Nothing new, something borrowed
Posted by Meteorstar101@reddit | greentext | View on Reddit | 204 comments
Posted by Meteorstar101@reddit | greentext | View on Reddit | 204 comments
KennKennyKenKen@reddit
Why was she such a baddie
Dry_Blueberry6806@reddit
That's not what the movie said.
Rhorge@reddit
The movie said unobtainium and that all I remember
StandardN02b@reddit
That's the first movie. They had to change it in the second because people realized that the humans were justified in atacking pandora, so they dumbed down their motives to be the most cartonishly evil thing they could imagine.
You don't hate holywood enough.
Fyrefanboy@reddit
The humans never were justified in attacking Pandora lol
StandardN02b@reddit
In the first humanity is reeling in the border of total colapse due to lack of resources, principaly, energy. Unoctanium is used to build nuclear fusion reactors. Such technology would propel humanity to a type 1 civilization fully capable of repairing the damage done to earth and giving us basicaly unlimited energy without contamination.
The expedition to Pandora is quite posibly humanity's last hope and Jake threw it away for moral superiority. While he enjoys his alien fantasy, the people of Earth die. People that read more about the lore of the movie learned that and plenty shifted their opinion to be pro humanity. That's, of course, a big nono, so they dumbed down and retconed the lore for the sequels so humanity is le bad.
HidenTsubameGaeshi@reddit
Wait, what? Who tf said they were justified in commiting genocide for profit? US and that other country?
Lucariowolf2196@reddit
Shrou to Shirou communication moment
Ted_Normal@reddit
The reason people say the humans were justified is largely derived from small lore details the movie doesn't place heavy emphasis on but definitely puts the story into a new context. More specifically, humanity is undergoing a resource/energy crisis and the unobtainium is key to resolving it. Additionally, the humans already exhausted all peaceful options when trying to negotiate with the Naivi (its mentioned they try to give them stuff like medicine but they rejected it). When you put all this together it adds more complexity and nuance where humanity isn't just acting out of greed but more out of desperation and the Naivi begin to look unreasonable and xenophobic. It kind of leads further to a tragic irony in the second movie where, because of Jake's actions, Earth is dying and the new plan is to prep Pandora for mass human colonization which makes things worse for the Naivi as a whole.
Fyrefanboy@reddit
The RDA are the armed mercenaries of the greedy megacorps who destroyed earth. They aren't there to save humanity.
k410n@reddit
This adds no nuance at all. Obviously they were not justified at all. Needing something really badly obviously doesn't allow someone to just murder and rob others.
NuclearDawa@reddit
But humanity, and the RDA specifically, fucked the earth out of greed. That's stated in the first 5 minutes of the first movie
They only state that unobtanium is worth a lot, and they wipe the first clan because they are sitting on the richest ore deposit, not the only one. They could have dug somewhere else and have slightly worse return on investment without killing anyone
TheOutcastLeaf@reddit
Bro is arguing with themselves 😭
HidenTsubameGaeshi@reddit
Shirou on Shirou violence is very on brand tho
StandardN02b@reddit
Just because you are correct doesn't mean you are right.
knyexar@reddit
Literally a canon event
akashom53@reddit
Yep. Same people who are now justifying war in Iran
Distantstallion@reddit
In the second movie they suddenly had cities and resources enough on pandora to be hunting whales for their ambergris despite austensibly being completely skint on resources and desperate in the first one.
The story doesn't matter, at some point I'm gonna just make a supercut to get rid of the dialogue scenes since they're mostly a waste of time.
YoungDiscord@reddit
I always assumed that the group of people in the second movie were a different set of mercenaries from the ones in the first movie
I mean pandora is an entire planet and its already established that earth has the technology to travel to pandora
Its also established that Jake is not of the first wave of people who have reached that planet so people have been doing stuff on pandora for some time now.
None of this is fed to us directly, rather its implied by the environmental storytelling
So its not a stretch to assume that the company that Jake worked for in the first movie is not the only company/group of people on that planet doing stuff
And if you think of it that way, its also not a stretch to assume that if these are capitalist ventures from different companies some might be doing better than others since its about money, not colonization so some ventures like the one in the first movie might be struggling for resources whilst others like in the second movie might not simply because they do things differently that works better for them.
Also location matters - the location in the first movie might have been more hostile to human settlement than in the second one but that's just a theory, kinda how you see so many abandoned minning settlements on earth - because they settled in a hostile place for the mining and once that was gone, the settlement was unsustainable due to... lack of basic resources.
That could have also been the case in the first movie but not the second.
