Subaru’s Outback SUV Overhaul Wiped Out A Third Of Its Buyers In One Quarter

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Redeemed_Expert9694@reddit (OP)

Subaru's sales are down, but

The Outback is controversial

The Impreza is mid

The Ascent is proudly worst in class

Aside from the Forster and Crosstrek, none of their main lineup is particularly noteworthy.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

You forgot the WRX - not particularly sporty, either.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

The key thing about the WRX is that it is absolutely the best WRX on the market.

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psaux_grep@reddit

Corolla GR seems to tickle a lot of the same areas.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I can't see well out of them. The sight lines aren't designed for people over about six feet.

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BayLAGOON@reddit

Gotta kill fitty men to do that, but by that point you're getting into a Cadillac car.

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hx87@reddit

People get surgery to add inches, why don't they get surgery to remove inches?

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Zealousideal-Taro976@reddit

For way more $$$, + overheating issues + no real room for tuning + dogshit interior. WRX is way better value for the $$$

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TheEdinburghMule@reddit

Cap - GR Corolla is the best WRX on the market

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Maybe if you're under 6' tall. The sight lines in the Corolla are terrible for very tall people unless you tilt the seat way, way back.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I mean, yes, but 100% of the market that is me, and not being able to see out of the car is a pretty quick nope when you go for a test drive!

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danny_ish@reddit

I’m shocked you wouldn’t consider buying one and installing a drop bracket for the seat. I’m short I plan on most of my cars needing either a seat riser or pedal extensions.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I’m not really interested in cars that have to be made non-stock to be functional 🤷‍♂️

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vaultdweller1223@reddit

Probably less likely to grenade as well

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Zealousideal-Taro976@reddit

What a bad take. The FA24 is a tuners dream. The transmission will go way before the engine. People are getting to around 400 hp before needing to upgrade internals.

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vaultdweller1223@reddit

I said the GR is less likely to grenade than the WRX

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teakwoodtile@reddit

You're right lol. AWD, manual (if you care) and faster than my former Si was enough to get me to buy one. Great car for daily duties - just lacks a bit of an edge.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Yup, hugs corners, turbo boost is fun, holds a load of groceries, fits child seats or, for short trips, adults in the back, lets you feel like you're Petter Solberg.

And honestly, the CVT in semiauto sequential paddleshifter mode is really underrated. Probably because most people who would use it a lot just buy the manual, and because it is just different enough from a true manual to be awkward until you've driven the car for a few hours.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

I know it’s sacrilege to criticize le manuel around here, but the 6 speed in the wrx is a pretty crappy transmission. The wrx platform in general is better suited to the cvt, the car’s not an EVO clone with a Nissan CVT, it’s more like a lower scale 3 series with almost 300 hp.

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OMGitsTista@reddit

~235 hp at the wheels. It’s unfortunately pretty slow for its heritage and the lack of STi trim made a lot of people upset. There’s just better cars in the segment if you’re looking at stock for stock. A basic tune changes that entirely though.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

235 at the wheels is 276hp at the crank. It’s plenty of power.

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OMGitsTista@reddit

Most manufacturers listed horsepower is much closer to their wheel horsepower these days. I’m just saying it’s one of the lower powered cars in the segment off the assembly line. The passing power leaves a lot to be desired as it falls flat on its face in mid to higher RPM ranges. All the power is down low. It’s also a pretty low number in 2026

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GoBSAGo@reddit

It was a much better buy at $25k base when I bought mine in 2017. Ridiculous at $37k last year.

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danny_ish@reddit

Hate to tell you this, but those values are the same. Mor

Inflation has caused that, go look at a cpi calculator. $27,000 in 2017 is $36,363 today.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

Inflation, sure. Wages? Not so much.

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danny_ish@reddit

I agree with you, but I make it a goal to check my income against inflation every year. Every 2-3 years I aim for a promotion of to jump ship, no way I am letting myself not keep up and keep ahead of inflation

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GoBSAGo@reddit

I have a similar approach, and it really bugs me that I manage to keep growing but am not graduating from Subaru money to Mercedes money.

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danny_ish@reddit

Fair enough. I earn now 20% more then I did 7 years ago, adjusted for inflation. I went from used hyundai money to used ford money.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

Half the blame for me is on the unbalanced economy, the other half is my choice to have two kids.

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bwrxa@reddit

The power curve in the VB WRX is smooth and linear. There are no dips or point where it "falls flat." Have you actually driven one?

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OMGitsTista@reddit

I own a 23 premium.

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bwrxa@reddit

Yeah and I own a 23 base. I havent noted any torque dips at all. Thats a VA WRX issue

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OMGitsTista@reddit

Maybe I’m spoiled by my previous cars but, to me, after the initial pull to 30 it definitely lets you ease forward with almost no resistance. Downshifting to pass on the highway also feels uneventful going from 50-70.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

This does not jive with my experience with the car at all.

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bwrxa@reddit

How is it pretty slow for its heritage? WRX's were always a 5 second 0-60 car and the current gen is just that. Better cars in the segment based on what exactly? If you're looking for a modern AWD manual turbo sedan then you dont have any other option.

My '23 base WRX was a huge steal at less than $30,000 brand new off the lot. There is no other car in its segment that I could have gotten brand new at that price.

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OMGitsTista@reddit

That high performance value car with a stiffer suspension and violent takeoff. Something that keeps up with much more expensive cars. A 5 second 0-60 was great in the late 2000s and even 2010s but these days it’s not as impressive. If you are looking very very specifically for an AWD sedan with a manually then yeah there aren’t really options. That’s not what segment means though. Other performance oriented sedans in the price range all outperform the wrx in one way or another. I’m not saying it’s a terrible car or a bad value. I’m saying stock for stock it has fallen a bit behind. Slap a basic tune on it and it’s suddenly an incredible value though.

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narcistic_asshole@reddit

235 is kinda on the low end from what I've seen. SavageGeese got 248whp when they dynoed the WRX, most stock WRX baseline dynos are in the 245-255whp range, though by itself a peak whp value doesn't mean much since they vary so much dyno to dyno

They do see a significant amount of drivetrain loss compared to their competitors though.

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Suck_dick_for_karma@reddit

Civic Si has an amazing transmission, better fit and finish, and is the epitome of slow car fast. More fun to drive than my 05 WRX, except in the snow.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

As a former Si owner for years - slow car fast is still slow ;)

AWD and ride quality are worth it alone - also next to no revhang.

