One million Europeans ask the EU to suspend association agreement with Israel for 'crimes in Gaza'
Posted by ChillAhriman@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 94 comments
pimmen89@reddit
Signed it. This one is a no brainer since the EU-Israel association agreement stipulates that the EU and Israel need a mutual respect for human rights, democratic principles, and international law. Settler colonialism, apartheid, and henocide violates that.
Till er andra svenskar: det är jättelätt, man kan signera med BankId eller Freja Id. Även den lataste som blir andfådd av att åka hiss kan ändå signera.
Dry-Season-522@reddit
Until Russia looks your way then you REALLY want that Israeli defense tech. I hope you never seen a circuit.
Naurgul@reddit
So far I've seen Israeli "defence" tech used by far-right politicians to spy on journalists, businesspeople, civil society and other politicians. Not the best impression.
dusjanbe@reddit
Arrow 3 is the main air defense system for Germany, the German government closed the largest arms deal in Israel's history.
Since you are Greek, apparently Greece is one of biggest spender in EU when it comes to buying Israeli weapons.
https://breakingdefense.com/2026/04/greece-inks-750m-deal-with-israel-for-elbits-puls-rocket-artillery-systems/
Naurgul@reddit
I was talking about what I've seen in action. I know our governments keep buying these things.
pimmen89@reddit
Israel buys more EU defense tech than we buy Israeli defense tech. We can also buy circuits from other countries, Israel is only 0.6% of EU trade so that’s roughly how much it costs to buy from somewhere else, maybe plus another 0.5% of our trade to account for logistics.
dusjanbe@reddit
That's just false, Europe is the largest market for Israeli weapon export and growing by the year, it's actually went after October 7th. Approximately $8 billion in 2024, the numbers for 2025 is not out yet but expect another record breaking year for Israeli arms industry. Note that Israel is the primary provider of Arrow 3 for Germany, the primary air defense system against Russian ballistic missile.
Then entire EU arms sale is around $124.06 million including some ammunition and smaller firearms.
https://www.calcalistech.com/ctechnews/article/vrvgh4wdb
https://tradingeconomics.com/european-union/exports/israel/arms-ammunition-parts-accessories
GriffinNowak@reddit
Will the EU be providing forces to ensure attacks against Israel stop?
SpontaneousFlame@reddit
I didn’t realise that stopping trade with someone entailed an obligation to protect them when they go on murder sprees and face inevitable opposition.
GriffinNowak@reddit
No. You would be protecting them to stop them from defending themselves. Israel is targeted by its neighbors. They developed the most advanced air defense in the world to combat it. If you want them to stop attacking their neighbors then you should get their neighbors to stop attacking them. And this is where europe fails. Look at souther Lebanon. Despite UNIFIL presence they failed to stop hezboullah attacks.
You want the human rights violations to stop? Then do something about the underlying problem. Because when Europe fails to address it (like with UNIFIL) you see what happens.
SpontaneousFlame@reddit
The underlying problem is a rogue state that is massacring children. Sending in troops to defend it isn’t going to stop it massacring children, it will embolden it and then more children will die.
This has never been about self defence. It’s about expansion and ethnic cleaning. You just have to listen to Israel’s politicians explaining this plainly to everyone who will listen in their voter base.
GriffinNowak@reddit
So don’t send troops to defend Israel. Send troops to stop the other countries from performing violent actions. Don’t make it about Israel. Make it about those other countries violent actions.
I think you’d be surprised by what changes when countries stop attacking Israel. Look at Egypt and Jordan for example.
SpontaneousFlame@reddit
Israel can’t stop attacking other countries. It’s like a drug addict with a rage problem. You want Europe to send troops to be target practice for the IDF? I don’t think that will work out for anyone.
You are approaching this problem from a viewpoint that Israel has the absolute right to mass murder children and other civilians in order to steal land and expand. That’s not a right anyone has under international law.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Other countries can’t stop attacking Israel. It’s like a drug addict with a rage problem. Europe complains when Israel does something about it so I am inviting Europe to address the situation themselves.