At least that's how it makes the most sense to me.
eutectic_h8r@reddit
Jake Soooly
matt_Nooble12_XBL@reddit
Why so blue?
Arguably_Based@reddit
Good luck remembering what it actually said
canoIV@reddit
the only lasting impact of the series has been the bad crop we're gonna starve meme
Arguably_Based@reddit
Every new movie makes a bajillion dollars then leaves everyone's brains. No one has ever had any discourse about Avatar, no one has ever made any political comparisons, no one has ever claimed that a character from the movies supports their political point of view. These movies didn't even make an impact on engagement farming bots.
Uniquely-Bee@reddit
Politically these movies are 50 years out of date. It's quite stunning, actually, how efficiently they managed to distill the pure essence of a 70s anti-Vietnam war, anti-colonialist, "MIC bad", ecologist gen-Xer.
Then I remember that's who Cameron is, and then I ponder in amazement again just how little he evolved politically over the decades
Matiwapo@reddit
But like, he's still right? Colonialism, the MIC, and the Vietnam war are all still bad.
You don't evolve from a correct opinion. And like, all these themes are still relevant. The US is still waging pointless destructive wars for profit and resource extraction constantly
Uniquely-Bee@reddit
His politics are surface level and pedestrian, either irrelevant in the 21st century, or in serious need of updating. The MIC boogeyman was a meme and dead talking point since at least the Last Supper in 1993, and the final nail in the coffin was last year, when the Trump administration cut military aid to Ukraine, the biggest ongoing military conflict in the world with highest consumption of artillery ammunition since WWII. One would think Trump would be assassinated by now by the MIC boogeyman. Btw, Microsoft alone is bigger than all American military contractors and industry combined.
We also get this distinctly American interpretation of imperialism, with hyperfixation on benajmins as a motivating factor. Basically post-Iraq PTSD that brain-broke-burgers for whom waging war for ideological or security reasons are completely abstract and incomprehensible concepts. The presentation of colonialism is also laughable, believe it or not it is possible to make a critique of colonialism without resorting to the noble savage trope that was popular with hippies in the 80s.
I'm a big environmentalist myself, and even I roll my eyes at the Ferngully/Captain Planet level of environmentalism. Except that those stories seem profound and subtle compared to the likes of Avatar. Is the lesson I should take that killing whales bad because they actually are super intelligent creatures but we just don't get them? So I assume less intelligent creatures are fair game? No, the actual rational case for environmentalism (that is above Cameron's personal obsession with whales) is that our own well being is co-dependent on a healthy ecosystem, which can be maintained with responsible resource extraction (not ceasing it completely, which would be civilization ending), and promoting biodiversity, it also being a source of academic study
Responsible_Jury_415@reddit
Most generational movies leave references and slogans name one catch phrase form avatar I fucking dare ya
Lolmemsa@reddit
Quotes and slogans don’t make a good movie
Jazzghul@reddit
But they do make a culturally relevant movie
Lolmemsa@reddit
If you want to talk about cultural relevance, every blockbuster was in 3D for a good few years after Avatar, the only reason 3D TVs existed was because of avatar
Outrider_Inhwusse@reddit
"I'll be nice, once. Then I won't."
Arguably_Based@reddit
Um... Uhh... Um... "Bro we're gonna starve!"
logan5124@reddit
the most impact avatar's ever made to me personally was having a really annoying ad...
in hoppers that mentions that it "ISN'T like avatar"
yomamasofatsheburger@reddit
Because everyone goes to see Avatar for the special effects. It’s all I heard about when Avatar II came out in theaters.
Arguably_Based@reddit
"What's your favorite movie?"
"Avatar."
"Cool,.want to watch it?"
"Actually, my 4k TV is in the shop..."
AmaterasuWolf21@reddit
Of course they do have discourse about it, it's the only movie I've seen chuds complain about cultural impact
NuclearTheology@reddit
Lmao
Arguably_Based@reddit
Chuds? What are you speaking Polish? Make an actual argument for the movie if you care so much. Unless you can't remember what happens in it either.
CampbellsBeefBroth@reddit
Incorrect, it also gave us this dude
tomtheconqerur@reddit
This dude should have been the protagonist.
Mesarthim1349@reddit
Even in Avatar form, the marines dress like nerds fresh from bootcamp raiding the tacticool-store
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
The lasting impact of Avatar has been a bunch of mouthbreathers repeating 'Avatar had no cultural impact' on threads talking about it.
The fact that 17 years after the original came out people are still hurr-durring over it, meming on 'unobtanium' and watching the sequels means it won.
canoIV@reddit
oof hit a nerve there
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
Yes, the nerve is 'bored of people saying the same moronic statements over and over again for almost two decades.'
