Who is wrong: my English teacher or me?

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Truewit_@reddit

It’s the kind of introduction you’d give to a starred review in the tv guide, not an essay

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NoFewSatan@reddit

Right, but this isn't an essay, it's an introduction to a book

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Truewit_@reddit

No it isn’t. It’s definitely an essay, it’s just the way they’ve written this also isn’t clear. It’s an intro for an essay about a book they were required to read for their English class.

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NoFewSatan@reddit

I wrote an introduction for a book we were required to read.

Quite clear what it was.

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Truewit_@reddit

Yeah it’s poorly worded. It’s about an essay.

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NoFewSatan@reddit

OK, if you say so.

Regardless, there's nothing wrong with the sentence.

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TheEvilAdventurer@reddit

Why ask the option of native speakers if you are going to ignore them! How arrogant!

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BeatificBanana@reddit

You realise that commenter isn't the person who posted this?

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Agile_Technology_192@reddit

'i wrote an introduction -to an essay- for a book we were required to read'

It is poorly worded, but I think this is what OP meant.

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Fyonella@reddit

I suspect it’s a précis as opposed to an essay to be honest.

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CarpeCyprinidae@reddit

at that upon which you are commenting

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MJLDat@reddit

Don’t worry about it.

Have a good day.

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is it possibly because you haven’t referenced the author? like you started the whole thing with “in her” so we have no idea who you’re on about. so for example if you’re on about Charles Dickens you’d start with “In Charles Dickens’ book… ” or “In Dickens’ book…” so we know who you’re writing about. because at that point you could be writing about absolutely anybody?

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Jaytreenoh@reddit

Your teacher is technically correct, although your usage is common.

The problem is that you have used the pronoun "her" without first establishing who "her" is.

Pronouns are meant to be used to refer to something/someone that the reader is already aware of. Someone reading what you wrote should know who "her" is, before you use "her" to refer to that person. In this case, the reader does not know who "her" is until later in your sentence.

This is not really a rule that native speakers would be aware of, it's the sort of thing that people who are learning English academically get taught.

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Popular-Jury7272@reddit

I would bet my life that the author's name immediately followed the first comma in the opening sentence. "Her" is established at that point. I don't really see English as strictly ordered in a way that would make that wrong. Anyway, English is defined by its usage, not arbitrary rules.

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apple_kicks@reddit

Depends on the course and how strict they are academically. There’s definitely going to be rules and standards on essay writing.

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Jaytreenoh@reddit

It is wrong according to some of the rigid grammar rules that exist for English.

As I said though, it is common usage and I am absolutely on the side of descriptivism, not prescriptivism. I am simply explaining why it could be viewed as incorrect, I do not believe that it should be.

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apple_kicks@reddit

Her name may sound better

“In Jill Beanbags darkly comedic thriller, she…”

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BillyJoeDubuluw@reddit

Without additional context this could go either way.

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stools_in_your_blood@reddit

It's fine to use a pronoun before the noun to which it refers, but you do have to use the noun at some point in the sentence. So:

"In her darkly comedic thriller, Jane Bloggs portrays 18th century London blah blah blah..." is ok.

"In her darkly comedic thriller, there is a portrayal of 18th century London" is incorrect (unless of course Jane Bloggs has already been introduced, but she hasn't because we're talking about the start of an essay here).

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CulturedClub@reddit

Op, this is the accurate answer.

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ctesibius@reddit

Yes - there’s a passage in Alice in Wonderland (or possibly Alice through the Looking Glass) where one of the characters takes exception to the phrase “It was found that…”, asking what “It” was. As you say, it’s fine to provide the referent of a pronoun later in the sentence.

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05blob@reddit

Alice in Wonderland, Chapter 3 (The one with the caucus race). The mouse is giving a boring talk about William the conqueror and at one point says 'found it advisable' and is immediately interrupted to ask what was found. The answer is of course that they found it advisable to go with somebody to meet the king... which the mouse would have said if the duck had just been quiet.

There's an even better example right at the end of the book in chapter 12. It's a poem that is presented as evidence in the Knave of Hearts trial.

