Pickled broccoli slaw fizzes when I shake it
Posted by Jesus-slaves@reddit | shittyfoodporn | View on Reddit | 77 comments
I added broccoli slaw (broccoli, carrots, red cabbage) into leftover pickle juice. I use this when I make tuna salad. This is the first batch that is fizzing. Smells fine. Wish me luck.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
Did you just add the raw veggies to the pickle juice or did you briefly boil the mixture and then cool it? If you did the former, it won’t be a proper quick pickle and may ferment in ways that will make it unsafe to eat. The fizz is CO2 byproduct of either the food going bad or (possibly) safe fermentation.
distressed_@reddit
This is wrong. You can absolutely add vinegar to veg and stick in the fridge. Fridge being key here.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
Vinegar also being key. Jarred pickle brine is not pure vinegar. It’s 1:1 water to vinegar.
distressed_@reddit
Which is exactly the ratio you need to prevent bacterial growth.
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
Good to know! I’ve been putting the raw slaw into pickle juice for about a month now and letting a handful sit over night/a couple days just for flavor in the tuna salad. This time, I really packed it in there and added some salt. No boiling.
spargel_gesicht@reddit
Hm. I want a pickle now.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
For the full technique for a quick pickle: prepare and season your pickling liquid, prepare the produce (thin slices is ideal, which you seem to have done), bring the pickling liquid to a boil, add your produce, return to a boil and quickly remove from heat and cool as quickly as possible (helps to keep the produce crisp and crunchy instead of cooking too much and becoming soft). To quickly cool, have a large bowl of ice water on hand and transfer the pickled veggies from the pot into a bowl that will fit into the bowl with ice water. Stir occasionally until cool.
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
Thank you! I might should add this experiment to the compost and try again.
Pez-@reddit
Don't forget to sterilise the jar as well.
I tend to wash as hot as possible, then dry in an open oven at a very low temperature.
Skepsis93@reddit
Simply washing with hot water may not be enough to eliminate all potential pathogens, so I hope you are drying in the oven at or above 100C or 212F for your low temperature.
Whenever I jar foods I boil the jars in water for several minutes, no real need to dry the inside as most of the residual water will turn to steam and evaporate away during 10-15 minutes I let them sit before pouring in whatever I'm preserving.
Pez-@reddit
You're right. When I said "very hot" I meant boiling, but avoided saying so because I didn't want someone to scald themselves following that advice.
Foolish and self-defeating, so thank you for pointing that out.
Eriiiii@reddit
me? i just eat the jar in 10 days while keeping it in the fridge. If its good enough for a broccoli salad its good enough covered in vinegar
OGBRedditThrowaway@reddit
Ice wands also work.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
Very true. A frozen water bottle or two is an easy way to cool stocks and soups, and in this case, pickles.
larkspur82@reddit
Sounds like youre doing a short fermentation which produces co2.
bjorneylol@reddit
It likely won't ferment in a way that renders it unsafe to eat - the only pathogens that grow in an anaerobic environments like this are like, clostridium (botulism) and listeria, neither of which can survive in acidic solutions, and commercial pickle brine is 1 step removed from vinegar.
It will, absolutely ferment in a way that makes the sealed container it's stored in unsafe to handle without risking losing a hand to exploding glass
LonnieJaw748@reddit
I wouldn’t be too confident in saying OP has created an anaerobic environment. Unless they submerged the jar in boiling water for 15-20 minutes. And it definitely doesn’t sound like they did that. And whatever bacteria or food spoilage that’s going on in there to cause the carbonation, will most likely only give them the shits for a few days. The point of my post was to not gamble on food prepared this way. It could be mildly unsafe and make them a little sick, or it could be (low probability) rather dangerous. Either way, it’s not worth it when there’s a better technique to do this that will be much safer.
Le_Nabs@reddit
Anaerobic means without oxygen (air), it has nothing to do with whether it's sterilized or not (that'd be sanitized or aseptic)
LonnieJaw748@reddit
No you doof, submerged it in boiling water after filling and sealing it to use the heat to create a vacuum within the jar —> hence, an anaerobic environment.
Le_Nabs@reddit
Sorry, wasn't thinking of that at all since the post is about a quick pickle, not a preserve pickle
LonnieJaw748@reddit
I should’ve explained better. I was only trying to consider how OP could have made anaerobic conditions with their… “setup”.
Ikora_Rey_Gun@reddit
you don't know shit about fuck
bjorneylol@reddit
What OP did is literally just called lacto-fermentation. It's how yogurt, kimchi, sauerkraut, kefir, miso, etc have been made for hundreds/thousands of years (yes, even modern commercial products, which do the same thing, only they add the dregs of the previous batch to the subsequent batch to speed up fermentation and more tightly control the dominant microbial species).
