Israeli legal org files ICC suit against Spanish PM over Iran exports
Posted by xland44@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 121 comments
Posted by xland44@reddit | anime_titties | View on Reddit | 121 comments
Michael_Gibb@reddit
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure that non-state parties can't file lawsuits at the ICC. It is a criminal court after all, one that has the job of prosecuting war crimes and crimes against humanity, including genocide. And it's one that only states are a party to. So this lawsuit seems entirely performative, which becomes even more apparent considering that Israel is not a party to the ICC.
notehp@reddit
Of course non-state parties can file lawsuits at the ICC. It's supposed to be a court of last resort if victims of war crimes do not get justice in national courts.
Michael_Gibb@reddit
According to the ICC website, only the Office of the Prosecutor can bring cases before the court.
notehp@reddit
Proceedings at the ICC can start with with one of the following:
The last point is what I meant that I as a private person can "file a lawsuit" - I notify the ICC of crimes committed, the ICC prosecutors will take over, determine if they take the case, start an investigation and if there is compelling evidence proceedings will start. If that's called something else than filing a lawsuit in English legal terms - my bad - I'm not a native speaker.
Michael_Gibb@reddit
Technically, in all those cases it's the ICC prosecutor who files the case with the ICC. The Security Council doesn't, neither does a state party. In all instances, a report is filed with the Office of the Prosecutor, alleging a crime had been committed. First, the Prosecutor must determine if a crime has in fact occurred before then launching an investigation and eventually charging someone with a crime.
The point is that all legal proceedings at the ICC must go through the Office of the Prosecutor, who is the one that has the sole authority to bring a case before the court.
It's best to think of the Office of the Prosecutor as the police and the district attorney rolled into one.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
So, according to the article an NGO that decided to launch lawsuits globally to any entity they deem "Israel's enemy" lol.
Part of of lawsuit says:
Who has killed more civilians in the past 3-4 years? Someone needs to sue all of Israel's suppliers.
Redditthedog@reddit
If the numbers are to be believed Iran’s slaughter of protesters out numbered civilian casualties in Gaza
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
I don't believe the Iran numbers. Show me the proof.
voidox@reddit
they never do reply when asked for proof on that, or heck for most of their claims, classic. The reality is:
https://x.com/DropSiteNews/status/2044273144454607016
the 42k number Trump is throwing out and these warhawks/genocide defenders are spouting seems most likely to be arrests, while the massacre of innocents by the regime is estimated at around 7k, according to HRANA which is a US-funded group so it's not pro-IRGC or w.e.
but ya, they'll never reply and can't show proof cause it's just PR for them, casually using innocent deaths to defend their genocide, disgusting.
travistravis@reddit
Even if 42k was all murders, it's still far less than Gaza.
protomenace@reddit
The question was civilian deaths though. The Gaza numbers include military.
travistravis@reddit
So you're willing to use the wildly inflated numbers from Iran and choosing to minimise the ones in Gaza.
That tells me about all I need to know.
protomenace@reddit
When did I minimize numbers in Gaza?
0 is 100% not the correct number of military deaths in Gaza. If you believe it is, you need your head checked.
travistravis@reddit
"Oh that only counts civilians" ... without accounting for the fact that in addition to bombing them, they were also being starved to death and the health system was systematically being destroyed which meant that there was no central location to even track the dead.
curious_scourge@reddit
The 30k figure comes from Iran health minister official medical numbers from just Jan 7 and 8. https://time.com/7357635/more-than-30000-killed-in-iran-say-senior-officials
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
So, from your article what I gather is:
-The sources of this claim are rwo unnamed senior officials from Iran’s Ministry of Health.
-Comes from Dr. Amir-Mobarez Parasta, diaspora living in Germany.
-Time explicitly states it could not independently verify the figures.
-No corroboration from major neutral outlets at that scale.
So with no explicit evidence, I'm to believe there was 30,000 deaths in 2 days, according to the claim? I'm not saying there weren't any, in fact I do believe the real estimates (~6000). But to blindly believe this unverified claim on this era of information warfare is wild, especially with how many incentives western media, governments and certain groups have to peddle this war.
🤔
curious_scourge@reddit
Well remember that the HRANA number is 6000 verified of 22490 reported deaths from Jan 7/8 under investigation.
