Envoy or Skywest CJO
Posted by Ambitious-Lock1100@reddit | flying | View on Reddit | 41 comments
Hello everyone, I know this post has been made somewhere before. The story is exactly as the title says. I have a CJO from Envoy and Skywest. I just want some ideas on helping me make the decision. I’m not in a rush, so class dates aren’t a big deal. I’ve already been an instructor long enough. I’m just looking for any opinions/facts to help skew my decision. I’m currently leaning towards Envoy.
Warm_Scientist4928@reddit
Envoy, not even close. Unless there’s a live in base factor that favors SkyWest.
SlickBrisket@reddit
It’s probably 6-8 months earlier for SKW.
Ambitious-Lock1100@reddit (OP)
Is it really a 6-8 month wait?
skele651@reddit
Interviewed mid September at Envoy and still haven’t gotten the call. At this rate I’ll be typed on the CRJ before I get a peep from them. Take the first date
pls_call_my_base@reddit
That is no longer the case. Latest info is both airlines soonest classes are this fall. Of course this can change at any time.
ZebraTurbulent8635@reddit
When was this announced?
pls_call_my_base@reddit
They don't announce stuff like this. You learn it by talking to your recruiters.
ZebraTurbulent8635@reddit
SkyWest is still interviewing and hiring and the CJO is only valid for 6 months
pls_call_my_base@reddit
What's your point?
ZebraTurbulent8635@reddit
Point is SkyWest is still announcing classes for the summer, they just announced one today actually
pls_call_my_base@reddit
Well I hope you are right!
Ok_Witness179@reddit
The recruiters were telling me 2-3 months too. They've been saying that for a long time. 6-8 months seems to have been more accurate..
LycomingO235@reddit
They told us not to call them asking about class dates. Been waiting since December from Envoy about a class date.
Warm_Scientist4928@reddit
Then my answer is SkyWest. That’s too long of a wait for a date that could get pushed out even further.
Warm_Scientist4928@reddit
If you can edit the original post it would help with the answers being more appropriate
dlognam@reddit
Im gonna go ahead and disagree most. Take the first class that comes. I got an Envoy CJO 8 months ago and seriously wondering if CJO will expire before getting a class. Had a class date with OO but turned it down in hopes for envoy. That was a big mistake. OO FO > CFI
NonVideBunt@reddit
Ouch
Flarre80414@reddit
I’d go Envoy… no training contract, ALPA, good spot for United or Delta with an AA flow in your back pocket.
LoudLingonberry5643@reddit
ANG pilot living in a SkyWest base and I’m about to apply to Envoy and not SkyWest. Yes I will commute sometimes but knowing my mil schedule for future trainings I’m going to be able to cut out A LOT of the reserve commuting. Worth it to not be metered
Fr3nch_Toa5t_@reddit
Envoy so delta or United will take you
spacedropper@reddit
Does delta/united not hire from Sky West?
Fr3nch_Toa5t_@reddit
Basically what the other guy said! “Flow” or their special needs cousin “preferred hiring” programs exists to staff the RJ flying by giving people the hopes of an easy transition to a major. Easiest way to get actually to a major is work for the competition or “fly” for them so hiring you takes away a resource from the competition (LCCs and ULCCs included). Put it this way, if you are flying an RJ for a major why would they want to bring you up as quick as possible when you are already flying their passengers for less cost (less pay)?
Do people flow? Yes, but often it takes at least 2-3 times as long as they told you it would when you started assuming there is actually a contractual obligation to flow you up. Sky weezy puts you in the unique position of flying for all 3 majors (+ Alaska) so getting hired outside of any of the programs is very difficult and the Sky->SWA to any major pipeline is mostly closed.
Flows, if it’s actually a flow and rn I believe only the AA wholly owned have a true flow, are a great backup but should never be the main plan.