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Suck_dick_for_karma@reddit

I would have considered a WRX if I didn’t commute 600 miles per week. As a former WRX owner I prefer the Si but in all fairness it’s brand new Honda vs older gen Subie

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teakwoodtile@reddit

Complete opposite situation for me, funny how things work. The new Si looks fantastic, shame they no longer offer 🟧

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SophistXIII@reddit

Wild take.

The MT in the WRX isn't anything to write home about, but it's not terrible either. If you're really fussy there's lots of aftermarket solutions to make it better.

The CVT in the VAs was pretty much universally panned, though. The FA20 has such a weird powerband you really need a MT to take advantage of it.

The worst part of the VA MT experience wasn't the shifter, but the rev hang. But I still can't imagine driving that platform with even a good DCT, never mind a rubberband CVT.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

The CVT locks out at 12mph and has absolutely no rubber banding. You should try one. The VA uses the same TR690 transmission as the VB.

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SophistXIII@reddit

I did try one before I bought my MT 2018 WRX because it was the only WRX the dealer had on the lot at the time.

I found it very laggy and unresponsive. It just wasn't a good combination with that motor.

I hear the VBs are better with the FA24, but I haven't driven one.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Can confirm, VA vs VB is night and day with the CVT

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Chippy569@reddit

The WRX CVT also uses the fancier VTD center diff, which isn't found in any other Subaru CVT.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

Couldn't agree more about everything.

The manual fan boys can't seem to wrap their heads around the 50:50 torque split in the standard WRX transmission and how that doesn't help the car's tendency to understeer everywhere.

The STI 6 speed is allegedly licensed from Porsche. It's buttery smooth, much stronger than the WRX transmission, and attached to the DCCD center diff. Everything about it is great. Sadly, I don't think we'll ever see it again.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

I will say, my VB has next to no revhang compared to my 2010 Si. That car had a slick shifter but absolutely abhorrent rev hang. New ones are no better, apparently.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Don't let the people in r/WRX hear you, lol. They have the world's biggest hate-boner for the CVT over there.

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GoBSAGo@reddit

Tell me about it.

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Vhozite@reddit

The transmission situation is the only thing keeping me out of a WRX. I didn’t care for the 6MT and the CVT just seems like it would be a bit lacking.

I really loved the rest of the car. A couple ok colors, nice utilitarian interior with a big trunk, nice gauge cluster, felt quick enough for me.

I feel like one of the few people exited to see what a hybrid WRX would be like.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I'd encourage you to test drive the CVT and use the paddles. It's a sublime driving experience.

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vaultdweller1223@reddit

If you're going CVT WRX, why not go Golf R and get generally better everything?

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beamdriver@reddit

Golf R is a lot more money?

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vaultdweller1223@reddit

Eh it's about a 5k difference between an R and a GT

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Main reasons for me:

The Golf is the most high-performing boring car on the market, and I don't want a boring car.
I hate hatchbacks. Blame it on that being the standard dad car of the early 80s when I was growing up.
The paddle shifters aren't as good.
Neither Petter Solberg nor Possum Bourne ever drove a Golf. (Though to be totally fair, Solberg raced twice in a WRC2 Polo at the end of his career.)

The simple reality is that the car I've wanted for over 25 years has been a WRX. If I drove a Golf, I'd always be thinking about how I didn't have a WRX.

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vaultdweller1223@reddit

I can respect that even if I disagree on it being boring. The heart wants what the heart wants.

Though I will say you can replace the paddles and at the end of the day you have a lightening quick dual clutch.

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No-Necessary7135@reddit

> Petter Solberg

That name made me horned up for WRX's for _decades_

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

His son Oliver is very very good. 24 or 25. Races for Toyota Gazoo and got a full time ride in WRC1 this year.

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Op3rat0rr@reddit

I know it’s bad to say on here but the Subaru performance CVT is just fine on public roads

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teakwoodtile@reddit

Plus with the CVT you get the 45/55 torque split.

I love the room and general comfort as well. 2 years in and it's surprising how far Subaru leaned into improving the livability of the car, given this is the sporty model.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Yup. Got mine six weeks ago during the 0% model end clearout and it's everything I hoped it would be and more. Got to drive it on summer tires for the first time yesterday and it was so much fun.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

Yup. Got mine six weeks ago during the 0% model end clearout and it's everything I hoped it would be and more. Got to drive it on summer tires for the first time yesterday and it was so much fun.

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Hayce@reddit

The problem with the WRX is it can’t live up to its own hype IMO. It’s been so built up as the ultimate enthusiasts daily driver for so many years. When I test drove one I was super excited, then kind of like “that’s it?” I then bought the Focus ST, which gave me the exact feeling I was looking for from the WRX.

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tagman375@reddit

I was trying to decide on a fun track day car, and test drove a new manual WRX. Frankly, it was boring and rode like an Outback. It had good power, but just wasn’t very exciting. For a car to just drive to work in, sure it would be a little fun, but you can get the same feeling from any 2.0 turbo commuter car. So I bought a ZL1 1LE Camaro instead. It’s actually fun to drive.

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AWD_OWNZ_U@reddit

Honestly the Subaru has always been that. The EVO was always a much better drivers car as were many others. The Subaru was the best one to toss down a dirt road or in the snow. I think what really happened is the WRX stayed the same and everything else.. disappeared.

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narcistic_asshole@reddit

I think the problem with the WRX is that people equate it to the sti. The regular WRX has AWD and typically has more hp than its direct competitors, but it typically isn't as dialed in as it'd FWD competitors or the more expensive sti.

I definitely had the same experience when I test drove the previous gen WRX, I ended up going with a Civic si because felt much lighter and tighter than the WRX. Coincidentally I'm test driving the current generations of both cars tomorrow so we'll see how they stack up now

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LetgomyEkko@reddit

I bought a VA cause I think the VB is hideous….

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Beer_Is_So_Awesome@reddit

The back end on the VB. Woof.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

Yes and yes

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Beer_Is_So_Awesome@reddit

*currently

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Magnus_The_Totem_Cat@reddit

But have you compared it to the WRX?

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I have!

