How do Americans view the accusations of being a child sex offender against Michael Jackson? Is there a consensus on whether he was guilty or innocent?
Posted by RaizenMatsuda@reddit | AskAnAmerican | View on Reddit | 93 comments
Avery_Thorn@reddit
He had sex with children. There is no doubt about it.
It is hard to tell his mental state. He was abused, he was mentally delayed, and it is hard to tell if he knew what he was doing was wrong or not - someone did, and covered for him and enabled it, if it wasn't him.
Younger people really want it not to be true. They make excuses and rationalize it. But... at the end of the day, MJ seems to have done the typical sexual play with your friends and mutual exploration thing that often happens in early teenage years. It's just he was in his 30s and 40 and his friends were children.
And past a certain point, it doesn't matter someone's intentions or means rea when they are continuously hurting other people.
Just ask his doctor.
I'll phrase it as such: there was an old joke. Why did Michael Jackson like to have sex with twenty seven year olds? Because there were twenty of them...
moonchili@reddit
Honestly i think he just really liked little kids in a platonic, but creepy, way.
Who knows.
GooseNYC@reddit
I agree. Based on the kids he hung around with. Corey Feldman has accused an awful lot of people of having molested him, but he said Michael Jackson didn't. Macaulay Culkin said the same thing, without the being molested by half of Hollywood routine.
captain_nofun@reddit
I think he was just seeking a childhood he never had. Its more sad than anything.
patawpha@reddit
He slept in a bed with children. He showed porn to children. He gave wine to children. Those three facts are pretty hard to refute.
Even if that's all that happened that never should have happened and he knew better.
I firmly believe that way more than those three things happened and the abuse he suffered as a child excuses none of it.
Mr_Noms@reddit
No consensus.
Many people are such fans they will never believe it to be true.
No-Diet-4797@reddit
Honestly I don't know. He was a strange dude. He was so incredibly talented and shoved into the spotlight from such a young age. I feel like he remained child-like because he didn't get to really be a kid. Being a grown man and hosting sleepovers with children is wildly inappropriate though. I put that on the parents. I don't care who it is. My child would never be allowed attend such a sleepover.
As for if he's guilty or not I really don't know. I sincerely hope not but he was such a troubled man I can consider that a possibility.
SalishSeaSweetie@reddit
Two of the boys that originally said there was no sex at a trial later came forward and said they lied, cuz Michael had begged them to.
M8NSMAN@reddit
Something inappropriate happened maybe not rape but still inappropriate thus the allegations & he had enough money to pay people off.
trisaroar@reddit
Not really a single consensus. Some people say "he had no childhood and related to young boys because of it" which like... isn't better and definitely isn't the kind of thing you'd have to say if someone were above reproach.
Celebrity worship was insane pre-internet, Taylor Swift is the closest we've come and even that you can see clips of her walking the streets of NY and at football games semi-regularly. They once closed down an airport and a major basketball game because Michael was just rumored to be there. "I remembered where I was when he died" is used synonously with 9/11 in terms of cultural touchpoints. His music redefined pop and created space for Black artists in the mainstream, and at that level it's unclear what's heinous actions, what's allegations for the money, and what's a cover up for also that same money.
FunNectarine6906@reddit
I don't have a consensus in my own head. I know at least some of the charges were completely fake. But, others might be true. It doesn't concern me much because he's not alive. God gets to deal with him now. He's either in a very happy place or a very sad place. Not my circus and not my monkey.
mugenhunt@reddit
There is no consensus.
Some people believe that he was indeed a pedophile and abused the children who came to his home.
Some people feel that he was just really socially awkward due to having been abused as a child, and parents were taking advantage of his naive nature by accusing him so that he would pay money to make the allegations go away.
SAwfulBaconTaco@reddit
The reason that I feel like Michael didn't do it is that the parents settled for money. I'm a parent, and if that had been my kid, there's no way I'd have taken money. I'd have wanted prison time.
Weary_Capital_1379@reddit
Too many allegations for them all to be false.
jimbobwe-328@reddit
I see where you're coming from, however there are plenty of people who don't have that same line of thinking when it applies to D. T.
the-quibbler@reddit
He was one of the highest grossing artists of all time. Once the first accusation is given credance, it is far from unlikely that opportunists might try to exploit the opening.
