Ferrari Luce Interior

Posted by strongmanass@reddit | cars | View on Reddit | 78 comments

Another video from Ferrari about the Luce interior. \[VIDEO LINK\](https://youtu.be/DP7vVve0jGc?si=hdGMrsiZH2v86YlF) They're \*really\* trying to focus on the tactility. What they haven't said anything about is the driving experience. Maybe it's just how they decided to segment the marketing campaign, but the message I get from the world's proudest performance brand focusing exclusively on the interior of their first ever EV is that they don't feel they have anything innovative or unique to offer to the performance EV driving experience. If we look at other legacy EV messaging: \* Porsche gave the Taycan a 2 speed gearbox because they wanted to maintain high-speed acceleration. They removed the rear seats to make a track variant. They drag raced the Cayenne EV against the 918 \* Rolls Royce's first line about the Spectre was a quote from Charles Rolls in 1900 wishing for EVs and how the Spectre finally grants that wish \* BMW gave their upcoming EVs the same name as the company-rescuing gamble from the 1960s and styling cues to match \* Jaguar are desperately trying to convince people that their new EV is a modern XJC \* Mercedes gave the AMG GT EV the exact same sound as their V8 \* Audi say the Concept C is inspired by their cars going back to 1936 \* Alpine say the A110 EV is still focused on being as light as possible (for an EV) Everyone is focusing on legacy and brand identity. But Ferrari..."look at our interior designed by the iPhone guy." They haven't even confirmed the body style. IMO it's very strange messaging from the quintessential supercar maker. \*\*TL;DR\*\*: new Ferrari Luce interior video \[HERE\](https://youtu.be/DP7vVve0jGc?si=hdGMrsiZH2v86YlF). Why no focus on how it drives?

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78 Comments

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Maximilianne@reddit

I don't think Ferrari needs to be innovative, like the 12 cilindri is the most expensive regular Ferrari and is probably slower and less advanced than the cheaper 296 and yet people still buy the big v12 front engined Ferrari anyway

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cerberaspeedtwelve@reddit

Agreed. One way of looking at this is what happened to Rolex. In the 1970s, when quartz crystal watches became widely available, Rolex thought they were doomed. Their selling point was superior accuracy, and it quickly became apparent that the finest $100,000 clockwork mechanism in the world was not as accurate as a $30 digital crystal. 50 years later and they're doing just fine. It turns out that most of the appeal of buying a $100k Rolex is that it costs $100k. For at least a decade, electric cars have been able to out-drag anything that Maranello can make, and yet it hasn't hurt their bottom line. If anything, it's [even more difficult ](https://youtu.be/aOMjp3OhxLY?si=6lu-WKTdDzxH3lJf)to get onto Ferrari's VIP list than it was twenty years ago.

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SwuishySqueeze@reddit

But Rolex is claiming to be the ultimate mechanical watch, how can Ferrari claim to be the superior car WITHOUT an ICE.

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Recoil42@reddit

>In the 1970s, when quartz crystal watches became widely available, Rolex thought they were doomed. \[...\] 50 years later and they're doing just fine. Er, except there's one little problem here — most watchmakers actually did go bankrupt during that time. It was called the [Quartz Crisis](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quartz_crisis): *"By 1983, the crisis reached a critical point. The Swiss watch industry, which had 1,600 watchmakers in 1970, had declined to 600. In March 1983, the two biggest Swiss watch groups, ASUAG and SSIH merged to form ASUAG/SSIH in order to save the industry. This organization was renamed SMH in 1986, and then The Swatch Group in 1998."* See also: [Survivorship Bias](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias). The Quartz Crisis was a very real thing and while Rolex in particular survived, other watchmakers did not. You're counting the hits and ignoring the misses.

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MDA123@reddit

These two points aren't really in tension. Ferrari bears much more resemblance to Rolex than it does to the makers of commodity watches, so there's plenty of reason to think it's possible Ferrari could chart a path like Rolex did: surviving by leaning into craftsmanship, beauty, and brand prestige instead of focusing on performance, which is rapidly commoditizing.