It’s the policy of “if you don’t like how I’m doing it. You do it yourself”. It’s easy to complain when you aren’t the one actually trying to solve it. I have also offered that every time one of the terrorist groups shoots rockets, missiles, etc I am allowed to do an equivalent it to the EU. I think a few rocket attacks will cause the EU to feel very differently on how this should be addressed
Revlar@reddit
Preemptive attacks are illegal by international law. If you want defensive pacts, make them and then they will be acted upon when Israel is attacked.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Great! So you would support a defensive pact where if Israel is attacked then the EU will defend israel and, unlike UNIFIL it will prevent any further attacks by eliminating the threat like we did when iraq invaded kuwait? Something tells me it wont take hezboullah or Hamas long to launch rockets again and since the EU will be handling the elimination of those groups after they attack israel israel won’t even do any war crimes….. assuming you guys actually eliminate those groups.
Revlar@reddit
I would support an intervention of Israel by international forces, a dismantling of the IDF and summary trial for all its active members as well as every political figure that acted in the furtherance of genocide. Israel's enemies will not attack Israel while it is occupied by the militaries of UN nations. Eventually there will need to be a dissolution of Israeli apartheid, and decades of work to bury the blood feuds it created and fostered.
GriffinNowak@reddit
I don’t think that would work. There’s already an intervention by the UN to disarm Hezboullah in southern Lebanon. I’m not sure if you’ve seen the news recently …. But you guys can’t even pull that offs
Revlar@reddit
No, that intervention is not to disarm Hezbollah, and sure there is because Israel is willing to attack UN workers and has done so many times since 2023. They've directly targeted the UN, the UN's infrastructure and the volunteer corps. They've given the international comunity no quarter, disallowing journalists, killing journalists from Gaza and Lebanon. They've targeted hospitals, aid convoys, paramedics.
GriffinNowak@reddit
https://unifil.unmissions.org/en/unifil-mandate
UNIFIL disagrees with you
Revlar@reddit
Can you not read what that says?
GriffinNowak@reddit
I can. Are you intentionally ignoring the whole:
Revlar@reddit
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_attack_on_Ramyah_UNIFIL_post
GriffinNowak@reddit
Did you find the parts I quoted from the website?
Revlar@reddit
I already read the whole thing. You haven't demonstrated that Hezbollah attacked from those positions, while it's been clearly shown that Israel has violated its agreements and seeks to expand into Southern Lebanon. Your entire argument is moot. The UN is being ignored and attacked by Israel.
GriffinNowak@reddit
So do you want to restate your original claim about the purpose of UNIFIL? Also I didn’t demonstrate it because I didn’t need to. Anyone who follows the situation knows what happens but if you need further proof here is the Red Cross admitting it.
Since you had a hard time reading the first one:
UNIFIL has failed to provide any evidence that these attacks are not coming from within the blue line. And seeing as their mission is may I remind you “Assist the Government of Lebanon in ensuring the return of its effective authority in the area.” They are failing at this.
They are ignored because they are failing.
Pklnt@reddit
Let's suspend trade with the state that violates international law first.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Okay. Stop trading with the US, Russia, pretty much all of the Middle East, oh and don’t forget China…. Actually who do you plan on trading with then?
Pklnt@reddit
Which state currently is violating international law as per UNGA & UNSEC resolutions and the ICJ and also has its head of state under an ICC mandate?
GriffinNowak@reddit
So you don’t care about international laws being violated. Only some international laws being violated. The ones you deem important. Interesting application of the law.
Pklnt@reddit
Find me a state that is violating international law as per the UN General Assembly, the Security Council, the International Court of Justice and the International Criminal Court and I'll tell you that we shop stop trading with them.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Russia: ICJ Ukraine v. Russian Federation (provisional measures, 2022)
United States: Embargo of Cuba
China: 2016 South China Sea arbitration
Here’s an example for each of the big 3. I am too lazy to go through the Middle East but you’re welcome to on your own. I look for to you saying you should stop trading with each of these countries (it would destroy your country)
Staticn0ise@reddit
Maybe they should. I mean they have pretty much cut Russia out. And Isreal should be sanctioned like North Korea for the genocide they are committing. You would think a people who were on the receiving end less than 100 years ago would be against committing it themselves but here we are.