Malvastor@reddit
I'm fond of "jarhead clan" myself.
AmaterasuWolf21@reddit
And the guy falling over
Wantitneeditgetit@reddit
Lasting IMPACT you say?
Sakuran_11@reddit
I have so many of these saved still
ThatFuckingGeniusKid@reddit
And the army guy/alien wife memes.
Dry_Blueberry6806@reddit
Does it have dialogue?
Unironicfan@reddit
Yes, just not memorable dialogue
Dry_Blueberry6806@reddit
Idk man, when the colonel guy said "blue pussy got me seeing your way sully, just not in a way you'd get" I knew I'll never forget that line.
Unironicfan@reddit
This meme gets me every time
He-She-We_Wumbo@reddit
BBtheboy@reddit
Avatar haters when they see an opportunity to tell people they don't care about avatar
Arguably_Based@reddit
What? I wouldn't have even thought about Avatar today if this meme hadn't been posted. It's more of an opportunistic thing. What I'm saying is, defend the thing you like more accurately, we have standards.
BBtheboy@reddit
So... exaclty what i said?
Hanza-Malz@reddit
Avatar
NotNonbisco@reddit
That is exactly what the movie said bruh
Jabbam@reddit
700 upvotes for media illiteracy
Cpt_Soban@reddit
Space Pocahontas
Alfred_Leonhart@reddit
That is definitely what the movie said
thr33beggars@reddit
Na’vi please
TKRAYKATS@reddit
Can a Na'vi borrow a french fry ?
Scottish_Whiskey@reddit
Na’vi, is you gone give it back!?
undreamedgore@reddit
Not sure what else the message could have been. It shit upon thr humans for trying go get the "fix everything" metal.
pedrokdc@reddit
Come HELLDIVE with heroes, patrior, SUPER EARTH NEEDS YOU
SilliusS0ddus@reddit
Well... the aliens are kind of the villains.
But humanity literally made them into that lol.
The4ourHorsemen@reddit
Good to see another super earth patriot
Prestigious-Fig1172@reddit
Can't, my pc is potat :(
PENG-1@reddit
Ender’s Game?
Aliens are mindless villains attacking earth with drone swarms, so we wipe them out. Then realize that 1. They misunderstood humanity as billions of mindless drones similar to themselves and didn’t realize they were killing individuals and 2. Had every opportunity to defend themselves but chose not to in order to try to deescalate, resulting in their species being wiped out because we thought they were fighting a similar war of annihilation
Malvastor@reddit
If I remember right they weren't even trying to deescalate exactly- they realized it was way too late for that, so the plan was to let themselves get mostly wiped out but leave a queen in hibernation where the one human who could empathize with them might find it.
dr_strange-love@reddit
In the book, once the Buggers figured out what they were doing, they just retreated home thinking we couldn't follow. I don't think the last queen was left behind as part of a plan, they just got lucky that one was hidden and Ender could sense it.
Hippocalypse44@reddit
Nope, in the books they absolutely had a contingency plan. They reached out to Ender through the philotic web, and they created the hiding place of the egg based on his experiences with the fantasy game. That bridge between their hive mind, Ender, and the fantasy game is actually what creates Jane in the books
dr_strange-love@reddit
You're right. I forgot about the fantasy game.
Malvastor@reddit
Right, the whole reason Ender's able to find the queen is they made a facsimile of the stuff he'd been seeing in the fantasy game, because he and only he would immediately recognize that and realize it was intentional.
agvkrioni@reddit
I was under the impression that human was under some kind of psychic influence but, maybe that's just my head canon.
WhiteSepulchre@reddit
Colonialism is bad and humanity does suck. If aliens existed capitalists would still raise your costs of living, steal your tax dollars and stagnate wages but now they blame it on aliens.
Dracorex13@reddit
Capitalism is good and so is fucking space furries.
JustChillin3456@reddit
This fantasy relies on thinking that aliens aren’t also colonialists / capitalists
Razor-Swisher@reddit
I fear you are both most likely correct
Darkblue57@reddit
OP is delusional.
Science fiction has been used as an allegory since Mary Shelly in the 1800's
Sci-Fi was literally always hippy shit.
TomCBC@reddit
Plus, there are SO MANY great sci fi stories where humans are good guys. Some of the biggest franchises of all time like Star Wars and Trek, also Stargate on tv was super successful. And it’s returning.
Shows where humanity are the heroes.