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Redeemed_Expert9694@reddit (OP)

Honestly, I wouldn't be too surprised if the WRX and Impreza are discontinued given slow sales...

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No-Necessary7135@reddit

I just looked at some data, and it's definitely looking grim.

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xamdou@reddit

The WRX is allegedly already getting a refresh.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

I see Subaru becoming an all EV brand - outdoorsy value brand of Toyota.

I would consider an EV if I could charge at home, fwiw.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I'd like my next car to be and STI EV. I'll call it "Steve."

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teakwoodtile@reddit

I like that idea.

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

I'll be curious to see how WRX sales go this year with the Base model coming back. Killing that was a really dumb move.

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DukeSeventyOne@reddit

I don't follow the market quite like I used to.

What else was competitive with it at its price (before tariffs?)

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narcistic_asshole@reddit

The rest of the segment is basically:

Civic si: nice interior, awesome driver inputs, but noticeably slower than the rest

gti: pretty competent all around, but no manual

Elantra N: by far the fastest car in the segment, though there's some fuckery with the engine management

WRX: only AWD option, decent power, more polished than previous generations, but less polished than the rest of the segment

If you get into the upper trims it's starts lining up in price with the GR Corolla and Civic Type R, both of which offer better performance, especially since Subaru doesn't make the sti anymore

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teakwoodtile@reddit

Nothing for me really - it's why I bought one.

A base model was cheaper than a Civic Si in 2024.

Could be a little less mature for a car of this class, but on the whole, it's a nice package.

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WillOTheSlime@reddit

At some point we all need to pitch in for group therapy for the average r/cars user because some of yall need to encounter reality

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teakwoodtile@reddit

To be fair, drove 8th gens for 10+ years before selling my last Si to buy a VB. Set a high bar. No revhang is so sweet though, Subaru nailed that.

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blazbluecore@reddit

They murdered the WRX.

The current management at Subaru are actual monkeys.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

Hahaha I don't know about murder, more moderately wound. They focused on making it appeal to a Crosstrek buyer by making it ride better, have more space and added plastic. Surprise a few years later - Crosstrek buyers did not buy more WRXs

Reviewers panned it for this reason, which made it cheap and easy for me to buy brand new!

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BetLeast4943@reddit

Sure it is... so fun to drive.

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EfficientTourist7480@reddit

Compared to older gen’s the latest is not very exciting and the sti is gone, I personally think it’s the appearance

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OllieFromCairo@reddit

The VB is probably the best-driving iteration of the car.

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BetLeast4943@reddit

Which is also fine. Its not an ugly car by any means. I've driven a VA and I think the VB is a much better drive. No rev hang and a better more even power band. I dont like the gearing on the new one though, the should have done 3.73 or something.

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teakwoodtile@reddit

It's pretty fun, I think I need a Miata to compliment it.

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Poobistank@reddit

And the BRZ!

While the BRZ is the less popular of the twins, it is available to actually order a build from Subaru, rather than Toyota's horrible system of hope.

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Larcye@reddit

Biggest reason why I won't even think about buying anything from Toyota. Zero reason why I can't walk into a dealership and order the exact car I want and wait 6-8 months for said car. Instead I'm told "Well we might get that color in but chances are you won't get the trim level you want..."

Fuck off with that shit.

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erbot@reddit

Its fine for mass market cars like Corollas or Rav4. Its just terrible for enthusiasts, and even then good dealerships will help source what you want.

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hx87@reddit

Especially since factory order is the default way of buying a new Toyota in Japan. If they can do it in the home country then why not here?

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Aerospaced0ut@reddit

Yeah it's more expensive, though. Yes a couple things are standard that are part of options packages with the Yota, but even after you add those features the Yota is still cheaper. It's basically a 5% tax to get the BRZ body.

It's also a shame they never put a turbo motor into it, imo. I know Toyota doesn't want to cannibalize Supra sales, but the BRZ could really use an extra 50-100HP and that would still put it well below the Supra in power which is pretty conservatively rated at 380HP.

It seems so easy from the outside looking in... 325HP "Sti" version of the Toyobaru, put the S58 into the Supra for a new top spec and sell thousands more cars. Or if BMW doesn't want to share the S58... Put a more aggressive tune on the B58 for an extra 50HP or so, that motor can handle that just fine.

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Poobistank@reddit

As an owner of a BRZ tS, honestly, the power is right. Any more power, and the costs would go up (initial, maintenance, consumables etc.), defeating the purpose of the car. If you want the same car with more power, the aftermarket is there.

And for many people, any extra on-paper costs are justified by being able to actually order the car you want. And many dealers are willing to work with determined buyers, because of the whole, ya know, slumping sales thing and all.

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Aerospaced0ut@reddit

I think the incremental cost increase would be worth it. It's the reason people bought the STI over the base WRX. Yeah the maintenance costs were 50% or more higher vs the base, but it was competing with muscle cars and exotics. The base BRZ is fine, but if you offered me the keys to that or an S2000 I'd take the S2000 keys every time, and I own one. It's underpowered for the modern era... Handles good but it's not mind blowingly good. S2000 you can get for $12-25K (I know I'm about to sell mine), so you've got competition. I'd take the keys to a Miata over it, too. That sells like crap, too, because nobody wants a vert these days, but it's just a lighter, better car.

My buddy just bought the Yota version, it's fine. It's not special, though. 320HP or so, that car becomes special. Bring on the down votes (I know they're coming) but the bland sales are because the offering is pretty bland in 2026. Even the GR Supra with the 3L B58 is pretty bland out of the box when the C8 exists and barely costs more. They're missing the target with the BRZ/GR86/Supra and all the "driver's car" and "sublime communication" (and "stick") in the world can't justify the lack of power. It's a 1965 Mustang with the slant six. It needs the "V8".

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Poobistank@reddit

What is the competitor at this price point? Mustang’s are much bigger cars, and I don’t believe you can get the EcoBoost in a manual anymore. Miata’s are convertible only and much much smaller; I literally do not fit in them.

For Toyota (the driving force behind the twins, let’s face it) to want to rock a very steady boat, with the result being they are competing with their other RWD sports car, I don’t see why they would ever allow a significantly faster version.

Your comparison to an S2000 is a weird one to me. It’s an enthusiast legend, but is quite an old car at this point. Most people shopping the new twin platform probably aren’t cross shopping it with an S2000. That comparison might make more sense with the first one I suppose.