There's also a doctor's network referenced in the wiki article
"A count of 25,654 "clinically reported [protest-related] deaths" for dates "up to the [23rd of] January" was stated by a doctor, Amir Parasta, on the basis of medical records "verified by at least two individuals in each medical organization". Sky News published the count on 29 January.[61] A count of 25,654 deaths was published by The Sunday Times on 24 January as a "clinically verified" update from the doctors' network that had earlier reported a count of ~16,500.[62]."
I get the doubt. I have no idea myself. But can pretty easily believe that a crackdown where the government admits to 3000 deaths and then shuts down the internet permanently, is probably underestimating. You have HRANA with 6000 verified. You have Iran doctor networks verifying 25k by Jan 23. Time and Guardian and so on saying 30k+ based on leaks.
So in my mind, the higher estimates are probably not far off from the truth.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
I belive as of right now the ~7,000 verified total deaths, using HRANA's verification methodology.
Parasta's 25,654 "clinically reported" deaths, no so much. Especially knowing he is openly aligned with the Reza Pahlavi opposition side, so there's an incentive to lie and inflate numbers.
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Still Iran, if you include their proxies in the Syrian civil war, the Yemeni Civil War and their own protesters.
ThePlacidAcid@reddit
You do realise that you could also pin all the deaths in these conflicts on western powers, since they also fund militant groups in line with their interests. It's not remotely comparable to dropping the equivalent of 5 nuclear bombs on a captive civilian population.
loggy_sci@reddit
Russia and Iran backed Assad who slaughtered his own people. Blaming all the deaths in the Syrian civil war on the west is a fucking joke.
You’re just selectively outraged about Israel and will excuse any behavior from groups you considered opposed to Israel, just like every other TikTok leftist on this sub.
ThePlacidAcid@reddit
Ah yes because the USA have never backed a dictatorship that murdered it's own people in that region. Saudi Arabia is wholesome chungus 100. The current Syrian regime is also just so amazing and nice to it's people! The US's actions in the middle east are all inductive towards stability and definitely can't be blamed for the deaths in any conflicts in that region!
loggy_sci@reddit
Just so everyone is aware, your argument changed from “all the deaths in the Syrian civil war and the Yemeni civil war are the fault of western powers”
to
“Iran may have backed Assad but the U.S. has backed dictators and whatabout KSA”
Nobody is arguing that the U.S. hasn’t backed dictators or the Saudis, but to say the U.S. is responsible for all the deaths in these civil wars is fucking dumb. But keep moving those goalposts I guess.
Guaire1@reddit
The ratio of dead civilians to dead solviers in Syria under Assad is lower than in Israel's actions on lebanon and gaza. Not the winning argument you think it is when israel is being worse than somebody like him
jakethepeg1989@reddit
The line of 5 nuclear bombs on captive civilians really shows up a gap in your logic and yiu can never follow it through.
Hiroshima and Nagasaki killed 120 thousand people instantly.
You make out Israel attacked with multiple times that, and killed 70k. And that doesn't even take into account if any were Hamas fighters. How does that work out?
Either the force used is exaggerated, or that force was used whilst actually trying not to kill as many Palestinians as possible.
The drive to paint Israel as this huge evil entity relies on soundbites with no logic behind them.
ThePlacidAcid@reddit
I used the example to highlight the completely excessive use of fire power Israel used against the Palestinians in Gaza. I wasn't saying that Israel literally dropped 5 nuclear bombs on Gaza.
Literally just look at footage of the strip from above. It looks like a nuclear waste land. My example was not an exaggeration. Israel destroyed almost every single home in a place with a population of over 2 million people. Furthermore, the statistics of 70k dead is almost certainly an undercount.
Israel's goal has never been to kill all the Palestinians as it knows it's wouldn't be able to get away with that. It simply wants to make conditions in gaza impossible for life, to try and force the Palestinians to stop defending themselves, and to remove as many as possible. The trump Gaza peace plan makes this evident, with the Palestinians losing sovereignty and being reduced to a serf class for wealthy tourists. If the fact that Israel used such excessive fire power against a captive population to achieve these goals is hard for you to incorporate into worldview, maybe try updating it.
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Gaza looks like a war zone. It looks like just like Homs, or Damascus or Aleppo.
Wars are terrible, everytime, don't start them.