WrigglingWorm@reddit
Some sci-fi, other sci-fi is just "Cool shit in the future." Aliens and predator are prime examples. Same with Star wars, pod racing exists because it is cool.
xXx_edgykid_xXx@reddit
Aliens? The series that specifically makes the design of the main antagonist be about male rape?
Predator? The movie that literally has American soldiers lose to asymmetrical warfare in a jungle?
Those are the examples you use for something to not be an allegory?
WrigglingWorm@reddit
How do you think parasites work? They don't ask nicely to come into your body, they either bite their way in or invade through a hole. Xenomorphs are just like a virus attacking a cell, they inject their own DNA, use the host to multiply and burst the host. Is a virus male raping a cell? No. Giger was a pervert yes but the point of the movies is humans battling against savage beasts either with guns or wits.
You can pick any movie with combat in and draw a historical comparison. That's the thing with combat tactics, the weapons change but methods don't. For predator you could just as easily draw a comparison to Gauls, Celts or similar harrying Roman patrols in the dense forests of europe. It's American soldiers because it is an American film, it engages the audience better. Again it's a movie about soldiers fighting an unknown advanced technology threat and overcoming it with their own wits and strength.
Inspiration doesn't mean something is allegory. The book Jurassic park has an industrial espionage theme, but that doesn't mean it's an allegory for a real world example.
Leadfarmerbeast@reddit
Damn dude, you are really missing a lot of great subtext and theme. The first Alien especially is all about rape, and combines that visceral distorted alien penis and vagina imagery with themes of corporate exploitation to represent rapacious capitalism.
Predator is such a hyper-masculine movie because it’s also subverting that masculinity at every turn. Dudes shooting big guns into the jungle ultimately becomes irrelevant. And after the over the top opening action sequence, the movie switches genre entirely, becoming a slasher movie. The soldiers become the horny teens in Friday the 13th, and Arnold becomes the final girl. All the manly man big gun stuff is rendered impotent, and only wits and creativity win in the end. Though Arnold did have to use some big muscles to build those traps at the end.
And industrial espionage is really the main thematic allegory you got from Jurassic Park? The movie (and book) that explicitly talks in detail about the foolish hubris of man?
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
Did Ridley Scott say that alien is about rape? Because tbh this does sound more like your personal interpretation. I simply don’t see the rape, penis or vagina imagery you talk about.
helio97@reddit
How the alien is a giant penis that puts it's seed inside you that explodes you from the inside out, killing you in the process. It's like the most rapey way to rape ever.
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
I can see how the alien may look kinda like a penis but that’s still a reach. But the alien isn’t even the one putting the seed inside, it’s the face hugger which doesn’t have any resemblance to a penis at all.
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
I wonder how rape might be a theme in a movie where someone is forcibly impregnated via face’hugging.’
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
That would make every movie about parasites rape themed. I’d the last of us rape themed because the fungus takes control without consent?
Also wouldn’t that make possession also a rape theme? Is the conjuring franchise rape themed?
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
The script writer confirmed the sexual assault reading was correct almost fifty years ago. It’s not subtle. It’s never been subtle.
The facehugger is a sexual assault creature that forcibly impregnates people. The framing of how the grown Xenomorph kills Lambert also alludes to sexual assault. Ash tries to kill Ripley by forcing a rolled up magazine down her throat in a similar way to the facehugger rather than simply strangling her because it’s more rapey.
Actually insane to me the negative media literacy it takes to completely miss this and start waffling about ‘all parasite movies being about rape.’ No motherfucker, the cordyceps fungus doesn’t grab your face and force a phallus down your throat before implanting a ‘baby’ in you!
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
Why do you have to resort to personal attacks?
Genuinely not interested in talking with someone who is acting so condescending simply because I haven’t understood the imagery the same way as you.
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
You're on r/Greentext dude, I'm not here to have a polite conversation, I'm here to laugh at morons. Someone who can't intuit the thematic difference between a fungus that turns you into a zombie and a forcibly implanted living being that bursts out of you... Well, I'll let you finish that one on your own.
Fmywholelife@reddit
Dan O'Brien the screenwriter said in a 2002 interview: "One thing that people are all disturbed about is sex... , 'That's how I'm going to attack the audience; I'm going to attack them sexually. And I'm not going to go after the women in the audience, I'm going to attack the men. I am going to put in every image I can think of to make the men in the audience cross their legs."
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
The first movie was released over 20 years earlier though. Also I feel like there’s a difference between using sexual imagery to conjure up disturbance in the audience and it being socially critical or portraying „rapacious capitalism“.
Fmywholelife@reddit
Did I miss something in this thread? I can't find any reference to "rapacious capitalism".