If you don’t mind buying used, you can get a low miles tS BRZ for $32kish. For the driving experience, it is hard to complain with. For reference, in the past few years I’ve had a GR Corolla and a Z4M Coupe. I got the Corolla to replace the Coupe, and ended up not liking the Corolla because it didn’t make me smile like my old car. Flash forward to today and my tS is 80% of the smiles of the BMW with (ironically for the twins) way more reliability and way way lower running costs.

To me, that’s what the new Twins offer. Thank you for coming to my ted talk.

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Aerospaced0ut@reddit

The competitors are mostly used, or a different form factor. Miata, GR Corolla / CTR, yeah, Mustang Ecoboost, and even the 2L Supra to a decent extent. Golf GTI, too, I guess. Miata for those that fit (totally get it's smaller). I drove an Ecoboost Mustang for a weekend fwiw, and thought it was overall a better package than the toyobaru. Used you've got Corvettes, Boxsters, Caymans at the $35K+ price point, used Supras, Camaro SS honestly shouldn't be out of consideration despite the weight they were great, or an FRS/BRZ that's down 20-30HP that you can mod right back to the base HP. If you go older there's lots of great RWD/stick combos.

S2000 is ancient at this point, for sure, but that's kinda my point. It's 2026, the BRZ should be way better than a 20yo car, but it's just not. You could also buy two for the price of one. I friggin own one, I should want to take the other car down that canyon road lol, even if it's not as good. Toyobaru is fun but it's a lesser joy... Sound, feel, emotion. It's just lacking... 50-100HP.

That's my humble opinion. I think they're great cars but just... Lacking something special. The Supra offers a bit of it, but it's also supposedly terrible in terms of visibility, and below par in terms of driver feel. The Mustang is heavy but it feels shockingly good all things considered.

Totally just IMHO and I expected to get blasted with down votes just as bad as I did last week when I dared to say modern progressive rock Tool is boring compared to classic metal Tool. It's an opinion and I can accept it's unpopular lol.

Z4M is a sweet ride, I can get that being approximately 20% better. The M cars are special. I'd love to see a special Toyobaru, it's such a great platform and chassis and it's analog in a digital age, I just want more out of it. 50-100hp more with brakes to match.

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doctorfeelgood21@reddit

Being able to show up at the dealership with a build sheet and get it at MSRP with no negotiation was why I went with the BRZ over the GR86

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EpicLegendX@reddit

Yep, but Subaru got rid of the lowest trim and became more expensive than the GR86.

Spending 35k+ on a ‘slow’ car is a hard ask when you can get plenty of faster used cars for the same price, or shell out a few thousand more for a faster new car.

You either have to like the platform, be interested in tracking, or loyal to pure lightweight sports cars to buy one.

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Mnm0602@reddit

My parents were telling me how they’re comparing the Grand Highlander and Pilot to the Ascent and I’m like good luck with that 😂

They love their Forrester they’ve had for 14 years but they also love their 8 year old Pilot and if they’re replacing the Pilot I don’t even see the point of the Ascent in the comparison.

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Redeemed_Expert9694@reddit (OP)

My honest opinion is that, as of right now, the Pathfinder is the best car in that segment.

Super reliable now that it has an automatic, better safety scores than either the Pilot or GH, and also lower priced than most of the competition. Ride comfort and seats are also basically top of the class

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Mnm0602@reddit

That class is so competitive I think the Pathfinder usually gets left out just because Nissan’s CVT rep, and honestly there’s kind of a status stigma with Nissan that’s developed as they’ve chased the low credit score crowd.

Which is funny because the Palisade and Telluride are both great options overall too and they get those customers on some of their cars but those cars are almost the “smart” choice for middle class families (death seat aside).

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GodsFavoriteDegen@reddit

there’s kind of a status stigma with Nissan that’s developed as they’ve chased the low credit score crowd.

Absolutely no one outside of perpetually online /r/cars users knows about this.

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Mnm0602@reddit

You must be smoking some good stuff to think only r/cars thinks that. You also know the minute you walk on the lot because the dumbass salesmen always start off asking what you want your monthly payment to be before they even get your name or what car you are interested in.

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cajunaggie08@reddit

It's definitely known outside of perpetually online people. Most of the Nissans in Houston Metro are driven by people who can't get credit anywhere else. There is a reason we all learn to avoid Nissan drivers with paper tags

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GodsFavoriteDegen@reddit

Most of the Nissans in Houston Metro are driven by people who can't get credit anywhere else.

[citation needed]

The average credit score spread between purchasers of different makes is far narrower than you think. Only 20 points separate Nissan and Honda.

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Mnm0602@reddit

And yet it’s all the way at the bottom right above Kia.

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Alive_Internet@reddit

That new Atlas looks really really good though. It straight up makes the GH look cheap/economy in comparison, and VW tends to strike a good balance between refinement and driving feel.

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Mnm0602@reddit

Atlas is one of the only vehicles where VW shows they “get” the US consumer.

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MaybeNext-Monday@reddit

Which is okay, because in my opinion the US consumer has miserably bad taste, and I like having an option in the US that doesn’t defile itself to cater to it.

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tagman375@reddit

If you owned a car company, you would go broke. They cater to what sells, they are in business to make money.

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MaybeNext-Monday@reddit

If the world was pudding I’d be sticky. I’m a buyer, my taste is my taste and I don’t particularly care if my taste is profitable.

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Joatboy@reddit

Yeah but Nissan....?

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Redeemed_Expert9694@reddit (OP)

I focus on models rather than brands because every brand makes atleast one shit model and almost every brands makes at least one good model

Also I've never understood the whole concept of rooting for or booing brands as if they're sports teams

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Joatboy@reddit

Yeah, but surely the corporate governance and performance of Nissan matters to some degree.

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hx87@reddit

How much does corporate performance affect me as an owner? As long as they keep the spare parts flowing and stay alive, not much.

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ChasedWarrior@reddit

The Pathfinder, along with the Pilot, have a V6 over a turbo four.

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mrshickadance412@reddit

Genuine question; what makes the Ascent pointless here?

[-]

Superlolz@reddit

It's not good at anything except have symmetrical AWD

[-]

mrshickadance412@reddit

Just the thing that keeps it on the road, lol. Mostly kidding, but if you actually plan to leave the pavement...helpful.