ThePlacidAcid@reddit
Damascus and Aleppo have not seen anywhere near the level of destruction that the cities and town in Gaza have. I don't think you understand how absurd it is to destroy near enough every single residential building in an entire city. Suburbs in Syria saw this level of destruction, but entire towns and cities have been destroyed to this level in Gaza. And that was done in far less time, and far more open intent.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
That shouldn't ever been turned into.
Or any of the thousands of cities leveled by Israel, and currently levelling more at Lebanon? Why haven't you mentioned 1, but mentioned these? To try to passe the idea that other levelled more? Sorry to disappoint you.
Tell that to Israel, the nation that started a war against another nation unprovoked by that nation. And no, a regional government doesn't grant Israel right to attack another nation.
But heck, what would be of Israel if it wasn't in constant war?
jakethepeg1989@reddit
I wish I lived in your fantasy world.
Where Oct 7th never happened, and Hezbollah never rocketed Israel.
Or are we just going to go back and back until the 1880s and massacres of Jews back then?
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
And I wish you stopped writing lies or distortions.
Or where the the Patria terrorist attack never happened , and King David terrorist attack too?
How about if you just stop trying to portrait others as evil, and admitting that Israel isn't the victim here, that historically Israel started the acts of terrorism?
There's a problem with the Hasbara narrative, there's a very well documented history very useful to tear apart all that crap.
Keep coming, it has been a true pleasure!
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Lol, ok. We are going to go all the way back...
Hebron Massacre, 1929...before your events. Why?
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
It was you who started it trying to find justification and/or trying to "whatabout it", don't like when someone does it too? Too bad, remember what you said about Gaza war? "don't start it".
If a Massacre, and I won't go into the details of that Massacre, is something that gives the right to Israel to massacre others, then when is Israel going to allow Palestinians, Syrians, Lebanese and Iranians to massacre them in order to "break even"? Hum?
IF you want to continue to go into the past, can we "please" start talking about how Israel contributed to Iran's fall into a religious state? Shall we talk how Israel "did it's best" to destroy the only and first Arab country that recognized Israel State (Iran)? How Israeli Mossad contributed to create Savak, the Iranian torturing machine?
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Lol, you act like you know so much about the Middle East and then think Iran is an Arab state 😄 🤣
And your logic is that nothing is justified by what went before...why do you want to keep bringing it up and blaming everything on Israel as the instigator.
Convenient way to just say "all Israel's fault" and then refuse to actually think about the incorrect rhetoric you spout.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
It's usually referred as being one, but ok I'll gladly give you that.
There's no justification to undescriminated killing, no matter what, that's my logic.
Because "you want to keep bringing it up and blaming everything on ~~Israel~~ Palestine / Iran/ Lebanon/Syria as the instigators." ?
Maybe because Israel has fauls too, that you surely know about tnem and you refuse to mention them?
And speaking about instigators, couldn't all your post history be considered as pure pro-Israeli and pro-genocidal spout?
As I told you before, keep coming...
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Iran is not usually referred to as an Arab state by anyone unless that person is wrong.
Of course Israel has faults. But whats funny is you insisting Israel started it all, and using an attack on the British from the 40s as proof then whinging I have the temerity to mention earlier massacres of Jews before that.
Just basic factual knowledge you lack, like thinking Iran is an Arab state... that you fill with propaganda lines
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Oh has? And should we be worried about what those faults are?
When it comes to terrorist attacks, it did and there's no escape from that.
An Terrorist Attack, let's be precise the same way you demand others to be like when you keep mentioning the Arab country thing ;)
Because you keep rereffing those, and only those to try to justify Israeli massacres.
No, I don't lack anything besides the Shekels from being a Hasbara bot, and one mistake doesn't invalidates all the rest. Otherwise I would be making jokes about you, a Jewish, by speaking of facts when he practices a religion.
Remember when you accused me of living on a fairy tale? I'm Atheist, you are Jewish... "a joke made by itself".
Why are you so easy, why?!?
voidox@reddit
Israel started the war, history didn't start on Oct. 7th. Update your hasbara bot, this shit don't work.
voidox@reddit
the point is that Israel has dropped that amount of bombs on an area the size of a city, it's beyond depraved and evil.
going to "duh x number is higher than y" is just the classic genocide defender depravity, trying to move the goalposts and then you went a step further in ur desperate attempt to defend the genocide in saying "oh well they weren't instantly killed like in Hiroshima/Nagasaki, so it's all good and not comparable at all".
