Actions have consequences
Posted by Obnomus@reddit | linux | View on Reddit | 202 comments
I'm a Linux user who has been using it for 4 years, I try to help if I can. I saw a new user use CachyOS with Hyprland, they had some issues and few people said "Action have consequences" "Niche distro with niche window managers with niche screen sharing app" "They should have chose kde or gnome". None of them are helping but lecturing that person for choosing what they liked. Issue was related to RDP. Now I understand CachyOS is a rolling release, Hyprland isn't something that easy to use, you need to read docs.
My question is what is the meaning of choices then. New user doesn't know about this at all, they'll pick what feels good to them, what looks more appealing.
I want to know your guy's opinions on this.
RetroGrid_io@reddit
Actions do have consequences.
I have always been conservative in my distro choices. Linux isn't just a hobby; it's a tool I leverage. I'm most interested in reliability. In decades of time, the number of times I've had serious problems with the OS is a handful.
Brief_Tie_9720@reddit
Self importance is weirdly but predictably demonstrated among tech user communities online. ‘RTFM’ isn’t an acronym created by people who are great at appreciating diversity in approaches to tech, but corporate cogs who knowingly create backends or security or whatever for important economic forces, mostly all identify as male, and are At least college education adjacent.
Given the demographics of English Reddit tech communities I’m curious what your impression of people who even know KDE and GNOME exist. I feel there’s a defending of one’s superiority in a culture that couldn’t be paid to care about your super awesome tech opinion, people do that for comments about hyprland in part because having an opinion on learning curves in the adoption of niche DEs is a behavior that’s typical of people in these communities?
Cyberspace_Sorcerer@reddit
I too always try to help.
But what annoys me is that there are a lot of people who refuse to do the slightest bit of research or put any amount of effort into fixing the problem. Obviously that isn't just a problem in the Linux space, i see it everywhere on Reddit.
But for the average new Linux user all it takes is less than five minutes of research to figure out that installing Arch Linux or Gentoo with Hyprland is a bad idea for them.
But lets say they really want to try out Arch Linux, which is totally fine. But the moment any problem arises, they directly come to Reddit and ask us to fix their problem with as little information as possible.
Don't get me wrong, I love helping people fix their PC related problems. But when i see someone ask for help on a problem that has been solved a 100 times already, it's really annoying because first of all, they give as little information as possible about their predicament. Second, 90% of the time all it would have taken was using the Reddit search bar or just looking up the problem on google.
What puzzles me is that with the widespread(well kind of) adoption of Linux these days, there are so many resources for new users out there!
But no, a google search would require too much effort.
Indolent_Bard@reddit
One Google search is fine. When you have to Google the explanation for the answer you got, that's going too far.
Afraid_Formal5748@reddit
Are you sure most people to not search? I would go as far as to say they do not understand what the supossed answer means.
If I search for something with Linux by default I get to pages that are way to far way from my knowledge base that it is offputing.
Figurarively it is as if a 5 year old ask you something but you give the answer only someone with a university degree or 10+ years of experience might understand.
FryBoyter@reddit
New users usually go for whatever’s currently popular.
And they usually do so without giving it a second thought or even bothering to find out the slightest bit about it. I can well imagine that quite a few users started out with Hyprland, for example (without having used https://wiki.hypr.land), and were put off by Linux because of the way it works.
I didn’t find the answers you mentioned particularly helpful either. But they aren’t entirely wrong.
I also believe that newcomers aren’t stupid. A beginner might well realise for themselves that something like Hyprland, which works completely differently to what they’re used to, isn’t the best idea to start with. But to do that, you’d have to do some research beforehand. And in my experience, that’s the problem with many beginners these days. Many beginners these days are simply too lazy. That is why it is becoming more and more difficult to help people.
Indolent_Bard@reddit
A good operating system is made for the lazy.
Square-Singer@reddit
What's also difficult is the difference between CSS and FOSS when it comes to new versions of stuff.
On CSS you always want to be on the newest version when getting into things. You wouldn't install Win10 on a PC now, same as you wouldn't buy a phone with Android 12 on it in 2026.
Because CSS is usually (of course, we know Microsoft exists) released when it's actually ready, and going with an older version means you will be outdated and left without support soon.
FOSS works differently. Stuff is often released years before it's actually good to use it. For example, Wayland was released in 2008, and it took probably 10 years before it was a good idea to run it completely. Also, old stuff is maintained for far longer. You can still run X11 without any issues.
So if you come from CSS, expecting that the newest stuff is always the best, this can land you in a lot of trouble if you end up on Linux in bleeding edge territory.
AMGz20xx@reddit
CachyOS is quite popular, not at all niche. Same with Hyprland. Linux is about freedom and choice. If I'm asking for help in a certain application, I expect answers, not "You should have used X instead of Y", "Skill issue", or "RTFM". If you're not going to answer my question, don't waste my time (and yours). If I'm asking for help with Hyprland, I expect answers related to Hyprland, not comments like "GNOME is better, you should have used that" that aren't related to my question.
Indolent_Bard@reddit
At least Google your question first. It seems that's what frustrates people the most.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
How dare you use common sense.
Lisanicolas365@reddit
People recommend CachyOS to beginners because they, for some reason, assume a new user won't have any issues or any breakage in a rolling bleeding edge Arch distro
CircuitSynapse42@reddit
Someone in my life once told me that while I mean well, I have an issue helping others because I "assume a level of knowledge that just isn't there." This is pretty much how I would describe the Linux community most days; we mean well, but we often forget what its like to be a Linux newbie.
CachyOS is great, but recommending it to someone who has never used Linux before and is just trying to ease their way into it and figure out how to do basic things is doing that new user a great disservice. It's like getting into a new game and having some veteran player trying to push their min/max builds on you before you've event had a chance to explore. Just keep it simple and stick with the distros that are known for being easy for new users so their first Linux experience is hopefully a good one.
ThunderDaniel@reddit
Literally the Curse of Knowledge and is something a lot of well meaning experts struggle with when talking or teaching normies
FriendlyKillerCroc@reddit
Wow what's your IQ if people are telling you things like that?
CircuitSynapse42@reddit
I’m autistic, it comes with the territory, lol.
OneTurnMore@reddit
I agree; I was better at helping noobs 8 years ago when I was a noob.
Lisanicolas365@reddit
Indeed. The reason I put that comment is specifically because that was my first impression of Linux. CachyOS.