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tagman375@reddit

You’ll slip the CVT if you even try to take the Ascent off road

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averynicehat@reddit

Wouldn't the Ascent be due for a new model soon? It's been around a while.

[-]

Drzhivago138@reddit

Yes, it actually came a year before the previous gen Outback, in mid-2018 for the 2019 MY. And yet there's no talk of a new generation.

[-]

Mnm0602@reddit

I’m sure Subaru is in a tough spot. It was down almost 40% in 2025, the peak was 80k units in the US in 2019 now it’s less than 40k, below the XC90, and the XC90 is obviously a different class and has global demand of 100k that I don’t think the Ascent has.

[-]

coffeeshopslut@reddit

I like the idea of the Crosstrek but holy hell it takes a hybrid to match the fuel consumption of everyone else's non hybrid

[-]

PNF2187@reddit

The Crosstrek's MPG isn't that lousy for the class. 26/33 isn't special, but the CX-30 gets the same and both vehicles are running much more powerful base engines than the rest of the class. A lot of the AWD competition gets comparable numbers on weaker base engines.

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tagman375@reddit

Except the CX-40 is actually fun to drive and has 320hp and boat loads of torque. The 2.5 N.A. or hybrid Crosstrek is slow and boring.

[-]

DaBanninator@reddit

You forgot the woodland. I'm looking forward to trying that out.

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alien_believer_42@reddit

I don't understand why they would change the outback so much instead of just making sure they keep their loyal customer base. It didn't need a redesign, it needed a tolerable powertrain.

[-]

TwelveTrains@reddit

The Impreza is a great car.

[-]

psimwork@reddit

God I must be really on some drugs or something with how much people are bagging on subaru recently. I love the new outback. I think the styling is phenomenally good. In-general I feel like Subaru has come online for me in the last year or two as a company that I actually really want one of their vehicles.

My wife is currently on her.. Third? Fourth? Vehicle from them, and I've always been pretty "meh" on them as I especially thought their color options on their vehicles is pretty crap. But I LOVE their current colors.

The WRX became a serious contender for me this year when they brought back the MT. If they end up doing the hatchback in the US that they've been showing recently, I'll almost certainly end up with one.

[-]

KingMario05@reddit

The Ascent is also a popular car with a certain three letter agency. That can't be good PR, especially for Subie loyalists.

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MaybeNext-Monday@reddit

On-brand that they use Subarus to blend in but picked the single most unpopular Subaru lmfao

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KingMario05@reddit

Probably got 'em for dirt cheap, too. Subie has had to pay people to get rid of them. Perfect for DHS!

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aPerson39001C9@reddit

What’s wrong with the ascent?

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_badwithcomputer@reddit

Who knew having shitty products with shitty quality would have a negative impact on sales.

[-]

Longstreet66@reddit

Why do you believe the Ascent is worst in class?

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Professional_Dot7128@reddit

What's wrong with the Ascent? Owned one since they came out in 2019 and never looked back..

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johnedn@reddit

Could you explain more Abt the ascent, I had one as a rental not too long ago and thought it was fine, but I'm not a huge car guy, this just ended up on my feed

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007meow@reddit

Don’t forget how many cup holders the Ascent has

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Huge_World4801@reddit

This thing makes the Pontiac Aztec look like a cohesive and thoughtful design

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TheMatt561@reddit

Don't change what people like

[-]

Realtrain@reddit

All they needed to do was an interior refresh where they overhaul the absolutely embarrassing infotainment system.

[-]

alien_believer_42@reddit

The customers like the looks. What it needed was a better powertrain. The NA is too slow and the turbo doesn't match the transmission. It's a fine car to own but damn I can't go back lol.

[-]

ArchiStanton@reddit

Best we can do is change everything and charge more

[-]

gravis1982@reddit

New model looks awesome. But expensive

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howyinzdoingnat@reddit

The lost model year was the end of the wagon and had .9% the new model takes time to come out and Subaru is great at terrible new product launch. Pair that with higher rates and a tighter car market. Sales are down all around

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gligster71@reddit

Just me or is this person having a stroke? "...had .9% the new model..." ??? "...great at terrible new product..." what does any of that mean?? lol!

[-]

Ba-dump-chink@reddit

Thank you for your comment. I read a word salad and wondered why it had so many upvotes. I guess people speed read and got the gist better than I do, but I was having trouble making sense out of the post.

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freakinidiotatwork@reddit

And this is the top comment! I tried to read it 4 times haha

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howyinzdoingnat@reddit

They are very good at fucking up new model launches

[-]

gligster71@reddit

Thanks!

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Fozzymandius@reddit

I mean yes. The wagon shape has been the definition of outback for over 20 years. So you might forgive people for being angry at the cannibalization of a nameplate so that they can produce yet another crossover suv in a market that has approximately 100 other choices in the segment. See also: Ford Mustang 4 door crossover ev.

Like sure, you’re allowed to like things, I see you’ve drawn attention to the existence of opinions, but it should be unsurprising to hear that there are people that want the old thing.

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-WallyWest-@reddit

They ruined it by making another garbage crossover. Its also quite ugly.

[-]

gligster71@reddit

"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man."

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-WallyWest-@reddit

Totally!

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unmistakablyvague@reddit

It's just turning into the shape of every other suv instead of the wagon like shape. Subaru is losing its unique styling trying to be like everyone else

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howyinzdoingnat@reddit

No one hates it. People hate change

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DaBanninator@reddit

Are you having a stroke?

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BananaPalmer@reddit

I think.. I think

...that they mean it had 0.9% APR financing available, and that Subaru has a tendency to botch new model launches.

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biggsteve81@reddit

My dealership has new Outbacks for $2k off MSRP plus 3.9% financing. If I were in the market for a new non-hybrid car I would definitely consider it.

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howyinzdoingnat@reddit

The new one is phenomenal inside. Back seat is huge. Year hatch space is amazing. It’s a deal. I imagine Subaru may do a mid month rate reduction to help move more

[-]

icecon@reddit

Back seat was always big, and so was hatch space.

They plastered the panels with some polyester mesh, that will not age well.

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DaBanninator@reddit

Yeah but it's ugly AF

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Astramael@reddit

Yea, I hate the new Outback, but I think this sales judgement is premature. There’s always a dip as models transition. I want to see a year of sales before I believe consumers are rejecting it. I think there’s every reason to think it will succeed still, personally.