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
No need for painting, has been doing it by it's own, without any reserves.
Nazis tried to hide the genocide from the rest of the world, Israel does his best to show it to the world.
actsqueeze@reddit
Israel supporters are incapable of applying standards universally.
Otherwise everyone of their arguments would fall apart
JAMisskeptical@reddit
If it wasn’t for double standards they wouldn’t have any at all.
jakethepeg1989@reddit
No, it just involves pointing out obvious flaws in logic or facts of scrappy soundbites.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
I wasn't talking about the Syrian civil war and it's unrelated to the subject. What are you on? Lmao
Are you also claming Iran caused that?
jakethepeg1989@reddit
You asked who caused more civilian casualties. Pretending that Iran, through Hezbollah hasn't had a big direct hand in killing lots of Syrians is bullshit.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
This is a ridiculous deflection. Typical of zionists whenever they engage in any sort of type of Israel criticism.
By the way, who was Hezbollah fighting? Weren't they fighting the Islamic State and Al-Nusra Front(the offshoot of Al-Qaeda) Those two never seem to target Israel, how odd...
Also, give me the numbers. How many civilians did Hezbollah killed in the Syrian Civil War?
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Lol. I love the Isis is really Israel conspiracy. Just so perfectly illustrates the racism of low expectations that many Israel haters have.
And as for numbers of Hezbollah in Syria:
The Syrian Network for Human Rights (SNHR) documented that Iranian-backed militias, of which Hezbollah was the primary force, were responsible for thousands of deaths, including at least 15,083 deaths due to torture as of March 2023.
voidox@reddit
https://crescent.icit-digital.org/articles/isis-hamas-and-zionism-enemies-or-allies
Israel loves ISIS, they've worked with ISIS many times and did things like treat wounded ISIS militia members. Same shit Israel does with various proxy groups and gangs, like in Gaza:
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/sep/30/israel-backed-militia-groups-potentially-threaten-new-peace-plan-for-gaza
https://ecfr.eu/special/mapping_palestinian_politics/israeli-backed-groups-gaza/
there it is, the classic zionist line there to the T. You love throwing out that line in the desperate attempt to try and excuse/justify/ignore Israel's crimes and actions.
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Yes, its funny.
And youre funny for believing it. Just shows how little you actually know.
Isis has attacked israel. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/June_2017_Jerusalem_attack?wprov=sfla1
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
"Whatabout"
The USS Liberty incident was an attack on a United States Navy technical research ship (a spy ship), USS Liberty, by Israeli Air Force jet fighter aircraft and Israeli Navy motor torpedo boats, on 8 June 1967, ?
Who's funny now? xD
voidox@reddit
omg they attacked Israel once!? no waaay that totally makes all the other reports, facts, reality on the ground totally false.
also read ur own link, that was one bombing incident not the entire group of ISIS that Israel has worked with many times over.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
Even if I were to believe your numbers, how many civilians has Israel killed in Gaza, the West Bank, Lebanon, Yemen, Syria and Iran these past 3-4 years? Directly and Indirectly. My original point stands and your whole "whatabouism" derailment remains pointless.
Total Estimated Direct and Indirect Deaths: Roughly 150,000 to 250,000
Gaza- https://arabcenterdc.org/resource/the-lancet-and-genocide-by-slow-death-in-gaza/?hl=en-US#:~:text=Gaza%20Death%20Figures,of%20the%20Genocide%20Convention%20described.
West Bank- https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2026/04/regional-conflict-has-eclipsed-surge-human-rights-violations-against?hl=en-US#:~:text=In%20the%20West%20Bank%2C%20including,by%20settlers%20according%20to%20OCHA.
Lebanon- https://globalnation.inquirer.net/312693/lebanon-says-death-toll-from-israeli-strikes-rises-to-123?hl=en-US#:~:text=BEIRUT%2C%20Lebanon%20%E2%80%93%20The%20death%20toll,dp
Syria- https://news.cgtn.com/news/2026-04-10/news-1Me2O6bF0EE/p.html?hl=en-US#:~:text=Syrian%20Observatory%20for%20Human%20Rights,Microsoft%20Azure%20Translator%20Text%20API.