After weeks of trying to figure it out, it went something like this:
"Wait, so all the memes about Linux only being available for hackers and terminal experts were actually true?". It made me dislike Linux for a few weeks...
I then tried Kubuntu, and I had a much, much better experience. Makes me sad seeing people recommend CachyOS for newbies, because they might be getting a bad first impression of Linux, just like me.
the_abortionat0r@reddit
I think we need to tone down the meme of rolling releases magically breaking, it doesn't make you sound smart.
Arch was known for breaking back in the day but that was 20% package pipelines not being what they are today and desktop Linux being more hobby than professional grade compared to now, and 80% user error.
That last part is FUCKING IMPORTANT. You don't build CachyOS from scratch. You don't set all your configurations from scratch, you don't pick and choose all your components, it's already done.
99% of "RoLlInInG rEleaSeS bReAk!" reasoning DOES NOT EXIST on prefabbed Arch spins (manjaro is a wild exception but that's entirely a maintainer issue).
Stop spreading this nonsense, the "opinionated" nature of these types of distro erase the stereotypes of Arch breaking.
It's not magic, there's no "newer magically break" spell. If you don't understand that you shouldn't be trying to talk about tech.
sumwale@reddit
I ran Arch about 3 years back for a full year and it did break on me three times, where the entire DE went non-functional twice. So it is still for the adventurous who know the ins and outs of package management, can rollback stuff and search online and wait for new updates and so on. Recommending to new users is a disservice to Linux as a whole which will leave a very poor impression on unsuspecting users who may not even understand the full meaning of "rolling distro".
Duncaen@reddit
Software has breaking changes and rolling release will deliver them whenever. I have no idea about those forks, but as far as I know arch would not do complete migrations for their users.
Maybe we have different definitions of breaking here. Yes distributions are not supposed to literally break all the time.
exedore6@reddit
In that case, how would you implement auto-updates in Arch?
I've run rolling releases with no problems, but I'm not going to go more than a couple of days before telling the computer to check for and apply updates.
A beginner isn't going to do that. Yes, it's extraordinarily unlikely that an update will break your system. But it can and does happen - even if 'breaking your system' means that an important package gets a major upgrade that requires manual intervention.
For me, when making recommendations, I err on the side of stability, that you're not going to sit down to your computer tomorrow to do something, and find that you need to reconfigure this or that tool again.
abbidabbi@reddit
You don't know what breaking and stable means in terms of software updates.
Arch, as a rolling release distro (and thus everything based on it), can have package updates that include new major versions at any time, meaning they can have so called breaking changes that affect the user's system, because stuff was either removed or things work differently know, requiring user intervention. This is the contract between software developers and their users via the chosen versioning model (usually semver or a slight derivation of that). This is what "breaking" or "unstable" means in that context, not that the system will crash randomly during operation.
A crashing system is called "unreliable", which describes software bugs. Those can happen at any time anyway, regardless of the software version and its maturity.
A rolling release distro is therefore always unstable by definition, but it can be totally reliable if you don't encounter any bugs in newly released/packaged software.
In contrast to rolling distros, stable point-release distros usually don't package new major versions until the next point-release, so users won't face breaking changes, which is the whole point of those distros. The drawback of this release model is that users will have to wait for new software to arrive, sometimes for a long time.
Ja_Shi@reddit
This.
I keep recommending Ubuntu to beginners. I dislike both Ubuntu (for all the reasons you can imagine) and Gnome, but for a complete beginner, when something inevitably breaks, that's gonna be the easiest distro to fix. Most likely 4000 people already had the exact same issue and he will find a 2 minutes tutorial on how to fix it.
From this point either they don't want to get better - which as far as I'm aware is neither illegal or against the terms of use - and they'll stay on Ubuntu - which isn't Arch, or Bazzite, or Cachy, but also not Windows - or they do want to get better and might move on to another distro.
In my experience, recommending anything else only increases the chances they'll get overwhelmed and go back to Windows.
King_Corduroy@reddit
Tbh I just don't understand why people recommend Gnome. I tried Gnome 3 when it came out and absolutely hated it, it was like all the worst bits of Unity.
KittensInc@reddit
Because it Just Works.
Is it ugly? Yes. Does it make some questionable design choices? Yes. Does it pamper the user and hide some critical power user options? Yes. Are there DEs with significantly better window management? Yes.
But it Just. Works. No messing around with obscure config files or CLI tools to connect to wifi - your out-of-the-box experience is perfectly functional for the vast majority of users. It is the DE for people who neither know nor care what a "DE" is, and who definitely don't want to spend days tweaking it.
Gnome almost certainly isn't the best DE for power users. But it is definitely the DE with the lowest barrier to entry, making it the logical choice for new Linux users.
WeAreGoingMidtable@reddit
Gnome is NOT a desktop environment, it's a tablet environment.
King_Corduroy@reddit
Exactly. It feels designed for touch screens.
adamkex@reddit
> But it is definitely the DE with the lowest barrier to entry
Lmao what. The DE that requires extensions to have a system tray and the DE that is the least similar to Windows is the lowest barrier of entry? My 73 year old mother uses Plasma 6 without any issues, I can't imagine her using GNOME.
yadius@reddit
My grandma uses Arch BTW
adamkex@reddit
Pacman has been out for over 40 years so she should be familiar with it by now
Serializedrequests@reddit
It's simple and attractive. It has the most design effort of any DE.
King_Corduroy@reddit
I suppose if you really enjoy using ipads then maybe... personally I hate it and think its ugly.
ThinDrum@reddit
Not me. I enjoy using a keyboard and find that GNOME is the best combination of usability, functionality and aesthetics.
I respect your opinion.
emalvick@reddit
I think it's very easy to use out of the box. I set up gnome based distros for non tech people who just need a basic desktop and something like Windows or Mac.
Usually I set them to mint instead of Ubuntu, but that's to keep it simple as I end up as tech support.
Now, personally, I try to use plasma for myself, but I have quit worrying so much about looks as long as it functions decently. I need to get more comfortable with distributions outside the Debian world as I tend to cower from the different command structures that can show up, but i digress, other than that's why I haven't really tried an arch based distro yet to play around with.
Jarngreipr9@reddit
I consider myself a power user and I managed to completely wipe out an entire bar in plasma in just one wrong move.
Unslaadahsil@reddit
Amateur. I once wiped my DE while messing around with bar settings in plasma.
Still not sure how, to be honest.