CaloricDumbellIntake@reddit
Last sentence, first paragraph of Leadfarmerbeasts comment
WrigglingWorm@reddit
You have a great career as an English teacher with the amount of reach you are going for.
Have you even read the book? It's quite different to the film. Greed is the main driver. Dinosaurs are just animals it's just a lot scarier than an escaped lion. Pretty much everything that goes wrong is down to Hammond's greed which triggers Nedry's greed. The message is you can't buy your way past proper planning and structure. Corners are cut, even the island is picked all to get the park going without inspections and due process. Also personal responsibility. Hammond is incapable of taking responsibility for anything throughout the whole book, he even blames the island itself in the end.
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
Sexual assault is a major theme of the first Alien movie. Like, a major major theme. From the way that facehuggers forcibly impregnate people, to the design of the xenomorph, to the way Ash tries to kill Ripley and how Lambert dies. It's not even really very subtle to be honest.
> "The point of the movies is humans battling against savage beasts with guns or wits."
Alien, the film about a crew of mostly competent space truckers being slowly torn apart one by one until only a single person is left, where the weapons they have do nothing to stop the xenomorph and there are maybe three or four jokes in the entire film? Are you sure?
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
Aliens is extremely obvious social commentary lmao
WrigglingWorm@reddit
Corporate greed is the motive plot point but that doesn't mean the films aren't about blasting the crap out of aliens.
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
I don't see how you can reconcile this with your previous comment that Alien/s is "just about cool shit in the future". It's about corporate greed and imperialism (since the ayys are effectively bioweapons intended to suppress rebellions) in all time periods. The cool shit is there and is cool, but that's not what the movie is about.
WrigglingWorm@reddit
I mean that is literally what the movie is about. If you ask someone what happens in The films:
Alien: They find some weird eggs on a mining planet and have to try and escape/fight it as it kills the crew one by one.
Aliens: They go to capture an alien but end up fighting and blowing up an entire hive.
Predator: A special forces unit gets sidetracked from their operation by an alien hunter looking to turn them into trophies.
Cool shit and a plot aren't mutually exclusive but a plot doesn't mean that "this is all supposed to represent X"
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
It's possible to watch pretty much anything without engaging with the themes, yes.
WrigglingWorm@reddit
Engaging with the themes doesn't mean saying everything is a nod to something else. Greed and conquest are universally human values. Just because someone invades a planet doesn't mean you have to sit there and go "hmmm this is just like the ottomans"
Mrshoephd@reddit
I disagree sci-fi without subtext and allegory is just fantasy in space
SparklingLimeade@reddit
This. But also if someone wants to tell a different story they're welcome to write.
Good old sci-fi/fantasy. The pulp staple. Barrier to entry so low you might mistake it for an open door.
Now that I mention this wide open space I wonder why OOP might be seeing a lot of a particular trope. Maybe the problem it represents is on a lot of minds.
heqra@reddit
next, you're gonna tell me Rage against the machine is woke
thot_chocolate420@reddit
Like Mass Effect?
The_Noremac42@reddit
The first movie was basically just Pocahontas In Space.
Lolmemsa@reddit
What an original statement, did you think of that one yourself?
srcactusman@reddit
I got that statement at the statement store
vladdeh_boiii@reddit
May i suggest 40k? Everyone there is the bad guy and we just sorta pick who we think is the coolest.
JustChillin3456@reddit
Bring back human supremacy. Aliens are meant to be used as slaves or concubines
Panophobia_senpai@reddit
Here inquisitor, this is the Slaanesh worshipper.
Lucius-Halthier@reddit
THE EMPEROR PROTECTS!
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
I notice that unlike Khorne and Nurgle, Slaanesh is face down ass up...
TheReverseShock@reddit
Nurgle
Lucius-Halthier@reddit
As a great space wizard once said, “let’s celebrate what unites us all: XENOPHOBIA!”
Absolutemehguy@reddit
Lucius-Halthier@reddit
I’ll trade ya friend.
GnT_Man@reddit
Wrong. Exterminate the xenos. Glory to the Emperor!
HiddenVisage@reddit
Didn't the emperor only want genuine threats against humanity exterminated? And didn't he absolutely hate it when people worshipped him?
Admirable-Ad-5026@reddit
He did but humanity mostly encountered hostile aliens even during the golden age only one race wasn't hostile but after the fall of humanity it's more of a question of survival rather than ideals and the emperor can't even move anymore so he can't undo the emperor cult nor reform the imperium
sockmop@reddit
Suffer not the Xenos!
miki325@reddit
No. Slavery is a stain upon the Galaxy.