Whether or not he did it, this is the risk of settling these cases. It encourages others to seek a payday.
ZephyrProductionsO7S@reddit
To be fair, anyone can accuse anyone. Especially if they’re a public figure.
I think he did it. That being said, accusations (by themselves) don’t mean anything except that you need to check.
Remarkable_Ship_4673@reddit
Ehh once the blood is in the water the sharks come
quietlywatching6@reddit
What is my personal opinion? It is that I don't know and he's dead so there's not anything we can do about it now. To me that seems a lot of evidence that it doesn't seem likely that he did so. Just based on the layout of the situations where this supposedly occurred. But at the same time people who do so normally find a way. But just based on the number of children and adults who've come forward and said he's never done anything, and that the people who accused him all did so because their parents were unhappy that they got cut off, after the parents behavior. But again that may just be the way it's presented. I think I'm inclined toward, he was just an adult he was trying to recapture his childhood that he never got through other people. There's a lot of evidence that things were not great at home even before him and his siblings became the Jackson 5, and that took over their life. 100% think it's creepy LOL but I don't know how I feel about whether or not it extended to SA or the R word. He's personal life seemed defined by his attempts to fix things he thought went wrong in his life, with terrible results.
Polonius_N_Drag@reddit
My view is it's very possible he did all the things he was accured of. But it's also possible that he had Peter Pan Syndrome and it was all innocent as far as he was concerned.
Toosder@reddit
I once worked with Justin Bieber when he was a little bit older but he was still so young. Like he hadn't been able to grow up naturally at all. It was really strange. I don't know how to describe it. Of course there are zero accusations that I'm aware of him hurting children but just the idea that celebrities grow up differently, and can have significant stunted development, seems very real to me. I watched him run off of an airplane into his bodyguard's arms and jump into them giggling like a child. It was surreal. Cute to be honest but surreal. but surreal.
I could see it impacting how Michael related to children and wanted to have sleepovers or other innocent things that are still creepy. But I can also see that perhaps he did a harm to children. I have no idea what the truth is.
driver004@reddit
Yeah same, I’m not really into celebrity worship the way a lot seem to be so never really dug into it but from what I know Jackson was a really weird dude. But being weird in itself isn’t a crime and it’s disgusting how people will try and conflate it into one at the drop of a hat. So far as I know nothing was ever proven and that’s that.
No-Perspective872@reddit
There’s new information coming out that suggests he was aware of Epstein’s doing and that he was attempting to rescue children 🤷
thepizzagod195@reddit
Idc if people make excuses for him I always found him to be a creepy ass pervert that liked kids.
Schnelt0r@reddit
As far as I know, all of the kids involved said nothing happened. I think the parents were just after his money.
Tankieforever@reddit
People make up a lot of excuses about his lack of a childhood, but I think most agree that his interest in young men was a bit unnatural, and even if not downright diddling kids, he was probably more than inappropriate
Physical_Reason3890@reddit
Agree. He may or may not have sexualy abused them but he was definitely crossing lines. I believe he was just acting like a child and having sleep overs and shit but not full on ppedophilia. But we'll never know
Personal-Presence-10@reddit
This is also what I believe. They were all abused by their dad and Michael being the youngest and the star… I think he had some deep psychological issues going on and I have questions on whether he was even capable of having sex. I know he was married and has kids, but there have been questions about whether or not he is even the biological father and with IVF…
Nattie_Cake@reddit
I was trafficked as a child and used to be on the side that decided he was definitely a pedophile. Now that we know more and have seen what REALLY happened, I believe that he is 100% innocent and was actually trying to protect them. I'm also autistic and I can recognize an autistic survivor of abuse. That's EXACTLY what he was.
Swimming-Gap7395@reddit
That falls into the category of weird shit people ignore. Like R. Kelly, Jay-z, P Diddy, and Glenn Campbell.
Gettles@reddit
Most people dont really care about the morality of entertainers.