Jarngreipr9@reddit
Plasma options are like two buttons. One close to the other. One resizes bar, the other nukes the home folder. I still love it, it's beautiful, but even though it's not a big jump from a Windows shell, i don't recommend it to beginners
King_Corduroy@reddit
Why not Cinnamon though? It's basically just like Windows before it was trash. Well I haven't touched Arch either and I've been using Linux since 2014 so don't feel bad about that. lol I was a Fedora fanboy for many years and now just use Cinnamon Mint cause it just works and I can't play games effortlessly.
liocer@reddit
You know cinnamon is a gnome fork?
King_Corduroy@reddit
Yes but saying Gnome in it's present form functions the same as Cinnamon is nonsense.
liocer@reddit
It’s based on Gnome 2 and Cinnamon is pretty close to the Gnome 2 experience.
GlutenFreeToaster@reddit
If you look at Cinnamon and your immediate reaction is to compare it to Gnome, then I have a bridge to sell you
liocer@reddit
Neither of them are for me tbh
GlutenFreeToaster@reddit
Well yes, 15 years ago was a very different story. Current Cinnamon is essentially a clone of the Windows 7 UI. Very different from Gnome 2. If you want the classic Gnome 2 experience, that's what MATE is for.
emalvick@reddit
I do use that, but it's just a different version of gnome with a different look, so I didn't consider different for my post.
Complex-League3400@reddit
Although Cinnamon and Gnome are the same underneath, for me they have entirely different workflows. Cinnamon is the standard Windows, "everything on one screen" workflow, maximise and minimise; Gnome -- and it took me ages to get this -- is "put each app its own screen" workflow. Learning that was the game changer to loving Gnome rather than hating it. I'd come from Windows and it didn't occur to me that everything could have its own workspace.
LinuxSBC-Anna@reddit
Modern GNOME is very different from early GNOME 3. The basic workflow is similar, but nearly everything surrounding it has changed. There are still plenty of valid reasons to dislike GNOME, but they might be different ones from what you found with GNOME 3.
anonymous-vampire@reddit
I’m new and I love the GNOME-based DE I landed on after trying Cosmic and KDE ¯_(ツ)_/¯ I came from Apple and GNOME suits my workflow perfectly and doesn’t feel like a project I need to maintain. Everyone’s different! Also, I think it looks great lol
AnsibleAnswers@reddit
Gnome simply doesn’t have as many bugs as KDE. Its opinionated design is a feature. It lowers overall complexity, and therefore bug count.
the_abortionat0r@reddit
Amen to that.
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
IT is a really nice WM.. I used gnome 2 and switched to gnome 3 immediately. The only thing I'm thinking about switching to is cosmic because it seems to be inspired by gnome in various ways.
Unslaadahsil@reddit
In my experience, people coming from apple find Ubuntu easier and people from Windows find Mint easier. I'm 90% sure that's down to UI and DE, but that's been my experience.
preparationh67@reddit
Its 100% just the UIs being more similar to what they already knew. I was recommending Lubuntu to Windows users for a while and the success was tied exclusively to the fact that it had a menu system layout closer to Windows. Even ran a small Linux lab with machines running LXDE as the default desktop environment and once they got over the initial shock they'd usually need little help beyond pointing out the name of Linux's equivalent of a program every now and then. Advanced users got to play around with customs configs with the expectation that the most help they would get fixing their mistakes is a fully revert back to the default.
Obadaya@reddit
Coming from Windows a few months ago I can attest.
But I got used to Ubuntu (mostly).
Fun_Instruction_807@reddit
this is exactly it
alicefaye2@reddit
Honestly it depends what your use case is. If it’s just general work or a work laptop then Ubuntu or Mint could be fine. The reason people recommend cachyos is usually for gaming, and in gaming spaces it isn’t because of simplicity per se but more because it offers newer hardware support and the latest software packages for things such as mesa which paradoxically despite being bleeding edge results in things such as your games breaking less, especially new games. Ubuntu is usually much further behind and causes problems when Ubuntu has outdated packages. The amount of people that say to install Ubuntu or mint and then those people go “why am I having XYZ problem” when the problem is outdated packages is so far too many from my experience. Some people do learn jumping in from the deep end as well which was my case.
b4k4ni@reddit
True, but I like the challenge. But I'm not a new user, my first start was with Debian in 97 or so. Always used Linux from time to time, but never really changed. At work I deal with it daily.
And I like cachy. Looks nice and works, errors are there to learn the way :D
But for a new user I would also recommend Ubuntu. The original. It's solid AF and simply works.
GlutenFreeToaster@reddit
Six years ago? Absolutely, I would've recommended Ubuntu. Now though? I've tried out each LTS and point release over the last few cycles and there has been some kind of ridiculous issue in each. Like the one that refused to mount network drives. Or the one where the installer crashed on formatting internal drives for months. Not really the end of the world in most cases, but with their accelerated update cycles now I'm not super confident that these things won't continue happening or get worse. There are plenty of other options with a stronger recent track record imo.
laczek_hubert@reddit
Fedora is fine too, with many upstream preconfigured distros you should tell them how to do x compared to windows like you shouldn't use any site if it's in discover, if it isn't go to x site and pase x script to konsole etc.
dredbar@reddit
Ubuntu and Mint are very reasonable choices for beginners. I also recommend Fedora to beginners, but only when I get to install the codecs myself. The average user won’t understand that stuff.
burning_iceman@reddit
Arch is rolling release but not bleeding edge, that would be Arch-testing. Regular Arch is up-to-date but quite stable.
Vladraconis@reddit
To be fair, CachyOS advertise themselves as a distro that lets you "Install things your way", and offers a wide choice of DEs, CPU optimized packages, no manual builds required, high performance.
Which sounds awesome to anyone looking for a Windows alternative.
And, when you have an Optimus config like me, it is one the highest recommended distros that handles this config flawlessly.
Saxasaurus@reddit
Cachy is ok for beginners but only if they have a strong technical background and know what they are signing up for. I would never recommend and Arch based distro for a beginner who couldn't figure out how to use chroot to fix things.
NotQuiteLoona@reddit
Arch is not bleeding edge. The only bleeding edge distro is Debian Sid. Arch uses latest stable version, and it's probably the behavior new users expect the most.
LurkingDevloper@reddit
For most of Linux's history, rolling releases were considered bleeding edge. For a long while, it was just Arch and Gentoo doing this.
