A Kalitta 777-300ERSF making a hard landing and a dicey go around at Miami (video credit to Nathan’s Aviation Creation)

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keenly_disinterested@reddit

There's this little maneuver at the end of nearly every flight called a "flare."

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F737NG@reddit

What happened to 'no configuration changes until positive rate of climb assured' ?!

Seemed to be very little altitude gained (and even a sink) between timestamp 0:18 and 0:28.

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Just_Another_Pilot@reddit

Never flown the 777, but on the 737 and 767 flaps are partially retracted immediately after setting go around thrust. Gear is retracted only after positive rate.

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Apprehensive_Cost937@reddit

If you have to do a balked landing (i.e. commence a go-around after touchdown), you leave the flaps where they are, and only retract them when airborne with a positive rate of climb.

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SubarcticFarmer@reddit

This is airframe specific. On the 737 the procedure is still flaps 15 unless you are below Vref. The exception is windshear escape.

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Apprehensive_Cost937@reddit

Not according to the FCTM...

A balked landing is a discontinued landing attempt and go-around initiated at or after touchdown, but prior to initiation of reverse thrust. The balked landing technique maintains landing flap configuration to expedite climb away from the runway environment.
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When performing a balked landing, disengage the autopilot, disconnect the autothrottle, smoothly advance thrust levers to go-around thrust, and verify speedbrakes are retracted. Maintain landing flaps configuration and smoothly rotate toward 15° pitch attitude at no less than VREF.
...
Selecting the go-around flaps during a balked landing can cause a decrease in the airplane lift and can result in increased takeoff distance.

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We have a supplemental bulletin from Boeing stating that either is acceptable. The more important part of the maneuver is to remember to manually advance the thrust, and to press TOGA again once airborne. Easiest way to handle this is for the PM to treat this like a takeoff -- call 'rotate' at Vref or greater, and then 'positive rate' once airborne.

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ma33a@reddit

On a 777 the flaps stay where they are till airborne, then you start the go around procedure again from there.

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ywgflyer@reddit

That's the typical sequence, yes -- but for a balked landing (ie, low-energy go-around or a G/A after touchdown), Boeing has told us that either retracting to flap 20 or sticking with your landing flap setting are appropriate and it is acceptable to do the initial part of this at F30. Once you are airborne again with positive rate and minimum Vref, you press TOGA again and call "go around flap 20", then from there proceed as any other go around.

You do get the config horn if you do this with weight on wheels though, which is distracting. Our SOP is to brief that if we try to go around after touchdown we will get the master warning during the maneuver.

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adjust_your_set@reddit

You can see the nose pitch down a bit too. Looks like the started losing speed somehow, maybe climbed before TOGA fully engaged?

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ywgflyer@reddit

Pressed TOGA and didn't follow up on the thrust levers is my guess. TOGA is inhibited on the ground (or below 2 feet RA for a few seconds) on the 777 and you have to advance the thrust manually. It looks like they tried to essentially go around at idle thrust, and when they got the shaker realized they didn't have any power on. Thankfully they were light and got away with it, this caused a crash a while back in Dubai when Emirates did it and didn't have enough room to recover.

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PerforatedPie@reddit

I think it's loss of lift due to retracted flaps.

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OperationAccurate154@reddit

Windshear

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OrganicParamedic6606@reddit

On (nearly?) all fleets at my airline, go around thrust is set with a reduction of flaps immediately. No check of positive rate required

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Winbot4t2@reddit

Usually there’s some stipulation for a low-energy go around that says delay flap retraction for a bit. Surprised your airline doesn’t mention that.

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OrganicParamedic6606@reddit

Not on any of the 4 aircraft I’ve flown here. Getting drag off is automatic in the procedure

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that_can_eh_dian_guy@reddit

As others have said that's type specific. On the 767/757 our go around/balked procedure is go around, flap 20, positive rate, gear up. No delay at all on the flap.

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Matuteg@reddit

Different planes different requirements. In my airline we do Toga, then flaps. Positive rate and gear up are followed afterwards.

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CrossBamboAtTen@reddit

That’s only really taught for windshear or terrain. For a go around as long as you’re above vref you’re good.

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F737NG@reddit

Noted.

The sink at around 0:24 looks like it wasn't the best decision to trade climb rate for a cleaner config.

Though I'm happy to concede to anyone with any knowledge and experience in airliners.

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RabidMoth1@reddit

That’s exactly what can happen if you do retract the gear before establishing a positive rate of climb. You can stagnate and even sink

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LigerSixOne@reddit

Just a guess, but I’d wager they correctly assessed positive rate without checking on V2 and now they are stuck in a configuration change while also trying to accelerate. The whole thing looks like playing huge mental catchup because you were expecting to be exiting L3 right about now.

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Insaneclown271@reddit

Possibly pressured TOGA and pushed up the thrust levers when on the ground and not followed the rejected landing procedure. Thrust levers can still be in IDLE, see the emirates crash in Dubai.

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Cerulean_Malstrom074@reddit

Configuration changes will continue until rate of climb improves!

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prw361@reddit

Even in this economy?!?!