They told me you had been to her,
And mentioned me to him,
She gave me a good character,
But said I could not swim.

(Not the whole poem, but the rest is in similar pronoun only language)

Alice insists the poem is nonsense and proves nothing, but the King tries to twist it to make the Knave look guilty. Things like insisting the Knave must have written it because he can't swim, basically just taking advantage of the fact that there are no names anywhere on the paper. He only decides it's not true as, according to the Queen of Hearts, 'she had this fit' doesn't apply to the Queen of Hearts.

(Might have been more than a little obsessed with the Alice books as a child/teen)

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n3m0sum@reddit

Alice in Wonderland, Chapter 3 (The one with the caucus race).

🎤🫳

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djw2011@reddit

I'd suggest beginning a piece with "In her..." suggests a familiarity with who "her" is.

Would be better to use the name in your first sentence to establish who she is.

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CarpeCyprinidae@reddit

Stylistically this is wrong, linguistically it is not. your teacher is trying to prepare you for how English is used as much as teaching the rights & wrongs of your usage.

the first words of the introduction to a book, if being strictly formal, should be - or at least include - the title of the book.

In title, author's darkly comic thriller

...Would be acceptable

Title by Author is a darkly comic thriller in which

Is far better

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BadMachine@reddit

if your teacher is critiquing your assignment , she should also stater her reasoning.

her telling you something is wrong without explaining why is only doing half her job. can you go back to her for elaboration?

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ac20g13@reddit

This is the trap of different writing styles, which I think is especially tricky for non-native speakers. As many have already mentioned, your opening isn't 'academic'. Academic writing is its own thing and very different from normal English. Academic writing is formal, dry, direct, and backed up by evidence (either other sources or quotes from the text). Your teacher should be explaining this to you in class.

Can you ask for example essays to read? It will help you get the tone and set expectations of what the teacher wants?

The difficulty of starting with 'In her' is not a problem of grammar (in my opinion). It's not even that you can't use it in academic writing. The problem is that it's the very first sentence, and 'her' centres the author not the book as the main subject of your writing. I'm not saying it can't be used, it just has to be done carefully. You're not making your life easy by choosing this as an opening structure. But outright banning it is a bit much (again in my opinion, crucially I'm neither an English teacher nor the one marking your essay).

In addition, you start by describing this book as a darkly comedic thriller - but crucially you are not evidencing why (what makes it dark and comedic and a thriller?). And This is another reason why it is not a suitable first sentence.

In her/the novel (title), (author) uses dark humour to explore (theme1, and theme2). In this essay I will demonstrate its effectiveness in exploring these themes...

Or just default to:

"Dark comedy is often used in thrillers for (reason). (Title) by (author) shows how this literary device is effective and demonstrates the author's mastery of (technique). In this essay I will...."

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Diplomatic_Gunboats@reddit

'her' is the problem here. You should have used the Author's full name (and just after that).

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St3lla_0nR3dd1t@reddit

Who is ‘her’ referring to? If this is not clear from your essay rather than the question you were responding to, it would be wrong.

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KatAstrophie-@reddit

Tell her the best-selling book of all time starts with “In the beginning, God created…”

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4oclockinthemorning@reddit

In the beginning of his darkly comedic thriller, God created the heaven and the earth.

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TSC-99@reddit

I don’t think it’s really wrong but I would start with the author’s name at the start of the sentence if it’s the very first sentence. Then you can open sentences using ‘her’ once the audience knows who you are referring to.

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gyroda@reddit

It could work if you immediately followed it with the name.

"In her adverbily adjective thingabob, Jane Doe does this and that which has left to the other. We discuss Jane Doe in more detail in the rest of this sentence..."

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TSC-99@reddit

I’m guessing that’s what OP wrote and guessing tutor’s reason.

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Popular-Jury7272@reddit

I would be very surprised if this wasn't exactly what happened. The other option would be "In Jane Doe's whatdyoucallit, she ...". Nothing wrong with either, and I see both all the time.