GriffinNowak@reddit
And China?
IAMADon@reddit
Russia is the most sanctioned country in the world.
I agree, there should be sanctions.
This isn't relevant. "Arbitration" means it's a dispute, not a crime.
The rest of your comments either refer to decades-old violations or imply that every violation is equivalent in seriousness to genocide, so this doesn't seem like a good line of argument, tbh.
GriffinNowak@reddit
No it doesn’t. They have been found to have violated international law. You can read up on it. They continue to violate it with many of their efforts in the South China Sea btw.
rattleandhum@reddit
Engaging in a frantic whatabout debate does not bolster your cause.
Just because the Global Hegemon kills and maims does not mean your favourite state gets to do the same.
And you'd be reminded that Russia is currently under broad economic sanction from the EU and the US.
GriffinNowak@reddit
This isn’t a whatabout debate. He said he wanted to suspend trade with states that violate international law first. So I told him who that would require suspending trade with. Being from South Africa you would be on that list too :)
He’s now gone from “violations of international law” to a corvette owner trying to explain how his car is a 1:1 because only 1 painted in that color was made on a Tuesday in June.
rattleandhum@reddit
oh please illuminate us, defender of genocide whose opinion isn't worth piss.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Apartheid, your occupation of Namibia, raids on your neighbors, backing insurgent groups, failure to arrest in compliance with ICC warrant, etc :)
Don’t know a lot about your own history do you now?
rattleandhum@reddit
I was unaware historic injustices were in the running, in which case literally no country is beynd rebuke, save perhaps Bhutan. But Israel being built the expulsion of almost a million people and on the graves of Palestinian towns is an apt foundation for such a rotten state.
I'm well aware of my history, which is why I recognise an ongoing Apartheid when I see one in Israel, as well as a reckless genocide being committed by messianic nutjobs pretending to speak for all jews.
GriffinNowak@reddit
You violated international law chief. You are no longer allowed to trade with France ❌❌❌❌
Pklnt@reddit
I'm talking about all the international bodies combined.
GriffinNowak@reddit
So, like I said, you don’t care about international laws being violated. Only the ones you deem important.
Pklnt@reddit
I literally told you that we should stop trading with countries condemned by the most relevant international bodies when it comes to international law.
GriffinNowak@reddit
I listed states that have violated international laws. I even listed examples of the laws they violated. You seem unwilling to suspend trade with them while you “reevaluate why Israel is such a disgusting state”.
I am sure the French will do quite well without trade with the US, Russia, and China. 😊😊😊
Pklnt@reddit
Do you struggle understanding English?
GriffinNowak@reddit
I dont. Let me remind you:
Each of those countries has been determined to have violated international law. I look forward to France suspending trade with all 3.
Pklnt@reddit
Let's suspend trade with the state that violates international law first
=/=
Let's suspend trade with states that violate international law first
GriffinNowak@reddit
My friend. You’re intentionally playing dumb. So I am playing along :)
Pklnt@reddit
I think you should go back to school and learn the difference between these two sentences.
GriffinNowak@reddit
I know the difference. That’s why I apologized. You will be suspending trade with China for its violations of international law. I support how much you care about international law that you would be willing to sacrifice the French economy like that. Viva la France or whatever you frogs say.
Pklnt@reddit
Now I understand why Trump was elected.
GriffinNowak@reddit
And I understand why pensioners make more than your average working age person in France.
GriffinNowak@reddit
OHHHH you’re right. “the state” So France will be suspending trade with China since it violates international law. My bad.