OmericanAutlaw@reddit
was it weird? sure. was he acquitted? yes. is he alive now to defend himself? no. and from all i’ve read there is only one person who maintains he was molested by MJ, while the rest have either recanted the claims or admitted they were doing it for money. i don’t believe michael jackson was guilty, personally. i tried to find stuff about him in the epstein files too but couldn’t find much. epstein had an interior designer named michael jackson as well that muddied up search results. the only picture with MJ in there was with his own kids
TyrKiyote@reddit
Michael was not normal in the head imo. So disconnected from reality that he couldnt see anything wrong with hanging out with kids.
peanutismint@reddit
I think it’s gone backwards and forwards. At the time we were all shocked but most thought it wasn’t likely, and then when that documentary came out, it sounded perhaps more likely, and then the whole thing where it turned out that thethe dad of the accusers was pushing them to make up stories, and he of course ended up killing himself presumably over the guilt after MJ died, so it now seems things have swung things back to “no conviction, no crime“. This is all completely anecdotal, obviously, but this has been my general experience.
Accomplished_Mix7827@reddit
Frankly, I think the Chandlers make it up to fleece him for money. Jordan Chandler, the child he allegedly molested, denied it initially, and only changed his story after heavy pressure from his parents. No child pornography or other evidence of pedophilia was found at Jackson's residence. Chandler's testimony contained several factual errors. Multiple grand juries dismissed the case.
Evan Chandler is a vindictive liar, and the stress of his witch hunt pushed Jackson towards the drugs that eventually contributed to his death
DontReportMe7565@reddit
He never molested me.
Showdown5618@reddit
I don't think there is a consensus. Many Americans think he is, and many Americans have doubts. I remember, after his arrest, he made a video telling the public of his innocence and awful experience, which helped make many see him as innocent, though not everyone.
Exact-Truck-5248@reddit
From what I've seen and heard, it's largely a racial divide
pickledplumber@reddit
He didn't do it. There's far more evidence that he didn't than he did. Namely positive stories from kids like Macaulay Culkin.
QualityOfMercy@reddit
He didn’t abuse one kid therefore the other kids must be lying? That’s not evidence of anything
pickledplumber@reddit
The same way one accusation from a. Documentary that came out after he died is not evidence of anything
AmbulanceChaser12@reddit
It’s really hard to prove a negative. What kind of “evidence” could there be that something didn’t happen?
The only “evidence that he didn’t do it” would be something like if the accuser said the assault happened at a certain date and time, and there was proof that Michael Jackson was elsewhere at the time. (But even that would only be proof that Jackson couldn’t have committed the act when he was accused of it, not that he couldn’t have committed the act.)
Dangerous-Budget937@reddit
He didn't target kids from wealthy/famous families. He went after those with parents who would be seduced by his wealth and fame and after a grooming period, he got them to hand over their boys to him.
pickledplumber@reddit
Was Macaulay Culkin from a famous family? He was just a kid from NY and came from a working class background.
iamunableto@reddit
there are also stories of him abusing kids of famous people, such as john lennons kid
docweston@reddit
Some say that he was saving kids from being taken to that island and abused. (You know the "island" I'm talking about...)
Muroid@reddit
The topic of what exactly he did or didn’t do is complicated, but I’ve always found arguments of this type to be very strange.
Like if someone didn’t harm every single person he ever met, he probably didn’t harm anyone?
RektInTheHed@reddit
Between Culkin and Feldman, what it suggests to me is that there were young Hollywood kids MJ hung out with, and then there were the nobodies it didn't really make sense for him to hang out with, who are the ones who made the allegations.
It's very possible MJ had different motivations for being around different kids of different social status.
Creepy-Floor-1745@reddit
100% agree with this statement
ThisIsATastyBurgerr@reddit
Icant believe we're still having this discussion. A ten year FBI investigation found nothing. A twelve person jury heard everything they had and said not guilty and the media present at the trial agreed. After MJ died all non-disclosure agreements have become void and nobody said anything
DesperateSmiles@reddit
Watch this, pretty sure he didn't diddle any kids and just had bad mental problems because of his father.
https://youtu.be/eDhseG8nOzE?si=Edr1dRTLVMLPVH3r
Joliet-Jake@reddit
I genuinely have no idea but neither would shock me.
garrett_w87@reddit
In my experience, it seems like more white people believe he was guilty and more black people think he was odd and did some strange things but nothing outright wrong. I’m a white guy and I grew up in an environment where we didn’t listen to him for a few reasons, one of which I can only assume was a presumption of guilt on this issue. But as an adult being close to someone who is part black and raised by the black side of her family, I see things a bit differently now and can enjoy his music without feeling any kind of way for doing so.