NotQuiteLoona@reddit
Is it still actual? Like, I'm active on a lot of Linux subreddits. I've never seen a single user saying about problems with any rolling release distro, be it Arch-based, openSUSE, or any other. I mean, they were, but those problems didn't relate to the package manager or updates at all. In all of my life I also didn't meet any.
LurkingDevloper@reddit
In times past, the rolling releases had quite a bit of problems with graphics.
In the late 00s, I quit using Arch on my desktop after some months because it was unpredictable as to whether or not the latest update would break my X11 setup.
A few times it was related to my Nvidia card's drivers. One time, however, an X11 update decided to overwrite my
xorg.confentirely.NotQuiteLoona@reddit
This is explainable. Though right now we've got the opposite, point release distros are not recommended for new users with Nvidia, because they often have ancient drivers. Though of course AFAIK there is a custom repository where they are updated more often.
Top-Rub-4670@reddit
Now you're just lying.
NotQuiteLoona@reddit
Quote again.
Electrical_Tomato_73@reddit
If you use latest stable versions of thousands of small packages you WILL encounter breakage.
NotQuiteLoona@reddit
Nope, not really higher chance than with point release. They go through highly complicated quality assurance, enough complicated for GNOME 50 to stuck for half a month. There is a reason Debian is pretty much the only point release distro excluding distros that are based on Debian. It's made for servers, not for desktop users, and I agree that for servers it's good, as servers need consistent behavior. If you don't use custom distros that plays with your repos, like (universally hated) Manjaro, you shouldn't have any problems. I mean, I'm using it for five years, and I never had a single problem because of it. That's because Arch-based distros follow the KISS philosophy - the simpler the routine, the lower the chance to fail it.
Feeling_Photograph_5@reddit
There is a certain peerage of the desktop Linux user base who is drawn to it because they are contrarian. If Linux was the dominant desktop OS, they would use Windows out of spite.
They're not pleasant people to deal with, and they go out of there way to shame newer users.
Best thing to do is to call them out as unhelpful when you see them.
slvrsnt@reddit
My opinion is that I don't care ...
Razidargh@reddit
The old saying still true: RTFM noob.
mwyvr@reddit
People tuning in to the harder-to-manage solution without any real background are going to run into problems. Many exhibit an air of entitlement "it should just work" without any understanding as to "the solution needs work".
There's a reason people steer such newbies to GNOME or something packages.
Honolulu-Blues@reddit
People not familiar with Linux don't know that stuff.
PJBonoVox@reddit
No, but people not familiar with Linux are ill-informed by other people who are ill-informed. Half the channels I see posted on here are hosted by supposed 'experts' who are anything but. It's a misinformation issue that I have no idea how to solve.
PixelmancerGames@reddit
Yeah, it's a big problem. When I first started using Linux it took a while for me to realize that most of the people in these forums aren't that knowledgeable. Funny thing is it's probably a large amount of newish users telling people what they don't know that they don't know.
PJBonoVox@reddit
Yeah, it's true of a lot of subreddits sadly. You don't realise until it's too late :|
PixelmancerGames@reddit
It's a lot worse here. I can usually trust niche Reddit subreddits. Of course there will be wrong answers but yoy can usually gage who is right and wrong by reading a few threads. Linux forums are terrible by my comparison.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
We know this and new user watches yt vidoes maybe check subs or other platform and see people saying it works.
Square-Singer@reddit
This is it. There's currently quite a big push where people are saying "Linux just works". And if you are lucky it does. If you are unlucky it doesn't. It depends a lot on the hardware, the distro, the software they run, and the combination of all three, so it's really hard to say in advance if someone will experience issues or not.
The problematic part occurs when someone has been told that "Linux just works", then it doesn't work and they go online asking for help, and gatekeeping idiots tell them that it's their fault for "not putting in the effort", "it works on my machine so you must be doing it wrong" or some such nonsense.
BitCortex@reddit
It's today's biggest problem with desktop Linux. Too many members of its community are less interested in helping users than they are in (a) adoption numbers, and (b) shifting all blame away from Linux – the kernel and abstract concept – and away from themselves as its advocates – and towards the distro, the window manager, the application, the user, etc.
Bed_Worship@reddit
Well cachyOS is an easy install - kde by default . Picking hyperland is usually out of the desire to rice immediately like the greatest ricers and get the sense of superiority and freedom of how you made your OS.
gamas@reddit
Yeah CachyOS probably has the most hassle free install. I do feel people in this sub look down on it for no good reason. Whilst it is an arch-based distro, it's different from your standard meme distro as the devs went for the approach of "90% of users are just going to want this setup so let's just make that the default setup so they don't have to do anything".
Saxasaurus@reddit
CachyOS is really good imo, but the easy install is a double edged sword. The arch base requires a certain level of competence and knowledge to successfully manage over time. So the easy install attracts some people that don't know what they are getting into.
gamas@reddit
Whilst that is true, the project maintainers do seem to be pretty on top of their shit. Whenever there has been a regression, we're talking a matter of hours before they push a fix. Which - let's be honest - at this point make it's more reliable over time than Windows.
trullaDE@reddit
I mean, actions DO have consequences. If someone sets themselves a task they are completely overwhelmed with, because they are missing a lot of the fundamentals, I think it IS helpful to point that out and make suggestions for something easier. There's just no need being a dick about it.
And that's their mistake, they shouldn't base their picks on feeling, but on research. And don't get me wrong, mistakes are ok to make, they are nothing bad as long as you learn from them - and don't expect others to fix them for you.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Hmm as more people are moving to Linux, this will occur more and more. Ngl when I switched from ubuntu to garuda it was for eye candy, I won't say I'm perfect but slowly I read & learned.
trullaDE@reddit
Well, and the first thing people need to learn is that Linux isn't as streamlined as Windows/MacOS (one flavour OS vs gazillion flavours OS), and that you are expected to get more involved. And as long as that doesn't change - and believe me, I don't want to gatekeep - I absolutely do think that if you just jump into stuff without doing your research in advance, then learning how to get yourself out of the mess you created is a pretty good lesson for life.
Again, there's abolutely no need to be a dick about it, but I do think teaching - or "lecturing" - someone to learn how to help themselves is usually more useful in the long run. There's a reason RT(F)M was coined, even if it isn't the most polite thing to say.
Indolent_Bard@reddit
The problem is that other operating systems are made so a monkey can use it.