All this being said flying an RJ for $100 an hour prbly beats the snot out of working for chicken feed as a CFI unless you have a super sweet CFI or a 135/91K job lined up which would give you multi or even better turbine time. Unless your commute would suck hard, Envoy gives you more options than the Mormons
NotABidoof@reddit
Not until they have extracted enough “value” from you
Separate-Sandwich419@reddit
I’m at SkyWest ORD and work on CRJ 200 500 700 900 and ERJ 175. Been here almost 9 months now and love it . I can taxi aircraft now and almost level 2 . We do everything here up to A checks. Pay is 40 an hour here . I did the 10k bonus thing and got all of it in one. No union . Envoy is next to us and we have a lot of former envoy staff that don’t like envoy cuz of the low pay 31 an hour last time I heard idk if it’s changed . But you don’t do much since envoy only has ERJ aircraft there. I can explain more in a DM about SkyWest . But yea if anyone is interested feel free to DM me. We just had 3 new guys start OJT this week on swings so yea . People from Reddit are applying .
thisistherubberduck@reddit
If you can live in base on either live in base. If all things equal then Envoy. You'll be able to try to get to UA and DL outside the flow and won't be metered.
Ok-Money2811@reddit
Absolutely the only answer…I commuted to a regional job for years. I now live 5 miles to work at a major….i will never commute again in my career if i can help it, even for less pay.
Yes, its that different of a life
MeatServo1@reddit
Envoy has ALPA and no 5-year contract. Why would you even consider SkyWest if you could do Envoy? And while it's a long flow time, flowing – literally a guaranteed accession to a major/legacy – directly to AA, or any mayor, isn't an option at SkyWest.
pls_call_my_base@reddit
I have the same good problem. I will be bidding on a junior base for both airlines (ORD) and will take the first available class at either airline in any type, although Envoy has numerous advantages.
I have less than 1 week old intel on class dates: - Envoy 4-6 months - Skywest 6 months ERJ and CRJ
Just a couple weeks ago, OO had CRJ classes available this summer but they are filled.
blizzue@reddit
ALPA
YamComprehensive7186@reddit
Not if it’s a 6-8 month wait, that could be an entire career of misery.
sprulz@reddit
Aside from the obvious with ALPA, it’s also worth pointing out that from what I’ve observed, movement is better at Envoy than most other regionals right now. You will be immediately have an upgrade class as soon as you hit 950 hours. I was on reserve for three months. Very different to what my colleagues at OO/YX are saying.
arnoldinio@reddit
Not true at all at SkyWest. Upgrade available when you want it maybe have to wait a few months. I’m not quite at my 2 year from Indoc mark and I have a may upgrade class.
Warm_Scientist4928@reddit
For CRJ only. ERJ FO’s are in an inferior situation and either bid for ANY base and likely commute to reserve, or transition upgrade into CRJ for an earlier date and preferred domicile. It’s going to likely be years for ERJ FO’s to get an upgrade into their preferred base that isn’t super junior. Bids are well over 1,000.
sprulz@reddit
Good to hear. My buddy there said it was stagnant for a while as an FO that’s why said that. Sounds like it’s gotten better.
arnoldinio@reddit
There was definitely a halt on upgrading and hiring about a year ago like everyone else but it’s coming back to full swing. ERJ is more of a wait than CRJ.
Bowzy228@reddit
Envoy. No contact and you also have a flow as a backup.🤷🏽♂️
Lance-Vancee@reddit
Why are you relying on the opinions of others for your future in this career. Don’t be lazy do your research and figure it out for yourself. Everyone is different.
fallingfaster345@reddit
I posted this in response to a similar question recently:
Here are some other things to ask yourself, at least these are the questions I asked myself when I was making my decision:
• Which is the more stable regional? • If there’s another world altering event and you get stuck at a regional for the next 10, 15 years… which one would you rather work at? • Aircraft (ex: ERJ vs CRJ) • QOL at each airline (contract, pay, union representation, etc) • How fast are the upgrade times? Will you have to fly for 1 year in the right seat to upgrade? 2? 5? • What is the route network like? That directly affects how quickly you will accrue hours. • Who does each carrier operate for? One legacy? All three? Let’s all learn a lesson from ExpressJet.
Worried-Ebb-1699@reddit
Envoy.
Don’t be held to that stupid flow and upgrade stuff
jabbs72@reddit
🦅
rFlyingTower@reddit
This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:
Hello everyone, I know this post has been made somewhere before. The story is exactly as the title says. I have a CJO from Envoy and Skywest. I just want some ideas on helping me make the decision. I’m not in a rush, so class dates aren’t a big deal. I’ve already been an instructor long enough. I’m just looking for any opinions/facts to help skew my decision. I’m currently leaning towards Envoy.
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