Xenocide is preferable, as it doesnt taint our democratic and liberal principles.
Prestigious-Fig1172@reddit
Let's not fuck aliens (they might enjoy it (we can't have that))
brightcrayon92@reddit
r/humansarespaceorcs
Ryengu@reddit
Don't listen, this is xeno trickery to steal our superior human genes.
Thendrail@reddit
GW: "Stealing our genes?"
WatIsLasagne@reddit
She could steal every last drop. Wait, did i say drop? I meant strand
Thendrail@reddit
"Don't worry, the stargods will accept your humble offering. I shall collect it."
Lucius-Halthier@reddit
“Do they steal jeans?”
“YER GUNNA DIE!”
Weener69@reddit
“I can no longer sit back and allow xeno infiltration, xeno indoctrination, xeno subversion and the international xeno conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids.”
deutschesgesetzbuch_@reddit
Fer_Sher_Dude@reddit
Just play mass effect or anything 40K related and realize we’re all awful.
Visible_Grocery4806@reddit
Humanity in 40K is the closest thing to not being awful lmao.
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
What? No the fuck they aren't lmao. The Imperium is constantly described, over and over again, as a massively inefficient, oppressive, dysfunctional system. People are punished in horrific ways for arbitrary reasons, entire planets are condemned because someone three hundred years ago forgot to dot an I or cross a T. Entire armies are regularly sent to planets without important protective equipment becasue the administration just... Forgot to do that.
Hell, one of the biggest reasons why the galaxy in 40K is filled with hostile aliens who are locked in a deathwar with the Imperium is because the imperium genocided all the chill alienss it could get its hands on.
Visible_Grocery4806@reddit
80% of the cons of the imperium you described are the issues caused by a both overburdened and overbloated buearaucracy which is caused by the fear of the machines following their uprising. The one actually evil thing about the imperium is its policy of xenocide, and is anyone really surprised when the most powerful xenos surronding the Imperium are Orks, necrons or the Tyranids? The Imperium itself is constantly fighting the forces of chaos, tyranids, Orks, Necrons and dark Eldars. All these races/ empires are far worse than humanity. The exceptions are the near extinct Eldar which view other races mostly as tools that can be used to fight chaos and their other enemies. The other faction are the Tau which are at first sight seen as a morally good empire. But the Tau empire is essentially a mix of "Brave New World" and an apartheid state that treats every other race as meatshield for Tau people, not to mention brainwashing its citizens and doing anything for the "greater good".
So yes the human empire is the nearest thing to not being awful in 40k.
TearOpenTheVault@reddit
The Imperium has fucking computers, they're the ones taht choose to use vellum scrolls for the vibes.
"The one evil thing." Ah yes, not the concentration camps filled with prisoners who committed 'heresy' (read, doing anything a priest might disagree with,) not their eugenics of people who don't adhere to the human form, not the feudal heirarchy that condemns literal billions to live in the most inhumane conditions imaginable, not even their habit of punishing criminals by intentionally subjecting them to permanent and intense agony, just the xenocide.
Again, this is the Imperium's own fault. Before the Great Crusade, there were lots and lots of other alien civilisations in the galaxy, and many of them were friendly. But the Emperor decided that everyone else had to go for humanity to ascend, and so all the aliens that were chill got steamrolled, leaving only the ones that could fight back against the Imperium to survive.
Oh that's a bad thing? Well fuck, it's sure great the Imperium doesn't view human lives as entirely expendable currency to be thrown at any problem in massive quantities then. Stupid xenos, don't they know that only the Imperium can view people as tools?
Literally false. Just like, emphatically false. They're not an apartheid state, they have distinct subspecies that form different pillars of their society. Those subspecies can and do interact with each other all the time. As for the 'brainwashing...' Yeah, it's very easy to convince your average Imperial citizen to side with the Greater Good when the Imperium is so unbelievably awful.
The reason why people keep switching away from the Imperium is becuase it's inhumanly awful. The reason why people side with Chaos is because Chaos offers them a chance - any chance at all, even if it's a lie, of making it out of the hellhole that is life in the Imperium. The reason why the T'au can cause planetary governers to peacefully defect and sway populations to their side is because they treat people with more dignity than the Imperium does.
I usually hate this term, but holy fuck does it apply here: You're a tourist who doesn't know what they're talking about.
Visible_Grocery4806@reddit
The Imperial concentration camp and totalitarianism, well it's 40K and indeed the worst that the Tau do is forced sterrilisation so there is that. And in dark crusade (the game) which is canon btw, if the Tau win they do sterillize the human population and trough different measures reduce their births.