Yemen- https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2026/country-chapters/yemen
https://acleddata.com/report/iran-where-and-how-us-israeli-strikes-are-harming-civilians
jakethepeg1989@reddit
You conveniently missed it Iranians killed by their own government.
And funny that you accuse me of whataboutism when this while thread is me calling out you excusing the Iranians and using Israel as a whataboutism for them.
Funny old world.
PuertoricanMofongo@reddit
Even if I were to believe and include the alleged numbers numbers from the NGOs with anti Iran agendas, Israel has killed more.
jakethepeg1989@reddit
Conveniently dismiss reports of how many Iran killed but assume that Israel hasn't killed a single Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthi or Irgc fighter.
Very Convenient
voidox@reddit
Conveniently assuming that all the deaths by Israel were just "Hamas, Hezbollah, Houthi, IRGC" and not civilians
Very Convenient
but then you genocide defenders don't see Palestinians and any Arabs as human, so it makes sense you group them all as terrorists, even women and children.
voidox@reddit
lol "still Iran" he says with no numbers at all and ignoring how much death, destruction, bombings, killings, starvation effects, effects of the blockade, etc. done by Israel in just the past 3-4 years alone, let alone the decades of that chaos in the region.
classic zionist.
MrTatyo@reddit
What are the dual-purpose components that have military applications? That's outrageously vague.
And it's crazy for Israel to submit an ICC claim while actively avoiding theirs.
Czart@reddit
Infrared or nightvision cameras for example. Probably stuff like inertial navigation, gyroscopes etc. Obviously this entire lawsuit is idiotic, and the dude arguing sugar can be made into rocket fuel isn't helping the case.
But dual-use is a reasonable idea imo, i believe there are some chemicals that have perfectly normal applications but are also critical in manufacturing chemical weapons.
travistravis@reddit
I think the dual use thing is how western countries have been able to send a lot of war supplies to Israel. "We're not sending munitions, we're just sending parts for airplanes... (so they can then use those airplanes to kill children)"
Czart@reddit
Western countries don't need to do that lol. They trade military equipment with isarel openly.
travistravis@reddit
They do make ridiculous overtures about "stopping arms shipments" -- both France and the UK have had things come out fairly recently about how even those were largely lies.
Czart@reddit
Then that's just lies not dual-use. In fact i would argue dual-use export controls can be criticised over the fact that they can prevent exports of things that have genuine civilian applications under the assumption that they could be used for military ones.
xland44@reddit (OP)
You'd be surprised at juat how many things can be used for weapons if you put your mind to it.
As a quick example off the top of my head - sugar and fertilizer can be used for explosives and rockets, balloons can be attached to molotovs to burn many acres of farmland, plumbing pipes can be used for rocket shells.
These are all things you can make with a basic understanding of physics with exttemely common materials and relatively little effort; for a capable country such as Iran it becomes exponentially easier to repurpose things towards effective weaponry.
MrTatyo@reddit
Like simple foods like sugar and basic construction material plumbing pipes are a bit of a stretch to call them military components?
By that logic almost all countries are directly involved in war crimes and the genocide occuring in Gaza.
Rulweylan@reddit
When Hamas have published videos showing how they turn water pipes into the rockets they fired at Israeli civilians, plumbing pipes are reasonably dual use.
It's yet another way Hamas fucks over Palestinians
MrTatyo@reddit
Who is commiting a genocide against the Palestinian people? Hamas is bad but they were state actor funded and supported by Israel until recently.
The UK is sending parts for jets to Israel and supplying them with drone footage of Gaza. In return the IDF is using these parts to murder UK civilians abroad and 10,000s of arabs in the middle east.
In response the UK government made it illegal to protest this as you will be labelled as a terrorist and arrested.