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Recoil42@reddit

>Ferrari bears much more resemblance to Rolex than it does to the makers of commodity watches Pre-quartz swiss watches weren't commodities — that was whole friggin' point of the Quartz Crisis. >surviving by leaning into craftsmanship, beauty, and brand prestige Mate, again, you're just doing rote [survivorship bias](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survivorship_bias) here. Other brands leaned into craftsmanship and failed. *Breitling went bankrupt! Tissot was folded into Swatch!* That was the *whole goddamn point of the Quartz Crisis!*

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MDA123@reddit

Note that I said it's "possible" Ferrari could chart a path like Rolex did by focusing on prestige over performance. I don't think anyone assumes doing so is a foolproof strategy, however. Some brands will try it and fail anyway. Some brands will try it and succeed. Some brands will employ a totally different strategy. The point is that performance is unlikely to be a distinguishing factor between one company's product and another in an age where EV power and related technologies make going fast relatively easy. So Ferrari, like other companies with a history of selling "going fast" to people, will have to lean on something else. Luckily for them, they have racing heritage, styling, and exclusivity as positive features beyond "mere" performance, so they have some good material to work with.

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

They don't need to be innovative in the ICE space because all they have to do is point to their history. But why should anyone buy the Luce over [any of the many very fast EVs]? Should they buy it because of Jonny Ive?

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the_joy_of_VI@reddit

I mean, you do realize that they’re GOING to show us the rest of the car eventually, right?

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

Of course. But them releasing multiple videos of the interior before they put any focus on the driving experience, which they're otherwise keen to tell everyone about, makes me wonder why they're suddenly so quiet about how this Ferrari drives.

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the_joy_of_VI@reddit

They’re clearly not quiet about anything, they’re just leading with the interior, which is honestly different enough to justify a novel approach. Just because they’re Thinking Differently ^(tm) doesn’t mean they’re necessarily hiding something

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cookingboy@reddit

Because it’s got a Ferrari badge. If it looks inside and out, people who already own multiple supercars will be considering it for their daily.

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PastPalpitationCry@reddit

because its got a Ferrari badge. People would buy a Ford Mustang Mach-e for 500k if it was built in Marenello and had a Ferrari badge.

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K_R_A_K_E_N-540@reddit

If people want speed they'll buy a Plaid. Supercars are for showing off

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MRDR1NL@reddit

I agree with most of the list , but hHw is making a sports coupe as light as possible "focussing on legacy"? Alpine just trying to make a fun EV.

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graverobber1@reddit

I hope this type of interior makes its way into the other Ferrari models. It's the perfect mix of tactile and digital. All other brands should really follow suit.

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

Eh ai don't care what Ferrari because I'm not a buyer. But I wouldn't want that interior in my car. It's too industrial for my taste. Everything's very usable and falls to hand, but the design is too joyless for me. There's no artistry. It's a triumph of function but the form leaves a lot to be desired.

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Recoil42@reddit

Jony Ive is a one-trick pony and that trick is ripping off Dieter Rams. All he does is boring-ass unusable designs and I'm tired of people pretending they're not what they are. It's flabbergasting he got where he is doing blatant imitations of 1970s Braun and nothing else.

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MPK49@reddit

What an original take

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Maximilianne@reddit

The death of skeumorphic design has been a disaster

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mantenner@reddit

I was honestly going to say this. He sort of pioneered anti skuemorphism across the industry, or at least it certainly wasn't adopted en masse until he pushed it at apple. That push was responsible for some of the most beautiful, timeless UI we've ever seen. iOS 7 (7.1 more so, 7 was a minor disaster in some ways) still looks modern to this day, can't say the same for iOS 6. He's had a criticized career, but someone so close to the top always will.

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Recoil42@reddit

Eh, fuck that noise. We whiplashed from one extreme to another and neither extreme was good. Overly-excessive simulacra is just as bad as no affordance at all.

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HillarysFloppyChode@reddit

You can’t usually tell it’s an Ive design by the over use of glass and aluminum

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Snazzy21@reddit

More designers should swallow their egos and worry about making designs that do the job rather than have originality. You get shit like whatever is the most recent Reddit/Youtube UI update did, or[ Hyundai Tucson gauges](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/n_oNnYZGlP4/hqdefault.jpg?sqp=-oaymwEmCOADEOgC8quKqQMa8AEB-AH-HYAC8BCKAgwIABABGGUgVihPMA8=&rs=AOn4CLCNZVtC91QQ6TkcRsHMB8cRpKUV_g) that go in increments of 20 mph to be different, but are actually stupid looking and hard to read. Dieter Rams himself interpreted Ive's work as following a a set of design principles rather than a copying of his style, and Ive's didn't deny the inspiration, so I see no reason to get upset

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Thomas_633_Mk2@reddit

The Tuscon design looks like it comes with a lower side impact from the factory, I agree those dials are stupid but it's not like the rest of that car is any better (the rear lights are also crap, they don't line up with the rest of the car at all). And it still sells really well.

