AME transparency and extent they see you medical history

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fallingfaster345@reddit

Don’t lie on your medical.

Go ahead and: 1. Get off your medication 2. Write a personal statement 3. Collect a statement from your prescribing doctor that you don’t actually have a diagnosis of depression or anxiety, it was something else (adjustment disorder, for example) and was only temporary and has since resolved 4. Do all the above steps for the ADHD, too 5. Be prepared to get statements from your doctors once a year to prove to the FAA that you are fine and can continue to hold a special issuance medical

But also, if you legitimately have depression, sometimes medication is the best way to take care of yourself and that should come before anything else, including a first class medical. We don’t need any more pilots attempting murder-suicide on commercial aircraft. Which is another reason you shouldn’t lie. People with depression sometimes get approved and sometimes they don’t, but you have a responsibility to every person you might potentially fly to be evaluated for your actual conditions, not a lie you told.

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is-empathy-extinct@reddit (OP)

I honestly don’t see anxiety, depression or ADHD as relevant or accurate for me anymore and for some time. I mostly was depressed due to an abusive family, being a closeted bisexual in a hyper religious family, all while trying to keep up at a cut throat competitive college.

I feel great now that I am out of the closet and have accepted who I am and found chosen family. But I just worry the FAA won’t take me serious.

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fallingfaster345@reddit

That’s my point, exactly. You are going to have to prove that to the FAA.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

It’s called HIPAA

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

HIPAA offers zero protections to pilots from the FAA. When you apply for a medical certificate, you sign away most of of your medical privacy rights.

If you're counting on HIPAA to let you get a medical cert while being statutorily unqualified, you're going to have a bad day (sooner or later).

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

Not true

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

HIPAA regulates how records are shared, not whether the FAA is entitled to the truth.

By signing Form 8500-8, you grant the FAA permission to verify your history. If you hide a diagnosis (like ADHD) and the FAA discovers it through their legal data-sharing agreements with the VA or SSA (which bypass your individual HIPAA consent) you aren't 'protected' by HIPAA. You’re just a pilot facing an emergency revocation and potential federal prosecution for falsification under 14 CFR § 67.403.

(Yeah they don't typically prosecute, but an 18-24 month HIMS sentence with $20k out of pocket costs is pretty rough for a young pilot.)

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

Your still wrong

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

It's "HIPAA" not "HIPPA".

As I've already noted, form 8500-8 has the pilot sign a release before they even walk into an AME office.

You claim HIPAA protects records from 'everyone, including federal agencies.' That is objectively false. Under 45 CFR § 164.512(b)(1)(v), covered entities may disclose PHI to public health authorities authorized by law to receive such information for purposes including 'activities related to the quality, safety or effectiveness' of a FDA-regulated product or activity. The FAA’s aeromedical branch operates under similar federal oversight mandates.

Bottom line, if a patient invokes HIPAA, it's their right, but they aren't getting a medical certificate. Federal law is clear, if you want a cert, you allow the feds access. Their logic is that nobody is forcing you to apply for a medical certificate. If you want it, you have to be transparent.

If you truly believe, as an AME, you don't have the rights to review applicant medical history because of HIPAA... Look you'll have a lot of business for maybe 36 months. Then you'll be washing cars for a living.

Snark aside.. You have a responsibility as a gatekeeper of medical certificates. I'm just some guy on reddit but for your own sake and for the sake of the public, please I implore you, challenge these assumptions and think this through. If you're legitimately an AME issuing certificates with this kind of professional negligence, you are personally and directly creating serious risk to the public. This is risk that you may have to answer for, both professionally and legally.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

Exactly, a guy on reddit with no training in HIPAA or being an AME. It is solely opinion with no expertise to back it up

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

Well I'm a masters student in aviation safety and cited federal regulations. You cited nothing, and can't even spell HIPAA correctly even after multiple edits. You're advising an applicant to falsify his application under the presumption HIPAA protects him. In aviation safety, we don't rely on "not getting caught", we rely on integrity and risk mitigation. You can win a reddit argument by claiming you're a doctor if you want. But the advice you're providing is objectively negligent. I'm done here, but for the sake of your patients and those they fly over, I hope you actually read 45 CFR.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

I gave no advice. You are giving opinion backed by no expertise

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

If you can cite your assertions I am sincerely interested. Being a 4.0 grad student isn't "no expertise" but it is certainly limited. I'm open to being wrong, truly. If you can back up your assertions I would appreciate it. Otherwise, have a pleasant evening.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

Still a student who doesn’t understand HIPPA

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

"Doc", it's "HIPAA" not "HIPPA".