Killeroftanks@reddit
holy fuck not this shit again.
yes sugar can be used for rocket fuel, but its extremely dirty and extremely weak, fertilizer can be used for explosives, but you need to do a fairly complex chemical alteration to get the nitrate you want for explosives, and the amount you need is so fucking much its quite extreme, no the real reason you prevent enemies from importing fertilizer, is to create a food shortage problem so they surrender faster, and the plumbing pipes is a repeated israeli lie, they just use that to ban plumbing pipes to make life worse in gaza when in reality literally any steel product thats tube shaped or just stuff that can be molded can be used for cheap rockets, its the reason why israel bans cookies, but not granulated sugar, not to prevent weapons from being produced, but to make life so bad no one wants to deal with Israeli's shit.
aka Israel is the annoying orange, with nukes.
xland44@reddit (OP)
Firstly, do note I didn't state I agreed with this NGO that dual use materials should be banned - I merely gave exa ple of how certain everyday items can be used.
The Hamas Qassem rocket which uses this was one of their most common rockets, so evidently they had a consistent and easy way of producing it using these materials.
I provided you an NYT article which explicitly mentions it, and also in the past Hamas released propaganda videos of digging up specifically piping insfrastructure for rockets. Here's another source while we're at it. So if it's a lie it's not an Israeli one...
Yes, any metal can be used but pipes are practically ready-made for this. They're shaped well for this, just need to plug up one end and you've got an easy container for gunpowder which is relatively aerodynamic.
Now i can continue replying to your points but evidently it's a wall of text based on your opinions rather than reality - I've provided enough sources feom reputable places. Have a good day
Decent_Cheesecake_29@reddit
I agree. All of these potentially dual use items need to be completely removed from Israel’s possession.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
They haven't updated yet page 6 from chapter 3 of the Hasbara manual.
debasing_the_coinage@reddit
What can be used for weapons is not a legal standard. In order to file suit you need a prima facie claim that a crime was committed, which means something specifically proscribed was sold.
xland44@reddit (OP)
Firstly as I said elsewhere I don't claim to support this. I'm also not familiar with this case beyond the article.
Yes, I'm pretty sure this is exactly the argument Shurat Hadin is trying to make.
xccehlsiorz@reddit
Lol god forbid people export sugar and balloons to Iran
Absolute nonsense once again
xland44@reddit (OP)
This isn't what I think, nor did I claim it's what this NGO says - I don't know if these examples fall under the legal definition of dual use.
This was merely an example of how everyday items can be used to deliberately harm people when the people in power divert it to such purposes.
ThePlacidAcid@reddit
Israel also consider prosthetic limbs for the child amputees they create "duel use". Probs best not to take em too seriously.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
A toothpick? An alarm clock?
HockeyHocki@reddit
Its an NGO
ChampionshipNo3072@reddit
Will they arrest Netanyahu?
HockeyHocki@reddit
What part of NGO do you not understand
BlueZybez@reddit
tell them go after israel first
ChampionshipNo3072@reddit
Sorry, would they push for his arrest by proper authorities in Israel?
Flaksim@reddit
Funny, Foreign Minister Katz claimed that the "ICC had lost its legitimacy." But now it's good enough to try and prosecute a foreign head of government.
xland44@reddit (OP)
This is an NGO, not the Israeli government.
aebulbul@reddit
I want to see anything remotely benefitting Israel fail, even if it’s rooted in truth. We didn’t allow any concessions for the Nazis, we shouldn’t allow amy for Israel.
Neurobeak@reddit
We didn’t allow any concessions for the Nazis,
Half, if not all, of higher brass in Western German Army was made of the "former" Nazis.
aebulbul@reddit
Really? That's news to me. Why weren't they prosecuted?
Solarwinds-123@reddit
What would you have liked them to do, prosecute every soldier?
Socraman@reddit
Because you would ran out of civil servants, and they would become very disgruntled. Kinda like what happened in Iraq after firing all the Baath party members.
xland44@reddit (OP)
Practically speaking because there was nobody to replace them with if you got rid of all Nazis and their sympathizers; Nazi Germany was built in a way such that anyone with power was a Nazi and vice versa. Political dissidents/opponents to the Nazis had been sent to camps.
shieeet@reddit
"Ex"-nazis made for 'excellent' commanders against the Soviet Union, thus alot of them got a free pass to carry on, with many of them making up NATO high command
TheBeardPlays@reddit
So Israeli civil society is just as batshit crazy as the government then.... Good to know!
xland44@reddit (OP)
Not at all. This is one specific organization. Other israeli NGOs which I assume you support are, for example but not limited to, B'tselem, Breaking the Silence, Yesh Din, etc.
I realise it's hard for you to comprehend, but israelis are not a monolith and there are individuals with different opinions.