AnsibleAnswers@reddit
The more people who move to Linux, the more necessary it becomes for these new users to receive attitude adjustments. You’re not a customer, and burdening the community with “I want to have my cake and eat it too” nonsense is going to burn out a lot of people who offer volunteer assistance.
jimmy_timmy_@reddit
"Niche" but it's cachyos and hyprland. That toxicity makes the Linux community look so bad
VTArxelus@reddit
And the segment of people that hear "read the flippin manual" from the ages users is getting larger and less helpful.
sidusnare@reddit
Work the problem or be quiet.
SynapticStatic@reddit
I generally ignore people that spread negativity like that. You do get a sort of elitism in some people in technical areas.
I don't think it's very helpful to dwell on them, or give them the time of day.
I probably wouldn't suggest a rolling release distro to a complete newbie. But people are going to do what they're going to do. If you want to be helpful, you can try to point them in the right direction.
Herr_Meier@reddit
In my opinion, this kind of judgemental attitude never helps. If someone has an issue, even if its caused by their own lack of knowledge or a previous mistake, we should still try to answer their questions or advise them that they would be better off using some other distro, without judging them for their mistakes.
NebulaMiner@reddit
If only everyone on Linux subreddits were actually trying to be helpful 🙏 it seems many get their kicks out of putting newbies down or I've seen people admit to actively gatekeeping their preferred distro.
ency@reddit
It feels like the whole community sliding backwards. Trying to learn linux and looking for help back in the early 2000s was absolutely brutal. So bad I did not bother to touch it again for almost 10 years. When I had to brush up and get good on Unix and linux systems again for work I was surprised at how friendly and helpful, relative to a few years before, the community had become. I was able to learn and understand things much better and faster. Even got a damn good promotion out of it as well.
It feels like the community has started to slide back into its old toxic ways somewhere between the time the arch memes started to become a thing and SteamOS gaining traction.
It's sad. SteamOS was the distro that proved gaming could work on Linux and was just what the community needs to bring in fresh air. Sure there are going to be steep learning curves for the new users and it's gonna frustrate a bunch of the user's that have been around for awhile. But if the linux community goes back to the toxicity of the 90s and 00s then people will just give up and skip linux altogether since it's such a pain in the ass to learn. Hell I've been a Linux/Unix, storage, and virtualization admin for over 15 years. I'm still discovering new, but actual old or ancient, tools and best practices.
There is not much that translates well from windows to Linux. Cut the newcomers some slack. We don't have to hold their hands but we don't have to be nasty about things either.
trivialBetaState@reddit
Excellent comments from both of the above. Toxicity is an adverse consequence of a failing society. In the 1990s it was a rising yuppie culture, now we have the rise of the far/alt-right with its poison trickling down to people who actively try to avoid taking any side. I know that it's not always appropriate to bring political arguments into technical forums but we would be hiding our face in the sand if we tried to explain the toxicity in our discussions in any other way.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Yes, I think too.
Apprehensive_Milk520@reddit
The road to hell is paved with good intentions...
SpeeBree@reddit
The only reason I started Linux was because Hyprland rices on r/unixporn looked so fucking cool. If I’d been told I had to start with a simple Windows like distro, I just wouldn’t have switched. I picked what looked appealing and, while it took two weeks of troubleshooting to get it perfect, it worked out. Making fun of new users for trying something new only drives people away. If you don't want to help, that's fine, but then just ignore it.
Leather_Flan5071@reddit
Why in the fuck are we doing that now?
Don't we wanna light a big interest in Linux? How the fuck are we gonna do that if we're like this
Just help anyone who needs helpful regardless of how repetitive or annoying it is sometimes
AliOskiTheHoly@reddit
It really depends on the exact circumstances in my opinion. Some things that people ask help for have such easy to find answers that it annoys people, they shouldn't expect to be handheld. In other cases however, documentation or forums are not all too clear, especially for a new user.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Its not about the person having an issue, its about like new user had issue, not only you're helping them but also lecturing them. Linux has choices and they chose one they liked and don't know about rolling release or anything.
AliOskiTheHoly@reddit
Right next to the download button is often a user guide or wiki button.
Again, help is out there if it is needed, but that's the thing: if needed. You need to be able to read some stuff yourself, otherwise you'll need help for every little thing. Nobody has time for that.
sacules@reddit
And then you have people that tell you to RTFM and not even tell you which manual or where in that is what you need lol. Like bro you could have just ignored that question and kept scrolling reddit with your greasy cheetos fingers it's ok, somebody will actually help that person.
Skogspingvin@reddit
New users pick what people recommend, and people keep recommending dumb shit.
Murb0rk-8098@reddit
Unlimited choice equals lots of bad decisions
fek47@reddit
Only if you don't want to learn.
fek47@reddit
Yes, this is the truth. Being a responsible human being requires that you acknowledge this fact. There's no way to avoid it. One can try to neglect it but it will only create more problems.
This is the way forward. Acknowledging the fact that you need to learn. This is true for everyone who uses Linux, even for experienced long-time users. I've been using Linux for about 20 years and I still need to learn. Very few Linux users, if any, knows everything.
A multitude of choices increases the importance of learning. Understanding the consequences of actions is crucial for being successful. Not understanding the consequences of actions and still going ahead is a recipe for a bad experience.
pythosynthesis@reddit
On the one hand you have a point. No need to be nasty to someone asking for help. On the other hand, if you've never worked out and load that squatting bar you can barely unhook it, and then you hurt yourself, because you want to prove yourself that you're strong, despite warnings from others, you truly have no one else to blame but yourself. A helping hand first, sure, but a kick up your arse is also appropriate. Educational. Tough love.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Real, but again my main motive is to know that how would an experienced user should handle this? Lecture them make fun of them? Or help them or ignore them?
dutchman76@reddit
Part of it is fatigue, when you get the same questions over and over, and the same type of newbies who barely know what a hard drive is get themselves into trouble, it wears you down.
Not saying it's a nice experience for the new people, or someone intermediate that just needs a little help, but I understand, the reaction, "why would just immediately go for something that complicated/finicky/bleeding edge? just install gnome/kde"
pythosynthesis@reddit
At the end it's down to personality. Some would just help, others just lecture. Experienced users are not all thr same persona.
IntenseWiggling@reddit
It is 2001, the Linux community is hostile and belittling to new users.
It is 2006, the Linux community is hostile and belittling to new users.
It is 2011, the Linux community is hostile and belittling to new users.
It is 2016, the Linux community is hostile and belittling to new users.
It is 2026 ...
I've been using Linux as my primary OS for over 25 years. From usenet, to irc, to forums, to reddit; general community demeanor to new inexperienced users has pretty much stayed consistent.