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kalendral_42@reddit

Depends on what your brief was for the assignment. If the assignment was to write a piece as if you’re a book critic doing a book review it should be fine, but if you were supposed to be writing a more academic piece deconstructing the book or how books are reviewed it might be seen as a bit informal for academic writing

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Sea_Measurement_1654@reddit

Your grammar is correct but your emphasis on the author rather than her content is unsuitable for a literary essay.

Your teacher will suspect that you modelled your response on a commercial review of the novel rather than the guidelines she has given you for essay writing.

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audienceandaudio2@reddit

There’s nothing necessarily wrong with “in her darkly comic thriller”, but it doesn’t read like the opening to an essay. Did the teacher give you any more context than this? There’s nothing technically incorrect about what you did, but I can potentially see why they left a comment here.

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cloud_designer@reddit

Yeah it sounds more like an interview or a review. Hard to know if OP was right without the context of what the essay was about though.

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TheBlueDinosaur06@reddit

I don't see anything wrong with it but to keep your teacher happy I'd just go with something like XY explores themes of xyz in her darkly comedic thriller. This is best illustrated through ...

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FunkyYoghurt@reddit

I'm a qualified English teacher. Yes, it's okay to start a sentence with a preposition. Anyone taught differently are being taught with an outdated curriculum.

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Busy_Currency_4690@reddit

Anyone is you daft melt

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Interesting-Bit725@reddit

Oh dear.

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Possible-Highway7898@reddit

Anyone is. Not anyone are.

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FunkyYoghurt@reddit

They mean the same thing. Study pragmatics, smart-arse.

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Terrible-Amount-6550@reddit

Bro undid all of the good stuff they he said in their original comment with that mistake 😂

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Fridarey@reddit

As any fule kno

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Interesting-Bit725@reddit

We need more context: the full sentence, the nature of the essay you were writing, and why your teacher said you were wrong.

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ctesibius@reddit

This is normal English usage. You might be able to find an older grammar book which says that it is incorrect, but be aware that at one time grammarians had the bad habit of trying to make English fit the conventions of Latin rather than describing conventions which have been in use since the time of Chaucer.

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abbeymarsay@reddit

Seems a bit informal

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bahumat42@reddit

Exactly it reads like an article not an essay.

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mhoulden@reddit

I would start with "In Imogen Suzanna's thriller The Time of the Sphinx..." It identifies what you're writing about without giving an opinion. My own English teachers would ask who thought it was darkly comedic.

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SnooDonuts6494@reddit

It's fine.

But some teachers stick to outdated and simplified rules, such as “Don’t start sentences with prepositions” - which isn't really a grammar rule at all.

But for that sake of a quiet life, you should probably just avoid them. Instead, you could say it as "Her darkly comedic thriller explores the themes of blah blah...." or something like that.

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mmoonbelly@reddit

But that’s less precises.

In her darkly homoerotic novel, the Talented Mr Ripley, Highsmith explores…

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HotButteredBagel@reddit

You have fronted an adverbial clause. That is perfectly acceptable as long as the following main clause uses the name of the person ‘her’ refers to. However, it is not a great opening to an essay and I suspect this is the issue that your teacher has identified.

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HeartyBeast@reddit

It reads fine as English. The only reason I can think of for rejecting it would be if it didn’t fit the teacher’s preferred essay form.

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JohnCasey3306@reddit

It's certainly an unusual way of structuring that sentence.

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mmoonbelly@reddit

Unless you’re writing/talking about a female author and her darkly comedic thriller.

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zephyrthewonderdog@reddit

No it’s not wrong, but it depends on the rest of the paragraph for context. Do you mention the author by name or is it all her and she throughout?

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BarryTownCouncil@reddit

You probably shouldn't be "hitting the ground running" so much I guess. It's not "wrong" though.

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UselessDood@reddit

Whether or not it's correct kind of depends on what follows it. The main issue is that currently "her" is ambiguous - if you'd name the person later in the same sentence then it can make perfect sense, though it'd still be unconventional.

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veryblocky@reddit

You’re writing an essay, not a tabloid. I agree with the teacher

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Popular-Jury7272@reddit

> my question is: is my teacher simply wrong, or am I wrong?

If you want an answer you will need to tell us why she thinks it is wrong. If she didn't tell you that, you need to ask her.