As for computer usage. Of course the Imperium is not different from any other state and suffers from red tape. Putting aside the widespread fear of technology in the Imperium, there are other reasons for the administratum to not use computers, like the fact the Imperium computers can be attacked by scrapcode, so imagine that you need to protect billions of interconnected computers from hacking by scrapcode. Which is also why administrating the Imperium which would require billions of computers that would cost a lot of resources to maintain just to crunch numbers while the Imperium is already stretched thin. And if the Tau empire was a couple thousand years old institution that had to manage like half the galaxy it too would suffer from bloat and mistakes costing millions of lifes.
The genocide of xenos. Well if they couldnt stand against the Imperium of Man they would have never stood a chance against the other factions. And yes hindsight is 20/20 maybe the Empire shouldnt have killed them. But also if a god like entity which brought your species from total collapse told you that you had to kill xenos in order for your people to ascend would you refuse to do it? The same way, if the Tau leadership decided one day to simply rid their empire of other races for the greater good would the brainwashed Tau people say no?
And dont the actions of Tau empire validate Imperium of Man's xenophobia in the first place? The moment the Tau could, they started influencing Imperial planets and annexed them into their empire.
Well i just used Eldar as an example that they werent good either but i can also say that creating Slaneesh and causing the eye if terror to manifest due to their hedonism was evil too.
And well, Imperium of Man's most widespread and bountiful resource are people, of course they will use them most in their existential struggle.
Tau Empire is straight up an apartheid state bro, sorry to break your bubble, the entire empire is designed in a way that places Tau above all else, it is a strictly hierarchical society, aliens like Kroot have their autonomy and such but are still completly subordinate to the Tau. This would be like saying that the Bantustans in South Africa and the fact that the white ruling minority interacted all the time with the black population meant that South Africa was not an apartheid state, and the black population was also a pillar of south african society wasnt it? They were employed the most in jobs which required least skill, so the respurce sector, that didnt mean they were equal to the ruling white minority. The etherals also literally use mind control to stop dissent. So YET again yes, Tau empire is an apartheid state that is using brainwashing. And Tau have the great diplomats of the water caste so of course they manage to convince planetary governors. The entire empire is also similarly to the Imperium of Man ruled by an elitist oligarchy which justifies its existance by saying that they are doing it for the greater good.
While the Tau empire is "equal" some races are more equal than others.
Lol
abermea@reddit
Mass Effect keeps winning
YorkPorkWasTaken@reddit
Andromeda >>>>> Veilguard
Admirable-Ad-5026@reddit
I didn't watch both new movies of avatar but who is she and does she really fucks humans in the movie ?
THEzwerver@reddit
She's the bad guy, she felt 'betrayed' by the Avatar God because of her inaction when she called for help to save her village from a natural disaster.
She finds the other antagonist (human villain that got turned into a permanent Avatar), as they both have common motives. he provides her with human weapons and they later do drugs and fuck.
Absolutemehguy@reddit
https://i.redd.it/6xmqecnjikug1.gif
Its_aTrap@reddit
She's the new sexy alien who wants to kill everyone
She doesn't fuck humans
Admirable-Ad-5026@reddit
Literally unwatchable
fenian1798@reddit
Saying she "doesn't fuck humans" is kind of a technicality. Without going too deep into the lore, her bf is an alien-human hybrid who is racist as fuck against the aliens. And she fucks him (and vice versa) even though she's 100% alien.
eutectic_h8r@reddit
He-She-We_Wumbo@reddit
Smooth_Maul@reddit
That line art and general style is giving me Vietnam style flashbacks
Drafo7@reddit
Do I want to know?
Smooth_Maul@reddit
Notorious paedophile Shadman had a shockingly similar art style. There's rumours he's tried to come back under different monikers but always slips up and gets caught, this very much looks like something he'd draw.
TheCheeseBroker@reddit
Tbf that's an adult ~~women~~ alien so there a high chance it not him.
Drafo7@reddit
Fuck I had a feeling it would be a pedo thing.
tygabeast@reddit
He's back.
Smooth_Maul@reddit
dancarbonell00@reddit
Reminds me of UP!
Smooth_Maul@reddit
I was talking about how he was drawn, it reminds me of someone else.
Section8firearms@reddit
She runs a fire cult that rejects the spirit tree. She mind rapes the other aliens. She fucks a colonialist human skin walker. And she doses people with space LSD.
SuperSocialMan@reddit
...yet.