You put your vegetables in a weak salt/acid brine and let it sit with an air-lock that lets gas out without letting outside air in. The only things that can grow in these conditions are yeast, lactobacillus, and acetobacter - they outcompete/kill any other microbes that are weakened by the conditions of the initial brine. As long as it's covered the CO2 produced by fermentation will displace the oxygen in the vessel (it's denser) leading to a predominantly anaerobic environment. Trace amounts of oxygen get consumed by the yeast for reproduction.
I can't think of a conceivable way how you could get sick doing this.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
There’s no acid in a brine when making lactofermented foods. It’s just salt water. The beneficial bacteria you’re cultivating in the brine are what make acids via metabolic byproducts and thereby lower the pH of the brine, which fosters the environment that the bacteria prefer and also preserves your food.
And you certainly can get sick doing this if it’s not properly carried out. Mainly, by various molds, fungi and harmful yeasts taking up residence in your pickle and producing toxic byproducts of their metabolic processes.
I would never suggest that a lactofermented food will be inherently safe. It takes a skilled and knowledgeable person to assure the safety of these items.
bjorneylol@reddit
Adding acid prior to fermentation (for the reasons I've already mentioned) is the norm for sour beers, some cheeses, and many types of pickles (e.g. turşu)
Le_Nabs@reddit
?
Most sour beers I know fully rely on either acetic or lactic fermentation, depending on the type. They absolutely do not add an acidifying agent
bjorneylol@reddit
Yes they do. It's common to add a tiny bit of lactic acid to get the pH down to 4.5 prior to souring as it prevents non-desirable bacterias from growing and producing off flavors before the lactobacillus takes hold. This is especially common in styles that don't pitch pure bacterial strains (e.g. lambics or anything wild fermented where enterobacter is part of the equation).
This is in addition to the tiny bit of lactic acid they actually add prior to mashing, as you need to drop the pH down to about 5.4 or so for peak activity of the amylase enzymes that break down the starches in the barley.
Source: brewer
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
This makes me feel better bc I can hear air escape from the jar lid. I got this idea reading about kimchi. It’s all been in my fridge the entire time.
bjorneylol@reddit
If you are keeping it in the fridge you have nothing to worry about, as long as you are opening it before the pressure gets too high. Alternatively they sell air-lock lids for mason jars that let it vent by itself.
You can dilute vinegar by like 50-200x before the pH gets high enough for bad stuff to grow in it
Elliethesmolcat@reddit
It's prison wine at this point.
LonnieJaw748@reddit
Just about!
Intrepid_Fact_7154@reddit
putting raw veggies in pickle juice is rly like trying to teach a cat to fetch, could be cool but highkey a disaster waiting to happen
LonnieJaw748@reddit
Exactly. Maybe for a short marinade, but I wouldn’t leave them in there for days and use them up a little at a time. At the least it would taste like poop since it’s just slowly decomposing veggies. At the worst you might be cultivating harmful bacteria and eating them, then getting sick.
chalks777@reddit
Usually when people say "quick pickle" they literally mean "put raw veggies in some brine". That's the definition. There are many different kinds of brine that you can use and it's totally fine for a month or two refrigerated. Anything that requires boiling, or anything canned, or anything that needs fermentation... is not "quick pickling".
Everything else you said is more or less accurate though. I wouldn't recommend eating a quick pickle that fizzed when the jar opened (though I have and would probably do it again lol)
AskMeWhyIFish@reddit
Why don't they just call it a quickle?
LonnieJaw748@reddit
I suppose they could!
WiglyWorm@reddit
It's absolutely fermenting but you don't know if it's good or not. If you're not doing LACTOFERMENATION you could be breading something really nasty.
Either boil it next time, or... since you seem to like slaw... you can easily lactoferment slaw in that same mason jar. Just make sure you find a known safe recipe. Canning and fermenting is a science, not an art.
granadesnhorseshoes@reddit
Its almost assuredly lactobacillus from the red cabbage. Not assuredly enough that i would eat it, but I'd wager 5 bucks in a bar bet.
WiglyWorm@reddit
But is there enough is it getting acidic enough, is there bacteria?
Op says they're shaking it so any surface mold would be mixed in. No way I'd touch it in a million years.
skronk61@reddit
Why did you use old pickling juice? It’s not magically resistant against bacteria and contaminants just because it’s a preservative.
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
I read somewhere you can put veggies into your remaining pickle juice from store bought pickles and get pickled veggies. Ran with it. Someone here has now explained I needed to quick boil the veggies.