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trail-g62Bim@reddit

Yeah idk how much is the new model and how much the economy tanking, economic uncertainty growing and tariffs. There were no tariffs this time last year and many people rushed to buy before they kicked in. There were many dealers (and Subaru in particular) that were ghost towns in March of last year as people rushed to make their purchases.

I'm sure some people rushed to get the last year of the last model too but idk if anyone has a good way of measuring what % were that vs. economic reality. 99% of the time, economics explain these things so I'm guessing that is the bulk of it here.

All Subaru models experienced sales declines in March, except for the all-electric Solterra

Yeah...that seems to indicate this is an economic issue. The Outback redesign shouldn't stop people from buying Foresters and Crosstreks. It's funny how people look at almost every model declining and then blame it on the redesign of just one model.

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xrelaht@reddit

It's partly economics, but Outback sales are down way more than the car market on the whole.

[-]

blchpmnk@reddit

IMO the original article isn't that great.

YTD:

Outback down 32%, Crosstrek down 11%, Impreza down 51%, WRX does 28%, Ascent down 17%, Forester UP 9%

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Bassracerx@reddit

Agree they can only sell what they can build to just conclude that buyers dont want the product when there hasnt even been a whole year of production yet is just silly.

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DM725@reddit

Yup. I don't see how anyone would take these numbers seriously while they were offering amazing incentives to get rid of the remaining inventory on the previous gen.

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L_viathan@reddit

It was a wagon?

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cjdacka@reddit

No shit, it's the ugliest fucking thing I've ever seen.

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johnedn@reddit

I got an ascent as a rental car when I was doing a bit of a road trip with like 6 people, I thought it was a nice car but I'm not a "car enthusiast" type person. I see lots of people hating on it, but not too much specific, is it mechanical stuff like they are a pain to upkeep and maintain or what?

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icecon@reddit

The first two years had issues and that tainted the rep of the car. It's a perfectly good car, turbo gets you there, safe, but a bit of a gas hog. It actually handles better than the other SUVs of it's size because of the low center of gravity of the boxer, but that is oft forgotten.

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waituhsecond@reddit

I think a lot of it has to do with how competitive the midsize segment is. It doesn’t do much to stand out against other similar priced vehicles like pilot, palisade, highlander, etc.

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Sir_Sir_ExcuseMe_Sir@reddit

I don't like the way they steer and handle, same as the Forester (and Outback to some degree). They're extremely boring, the infotainment is worse than my Polestar's (which is crazy), and the car is weirdly unattractive. Reliability and comfort are fine though.

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johnedn@reddit

Fair, I wasn't a big fan of the infotainment display, but I don't like them in general so I didn't really think much into it beyond that. Definitely not a zippy sporty fun car, and it was a pain to park at times bc it's pretty bulky, but similarly I wasnt too surprised bc it's a 3 row suv.

But those are all very valid complaints, I did like the clearance on it tho and while I didn't do anything that really needed the AWD, I like having AWD over anything else but I live in the NE US near the Great lakes so I get buried in snow every winter

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Capri280@reddit

I think attributing the Outback's decline to its admittedly ugly looks is a simplistic approach. After all, even the article admits that the other Subies are also in sales decline, and I don't think they've been overhauled those. Plus, hasn't total auto sales fallen in Q1?

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icecon@reddit

42.9% decline. Read that again. 43% decline on their most iconic nameplate.

This is Cracker Barrel or New Coke level disaster. Can never mess with the "soul" of the thing.

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Chippy569@reddit

There's even another layer there when looking specifically at YOY sales, march last year we had impending tariffs so many people that wanted a new car bumped their purchasing earlier.

Like EV sales here saw the same thing when the tax credits were ending. Rush of sales right before, and then "omg sales down" panic after.

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Pristine_Spend_5604@reddit

You could see this coming. As an ex-Subbie owner when they changed the form of the Outback we looked elsewhere. They became yet another SUV.

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my_lemonade@reddit

We have a touring trim of the previous gen we bought new Summer 2020, which has been great for our family. Other than wishing it was a plug in hybrid, not much I would change for our needs as one-car family do it all. Recently paid off, and just cracked 40k miles. I don't see us getting rid of it for a long time.

My partner and I were on a walk the other day and saw one of the new ones, and I asked her what she thought and she was like "THAT's an outback? That's hideous".

I can't say I disagree...

[-]

uniqueglobalname@reddit

A brand new gas only flagship model is ridiculous today. 22mpg is criminal when the competition is all 35+. What were they thinking??

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Specialist-Garbage94@reddit

Everytime I look at it. I like it more and more. IRL you cannot tell me that’s a wagon though.

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I_like_cake_7@reddit

I have to admit that the new Outback’s design is slowly growing on me. I actually dig the more squared off styling compared all of the previous generations of Outback. It looks the best in deep emerald green pearl.

However, The Wilderness trim’s grille is absolutely heinous.

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Specialist-Garbage94@reddit

I agree and honestly more pictures I see I like it but it was also starting to look like a wagon again but then I saw one in person. It’s really not a wagon.

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I_like_cake_7@reddit

No, it’s definitely not a wagon, but I do at least appreciate that Subaru didn’t give the new Outback a ridiculously tall greenhouse like the Forester has.

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Dnlx5@reddit

They should kill the ascent, and Give the outback a 3rd row.

Then in 28, launch an OutbackSport model with classic 2 row wagon form factor.

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nicholt@reddit

Should just not be called an outback, but that's their #1 nameplate so they went with it.

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FriedEldenRings@reddit

The outback's old design was the only thing really differentiating it from the forester. now there's no reason for both models to exist.

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tagman375@reddit

I wish they would give the forester the 2.4 turbo that all the other wilderness trims get. The wilderness looks cool, but the anemic 2.5 just kills it for me.

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Angry_Homer@reddit

Fozzy has better visibility too, while the outback is a bit more luxury oriented. At least with the last gen, it reminded me of a discount volvo. You even got fabric on the A-pillars!!!!!!!

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TPatS@reddit

New Outback looks like an SUV but still has a lower car like seating position. Forester has a higher SUV seating position. I think quite a few people like the lower and more lounge like position of the Outback.