Nataliza@reddit
I have complicated opinions on how to view him. I love his music and he did incredible things for Black artists by breaking mainstream barriers. But his behavior towards children, even if it didn't escalate to full sexual abuse (and I'm not saying it didn't, I'm just not sure), was not to be excused, though I do have empathy for his awful upbringing.
an_edgy_lemon@reddit
Seems to be a particularly polarizing topic. Even all these years later, I’ve heard people passionately insist that he’s innocent, and other people insist that he was a creep. He was a hero to a lot of people, so they don’t want to acknowledge his faults.
I personally think some of the evidence is pretty damning. The man led a tragic life and was no doubt disturbed. There’s no way to know if all of the accusations were true, but his behavior clearly crossed a line at times.
kilertree@reddit
Michael Jackson is the only person who can say that it's okay to sleep in the bed with a child that you are not related too.
GateDeep3282@reddit
He gets a pass because everyone loved him and there's no real evidence.
There is also no real evidence against Trump, yet many of the same people who ignore Jackson are the first to scream pedo about Trump.
Kinda weird.
It gets worse though, people also turn their heads and ignore pedos like Steven Tyler, where their is actual documented proof.
Icy-Whale-2253@reddit
There are people who believe he did it, there are people who believe he is innocent, and there are people who believe there is nuance to it. At the end of the day, a jury acquitted him because the jury believed the child was lying and the child’s mother put him up to it. The distrct attorney said that paying a settlement was not an admission of guilt.
Puzzled_Orange_6880@reddit
Comes down to personal taste. No one disagrees that he was a fundamentally weird human being...but seeing him as a malicious predator seems too far reaching. Regardless, I don't think many are in the mindset that he was to be especially viewed as a trusted adult. Personally, I think he found joy in the simplicity of children and almost certainly encroached on personal boundaries that would be seen as predator adjacent (Think unwanted tickles, lets just snuggle, who wants a sleepover in our jammies!?). So a tacit yes....but it takes some time to work through it.
tavikravenfrost@reddit
There's not even consensus in my own mind. For me, it's one of those situations where I wouldn't be surprised either way. He might have just been a very odd man who was robbed of any semblance of a normal childhood and spent an inordinate amount of time trying to recapture what he felt he lost, never hurting a single child in the process, and that wouldn't surprise me. He could have assaulted at least some children, and that also wouldn't surprise me.
ExtensionInfinite563@reddit
There's no consensus. Too many people don't want it to be true. I live close to where he lived and know many people who worked with him and knew him. They say he was inappropriate with children, but Michael viewed himself as a child so in his mind it was like being a kid playing/experimenting with other kids.
Zealousideal_Top20@reddit
Mostly look the other way bc his music rocked. Ppl will give much more long and complicated explanations but it mostly comes down to that.
FaxCelestis@reddit
See also: the fact that Chris Brown still has a massive fan base.
TissBish@reddit
I think he had his childhood taken from him and wanted to keep other kids from losing that. Funny with the Epstein files and MJ wasn’t in them at all
IHaveBoxerDogs@reddit
People are very divided.
Ok_Relation5354@reddit
Apparently we do not care about child sex offenders in the US.
KingBadford@reddit
It's a weird topic, because he was a strange guy. He's someone that people can see doing things like that, but at the same time, there's evidence and testimony that he wasn't like that at all. It's further complicated by the fact that he was so damaged.
I don't think we'll ever know for certain. And there are plenty of people who villify him, and others who believe he's innocent, and still more who just like his music and don't want to comment on any of those things.
Both_Painter_9186@reddit
I don’t care if the allegations are true or not. He’s a fucking weirdo and he’d be cancelled if he existed today. You sure as fuck wouldn’t let your kids around him. He just gets a pass from the public because he was popular… checks notes 40 fucking years ago.