Skrals@reddit
yeah, back in the days the default response was "rtfm"
PingMyHeart@reddit
I think this is more of a human problem rather than a Linux community problem.
LocodraTheCrow@reddit
I'd say that "the meaning of choices" in this regard requires knowledge. The reason people were clowning is bc nobody wanted the responsibility of being that one guy's sysadmin, because you can't ask a rolling release bleeding edge distro to be 100% stable and fault the distro for a newcomer to the ecosystem not being able to figure it out.
Either you accept that the bleeding edge distro requires knowledge, or you demand that it be stable instead of bleeding edge. The point that they were smugly making is that this setup was too much new information for that guy.
S7relok@reddit
That's why I use KDE with Fedora. Lots of options but not a trucktons on a conf file with huge documentation, I want to use more my PC than configure it. Also, stability.
I do the same for the people I helped go on Linux. GNOME or KDE. There's a lot of doc with screenshots or videos to give self-help an interest, and if it's a bit too difficult, just call me
ronaldtrip@reddit
That is why I just skip questions. Troubleshooting is a certain mindset and most people don't have it. So a newbie wanting help with a problem, is most likely the expectation of having an easily disgestible solution for complex situations that make the problem vanish forever.
I can't deliver that. I can help with pointers. I can help with ruling stuff out. What I can't do is guarantee a foolproof solution that can be done in less then 5 clicks. So I just skip the question. At the end of the day, the owner of a machine is responsible for the whole thing. You break it, you get to keep the pieces.
fek47@reddit
I agree. As often as possible I try to point out the inescapable fact that using Linux requires the user is willing to learn and that the learning process is very dependent on the users capacity to find solutions for himself/herself.
I understand that it isn't easy for beginners to do this but if I can't identify even a small degree of a willingness to learn and that the person hasn't put in any effort in finding a solution I skip the question.
I'm not advocating for other people to follow my example. I'm just trying to describe the way I function.
No_Intern3891@reddit
We're trying to tell people that if you don't do enough research, you will have to bite the consequences, no amount of babying an user will train them to troubleshoot on their own than to RTFM
vitimiti@reddit
But actions do have consequences. Installing and maintaining a rolling release is more difficult. Using a WM instead of a complete DE is more difficult. Using niche things is more difficult
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
How cachyos or hyprland is niche?
vitimiti@reddit
Linux is niche. And within Linux, both of those are niche
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Everything is niche.
vitimiti@reddit
There is, within Linux, stable and well tested things. Hyprland isn't one of those, specially on bleeding edge or rolling releases
khsh01@reddit
There is still "meaning of choice".
You speak like a beginner. There is no reason anyone can't setup hyprland on any distro. You don't have to use cachy. Thats the whole point of there being so many distros. Choose your own start.
Kitchen_Office8072@reddit
Investigate available options and use common sense instead of bullcrap people just say. Think about why something appeals to you, and what specifically you get out of making a particular choice. New users should have some inclination to investigate their options, just as people online should have an inclination to help new users. Everyone can just ignore toxic people.
Dr_Hexagon@reddit
I've said for a long time one of the biggest barriers to mass Linux adoption is the attitude of some existing Linux users.
The polite reply would have been "Cachy is only recommended for experienced Linux users, here are some suggested distros for beginners....."
dutch_connection_uk@reddit
If you're trying to help, and you say something that is less useful than saying nothing, that's very unhelpful. So I have to assume that people who make posts like that aren't genuinely trying to help.
If a new user wants to use Arch or CachyOS or Hyprland or whatever, just point them to the references that will help them. If they say that they're struggling and want to switch off, you could suggest they use Mint or something, but talking on support forums is part of how people learn to use and understand documentation. It also creates a record of a specific question and answer for search engines.
gamas@reddit
Honestly, I just wouldn't recommend sending any user to a sub other than the distro's sub for support - which tends to be more filled with chill people (generally I've found the CachyOS sub and discord to be incredibly chill, no judgement just people willing to help each other out).
My general observation is that communities such as this one tend to be dominated by what I would term "Linux snobs". People who used to feel the air of superiority over their choice to use Linux instead of Windows, but now using Linux is increasingly becoming a thing everyone does, are trying to find a new way to feel superior ("You chose wrong, I made better choices").
Like going back to the original problem, okay granted Hyprland is turning into a meme with newbies trying it and quickly learning it's not really designed for newbies, but calling CachyOS niche is absolutely ridiculous at this point. CachyOS has at this point dethroned Arch itself in terms of popularity - by simply being Arch but for people who just want to click a single button for their OS to be installed and optimally configured for their machine.
Stressedhumbucker@reddit
"Actions have consequences"? The hell? I thought we were discussing operating systems, not lecturing Spider-Man after he accidentally lets Uncle Ben die.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Lmao.
FunAware5871@reddit
Imho there's an increasing amount of users advising newbies to use "advanced" (aka harder to configure and maintain) distros... What's the point of telling someone to use cachyos if they don't know how updates work, or to use hyprland if they have no idea of what window classes are?
And that brings to issue 2: the kind of answers you mentioned. Some people are getting annoyed at the increasing amount of "X doesn't work!" help requests that stem from misconfigurstions due to lack of experience/knowledge... And I can relate with them getting frustarted after they find out the user didn't even read some documentation, but more often than not nobody even told them there was one...
Just to be clear, I don't blame a new linux user who sees a video about cachyos + hyprland and wants to try it out, I'm blaming the video not explaining it's an advanced setup and not everyone should try it out.
Let me draw a parallel from my workplace: we all use a specific setup with zfsbootmenu + root on zfs, but new entries don't use that unless they already know Linux well enough. We make them start off with Mint until they get comfortable enough with the terminal, managing services and getting their head around basic issues. When we think they know well enough we hand them a guide on how to install the same setup everyone is using, the point being if they can't follow some steps they still need some time to adjust...
Any-Category1741@reddit
I think it reflects how miserable they feel in life that want to make others feel more miserable so they can feel better about themselves.
Experience users should inform. Provide links for info and easy to digest information if they have the time. If they don't or the patience to do so just scroll pass it and seek something that will brighten your day and in consequence others.
The only way Linux got to the point it is, has been by community by being open source. Being toxic to the community only helps to slow down linux movement and scare away a possible future contributor to make wvery distro even greater.
Every community has bad apples, be one of the good ones honestly. It benefits us all including yourself.