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helloder2012@reddit

The actual footprint and layout of the cars is significantly different in person. I guess maybe you have seen one IRL but to say they fit the same group is crazy. The new Outback doesn’t look like a wagon, but it sure as hell doesn’t look like an SUV.

It looks like someone had been described both and was told that the max ground to roof height had to be the same as the last outback. Then what came out was a pretty modern Subaru rear end and an awkward but not terrible front end.

looks are subjective. Height and length matching what we just called the last outback is not

[-]

Drzhivago138@reddit

eight and length matching what we just called the last outback

The new Outback does have a slightly higher roof, but length and width are almost the same.

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helloder2012@reddit

You’re right. Just looked it up. Just about an inch and a half. Same ground clearance.

I just personally think the hate is a Reddit circle jerk at this point.

Next to a true “typical” crossover SUV there’s no doubt that they are different approaches to what would be considered “the opposite of a car”

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Drzhivago138@reddit

now there's no reason for both models to exist.

One is a compact (183") and the other a mid-size (192"). That's enough reason for both to exist. Not unlike the RAV4 and Crown Signia existing.

[-]

PaulClarkLoadletter@reddit

Cargo space. I can fit my family and luggage in an Outback. The Forrester is too small. It’s too bad the new Outback is such a mutant.

[-]

Drzhivago138@reddit

now there's no reason for both models to exist.

One is a compact (183") and the other a mid-size (192"). That's enough reason for both to exist.

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toolfan955@reddit

If Subaru wants to sell cars again. There's a really simple solution. Offer the Crosstrek Wilderness with the turbo engine.

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leftlanespawncamper@reddit

If I could've got the WRX engine/6-speed in a Crosstrek, that's what I'd be driving right now. I don't want a current WRX; I think trunks are pants-on-head stupid (give me a liftback or a hatch). I want something I can crash through unseen potholes without worry, and also has enough power that I don't die when I'm stuck behind someone who won't accelerate on the on-ramp.

But Subaru won't make that, so I bought a used Korean BMW. :shrug:

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PurdueGuvna@reddit

I love my WRX, I took my wife to look at the Outback for her, she wasn’t in love. She ended up in a Honda Odyssey.

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Bosfordjd@reddit

The outback was only noteworthy because of the wagon styling. They should have gone more wagon, not less.

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mrteas_nz@reddit

They thought to grow market share they needed to be in the SUV market, but they didn't realise they were the only ones making a vehicle like the Outback.

Instead of having zero competition, now they're competing with everyone and losing.

[-]

V8-Turbo-Hybrid@reddit

There is still a Subaru wagon in new car market, it’s Levorg/WRX wagon.

If Subaru has clearly seen the wrong decision in Outback and believed wagon buyer there, they could just bring Levorg/WRX wagon to fix sales.

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Bosfordjd@reddit

Yeah they will never bring it to the US lol. But I would loved a Levorg, maybe would still consider one if by some miracle it made it to the US.

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KingMario05@reddit

Yes. What the fuck is that thing wearing its name. Cause it ain't an Outback. Go back and do it over from scratch, Subaru. Please.

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1988rx7T2@reddit

Just turned in a 2024 lease for a new 2026 fully loaded Touring XT. It’s a styling downgrade. Infotainment is a lot better with somewhat faster response and more physical controls. Driving assistance is improved. Interior materials are improved a bit.

It’s a net improvement, but the outgoing generation had a lot of non working software. Like the driver camera that was supposed to recognize you and set your seat position just forgot what you look like after 2 weeks even after an over the air update.

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TheCountChonkula@reddit

This is why I ended up going with a 25 rather than a 26 since it’s more of a wagon than an SUV. I know it started off as just a Legacy wagon, but it has since moved closer to an SUV especially with the new one that just came out. If I wanted an SUV, I would have gone with a Forester and now the current Outback seems a bit redundant.

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Unique-Egg-461@reddit

saw one last night at dinner. thrown back by just how awful it looks.

had outbacks for a good chunk of my life.

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MotelSans17@reddit

Saw one in person finally, has to do a double take... Who the fuck approved this design?

It reminds me of an old Justy, but in a bad way.

Depending on your thoughts on EV vs ICE, the Trailseeker is a much better evolution of the Outback IMHO (disclaimer, I own a bZ4X and it's my favorite car ever, despite being my 15th)

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QuitBrowserGoOutside@reddit

The Trailseeker is even called the "e-Outback" in Europe (where they don't sell a gasoline Outback.)

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kyonkun_denwa@reddit

Honestly I much prefer the Trailseeker's design and I think you're right, it's looks more like an Outback than the current Outback does. Why Subaru couldn't pull a "Stellantis pro gamer move" and jam an ICE into the Trailseeker is beyond me.

You could keep both models- Trailseeker is the EV, Outback is the ICE.

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MotelSans17@reddit

Well the Trailseeker is built on a platform designed from the ground up to be an EV.

The Charger was always planned to be offered in both EV and ICE.

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CarpeNivem@reddit

I have to guess the reason might be, once the Outback became an SUV, it started to compete against other SUVs, which last I checked, is a very crowded market. Meanwhile, back when the Outback was a wagon, Subaru pretty much had on lock every person who wanted one.

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colenotphil@reddit

Can confirm, I liked when the Outback was a wagon but have been complaining about the new design to friends. It's so boring and looks generic.

The Subaru Outback used to be cool. Now it's boring.

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oralabora@reddit

Thank god

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NotoriousCFR@reddit

I don't think "SUV'ifying" it is necessarily the problem, the problem is it's just butt fucking ugly

Although, anecdotally I know a lot of Outback loyalists who like it specifically because it was still kind of "wagon-y" and hadn't gone full SUV. So there is that. Those buyers have been slowly leaving since the 2010 redesign but yeah, I imagine they lost whoever of the "wagon" crowd was left with the current redesign

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404nd2@reddit

So they took a vehicle from a niche market and reconfigured it for a highly saturated market.

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pinchevato57@reddit

It looks like shit.

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LightKing20@reddit

This Outback looks so much nicer than the last gen. If I was shopping for a new car I would very strongly consider this, whereas the last model felt a little bit too ugly.

Based on design impressions it seems like I’m one of 3 people in the world that loves this look

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costafilh0@reddit

That is surprising. I would guess at least half. I would be included in those because I fvcking hate it, even more than I already hated it before.