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Low-Umpire236@reddit

The 2017 MacBook Pro had only USB-C ports (4) (before their time) and nothing else. When Jony Ive left Apple, they brought back MagSafe, HDMI, and SD card slot in the 2021 MacBook Pro. He loves deleting stuff.

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Recoil42@reddit

Yup. Held onto my 2015 MBP for years for that very reason.

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Low-Umpire236@reddit

They got rid of those clacking butterfly keyboards too in 2021.

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the_joy_of_VI@reddit

> boring-ass unusable designs Boring is of course subjective, but *unusable*? Come the fuck on lol

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Recoil42@reddit

Unusable. Ask anyone with a \~2016-2018 era Macbook Pro with the Butterfly Keyboard.

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AmazonPuncher@reddit

Apple makes ONE bad keyboard and you write off everything this guy has ever done. You're an idiot.

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KaszualKartofel@reddit

Also was he involved with the actual mechanical design of the keyboard? Forgive me my ignorance if he did.

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Recoil42@reddit

Apple made a bunch of shitty things during Jony Ive's tenure. Me listing one thing doesn't mean that's the only example that exists. Speaking of unserious people, yeesh.

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arcangelxvi@reddit

> Apple made a bunch of shitty things during Jony Ive's tenure This mostly became true as Ive gained more control over the execution of his designs. As long as he has the right people to reign in his desire to place form / messaging over function then he’s created some pretty great stuff.

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Recoil42@reddit

I'd generally agree with that (the 2016-2019 era was complete nonsense) but he made a bunch of shitty things early on, too. Hockey puck mouse was a Jony Ive design, for instance. So were the Apple Pencil and Magic Mouse. Trashcan Mac Pro as well.

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the_joy_of_VI@reddit

Apple Pencil and Magic Mouse are bangers though.

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quellofool@reddit

\> there's so much else happening in the automotive world. what else is happening in the automotive world? the GT3 S/C? what else?

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Recoil42@reddit

It would be exhausting to list. To name a few that would be potentially applicable to the Luce (aka, no combustion): Software-defined electronic architectures, steer-by-wire, brake-by-wire, electric braking, electro-mechanical suspension, active suspension, solid-state electrolytes, silicon-carbon anodes, panoramic heads-up-displays, metal printing, high-pressure cast magnesium and aluminum...

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cookingboy@reddit

> it’s ludicrous this is all Ferrari seems to be focused on when there is so much else happening in the automotive world I think there is Ferrari, and then there is the rest of the automotive world. It is a Veblen good that people buy for emotional reasons, and they have all the right, and the ability, to ignore what’s happening in the rest of the world other than government regulations. Even for their EV, it won’t be marketed as mass market product, or even toward people who dream of owning a Ferrari. It will be market as the slickest and sexiest daily driver for people who have already own other Ferrari sports cars.

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

Not everyone can take a rams design & adapt it to modern electronics w/ accessible ux Totally overrated yes but I think he deserves \*slightly\* more credit, he delivered what apple needed Ferrari does not need that who knows wtf is going on there why is there an analogue clock taking up half my CarPlay space

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BowlOfFlowers@reddit

I can care less about the hate. Best ev interior by far. Love all the toggles

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doom_pizza@reddit

You couldn't care less. You're saying that you do care to some degree.

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BowlOfFlowers@reddit

Maybe

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Hackwork89@reddit

Imagine paying Ferrari money and getting that.

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Multifaceted-Simp@reddit

Pretty unique and appears well thought out with a bunch of unique features

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MogosTheFirst@reddit

Looks amazing. I love it much more than whatever others are doing now with one big screen through the dash.