TheBeardPlays@reddit
Fair point: I know Israelis are not a monolith, and obviously there are Israelis who oppose what their government is doing.
But listing B’Tselem and Breaking the Silence as if they represent Israeli civil society at large is basically using the exception to deny the rule. Those groups are notable precisely because they are not the norm in Israel.
From the outside the data we see is pretty grim mate.... In 2025, 78% of Jewish Israelis said Israel was making substantial efforts to avoid Palestinian suffering in Gaza, 79% said they were not very troubled by reports of famine and suffering there, and in late 2024, 83% gave the IDF high marks for its ethical conduct in the war....it's ETHICAL conduct! I'm sorry but to me that is more than enough to personally conclude the vast majority of Israeli civil and non civil society is in support of this madness.
So yea dissent exists. Not all Israelis support this but they look very much like an embattled minority, not the mainstream norm...
blindmodz@reddit
We arent dumb enough to fall for the NGO made by Shurat Hadin
Flaksim@reddit
The N in NGO in this case is more for show.
sivvon@reddit
Shurat hadin is a quasi government proxy actor at best.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
You forgot the /s
OptimisticRealist__@reddit
This is a ngo not the gov
This works both ways. Putin also does this all the time where he uses intl institutions to go after the west, in a "lets see how important the rules based order is to you, now that youre doing the bad things". Its petty and in principle not even wrong per se bc the US does move with an immense double standard
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Actually it's an NGO actively supported by the government.
xccehlsiorz@reddit
So a GO?
theycallmedadinho@reddit
There is an actual name for those, its GONGO
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Obrigado
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Probably more a ZO.
LineOfInquiry@reddit
In this case though Spain didn’t do anything wrong, so they weren’t even breaking the rules based order
furimmerkaiser@reddit
Before anything, ask them to send all their war criminals to Hague first
Sacaron_R3@reddit
Maybe we can get Bibi, Katz or Smotrich to personally drop off the paperwork.
HockeyHocki@reddit
Try reading next time
dhsilver@reddit
This is performative nonsense. It is aimed at their domestic base — people who love the fantasy that another “this will show them” stunt means anything.
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Not only that, unfortunately, it's a scare tactic used to show other leaders how far they go if someone criticizes them.
Also, at same time a notorious judge tied to Spanish far-right has accused his wife of corruption, again, after already charging his brother and other members, but those accusation keep falling apart when other courts analyse the accusations. Meanwhile these accusations produce lots of headlines, posts and create false sensations.
Smear tactics...
Levitz@reddit
These two are different subjects.
In any case, it's worth noting that Spain's position on all of this goes from the bottom up, not from the top down. Sanchez could leave government tomorrow, the country is still going to have a whole lot to say against the state of Israel.
ausmomo@reddit
Is this the same ICC that providionslly found Israel is committing genocide in Gaza? Or was the the ICJ? I get them mixed up.
https://opiniojuris.org/2024/04/05/the-icjs-findings-on-plausible-genocide-in-gaza-and-its-implications-for-the-international-criminal-court/
They are both tribunals in the Hague. ICJ is UN charter and the ICC is Rome Statute stuff right?
HockeyHocki@reddit
That was the ICJ, and no that isn't what they found at all, here is the head of the ICJ at the time explaining that common misconception
axeteam@reddit
So they just decided to use a picture of this guy at an event with China out of all other potential pictures out there, which I'm sure there are plenty of. I'm guessing to make him look "evil"?
xland44@reddit (OP)
Why would you think being in china makes him evil?
MilitantStoner@reddit
Better lock me up too then! My tax dollars have definitely been used to commit some foreseeable war crimes in Gaza...
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
What did you send? Band-aids? They can use them to trick Israelis soldiers by pretending being injured!
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
What is Shurat HaDin?
Critics have labeled Shurat HaDin a "government-organized non-governmental organization" over its ties to the Israeli government.
Worth reading more about it BTW.
Hasbara tactics against critics, nothing new...
blindmodz@reddit
I was about to say the same, shes just a Israel's arm to send lawsuit to their enemies
OsgrobioPrubeta@reddit
Lawfare and Smear tactics. Sanchez, his family and his government have been filled of accusations of corruption. But just that, accusations that don't go beyond that, many carried out by judges close to far-right.
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