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Fit-Soil9371@reddit

Even in that business

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railker@reddit

ADS-B Track of the go-around

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bkn95@reddit

yesss i puckered up from here!

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Flat_Equipment_7140@reddit

My first time seeing a 777-300F and I am not kidding.

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Joehansson@reddit

They’re a new species. Converted passenger liners which have reached the end of their economical life

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According-Reveal2369@reddit

The 777 has TOGA Switches inhibited below approx 2ft on landing. So the balked landing procedure has to be followed which results in disconnecting the autothrottle and applying max manual thrust with no flap change. Only once climbing away can you sequence the Normal GA with a push of TOGA and F20.

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arizonadeux@reddit

Assuming they followed that procedure, what resulted in the rich fuel burn at 0:32? Is that an adjustment in engine configuration from max manual thrust to TOGA?

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CommunicationNo3626@reddit

The freight won’t complain about the landing though

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Cautious_Use_7442@reddit

The horse in the back of the plane might want to complain though

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whiskeytown79@reddit

The packages all clapped when the pilot got it on the ground the next time.

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sylvyrslyt@reddit

I dont fly a ton, but I do remember clapping a few times.

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ABoutDeSouffle@reddit

One of the surest signs you don't fly often :)

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sylvyrslyt@reddit

Both occurrences were probably 30+ years ago, and all 'the boxes' on the plane were clapping like it was the end of a good live song. Might have been a few hoots and rollers, even.

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DutchBlob@reddit

Local bakery’s shipment of 20 wedding cakes was in there

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V3NTRAPMENT@reddit

The freight trains go through a little loopdeedoo there. Also a jail is right out of sight protected by a moat full of gators on at least one side.

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YU_AKI@reddit

Unless there was anything breakable in it

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FwendyWendy@reddit

If this is the one we're leasing at UPS, then don't worry: it's already broken!

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sys370model195@reddit

The founder of Kalitta Air was the first driver to reach 200MPH in a Top Fuel car, in 1964 - he founded Kalitta Air in 1967. Kalitta was a big name in drag racing when I got interested in cars in high school around 1970, but mostly as team owner and no longer as a driver.

If you never have been to a NHRA race, and watched Fuel cars launch from the pit side as close as you can get to the start line, you don't know what NOISE is :-)

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CassiCatto@reddit

So, a Thursday for Kalitta.

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planchetflaw@reddit

Cool spot. Aircraft, road transport vehicles, trains all parallel

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NoConvincingName@reddit

Autistics safe space

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CT-1065@reddit

TIL there's a freighter conversion for 777-300s!

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DouchecraftCarrier@reddit

It's such an interesting idea to me because in terms of sheer weight the 300ER doesn't actually have that much higher MTOW than the F variant even though it is over 30 feet longer so it's not just a matter of being able to cram in way more boxes - or if it is its because they found a utility for large volumes of non-as-heavy freight that would fill an F without maxing it out on weight.

I mean clearly it's cost effective - they're doing it, after all. It's just interesting to think about. I wish I knew more about what the tradeoffs are.

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random352486@reddit

Volume matters more nowadays with ecommerce being as popular as it is, Airbus even admitted that they were dumb for making a dedicated 330-200 freighter instead of a 330-300 one since most customers need to ship high volumes without maxing out the payload.

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Lord_Master_Dorito@reddit

There’s a Kalitta 777-300ER that’s being flying from ONT daily but I think they’re being leased by UPS. Showed up after the MD-11 groundings.

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LowEmergencyCaptain@reddit

This!

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HelloSlowly@reddit (OP)

Indeed. AerCap does the conversions in house. Kalitta is getting a bunch of ex-Emirates birds as converts through this program

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fly_awayyy@reddit

The do not do it in house? It’s done by IAI Bedek in Tel Aviv Israel. They’re known for their 767 and 747 conversions as well. They were the first ones to the market with the 777 conversion program with 2 other American ones to follow. The 777-200LRF actually just got certified a few days ago. There are only about 10 of the -300ERFs around the while program is about less than a year old.

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definitelyainoreally@reddit

777-200LRF

did they finally figure out what to do with the floor of 77L? I thought it was cost prohibitive because the floor spars were carbon or something

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fly_awayyy@reddit

Same thing from the -300ERF to the -200LRF. All 777s for that matter have carbon floor beams. But they replace them all during the conversion. I suppose they made it cost effective or warranted to do that.

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planchetflaw@reddit

Hopefully they'll look at going in-house now.

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fly_awayyy@reddit

Why would they do that? IAI owns the STC with the other 2 companies still working on certification. AerCap is a leasing arm…they don’t do nor want to do this type of work. IAI is a benchmark and standard in these conversions with their years of experience.

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HelloSlowly@reddit (OP)

Thanks for the correction. Just went down the rabbit hole and now I don’t know how I conflated the program with AerCap. Just one of those things I thought made sense when I read about it and then didn’t bother to read further into it. Thanks though!

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Pootang_Wootang@reddit

Aspire is doing conversions in partnership with Mammoth freighters in Fort Worth

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PointOfFingers@reddit

Looks like it's carrying a load of helium balloons.