They taught me that at least lol

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

Congrats, at least you learned something 👏

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

Honestly man, can you provide any citations at all? If I'm misunderstanding something here I do really want to know. I honestly don't think there's any mechanism to issue a FAA medical to someone who invokes HIPAA to protect their medical history. If I'm misinterpreting because I don't have the requisite knowledge truly I'd appreciate a clarification that cites federal law. I'm not omniscient. I'll probably be interpreting federal law professionally at some point. I want to know where I'm statutorily misguided so I don't unnecessarily fuck up somebody's life.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

If you don’t disclose a diagnosis, there is no way to get your medical records without a subpoena. Why would you even attempt to get medical records if you don’t know about the diagnosis to begin with? I don’t call every pilot’s physician to make sure he is disclosing everything to me. I have to take him at his word. The pilot’s physician couldn’t tell me anyway because of HIPPA.

Now the issue is you treat every pilot like you are going to fly with them personally.

Also, should litigation ever arise due to their piloting error , you could be deposed. Now, if they didn’t disclose it to you, there’s nothing you could have done.

You don’t understand Hippa

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

HIPPA

After correcting you a half dozen times I have to ask, are you trolling? Please don't tell me we live in a world where someone can be this obtuse and actually pass the USMLE

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

You just don’t understand what you’re talking about

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

The irony here is that you're using 'common sense' to defend a systemic vulnerability. In aviation safety, 'common sense' is what people cite right before an NTSB report explains why they died along with their innocent passengers in a fiery crash.

You’re essentially admitting you’re a rubber-stamp AME who relies on the honor system. If you actually think the FAA only knows what a pilot tells them, you’re not just 'misguided', you're a single point of failure. It is truly staggering that your medical 'trade-school' degree failed to prepare you for an elementary conversation about the federal regulations governing your own professional practice.

I have repeatedly asked for a single citation, and you have failed to provide anything beyond a narrative and a misspelled acronym. As a safety professional being trained at a world-class aviation university, I am being taught to mitigate the exact kind of hubris and 'don't ask, don't tell' strategy you’re advocating for.

Enjoy your next deposition. I don’t say that lightly. Have some humility and really consider educating yourself on the 2026 data-matching protocols before you inadvertently get someone killed and your medical license revoked.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

You need to get out of the classroom. It is a flawed system that relies on the airman being truthful. You have a lot to learn.

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StangViper88@reddit

You are incorrect. Doctors legally cannot pull your medical history if it is not pertinent to their scope. An AME CANNOT pull your medical records or pharmaceutical records. If you go to a MD asking for pain meds, they can and will pull records to check for abuse.

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

You're right that 'random browsing' is illegal. But filing a MedXPress application is a voluntary request for a federal credential that requires a signed waiver of those exact privacy protections.

You aren't being 'browsed'; you are being 'vetted.' Claiming HIPAA protects you from the FAA is like claiming 'privacy' protects you from a background check for a Top Secret clearance. You don't have to give up the data, but if you don't, you don't get the job.

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LRJetCowboy@reddit

My AME advised me on my first exam of the following: I’m your AME, you need a GP. Don’t tell me about anything he says and don’t tell him anything that happens here. Understand kid? I said YES SIR!! Never had a problem.

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

That is really good advice! Unfortunate reality but it is reality. Understanding the incentives is critical, with a career (or stupidly expensive passion hobby) on the line.

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Express-Reality-4826@reddit

You’re truly misguided.

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HippityHopSin@reddit

Hey, I was in a similar position to you before my medical, view my history and see my Medical writeup.