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Exadory@reddit

I know it's one person, and anecdotal, but my dad has bought a new outback wagon every few years since the late 90ies and he hates the SUV and wont be buying it.

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plingding@reddit

They stopped shipping to Canada because its production is in the US and Canada counter tariffed US autos n response to Trumps tariffs on Canada.

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PNF2187@reddit

This is not the case for the 2026 Outback. All 2026 Outbacks are being made in Japan now.

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plingding@reddit

Gotcha, thanks.

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XSC@reddit

I am subbie person but unless they are massively discounted, I am not interested. Too expensive and not a fan of the looks.

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1975hh3@reddit

It’s hideous. Being a station wagon was part of its appeal. Now it’s like every other crappy SUV.

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TwelveTrains@reddit

What does this title mean?

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Farnetus@reddit

Glad I'm not the only one confused by the title. Tho I'm also a car noob.

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eh_itzvictor@reddit

I mean.. they changed it from lifted wagon to regular suv.. people bought it for the wagon-esque factor. It also just doesnt look good, so there's that

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dchap1@reddit

Not shocked. They lost their way with that one IMHO.

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ChasedWarrior@reddit

They screwed up with the new Outback. Part of it's charm was that it was just a wagon that had a lift kit. One of the few "wagons" left. The new one just looks like another SUV. And even with discounts Subaru priced it too high.

[-]

carsgobeepbeep@reddit

The higher price was a big nail in the coffin, but let’s not forget the others:

The elimination of deployable roof rails (that’ll be $300-700 extra please and oh you need two people and an Allen wrench to put them on and off now)
the shitty low-coverage sun visors vs. the outgoing model
the terrible and clunky trunk hammock cover concept (literally a piece of flimsy fabric). The old tonneau cover was just fine… talk about a whack cost saving measure.

[-]

hughcifer-106103@reddit

Yikes, that thing is ugly AF. Subaru might make well-built cars, but they are hideous.

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sometext@reddit

I have an Outback and I love the car, but it's far from pretty. That's fine! Not what the car is about. This new one is downright gruesome though. It's hard to look at. I would only buy it to park in the driveway and scare away neighbor kids like a gargoyle. This car makes me envy the blind. Honestly let ChatGPT design the next one there's nowhere to go but up.

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MaybeNext-Monday@reddit

It looks like someone tried to build a land cruiser from memory using only subaru parts… on a 1-hour time limit

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BurninCoco@reddit

"This car makes me envy the blind" 😂

That was the Aztec!

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Shmokesshweed@reddit

I, for one, am shocked.

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ProcedureStraight601@reddit

good

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peaked-at-7@reddit

Trying to spin this as being the fault of the redesign is dumb.

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Scazitar@reddit

Well yeah they pretty much made it a diffrent car lol.

Good or bad you're going too lose some of your core audience.

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IMA_5-STAR_MAN@reddit

Didn't they also raise the price 20%? And they redesigned the more affordable Forester and it looks great.

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Sxcred@reddit

I know a lot of people who are interested in the 2015-2022 models now. But not a new one for sure.

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ssowinski@reddit

Solution = add more matte black plastic?

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valsalva_manoeuvre@reddit

I really don't care for the new full-on SUV Outback. I've owned two Outbacks and a bugeye Impreza wagon. Maybe the station wagon demographic in North America is limited to car enthusiast subreddits, but I just want a wagon.

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40ozT0Freedom@reddit

Oh god, its hideous. My wife's company gives them outbacks as their work car and they get new ones every few years. I really wouldn't mind if they just said to hold on to this one for a bit longer.

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neelav9@reddit

Cus it’s fugly.

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STMIHA@reddit

They really miss the mark. The outback had a niche that they really shouldn’t have messed with. They wanted to skill this to compete more with the larger alternatives like the Santa Fe. And it failed.

They would’ve had better luck repositioning the Forrester or simply taking the time to introduce a larger model that addresses the void in the lineup.

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7frosts@reddit

I was going to buy an Impreza for my daughter, only to be told it doesn’t come in a manual anymore. Such a waste.

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Ser_Drewseph@reddit

I actually know a couple that had an outback from a few years ago. The lease was up and they hated the new outback enough to switch to a different vehicle. Besides the styling, they hated that the ride was now floaty as an crossover/suv. They liked the more car-like driving dynamics of the wagon of the previous gen. So instead they got a WRX

[-]

Phosphorus444@reddit

At least I know I'm not the only one who didn't like the redesign. Which is unfortunate since they fixed the interior.

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kyonkun_denwa@reddit

One of my friends has a 2015 Camry, which was a somewhat controversial car because it seems almost everyone (enthusiasts, not normal buyers) hated the redesign compared to the 2012. But in his words, "when I'm driving I'm not looking at the outside of the car, I'm enjoying the improved inside". I imagine the same logic will apply to some new Outback buyers.

Given that the 2015 Camry now looks tame and even handsome, who knows, maybe in 2036 we will think the same of this Outback.

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tacoinmybelly@reddit

Doesn't surprise me. I was their target customer, they lost me when they killed the wagon.

I traded my 2020 outback in for a Mazda. No ragerts.

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Certain_Librarian373@reddit

Subies are fading fast from being a vehicle that only a niche market wants.

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CobaltFermi@reddit

Sounds like a combination of the economy being tight and the current gas prices. Most Subaru models do not have hybrid versions. And, just my 2 cents, the Outback redesign sucks big time. About time that automakers face some consequences for these ugly, boxy cars they've been churning out lately.

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Psyclist80@reddit

Of course it it, they took a cool softroad/offroad wagon and made it an ugly SUV. Less is more Subaru!

[-]

unsaltedbutter@reddit

I test drove one and liked it. The exterior isn't great, the wheel wells are ugly, but the interior is ok.

Tried to buy one and was offered roughly 10% off sticker on a new Outback Touring XT. There are a number of posts in the subbreddit of others getting offers around the same too.

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HappyGuardian5@reddit

Subaru needs to ditch the boxers and switch to briefs.

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shitflavoredideas@reddit

They need to drop the CVT and boxer. Way to many pit falls for it to be reliable long term and too high of complexity for something that is essential an appliance.

When they offered performance you could look past those pitfalls but these days there is nothing performance oriented in their entire lineup.

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