto territorial claims against Greece. (even if "ambiguous").

so, no.

I don't think u would.

but, if some crazy nationalist wins power & it becomes, a "national mission" or whatever, eh.

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markohf12@reddit

Man, how do you write like this it's difficult to read.

we know North Macedonia (& Albania) would side w/ Turkey

We won't, we have no reason to anymore also we don't want to have Turkey as a neighbor either lol.

yes, it would be "harder" obviously but if u think Greece would collapse within 24 hours u r beyond delusional, lmao.

Geography plays a major role, one of the reasons why Trump wants Greenland, it changes the odds a lot even though the US is basically a superpower. Also one of the reasons why the invasion of Ukraine happened from Belarus as well.

I don't think u realize how capable/strong of armed force Greece has, (our air-force is, currently, ahead of the Turkey one, in terms of quality).

It is capable yes, but let's be honest, it's not even close to the capacity Turkey has. Turkey has one advantage Greece doesn't have and that's military experience. Turkey is actively involved in conflicts in the middle east and also has a massive winning streak.

I can go to ur sub, & find loads of posts mentioning "Solun" being "occupied" etc.

A subreddit as a source, seriously?

it's ur government that, before the agreement, included de-facto territorial claims against Greece

No gov. since 1991 ever claimed Greek lands. Disputes were mostly about history, name and minority rights.

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Kooky_Resource6348@reddit

ahh okay. Well, if business is going great, I don’t see why N. Macedonia should diversify. If anything N. Macedonia should try to make the trade relations even better with Greece if their plan is to join the EU in the future

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icancount192@reddit

Don't mind them they are demented. They are a laughing stock in the Greek subreddit.

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sheynzonna@reddit

Σοβαρό σαμπ.

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icancount192@reddit

And here's the second laughing stock, the gooner fascist

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YngwieMainstream@reddit

Don't be upset, communism is not possible in Greece due to geography, corruption (outside the law interactions) and the overall Greek spirit. But sometimes I wished it succeeded in the 50-60 so you guys can feel it firsthand.

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icancount192@reddit

Yes we were so lucky we only had a fascist dictatorship for 7 years, mass exiles torture islands for 30 years, political murders and beatings. And we also had the Nazi collaborators out of prison murdering, raping and torturing in what is known as the "White Terror"

So lucky was Greece.

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YngwieMainstream@reddit

What socialism? Yugoslavian socialism? Even that would have been bad. But your commies (who found refuge in Romania, learn your history) would have never agreed with communism lite.

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icancount192@reddit

Yes they found refuge in Romania, because the Greek fascists after the Civil war were killing them and their families.

Again, learn history.

Greece had it as bad as the Eastern block. You didn't have torture islands and fascists executing in mass graves.

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YngwieMainstream@reddit

Bro... you could fucking LEAVE, lol

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icancount192@reddit

If you were a leftist you couldn't. My father made fake papers to immigrate to West Germany and when he came back to visit they captured, tortured him and sent him to a camp.

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YngwieMainstream@reddit

I mean, I am 100% certain he would have done the same if he won the power.

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icancount192@reddit

He didn't fight in the civil war and wasn't even a Communist then. He became after that.

Extremism radicalizes people.

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sheynzonna@reddit

Just because I don't become a brainless commie like y'all that doesn't make me a gooner fascist.

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icancount192@reddit

Nope you're just a gooner fascist, jerking it off to Molly like a basement dwelling loser

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Kooky_Resource6348@reddit

your profile picture got me :>

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Putrid_Speed_5138@reddit

This is misinformation.

The EU is Turkey's top trade partner for both exports and imports. In terms of a single country, it's Germany.

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alkorisno@reddit

Oec.world says imports from china are 44 billion, germany 27, russia 26. Source for the image is IMF

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Putrid_Speed_5138@reddit

When you refer to a trade partner, it should count both imports and exports.

China was Turkey's third biggest trade partner in 2024, and it rose to the second place last year, according to official figures.

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alkorisno@reddit

I was just correcting the original comment, said both import and export and it is not even close to imports. In case of just adding import and export values, which is kinda weird to me for some reason, both germany and china get to around 48, so very close and it could depend on rounding up or sources I guess.

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