As far as lying, I thought the same as you - I'm going to invest so much time and money into this thing, so why build so much investment on a shaky foundation?

Lying will be fine... until it isn't. Until you bend metal or are tangentially involved in some accident, and then the FAA/NTSB start poking around and digging into yours/the other pilots' background. Then you might be fucked.

It just didn't seem worth it to me, so I sucked it up, and put it all out there. Medical didn't take as long as some of the other horror stories around here.

Good luck!

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is-empathy-extinct@reddit (OP)

Did you have similar diagnosis? How insane was the process? I hear it can take years to be cleared.

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Curious-Owl6098@reddit

If you lie you they won’t know and you can get away with it. So on that front the airline pilots you’ve spoken to are right. AMEs and the FAA can’t just pull your medical records as they please whenever they want. VA disability or military medical records get guys hosed... There are plenty of airline pilots that double dip flying while getting VA disability checks but eventually they will get caught. Civilian records from when you were really young are a lot harder. In the event of bending metal one of the first people who show up will be the piss test guy though.

If you disclose everything you won’t get a medical and it’ll be immediately denied. You might get a special issuance after spending 20-30 grand and jumping through hoops for 2-4 years to get it. But still is unlikely

Take the information as you will. But it seems like the people of Reddit here are perfect angels who have never told a lie ever. I can tell you countless airline guys and professional pilots that for sure lie on their medicals as well as padded their logbooks during training. It’s pretty rampant. I’m not condoning doing any of that. I’m just giving you a realistic perspective of playing the game

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ltcterry@reddit

Schedule a consultation. Not an appointment for a medical.

Before you do this, call around and find an AME who has done this before. Even if you have to go out of town. Don’t be the guinea pig.

With planning some of these might be easier to deal with if they age out some. The consult can tell you this without risk.

Don’t get a medical yet. You’ll create a mess.

You might want to consider starting with Sport, or if convenient, Private in a glider. No medical required.

There is no reason to rush. No reason to pursue a medical when there’s an 80% dropout rate. And every reason to take your time and be smart.

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Physical_Height_727@reddit

Can confirm, go with an ame one that would work with you. I was the guinea pig and had to figure all out by my self.

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atmatthewat@reddit

Not going to give you advice one way or another, but I will tell you that your decision to be fully transparent with the list of things you've disclosed to us above is going to be tens of thousands of dollars (perhaps many tens of thousands), a year or longer, and absolutely no guarantee that after all that you'll end up with a medical.

If you can afford the time and money and anxiety of waiting, and can afford for it to all be a waste of time and money, great. If not, this might not be a career you're ready to pursue.

The FAA really needs to change this, but they have zero incentive to do so, and every incentive to be conservative to the point of just denying people with histories like yours no matter what the tests say.

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atmatthewat@reddit

I do recommend some reading of what's at https://www.pilotsofamerica.com/community/forums/medical-topics.13/

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-LordDarkHelmet-@reddit

You also have to consider any changes that may come up in the next few decade. My AME thinks that the whole AME thing is dying, and that eventually we will all just go to our primary with some paperwork to fill out. What does the AME do that your primary can't? Which means your primary would have access to all your medical info which could be an issue.

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Oregon-Pilot@reddit

Sadly, the medical game is exactly that - a game. Same with the “don’t fly fatigued” sentiment from the Company that voluntarily creates regularly scheduled transcon redeyes that leave at 11:30pm after you, and every other regular and healthy human, have had a full day awake because…..they’re humans with lives. It’s all bullshit lip service designed solely by and for company and FAA lawyers to mitigate their liability in the event of an accident or incident. That’s all this is.

Having said that, you still gotta be smart about being stupid. If there’s a paper trail, you can’t lie. They’ll find out, and that is not something you’ll want to deal with. Best bet is to go in armed with information about the process and the proper expectations, and to learn beforehand what to say or not say. Find a “good” AME with lots of experience with this sort of thing, who will actually help you get your medical by working the system that they know how to work. Let them do that part.

Good luck!

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RexFiller@reddit

There is a database for controlled substances, which amphetamines are. If the last time you took them was over a year ago, most AMEs if they search the database wont search more than a year ago, but they absolutely could. Also if anything came up that requires FAA review, you bet they will search it and you could lose everything if you lie.