NVRGP22@reddit
I miss when aliens were either hyper deadly or more advanced than us, and the real question was how we should improve instead of colonialism
Chomps-Lewis@reddit
I feel like the Predators aliens are solidly the bad guys
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
They are, but they're also a form of social commentary on humans hunting wild animals for sport. So the Predators are the bad guys, but they're effectively a stand-in for something humans do irl.
Chomps-Lewis@reddit
So?
Real-Ad-1728@reddit
This is part of why, in my opinion at least, the movie version of Starship Troopers failed to sufficiently satirize fascism and a bunch of people continue to miss the point.
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
They needed to make it clear in some way that Buenos Aires was intentionally allowed to be destroyed, then the satire would work. As things stand, it's not unreasonable to believe "militarism is preferable to annihilation".
Visible_Grocery4806@reddit
What do you mean by saying that it's not unreasonable to believe that militarism is preferae to annihilation?
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
Would you rather live under a militaristic government that nonetheless falls short of being totalitarian
Or
Get eaten by the bugs
Because the movie never actually proves that the government is deliberately prolonging/deepening the war, this is a legitimate question and it means the war is justified.
Visible_Grocery4806@reddit
Yes lmao? I would obviously prefer to live under militarist goverrnment lol? Even the supposedly fascist and evil government in Starship troopers is shown to have politicians facing consequences for their incompetence like the sky marshal resigning after the failed invasion of Klendathu. And the fuck does "falls short of being totalitarian" mean? The movie dosent show any authoritarian measures employed by the government. The only thing that might be shown is an omnipresent censorship and control over the media by the government. Oh maybe the requirement of a certificate to have babies is a definitive sign of authoritarianism. But i really fails to see any sort of totalitarianism in the movie.
So im not sure if your question was supposed to tell me that getting eaten by bugs is the better option.
Th34sa8arty@reddit
Nonexistent_Purpose@reddit
Independence Day
PrrrromotionGiven1@reddit
In The Ur-Quan Masters, the aliens are the old school imperialists and humans are the colonial subjects for a change
Chodor101@reddit
Anon is right on the money, I want media where we are the good guys in comparison but aliens aren't comically evil... invincible is first thing that comes to mind. So do that but with more than 3 fps.
Comradepatsy@reddit
Lets be honest, these ayy lmaos have been steeling people and experimenting on them and probulating their booties. We will be totally justified in stealing their space oil.
kader91@reddit
I know for a fact humans will try to fuck aliens either if they’re fuckable or not.
PredatorAvPFan@reddit
I like the art style. Anyone know the artist
AHighAchievingAutist@reddit
Yep
sloothor@reddit
Do you feel me throbbing against the walls of your colon?
AHighAchievingAutist@reddit
Is it in yet?
Bad_Routes@reddit
Anon is mad at that the oversaturated evil aliens genre isn't even more overly saturated
Resident_Monk_4493@reddit
Blue Dances with Wolves
CasulWrecker@reddit
Motherfucker half of the movies (and even more video games) that represent alien life inside they are depicted as all consuming monsters.
QuinnAvery89@reddit
StarCraft was peak.
KnownAsAnother@reddit
Do me like you do your earth girls Jake Sully!
Aggravating-Ad6415@reddit
Brother's looking for some actual plot in the Avatar moview
Nerdic-King2015@reddit
bigbadbillyd@reddit
I don't care. I'll never see the humans as the bad guys in Avatar. Terra Firma, baby! I need the unobtanium. I need the psychic whale juice. They weren't doing shit with the planet anyway.
Luv me 'umans Luv me industry 'ate de aliens Not racist just don't like 'em. Simple as.
SillySnail66@reddit
When the subversion of a trope becomes a trope
Panophobia_senpai@reddit
mahk99@reddit
The biggest movie in theaters right now is about a human selflessly saving civilizations
Britwit_@reddit
“Humans are always the villain”
Pictured: alien villain
TheRedditK9@reddit
Also like I’m pretty sure there are fucking millions of movies where aliens invade Earth and are the villains
Hitmanty_@reddit
The OG alien story is war of the world's after all
undreamedgore@reddit
Only after they got rid of thr humans who were just trying to mine.
BrussianPlue@reddit
gotta keep tradition
OptimisticGlory@reddit
Being racist or sexist is cringe, I’m human supremacist until the day I die. Alien cheeks are gay.
THEPIGWHODIDIT@reddit
ET had none of this shit
gary-cuckoldman@reddit
They should make a video game where there’s zombies everiwher but humans are the real monsters (at least the Shufflers are easy to predict)
zman419@reddit
Being sick of "art having a message " is just telling on yourself