Far-Increase8154@reddit
Never looked into it
But most people seem to think he’s guilty
earmares@reddit
There is no consensus. Without proof and just accusations, he is innocent until actual proof, imo. Plus he has people sticking up for him.
alkatori@reddit
He was never convicted.
I think he was probably innocent, just a weird rich dude caught up in a witch hunt.
False-Cookie3379@reddit
I agree. Mackauly Culkin and Corey Feldman were both around him a lot as children and have never said anything bad about him. I think he was mentally stunted and just wanted to have experiences that children have but didn’t have the maturity to understand that what he’s doing is inappropriate and weird.
Powersmith@reddit
Weird, but also one would think severe childhood trauma
HippoProject@reddit
I thinks it’s pretty clear what he did. It’s strange how some people get a pass and some don’t. I personally can separate the art from the artist. He did some pretty heinous things, but if you know what he went through in his early years it’s not to hard to see why he turned out the way he did. It’s no excuse, but you could definitely understand why it would screw someone up.
bizoticallyyours83@reddit
I don't know if he did or not, but he certainly did some weirdly suspicious things. Also, if it did happen I'd like to know what the hell the parents were thinking, dropping their kids off for a sleepover with a stranger? Because that's messed up.
Slight_Manufacturer6@reddit
There is no consensus
Kman17@reddit
There’s not really a consensus on the most serious charges.
I think the only consensus is that the guy reached a level of fame that no one on the planet had - and he was clearly grappling with that at the end of his career / descent.
igottathinkofaname@reddit
I have no idea. It seems to have been confirmed, then proven false, multiple times.
thickjamaicanuncle@reddit
There is a HUGE section of the population who will readily tell you that Michael Jackson was just having "innocent sleepovers" with the kids. Their reasons vary. Some will tell you that it was because he didn't have a childhood of his own while others will say he was "protecting" the kids. I'd say that this was a prevailing narrative for a while, mainly because of testimonies by Macauley Culkin and other children who were with him that said that he never molested him.
People absolutely love Michael Jackson and they will do anything to defend him. His level of stardom was unmatched. That said I think he was definitely molesting those kids.
madogvelkor@reddit
I don't know, he's so strange and unusual that anything could have happened.
theresanrforthat@reddit
And having money and being weird attracted people to take his money.
eyepocalypse@reddit
I’m way to young to have heard anything first hand as it was coming out, but I have had some people be weirdly invested in telling me without any prompting or interest on my part that he was absolutely innocent. So he probably was a pedophile.
anillop@reddit
I view it is the man’s whole life was more or less a tragedy. The poor dude never had a chance at a normal life and had an amazing yet completely fucked up upbringing that resulted in him not being able to have normal adult relationships. I don’t know anything for sure about the pedophilia. I just know the guy wasn’t right in the head, but he made some amazing music. That was a huge part of my youth, and I still enjoy it to this day. He was a showman with a tremendous amount of talent built on a lifetime of tragedy and pain.
Weary_Capital_1379@reddit
I don’t think there was much doubt.
boodyclap@reddit
Honeslty it depends who you asked, I knew many people who would defend him tooth and nail, and even some comedians who would make light of it at the time
pseudonym7083@reddit
I don't know and I don't think I want to know whether or not he actually did it.
rshining@reddit
A lot of people will very actively quell those accusations, because they really really don't want to admit it could be true. He was the very first Super Prominent Celebrity to have a super public accusation, and since his lifestyle was considered extraordinarily weird to begin with, people can pretend it's "all a part of him being Michael".
CompetitionFast2230@reddit
I think a number of the kids who accused him later came out saying they were pushed to accuse him by their parents for money.
RektInTheHed@reddit
I am not and never have been a Michael Jackson fan. I didn't object to his music, but the last 30 years, I definitely cringe when I hear it, because it makes me think of, y'know, Epstein shit.
deereeohh@reddit
Not a consensus. New charges currently I believe.
DonJota5@reddit
I think he was set up, but he obviously had some problems. Child stars all do
whatisakafka@reddit
Mixed. He definitely abused kids IMO
RaspberryLanky7905@reddit
fake news.