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

Diagnoses are killers. There are pathways now for some anti-depressants and even on the spot approvals. But time from diagnosis/medication matters.

Electronic health records are increasingly interconnected. Since this is under 2yrs ago, you should assume your AME can see it. Especially if insurance paid for anything.

Others have said it, and it's true. Get a consult first. Before an AME I'd suggest talking to AOPA or the other pilot medical lawyers.

The reality of the FAA is there's one path to getting a medical if you don't get instant approval. It involves tens of thousands of dollars out of pocket and 18+ months. If you truly have a passion for flying it's doable. But you have to understand that the FAA treats you almost exactly the same as a guy who was caught mainling heroin on the flight deck. It's a serious flaw in the system.

The other commenters are right to warn you, you could file and get a certificate and be fine. Until you bend metal. Then a routine review flags you and while it has nothing to do with some goober running into your plane while the CA was taxiing, a discrepancy gets identified and you're out of work for 18 months spending $20k on neurocogs. You could spent your entire career going unnoticed, or you could have an incident on probation at your first regional and be royally screwed.

The system sucks. It's slightly better than it was before. But it still sucks.

Know what you're getting into when you disclose. If you really want it, remember, the walls are made to keep others out who didn't want it as much as you do. Good luck.

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Fine-Literature-8031@reddit

Do you want to stake an entire career based on a lie that could be revealed?

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

The FAA would have preferred it if OP drank his troubles away. They call it aeronautical decision making, actually.

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EnthusiasmHuman6413@reddit

Psh. Obviously you’ve never seen “catch me if you can”. Pure adrenaline until it blows up in your face.

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DefundTheHOA_@reddit

Your depression is more of an issue than your ADHD diagnosis. Your medical will be denied until you go through the process

Don’t lie as it’s a felony

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IveSeenYourCheers@reddit

Nobody's prosecuting that. The bigger issue is he's sitting on six figure private loan debt (and alimony) and is grounded for 18 months because HIMS treats him the same as a guy caught mainlining heroin on the flight deck, all because 20yrs from now some regional guy clips his bird taxiing too closely and the feds do their homework.

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No-Brilliant9659@reddit

Just call and ask for a consultation

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is-empathy-extinct@reddit (OP)

What do you mean?

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aftcg@reddit

Call a reputable AME group that can walk you through what needs to be put on the medexpress application.

Wingmanmed.com is my go to, but there are others that are just as good.

If you submit the medexpress app before the consultation, you run the high and likely risk of putting something in there that will fuck up your app so hard you'll regret it. Get a pro's input!

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dodexahedron@reddit

The FAA does not have carte blanche to just dig up any medical information on you they want from wherever thwy want, whenever they want. They have to ask permission, and, further, they generally make you do the work of getting that information to them, rather than asking permission and then getting it themselves.

What they can access is the totality of anything you have ever sent them, anything you have explicitly given permission for them to have, anything your AME has sent them, and your driving record for the past 10 years (you grant that on the application). But even as a public health agency, they still do have limitations under HIPAA and 14CFR, and can't just go fishing.

Dots can sometimes be connected for some things, and they sometimes do get connected and then investigation begins. But usually not until someone bends metal or dies.

There's a reason prohibited medications are common in NTSB accident reports, from autopsies on pilots: It's often easy to get away with.

But for certain things, like ADHD, just peruse this sub for a while to see just how reasonable most of us consider the rules to be and juat gow ridiculous the processes around it all can be, and there's your answer on why people lie.

Just to be clear, though, it's a federal crime to lie on the application, and one to several federal crimes to then proceed to fly on an invalid medical.

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NE_Flight_Medicine@reddit

Please don’t lie on your 8500-8. You may get away with it temporarily, but it can catch up with you and when it does, the consequences will be severe. It’s just not worth it.

I suggest scheduling a consultation with your Ame BEFORE you do your 8500-8 and come up with a plan of action for your medical.

