Thoughts on the XM7 rifle?
Posted by No-Reception8659@reddit | ForgottenWeapons | View on Reddit | 33 comments
I’ve come across a lot of mixed opinions about the XM7 rifle.Some praise it,others point out potential issues.What I’m really interested in is how it will actually perform in real battlefield conditions.Will it face the same kind of practical drawbacks that became apparent with the 1st gen AK-12s once it saw combat? And if any shortcomings do emerge,what kind of upgrades or improvements could realistically be expected in future iterations?
jefferysteele@reddit
its a good idea comparable to a solution looking for a problem that causes other issues in that now there is a weapon that will mess with logistics because the mags do not take STANAG magazines and uses a proprietary ammo. it can work but they need to make up their mind on whether it will replace the m4 or the 7.62 battle rifle platform.
the idea of body armor being tougher is a real thing the military expects to face but the engagement ranges are close to fantasy with what we are fighting with.
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
As of now, it's not supposed to fully replace the M4. They intend to run both systems with the M7 serving in close combat units.
jefferysteele@reddit
Sadly this is true and we now are looking at the XM8 as the full m4 replacement which fixes only the weight issue and not the issue with it being an MCX platform with its wide magazines.
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
It doesn't even fix the weight issue.
jefferysteele@reddit
See now that’s just anti Sig propaganda, but yes even with the requested weight reduction it’s still heavy but from what I was told the difference loaded is a lot better compared to the full length M7 but not enough to be desired as a replacement for less ammo and more recoil unless you have the suppressor.
The MCX is a heavy gun with bits and bobs that don’t really make sense,
Dual charging handle
Magazine too wide to fit in a rig the same way a 5.56 would
Lancer magazines being well lancer
A hand guard that is notorious for wobbling
A folding stock that I’ve been told is finicky to operate and doesn’t fold into a good position
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
I'm not sure if you're joking but the numbers don't lie. Even if you somehow take a whole KG out of the M7, it's still heavier than an equivalent M4/5.56 loadout due to the heavy bitch of an optic and the massive weight penalty the 6.8 implies. Afaik they switched from Lancer to metal mags recently, and the handguard can be (and has allegedly been) fixed. Even if all the small kinks of the M7/M8 get ironed out, it is fundamentally a heavy solution to a questionable problem.
jefferysteele@reddit
Oh I’m in full agreement on it being a fat monster trying to replace a carbine.
This really should have been the successor to the sr-25 and SASS which would have been a big improvement over replacing the 5.56 AR which is still doing more than enough for what it’s expected to be used against.
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
Gotcha, and fully agree. I think if they really have figured out the barrel wear and muzzle blast issues, 6.8 can be a good 7.62 replacement, but not much more than that. The XM157 could also be a neat SDMR/machine gun optic.
forrest1985_@reddit
Great DMR, poor infantry rifle
LajosGK22@reddit
I wanted the bullpup.
reznov-where-are-you@reddit
I think now you mean the XM8, its a waste of money and clearly someone at SIG setting themselves up very nicely.
TheBoogBear@reddit
"The whole point of this thing is velocity, so we went ahead and shortened the barrel-"
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
The velocity allegedly still meets Army requirements and it still outperforms 7.62 NATO.
Popular_Mushroom_349@reddit
There will probably be an issue with the handguards coming loose. Since it's free-floating. Other than that: It's basically the same AR-15 design we're used to. Just with a different cartridge.
Personally, I still think .277 Fury is a bit much for a regular foot soldier. It should have been more similar to 6.5 Grendel, necked-up to 7mm. With an FG-42 style muzzle brake.
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
You're not getting the same trajectory out of a .280 British, which is probably one of the more overrated intermediate rounds out there.
Brown_Colibri_705@reddit
A lot of the tech it advanced is interesting, but it's simply way too heavy.
Bishop1873@reddit
Nothing
Leroy_Washington@reddit
A rifle and round built for the last conflict. They could have gotten similar results by changing to a caliber that used the same mags and lowers and just swapped uppers.
Too heavy, unbalanced (even with the XM8 changes), at best will be limited to a DMR role.
It’s a boondoggle and will suffer a similar fate as the M14.
Fidget11@reddit
I’m sure some generals have hefty offshore accounts and some extremely high paying jobs waiting once they retire…
No way this whole thing isn’t the result of corruption and bribery as far as I’m concerned
J3RICHO_@reddit
Heavy, not very accurate, high recoil, unreliable, and bulky.
Its looking to solve a problem that doesn't really exist and spending a shit-ton of money doing so.