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Snazzy21@reddit

Circles are a notoriously space efficient shape- I mean inefficient. I get wanting it to look like gauges but but if you can't commit to using analog gauges then why fit into the limitations of analog gauges. Rectangular and square gauges existed, and they haven't been used in a very long time and would be something new (old)

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NothingCreative1@reddit

This is going to depreciate like a MF

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

I get what you're saying but every single point you made short of the rolls & maybe the BMW just reads like pure marketing cope For the Alpine, better point is probably the focus on the open-top experience, sound system, etc. they're trying something new Drag racing EVs is so 2018, does anyone care? doesn't seem like their sales do that much. they put a two-speed because they couldn't make a motor nice enough for one I don't see how what Jaguar, Audi, Mercedes are doing is any better than what Ferrari is doing here. Mercedes messaging in fairness is showing quite a bit of the platform. Other two are focusing on everything not-ev about them This is as much based in their legacy identity as Jag's new tourer is based in the e-type

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

I didn't mean any of the other messaging was believable, just that they're attempts to lean on heritage and identity. The fact that Ferrari isn't (or hasn't yet) makes me wonder if they think the easier sell is to focus on the interior details. If that's the case, then I also wonder if they're struggling with what an electric Ferrari means. IMO most legacy performance brands are struggling with communicating the USP of their EVs and not much of it is convincing. But they're all trying the history angle. Is it a good or bad thing that Ferrari's taking a different approach?

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

> fact that Ferrari isn't (or hasn't ye eh I think they're leaning a fair bit on 50s/60s Ferraris particularly with the Veglia/Jaeger dials + 849/sp3/etc > wonder if they think the easier sell is to focus on the interior details > Is it a good or bad thing that Ferrari's taking a different approach? I think more realistically a la audi this is them betting on a design language for the future & they're just beta testing response w/o blowing up their mainline entries. If it goes awry just blame it on EV demand I'd imagine if this was released in '22/'23 back when EV optimism was much higher they'd lean on the technicals a little more, but even thenaA lot of the modern 'ferrari driving experience' is just making their customers feel as good as possible w/o explicitly advertising assists, EV is naturally well suited to those sort of TC systems, I'm sure it will drive quite well if you speak on that you've let the cat out the bag

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> I'd imagine if this was released in '22/'23 back when EV optimism was much higher they'd lean on the technicals a little more Potentially. They have a fair bit on their [website](https://www.ferrari.com/en-EN/auto/ferrari-luce-engineering), but it's probably hard to make that the selling point when people will just point to BYD/Yangwang and Xiaomi. > A lot of the modern 'ferrari driving experience' is just making their customers feel as good as possible w/o explicitly advertising assists That's part of what I'm getting at. A lot of that "feel good" is the ICE internals. When you take away the drama of the engine and gearbox, do Ferraris still justify the premium on merit?

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hi_im_bored13@reddit

> website this might just be top 10 most infuriating sites of all time > A lot of that "feel good" is the ICE internals My point was kinda the opposite, I think a lot more of that ferrari feel has to do with their tuning on electromechanical systems than ICE engineering I think the ferrari chassis magic is greatly overstated in regards to the material science & design of just the bare chassis alone. Likewise with porsche, your usual buyers (at least those at work) love talking about how authentic they've kept the turbo all these years later, its just as inauthentic as anything else they've just always done a better job of integrating it all > do Ferraris still justify the premium on merit? spectrum of California<->Roma with the Cali as no & Roma as yes where I'm pretty sure they've sorted out their character as evidenced by the fantastic response to the 849 for the most part

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> My point was kinda the opposite, I think a lot more of that ferrari feel has to do with their tuning on electromechanical systems than ICE engineering Oh I misunderstood what you meant by "feel as good as possible." I'll give Ferrari credit that they've been gradually increasing their driving assistance without basically any criticism, so it must feel natural/helpful but in a way that drivers still feel in control. > its just as inauthentic as anything else they've just always done a better job of integrating it all IMO one of the greatest accomplishments of modern performance cars is that they're able to convince enthusiasts they're still raw and analog when they're all computer-controlled and the character is explicitly designed. That doesn't mean that modern performance cars aren't desirable or enjoyable, but there's some collective wilful ignorance among enthusiasts.

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GatorD42@reddit

I think it looks good. A few things I’m skeptical about like the rotating screen in the middle and the way that center bin opens.

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APigInANixonMask@reddit

I don't care what anyone says, I think the interior looks phenomenal. It's leagues above what other brands are putting out right now (especially BMW & Mercedes), and I think it's going to age really well. We don't even know what the car looks like on the outside yet, I don't think it's that weird they haven't talked performance.