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Can_Not_Double_Dutch@reddit

FAA considers those big issues, get all your records together and go to an AME to discuss before starting flight training. You might realize the obstacle is too much. But don't lie with those issues.

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320sim@reddit

I’ll just say it’s unlikely at this time that you get caught, but the consequences if you do are enormous. They have caught people before, and they have permission to access medical records. They could start using a computer system to audit medicals tomorrow if they wanted.

The possible punishments for getting caught lying range from losing your career and ability to fly on the low end, to fines and jail on the high end. I’d say it’s better to spend a few months going through the process and not take that risk

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ParagPa@reddit

So - there's a chance you could lie and get away with it (at least as a GA pilot). HOWEVER, if you're ever involved in an incident, and there's an investigation, and this is all discovered, you're completely hosed. Both with the FAA and your insurance carrier. It's why even though pretty much everyone told me to lie on my medical application, I went through the full process. I had too much to lose to make lying even an option.

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BagOfMoneyNoChange@reddit

Will the AME pull up all your primary care records during your medical process? No. You can lie and get issued a medical on the spot.

But one day it will probably catch up with you. The federal government can pull your medical records if and when they want.

So you can either do it the right way, or you can lie about it now and sit under that shadow for the rest of your career, waiting for the fact that you committed a federal offense to get to where you are.

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Kuchington@reddit

You need to stop taking advice from whoever these clowns are. Do you really want invest $100k and years of your life with the risk of losing it all just because you lied on your medical?

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rFlyingTower@reddit

This is a copy of the original post body for posterity:

Because of big of an investment going into this career will be, I do not want to mess it up and will be going the route of being transparent with my true medical history BUT I’m still curious based on all the advice airline pilots have given me to do the opposite.

In my past I’ve had depression, been on anti-depressants, been diagnosed with ADHD (I think it was more so just being over diagnosed and I just went along with it), and was on Adderall until a year and a half ago.

I know there is a route to get approved for all these things but it costs more and takes longer. When talking with MANY airline pilots about my situation like 70% plus have told me to go into my AME and just lie and say I have no history of anything and since none of those issues is bothering me or relevant today it’s better to just not go through all the hoops and just say you’ve been healthy and don’t go to the doctor so there’s nothing to have them look into.

I’m mostly just curious, how is that even possible to do? Don’t they have government access to all my medical records no matter what? Would it even be possible to do what they are saying? I still feel safer being honest so nothing bites me in the ass but it’s blowing my mind these pilots are telling me there’s no way the FAA or AMEs would be able to find out about my history if I don’t disclose it and provide medical records.

Do any AMEs or people in this world have more info on this?

I am legitimately worried about my past ADHD diagnosis because I never felt it was accurate or fitting but in college it was encouraged to get to be competitive at my very competitive institution but now I regret even bringing it up to a doc in the past.

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AutoModerator@reddit

Hi, I'm a bot and it looks like you're asking a question about medical issues: depression.

Medicals can be confusing and even scary, we get it. Unfortunately, the medical process is very complex with many variables. It's too complex, in fact, for any of us to be able to offer you any specific help or advice.

We strongly suggest you discuss your concerns with a qualified aviation medical examiner before you actually submit to an official examination, as a hiccup in your medical process can close doors for you in the future. Your local AME may be able to provide a consultation. Other places that may provide aeromedical advice include: AOPA, EAA, the Mayo Clinic, and Aviation Medicine Advisory Service.

For reference, here is a link to the FAA's Synopsis of Medical Standards and for more in-depth information here is a link to the FAA's Guide for Aviation Medical Examiners.

Also, feel free to browse our collection of past medical write-ups and questions in our FAQ.

Finally, we suggest you read the instructions on the medical application very closely. Do not volunteer information that isn't asked for, but also do not lie. Some people may urge you to omit pertinent information, or even outright lie, on your medical application in order to avoid added hassle and expense in obtaining a medical certificate. Know that making false statements on your medical application is a federal crime and that people have been successfully prosecuted for it. But for heaven's sake, don't tell the FAA any more than you absolutely have to.

If you're not in the United States, the above advice is still generally correct. Just substitute the FAA with your local aviation authority.

Good luck!

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