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bluejackmovedagain@reddit

It isn't an appropriate introduction for a piece of academic work or another form of formal writing. It would be fine in a blog or magazine.

It is more an issue of style than of grammar.

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Brickie78@reddit

Difficult to know without the rest of the sentence.

In her darkly comedic thriller, Jane Author show us that she can tackle many different genres

Absolutely fine.

in her darkly comedic thriller, John Actor plays a clown hitman

Makes no sense on its own, but fine if previous sentences have been talking about Jane Author. Otherwise the "her" is left dangling.

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Busy-Doughnut6180@reddit

If you followed it with her name right after that ("In her darkly comedic thriller, Author Name explores blah blah blah"), then it's okay. But you also need to be careful of the context. This would be fine for a report intended to sound like an article. I don't think it would be appropriate for a report that is more like a formal essay/paper.

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Subsyxx@reddit

In terms of English language, there is nothing wrong with "In her...".

You've started the sentence with a prepositional phrase which is common for journalists and things like editorials/reviews/analysis.

Your teacher might not think it's appropriate for the beginning of an essay, because if it's the first instance of the piece then you would rather use the name instead of the pronoun "her".

Or they're just not a good teacher.

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conduit_for_nonsense@reddit

In my opinion, it can be used in a subordinate clause followed by a comma.

See what I did there.

'In her first novel, Mrs Jones explored the proper use or a comma.'

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baeworth@reddit

In my experience you always want to address with a name. Never just with pronouns, unless you have already used the name in the same sentence. I’m not sure if it’s more an etiquette thing as it is generally seen as quite rude in our culture just addressing someone as “her or him” rather than their name

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woollover@reddit

Your teacher is correct

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blue_rizla@reddit

How so?

"In her darkly comedic thriller, Jane Doe explores themes of X, Y, and Z" reads perfectly fine to me.

Can you explain why you think the teacher is correct?

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ScreamingDizzBuster@reddit

Yes me too, and I used to work as an academic editor.

People in this thread are calling stylistic choices "wrong" or "right".

We can talk about when you might want to use the form, and why you might choose something different depending on circumstances, but there is absolutely nothing inherently wrong with OP's sentence.

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Alarming-Produce4541@reddit

Why?

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FunkyYoghurt@reddit

Wow. well done. Thanks for giving an explanation as to why.

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grahamssister@reddit

It depends what comes next - if you wrote “In her darkly comedic thriller, Catherine Cookson explores the world of juggling “, that’s fine. I can’t imagine not having the author’s name after what you wrote

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Fit-Replacement-551@reddit

English is soo old and complicated that not everyone agrees on the rules. Also there is different variations of English (UK, US, Canada, Austrailia). So just go with your teacher for the marks but study other reputable sources as well

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loveswimmingpools@reddit

I like your sentence. It's fine.

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United-Mall5653@reddit

Reads fine to me with the context you've given

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Metric_Mushroom@reddit

I think we need the full sentence to judge whether or not it's correct.

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Mickleborough@reddit

What reason was given? It doesn’t sound incorrect.

However it reads more like a paragraph that has preceding text before it.

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Few_Wolf_4634@reddit

What came next? If you’re about to say for example “[female author’s name] introduced her famous character [character’s name]” it works, as the “her” is possessive.

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WeeklyPermission239@reddit

What was the reasoning given?

Anecdotally, I think I've encountered "In this darkly comedic thriller" more often, but I'd be interested to know why she felt your phrasing wasn't appropriate.

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gyroda@reddit

Anecdotally, I think I've encountered "In this darkly comedic thriller" more often

This would make sense if you were discussing the work instead of the creator. If you're discussing the creator and using the work as a launching pad OP's makes more sense

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WeeklyPermission239@reddit

Well, yeah...

Your reply is redundant, since (if you read my next sentence) I already asked OP for more context.

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HarB_Games@reddit

I'd expect to see that start in a review/post about a woman's thriller. But that's the only context I could see this in personally.

Unfortunately you haven't given anywhere near enough context as to what this essay was about to say whether you or your teacher was correct.

I'd assume being that your teacher HAS context, if they are saying it's wrong, it's wrong.

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