Pklnt@reddit
Now you're playing dumb? It's pathetic honestly.
voidox@reddit
yes there's a difference between the various international laws: Israel's ongoing genocide and ethnic cleansing, that one demands more attention and focus now than others.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Oh we should prioritize ongoing genocide and ethnic cleansings? Interesting. Why is the UAE not currently sanctioned for funding the RSF then? If that’s our concern we should also be prioritizing the most active and most prevalent genocide and their backers right?
voidox@reddit
cause UAE is a US and Israel puppet, so the underlying issue is still the US and Israel there.
yes, Israel and the US. Thanks for agreeing with me and supporting this initiative.
voidox@reddit
you zoinists just can't stop eh, you can't even update your hasbara to try something different.
yes, Israel totally just "gets attacked" by others as Israel totally has just sat around doing nothing since it's founding, totally. Israel totally is the innocent victim who did nothing and it's everyone else that just "attacks them for no reason".
stfu please, no one believes this nonsense and anyone with eyes can look up history of how Israel is always the aggressor.
every accusation is a confession <--- every time, the saying is always true.
the underlying problem is Israel and zionists like you that defend genocide and want genocide, ethnic cleansing, human rights violations, torture, rape, imprisonment, stealing land, abuse, oppression, the Gaza concentration camp, starvation, blocking aid, Death Law, apartheid and the war crimes list goes on and on.
so yes, we want the human rights violations to stop and Israel is the underlying problem, so this initiative is working to do something about it.
you can cry about Hezbollah all you want, it doesn't change reality and doesn't work, same shit you tried to pull with "Khamas!" all the time after yet another war crime. Hezbollah would stop their attacks if Israel retreated from Lebanon and returned all the annexed lands, if Israel stopped bombing Lebanon... a little bit of history here for you: Hezbollah is a direct creation of Israel's (and the US's) actions and war crimes during the Lebanon civil war. "Reap what you sow" is a favourite line you genocide defenders love throwing out, well reap what you sow then.
voidox@reddit
it's some insane victim card stuff by him, acting like the only way Israel will stop it's genocide, being the aggressor, ethnic cleansing, war crimes is when others "defend them", as if Israel cannot stop it's evil and it's everyone else making them do it... just insane.
pimmen89@reddit
No, genocide, settler comonialism, and apartheid is absolutely indefensible and something a country has to stop unconditionally since it’s indefensible.
GriffinNowak@reddit
That’s nice. Will you be providing protection against the groups currently attacking?
pimmen89@reddit
The terrorist groups are already designated as such by the EU and funding them is a crime that is enforced by EU authorities and banks. We’re already doing things to weaken those groups, and so far this carrot has only emboldened Israel in its genocide, apartheid, and settler colonialism against Palestinians.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Great! But they’re clearly still being funded or else they wouldn’t be able to attack. Evidently that strategy isn’t working. So I ask again, will the EU be providing protection?
pimmen89@reddit
And I said ”maybe”, it will likely depend on what reforms the Israel makes to ensure it’s institutions won’t allow genocide, apartheid, and settler comonialism again.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Interesting. Well I welcome you to get the EU to commit to doing this. I think if the EU provides a sufficient level of security and actually backs this up unlike their already failed attempts with UNIFIL you will see policy shift. But what should be the consequences if they fail? Does the EU need to admit that they were wrong about what Israel is doing?
pimmen89@reddit
I don’t think so, the EU gave Israel weapons, favorable trade deals, designated Israel’s enemies as terrorists, research cooperation, and more which has just made Israel policy worse and worse. Giving into Israel’s demands has only made Israel ramp up its settler colonialism, ethnic cleansing, apartheid, and it finally culminated into genocide.
That’s why I think the EU should admit that they were wrong about appeasing Israel and they definitely need to admit that they were wrong about what Israel is doing, since they’ve been calling it ”national security” when in reality Israel was committing genocide, settler colonialism, and ethnic cleansing. That’s what the whole petition is about.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Okay so in return for less research cooperation and favorable trade deals the EU will use those weapons that Israel will no longer need to eliminate the groups that keep attacking Israel.