0lus is just the right thing to do. 🤷
EarlMarshal@reddit
I'm really not a fan of AI, but it's never has been easier to explore a problem space with it, but people probably have to learn to research a problems first. Everyone with years of Linux knowledge has that knowledge because they had to research on how to deal with stuff at times when there were less resources and they were harder to access.
It's not really about choices or having the greatest OS even if that's the case. It's about having control about your system and making decisions. If you can't do that maybe settle for something more commonly supported.
The_Casual_Noob@reddit
A lot of people are judging newcomers for choosing a niche distro that's hard to maintain for a newbie, and yet in the "what distro should I choose" posts I often see those distros being presented. Hell, even I did such a post over a year ago and someone told me Arch would be great for me, though I ended up with Fedora to be safer. Then you have youtubers ditching windows and going for gaming distros like Bazzite or CachyOS, so their audience will probably try the same thing. Even with beginner friendly distros there is already multiple valid choices (ubuntu, mint, Fedora, ...).
Of course, we see beginners chose distros that aren't made for beginners and struggle, and we put the blame on them, while we might need to look a bit more at how and why they chose such a distro to begin with, because entering the Linux community is not easy either.
modified_tiger@reddit
Pick a complex setup, be ready to learn a complex setup. Pick a complex setup you didn't set up? Be ready to learn not only how the complex parts work, but how they're configured. Comes with the territory, from a person who used Arch and minimal window managers for a decade.
Choices come with different responsibilities. You're free to choose, but responsibility for your system is a result.
jonsca@reddit
Distro ≠ Window Manager ≠ Linux
People get so hell bent on trying to outdo their friends that they forget that it's an operating system for a computer, not a religion.
KnowZeroX@reddit
Actions do have consequences, but it isn't the new users fault, the fault lies with whoever recommended CatchyOS with hyperland to a new user. People really need to stop the bad habit of trying to get them on the distro they are on.
I personally would love to recommend people to the distro I am on, but am sane enough to know it isn't the ideal choice for a new user. And the community is also important to consider when recommending a new distro as well.
MrCrunchyOwl8855@reddit
My suggestion is use MATE or Cinnamon desktop environments. You can install these on most systems, though exotic systems may require lightdm for you to pick which one you want to use at the sign in screen.
KDE and its more recent MATE fork can emulate windows XP to 7 and Mac Leopard to Mountain Lion experiences very closely, and in my humble opinion, outperform both. Cinnamon is a slicker, more modern win 8 to 11 or modern Mac style desktop that does sometimes feel snappier than KDE/MATE, may use either less or more ram based on what you are doing, and are ideal starting points for Linux novices. I started with GNOME Ubuntu in 2005, which was not ready for prime time and in my opinion, GNOME's pursuit of Mac simplicity makes it unappealing to most windows power users.
I've used Manjaro and Crunch and Plus and z fee distros in between and for simplicity of use, I normally suggest Linux Mint MATE of Linux Mint Debian Edition (Cinnamon), or if you really are short on hardware, Bodhi runs the less supported Enlightenment desktop on my 2010 laptop. Just don't expect installing non standard packages to be as easy as ig is on Debian/Ubuntu based systems.
redballooon@reddit
Communication skills are hard. On the internet many forget that such a thing even exists.
rabbit_in_a_bun@reddit
Welcome to the internet...
ruiiiij@reddit
I'm not a fan of elitism but in this situation I think suggesting them to install Ubuntu is probably the best response. If you're a complete beginner, choosing cachy with hyprland was a mistake. There's nothing wrong with suggesting that they should correct that mistake.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
I hope you meant don't be a dick about it.
ruiiiij@reddit
Yeah I hope people won't be a dick. But that's probably asking too much for strangers on the internet.
King_Corduroy@reddit
I'm so lucky that I preferred the old school look of MATE when I first started back in 2014. lol Fedora was a ballache most of the time for drivers and other shit but at least MATE was easy to use!
inbetween-genders@reddit
In my head people use some of these distros to say they got it working to their friends or whoever but then a lot are allergic to reading and run into a whole slew of problems.
King_Corduroy@reddit
Yeah I mean probably that's a component of it but I think these slick newer distros also market more to the "gamer" crowd then say Mint or Fedora. When I first started one of the people who kinda suggested it to me was a Gentoo user and he'd constantly talk about tinkering with his system but when I finally laid eyes on it it wasn't anything special, he just had to put in 80% more effort to get it running on install. lol
KnowZeroX@reddit
The real benefits of something like Gentoo is when you are managing a fleet of same hardware, you compile once and distribute it to all the hardware.
Hence why ChromeOS is based on parts of Gentoo. The low end hardware get better performance when everything is compiled for that hardware.
For personal use, it isn't something a person should use. Even if things are easier these days as they now offer precompiled binary versions for anyone who doesn't want to self compile and doesn't care about optimization.
inbetween-genders@reddit
Hah I remember I recompiled the kernel on my Gentoo daily driver and it was compiling for I don’t know how and and when it was done I was like….ok ?yay? 😆. I realize somewhere then that I didn’t buy this damn machine to tinker but to get stuff done 😂
King_Corduroy@reddit
That's exactly what I told him once after he recommended Gentoo for the billionth time. lol I was like "Yeah but I want to actually DO stuff with my computer once in a while" lol
Turbulent_Fig_9354@reddit
Now, call it a hunch, but did this interaction happen to take place on Reddit by any chance?
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
No
PracticalPersonality@reddit
You seem to be making the argument that all available choices should be appealing to new users. Why? Doesn't it make sense that there would be choices that cater specifically to experts, and others that cater specifically to beginners?
FineWolf@reddit
When you decide to purchase a pair of headphones, a fridge, a car, a whatever... you do a minimum amount of research to see if it will fit your needs, what's involved, what people are saying.
Yet, people jump in to software without being minimally diligent about surface-level research, and get bitten by it over and over again.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
You really think that. People do research before switching over to Linux, haven't you seen sub filled with these type of post, "Which distro to choose?" And yet you're saying that the user who had issue just directly downloaded the distro, and started installing and didn't search for anything. No one does that.
FineWolf@reddit
Judging by the number of people who try to install SteamOS on Nvidia hardware, or who ask how to run their Windows software that doesn't run on Wine AFTER going through an entire install... Plenty of people do that.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
I'm getting they see some yt videos and try to follow that guide and then ask. But if you're suggesting like they should know everything then I'm afraid that is not how things work.