I actually haven’t tried any from this jar yet. Glad I posted tho.. the fizzing seems consistent every day when I shake/burp it, nothing appears to be growing, and it smells like pickled broccoli. I was about to try it 😬
ChoomChoomTheGuy@reddit
I highly suggest just getting a big thing of pickling spice from Amazon. I never hard boil my pickling stuff, I just get it hot and I’ve never had an issue but don’t take my word for it. I’ve microwaved salty water before for a minute and got away with that too. Experiment with what ratio of salt/vinegar you like. You’ll get better results, the only time I’ve gotten something gross growing in a jar was trying to use leftover brine from store pickles.
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
I still really want to try this. I’ve never had food poisoning and I (obviously, I reckon) eat some questionable stuff. But I’m not, gonna toss it and follow some of the great advice I’ve gotten!
Sea-Drawer9867@reddit
It's fermenting. If you add salt and some water to raw vegetables they will naturally ferment/get broken down by bacteria/yeast and pickle. Since you got to this stage of fermentation basically on accident, there is a chance you could get sick from eating your vegetables. Basically because if the fermentation is weak and poorly controlled, there is a much higher chance for bad bacteria to get in there. I'm not saying you will get sick, but there is a risk there.
tieme@reddit
Home lacto fermentation is extremely safe and deaths or illnesses from it are extremely rare. It's safe because the lacto fermentation lowers the ph to a point where most things cannot grow, including botulism which is the primary risk with home preservation. The few things that can still survive in that type of environment and are unsafe to eat also produce off flavors or visible clues like black colored mold.
Pickle juice from leftover store bought pickles is going to be a much lower ph than a home lacto fermentation. I wouldn't use it for batch after batch as it will get weaker each time, but using it once or twice is not really a risk. Any further fermentation is just going to continue lowering that ph.
llcdrewtaylor@reddit
Kimchi!
Chucktayz@reddit
Fermentation of some sort
Critical-Comment6114@reddit
Literally... youre fine. Keep the pH below 4.6 and keep it refrigerated and youre fine. Just periodically add some extra vinegar and salt. The yeasts on your veggies metabolize more slowly in the fridge making light carbonation. pH control is an insanely effective preservative, thats why we have been pickling and fermenting since the dawn of agriculture.
so_it_goes17@reddit
M on
RetroSwamp@reddit
Now I'm worried I'm killing myself. I've been reusing pickle juice left over to pickle onions and jalapenos. I was told it was ok if nothing is above the brine line. Ohh no
queenlizbef@reddit
Yes that’s correct!
RetroSwamp@reddit
ok good to know!
queenlizbef@reddit
It fermented, but not all fermented food is safe
Doctor_Saved@reddit
Maybe should ask in the pickling subreddit.
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
It’s fine. It’s carbon dioxide.
sabotag3@reddit
Fizz in food is always carbon dioxide, it’s a byproduct of fermentation (unless it was intentionally added). What’s dangerous is what’s causing that fermentation
Dunstund_CHeks_IN@reddit
ASK PICKLING SUBREDDIT
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
Done.
sharkattax@reddit
why is this so funny
NiobiumThorn@reddit
Seems like they're celebrating
joziboom789@reddit
Hear me out...
seXJ69@reddit
Do not the jar
TikiJeff@reddit
I think you made broccoli sauerkraut, or kimchi
Fine-Upstairs-6284@reddit
It’s lacto fermenting. That’s normal
WiglyWorm@reddit
without following a known safe recipe and getting your ratios correct you have no idea if it's lactofermentation or not.
indieplants@reddit
please, you don't know if it's good fermentation or bad. it could be contaminated
Global-Reindeer7364@reddit
It's the vinegar. Totally fine, still edible. Your salt portion may have been off, but not harmful. Let it sit a little longer than expected it's gonna be very tangy/flavorful
PreferenceAnxious449@reddit
Bro is making a nuke
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
This is how we evolved.
onionleekdude@reddit
Blend the whole jar and chug it.
nr4242@reddit
It's called lacto-fermentation and it's a good thing
This_Price_1783@reddit
One thing to note, when using liquid from something that has already been pickled, is that some of the salt, vinegar and other things have already been used in the original pickle and replaced with water from the vegetables. This means the salt content and acid level might be insufficient for a 2nd round. I usually add a bit of distilled vinegar and some extra salt to it, and be sure to boil it first.
Sure-String-122@reddit
Don’t you have to do the burping thing?
reedzkee@reddit
Its fermenting
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
I sure hope so. My whole kitchen smells like pickle rn
DnDeez_Nutz@reddit
2000 pieces. What do we win if we're right?
Jesus-slaves@reddit (OP)
You win my next science project pickles!