You are claiming that this is possible to do without the things that Israel is doing. So I think it’s only fair you guys prove it. But if you can’t do it (and seeing as EU countries currently staff UNIFIL who once again is actively failing at this exact goal) you will need to admit that maybe you guys don’t know what you’re talking about. Oh and btw if in your efforts you kill and civilians, despite the combatants dressing as civilians, I will accuse the entire EU of performing war crimes.
pimmen89@reddit
Most likely not, maybe if Israel shows very major reforms of its government so that their institutions will prevent future genocides, security guarantees might be on the table. That’s why I said ”maybe”, it’s a very small ”maybe”.
The EU is not obligated to give favorable trade deals to countries, so I don’t see why the EU should give something to Israel in return for not giving something else to Israel. Israel isn’t entitled to the trade deal, they got it after they promised to better its human rights record, and they failed to do it (most likely by not even bothering to try).
GriffinNowak@reddit
I don’t think Israel will be willing to do this. They have already watched you fail in Lebanon. Why would they think you will succeed with this? You want them to reform while you can’t even stop the groups you’ve already committed to stopping?
This is countries. They aren’t really obligated to do anything if they don’t care enough. I don’t see why the EU should expect Israel to reform anything when EU countries can’t fulfill their commitments in Lebanon.
pimmen89@reddit
Well that sucks for Israel then if they’re not willing to do it, since their trade deal with the EU is dependent on them not committing genocide, settler colonialism, apartheid, and ethnic cleansing. South Africa for example had to stop its apartheid before it got rid of its sanctions from European countries, Israel signed a deal pledging they would do the same. It really is pretty simple.
The EU expected that Israel would reform to stop its human rights abuses, and I agree with you that the EU shouldn’t have expected Israel to do that. That’s the point of the petition. Israel should lose its favorable trade deal since it was legally predicated on Israel improving its human rights record, and only get it back when they’ve actually done the necessary reforms.
GriffinNowak@reddit
If you want Israel to stop the abuses you need to address why the abuses exist. You can attempt to sanction them but it’s unlikely to work.
The UNIFIL involvement was also legally predicated on the UN preventing attacks from southern Lebanon. Like… you aren’t picking up on the problem here. If you want the attacks to stop you need to address the threats.
Let me make this more obvious:
If Germany decided it was going to fire rockets at Poland because Poland took control of Gdansk and expelled the Germans you can try to sanction the poles for being mean to the Germans but as long as the Germans keep firing rockets at the Poles they’re not going to stop what they’re doing. Especially if you promised them that you would occupy Berlin in order to make Germany stop but Germany keeps shooting them despite the occupation. If anything at that point Poland you’re only pressuring Poland to invade Germany, eliminate the threat once and for all. And call it a day. Or seeing as in this scenario Poland is stronger than Germany, then you just invade Germany, capture Berlin and kick out all the Germans to France and use Germany as a buffer zone…. Wait a second that sounds familiar.
pimmen89@reddit
So maybe Israel shouldn’t have signed a deal saying they would stop committing its human rights abuses if they can’t promise to actually do it? You and Israel want to claim it’s unfair for the EU to take away a trade deal after Israel explicitly violated the terms of the deal, and you even argue that Israel should be compensated with security guarantees in return for breaking the deal.
Genocide is not a defensible war strategy. That’s what ”never again” meant.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Maybe the UN shouldn’t have committed to stopping Hezboulah in other Lebanon if they couldn’t actually do it? And if the EU doesn’t like how Israel is handling it then, once again, I welcome the EU to address the problem themselves. And I will sit there and accuse them of genocide every step of the way as they try to deal with it.
I am very curious what deal you’re talking about now. I looked around a bit and didn’t find what to seem to be claiming.
Also, will the UN compensate Israel for its failures in Lebanon?
pimmen89@reddit
This isn’t about restoribg security to the region, that’s not what the petition is about. It’s about not giving a favorable deal to a genocidal state that committed itself to stop its human rights abuses by signing it.