PJBonoVox@reddit
In your experience are new users actually following videos to learn new processes? That seems like a terrible way to learn.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
I mean thats what people say, heck most of them don't even know their is wiki thing too, not specific to arch.
FineWolf@reddit
I'm not.
But if you are waiting until your entire installation is done to ask how to play League of Legends or Fortnite on your shiny new Linux install, then clearly you missed a step somewhere.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
That is important to know before wiping your drive and feeling bad lol.
PJBonoVox@reddit
The problem is not the user. When a thread like that is posted, 99% of the comments are from new users who just recommend their favourite distro and don't even the basic understanding of what that distro does differently from any other. The blind leading the blind.
Those posts are upvoted by other blind fanboys of the same distro and the misinformation spreads like wildfire.
PJBonoVox@reddit
Most of the new user disinformation is propagated by new users. Someone installed and it fixed their problem, so clearly is best and everyone should use it.
They're not learning Linux, and that's a fairly new problem I feel. I'm not saying they should have to, but it's not something the community has dealt with as much in the past.
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
my opinion is that new users should use kde or gnome on well known distros. Once they've got a solid footing they can do whatever they want.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Hmm thats where I have doubts then like sure you have to know before knowing a wm. But its also a choice right and Linux is advertised that you can choose anything.
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
the choices are for people who know what they are doing!
LancrusES@reddit
You can choose to drive a truck, after drinking a bottle of tequila, without even a driving license, and ask for help after you crashed, but dont expect ppl to ignore the fact that you did what you shouldnt...
Actions do have consecuences, you should have got a driving license, and you should know that alcohol is not the best friend of a driver, because Im not going to solve your imprudences, instead of that go to the trucks reddit and ask, what do I need to drive a truck? What should I study to do It nicely?
Because accidents happens, and if after studing and learning you got issues, people will help you and will try to solve It, but if your problem is related to something very basic that you should have read before copy/pasting commands without knowing what you were executing, people will tell you, obviously, you cant see a video of a wm you have never used in your life, and follow a tutorial to install It and expect everything to work perfectly in 5 minutes, and if It doesnt tell reddit you have a problem you cant even describe correctly, and dont lecture me!!! Sorry, we will.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Bruh how cachyos + hyprland setup is drink driving lmao. Crazy example lol.
LancrusES@reddit
Sometimes you have to exagerate things to explain them, you can understand It or focus on the example to avoid the topic, your choice.
GovernmentSimple7015@reddit
Freedom of choice isn't freedom from consequences. If you need a lot of help debugging then running unpopular choices isn't a great idea
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
But how does a new user know? They watch videos, read people's comments on social media, like it works. So they assume that it will work for them too. Sure as long as there is a software there will be bugs. But my point is like is it correct to lecture instead of helping? I mean if you don't want to help ignore.
GovernmentSimple7015@reddit
I dunno, do some research or something. Being a new user doesn't mean you were born yesterday. In all honesty, I've come around to actually preferring gatekeeping at this point. The Internet has shown that without any negative feedback on bad content, forums get overwhelmed with the lowest common denominator content.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
So you just assumed that the new user just downloads the iso and installs it? Brother just look at Linux subs they are filled with which distro to pick and people in comment give tips.
GovernmentSimple7015@reddit
Okay, so what? 90% of people will just give ubuntu as the default choice if you choose to listen to the other 10% of people then you get what you get.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
So having choices is useless then? Again if you think this is about picking a distro then no. Its about how experienced users handle this situation and I can see who you are lol.
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
save the choices for when you know what you're doing!
GovernmentSimple7015@reddit
I don't really understand this choices thing with you. The only time choices have meaning to you is if you're handheld through the negative consequences of making that choice?
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
see
GovernmentSimple7015@reddit
Okay, that person thinks that. Did you just want people to confirm your existing opinion?
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
No, but I wanted to know how things should be handled and it turned out something else nvm.
inbetween-genders@reddit
As a new user a while back I got around not know about stuff by reading.
Business_Reindeer910@reddit
We should be pushing back on those people recommending bleeding edge or otherwise complicated stuff to new folks.
LurkingDevloper@reddit
If someone's a new user, they should be recommended Ubuntu or Mint.
But, if they, in spite of the community's recommendations, decided to try something else... then help them get it set up if you're also running it.
Holier than thou attitudes drive people away from Linux, not to it.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
This was an answer I was looking for, idk if you'll look at the comments but damn, some people really have this actions have consequences.
LurkingDevloper@reddit
Unfortunately it's always been this way. For what it's worth, it's better than it was in past times.
johncate73@reddit
There are assholes in every discussion. Using CachyOS and Hyprland would be a severe challenge for a newcomer to Linux, and it's OK to say that, but being obnoxious about it is not helpful.
1800-5-PP-DOO-DOO@reddit
I think there is a lot of trolling in the Linux subs and a lot of that is kids being shitty to each other.
On the other hand, a lot of kindness and goodwill outshine the crap on the subs ✨
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
Well this is true.
Electrical_Tomato_73@reddit
I have used linux for 30 years, ubuntu for 19. My advice is you are not running a distro, you are running apps. I use sway, not gnome/kde/unity. You can run what DE you like and what distro you like but do your research. In my early linux days I used fvwm (very common then) then the brand-new KDE. Then I used unity for a while. It took me years to try i3 and I had good knowledge about reasons. Eyecandy is not a reason.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
I agree no one will spoonfeed. But my main question is about the attitude or handling people with this kind of issue. What would you do? Would you lecture them or help them or ignore them?
Electrical_Tomato_73@reddit
I would advise them to use a mainstream distro and DE while learning. Don't learn to drive in an F1 car or a Bugatti. Don't use CachyOS and Hyprland as your intro to Linux.
Obnomus@reddit (OP)
I agree with you. I think its just the other side of having options
_ParanoidPenguin_@reddit
If you disagree with a decision someone made, you don't have to post something snarky about it.
It's a Reddit-wide problem, I have noticed that instead of helping (even on advice/guide subs) people will comment just to be assholes.
Imo if you have nothing to construct, ask yourself if you really need to comment, if your goal is to be an ass, it should count as being off topic.
Four_Muffins@reddit
I'll guess you mean 'why let people choose if veteran Linux users are going to tell them what to pick instead of helping'. Some people are dicks, and a lot of them like to leave useless comments.
paskapersepaviaani@reddit
Weird people. I have used cachyOS on my main workstation with Wayland and Sway now for many years with pretty much zero issues.