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> It's leagues above what other brands are putting out right now (especially BMW & Mercedes) I don't agree that it's leagues above , just a different focus. But the Germans are also mass market brands. The Luce interior isn't leagues above Bentley or Aston Martin (design at least, Astons don't actually work). I'll give Ferrari credit that the Luce at least appears on that level instead of the disasters they're known for.

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JARDIS@reddit

They are probably focusing their initial marketing on the interior because this is 4 seater. It makes sense they want to focus a little more on the cabin than the raw performance out the gate. It hints at the direction of the car's focus and also is an addressing of past criticism of Ferrari's interior usability not being as high as it could be.... and they probably spent an ass load on that apple guy so its got to be a selling point Either way the marketing isn't for me so idgaf actually. Ask a rich guy what he thinks about it?

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> They are probably focusing their initial marketing on the interior because this is 4 seater. That wasn't their messaging for the Purosangue aka the "Thoroughbred." That was all about how it has Ferrari DNA and blends performance and livability and is true to their ethos. > Ask a rich guy what he thinks about it? I'm not asking what potential buyers think or what the market reaction will be. I'm questioning if Ferrari believe in the performance merits of their own product relative to other high power options on the market.

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Dead_Beat_Anime_Dad@reddit

reveal still a few weeks away. why not wait instead of speculating

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xlb250@reddit

Emotional therapy

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

They chose to release promotional material before the launch. They chose to emphasize the interior in that promotional material. IMO it's fair to wonder why they've promoted that when they traditionally focus on performance. If Rolls Royce had emphasized the Spectre's performance and said nothing about the smoothness and luxury I'd question them too.

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gosukhaos@reddit

It’s a Ferrari and it’s an EV = it’s going to be really fast, what else do they need to focus on? They have the luxury of the badge doing 90% of the marketing for them

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> what else do they need to focus on? The same things they focus on in their ICE cars outside of the engine and gearbox.

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gosukhaos@reddit

So badge and engine? Maybe you've missed it but they don't market all cars the same, the marketing for a first of its kind EV grand tourer isn't going to be the same as a track focused limited edition just like the marketing for a v12 grand tourer is different. I'm genuinely surprised people in a car enthusiast board need these things spelled out

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baconjerky@reddit

Idk that’s a pretty awesome take on a modern tactile interior. Very innovative usage of screens without plastering the entire dashboard with them like Mercedes. This is the first truly innovative interior I’ve seen in a modern car of any kind. They have to make up for the loss of enjoyment of an ICE drivetrain with a cool interior that’s an interesting place to spend time. I don’t think anyone cares about the drivetrain all that much - it will be fast as fuck.

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

> They have to make up for the loss of enjoyment of an ICE drivetrain with a cool interior that’s an interesting place to spend time. That's what I'm getting at. I don't think that's a convincing USP for a Ferrari. I'm not the Ferrari buyer in any way in any segment so my opinion is moot from the purchasing side. But my reaction to all the Luce stuff is, "is this all the world's most famous performance brand has to offer?"

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Th1rt13n@reddit

Ah, Classic r/cars and internet: We hate screens, give us analogue. Brand: Gives analogue The circlejerk: nooo, not this kind, and why are you focusing on the interior, i want the heritage now.

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

Different individuals have different opinions. I've never complained about screens specifically. I've complained about lack of artistry in interiors. The Luce interior looks a triumph of industrial design and not one of artistry. That's what you get when you hire an industrial designer. I'm also not saying I want Ferrari to focus on heritage. I'm wondering why they're distinctly not doing that when they have for many of their previous cars.

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Puzzled_Region_9376@reddit

You’ve just read marketing and believed it at face value huh? At least Ferrari is looking forward and trying something new while learning from the mistakes made (capacitive nonsense) We will see how the car pans out but honestly I don’t think it’s targeted at anyone here me included

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strongmanass@reddit (OP)

I pointed out the differences in marketing; I didn't say I believed any of it. Whether or not we're the rarget buyers, it's fair to wonder if Ferrari believe the Luce will be best in class based on what Ferrari have always been good at, which is performance. If they believe it, why are they only telling everyone about the interior?

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Puzzled_Region_9376@reddit

Ehhhh? I don’t know if Ferrari is really selling best in class performance in ALL their cars. Some of them for sure But let’s also be honest here. They’re a lifestyle brand at a certain point and they use performance to enhance that image. This seems in line with their strategy when you consider for every car unveiling they make their formula 1 drivers attend they have to attend like 3 Ferrari style events.

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