You know the deal mentioned in the petitition that this whole thread is about, the EU-Israel association of 2000? It stipulates that Israel gets a favorable trading relationship with the EU, conditional on Israel improving its human rights record. Israel is only 0.6% of EU trade so the EU gets almost nothing out of it, but the EU is more than 30% of Israel’s trade so they get a lot out of it and have violated the terms of the deal.
This goes beyond Israel even, what’s the point of us making deals when the other party can just shit all over it and we still give them what they want? Why make deals with Mercosul where they pledge better environmental policy in exchange of better trade relations with us when Metcosul knows they can just ignore it and get no consequences, like Israel did?
ChillAhriman@reddit (OP)
Is Israel willing to suspend their sovereignity so that we can stop them from doing the things that make people want to attack them? If that's the case, you can count me in.
GriffinNowak@reddit
Sure. You just have to prove that you can stop them from getting attacked first. Unfortunately this was already attempted with UNIFILs failure so you will need to prove yourself first.
ChillAhriman@reddit (OP)
Is there a UN blue helmets division detaining the Israelies who illegally kick Palestinian civilians out of their homes? Or the Israeli soldiers who arbitrarily detain Palestinian children and torture them? No, there aren't. The blue helmets at Lebanon were only a half-baked measure that didn't aim to solve the root of the conflict.
GriffinNowak@reddit
All the EU has to do is prove that they can actually address the problem. The UN unfortunately lost you the benefit of the doubt with its failures. I welcome you to campaign for this approach to finally bring peace to this area. Just to make sure the EU takes it seriously though, unlike UNIFIL did, any attacks the EU fails to prevent I should be allowed to personally launch an equivalent one against spain. You let Hamas launch rockets? I get shoot rockets at spain. You let Hezboullah shell Israel? I get to shell a town in spain. I think this will ensure that they take it seriously. Im sure the Spainish people will welcome this. Think of the number of lives it will save :)
meister2983@reddit
Israel had already built extensive settlements in the West Bank and had annexed East Jerusalem by the agreement date in 1995 so presumably plenty of actions don't count as violations
GR1ZZLYBEARZ@reddit
You Swedes have the coolest names for stuff
DancesWithAnyone@reddit
My kindergarden was named after Loki, so I guess I see your point.
GR1ZZLYBEARZ@reddit
Perfect for little kids, mischievous buggers
No_Fox@reddit
Respecting human rights is antisemitic don't you know? /s
ChillAhriman@reddit (OP)
If you're an EU citizen and you haven't signed it yet, you can do so here: https://eci.ec.europa.eu/055/public/
Even though the initiative has reached the 1 million required signatures, a percentage of those will be found not valid upon sending it to the European Parliament, so it's best for it to have as many extra signs as possible to avoid unnecessary setbacks.
PerforatedPie@reddit
The article says they're going to keep taking signatures until they reach 1.5 million to account for this.
Scythe95@reddit
Thanks!
turbohuk@reddit
thank you for the link. signed it.
Oninonenbutsu@reddit
done
gnocchiGuili@reddit
In France 700,000 people signed against a law that would forbid the criticism of Israel, they decided to throw it away, and just postponed the law until during the World Cup.
Pretty sure this petition will end up the same sadly.
Daysleeper1234@reddit
People will say their opinion, government will ignore it, people will vote for the new government next election, new government gets elected, does everything what the old one did. But it's democracy, we have a voice, and it will be heard, I mean it will, but it will be ignored as always. If you want to criticize something that doesn't hurt their owners, our politicians will agree with you, give you all the rights. But as soon as you touch the people who own them, then it goes: hold on, buck!
ChillAhriman@reddit (OP)
It's possible, but if the opposing side has been lobbying for their goals for decades, our side will have to lobby for ours for a long while as well.
The vast majority of political battles you pick will not reach the goals you want them to, but they still push in their direction, and even a trail of defeats can carve a way to create a slightly better world, just as long as you're consistent. This initiative will probably not achieve the suspension of the EU-Israel partnership, but it still signals to politicians that there are millions of voters who might be willing to punish them for looking the other way in the face of genocide, and some parties will slowly begin to change direction.
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