If US Army leadership actually gave a fuck about updating their troops service rifle to be more effective they would issue Suppressors and LPVOs like how the USMC wants to.
amir_azo@reddit
Not to mention adopting a rifle that is just a better version of what you have right now. HK416 is just better
J3RICHO_@reddit
The 416 is great if you want an overgassed, heaver M4A1 lol
Fancy-Atmosphere-701@reddit
Pretty much all of that could've been solved if the army picked the other bullpup contender (RM277). Longer barrel, plastic ammo, significantly longer barrel life, compact, low recoil from their short gas blowback + piston combo, etc. That rifle was actually game changing, but the army is in bed with Sig, so...
paypaypayme@reddit
I think the big miscalculation is that it's designed for long ranged fighting, but what we've seen in ukraine and gaza is that urban fighting (or caves and tunnels) is going to be a huge part of modern conflict. Pretty sure this is due to FPV drones, if you don't have overhead cover you're screwed.
This weapon is not great for urban conflict for multiple reasons.
- you can't carry as much ammo because it's a heavier caliber than 5.56
- the length is longer due to the suppressor (they shortened the barrel in the most recent version though)
- the suppressor is going to glow under thermal imaging
- engagement range is like 200m so the optic is useless
I think has actually been listening to feedback and iterating on the design so I don't think it's as bad as people say... sure we don't have the logistics for it and there are some problems _but_ we're not in WW3 yet so we have some time.
I think if they made it slightly more modular, it would be fine, e.g. able to adapt better to different scenarios. like take the optic and suppressor off for urban fighting and give it some other options - red dot or low power optic, 30 round mag, flash hider, etc...
For a peer to peer conflict in a defensive scenario like taiwan I think it would be great. You can fight from the mountains and pierce the thin skinned chinese APCs.
NormalfloridaCitizen@reddit
Logistics. The ammo is niche. If you go for a long war then GG
theess12@reddit
I think that the gun is good and with a bit of work it can replace the m4, I also think that the focus on extending the effective range of infantry is a good idea, the gun is not perfect but it has more potential than the m4 has
HELLFISH-762@reddit
it's dumb
_That_Guy_in_AZ_@reddit
Too heavy, not necessary, needless, limited ammunition, created by someone who proves we have too many brass in the Army and way too many yes men afraid to tell them that it's a bad idea.
Non combat arms and fans of guns that never served in the mil let alone combat arms, lol you v=can see yourselves out before wanting to argue with me.
Electronic_Camera251@reddit
It is a godanmed clusterfuck it is the fully self aware military procurement trope about fighting at least one war back , and really it was only one theater that this is applicable for that being Afghanistan because the vast majority of fights actually in the Middle East were qcb in nature and the available body armor in the entirety unlikely event it was worn was easily defeated by the already ubiquitous 5.56 ,7.62,.338 lappua ,.50 bmg and actually sometimes even our 9mm handgun about the only round in limited service that wouldn’t punch was .45 acp that is simply a result of its mission requirements . Making a rifleman hump more weight for rounds that are likely unable to Do significantly more than .308 seems like a backroom deal made to the detriment of the soldiers the only really valuable part of the entire weapons system is likely to be the very smart optics which if employed properly beating the “armor” would be unnecessary as headshots would become almost common. I dont buy the use case as a legitimate reason to swap the most popular weapons system in the world when at significantly more could be possible using existing.308 platforms such as bren 2 or scar or even updated M14 models using the optical system and upping a squads available firepower might better be served through a smart grenadier system utilizing 30mm or smaller smart fused munitions that are programmable as to the method of fusing the on target effects and the option to set for individual circumstances as well as being a not to shabby platform to fire anti drone munitions smart or dumb fused the way i see that being addressed would be through the loss of 3 rifleman 2 using the smart grenades and a secondary saw operator… the value of the suppressive fire inside 400 yards if for some reason we saw an operational need to extend the reach of our capability beyond what is efficient in 5.56 having soldiers cross trained in battle rifles is a better solution than running round that cost almost $6 a piece for what by all accounts have been lackluster field reports…advanced further development of existing combat ready weapons systems is the way forward not a kludged not ready for prime time boondoggle. Regardless of what military wogs predict we still are decades ahead of a near peer conflict the capabilities of the “Near peer” militarys we potentially face corruption , lack of effective leadership,lack or experience all will continue to be albatross’s on the necks of Russia,China,India,Pakistan,North Korea (gimme a break) and the only scenario where this move makes any sense would be a head to head conflict with former nato allies and if thats where we are going next god help us . We are currently being embarrassed by a second world power at the request of our redheaded stepchild who probably should have been not just abandoned but turned first into a 60x60 lake of fire followed by maintained as a flat sheet of glass so nobody forgets
Nekommando@reddit
It's been almost 1 year and the Army doubled down
Open-Ad-6563@reddit
We have to let it be refined, the rifle aint done cooking Still looks shit tho
WR-DG-02FC@reddit
Too soon, junior.
AutoModerator@reddit
Understand the rules
Check the sidebar. It's full of resources to help you.
Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate.
No Spam. No Memes.
No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics.
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.