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TapDancinJesus@reddit

Im just a helicopter guy, but can someone tell me why you'd go around after that? Looks like it was already on its mains

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TigerIll6480@reddit

Not a pilot, but I’ve traveled a lot, and I was wondering the same thing.

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OperationAccurate154@reddit

Could have been a windshear they got before touching down. Hit the power to go around but those big engines take a bit to spool up to go around thrust. Could have landed beyond on the touchdown zone and instead of risking a runway overrun the balked the landing too. Could have been a million different things. Lots of arm chair pilots in this thread.

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Techhead7890@reddit

Most likely unstable possibly due to crosswinds that you can hear on the mic, looked like the tail or wingtips were about to hit the ground at some points (eg 0:06 as the tail just passes the railway crossing RxR sign). Better not to risk any damage the plane, few bad seconds could be very costly.

Not a pilot nor local so can't comment directly on airspeed or location relative to the runway threshold (pretty hard to see any end markings from the video itself), but those could also be factors in deciding to make another approach, because you don't want to go off the end either.

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willreadforbooks@reddit

DON’T SINK! DON’T SINK!

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RogLatimer118@reddit

PULLL UP! PULL UP!

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weech@reddit

Seriously, wtf that 💀

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SnooEagles7290@reddit

bro needed a deep breath at the throttle before locking in again

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HF_Martini6@reddit

Not that hard of a landing and definitely no dices rolling on that go around

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Mysterious_Contact_2@reddit

That wasnt really a hard landing

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xChoke1x@reddit

I was on a plane that did this.

Terrifying isn’t even close to what this shit is

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Techhead7890@reddit

It feels unexpected but it's usually safer to stay in the air, rather than hitting something by accident. Even a small ding can end up becoming a headache for maintenance and operations. Seems like you made it home safe, so it seems like pilots made the right call all being said in the end!

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Scrambley@reddit

I know this doesn't really make sense but, that plane looks like a goober. Never thought that was possible but it really looks like a goober of a plane.

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bleeper21@reddit

Why no livery or markings?

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ActualSupervillain@reddit

Cargo planes that run military contracts are generally as plain and white as possible

Worked in cargo for 10 years, other companies do it too

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bleeper21@reddit

Interesting, you'd think that would make them stand out more

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Fancy_o_lucas@reddit

It’s more about avoiding having the bright flashy livery of the company directly showing their involvement in highly political military movements.

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bleeper21@reddit

Classic

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MauschelMusic@reddit

To professionals and people interested in aircraft, but not to the public. I guess it depends on who you don't want to notice.

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ToddtheRugerKid@reddit

Yep, another thing, Kalitta had a few 747 Factory freighters and IIRC most of them were white for that reason. They used the Factory freighters for a lot of military stuff because of the nose door.

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samnfty@reddit

I was told by a load master that, due to the layout of the 777F floors, they can only handle standard sized freight containers, and cannot handle the odd sized military freight.

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prex10@reddit

Boxes don't care what the plane looks like

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bleeper21@reddit

I don't get it

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prex10@reddit

Boxes aren't not living things...

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bleeper21@reddit

So they are?

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prex10@reddit

I don't know to explain that any simpler.

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SamKay00@reddit

As a first step… Tell him it’s a cargo plane 😅

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bleeper21@reddit

Ooooooh, I understand. The boxes INSIDE the CARGO plane don't care what the outside of the plane looks like.

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flightist@reddit

Probably don’t have strong opinions on the inside aesthetics either.

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bleeper21@reddit

Maybe you should reach out to FedEx, UPS, DHL and countless other major shipping companies because I think they also might be confused. Can you believe they paint the outside of the plane?! Those idiots probably did it because they think the boxes have opinions.

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DistributionHot2150@reddit

A bunch of DHL planes are white

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bleeper21@reddit

Clearly my lack of tarmac time is showing.

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HelloSlowly@reddit (OP)

Likely fresh from conversion from AerCap and Kalitta isn’t keen to keep her on the ground to get a paint job when she can make them money. Or in this case do a bouncey bounce

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Eeebs-HI@reddit

I think the name is Mr. Bouncey McBounce.

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fly_awayyy@reddit

AerCap doesn’t convert its IAI Bedek

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GeraintLlanfrechfa@reddit

No livery no shame 😅

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bleeper21@reddit

Pilots slowly pulling the blinds down

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Big_Spicy_Tuna69@reddit

Aeroflot style

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Winbot4t2@reddit

Fuck I love the GE90.

But yeah, dicey is fairly accurate here.

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jaynon501@reddit

my spine hurts from seeing that

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confusedguy1212@reddit

My first reaction is “I’m willing to bet they landed flaps 25”

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Searching4Health@reddit

Not 777 rated but is there some tiny resemblance to the Emirates 777 crash? Pressing TO/GA button close to the ground and not getting full throttle? Obvs got some juice out of this one but looked like it was intermittent until the end.

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Necessary_Topic_1656@reddit

You don’t rely on autothrottles. You physically advance the thrust levers to TOGA while pushing the TOGA buttons.

It’s part of the rejected landing / go around just prior to touchdown briefing prior to the approach.

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